Social NintenZone Social 6.0 - L'Arachel Edition, Apparently?

[Fire Emblemier]

Was 4Kids handling of OP so bad that it killed any chance of OP being mainstream in the West?

I didn't think the damage was that bad. Tho it is 4Kids who's dubs tended to suck except for the Pokemon one.

I mean the Yugioh dub falls under the "so bad, its good" campy style.

 

[Zinith]

Was 4Kids handling of OP so bad that it killed any chance of OP being mainstream in the West?

I didn't think the damage was that bad. Tho it is 4Kids who's dubs tended to suck except for the Pokemon one.

If anything all it did was send Funimation back several hundred episodes for their dub.

The thing about 4Kids is that they had a policy of only doing child appropriate animes to dub (the name of their company after all), but One Piece showed that they didn't screen the shows they acquired beforehand and then thought "oh ****, we ****ed up."

 

[PLATINUM7]

Was 4Kids handling of OP so bad that it killed any chance of OP being mainstream in the West?

I didn't think the damage was that bad. Tho it is 4Kids who's dubs tended to suck except for the Pokemon one.

That's the popular story.

The 4Kids One Piece dub and the Naruto dub aired alongside Pokemon, Yugioh and DBZ here in Australia but neither seemed to have lasting appeal to the casual anime fans. Though, it might be because they stopped airing. I knew a few people who bought One Piece video games.

I dunno, other than Dragon Ball, it's always been "that one anime everyone knows about" for me.

Might just be where I live then.

When I go buy manga, no one even bothers stocking Naruto. One Piece will go through stock regularly, even Jojo sells but Naruto is non existent.

 

[KMDP]

Was 4Kids handling of OP so bad that it killed any chance of OP being mainstream in the West?

I didn't think the damage was that bad. Tho it is 4Kids who's dubs tended to suck except for the Pokemon one.

Yes, 4Kids' handling of the dub was that bad.

Obviously, to kids who didn't know any better, there was no problem.

But there were cracks and they would have been broken wide open if 4Kids had continued dubbing it.

The primary examples are cutting the Twin Capes arc (which introduced Laboon the Whale) and the Little Garden arc, these aren't big deals in a vacuum, but Laboon turns out to be extremely important a few arcs later, and the Little Garden arc has even quicker consequences.

In Little Garden, three things happen:

• Sanji gets the crew the ability to reach Alabasta, their final destination during that part of the story, while also setting up his relationship with Crocodile (the Mr. Prince persona).
• Nami catches a dangerous disease, which is why they need to go to Drum Island, this isn't that big a deal, and can be plastered over relatively simply.
• The Crew meets Dorry and Brogy the Giants, which gives Usopp a goal of reaching Elbaf, their home island. It also has a payoff later on when the fact that they know Dorry and Brogy allows them to get two other Giants to join them in the Enies Lobby Arc.

The Dorry and Brogy and Laboon things are the big missteps in 4Kids' handling of the show, fortunately, they lost the rights before the arcs where those characters became relevant.

 

[Zinith]

I mean the Yugioh dub falls under the "so bad, its good" campy style.

Technically 4Kids still dubs Yu-Gi-Oh! even though they went under. The dubbing studio was bought out by Konami and retitled "4K Media" and is in the process of dubbing VRAINS

 

[Will]

Where I'm from, Naruto is more known than DBZ half the time.

 

[Deleted member]

Technically 4Kids still dubs Yu-Gi-Oh! even though they went under. The dubbing studio was bought out by Konami and retitled "4K Media" and is in the process of dubbing VRAINS

Can't 4Kids just Rip Konami?

 

[PLATINUM7]

Yes, 4Kids' handling of the dub was that bad.

Obviously, to kids who didn't know any better, there was no problem.

But there were cracks and they would have been broken wide open if 4Kids had continued dubbing it.

The primary examples are cutting the Twin Capes arc (which introduced Laboon the Whale) and the Little Garden arc, these aren't big deals in a vacuum, but Laboon turns out to be extremely important a few arcs later, and the Little Garden arc has even quicker consequences.

In Little Garden, three things happen:

• Sanji gets the crew the ability to reach Alabasta, their final destination during that part of the story, while also setting up his relationship with Crocodile (the Mr. Prince persona).
• Nami catches a dangerous disease, which is why they need to go to Drum Island, this isn't that big a deal, and can be plastered over relatively simply.
• The Crew meets Dorry and Brogy the Giants, which gives Usopp a goal of reaching Elbaf, their home island. It also has a payoff later on when the fact that they known Dorry and Brogy allows them to get two other Giants to join them in the Enies Lobby Arc.

The Dorry and Brogy and Laboon things are the big missteps in 4Kids' handling of the show, fortunately, they lost the rights before the arcs where those characters became relevant.

The only good thing I can think to come out of it is that it aired alongside other popular anime for 4kids target audience. Got people I know into it later.

That said, I like to imagine a world where Funimation got the license straight away and aren't 300 episodes behind.

 

[Chrono.]

Naruto blew up in the west? Since when?

It's always been just as niche, if not more than One Piece in my experiences.

Naruto, at least in America? Was a pretty big deal in the mid to late 00s. CN/Toonami aired it a ton, there was merch everywhere, all the games got localized and I think the first movie even had a limited theatrical release, which was pretty rare unless you were like Pokemon or something. Even Ubisoft made a pair of Naruto games aimed at the Western audience. Nowadays even the average joe has some idea of what Naruto is.

It didn't get as popular as Pokemon, DBZ or even Yugioh, but it came the closest.

Was 4Kids handling of OP so bad that it killed any chance of OP being mainstream in the West?

I didn't think the damage was that bad. Tho it is 4Kids who's dubs tended to suck except for the Pokemon one.

Yeah OP's dub went beyond just being a bad dub.

They cut entire arcs, arcs that would major consequences at later points. Character motivations were simplified or outright warped to something else entirely. Scripts were overdone with jokes and bad puns, etc etc.

A lot of "badly" dubbed anime aren't really all that bad beyond some weird censoring or bad voices, but One Piece's 4kids dub was something else.

When they lost the rights the popularity it had kinda fizzled out and never quite recovered after FUNI picked it up. It's still really popular in the west, obviously. Just didn't have that same boom Naruto did in it's heyday.

 

[Ura]

I mean the Yugioh dub falls under the "so bad, its good" campy style.

Yeah i'm nostalgic for the YGH anime with it's memorable cast but the dub itself had some pretty crappy edits to it.

If anything all it did was send Funimation back several hundred episodes for their dub.

The thing about 4Kids is that they had a policy of only doing child appropriate animes to dub (the name of their company after all), but One Piece showed that they didn't screen the shows they acquired beforehand and then thought "oh ****, we ****ed up."

Even more so I think OP missed it's chance when it was exposed to the largest audience possible. That's why DBZ and Naruto became so popular because of all the kids that were exposed to it and it became famous as a result.

That's the popular story.

The 4Kids One Piece dub and the Naruto dub aired alongside Pokemon, Yugioh and DBZ here in Australia but neither seemed to have lasting appeal to the casual anime fans. Though, it might be because they stopped airing. I knew a few people who bought One Piece video games.

Might just be where I live then.

When I go buy manga, no one even bothers stocking Naruto. One Piece will go through stock regularly, even Jojo sells but Naruto is non existent.

IDK about Australia but in North America, Naruto is really popular. I mean it's nowhere near mainstream but it's like the most popular non-mainstream anime in North America. Kinda like how The Legend of Zelda is the most popular non-mainstream game.

The only mainstream anime's IIRC are DBZ, Pokemon, Sailor Moon, and YGH. Some are like Naruto in that they're really popular but not mainstream levels of popular.

Yes, 4Kids' handling of the dub was that bad.

Obviously, to kids who didn't know any better, there was no problem.

But there were cracks and they would have been broken wide open if 4Kids had continued dubbing it.

The primary examples are cutting the Twin Capes arc (which introduced Laboon the Whale) and the Little Garden arc, these aren't big deals in a vacuum, but Laboon turns out to be extremely important a few arcs later, and the Little Garden arc has even quicker consequences.

In Little Garden, three things happen:

• Sanji gets the crew the ability to reach Alabasta, their final destination during that part of the story, while also setting up his relationship with Crocodile (the Mr. Prince persona).
• Nami catches a dangerous disease, which is why they need to go to Drum Island, this isn't that big a deal, and can be plastered over relatively simply.
• The Crew meets Dorry and Brogy the Giants, which gives Usopp a goal of reaching Elbaf, their home island. It also has a payoff later on when the fact that they know Dorry and Brogy allows them to get two other Giants to join them in the Enies Lobby Arc.

The Dorry and Brogy and Laboon things are the big missteps in 4Kids' handling of the show, fortunately, they lost the rights before the arcs where those characters became relevant.

Honestly there were changes that really baffled me as to why they even existed. And those were the ones that weren't toning anything down and was changing for the sake of it.

Where I'm from, Naruto is more known than DBZ half the time.

Among anime fans maybe. Casual fans all know about DBZ whereas Naruto is foreign to them.

 

[Zinith]

One Piece, Dragon Ball and Naruto are the 3 highest selling manga of all time in that order

Golgo 13 used to be 2nd. I remember that

 

[Will]

Among anime fans maybe. Casual fans all know about DBZ whereas Naruto is foreign to them.

They are casual fans?

 

[Deleted member]

Is any Tv based Video game cashgrab's planned i played the Paw Patrol game and i had something that resembled fun... I am a simple person....

 

[KMDP]

The only good thing I can think to come out of it is that it aired alongside other popular anime for 4kids target audience. Got people I know into it later.

That said, I like to imagine a world where Funimation got the license straight away and aren't 300 episodes behind.

Yeah OP's dub went beyond just being a bad dub.

They cut entire arcs, arcs that would major consequences at later points. Character motivations were simplified or outright warped to something else entirely. Scripts were overdone with jokes and bad puns, etc etc.

A lot of "badly" dubbed anime aren't really all that bad beyond some weird censoring or bad voices, but One Piece's 4kids dub was something else.

Honestly there were changes that really baffled me as to why they even existed. And those were the ones that weren't toning anything down and was changing for the sake of it.

I'd have been interested in seeing how 4Kids would have handled Khalifa (primarily her fight with Nami), Boa Hancock (and Amazon Lily as a whole) and Ivankov.

Also Sabaody ("Isn't human trafficking fun?"), Marineford or post-timeskip OP in general.

As the series goes on, One Piece became less and less suited for 4Kids' localisation style; to an almost hilarious degree.

 

[PLATINUM7]

One Piece, Dragon Ball and Naruto are the 3 highest selling manga of all time in that order

Golgo 13 used to be 2nd. I remember that

Those three are basically the gateway drugs to anime.

One of my high school friends was a literal textbook example. Started watching DBZ, moved on to Naruto when finished, then moved on to One Piece and quickly became a bona fide weeb.

 

[praline]

I haven’t watched a single episode of One Piece or Naruto.

 

[Zinith]

As the series goes on, One Piece became less and less suited for 4Kids' localisation style; to an almost hilarious degree.

Well it's a good thing that once 4Kids found out how inappropriate that show was for their brand, they had plans to drop it the moment they had the chance. It's just that it took about a hundred (edited) episodes for that to happen...

 

[Ura]

They are casual fans?

I mean people who aren't really in to anime. Those are the kinds of people who know about DBZ and loved the series from back in the day.

A good video game analogy would be Mario and Zelda. One is almost universally known to the general public and the other is extremely popular in it's medium despite not being at the mainstream level.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

No. Kale.

Then later Kefla like with Goku Black and Fused Zamasu.

Now that’s great business planning

I'd say "Literal Girl Broly", but...

She actually grows beyond that.

Not gonna lie, though, I like both Caulifla and Kale (and Kefla by extension).

There is a single line dedicated to Hercule's situation, hidden within the Videl paragraph.

Basically, when asked if they'd have Hercule in the game, IntSys said "No."

Maybe they changed their minds since the game was in development? I dunno.

They better change their mind on the 2nd GOAT

 

[praline]

One Piece, Dragon Ball and Naruto are the 3 highest selling manga of all time in that order

Golgo 13 used to be 2nd. I remember that

Hence why Luffy, Goku and Naruto were the first 3 characters shown for Jump Force

 

[Will]

I mean people who aren't really in to anime. Those are the kinds of people who know about DBZ and loved the series from back in the day.

Yeah.
That's what I'm talking about.

Is the idea that people know more of Naruto than DBZ casually so alien to you that you're gonna deny my word as a Memphis boi?

 

[Mythra]

Naruto became pretty niche here, it got aired in CN at accessible hours and got pushed along with One Piece, Naruto notably got a lowkey hatebase from DBZ hardcore fans (As you know, Dragon Ball is a ****ing religion in México).
It stopped airing on TV when the Shippuden stuff started but I still heard it mentioned in friends circles and groups, giving it a quiet but dedicated fanbase.

 

[Zinith]

Naruto became pretty niche here, it got aired in CN at accessible hours and got pushed along with One Piece, Naruto notably got a lowkey hatebase from DBZ hardcore fans (As you know, Dragon Ball is a ****ing religion in México).
It stopped airing on TV when the Shippuden stuff started but I still heard it mentioned in friends circles and groups, giving it a quiet but dedicated fanbase.

Since anime and Mexico has been mentioned in the same paragraph...

How big is Saint Seiya down there?

 

[Chrono.]

Naruto became pretty niche here, it got aired in CN at accessible hours and got pushed along with One Piece, Naruto notably got a lowkey hatebase from DBZ hardcore fans (Dragon Ball is a ****ing religion in México).
It stopped airing on TV when the Shippuden stuff started but I still heard it mentioned in friends circles and groups, giving it a quiet but dedicated fanbase.

Did you watch the Broly movie btw?

The latino dub was amazing as usual. I bet the theaters were super packed over there.

 

[Deleted member]

Someone really needs to open a anime discussion lol

 

[Will]

(As you know, Dragon Ball is a ****ing religion in México).

The Protestant DBZ vs The Catholic Saint Seiya if you ask me. SS is so ****ing popular in Brazil

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

Holy ****, guys.

You have no idea how long I've waited to see Mysterio finally show up in a movie. Ever since I played the N64 Spider-Man at least. And then they went and picked one of my all time favorite actors to play him. Add that on top of ****ing Sam Jackson coming back as Nick Fury and Michael Keaton already confirmed to return and holy **** I'm already in love with this movie.

 

[KMDP]

I haven’t watched a single episode of One Piece or Naruto.

One Piece is a very good series if you
A) Like world building
B) Like long series' (EDIT: One Piece is a series that handles it's extreme length well, because of it's nature as an Adventure Manga)
C) Like creative powers (if not necessarily creative fights)
D) Don't mind disproportionately large breasts (while I don't personally have a problem with it, some do, the body proportions can get incredibly exaggerated on both males and females)

One Piece is a series that thrives on it's World Building and use of characters (there's a fandom meme: "Oda never forgets"), some of the best bits are the inter-arc sections where future plotlines are set-up and everyone reacts to the main characters' insane stunts.

Naruto, on the other hand, is a story that had a lot of promise, but kind of loses it's steam at some point (where this happens is up to debate). The early parts are incredibly good, though.

Spoiler

One fan theory I've seen is that the story issues resulted from Kishimoto not being able to do the story the way he wanted, namely there was an arc early in the story, shortly before the timeskip, where it seems clear that certain characters are going to die... and then they don't despite all the flags that were being set-up, the theory goes that, since said characters were ~12 Years old (like most of the protagonists in that arc), Kishimoto's editor told him not to kill them off.

 

[PLATINUM7]

Also, while major book and dvd retailers sell manga and anime here in Australia, really the only stuff that will be advertised is Pokemon and DBZ.

Except for My Hero Acdemia. Saw a huge advert for the DVDs in a cataloge one day and it blew my mind.

 

[Will]

So after a little bit, I'm feeling like Part 5 anime is bringing David back to top tier anime production. We back at Part 1/2 tier remakes babyyyy

 

[Mythra]

Did you watch the Broly movie btw?

The latino dub was amazing as usual. I bet the theaters were super packed over there.

Not yet, I plan to do it this weekend.
And yeah, it is the most watched movie here

Since anime and Mexico has been mentioned in the same paragraph...

How big is Saint Seiya down there?

It is big, not freaking huge like DBZ but it is very recognized and sells big merch still.

Back in the 90s-00s it was the competitor of Dragon Ball as they aired on rival national TV channels.

Last year both aired in the same channel; they showed The Sanctuary, Asgard, Poseidon and Hades sagas + Lost Canvas, followed by DBZ, GT and Super. A true shonen paradise.

 

[Zinith]

Also, while major book and dvd retailers sell manga and anime here in Australia, really the only stuff that will be advertised is Pokemon and DBZ.

Except for My Hero Acdemia. Saw a huge advert for the DVDs in a cataloge one day and it blew my mind.

Is Madman Entertainment responsible for much of the dubs over there?

Cause here in 'Murca it's mostly Funimation, Sentai, VIZ, Animax, Discotek and Media Blasters

 

[Ura]

Yeah.
That's what I'm talking about.

Is the idea that people know more of Naruto than DBZ casually so alien to you that you're gonna deny my word as a Memphis boi?

No sorry if it came across that way. I guess there might be some anecdotal examples but all in all there's no topping Dragon Ball Z as the most popular anime in the West.

Which is funny given how the original Dragon Ball was never able to catch on in the West. The audience that grew up with DBZ didn't like the adventure storyline and less-dramatic/showy fight scenes.

 

[PLATINUM7]

One Piece is a very good series if you
A) Like world building
B) Like long series' (EDIT: One Piece is a series that handles it's extreme length well, because of it's nature as an Adventure Manga)
C) Like creative powers (if not necessarily creative fights)
D) Don't mind disproportionately large breasts (while I don't personally have a problem with it, some do, the body proportions can get incredibly exaggerated on both males and females)

One Piece is a series that thrives on it's World Building and use of characters (there's a fandom meme: "Oda never forgets"), some of the best bits are the inter-arc sections where future plotlines are set-up and everyone reacts to the main characters' insane stunts.

Naruto, on the other hand, is a story that had a lot of promise, but kind of loses it's steam at some point (where this happens is up to debate). The early parts are incredibly good, though.

Spoiler

One fan theory I've seen is that the story issues resulted from Kishimoto not being able to do the story the way he wanted, namely there was an arc early in the story, shortly before the timeskip, where it seems clear that certain characters are going to die... and then they don't despite all the flags that were being set-up, the theory goes that, since said characters were ~12 Years old (like most of the protagonists in that arc), Kishimoto's editor told him not to kill them off.

Oda never forgets while Araki never remembers.

 

[Chrono.]

I remember watching Los Caballeros del Zodiaco when I was like 5 in mornings before school.

Though I don't think it caught on that much here in Puerto Rico. I wouldn't learn the actual name of the series until I was in high school and actually got into anime.

 

[Deleted member]

https://smashboards.com/threads/anime-discussion-thread.471347/ i know nothing about Anime except pokemon but go wild!

 

[Will]

Oda never forgets while Araki never remembers.

IT'S BEEN EIGHT YEARS ARAKI

WHO THE **** IS THIS GUY

 

[PLATINUM7]

Is Madman Entertainment responsible for much of the dubs over there?

Cause here in 'Murca it's mostly Funimation, Sentai, VIZ, Animax, Discotek and Media Blasters

Madman does 99% of anime ditribution. It's basically a monopoly for them. They ****ing pop up everywhere. They don't dub themselves but release existing dubs, like those by Funimation and Viz. Outside of anime, they do a lot of other stuff, like Cartoon Network releases and BBC content.

I think Hanabee is another distributor but they're nowhere near as prolific as Madman. 4K media also releases Yugioh themselves instead of Madman.

 

[Chrono.]

Oda never forgets while Araki never remembers.

I've always said but Araki and Toriyama are two sides of the same coin.

Both have a lot of similarities in their writing and as writers but while Toriyama plays it a bit safe and knows what works really well, Araki just goes bat**** crazy.

 

[Zinith]

I've always said but Araki and Toriyama are two sides of the same coin.

Both have a lot of similarities in their writing and as writers but while Toriyama plays it a bit safe and knows what works really well, Araki just goes bat**** crazy.

Toriyama hardly ever does long-form serials after Dragon Ball. It's mostly one-shots and 4 one-volume serials (Cowa!, Kajira, Sand Land and Jaco the Galactic Patrolman)