Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[Louie G.]

Palutena was also one of the most popular character choices at the time. Back then Kid Icarus Uprising was REALLY popular.

No diss to the ones making this comparison because they're pretty much right, but I feel like people forget that Palutena was comfortably sitting amongst K. Rool, Ridley and Little Mac as the most wanted newcomers. Some people made a bit of a heel turn on her after Dark Pit was added and K. Rool / Ridley missed the boat which I thought was really frustrating. Whether you want to claim oversaturation or not, she was the one thing most people agreed on.

...also, remember when the Uprising trailers came out and people backed Magnus because they thought he was going to be really important? That's really funny in retrospect, although Magnus is neat. Glad he's here as an AT at least... or was? Damn, why did they get rid of him?

I actually dug up this ancient image in the RTC thread a couple months ago, on a nostalgia trip through old Smash 4 era discussion. We've come so far! It's actually kind of difficult to make an image like this now, it felt so clear cut back then.

 

[Sucumbio]

Plus with dual screens I can play Dragon Quest Heroes: Rocket Slime

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

No diss to the ones making this comparison because they're pretty much right, but I feel like people forget that Palutena was comfortably sitting amongst K. Rool, Ridley and Little Mac as the most wanted newcomers. Some people made a bit of a heel turn on her after Dark Pit was added and K. Rool / Ridley missed the boat which I thought was really frustrating. Whether you want to claim oversaturation or not, she was the one thing most people agreed on.

...also, remember when the Uprising trailers came out and people backed Magnus because they thought he was going to be really important? That's really funny in retrospect, although Magnus is neat. Glad he's here as an AT at least... or was? Damn, why did they get rid of him?

I actually dug up this ancient image in the RTC thread a couple months ago, on a nostalgia trip through old Smash 4 era discussion. We've come so far! It's actually kind of difficult to make an image like this now, it felt so clear cut back then.

View attachment 382900

I also distinctly remember Black Shadow being sort of a 7th, though mainly in Japan.

 

[Dinoman96]

tbh, and with all due respect to Palutena (I was one of her fans during that era, after all), I always felt like a large part of her popularity during Smash 4 was because of her perceived likeliness. After all, the lord of Smash himself just made a big AAA (by 3DS standards anyways) Kid Icarus revivial with her in a huge starring role, and we were just coming off the back of Brawl which notably gave the Kirby series (another of Sakurai's creations) a lot of love, so naturally people thought Sakurai would do the same with the other Nintendo IP he just worked right on before he started Smash 4's development. That, and also a new girl character, which Smash super desperately needed back then.

 

[fogbadge]

People that understand how popularity and money work?

Is this one of those only it’s standing in the US matters type deals? I got enough of that from the Nintendo power die hards

 

[Ivander]

Hmmm...

If this has to do with the Switch 2, and the Switch 2 is the new Nintendo console's name, what better way to make a Switch 2 than to make it have 2 screens?

Is this about the Switch 2 rumors about having 2 screens that can be disconnected and both can be used separately for multiplayer and whatnot? Like I said, what better name than to call it "The Nintendo Splitscreen"?

 

[Louie G.]

tbh, and with all due respect to Palutena (I was one of her fans during that era, after all), I always felt like a large part of her popularity during Smash 4 was because of her perceived likeliness.

It was definitely a factor. If Palutena got passed on during Smash 4, and Uprising still didn't get a sequel and then Ultimate rolled along, I suspect she would have been seen as a character who missed the boat. So the timing was right for her and they took advantage of that. Maybe she would have done sufficiently well on the ballot, but I think the excitement around her would have depleted due largely to a lack of faith. Voices get louder if we can believe that what we want is feasibly within reach.

I was a big Palutena fan as well, but unless the fans showed up en masse to demand her for next game like K. Rool and Ridley... which could have happened, I dunno, but unless it did there wouldn't be a whole lot of incentive to add her anymore. All pretty pointless speculation for a character already in the game, but it's interesting to think about right? Out of the characters in that image I sent I suspect Mewtwo and Little Mac still would have had pretty devout followings going into Ultimate as well, although it can be argued Punch Out Wii helped boost Mac quite a lot too. Naturally the other two made it later.

I also distinctly remember Black Shadow being sort of a 7th, though mainly in Japan.

I don't remember too much about where he stood popularity wise, but I do remember him popping up on rosters more often. Black Shadow was always a little tricky to gauge because of how much people just wanted to shove Falcondorf onto somebody else, but I like the guy independent of that. Would probably prefer Samurai Goroh myself, though.

 

[BuckleyTim]

Is this about the Switch 2 rumors about having 2 screens that can be disconnected and both can be used separately for multiplayer and whatnot? Like I said, what better name than to call it "The Nintendo Splitscreen"?

Rumors that I want to be true solely because it means the next WarioWare game would have an insane amount of potential to work with

 

[Quillion]

Ugh, same. The Xenoblade characters already feel like just getting more FE characters as it is. So the prospect of getting twice as many of those or a regular basis is groan inducing.

Even though you agree, equating Xenoblade characters to Fire Emblem characters is horrid reasoning for it. Just have to get this out.

 

[NintenRob]

I've seen first hand that when a character is perceived as likely, their popularity shoots up like crazy. When Skull Kid became the frontrunner for a Zelda character in Smash Ultimate, his support board gained a massive boost in people actually talking in it.

 

[SPEN18]

Somewhat random but anyway Marx sorta came up in the earlier discussion. He's my favorite Kirby character. I was pleasantly surprised to see him show up as a boss in Ult, esp. since I didn't imagine him having much chance as playable for Ult. Just hope he isn't stuck in that role forever, as I'd love to eventually see him as playable. From a personal bias standpoint, he would have the most awesome Kirby moveset in Smash if he made it in. In the meantime, I will continue to use Ridley as an excuse for hope

 

[Dinoman96]

I've seen first hand that when a character is perceived as likely, their popularity shoots up like crazy. When Skull Kid became the frontrunner for a Zelda character in Smash Ultimate, his support board gained a massive boost in people actually talking in it.

Happened with Banjo & Kazooie, too. No one took them seriously as candidates for obvious reasons until Phil Spencer gave us his blessings back in 2015, right in time for the Smash Ballot.

I'd argue it's the same for Geno, too. After Brawl, a lot of his fandom had scattered to the wind but they came back in the full swing of things when Sakurai acknowledged his popularity with the Mii outfit at the end of Smash 4, and then the SMRPG remake has further stabilized his support base.

 

[Gorgonzales]

Somewhat random but anyway Marx sorta came up in the earlier discussion. He's my favorite Kirby character. I was pleasantly surprised to see him show up as a boss in Ult, esp. since I didn't imagine him having much chance as playable for Ult. Just hope he isn't stuck in that role forever, as I'd love to eventually see him as playable. From a personal bias standpoint, he would have the most awesome Kirby moveset in Smash if he made it in. In the meantime, I will continue to use Ridley as an excuse for hope

Marx would be very cool, Kirby has a lot of potential for cool characters and I wouldn't mind seeing them, whether it's Bandee, Marx. Magolor, Susie, or the like.

One of Smash's current issues that bugs me a lot (next to the animal voices, the over-saturation of first-level stages, and the cinematic finisher slop) is the blatant imbalance toward Sakurai-era Kirby; all the newer games get are spirits and the occasional music track, classic Kirby gets all the cool stuff like the assist trophies, the stages, the boss, yadda yadda yadda we've been over this and know why it sucks. My question is, how would you go about addressing it?

Personally, I'd make Magolor a fighter and have a stage based on the Wondaria Dream Parade, since it's one of the stand-out moments of Forgotten Land and is just a breathtaking area in its own right.

I want Forgotten Land to have a stage but really don't want it to be like the first level or whatever, that's such a boring choice and it'd feel like it'd only be there so they can say "Look guys, we're not biased! We have a modern Kirby stage!"

 

[NintenRob]

Marx is truthfully very low on the Kirby characters I want in Smash. Part of that is because he's primarily known for Super Star and I'd prefer to see literally any other Kirby game get represented.

I also think Magolor has conformably set himself up as the next logical step after Bandana Dee, maintaining his presence in games after his debut (especially spinoffs) and even has a couple of his own modes

 

[Will]

Marx is truthfully very low on the Kirby characters I want in Smash. Part of that is because he's primarily known for Super Star and I'd prefer to see literally any other Kirby game get represented.

He made Smash and Super Star, Sakurai can and will flex his gaming achievements on you.

 

[dream1ng]

I also distinctly remember Black Shadow being sort of a 7th, though mainly in Japan.

Uhhh... I'm not sure about that.

I remember a number of others: Roy, Chrom, Waluigi, Bowser Jr, Isaac, Shulk, Dixie, with earlier on, Krystal, Zoroark and Ghirahim, and later on, Pac-Man and BWD, having it over him popularity-wise. Takamaru was also very common, but in part because people saw the need to have a retro spot.

Though yeah in Japan he was more popular because of his VA. I wouldn't be able to give a ranking, though. However also in Japan, Ridley and Mac wouldn't have been anywhere near the top six.

 

[Ivander]

Rumors that I want to be true solely because it means the next WarioWare game would have an insane amount of potential to work with

I want it for the potential with Multiplayer and the possibility of something akin to Mario Kart DS and 7 with the Download Play. Remember how you could use 1 cartridge for those games and play with your friends and family? Sure your friends were restricted to Shy Guy, but imagine a console with 2 screens able to separate the screens from each other and only needing that one console and one cartridge to do 2-Player Multiplayer for something like Monster Hunter, Fortnite, NSO Multiplayer titles, etc, with each of you having your own screen instead of 1-screen Splitscreen multiplayer?

And heck, be able to make games or remakes of where games like Nintendo Land on the Wii U tried to do where a person can have a completely different perspective or role while the other players are sharing another screen playing the team roles, like the Luigi's Mansion part of Nintendo Land where 1 player is the Ghost and the other players are the Ghost Hunters. Like the multiplayer potential with a console concept like this is endless.

 

[dream1ng]

It is true that a Kid Icarus character was largely expected, and that increased their popularity. It's, however, also true that the Uprising cast overall was very well received. Palutena, Medusa, Hades, Viridi, Magnus and Dark Pit all had decently notable fanbases.

I think the dual factors of expectation and just innate appeal work hand in hand on those.

I've seen first hand that when a character is perceived as likely, their popularity shoots up like crazy. When Skull Kid became the frontrunner for a Zelda character in Smash Ultimate, his support board gained a massive boost in people actually talking in it.

Skull Kid support is a unique paradox that becomes disarmingly high very fleetingly every few years and then recedes to stable but unexceptional levels. It's like a swarm of locusts. If it maintained that peak he'd be a real force to be reckoned with.

But yeah, expectation and popularity feed into each other in a feedback loop. That's how kinda mid Pokemon can get so "requested", because they're one of like... two or three possible choices, and how Geno can actually become an expected character.

 

[BuckleyTim]

Interesting tidbit about the new spirit event: Noah and Mio don't have a series listed for their spirit, unlike the other three. Does it mean anything? No! But it's funny that it happened to the one out of the four that I think is most likely to be more than just a spirit next game (...actually, no Oatchi is still more likely imo).

 

[Perkilator]

Marx would be very cool, Kirby has a lot of potential for cool characters and I wouldn't mind seeing them, whether it's Bandee, Marx. Magolor, Susie, or the like.

One of Smash's current issues that bugs me a lot (next to the animal voices, the over-saturation of first-level stages, and the cinematic finisher slop) is the blatant imbalance toward Sakurai-era Kirby; all the newer games get are spirits and the occasional music track, classic Kirby gets all the cool stuff like the assist trophies, the stages, the boss, yadda yadda yadda we've been over this and know why it sucks. My question is, how would you go about addressing it?

Personally, I'd make Magolor a fighter and have a stage based on the Wondaria Dream Parade, since it's one of the stand-out moments of Forgotten Land and is just a breathtaking area in its own right.

I want Forgotten Land to have a stage but really don't want it to be like the first level or whatever, that's such a boring choice and it'd feel like it'd only be there so they can say "Look guys, we're not biased! We have a modern Kirby stage!"

I'd feature both BWD and Magolor as newcomers and as for stages: for Magolor, I'd have Another Dimension as a stage. For Bandana Waddle Dee, I'd pick either Waddle Dee Town or Wondaria.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

No diss to the ones making this comparison because they're pretty much right, but I feel like people forget that Palutena was comfortably sitting amongst K. Rool, Ridley and Little Mac as the most wanted newcomers. Some people made a bit of a heel turn on her after Dark Pit was added and K. Rool / Ridley missed the boat which I thought was really frustrating. Whether you want to claim oversaturation or not, she was the one thing most people agreed on.

...also, remember when the Uprising trailers came out and people backed Magnus because they thought he was going to be really important? That's really funny in retrospect, although Magnus is neat. Glad he's here as an AT at least... or was? Damn, why did they get rid of him?

I actually dug up this ancient image in the RTC thread a couple months ago, on a nostalgia trip through old Smash 4 era discussion. We've come so far! It's actually kind of difficult to make an image like this now, it felt so clear cut back then.

View attachment 382900

It's crazy to me that all six of these are in Smash now.

We've come a long way.

 

[BuckleyTim]

On the subject of Kirby, I'll always be a supporter of Adeline ever since a certain blue-and-white webcomic introduced me to her. Is it weird to say I only played the Dark Matter trilogy long after that fact?

 

[Louie G.]

Somewhat random but anyway Marx sorta came up in the earlier discussion. He's my favorite Kirby character. I was pleasantly surprised to see him show up as a boss in Ult, esp. since I didn't imagine him having much chance as playable for Ult. Just hope he isn't stuck in that role forever, as I'd love to eventually see him as playable. From a personal bias standpoint, he would have the most awesome Kirby moveset in Smash if he made it in. In the meantime, I will continue to use Ridley as an excuse for hope

No exaggeration, I think I was as excited that I could play as Marx in Star Allies as I was for Smash being announced at the tail end of that same Direct lol. And really Star Allies did nothing but confirm to me how fun Marx would be, because he has a dizzying amount of tricks that would make an extremely dynamic moveset. I love his design, I love him as a character, and I would be playing him right out the gate.

Marx is truthfully very low on the Kirby characters I want in Smash. Part of that is because he's primarily known for Super Star and I'd prefer to see literally any other Kirby game get represented.

I also think Magolor has conformably set himself up as the next logical step after Bandana Dee, maintaining his presence in games after his debut (especially spinoffs) and even has a couple of his own modes

I understand you, but Super Star Ultra is still my favorite Kirby game and I'm more concerned about the value of the character himself than needing to side step and be "fair" to everyone else. Don't get me wrong though, I'd be happy with just about any new Kirby character - especially Magolor, that would be great. But I also don't feel particularly guilty about backing the character from its most prominently represented and popular game when he's been a favorite of mine for so long. There are dozens of other ways we can contribute to more diverse Kirby representation through non-playable content.

How likely do I think he is though? Well, certainly under Bandana Dee and probably under Magolor too. Maybe sitting somewhere around a distant third place? My biases aside I do think we should probably see BWD first, but with how imaginative and fun some of the less prominent Kirby characters are I'd just be more excited to give them a whirl in Smash.

 

[Scrimblo Bimblo]

Marx Is the Kirby character I'd like to see the most. Love how creepy he is, and a fighter with no arms would be cool.
I'm not really a big Kirby fan even though I've played most of his games, though. Magolor would also be neat. He's sorta similar to Marx anyways.
Bandana dude Is also okay. The spear moveset is fun, and while it sounds like a nightmare, a very small character with very big disjoints would instantly be unique.

Who I really want, though?... Whispy Woods. He could move around in Dream Land 3! I want to play as a tree

 

[CannonStreak]

Say, how long is the first new Spirit event for Smash Bros. Ultimate going to last until?

 

[Perkilator]

Say, how long is the first new Spirit event for Smash Bros. Ultimate going to last until?

It goes from today to the 17th.

 

[SPEN18]

Marx would be very cool, Kirby has a lot of potential for cool characters and I wouldn't mind seeing them, whether it's Bandee, Marx. Magolor, Susie, or the like.

One of Smash's current issues that bugs me a lot (next to the animal voices, the over-saturation of first-level stages, and the cinematic finisher slop) is the blatant imbalance toward Sakurai-era Kirby; all the newer games get are spirits and the occasional music track, classic Kirby gets all the cool stuff like the assist trophies, the stages, the boss, yadda yadda yadda we've been over this and know why it sucks. My question is, how would you go about addressing it?

Personally, I'd make Magolor a fighter and have a stage based on the Wondaria Dream Parade, since it's one of the stand-out moments of Forgotten Land and is just a breathtaking area in its own right.

I want Forgotten Land to have a stage but really don't want it to be like the first level or whatever, that's such a boring choice and it'd feel like it'd only be there so they can say "Look guys, we're not biased! We have a modern Kirby stage!"

Marx is truthfully very low on the Kirby characters I want in Smash. Part of that is because he's primarily known for Super Star and I'd prefer to see literally any other Kirby game get represented.

I also think Magolor has conformably set himself up as the next logical step after Bandana Dee, maintaining his presence in games after his debut (especially spinoffs) and even has a couple of his own modes

Not gonna lie, Super Star / Super Star Ultra is my personal favorite. But bias aside, it's also widely considered one of the absolute best in the Kirby series.
That said, I get wanting more representation for modern Kirby. I like it when series representation gets good coverage across all eras.

Though when it comes to the playable roster at least, I don't view one singular Super-Star-focused rep as an offense to modern Kirby. Wanting more modern Kirby representation shouldn't mean groaning at Marx, who I think would have earned his spot if he got in.

To be fair, I also think Magolor would be a good inclusion. Especially if his new side mode is just the tip of a larger iceberg as far as future appearances go. Right now I view him as pretty similar to Marx as far as credentials go.
And I think almost everyone expects BWD to be the #4 rep, who if he got in would be another major skew towards modern Kirby.
So in that respect, if we got BWD and/or Magolor, then there would even more definitely be no issue with someone like Marx also being there.

Though outside the playable roster is a great place to give modern Kirby its due also. It has a plethora of options for stages; a couple top-of-mind ideas would be fighting on the Lor Starcutter, in the Alivel Mall, or even maybe on Jambandra. I would also more liberally give out ATs to Kirby characters who can't make it as playable.

 

[fogbadge]

It's crazy to me that all six of these are in Smash now.

you should see the stuff i think

 

[CannonStreak]

It goes from today to the 17th.

I see. Not what I was expecting, but...

Why do I feel (and I just feel, that is all) that some kind of surprise is going to be announced for something Smash Bros. related at the end of the fourth spirit event?

 

[Wonder Smash]

You know, it's strange that the Noah & Mioh spirit doesn't have the Xenoblade Chronicles Series name on it. Anybody else notice that?

 

[Louie G.]

I would also more liberally give out ATs to Kirby characters who can't make it as playable.

I feel like, outside of the obvious missed stage opportunities, had we gotten like... Magolor and Susie added as ATs alongside a Lor Starcutter stage we would be hearing a lot less complaints about the lack of modern Kirby content. This feels like such an easy band-aid to me which makes it all the more confusing RTDL wasn't in consideration to get a new stage in Smash 4. Music is obviously a concern as well, but admittedly we're in a better spot now than we used to be.

Kirby, Dedede and Meta Knight are evergreen characters so regardless of the way the series evolves they're always gonna be there. I think this lineup is about as strong as its ever been and BWD would just be the strawberry on top of an already delicious shortcake. Just give us a stage and better acknowledgement of one or two characters from Kirby's past 15 years. I'd sacrifice the disappointingly lame Nightmare AT any day for a cool Magolor one. Knuckle Joe and Chef Kawasaki are chill though.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

Uhhh... I'm not sure about that.

I remember a number of others: Roy, Chrom, Waluigi, Bowser Jr, Isaac, Shulk, Dixie, with earlier on, Krystal, Zoroark and Ghirahim, and later on, Pac-Man and BWD, having it over him popularity-wise. Takamaru was also very common, but in part because people saw the need to have a retro spot.

Though yeah in Japan he was more popular because of his VA. I wouldn't be able to give a ranking, though. However also in Japan, Ridley and Mac wouldn't have been anywhere near the top six.

I dunno. I got an old Miiverse image saved on my desktop that had Mac, Ridley, K. Rool, Palutena, and Black Shadow as a set.
Just found it interesting to remember.

 

[dream1ng]

I feel like, outside of the obvious missed stage opportunities, had we gotten like... Magolor and Susie added as ATs alongside a Lor Starcutter stage we would be hearing a lot less complaints about the lack of modern Kirby content. This feels like such an easy band-aid to me which makes it all the more confusing RTDL wasn't in consideration to get a new stage in Smash 4. Music is obviously a concern as well, but admittedly we're in a better spot now than we used to be.

Kirby, Dedede and Meta Knight are evergreen characters so regardless of the way the series evolves they're always gonna be there. I think this lineup is about as strong as its ever been and BWD would just be the strawberry on top of an already delicious shortcake. Just give us a stage and better acknowledgement of one or two characters from Kirby's past 15 years. I'd sacrifice the disappointingly lame Nightmare AT any day for a cool Magolor one.

Not confusing to me, it seems pretty clear Sakurai isn't particularly interested in giving much coverage to the Kirby games he didn't make.

I think it's going to be harder to pass over Forgotten Land, though.

 

[Perkilator]

I see. Not what I was expecting, but...

Why do I feel (and I just feel, that is all) that some kind of surprise is going to be announced for something Smash Bros. related at the end of the fourth spirit event?

Maybe a teaser for the next Smash game, I guess? That it was this thread is named after, so I imagine after this thread reaches 1,000 pages, we'll get another thousand every half an hour from the teaser alone (exaggerating, of course).

 

[CannonStreak]

Maybe a teaser for the next Smash game, I guess? That it was this thread is named after, so I imagine after this thread reaches 1,000 pages, we'll get another thousand every half an hour from the teaser alone (exaggerating, of course).

That was, at the most, what I was thinking, actually.

 

[dream1ng]

I see. Not what I was expecting, but...

Why do I feel (and I just feel, that is all) that some kind of surprise is going to be announced for something Smash Bros. related at the end of the fourth spirit event?

Maybe a teaser for the next Smash game, I guess? That it was this thread is named after, so I imagine after this thread reaches 1,000 pages, we'll get another thousand every half an hour from the teaser alone (exaggerating, of course).

Really depends on if they finish before the new system is revealed.

Though teasing the next Smash game, unless it's much closer than we think, seems unlikely to me. It seems like they'll have enough other, closer stuff to show for the next system and Sakurai doesn't like revealing the Smash games when they're so far from release. Which is how Brawl and 4 went.

 

[CannonStreak]

Really depends on if they finish before the new system is revealed.

Though teasing the next Smash game, unless it's much closer than we think, seems unlikely to me. It seems like they'll have enough other, closer stuff to show for the next system and Sakurai doesn't like revealing the Smash games when they're so far from release. Which is how Brawl and 4 went.

Well, it was not the only thing I was thinking of.

What Perkilator said was at least one possibility. If there is something, it could be anything.

 

[dream1ng]

I'm interested in what the other three events are actually going to be, considering most of the obvious promo stuff has been covered.

I could see Pokemon S/V getting a whole event to itself because TPC.

There's also Engage and Wonder and other stuff.

But I don't think they're all going to be promo.

 

[Noipoi]

I'm interested in what the other three events are actually going to be, considering most of the obvious promo stuff has been covered.

I could see Pokemon S/V getting a whole event to itself because TPC.

There's also Engage and Wonder and other stuff.

But I don't think they're all going to be promo.

I see at least one more batch of Promo Spirits for games like Wonder, Engage, S/V, etc. And then something specifically Smash related.

Like maybe a Smash 64 event, it's rather unique character art could lend itself well to something like that.

 

[CannonStreak]

Still, even if it is just one possibility that MIGHT happen (or not) after the fourth spirit event, I do not think a teaser is all that far-fetched. I mean with the Smash team behind Ultimate coming back for four Spirit events in the first place, and the new possible Switch successor possibly being announced this year, I do feel they are working on something new here. It does not have to be a full trailer or even anything that has much, just a simple teaser could work. I mean, again, it could be anything, but whatever it is, I do think they are working on some sort of a surprise (even if it is not a teaser for the next game).

Or the surprise could be some kind of "Thank you for playing" event in the form of the fourth spirit event.