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[BluePikmin11]

Part 5 of the individual character poll is complete:
https://goo.gl/zqINJP
Go vote guys!

 

[True Blue Warrior]

I think having ICs as WiiU exclusive is still a bad idea; if a character will only work on one of the consoles, you should be putting the development that would have went into them into a different character that will work just fine on both.

They were already being worked on the Wii U version- in fact, scrapping them from a version they were running on is a greater waste of development time.

 

[PushDustIn]

I still don't think the Ice Climbers could work in 8 Player Smash, and that's part of the reason they got axed. 8 Ice Climbers would make 16 Player Smash, essentially. If the Wii U can't handle Ridley/ giving Wii Fit Trainer a proper thumb with 8 players I doubt the Wii U could handle 4 extra Nanas.

 

[Schnee117]

Part 5 of the individual character poll is complete:
https://goo.gl/zqINJP
Go vote guys!

Cia's on there twice.

Spoiler

 

[Omega Tyrant]

They were already being worked on the Wii U version- in fact, scrapping them from a version they were running on is a greater waste of development time.

"Working" =! fully done, the evidence in the data shows they didn't make it that far (they don't have a reference to their series emblem while RH does), and we don't know if they were even workable in 8-man Smash. They still required a bunch of more development/resources at the time they were cut, and if they weren't cut, it could have been another character like Bowser Jr. that was instead scrapped.

 

[Chandeelure]

I still don't think the Ice Climbers could work in 8 Player Smash, and that's part of the reason they got axed. 8 Ice Climbers would make 16 Player Smash, essentially. If the Wii U can't handle Ridley/ giving Wii Fit Trainer a proper thumb with 8 players I doubt the Wii U could handle 4 extra Nanas.

Yeah, you are right, I don't know why people can't see that.
8 Player Smash has lag sometimes and characters have less bones, like WFT, Roy, etc.
The Ice Climbers will not come back.

 

[SuperSegaSonicSS]

Yeah, you are right, I don't know why people can't see that.
8 Player Smash has lag sometimes and characters have less bones, like WFT, Roy, etc.
The Ice Climbers will not come back.

This kinda makes me think if this is the main problem, why did they forced that mode into the game when it still wasn't practical yet? It's been said Sakurai wanted it in since Melee, but if it's just not going to work efficiently with everything in the game, why bother?

 

[A Distant Demon]

Part 5 of the individual character poll is complete:
https://goo.gl/zqINJP
Go vote guys!

Just saying but Cia shows up twice on the poll
EDIT greninja'd hard. page not loading again. ZZZ


late from awkward sleep schedule but my most wanted megas are
1. Mega Nidoking/queen
2. Mega krookodile
3. Mega Luxray

 

[BluePikmin11]

Cia's on there twice.

Spoiler

View attachment 73024

Fixed.

 

[TheAnvil]

I still don't think the Ice Climbers could work in 8 Player Smash, and that's part of the reason they got axed. 8 Ice Climbers would make 16 Player Smash, essentially. If the Wii U can't handle Ridley/ giving Wii Fit Trainer a proper thumb with 8 players I doubt the Wii U could handle 4 extra Nanas.

Maybe. But Sakurai did say they were working on the Wii U.

 

[Chandeelure]

This kinda makes me think if this is the main problem, why did they forced that mode into the game when it still wasn't practical yet? It's been said Sakurai wanted it in since Melee, but if it's just not going to work efficiently with everything in the game, why bother?

Because it was possible and it's more content/reasons to buy the game, I think.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

"Working" =! fully done, the evidence in the data shows they didn't make it that far (they don't have a reference to their series emblem while RH does), and we don't know if they were even workable in 8-man Smash. They still required a bunch of more development/resources at the time they were cut, and if they weren't cut, it could have been another character like Bowser Jr. that was instead scrapped.

At least with someone like Bowser Jr., you got a character that could have easily been DLC had he not been on the initial roster, which is definetly a better scenario than what happened with the Ice Climbers.

 

[SuperSegaSonicSS]

Because it was possible and it's more content/reasons to buy the game, I think.

I guess. But I think if would have just been better to keep something that was a staple to the series and more without other character's getting altered in movesets; Zelda and Samus, or cut entirely because of just one mode, Ice Climbers and Pokemon Trainer, when no one really minded just 4 player Smash since the 64 days. But that's just my opinion.

 

[DoodleDuck97]

It would be great to see Popo come to Mario Maker around Christmas time.
Seeing how this is also his game's 30th anniversary.
I would still love ice Climbers to come back as DLC even if only for Wii U.

 

[Omega Tyrant]

At least with someone like Bowser Jr., you got a character that could have easily been DLC had he not been on the initial roster, which is definetly a better scenario than what happened with the Ice Climbers.

Or, we get Bowser Jr. on both versions in the base game while getting another character for DLC that works just fine on both versions, instead of having one of the slots taken by a character that only works on one version. In both scenarios the ICs are not a free cost to the WiiU and it wouldn't be "the roster we have now + ICs" on WiiU.

 

[Chandeelure]

I guess. But I think if would have just been better to keep something that was a staple to the series and more without other character's getting altered in movesets; Zelda and Samus, or cut entirely because of just one mode, Ice Climbers and Pokemon Trainer, when no one really minded just 4 player Smash since the 64 days. But that's just my opinion.

Probably because 8 Player Smash is pretty "hype" and innovative, and the changes to those characters's movesets weren't really a bad thing. It made the characters more unique.
The Ice Climbers had other problems (3DS) and Squirtle, Ivysaur... I don't know, maybe Sakurai noticed that the Pokemon Trainer's mechanic was terrible and unbalanced and that Squirtle and Ivysaur as solo characters would be weird.

 

[Substitution]

Eh, to be honest I stopped missing Ice Climbers. Sure, it was sad they were gone, but I have over fifty other characters to pick from. And to be honest, if only one character keeps me from enjoying one of the biggest rosters Smash has had, what's the point of playing?

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Or, we get Bowser Jr. on both versions in the base game while getting another character for DLC that works just fine on both versions, instead of having one of the slots taken by a character that only works on one version. In both scenarios the ICs are not a free cost to the WiiU and it wouldn't be "the roster we have now + ICs" on WiiU.

Of course they are not a free cost, but it's not as if the development time of a Brawl veteran that was already being worked on= develoment time of a potential newcomer so I don't see how the whole "taking a slot" argument works.

 

[Deleted member]

I guess. But I think if would have just been better to keep something that was a staple to the series and more without other character's getting altered in movesets; Zelda and Samus, or cut entirely because of just one mode, Ice Climbers and Pokemon Trainer, when no one really minded just 4 player Smash since the 64 days. But that's just my opinion.

We didn't have the idea of 8 player smash until this game, and my thought is, if its between 8 player smash or ic's on wii u, i would take 8 player, ic's will just find another way to infinite

 

[TheAnvil]

Squirtle and Ivysaur as solo characters would be weird.

No weirder than Jigglypuff, Lucas, Ness, Roy, Shulk or any other obscure characters.

 

[Spazzy_D]

I still don't think the Ice Climbers could work in 8 Player Smash, and that's part of the reason they got axed. 8 Ice Climbers would make 16 Player Smash, essentially. If the Wii U can't handle Ridley/ giving Wii Fit Trainer a proper thumb with 8 players I doubt the Wii U could handle 4 extra Nanas.

While there is logic behind that, it's just an assumption. No "source" behind it, so to speak.

I am pretty confident that 8 player Smash had nothing to do with the IC getting cut as Sakurai has gone on record as saying the 3DS limitations are what lead to their exclusion. If anything, I think it may have been the opposite of what you are proposing here, with Sakurai deciding to implement 8 player Smash after he realized IC would not work. I don't recall, was 8 player Smash discussed in the design documents?

 

[Burb]

[

While there is logic behind that, it's just an assumption. No "source" behind it, so to speak.

I am pretty confident that 8 player Smash had nothing to do with the IC getting cut as Sakurai has gone on record as saying the 3DS limitations are what lead to their exclusion. If anything, I think it may have been the opposite of what you are proposing here, with Sakurai deciding to implement 8 player Smash after he realized IC would not work. I don't recall, was 8 player Smash discussed in the design documents?

http://www.sourcegaming.info/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/Scan-Translation-2.png

 

[Spazzy_D]

[

http://www.sourcegaming.info/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/Scan-Translation-2.png

Thanks, I thought it was but I couldn't recall.

 

[BluePikmin11]

If you guys have reddit, please help upvote it!
https://www.reddit.com/r/nintendo/comments/3koe1d/take_the_biggest_smash_poll_ever/

 

[DoodleDuck97]

Probably because 8 Player Smash is pretty "hype" and innovative, and the changes to those characters's movesets weren't really a bad thing. It made the characters more unique.
The Ice Climbers had other problems (3DS) and Squirtle, Ivysaur... I don't know, maybe Sakurai noticed that the Pokemon Trainer's mechanic was terrible and unbalanced and that Squirtle and Ivysaur as solo characters would be weird.

See as they stand right now they are pretty good and unique.
Not to mention they would get a brand new B move if they came back be it Down or Side B seeing how Charizard swapped out Rock Smash for his down B.
And not only they would have unique final Smash seeing how they can't Mega Evolve.
I still would like to see the two of them back as well. It's also another reason why I would rather Grovyle over Sceptile as he would have to have a non Mega Evolution Final Smash.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Meanwhile as you guys all hype I'm still fighting to get my computer back.

 

[Chandeelure]

No weirder than Jigglypuff, Lucas, Ness, Roy, Shulk or any other obscure characters.

See as they stand right now they are pretty good and unique.
Not to mention they would get a brand new B move if they came back be it Down or Side B seeing how Charizard swapped out Rock Smash for his down B.
And not only they would have unique final Smash seeing how they can't Mega Evolve.
I still would like to see the two of them back as well. It's also another reason why I would rather Grovyle over Sceptile as he would have to have a non Mega Evolution Final Smash.

Jigglypuff as a character is weird, but it's a 64 veteran, there is a reason why Jigglypuff was almost cut in Melee and Brawl, it feels weird as a character. Squirtle and Ivysaur are not long time veterans and unique or not, they are pretty unnecessary and they are not even popular as Smash characters, not even Japan wants them back.
The other characters are main characters, it doesn't matter if the franchise is popular or not, those characters are important and popular in their games and Smash, so they don't feel weird as characters.

 

[Z25]

Damn Serebii was here and I missed it! Anyway I hope the new anime arc is animated and done like the Mega Arcs, that would easily make it the best arc imo. And 3 Megas:

Mega Swalot
Mega Dewgong
Mega Serperior.

 

[Chandeelure]

Damn Serebii was here and I missed it! Anyway I hope the new anime arc is animated and done like the Mega Arcs, that would easily make it the best arc imo. And 3 Megas:

Mega Swalot
Mega Dewgong
Mega Serperior.

No Mega Zoroark? XD

 

[Substitution]

Damn Serebii was here and I missed it! Anyway I hope the new anime arc is animated and done like the Mega Arcs, that would easily make it the best arc imo. And 3 Megas:

Mega Swalot
Mega Dewgong
Mega Serperior.

What would a Mega Swalot even look like?

 

[Frostwraith]

In regards to the Ice Climbers and 8P Smash:
1. @ PushDustIn has a valid point considering some characters and stages have to be toned down to work in an 8-player environment.
2. We don't know if the Ice Climbers were cut before or after 8-player Smash was fully implemented. It's possible that, had Sakurai decided to make the Ice Climbers a Wii U exclusive character, they could have run into problems and be cut anyway.
3. Adding to point 1, the 3DS limits Multi-Man modes to 5 players. Co-op modes will actually have one less opponent in the Mii Fighter team. In the Wii U version, there are always 5 enemies on-screen, being a 6 or 7 player Smash depending on the number of human players.
4. As @ Omega Tyrant stated, "working" doesn't mean "being finished". They could have been working at an earlier phase of development before the 3DS issues arose and they cut them to work on other aspects of the game, possibly granting the implementation of other ideas that would've been scrapped had they been busy with fully implementing the Ice Climbers.

Officially, yes, the Ice Cimbers were removed due to 3DS issues, but it's not unreasonable to think they'd have problems on the Wii U version. We may never know and perhaps, not even the development team knows.

 

[Chandeelure]

What would a Mega Swalot even look like?

Spoiler

 

[Omega Tyrant]

Of course they are not a free cost, but it's not as if the development time of a Brawl veteran that was already being worked on= develoment time of a potential newcomer so I don't see how the whole "taking a slot" argument works.

It's not that cutting the ICs mid-development would mean they could be replaced with an entire newcomer from scratch, it's that it frees up enough resources to be used on another in-progress character that would have been scrapped if they didn't have those extra resources.

 

[Frostwraith]

Jigglypuff is lucky to have a similar body shape as Kirby. That's why she is easily added during later development phases.

She still shares some moves with Kirby such as the up tilt, forward smash, back throw, down aerial or forward tilt. The animations are somewhat altered, but they're still similar enough.

Ganondorf is similar in that regard.

 

[Strofirko]

I don't think checkpoints will ever be added on mario maker.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Raymundo

Owlknight

Updating.

 

[Spazzy_D]

Jigglypuff is lucky to have a similar body shape as Kirby. That's why she is easily added during later development phases.

She still shares some moves with Kirby such as the up tilt, forward smash, back throw, down aerial or forward tilt. The animations are somewhat altered, but they're still similar enough.

Ganondorf is similar in that regard.

Jiggly Puff is more important to Smash than she is to Pokemon at this point. That importance within the Smash franchise grows with each installment as well.

 

[Deleted member]

I am heavily disappointed that I am the only one that wants this sexy beast to exist.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Jigglypuff was not a weird inclusion in 64 at all, considering she was the second most popular Pokemon over in Japan at the time. She also had a recurring role on the anime and is still an iconic Nintendo character to this day.

In fact, the only "weird" inclusion in 64 was Ness and Falcon considering how obscure they were at the time and hardly could be considered Nintendo icons in contrast to the other 10 characters.

Jigglypuff as a character is weird, but it's a 64 veteran, there is a reason why Jigglypuff was almost cut in Melee and Brawl, it feels weird as a character. Squirtle and Ivysaur are not long time veterans and unique or not, they are pretty unnecessary and they are not even popular as Smash characters, not even Japan wants them back.
The other characters are main characters, it doesn't matter if the franchise is popular or not, those characters are important and popular in their games and Smash, so they don't feel weird as characters.

Source? And I mean actual first-hand source of Sakurai confirming that Jigglypuff was nearly cut due to time constraints and not merely considered a possible cut in Melee.

 

[TheAnvil]

Jigglypuff as a character is weird, but it's a 64 veteran, there is a reason why Jigglypuff was almost cut in Melee and Brawl, it feels weird as a character. Squirtle and Ivysaur are not long time veterans and unique or not, they are pretty unnecessary and they are not even popular as Smash characters, not even Japan wants them back.
The other characters are main characters, it doesn't matter if the franchise is popular or not, those characters are important and popular in their games and Smash, so they don't feel weird as characters.

Semantics.

It doesn't matter the circumstances of how a character gets to be in Smash, in this context. All that matters is that they're on the CSS. Squirtle and Ivysaur stick out as being weird no more weird than any one of the 5 Fire Emblem characters, Jigglypuff, Wii Fit Trainer etc etc.

They're starter Pokemon from Gen 1. Any one of those 9 characters being in Smash wouldn't be "weird".