Social NintenZone Social 4 - Bring It In, Guys!

[praline]

Thank you for that wonderful trade praline .

Definitely going to take good care of her for the future.

While we are in trade could i do some trade evos?

 

[Deleted member]

Fun fact actually, Shinji was going to be a girl but they changed it to appeal to boys iirc

Girl Shinji would have been fine, as he has plenty of feminine traits, but I find him a lot more interesting as a male. A lot of the sexual tension between him and the leading girls wouldn't be as strong if he were a girl, especially since sex is a drive for him various times, and it ties into his desire for acceptance. And boys tend to be more sexually impulsive than girls. Also, the nuance of his relationship Kaworu is only interesting cause of the homosexual undertones.

This is the second time you've mixed up protagonist and antagonist.

Not really.

Protagonist is literally the "leading actor" by definition.

A protagonist (from Ancient Greek πρωταγωνιστής (protagonistes), meaning "player of the first part, chief actor") is the main character in any story, such as a literary work or drama.[1]

Antagonist is literally "opposite of the protagonist." As in, something or someone for them to overcome. As an antagonist doesn't necessarily have to be a person, it can very well be a setting. "Anti" is the Greek word for opposite.

The protagonist and antagonist are merely characters who "change the plot" but both are better off driving it, rather than being led around and responding to it. It's just better overall for the writing of the story.

As already stated, Ren was badly wounded. Also, I'm pretty sure 'saved' doesn't mean 'gets ****ing crippled by a lightsaber stab to the back

I'm sure he'll be fine, this is Disney, I don't have much faith in them to bring nuance to their stories. They dropped the ball hard with TFA. So much potential for a good story, squandered. As the premise of "searching for Luke Skywalker" is not a bad one at all.

And Ren, despite being wounded, showed plenty of fighting capabilty when fighing Rey, he had full range of motion, and this was visibly shown. If he was meant to be defeated because of that, then that's bad directing on JJ's part, as this was not overly apparent, nor was there any explanation given for why he couldn't just Force push Rey off a cliff, or just outright force choke her, considering Vader could do that with ease, and Ren was show to be far stronger than Vader.

Then why try arguing with someone about the new Rider when it's very clear that the person you're arguing against HAS watched it? Also, you might not have known, but Part V stops the 'buff doods' and makes them more feminine looking, and has the most homoerotic moment in the franchise.

Because that's not the point I'm trying to make. I'm not trying to argue over specific characters. I was merely trying to chime in on what I thought makes a good character, and what doesn't, and express that by giving an example with Rey, who I think is a very poorly written character, and yes, a by the book, Mary Sue. And to add to this, Luke is NOT a Gary Stu, not in the slightest.

Anyone trying to argue this, needs to look at the nuance between both characters, and their accomplisments. Luke's accomplishments were few, and hard won, and he actually failed and needed rescue more often than not. Rey in the other hand, had no major **** ups, and the only on that's ever cited, is where she sets the beasts lose on the Falcon, and even that she turns into a net positive with which she saves the day. That's a Mary Sue.

But those were in LATER movies, AFTER Ripley was already established as a woman, I was talking about the original casting for the character Ripley

I honestly remember very little about the first Alien film, as it's only the second that I truly like, and have seen many many times. I don't remember much about Ripley in the first film outside of her being a stoic millitary woman. And if that's all she had to her, then, that's probably why. I would probably argue she didn't become a very well written character until Aliens, but I'd have to go back and rewatch the first in order to properly say anything.

Anyway, that's not the point. Paying homage is also not a good reason to write a bad character, nor does it save a bad character. Samus also pay homage to Ripley, and I'd argue that she's a much better nod to her than Rey. And actually, there is sexuality in Ripley in the first Alien. The first film literally ends with her taking her shirt off and showing her cleavage. That's actually literally where Metroid got the "sexy rewards" thing from. There's probably more than that, but again, I'd have to go back and rewatch the film. It's been years.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

While we are in trade could i do some trade evos?

Cool.

Got a Machoke and Scyther for that one. Will be back.

 

[TylerBlackRunIt]

Since I do have double the Buzzwoles, who's willing to trade me a Pheromosa?

SuperTY, I would be willing to trade my Scyther with you.

Thanks, my FC is 2509 - 3601 - 8302

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Who are you to tell me what's good writing>?

How many books has your family published

Please don't do this. How can you know when a video game is good or bad? How many have your family made? Are you a professional chef? No? Then stop saying blue-ish bread is bad. Are you an actor? No? How can you tell it's bad or good acting? You can SEE some cases. Furthermore, how many books have YOUR family published? My mother actually knows an author so I can brag about writing I guess

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

look at what Anime News Network put right next to each other 'accidentally'

 

[Wario Bros.]

Today I decided to look at in-game store of Killer Instinct and saw the holiday accessories banner up. Hoping they finally got something new added, I took a look:

...hold me.

*Insert Assassin's Creed Unity joke here*

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Please don't do this. How can you know when a video game is good or bad? How many have your family made? Are you a professional chef? No? Then stop saying blue-ish bread is bad. Are you an actor? No? How can you tell it's bad or good acting? You can SEE some cases. Furthermore, how many books have YOUR family published? My mother actually knows an author so I can brag about writing I guess

Hes dismissing what I have to say and saying he's objectively right

 

[Hat N' Clogs]

I don't think he particularly is, but he has some characteristics that are definitely Mary Sue like. Such him outdoing the empire so easily even though they're established to be very powerful and the very best. Meanwhile you just have some random dude from a sand planet that's able to outgun them, outsmart them, and even be much more nimble than them. Hell, in a new hope in seems that look has an easier time getting around the death star than the people that are suppose to know it in and out.

He's also just able to pilot the X-Wing and T47 airspeeder with excellence(He's by far the most effective in battle compared to the Rebel pilots) despite the fact that he so little experience. And the reasoning being that his Dad was such a good pilot. Which, one hell of a characteristic of a Mary Sue is being related to someone so powerful and masterful in the first place. It doesn't help that Darth Vader is the only one in the empire that can even give Luke trouble too. Besides Palpatine. So really it comes to either most of the empire is incredibly weak or Luke has incredible luck and skill he shouldn't really even have. He doesn't even have much training at all(none established anyway) in the points I'm referencing. I'm not talking about him post training, I'm talking about him pre-training. And it mostly comes from a new hope and its action scenes. Which is the fairest comparison as TFA is only one movie in and that's what it's mostly based off of.

Not that Rey doesn't have any either, but the ones she does have are definitely due to being similar to Luke. In fact, most of the movies problems are just from trying to be similar to a new hope.

With the X-Wing thing, I agree with you on. With defeating the empire...to an extent I agree with you. I do think he had significant help from Han, Leia, and his friends of course. He has Mary Sue traits, but he's far from being one.

On the topic of TFA, I think it depends on how you look at the movie. If you're brand new to the franchise, it's a really good movie and it's fun. However, if you're a seasoned Star Wars fan like myself, it ends up being average overall.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

Scyther will just have to wait until I find a Metal Coat.

But at least you've got a nice Alakazam and Golem praline . Thanks for helping Machoke evolve.

As for you TylerBlackRunIt , I would trade if you have an extra Metal Coat in hand.

 

[praline]

Scyther will just have to wait until I find a Metal Coat.

But at least you've got a nice Alakazam and Golem praline . Thanks for helping Machoke evolve.

As for you TylerBlackRunIt , I would trade if you have an extra Metal Coat in hand.

Thanks dude. Also Machamp wanted to learn Strength but I didn't wanna mess with its moveset so I didn't teach it it.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

Thanks dude. Also Machamp wanted to learn Strength but I didn't wanna mess with its moveset so I didn't teach it it.

Same can be said for your Alakazam wanting to learn Kinesis. But I left it the way it is not to mess with it.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Not really.

Yes really. I LITERALLY said 'antagonist' in my first argument, in which you then said protagonist in your reply, and when I said the definition of BOTH, you replied with 'protagonist' when talking about how I described ANTAGONIST. You didn't say 'Actually, you're mixing them up' or anything to correct me, so I highly doubt that means I'm wrong.

I'm sure he'll be fine, this is Disney, I don't have much faith in them to bring nuance to their stories. They dropped the ball hard with TFA. So much potential for a good story, squandered. As the premise of "searching for Luke Skywalker" is not a bad one at all.

And Ren, despite being wounded, showed plenty of fighting capabilty when fighing Rey, he had full range of motion, and this was visibly shown. If he was meant to be defeated because of that, then that's bad directing on JJ's part, as this was not overly apparent, nor was there any explanation given for why he couldn't just Force push Rey off a cliff, or just outright force choke her, considering Vader could do that with ease, and Ren was show to be far stronger than Vader.

"I'm sure he'll be fine" isn't good enough. This is from the same movie that killed one of the franchise's most beloved characters, so you can't go 'loldidny', not to mention Disney owns Marvel now so I guess all Marvel characters have always been fine since the buy-out.
The last time they tried explaining the force the entire fanbase got angry as hell. What's to say stamina doesn't play a part?

Because that's not the point I'm
trying to make. I'm not trying to argue over specific characters. I was merely trying to chime in on what I thought makes a good character, and what doesn't, and express that by giving an example with Rey, who I think is a very poorly written character, and yes, a by the book, Mary Sue. And to add to this, Luke is NOT a Gary Stu, not in the slightest.

But you DID! You said that the protagonist for the new KR was well-liked for his feminine traits, and the only remotely feminine trait he has, caring and stuff, is because of his job. You ARGUED something against someone who knows what they're talking about. You don't do that. Also, Rey is pretty much Luke 2.0 just like the rest of TFA being like ANH, so if Rey is a Mary Sue, so is Luke.

I honestly remember very little about the first Alien film, as it's only the second that I truly like, and have seen many many times. I don't remember much about Ripley in the first film outside of her being a stoic millitary woman. And if that's all she had to her, then, that's probably why. I would probably argue she didn't become a very well written character until Aliens, but I'd have to go back and rewatch the first in order to properly say anything.

And this was precisely what I was talking about. She was MEANT to be a stoic military person, the rest was added in sequels, which by the way, weren't all done by Scott. I specifically remember the second movie being by James Cameron

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

If something is "objectively" true I'm going to need evidence. It's no longer opinion

 

[praline]

Same can be said for your Alakazam wanting to learn Kinesis. But I left it the way it is not to mess with it.

Well I'm a scrub who doesn't use non fighting moves so I wouldn't have added it anyways. lol

 

[Kurri ★]

With the X-Wing thing, I agree with you on. With defeating the empire...to an extent I agree with you. I do think he had significant help from Han, Leia, and his friends of course. He has Mary Sue traits, but he's far from being one.

On the topic of TFA, I think it depends on how you look at the movie. If you're brand new to the franchise, it's a really good movie and it's fun. However, if you're a seasoned Star Wars fan like myself, it ends up being average overall.

Except there's a large number of "seasoned fans" who enjoyed TFA, such as I.

 

[Hat N' Clogs]

Except there's a large number of "seasoned fans" who enjoyed TFA, such as I.

*sigh* Sorry for having piss poor wording then...if you enjoyed it, that's great. Glad you enjoyed it.
I thought it was ok, just not a favorite.

Yay me for not being good enough to explain things...

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

I'm ready when you are TylerBlackRunIt .

And it's fine if you don't have the extra Metal Coat.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Hes dismissing what I have to say and saying he's objectively right

And I think a movie gets to have objectively good writing if the movie is one of the most successful movies out there and also has critical acclaim. You don't see 2016 GB getting any awards for it's meh everything nor do you see ET Atari get praise. Sure, you can say it's flawed, but there's a difference between the two

 

[wedl!!]

View attachment 124047

I think an article published on the NYT has a bit more leyway, no?

Regardless, SJWs are so 2015. Trump winning should have been more than a sign that people are tired of the far left. It's just funny to see these people run circles around themselves. Give someone a long enough rope and they'll hang themselves with it, is what they say.

No I just think people are tired of pretentious neoliberalism. But the common folk are glad to take said SJW NOOSES and shackle themselves to nationalism and fascism!

I just didn't feel like linking to either one as I don't feel either of these people deserve views for writing clickbait.

sure, it's a "hot take", but I don't get how this automatically makes it wrong

you're just mashing buzzwords together at this point

 

[Deleted member]

With the X-Wing thing, I agree with you on. With defeating the empire...to an extent I agree with you. I do think he had significant help from Han, Leia, and his friends of course. He has Mary Sue traits, but he's far from being one.

Yep. That's exactly what I mean. He has Mary Sue traits, but hes not a complete Mary Sue, there's context to be considered. Though it doesn't help that the power of the empire set up outside of the original trilogy makes them seem much way more threatening and powerful than in the OT. It makes them seem silly in the OT.

The same applies to Rey, she seems much more so like a Mary Sue if you don't apply context that she recieves help and that her enemies to be rather weak or amateurish.(The first order isn't suppose to be nearly as powerful or threatening as the empire.)

It's not that TFA doesn't have its problems, it's just that people tend to have nostalgia goggles when it comes to the original trilogy. I don't think any movie in the Star Wars franchise is really even that great, it just has the huge following to get such grand appreciation.

Also, the original trilogy was incredibly plot driven, not character driven. Most of the plot wouldn't exist without a lot of coincidences.(To be fair I'm not criticizing it for that, it's hard not to when you're covering movies that have such a huge world and have to cover it in such a short amount of time, but still.)

 

[Opossum]

In what may be a vain attempt to change the subject, I have a hypothetical scenario I want to ask this thread about.

So Nintendo's been saying for a while now that they want to do more with their IP. So far this has been shown with their mobile games and Super Nintendo World. Today I got to thinking about what other avenues they could explore and one idea got me thinking harder than the rest...I just have no idea if people would have any interest in it.

Hypothetically, if Nintendo were to do it, would anyone here read a licensed Nintendo game-based novel? Naturally some series lend themselves better to this than others, but I figured it might be worth exploring. Marvel and Star Wars both do pretty well with this despite branching from other forms of media, so it's not a completely unexplored market.

Would anyone find this interesting? Any series or game in particular you'd like to see this happen for?

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

And I think a movie gets to have objectively good writing if the movie is one of the most successful movies out there and also has critical acclaim. You don't see 2016 GB getting any awards for it's meh everything nor do you see ET Atari get praise. Sure, you can say it's flawed, but there's a difference between the two

That doesn't make it objectively good

Avatar was absolutely horrible and it's one of the highest grossing movies

 

[Hat N' Clogs]

Yep. That's exactly what I mean. He has Mary Sue traits, but hes not a complete Mary Sue, there's context to be considered. Though it doesn't help that the power of the empire set up outside of the original trilogy makes them seem much way more threatening and powerful than in the OT. It makes them seem silly in the OT.

The same applies to Rey, she seems much more so like a Mary Sue if you don't apply context that she recieves help and that her enemies to be rather weak or amateurish.(The first order isn't suppose to be nearly as powerful or threatening as the empire.)

It's not that TFA doesn't have its problems, it's just that people tend to have nostalgia goggles when it comes to the original trilogy. I don't think any movie in the Star Wars franchise is really even that great, it just has the huge following to get such grand appreciation.

Yeah, that makes sense. Thanks for explaining.
And you're right, Rey did need some help in order to succeed. I personally like Rey as a character myself
(favorite Star Wars character overall is still Obi-Wan though)

 

[Cutie Gwen]

In what may be a vain attempt to change the subject, I have a hypothetical scenario I want to ask this thread about.

So Nintendo's been saying for a while now that they want to do more with their IP. So far this has been shown with their mobile games and Super Nintendo World. Today I got to thinking about what other avenues they could explore and one idea got me thinking harder than the rest...I just have no idea if people would have any interest in it.

Hypothetically, if Nintendo were to do it, would anyone here read a licensed Nintendo game-based novel? Naturally some series lend themselves better to this than others, but I figured it might be worth exploring. Marvel and Star Wars both do pretty well with this despite branching from other forms of media, so it's not a completely unexplored market.

Would anyone find this interesting? Any series or game in particular you'd like to see this happen for?

Zelda, Metroid and Fire Emblem seem like good franchises to do this with

That doesn't make it objectively good

Avatar was absolutely horrible and it's one of the highest grossing movies

Dude, at that point you just have godawful taste if you say that about Avatar

 

[TylerBlackRunIt]

I'm ready when you are TylerBlackRunIt .

And it's fine if you don't have the extra Metal Coat.

Ok, im ready

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Zelda, Metroid and Fire Emblem seem like good franchises to do this with

Dude, at that point you just have godawful taste if you say that about Avatar

LOL, really?

Unobtanium

Brilliant writing

 

[SegaNintendoUbisoft]

In what may be a vain attempt to change the subject, I have a hypothetical scenario I want to ask this thread about.

So Nintendo's been saying for a while now that they want to do more with their IP. So far this has been shown with their mobile games and Super Nintendo World. Today I got to thinking about what other avenues they could explore and one idea got me thinking harder than the rest...I just have no idea if people would have any interest in it.

Hypothetically, if Nintendo were to do it, would anyone here read a licensed Nintendo game-based novel? Naturally some series lend themselves better to this than others, but I figured it might be worth exploring. Marvel and Star Wars both do pretty well with this despite branching from other forms of media, so it's not a completely unexplored market.

Would anyone find this interesting? Any series or game in particular you'd like to see this happen for?

I'm not a big novel reader myself, but aside from the obvious Zelda answer, Metroid has the potential to be a really good novel.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

LOL, really?

Unobtanium

Brilliant writing

Bravo
You used a single word to prove the writing of the entire movie is horrible
You officially picked a cherry
Do not collect $200 after passing start

 

[wedl!!]

avatar was a **** movie which only blew up because of its then-stellar visuals

 

[praline]

I decided for Pixilate to be the hidden ability for my regional Machamp.

 

[Hat N' Clogs]

I don't have an opinion on Avatar lol. Only seen 2 clips of it. I'm not really up for any argument right now

*tips hat and leaves thread*

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

Ok, im ready

I've taught your Scizor "Bullet Punch" and replaced Quick Attack.

Are you cool with that?

 

[Opossum]

Avatar was literally just Atlantis: The Lost Empire with less likable characters.


As someone who sees A:TLE as severely underrated, Avatar irks me more than it should.

 

[TylerBlackRunIt]

I've taught your Scizor "Bullet Punch" and replaced Quick Attack.

Are you cool with that?

yeah thanks

 

[Schnee117]

Debbie Reynolds (Carrie Fisher's mother) is now in Hospital. That's just ****ing cruel.

In what may be a vain attempt to change the subject, I have a hypothetical scenario I want to ask this thread about.

So Nintendo's been saying for a while now that they want to do more with their IP. So far this has been shown with their mobile games and Super Nintendo World. Today I got to thinking about what other avenues they could explore and one idea got me thinking harder than the rest...I just have no idea if people would have any interest in it.

Hypothetically, if Nintendo were to do it, would anyone here read a licensed Nintendo game-based novel? Naturally some series lend themselves better to this than others, but I figured it might be worth exploring. Marvel and Star Wars both do pretty well with this despite branching from other forms of media, so it's not a completely unexplored market.

Would anyone find this interesting? Any series or game in particular you'd like to see this happen for?

As long as the writer isn't Karen Traviss. Work on Halo was bad outside of Jul 'Mdama's rise to power which was just a very small part of the trilogy she did.

Troy Denning (Halo: Last Light) or Peter David (Halo: Hunters in the Dark) would be great picks for Metroid.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Avatar was literally just Atlantis: The Lost Empire with less likable characters.


As someone who sees A:TLA as severely underrated, Avatar irks me more than it should.

I really like Atlantis, I really don't see why it failed as much as it did.

I'd like to see Kida as a Disney Princess

 

[wedl!!]

avatar also has the crippling flaw of not having a lez-as-hell antagonist (atlantis does)

 

[Deleted member]

Yes really. I LITERALLY said 'antagonist' in my first argument, in which you then said protagonist in your reply, and when I said the definition of BOTH, you replied with 'protagonist' when talking about how I described ANTAGONIST. You didn't say 'Actually, you're mixing them up' or anything to correct me, so I highly doubt that means I'm wrong.

Oh, then I misread.

Protagonist can drive the plot too though. See Stein's Gate, Death Note, Breaking Bad, etc... These aren't concrete rules, and the point I was trying to make was against characters who are reactionary. It doesn't often work unless you write your story around that. It just about any decent monomyth, it's the protagonist who takes sets things going for one reason or another. Characters making conscious decisions give us a window into their minds, as their actions are driven by purpose, and purpose and motivation are what make characters interesting.

If you're unable to properly define a character's motivations and purpose, whether they be proactive, or reactionary, then that's not a very well-written character. People are a lot more nuanced than a person who is simply taken for a ride and has the world deliver a tailored adventure just for them.

Even a lack of purpose can be a motivation, look at Welcome to the NHK.

But for a Monomyth, unless a character is written with an explicit lack of purpose and you're seeking to explore that, a reactionary character is hard to make work.

"I'm sure he'll be fine" isn't good enough. This is from the same movie that killed one of the franchise's most beloved characters, so you can't go 'loldidny', not to mention Disney owns Marvel now so I guess all Marvel characters have always been fine since the buy-out.

Han Solo had a death sign hanging over his head the entire movie, it couldn't be move obvious he was gonna die. Especially since Harrison Ford had been wanting to kill him since EpV, and had said that he'd only sign up for another trilogy if he could kill Solo off.

As an aside, the way in which Solo was killed also bothered me. Especially since it was at the climax of the film. It didn't serve the story at all. I would have much liked it if Solo had been killed before the story was set in motion, and actually, most of the story on Ren's side dealt with him coping with his decisions and emotions. Ren has a semblance of nuance, but he has no core direction, and as a result, rather than coming off as conflicted and complicated, instead is just omnidirectional and sloppy in character. Which is a pity, cause they could have done more with him. As it stands though, I think he's by far the character with the most potential for VIII though, as he's the only one with any semblence of character.

The last time they tried explaining the force the entire fanbase got angry as hell. What's to say stamina doesn't play a part?

But that was only cause when they did that, it **** all over the established canon and took the fantasy out of SW by turning mystical space magic, into mitychlorians.

But you DID! You said that the protagonist for the new KR was well-liked for his feminine traits, and the only remotely feminine trait he has, caring and stuff, is because of his job. You ARGUED something against someone who knows what they're talking about. You don't do that. Also, Rey is pretty much Luke 2.0 just like the rest of TFA being like ANH, so if Rey is a Mary Sue, so is Luke.

I didn't say he was well liked, I merely said that a character with more nuance to them by having both masculine and feminine traits is inherently more interesting.

As for Rey, I can nuke your arguement with one simple question.

"What are Rey's core motivations and drives?"
WHO is she? What does she want? What is her PURPOSE from the start of the film?

None of these are answered over the course of the movie.

Luke on the other hand has all of these questions totally answered before he even gets off Tattooine: He wants to follow in his father's footsteps and become great, just like his father whom he's been told so much about. Him wanting to rescue Leia was in part cause he was horny, but also because it was a chance to prove himself and find adventure. It was a call to action.

 

[Deleted member]

Who are you to tell me what's good writing>?

How many books has your family published

Someone who can actually differentiate writing quality to enjoyment
I don't give a single **** to how many books your family has published when you can't differentiate those two and it doesn't seem like you know what makes good writing
Saying TFA is objectively bad would mean its plot structure doesn't make sense, the characters are unlikeable or artificial, use of tropes that indicate bad writing, etc etc.
TFA has none of that: its plot is consistent, its characters feel real and it doesn't have things like a Deus ex Machina.

Like, I hate The Fault in Our Stars, I hate that book so much but I can't deny that its writing is brilliant because it actually managed to make me finish, because despite me hating it.
Or the Now You See Me movies which I have found a lot of enjoyment from despite its writing being infuriating on how bad it is

Dude, at that point you just ha

I think he's talking about Avatar the movie with the blue guys
Because that one was ****