Social NintenZone Social 4 - Bring It In, Guys!

[Aurane]

Stop saying body forms are the reason a character wouldn't work. We got two balls, a plant frog and Olimar to work.

 

[Deleted member]

Actually, I wouldn't mind this.

We would have gotten him if it wasn't for Sakurai wanting more balanced evolutionary lines for Pokémon Trainer's choices instead (hence why Squirtle would be chosen over the water canon turtle).

As much as I want to believe Venusaur would have worked, I feel Venusaur also played a role against the idea of everyone being fully evolved.

AND IIRC, the initial concept was either going to be all base or all finals.
So the same argument you're giving for Blastoise? Can be applied to Charmander and Bulbasaur.

 

[Z25]

People betting on a Gen VII Pokemon are going to be disappointed.

People betting on Robinhoot are going to be REALLY disappointed.

I don't see how.

If it's an enhanced port it'll likely come out within the first year of the Switch. So a lack of relevance isn't an issue.

And then there's the fact that Sun and Moon are, in part, the culmination of Pokémon's 20th anniversary. That's massive, and I can easily see Sakurai wanting someone from it in the game. Add in the fact that a pure archer character (that is, using their bow and arrows for more than their neutral special) hasn't been seen in Smash yet, and I really think it's a solid bet.

It's at the very least a lot more plausible than Sceptile's "complete the starter type trio" bandwagon.

I think at least one mon from Gen 7 is very likely. It's Nintendo's second biggest IP, has a massive range of characters, and many of them have high moveset potential and elemental abilities that few other characters are capable of.

That's a big reason why Sakurai and his team pulled the trigger on a Gen 6 mon for the first two versions: X and Y were going to have been out for a year by their release, and Pokémon from that generation were going to be relevant. Game Freak sent them art assets and other things for some of the new mons, and Greninja was chosen out of them. His "window of opportunity" was open, as Sakurai has said about relevance before. I think they'll do it again, especially considering there are prominent mons with plant/wind and earth powers this time around, which are very rare on the roster as is.

Granted, I'm guessing this game won't be out right at launch, it'll be out next fall right at the end of the launch window...

These reasons, Plus it's Pokemon which sells, the games are already becoming the biggest in the franchise and we don't even physically have them. The series is more exposed then ever. A port falls in the right time.

The two popular starters are Robinhoot and Luchalitten. Both offer completely new playstyles. Greninja was chosen from concept art before it physically existed and had popularity.

The starter concepts leaked and became massively known and popular. GF and Nintendo know how much the starters are going to sell.

Not choosing a new Pokemon rep from the latest installment would be a huge missed opportunity to cash in on the franchise. Especially since Corrin was in a similar scenario where Japan had him for some time, now everyone will have the starters at once and the game will have equal worldwide exposure. Making this the perfect marketing idea.

Plus we need another grass type...

 

[Delzethin]

Watch it be some character that almost no one saw coming.

/inb4 we get something like Alolan Ninetales or Kommo-o

 

[AwesomeAussie27]

Watch it be some character that almost no one saw coming.

Soooooooo Alola Persian and Alola Dugtrio?

Stop saying body forms are the reason a character wouldn't work. We got two balls, a plant frog and Olimar to work.

This.

 

[Aurane]

Kommo-o

I'd be down with that. Street Fighter-esqe dragon with dreads? Hell yes I'd be okay.

 

[Z25]

Watch it be some character that almost no one saw coming.

Arcade Bunny Gets His Game On!?

please....

 

[N3ON]

If GF wants another Pokemon in there, we'll get some Gen 7, if not, I doubt it.

Stop saying body forms are the reason a character wouldn't work. We got two balls, a plant frog and Olimar to work.

And we didn't get a guy with balloons or one who rides a bike.

 

[Aurane]

And we didn't get a guy with balloons or one who rides a bike.

Yeah we did.

 

[Arcanir]

I really don't see how Rowlet3 is only being held up by the GWF thing that Sceptile did. Unlike Sceptile, Rowlet3 is undoubtedly the most popular starter of its generation (not to mention the line as a whole) and the fandom as a whole as been very receptive to it. Additionally, as of right now, it isn't overshadowed by a Pokémon that had a lot more popularity and promotion to it, so it's not like the typing is being used as a clutch to place it higher then it really was. So with Rowlet3, its popularity is coming more from its actual standing in the fandom rather then an arbitrary reason, the Grass typing comes off as more incidental then a major part of its push.

That's not to say Litten3, Mimikyu, the Rockruff line, or even Silvally don't have merits to be considered over it as honestly they along with Rowlet3 are probably the top choices of the generation at this point for multiple reasons, but I feel Rowlet3's is being unfairly written off here as "GWF filler" when it has actual merits to it that are being overlooked.

 

[Deleted member]

What's with all the mentioning of balls in this thread all of the sudden?

Watch it be some character that almost no one saw coming.

So Alola Dugtrio or Alola Persian?

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

What's with all the mentioning of balls in this thread all of the sudden?

So Alola Dugtrio or Alola Persian?

Kirby and Jigglypuff says hi!

And I doubt the former would really work. Have we seen Dugtrio really jump out of them mole holes?

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Okay...

I did not say Robinhoot had no merits.

STOP SAYING I SAID THAT!!!

I said I don't think he'll be picked.

****, at least address what I was saying.

 

[Cardboardtubeknight]

So is a new character in the line or something? I don't keep up. I'm too drunk to taste this chicken.

 

[Deleted member]

Kirby and Jigglypuff says hi!

And I doubt the former would really work. Have we seen Dugtrio really jump out of them mole holes?

I'm pretty sure that every time they'd jump they'd push themselves out of the ground with their fabulous hair and fly around with it.

 

[N3ON]

Yeah we did.

I hate you, well played.

 

[Deleted member]

Honestly, I feel people are jumping the gun with Robingroot much like people jumped the gun on Zoroark.

Remember when Zoroark was clearly the most likely Pokémon to be added to Smash because of how Lucario got in Brawl?

Replace "Zoroark" with Robingroot, "Lucario" with Greninja, and "Brawl" with Smash 4, and that's the exact same thing we've got.
With the added twist of the same reasoning Sceptile was such a shoo-in once Charizard and Greninja were revealed for Smash 4. "MUH GRASS STARTER".


Could Robingroot be the Alola Pokémon that is added to a hypothetical Smash Bros. for Nintendo Switch? Sure.
Is it the only one that could? Not at all.

 

[Jaedrik]

Well, from a hypothetical point of view, long as it goes both ways and if people have that much of a problem with whoever the service provider is they'd likely boycott anyway.


However, like many libertarian views, that's simply just a hypothetical wet dream that doesn't work so much in execution. A huge reason why anti discrimination laws are in place, is so you aren't denied basic public access basically everywhere you go. I'd rather not see "white only" signs across America again, that slippery slope goes both ways. I'd personally rather deal with people without any conflict, not every person I talk to daily needs to know every single personal detail about me every time I have to go shopping or anything along those lines, I'd rather just go on with whatever business and go on with my day.

Yeah, it'd work in a lab setting, but then you've got certain hot spots like the south where things would be, well... I don't think I really need to explain. Though that's not the only way, there's plenty of ways where you can just see all kinds of unnecessary controversy weekly on what could of easily been avoided if business was business.

And no this isn't about the whole cake thing, I could care less about that, that was such a non issue.

It's not so much a hypothetical as it is a thought experiment showing that a principle must be applied consistently if it's to be a principle, and helping to explain what that principle is. It seems you've misunderstood what I meant by "fully informed," though. When it's plainly obvious someone is just making something up to escape an obligation, that wouldn't be considered legitimate grounds to back out of a contract. On the other hand, it should be fairly obvious, one can easily get testimony from neighbors as to whether someone actually holds a position, when someone has a personal objection and is being truthful about it.

The contention you're making is that civil society can't be trusted to root out the people who give bad reasons for their denial, and so government must compulse them. On the contrary, it's a statist wet dream that we can trust government when civil society fails, as Herr Mises says: "If one rejects laissez faire on account of man's fallibility and moral weakness, one must for the same reason also reject every kind of government action.” Though things may be bad, the idea that a bureaucratic institution can force anyone to behave virtuously is a ridiculous notion. Civil society; communities, churches, charities, associations, and the individual himself, is what makes a person virtuous or vile. Politics is generally downstream from culture, so what bureaucratization does is give inertia cultural norms. It (usually) cannot change cultural norms by use of force, and will only create more resentment, unrest, and hatred, just like it did in the South after the Civil War.

Because of all this, I forward that society would be much better off if there was no public access at all, as in all things were privately owned. Why? Because, at best, governments imitate a virtuous society and, at worst, suppress good change by bureaucratization of bad social norms. Governments force everyone to abide by those rules, and if the government simply didn't have the power to impose such rules then the choice would be left to the individual. It then follows that at least some virtuous people in an otherwise morally corrupt society would be allowed to open their drinking fountains and banks and other establishments to whomever is being discriminated against, and start to overtake the others because of the incredible boon their business gets. In fact, when left alone, this is what blacks did in the South: they made their own enclaves and restaurants and investment firms and grew prosperous because they practiced their own discrimination and catered to themselves, and supported those who would support them. That's what makes the community strong, its power to rise above and compete with other communities rather than having to come begging for work and services. And rise it did, until it was all demolished by laws and programs such as The Great Society. Discrimination goes both ways; society isn't one huge, monolithic entity (as opposed to the state / government, which has monopoly on the use of force), and that's a far better situation than forcing people which, again, creates resentment and hatred and breaks down civil discourse. In a virtuous society, the bad actors would simply be boycotted out of existence, would otherwise be inconsequential, or be converted through reason to the truth (for, that which is true is good, and that which is true has all the best arguments) of liberty and harmonious civil society.

No matter what way one puts it, it seems that liberty, consistently applied, comes out on top.

 

[AwesomeAussie27]

What's with all the mentioning of balls in this thread all of the sudden?

So Alola Dugtrio or Alola Persian?

Even though I was the one to said this first, I would be all for Alola Persian.

Just look at that **** eating grin, that Garfield parody is just asking to be a star in Smash.

 

[N3ON]

Okay...

I did not say Robinhoot had no merits.

STOP SAYING I SAID THAT!!!

I said I don't think he'll be picked.

****, at least address what I was saying.

I don't understand your reasoning for not putting him with Tigerman, Ghost Pikachu or Tappy Cocoa.

All I've seen is you say he's not as likely as people think. He's the most popular starter. He's the last of the three starter types, for whatever that's worth. He would work fine in Smash. Why isn't he at least on par with those other three?

So is a new character in the line or something? I don't keep up. I'm too drunk to taste this chicken.

Yes.

The next one in line is Isaac, so that's the one we'll be getting

Honestly, I feel people are jumping the gun with Robingroot much like people jumped the gun on Zoroark.

Remember when Zoroark was clearly the most likely Pokémon to be added to Smash because of how Lucario got in Brawl?

Replace "Zoroark" with Robingroot, "Lucario" with Greninja, and "Brawl" with Smash 4, and that's the exact same thing we've got.
With the added twist of the same reasoning Sceptile was such a shoo-in once Charizard and Greninja were revealed for Smash 4. "MUH GRASS STARTER".


Could Robingroot be the Alola Pokémon that is added to a hypothetical Smash Bros. for Nintendo Switch? Sure.
Is it the only one that could? Not at all.

I still feel that without Gen VI showing up, Zoroark is the one that would've got in.

I'm not saying we will get Owlmon, or even a new Pokemon, but I don't see Gen VIII showing up before this port releases.

 

[Deleted member]

Also remember when no one had a clear idea on a Kalos Pokémon because there was no "Lucario" for that Generation like Zoroark was supposed to be for Unova?

And how Greninja blindsided a majority of us for a multitude of reasons?


So....why exactly are we trying to use Greninja as a reference point when using Lucario as one clearly didn't work again...?

 

[Cardboardtubeknight]

Yes.

The next one in line is Isaac, so that's the one we'll be getting

So yeah so like Captain Falcon is my boy in this picture I gotta say

 

[Aurane]

Also remember when no one had a clear idea on a Kalos Pokémon because there was no "Lucario" for that Generation like Zoroark was supposed to be for Unova?

And how Greninja blindsided a majority of us for a multitude of reasons?


So....why exactly are we trying to use Greninja as a reference point when using Lucario as one clearly didn't work again...?

Welcome to the Smash fanbase- a large group of bigots repeating past mistakes to doom their own futures in order to stay afloat in the air by sheer force of anger and spite.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

Even though I was the one to said this first, I would be all for Alola Persian.

Just look at that **** eating grin, that Garfield parody is just asking to be a star in Smash.

I seriously don't see the similarities between the two.

He looks more like an uglier Nermal than anything.

 

[N3ON]

Also remember when no one had a clear idea on a Kalos Pokémon because there was no "Lucario" for that Generation like Zoroark was supposed to be?

And how Greninja blindsided a majority of us for a multitude of reasons?


So....why exactly are we trying to use Greninja as a reference point when using Lucario as one clearly didn't work again...?

Probably because there is a parallel to Greninja in this gen. At least as far as a feasible, popular final starter (who completes the trio). If there was a parallel to Lucario we'd probably be prioritizing that one even above the Greninja parallel. Prior to Smash 4 people didn't think we'd get the starters unless we got all three types, now they know better and will use that as their fallback.

We probably also would've gotten the "Lucario" of Gen VI over Greninja if there had been one. Just my guess.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I don't understand your reasoning for not putting him with Tigerman, Ghost Pikachu or Tappy Cocoa.

All I've seen is you say he's not as likely as people think. He's the most popular starter. He's the last of the three starter types, for whatever that's worth. He would work fine in Smash. Why isn't he at least on par with those other three?

Personally, I feel that he's not gonna be the marketed one.

I think the Litten line is gonna be that.

 

[Deleted member]

Probably because there is a parallel to Greninja in this gen. At least as far as a feasible, popular final starter (who completes the trio). If there was a parallel to Lucario we'd probably be prioritizing that one even above the Greninja parallel. Prior to Smash 4 people didn't think we'd get the starters unless we got all three types, now they know better and will use that as their fallback.

We probably also would've gotten the "Lucario" of Gen VI over Greninja if there had been one. Just my guess.

I beg you to please stop trying to use the "complete the trio" point.

It was bull**** when it was first used for Sceptile, it's still bull**** now.
Typing is irrelevant. If Robingroot gets in, it will be because what it can do appeals to Sakurai/whoever is directing, not because "MUH GRASS TYPE".

Greninja wasn't chosen because of being a Water type Starter to counter Charizard being a Fire type Starter. So using Robingroot being a Grass type Starter as a parallel to Greninja is doing it wrong.

Also, people using the "popularity" argument for Robingroot as parallel to Greninja are doing it wrong as well.
Yes, Greninja is the most popular Kalos Starter and one of the more popular Pokémon in general right now.
However.....
....that wasn't the case when Greninja was chosen. Literally NONE OF US knew who Greninja was when Sakurai chose him for Smash.

 

[N3ON]

Personally, I feel that he's not gonna be the marketed one.

I think the Litten line is gonna be that.

I mean, you might be right, but seems a little presumptuous to act as if already a fact.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I don't understand your reasoning for not putting him with Tigerman, Ghost Pikachu or Tappy Cocoa.

All I've seen is you say he's not as likely as people think. He's the most popular starter. He's the last of the three starter types, for whatever that's worth. He would work fine in Smash. Why isn't he at least on par with those other three?


Yes.

The next one in line is Isaac, so that's the one we'll be getting


I still feel that without Gen VI showing up, Zoroark is the one that would've got in.

I'm not saying we will get Owlmon, or even a new Pokemon, but I don't see Gen VIII showing up before this port releases.

Add everyone else there too, then sure

Except Krystal maybe

 

[Deleted member]

Personally, I feel that he's not gonna be the marketed one.

I think the Litten line is gonna be that.

This is where I disagree with you.
It's already implied Ash gets Rowlett in the anime.

On that note, I can see Robingroot being among the top candidates along with Beltigre and Mimikyu.
Not Tapu Koko or any of the other Tapus.
I'd say something like UB-01 is more of a candidate than the Tapus.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

This is where I disagree with you.
It's already implied Ash gets Rowlett in the anime.

On that note, I can see Robingroot being among the top candidates along with Beltigre and Mimikyu.

Well, they did do a survey and Rowlett had all the hype since it's initial reveal

It's only smart they go with that

 

[Deleted member]

Well, they did do a survey and Rowlett had all the hype since it's initial reveal

It's only smart they go with that

Not wise to go with the results of the base form for judgment of a final evolution we're technically supposed to know nothing about.

Lest we forget poor Fennekin.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

t's already implied Ash gets Rowlett in the anime.

Is it?

I thought he got Litten.

I honestly don't know anymore.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I got one potential way Ash doesn't get a Rowlett

Ash is confirmed not to be using Popplio

However, Hau or whatever his name is always picks the starter WEAK against the protagonist

So, with the two other starters

Rowlett is weak against Litten

 

[Deleted member]

Is it?

I thought he got Litten.

I honestly don't know anymore.

For all we know, he could end up getting both, like how he was primarily advertised with Turtwig, then got Chimchar later on which quickly overtook Turtwig as the "main" Starter for him.

But at least on the poster for the new season, Ash, Pikachu, and Rowlett (and the Rotom Pokedex) are all surrounded by a white "aura" together. Litten though is looking pretty smug being right in front of the "camera". And unlike Popplio, we have no idea who owns it....

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Watch Sakurai just be all ''You expected a new gen Pokemon? Too bad. You're getting Diggersby and you're going to like it!"

 

[Arcanir]

Okay...

I did not say Robinhoot had no merits.

STOP SAYING I SAID THAT!!!

I said I don't think he'll be picked.

****, at least address what I was saying.

If you're referring to me, I never said that anyone said it had no merits whatsoever (and I was speaking more generally, but that's neither here or there). My point on the matter was more that it's underselling those merits to equate it and its fandom with Sceptile's, not that those merits were said to be nonexistent.

 

[N3ON]

I beg you to please stop trying to use the "complete the trio" point.

It was bull**** when it was first used for Sceptile, it's still bull**** now.
Typing is irrelevant. If Robingroot gets in, it will be because what it can do appeals to Sakurai/whoever is directing, not because "MUH GRASS TYPE".

Greninja wasn't chosen because of being a Water type Starter to counter Charizard being a Fire type Starter. So using Robingroot being a Grass type Starter as a parallel to Greninja is doing it wrong.

Also, people using the "popularity" argument for Robingroot as parallel to Greninja are doing it wrong as well.
Yes, Greninja is the most popular Kalos Starter and one of the more popular Pokémon in general right now.
However.....
....that wasn't the case when Greninja was chosen. Literally NONE OF US knew who Greninja was when Sakurai chose him for Smash.

Other times I've clarified the typing might not be worth anything. Probably even on this page or last. I don't type that every time, that's on me. Also there's been no game between 4 and now, so the Sceptile thing was always a strange, ill-fitting comparison. For many reasons. Least of which being expecting another Pokemon at that point in general was idealistic.

I'm content to wait until a Smash game coincides with a gen in which there is no Lucario or Mewtwo counterpart which contains a feasible grass type starter and it gets overlooked in favour of another starter. Until then I'm not disregarding it. Obviously it might mean nothing. And I'm aware that might never happen. It's pretty specific. Feel free to scoff.

The main reason though is that people didn't believe we'd get only one of the three starters in a gen as playable, before it was Pokemon Trainers or nothing, so since Greninja (and Charizard) people support individual ones. People like precedence. So they're going with the most popular one, not just due to Greninja but due to Charizard as well.

To be fair though I haven't even seen that much Gen VII Smash talk until today.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I wasn't a fan of sceptile until it got it's mega form

I always thought that sceptile's tail was really odd looking

But mega sceptile gave the tail a point

Spoiler

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

Just got back from seeing Dr.Strange and I saw Smash 4 enhanced port speculation a few pages before:

1. Wolf (Prediction and Want)
2. Ice Climber (Prediction)
3. Inkling (Prediction + Want)
4. Final evolution of a Gen 7 starter Pokemon (Prediction)
5. A third party character (Prediction, Simon Belmont maybe???)
6. Wilcard AKA totally don't want Kyo or a KOF rep