• Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!

    You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!

Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

Quillion

Smash Hero
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
5,989
Breath of the Wild actually had a bunch of crossover content with the different clothing options. You could even have Wolf Link from Twilight Princess as a companion.
True, but it's handled with little care. With the Fire Emblem and Xenoblade examples, they put a lot more effort into integrating them in the game as a whole by explaining why they're there and such. BotW DLC cameo items are just randomly scattered about and do things that the base game's armor can already do.

I see a difference indeed between "the Hero, the Princess, and the Devil, infused with the power of the godesses, seem to be stuck in an eternal battle of good vs evil and doomed to be reborn over and over again" and "everybody comes back all the time because why not". But I am very wise.
It's as simple as saying these commoner family lines just reuse names from time to time just like the Royals do.

I say Tingle and Beedle are okay, because they're funny. :4roy:

The rest really don't need to happen.
Beedle is such a boring piece of ****, and I've really come to dislike how he gets to be in BotW over any of the other recurring minor characters.

PLEEEEEASE bring Tingle back!
----
So actually are there any Smash roster members that only appear in one single source game? I'm struggling to think of any, but if not then maybe being a "one-off" is a soft de-confirm for Smash inclusion which admittedly sucks but as they say you can't squeeze blood from a turnip. Or something...
Like I said, there are quite a bit of one-shot characters, but they're either from one-shot IPs or rotating cast IPs.

It all has to do with how prominent these characters are relative to their series.
 

Swamp Sensei

Today is always the most enjoyable day!
BRoomer
Joined
Jan 4, 2013
Messages
38,992
Location
Um....Lost?
NNID
Swampasaur
3DS FC
4141-2776-0914
Switch FC
SW-6476-1588-8392
Beedle is such a boring piece of ****, and I've really come to dislike how he gets to be in BotW over any of the other recurring minor characters.

PLEEEEEASE bring Tingle back!
Okay. Quill. We've disagreed on stuff in the past.

But this.

This.

This I cannot accept.

Leave my funny merchant man alone.

 

Hadokeyblade

Smash Legend
Joined
Dec 5, 2018
Messages
10,840
I really doubt we would get Rare replay on Switch but I'm sure more N64 Rare games will eventually comes to Switch online such as Banjo Tooie and Perfect dark.



There is, but none of them are vilains or side characters like Skull kid, Midna and Girahim. For example, Ice climber and Duck hunt have only one appearance (not counting cameo in other game or crossover like Wario Ware or Tetris DS), but that's because their respective franchise have only 1 game (not counting re-release obviously). Ness and Lucas both appear in only one of the Mother Games. MinMin also appear in only one game because Arms also have one game.

If you don't count spin off, Chrom and Robin appear only in one game because they're not in Engage (although they're both are in the Warriors spin off and in Heroes). Joker also appear in only one game not counting spin off and not counting Royal as a second game (he does appear in Persona dancing and Strikers). Not counting spin off Sheik would also have only one appearance being in Ocarina of time.
Strikers is officially a sequel to Persona 5 so Joker does have more than one appearance. Technically.
 

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

Flap and Swish~
Premium
Joined
Aug 13, 2001
Messages
34,391
Location
Cull Hazard
NNID
Irene4
3DS FC
1203-9265-8784
Switch FC
SW-7567-8572-3791
Beedle is an amazing merchant with lots of personality. He doesn't need to be an action character. He's just a cool guy.

...No wonder I also like Tingle so much. He's a fun guy and that's it. Sure, his WW version was godawful, but beyond that? I never had an issue with him, and I still liked him in it to a degree. It showed how cynical the world can be and that even good people can turn bad. Hell, even Ganondorf was portrayed more sympathetically than this guy, which says something. What the hell did he go to jail for? Who knows. A simple bit of thievery? Etc.
 

Sucumbio

Smash Chachacha
Moderator
Writing Team
Joined
Oct 7, 2008
Messages
8,441
Location
wahwahweewah
Beedle is an amazing merchant with lots of personality. He doesn't need to be an action character. He's just a cool guy.

...No wonder I also like Tingle so much. He's a fun guy and that's it. Sure, his WW version was godawful, but beyond that? I never had an issue with him, and I still liked him in it to a degree. It showed how cynical the world can be and that even good people can turn bad. Hell, even Ganondorf was portrayed more sympathetically than this guy, which says something. What the hell did he go to jail for? Who knows. A simple bit of thievery? Etc.
Thaaaank you
 

HyperSomari64

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 10, 2018
Messages
3,662
Location
Lima, Peru
Instead of Nintendo vs. Capcom, why not a Mario × Mega Man (Classic) crossover.

I always imagine it with rail shooter + rhythm for the bosses where you shoot through the beat of the songs, while the normal game is a survival horror.
 
Last edited:

Sucumbio

Smash Chachacha
Moderator
Writing Team
Joined
Oct 7, 2008
Messages
8,441
Location
wahwahweewah
Instead of Nintendo vs. Capcom, why not a Mario × Mega Man (Classic) crossover.

I always imagine it with rail shooter + rhythm for the bosses where you shoot through the beat of the songs, while the normal game is a survival horror.
A Mario x Mega man Survival Horror Game with rail shooter esqu boss fights?

What? Hahaha wow. That's ... Ok.
 

Quillion

Smash Hero
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
5,989
Swamp Sensei Swamp Sensei , Verde Coeden Scalesworth Verde Coeden Scalesworth :

Seriously though, is there anything remotely remarkable about Beedle other than "likes bugs" and "very slightly fruity"?

Now Tingle is a genuinely funny and unique character thanks to his greed, obsession with fairies, cartography skills, and weird/somewhat bossy relationship with his family.

But Beedle feels like they're trying to make their own Anna from Fire Emblem but with no charm whatsoever.
 

HyperSomari64

Smash Master
Joined
Apr 10, 2018
Messages
3,662
Location
Lima, Peru
A Mario x Mega man Survival Horror Game with rail shooter esqu boss fights?

What? Hahaha wow. That's ... Ok.
Thanks.

Since Mario already crossed with Sonic (Mario & Sonic at The Olympic Games) and Pac-Man (Mario Kart Arcade GP), why not with the Blue Bomber? (specially his classic series)
 
Last edited:

Quillion

Smash Hero
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
5,989
Thanks.

Since Mario already crossed with Sonic (Mario & Sonic at The Olympic Games) and Pac-Man (Mario Kart Arcade GP, why not with the Blue Bomber? (specially his classic series)
IDK, it feels like if you cross over with any Capcom stuff that isn't Street Fighter, it's gotta be a package deal.
 

dream1ng

Smash Champion
Joined
Jul 24, 2016
Messages
2,201
When talking about one-off characters who got included, surely what counts is whether they were one-offs prior to inclusion, not if they've had appearances since getting included, right? Because we're trying to extrapolate from it.

To that end, from the Zelda series, both Sheik and Ganondorf (in the dorf form) were one-offs prior to inclusion. iirc he was planned for the Oracle games, and he shows up in that tech demo, but in terms of appearances that count, it would only be OoT.

ZSS technically isn't a one-off, but would be very close.

And considering two of these three were included as a complementary transformation to one of the major series characters, and the other was a form of the main antagonist included because his physiology made for clone fodder, they all have somewhat extenuating circumstances leading to their inclusions.

Oh and Dark Pit. His situation is self-explanatory. And even for a nearly straight clone his inclusion was divisive.

Then there's the rotating cast series, and the one-game series, but those aren't really the same.

I think that's it?
 

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

Flap and Swish~
Premium
Joined
Aug 13, 2001
Messages
34,391
Location
Cull Hazard
NNID
Irene4
3DS FC
1203-9265-8784
Switch FC
SW-7567-8572-3791
Swamp Sensei Swamp Sensei , Verde Coeden Scalesworth Verde Coeden Scalesworth :

Seriously though, is there anything remotely remarkable about Beedle other than "likes bugs" and "very slightly fruity"?

Now Tingle is a genuinely funny and unique character thanks to his greed, obsession with fairies, cartography skills, and weird/somewhat bossy relationship with his family.

But Beedle feels like they're trying to make their own Anna from Fire Emblem but with no charm whatsoever.
I don't even know what makes Anna likable at all. I've never seen her. I just know I love Beedle because he's got a great voice actor and is funny to me.

...FE is also a game where stuff like dating/romance is a huge part of it, which applies to a ton of characters and requires them to have more fleshed out personalities for that to work. Zelda doesn't do that kind of stuff, so it makes sense it focus more on mechanics than characterization. It still has story on its own, but the story is more towards a specific game or some lore. Many characters don't gain any development outside of highly important ones. We still see some nice stuff, but the reality is, there's tons of minor characters who aren't supposed to be more than simple. Tingle also had his own series and has two fully different versions of him, so of course he's fleshed out more. There's different people. Beedle didn't change, nor did most characters because they're recurring popular characters with nothing more important to them than repeating a role.
 

Sucumbio

Smash Chachacha
Moderator
Writing Team
Joined
Oct 7, 2008
Messages
8,441
Location
wahwahweewah
Thanks.

Since Mario already crossed with Sonic (Mario & Sonic at The Olympic Games) and Pac-Man (Mario Kart Arcade GP), why not with the Blue Bomber? (specially his classic series)
No doubt. Kinda why I loved Captain N. One of the hypest moments in my cartoon childhood was seeing all my favorite game characters interacting.
 

Quillion

Smash Hero
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
5,989
I don't even know what makes Anna likable at all. I've never seen her. I just know I love Beedle because he's got a great voice actor and is funny to me.

...FE is also a game where stuff like dating/romance is a huge part of it, which applies to a ton of characters and requires them to have more fleshed out personalities for that to work. Zelda doesn't do that kind of stuff, so it makes sense it focus more on mechanics than characterization. It still has story on its own, but the story is more towards a specific game or some lore. Many characters don't gain any development outside of highly important ones. We still see some nice stuff, but the reality is, there's tons of minor characters who aren't supposed to be more than simple. Tingle also had his own series and has two fully different versions of him, so of course he's fleshed out more. There's different people. Beedle didn't change, nor did most characters because they're recurring popular characters with nothing more important to them than repeating a role.
Hey, Tingle still manages to have a lot of charm to him, and I'm disregarding his short-lived spin-off series here.

Anna has her devotion to running a business even in the heat of battle and connection to her multiversal family.

Beedle has virtually nothing of note. You could replace him with any run-of-the-mill fantasy RPG merchant and nothing would change.

When talking about one-off characters who got included, surely what counts is whether they were one-offs prior to inclusion, not if they've had appearances since getting included, right? Because we're trying to extrapolate from it.

To that end, from the Zelda series, both Sheik and Ganondorf (in the dorf form) were one-offs prior to inclusion. iirc he was planned for the Oracle games, and he shows up in that tech demo, but in terms of appearances that count, it would only be OoT.

ZSS technically isn't a one-off, but would be very close.

And considering two of these three were included as a complementary transformation to one of the major series characters, and the other was a form of the main antagonist included because his physiology made for clone fodder, they all have somewhat extenuating circumstances leading to their inclusions.

Oh and Dark Pit. His situation is self-explanatory. And even for a nearly straight clone his inclusion was divisive.

Then there's the rotating cast series, and the one-game series, but those aren't really the same.

I think that's it?
So it appears that of all the "fixed cast" franchises in Smash, only Dark Pit and Sheik have remained one-shots. And Sheik is the only one whose series is still veritably ongoing.

Zelda is just stuck in a weird position between "fixed cast" and "rotating cast", so I guess they just go with the former treatment since it's easier.
 

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

Flap and Swish~
Premium
Joined
Aug 13, 2001
Messages
34,391
Location
Cull Hazard
NNID
Irene4
3DS FC
1203-9265-8784
Switch FC
SW-7567-8572-3791
No doubt. Kinda why I loved Captain N. One of the hypest moments in my cartoon childhood was seeing all my favorite game characters interacting.
Honestly, I just loved how they made Mother Brain an actual person. Sure, she's still ugly by design(but actually not a truly monstrous design. She can actually emote!). I think what made me fall in love with the overall characterization is that even she was legitimately happy at times(mainly at getting married), but overall the show, as bad as it was, had its good moments. Link got characterization in Season 2 of it as well, coming off from his own TV Show, where he was a big jerk, but it didn't take him long to realize it was hurting the team and began acting better for the good of all.

Though yes, MegaMan's colors were... urgh. Kid Icarus was still fun, and admittedly wasn't that off overall design-wise. King Hippo was another good one, being pretty much the same other than the blue skin. Eggplant Wizard also became instantly cooler thanks to being a proper character. I also liked how Donkey Kong was the Wild Card, since it changed things up.

Another fun fact is Alucard, when finally playable, now has blonde hair compared to his old design, coincidentally being the same color as the one in the show. I think what's worth noting is that despite him being a ridiculous version of the son of Dracula, his purpose is to share the opposite views, and that started off as accurate. He inaccurately joins him at the end compared to the games, but it's also been shown that both still share legitimate conversations in games and care about each other. Even if a small amount. The Netflix series actually reflects this more too. Alucard became more like his father near the end of it, while Dracula became more like his son, much kinder.

------------

For the record, nothing was answered about Anna's important to the story. So again, her being a neat merchant doesn't tell me anything. Beedle is the same to me with that argument. Both are full of charm and the core merchants where applicable. I can't tell a difference here. That's saying something.

Tingle, that said, is a great character, but his charm in MM wasn't as nice in WW due to his sudden slave-driving. He was a greedy asshole which felt like the charm was gone by then. This was fixed with his own games and his silliness being without atrocities like in FSA and later games, making him benevolent again. Ages was basically his MM character but with the Toon design.

Beedle to me has lots of charm by doing a simple job, doing it right, and having a perfect voice actor for it(US version, at least). Maybe it's just other versions aren't as fun for some. You can't replace him with just anyone. They don't have a specific personality that says "Beedle". He's not just like any action-adventure one, because they get their own charm and style. They're different because they're their own person. You can't easily replace him because he's not a generic merchant at all. This isn't the random merchants in Zelda 1 who are easy to replace. This is an actual person with a distinct voice and style. He does his own thing. ...Which is why so far I have yet to see what makes Anna special within her own franchise. Why does have a notable goal matter outside of the fact FE is more story-driven? That's why the difference is little to me. It makes sense... in that context why she's like that. Beedle makes perfect sense in the context of his series. There's nothing more to give him to do outside of changing the story up entirely to fit him into it as some super important character. ...In an action adventure game where story is supposed to be a bit on the lighter side and only star a handful of characters where there's kind of no reason to super flesh out anyone else? Like, even the 4 Champions aren't that fleshed out. They're absolutely notable, but they're still fairly simple but nothing like the main characters. They're secondary. Beedle is a minor character and well below that. Tingle is much closer to secondary even.
 
Last edited:

chocolatejr9

Smash Hero
Joined
Sep 30, 2018
Messages
8,410
No doubt. Kinda why I loved Captain N. One of the hypest moments in my cartoon childhood was seeing all my favorite game characters interacting.
Yeah, if there's any non-video game rep I'd actually be okay with, it's Captain N. Though maybe they should do a reboot first, just in case...

(BTW, I know somebody actually pitched a reboot, but it never got off the ground or anything).
 

Sucumbio

Smash Chachacha
Moderator
Writing Team
Joined
Oct 7, 2008
Messages
8,441
Location
wahwahweewah
For the record, nothing was answered about Anna's important to the story. So again, her being a neat merchant doesn't tell me anything. Beedle is the same to me with that argument. Both are full of charm and the core merchants where applicable. I can't tell a difference here. That's saying something.
I can throw in my two cents on Anna but I don't know if it'll answer your question. Anna is a recurrent motif within Fire Emblem. She's ... Almost like the character version of the weapon triangle. Something unique to Fire Emblem, and almost always present. The way in which she's presented does change, such as a merchant, a guide to the player tutorial as your teacher, a playable fighter, so forth and so on. She's presented in different ways and serves different purposes but she's still Anna in each iteration because the character itself has been fleshed out enough to make that work.

You could argue that other characters also fit this. The axe wielding guy, the thief, etc but their names change as do their various costumes though their body types usually stay similar. Every game pretty much has an Oscar, a Titania etc. So anyway Anna is always Anna, and because she's been in so many games she's well liked and serves somewhat of a mascot for FE, or cheerleader if you will.

As compared to beedle, I'm not aware of him being anything other than a merchant but I've only played skyward sword and wind waker so...
 

Mamboo07

Smash Hero
Joined
Mar 23, 2019
Messages
9,553
Location
Agartha, Hollow Earth
Though maybe they should do a reboot first, just in case...

(BTW, I know somebody actually pitched a reboot, but it never got off the ground or anything).
I can imagine a reboot having the characters get their modern designs and more villains working for Mother Brain.
(As well other Nintendo characters like Kirby)
 

SPEN18

Smash Champion
Joined
Nov 1, 2018
Messages
2,325
Location
MI, USA
Anna was never important to any of the FE stories. Up until Awakening she would literally just make brief cameos when visiting certain houses/villages on the maps and also run some "secret shops" (which to access you needed a special item and also to spot a suspicious-looking tile on the map), so many players could easily go through the whole games without even seeing her. Since Awakening she has gotten some playable roles but those still haven't made her plot-important; like your average FE character she can literally die and it will have no effect on anything.
That's not to say she's not a likable character; she's popular among FE fans (though not Lyn/Ike level) and takes on a bigger role in the mobile game.

edit: I forgot about some of the other minor things like playing a role in menus, tutorials, etc. occasionally
 
Last edited:

Quillion

Smash Hero
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
5,989
Anna was never important to any of the FE stories. Up until Awakening she would literally just make brief cameos when visiting certain houses/villages on the maps and also run some "secret shops" (which to access you needed a special item and also to spot a suspicious-looking tile on the map), so many players could easily go through the whole games without even seeing her. Since Awakening she has gotten some playable roles but those still haven't made her plot-important; like your average FE character she can literally die and it will have no effect on anything.
That's not to say she's not a likable character; she's popular among FE fans (though not Lyn/Ike level) and takes on a bigger role in the mobile game.
I thought Verde Coeden Scalesworth Verde Coeden Scalesworth was asking what makes Anna likeable, not how she's important to FE.
 

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

Flap and Swish~
Premium
Joined
Aug 13, 2001
Messages
34,391
Location
Cull Hazard
NNID
Irene4
3DS FC
1203-9265-8784
Switch FC
SW-7567-8572-3791
I can throw in my two cents on Anna but I don't know if it'll answer your question. Anna is a recurrent motif within Fire Emblem. She's ... Almost like the character version of the weapon triangle. Something unique to Fire Emblem, and almost always present. The way in which she's presented does change, such as a merchant, a guide to the player tutorial as your teacher, a playable fighter, so forth and so on. She's presented in different ways and serves different purposes but she's still Anna in each iteration because the character itself has been fleshed out enough to make that work.

You could argue that other characters also fit this. The axe wielding guy, the thief, etc but their names change as do their various costumes though their body types usually stay similar. Every game pretty much has an Oscar, a Titania etc. So anyway Anna is always Anna, and because she's been in so many games she's well liked and serves somewhat of a mascot for FE, or cheerleader if you will.

As compared to beedle, I'm not aware of him being anything other than a merchant but I've only played skyward sword and wind waker so...
Then the comparison by Quillion makes zero sense. One is a minor character while the other specifically has a bigger role with a different purpose. It’s unrealistic to expect Beedle to be more exciting.

Thanks for clearing that up.

Albeit, Anna isn’t super important either(my bad), but her role is clearly expanded in a character-driven game. LOZ isn’t driven by a large cast, but a few key characters and gameplay moreso. Beedle had no reason to be fleshed out. Though that said, camp characters are awesome and make the cast feel even more alive with tons of variable personality. Fleshed out backgrounds aren’t all there is to a good cast. Personality plays a big role in making someone memorable, and Beedle is quite memorable for a minor character.
 
Last edited:

Ivander

Smash Legend
Joined
Dec 1, 2014
Messages
11,050
For the record, nothing was answered about Anna's important to the story. So again, her being a neat merchant doesn't tell me anything. Beedle is the same to me with that argument. Both are full of charm and the core merchants where applicable. I can't tell a difference here. That's saying something.

Which is why so far I have yet to see what makes Anna special within her own franchise. Why does have a notable goal matter outside of the fact FE is more story-driven? That's why the difference is little to me.
Anna's not important to the stories, aside from Fire Emblem Heroes where she actually is a main character, although she's more minor compared to Alfonse, Kiran, Sharena, Veronica and the Books' Main Heroine character(Fjorm, Eir, Peony, Reginn, Ash and Seior). Basically, she's a character who appeared in all Fire Emblem games aside from Gaiden/Echoes(so she's a much older character than Beedle) and her role used to be mainly a cameo with her boyfriend Jake or a merchant. It wasn't until Awakening where she was made a full-out playable character and her playable appearances continued afterwards.

But she's never been a plot important character aside from her Heroes appearance as the Order of Heroes' Commander. She's always been in the vein of a hidden bonus character. Not someone important to the story, just a character you can find and/or recruit to your Army. Nothing wrong with secret or bonus characters. And compared to Beedle where his appearances are more implied to be ancestry and whatnot, Anna was given the Nurse Joy/Officer Jenny treatment where all of them are sisters competing with each other in money/treasure getting.
Yes, all of the Annas in each game are different. Some of them are more heroic compared to some others and most of them do want to be as honest with their customers as possible, but they have that heart for gold & money and some certainly aren't against being manipulative and are willing to take advantage of scenarios. That said, some of the Annas you can point out the differences between each one while others are meant to be rather straightforward. So it's not impossible to like a specific Anna or dislike a specific Anna, although some of her fanbase do tend to link the Annas together due to similarities in their characters' personalities. But some definitely have more distinct traits.

Heck, you could actually make an interesting concept with Anna as a Smash Bros. character where she's none of the Annas from any of the games, but another sister competing in the Smash tournament and you could go creative with her moveset, with using a variety of weapons/skills and references to the various Annas from the games. Heck, she and her siblings practically go based around the Merchant/Adventurer motif, so why not have her be a literal "Everything including the Kitchen sink" character.
You know how we have Peach and Daisy where their Forward Smash attacks alternate between the three items they attack with, not to mention the Turnip special? Or Sora's B-Special that alternates between Firaga, Blizzaga and Thundaga? Or how Robin discards their tomes and Levin Sword when they are used up? Or Steve having access to different swords of different materials?

Anna could certainly work with that whole alternating weapon gimmick. Think something like Gilgamesh from Dissidia Final Fantasy 012. She starts out barehanded and her unarmed attacks are somewhat weak, but her B-special pulls out a item-like weapon that alternates between a Sword, Axe and Lance that she uses to fight with while her other specials use a Bow, Warp Staff and various other items. For the weapons from her B-Special, she has to stick with that weapon until it's durability runs out in which she can throw it like an item afterwards.
She'll most often get an Iron Sword, Axe or Lance, but she sometimes pulls out different variations of the main weapons, like:
  • A Bronze version of the weapon she pulls(the 2nd weakest weapon you can pull, but has the fastest attack speed)
  • A Silver weapon(the 2nd strongest in straightforward damage).
  • A Kodachi/Hand Axe/Javalin(a weapon that can be thrown immediately and can be thrown a number of times).
  • A Levin Sword/Bolt Axe/Shockstick, which shoots down lightning in front of the Forward attack(giving a bit of extra range), in front of the wielder if using an Up-Attack or Down-Tilt or on both sides if using Down-Smash.
  • A Killer Edge/Axe/Lance, which functions like the Killer Edge in Smash Bros, except with durability and not alot of it.
  • A Tree Branch/Ladle/Log, the weakest weapons that deal very little melee damage, have low durability, but deal decent damage when they are thrown and hit somebody.
  • Last but not least, a possibility of a PRF/Legendary weapon, being either Mystletainn(based on the Awakening design), Noatun or the Apotheosis Spear. On the other hand, sometimes instead of Mystletainn, she'll pull out Missiletainn(which is normally exclusive to Owain, but in her Warriors Support with Robin, one of the items she has on sale is Missiletainn) and deals much weaker damage(about as much as an Iron Sword) than Mystletainn, but has the chance to do a one-time powerful critical hit stronger than the Killing Edge. Yes, Missiletainn is mistaken for the Demon Sword Mystletainn and is likely a reference to Excalipur/Excalipoor from Final Fantasy.
For her Side-Special, she uses various bows, but not as many as the above. She can either shoot with an Iron Bow, a Silver Bow, a Shining Bow(basically a Magic Bow like the Levin Sword/Bolt Axe/Shockstick), a Killer Bow(a Bow that hits with a Critical Hit) or Astra, a Bow that shoots out 5 Arrows in close succession compared to the others that shoot out one Arrow. Her Up-Special is a Warp Staff that allows her to "Warp". Her Down-B takes a page from Hero and basically you can pick an item that does a certain effect.
  • You can get Tonics that either boost her Attack, Speed, Defense or Resistance for a short time.
  • You can get an Energy Drop that boosts up her Attack greatly for one attack or a Talisman that boosts up her Defense/Resistance greatly for one hit.
  • A pair of Boots that give her an additional double jump for a limited time. And yes, while they originally increase move spaces a character can move at, there is an artwork for Boots that does show them with wings, so you could use them to apply for double jumping.
  • A Lightning Charm, an item that when thrown and hits either another character or the ground electrifies and damages all characters around where it lands.
  • A Lightrune, an item that when placed on the ground, prevents characters from traversing past the barriers for a limited time. It blocks on the left and right side. It can't prevent edges from being grabbed from below.
  • A Reeking Box, an item that summons a Risen Soldier that attacks both foe and friend alike.
  • Iote's Shield, an item that protects against ranged attacks for a limited time.
  • Hammerne, a Staff item that repairs the currant weapon Anna is wielding.
  • A Steel Dagger, a throwable item that when it hits an enemy, reduces their attack damage slightly as well as their Defense and Resistance to damage and launching for a short time.
  • A Flame Shuriken, an throwable item that damages and burns enemies that it hits and reduces their damage defense slightly for a short time.
  • An item from within Smash Bros. will appear as a selectable item if Items are on, but only one item from within Smash Bros. will appear in the list.
As for Anna's Final Smash, she uses a Torch and signals Jake, her boyfriend in some of the Annas' appearances(like in Shadow Dragon, Genealogy and Blazing Sword) to fire a destructive Ballistae shot upon an area, similar to the Dragoon/Pit's Final Smash.
Anyway, sure while Anna may not be important to her games' story much like Beedle, and unless Intelligent Systems or Sakurai/New Director advocate for her, she's probably not going to get into Smash Bros compered to the Major main characters. That said, she definitely has her own perks, quirks and uniqueness that I think can make her unique for Smash Bros. and differentiate herself from other Fire Emblem characters as well as Merchant characters from other series.
 
Last edited:

fogbadge

Smash Obsessed
Joined
Jun 29, 2012
Messages
22,791
Location
Scotland
on the subject of zelda characters: how about the happy mask salesman?

on the subject of anna: why is she a toddler now?
 
Last edited:

Gengar84

Smash Hero
Joined
Dec 9, 2009
Messages
6,783
on the subject of zelda characters: how about the happy mask salesman?

on the subject of anna: why is she a toddler now?
He could actually be a lot of fun. I imagine him playing basically like how I would have liked Young Link to play if he was unique.

Zelda’s in a bit of a weird spot for me. My most wanted character is Impa, but only her Hyrule Warriors incarnation specifically. I never really cared too much about the character before or since but I absolutely loved her in that game. I suppose her portrayal in Skyward Sword would be a good choice since they have s lot of similarities. I’d still be excited to see Skull Kid, Midna, or Ganon too, but HW Impa would be my number one. They could always pull another Pirahna Plant with Zelda and give us something totally unexpected like a Moblin, Lizalfos, or Octarok.
 
Last edited:

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

Flap and Swish~
Premium
Joined
Aug 13, 2001
Messages
34,391
Location
Cull Hazard
NNID
Irene4
3DS FC
1203-9265-8784
Switch FC
SW-7567-8572-3791
Anna's not important to the stories, aside from Fire Emblem Heroes where she actually is a main character, although she's more minor compared to Alfonse, Kiran, Sharena, Veronica and the Books' Main Heroine character(Fjorm, Eir, Peony, Reginn, Ash and Seior). Basically, she's a character who appeared in all Fire Emblem games aside from Gaiden/Echoes(so she's a much older character than Beedle) and her role used to be mainly a cameo with her boyfriend Jake or a merchant. It wasn't until Awakening where she was made a full-out playable character and her playable appearances continued afterwards.

But she's never been a plot important character aside from her Heroes appearance as the Order of Heroes' Commander. She's always been in the vein of a hidden bonus character. Not someone important to the story, just a character you can find and/or recruit to your Army. Nothing wrong with secret or bonus characters. And compared to Beedle where his appearances are more implied to be ancestry and whatnot, Anna was given the Nurse Joy/Officer Jenny treatment where all of them are sisters competing with each other in money/treasure getting.
Yes, all of the Annas in each game are different. Some of them are more heroic compared to some others and most of them do want to be as honest with their customers as possible, but they have that heart for gold & money and some certainly aren't against being manipulative and are willing to take advantage of scenarios. That said, some of the Annas you can point out the differences between each one while others are meant to be rather straightforward. So it's not impossible to like a specific Anna or dislike a specific Anna, although some of her fanbase do tend to link the Annas together due to similarities in their characters' personalities. But some definitely have more distinct traits.

Heck, you could actually make an interesting concept with Anna as a Smash Bros. character where she's none of the Annas from any of the games, but another sister competing in the Smash tournament and you could go creative with her moveset, with using a variety of weapons/skills and references to the various Annas from the games. Heck, she and her siblings practically go based around the Merchant/Adventurer motif, so why not have her be a literal "Everything including the Kitchen sink" character.
You know how we have Peach and Daisy where their Forward Smash attacks alternate between the three items they attack with, not to mention the Turnip special? Or Sora's B-Special that alternates between Firaga, Blizzaga and Thundaga? Or how Robin discards their tomes and Levin Sword when they are used up? Or Steve having access to different swords of different materials?

Anna could certainly work with that whole alternating weapon gimmick. Think something like Gilgamesh from Dissidia Final Fantasy 012. She starts out barehanded and her unarmed attacks are somewhat weak, but her B-special pulls out a item-like weapon that alternates between a Sword, Axe and Lance that she uses to fight with while her other specials use a Bow, Warp Staff and various other items. For the weapons from her B-Special, she has to stick with that weapon until it's durability runs out in which she can throw it like an item afterwards.
She'll most often get an Iron Sword, Axe or Lance, but she sometimes pulls out different variations of the main weapons, like:
  • A Bronze version of the weapon she pulls(the 2nd weakest weapon you can pull, but has the fastest attack speed)
  • A Silver weapon(the 2nd strongest in straightforward damage).
  • A Kodachi/Hand Axe/Javalin(a weapon that can be thrown immediately and can be thrown a number of times).
  • A Levin Sword/Bolt Axe/Shockstick, which shoots down lightning in front of the Forward attack(giving a bit of extra range), in front of the wielder if using an Up-Attack or Down-Tilt or on both sides if using Down-Smash.
  • A Killer Edge/Axe/Lance, which functions like the Killer Edge in Smash Bros, except with durability and not alot of it.
  • A Tree Branch/Ladle/Log, the weakest weapons that deal very little melee damage, have low durability, but deal decent damage when they are thrown and hit somebody.
  • Last but not least, a possibility of a PRF/Legendary weapon, being either Mystletainn(based on the Awakening design), Noatun or the Apotheosis Spear. On the other hand, sometimes instead of Mystletainn, she'll pull out Missiletainn(which is normally exclusive to Owain, but in her Warriors Support with Robin, one of the items she has on sale is Missiletainn) and deals much weaker damage(about as much as an Iron Sword) than Mystletainn, but has the chance to do a one-time powerful critical hit stronger than the Killing Edge. Yes, Missiletainn is mistaken for the Demon Sword Mystletainn and is likely a reference to Excalipur/Excalipoor from Final Fantasy.
For her Side-Special, she uses various bows, but not as many as the above. She can either shoot with an Iron Bow, a Silver Bow, a Shining Bow(basically a Magic Bow like the Levin Sword/Bolt Axe/Shockstick), a Killer Bow(a Bow that hits with a Critical Hit) or Astra, a Bow that shoots out 5 Arrows in close succession compared to the others that shoot out one Arrow. Her Up-Special is a Warp Staff that allows her to "Warp". Her Down-B takes a page from Hero and basically you can pick an item that does a certain effect.
  • You can get Tonics that either boost her Attack, Speed, Defense or Resistance for a short time.
  • You can get an Energy Drop that boosts up her Attack greatly for one attack or a Talisman that boosts up her Defense/Resistance greatly for one hit.
  • A pair of Boots that give her an additional double jump for a limited time. And yes, while they originally increase move spaces a character can move at, there is an artwork for Boots that does show them with wings, so you could use them to apply for double jumping.
  • A Lightning Charm, an item that when thrown and hits either another character or the ground electrifies and damages all characters around where it lands.
  • A Lightrune, an item that when placed on the ground, prevents characters from traversing past the barriers for a limited time. It blocks on the left and right side. It can't prevent edges from being grabbed from below.
  • A Reeking Box, an item that summons a Risen Soldier that attacks both foe and friend alike.
  • Iote's Shield, an item that protects against ranged attacks for a limited time.
  • Hammerne, a Staff item that repairs the currant weapon Anna is wielding.
  • A Steel Dagger, a throwable item that when it hits an enemy, reduces their attack damage slightly as well as their Defense and Resistance to damage and launching for a short time.
  • A Flame Shuriken, an throwable item that damages and burns enemies that it hits and reduces their damage defense slightly for a short time.
  • An item from within Smash Bros. will appear as a selectable item if Items are on, but only one item from within Smash Bros. will appear in the list.
As for Anna's Final Smash, she uses a Torch and signals Jake, her boyfriend in some of the Annas' appearances(like in Shadow Dragon, Genealogy and Blazing Sword) to fire a destructive Ballistae shot upon an area, similar to the Dragoon/Pit's Final Smash.
Anyway, sure while Anna may not be important to her games' story much like Beedle, and unless Intelligent Systems or Sakurai/New Director advocate for her, she's probably not going to get into Smash Bros compered to the Major main characters. That said, she definitely has her own perks, quirks and uniqueness that I think can make her unique for Smash Bros. and differentiate herself from other Fire Emblem characters as well as Merchant characters from other series.
It was already answered earlier enough for me to understand her position, but thank you for the details too. :)

(My last post notes that "My bad" when it came to thinking of her importance). Though as I said, I don't think she's comparable to Beedle either way. She's in a character-driven series where fleshed out personalities are a major part of its charm and necessary. Zelda is not a case of that as it's focused far more on unique gameplay, which is why few characters get fleshed out and many are fun reoccurring characters like Beedle, Malon, or even just some enemies when they're more on the silly side(Bokoblins, for instance). The only similarity she has to Beedle besides their job is there's more than one, but they're on different levels of designs and practices too. That also said, since Impa was brought up, I remember her being the same person in the general series due to time travel shenanigans. She's like the only one that might be like that. I don't remember the official explanation, though. We've had two Ganons overall(FSA is a different version of him), compared to the tons of Zeldas and Links.
 

Gengar84

Smash Hero
Joined
Dec 9, 2009
Messages
6,783
I feel like, at least early on, the Zelda developers never really thought of the timeline as a whole and how everything fits together and just designed each game as its own separate entity without too much consideration about the rest of the series. It always felt to me that the games were initially intended to just be standalone stories with some fun recurring cameos. I think all the timeline stuff was made after the fact because fans were curious. Modern games likely put more thought into that area since it has already been established at this point. I could be wrong though. I don’t know if Nintendo ever claimed that to be the case.
 
Last edited:

Quillion

Smash Hero
Joined
Sep 17, 2014
Messages
5,989
I feel like, at least early on, the Zelda developers never really thought of the timeline as a whole and how everything fits together and just designed each game as its own separate entity without too much consideration about the rest of the series. It always felt to me that the games were initially intended to just be standalone stories with some fun recurring cameos. I think all the timeline stuff was made after the fact because fans were curious. Modern games likely put more thought into that area since it has already been established at this point. I could be wrong though. I don’t know if Nintendo ever claimed that to be the case.
Early on yeah, but at least with the 3D games, we have Wind Waker and Twilight Princess directly following up on OoT's plot. Then there's the DS games following up on WW's plot. SS explains the origin of Sheik's harp, and BotW directly references events from OoT.

It just manages to not make sense if you try to shove in the Four Swords games or the traditional 2D games into the timeline, given that the former seems to act as its own wrapped-up series while the latter are all standalone barring a few sequels here and there.

Either way, if you're just going by in-game, there's a definite "Hero of Time Saga" and a "Wind Saga", with other games loosely but veritably connected to the former.
 

fogbadge

Smash Obsessed
Joined
Jun 29, 2012
Messages
22,791
Location
Scotland
Early on yeah, but at least with the 3D games, we have Wind Waker and Twilight Princess directly following up on OoT's plot. Then there's the DS games following up on WW's plot. SS explains the origin of Sheik's harp, and BotW directly references events from OoT.

It just manages to not make sense if you try to shove in the Four Swords games or the traditional 2D games into the timeline, given that the former seems to act as its own wrapped-up series while the latter are all standalone barring a few sequels here and there.

Either way, if you're just going by in-game, there's a definite "Hero of Time Saga" and a "Wind Saga", with other games loosely but veritably connected to the former.
it’s called the adult timeline not the wind saga
 

fogbadge

Smash Obsessed
Joined
Jun 29, 2012
Messages
22,791
Location
Scotland
"Wind Saga" sounds better, especially since we already have a "Hero of Time Saga" that takes place across two timelines and an upcoming "Wild Saga" that takes place in an unknown timeline.
yeah well it’s called the adult timeline

and botw is said to be at the far future of all the timelines
 

Hadokeyblade

Smash Legend
Joined
Dec 5, 2018
Messages
10,840
For the record, nothing was answered about Anna's important to the story. So again, her being a neat merchant doesn't tell me anything. Beedle is the same to me with that argument. Both are full of charm and the core merchants where applicable. I can't tell a difference here. That's saying something.

Tingle, that said, is a great character, but his charm in MM wasn't as nice in WW due to his sudden slave-driving. He was a greedy asshole which felt like the charm was gone by then. This was fixed with his own games and his silliness being without atrocities like in FSA and later games, making him benevolent again. Ages was basically his MM character but with the Toon design.

Beedle to me has lots of charm by doing a simple job, doing it right, and having a perfect voice actor for it(US version, at least). Maybe it's just other versions aren't as fun for some. You can't replace him with just anyone. They don't have a specific personality that says "Beedle". He's not just like any action-adventure one, because they get their own charm and style. They're different because they're their own person. You can't easily replace him because he's not a generic merchant at all. This isn't the random merchants in Zelda 1 who are easy to replace. This is an actual person with a distinct voice and style. He does his own thing. ...Which is why so far I have yet to see what makes Anna special within her own franchise. Why does have a notable goal matter outside of the fact FE is more story-driven? That's why the difference is little to me. It makes sense... in that context why she's like that. Beedle makes perfect sense in the context of his series. There's nothing more to give him to do outside of changing the story up entirely to fit him into it as some super important character. ...In an action adventure game where story is supposed to be a bit on the lighter side and only star a handful of characters where there's kind of no reason to super flesh out anyone else? Like, even the 4 Champions aren't that fleshed out. They're absolutely notable, but they're still fairly simple but nothing like the main characters. They're secondary. Beedle is a minor character and well below that. Tingle is much closer to secondary even.
She's basically just Mr Krabs as a cute anime girl with multiverse hopping powers.
 

Ivander

Smash Legend
Joined
Dec 1, 2014
Messages
11,050
She's basically just Mr Krabs as a cute anime girl with multiverse hopping powers.
Only if he was the equivalent of Nurse Joy across the multiverse with some being more chivalrous/less greedy compared to some of their other siblings.

Also, Mr. Krabs is honest about his greed. Most Annas try to hide their greed. There are a few who don't though and sometimes the ones who try to hide it end up spouting their inner thoughts.

That said, you can't really compare Mr. Krabs to Anna when each Anna is a different individual despite their looks. Heck, in FEFates, when talking with F!Corrin, that Anna even questions herself on why she and her siblings look alike, have the same name, etc.
 
Top Bottom