Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

I don’t know, I guess I would be frustrated if every single bit of content was removed. There’s no reason for them to go in and remove Mother 3 music, so if that happened that would feel insulting. But unless we’re getting a totally revised soundtrack this doesn’t typically happen.

Would also like to point out/add that even though Lucas wasn't in 4 for the first like 9 months, Unfounded Revenge/Smashing Song of Praise, Mother 3 Love Theme, and Porky's Theme (which uses his themes from Mother 3) returned anyway in Wii U's expanded soundtrack, so there's legitimately zero reason to believe Lucas being cut would remove Mother 3 music from the soundtrack unless we're going back to like two tracks per stage like Melee and Smash 3DS did.

EDIT: Not to mention, Smash 4 ADDED trophies of the Ultimate Chimera and Lucas himself at launch when all Brawl had trophy-wise for Mother 3 was Porky in his mech and the Porky Statue.

 

[Pupp135]

I’m a little late to the Jigglypuff conversation, I was thinking of this photo, and it seems that Jigglypuff is pretty low priority for For. While it does seem like a low priority character, I feel like it’s something that the developers tend to add last minute.

Ya know, we all have a perception of what characters a Smash game can't really go without (original 12 + Marth and such), but when talking about rebooting the stage list, I don't think we've ever discussed what that looks like for stages.

So what do you guys think are Super Smash Bros.'s stages classics? I'll start with:

• Battlefield
• Final Destination
• Temple
• Brinstar
• Sector Z/Corneria
• Jungle Japes
• Onett
• Pokémon Stadium/Pokémon Stadium 2
• Yoshi's Island (Melee)

These are all stages that have had nearly perfect attendance (SSB3DS drops most of them because they wanted to diversify the two stage lists in SSB4) throughout the series since SSBM. Not the best metric since most people aren't exactly rooting for the return of stages like Jungle Japes, and it's definitely SSBB erasure, but it's a good starting point I think.

I think these nine stages are a good base for what to expect next game. I’d also wager that these stages are valued by the developers also:

Some Mario stage from Brawl (I’ll just say Mushroomy Kingdom for convenience)
Kongo Jungle
Hyrule Castle or Bridge of Eldin
Norfair
Dream Land 64
Halberd?
Lylat Cruise
Port Town Aero Dive
Castle Siege
Skyworld
Wario Ware
Distant Planet
Green Hill Zone

 

[Wonder Smash]

We had all of October - March to be upset Lucas wasn’t in the game. We didn’t know how DLC was being handled past Mewtwo and we didn’t know Lucas would be a part of it. For that period of time Lucas fans knew how that felt, and learned to deal with it and find joy in other characters. This is a ridiculous argument so I’m going to cut it off here.

Of course it's ridiculous because like I said, you ended up getting Lucas soon after that anyway, so it doesn't say anything. It's about as ridiculous as comparing yourself to Snake fans. You really cannot compare your experience of just simply not having your character in the base roster to them not having their character in the game at all. Stuff like that really has to sink in.

Hence why I’m prepared to lose one. And yes I can blame people if they choose to react in an immature, spiteful way. I’m an adult and I know these decisions are not personal. Sakurai has shown the game a tremendous amount of love up to this point, and I am grateful for that. It doesn’t retroactively mean he hates Mother 3 and its fans if it doesn’t last forever.

If venom is spat at Sakurai and other new additions simply because he couldn’t bring back one character I like, a semiclone from a series that hasn’t had a game in nearly two decades, I will be disappointed in the people who express and promote that hate. I won’t judge anyone for being upset. Just for making that everyone else’s problem.

You're talking about attacking Sakurai and that's not what I'm saying. I said you can't blame them for feeling dissed. It's not immature to feel that way. I mean, it's bad enough that Mother 3 hasn't been localized. Cutting Lucas is like adding insult to injury.

Nobody is denying what Sakurai has done for the games but we shouldn't be acting like he's above criticism (though, in the end, it's Nintendo's decision anyway). He's not perfect and I'm not a Sakurai Servbot.

I don’t know, I guess I would be frustrated if every single bit of content was removed. There’s no reason for them to go in and remove Mother 3 music, so if that happened that would feel insulting. But unless we’re getting a totally revised soundtrack this doesn’t typically happen.

Yeah, it wouldn't make any sense so I wouldn't blame you feeling that way.

 

[Gorgonzales]

Okami was the most pleasant surprise for me. Don't think it means Amaterasu's necessarily popping up in Smash or anything, but a sequel with today's hardware could be amazing. A well promoted follow up on the Switch 2 could do very solid numbers in Japan alone.

Okami is one of those titles that reminds you that games are art. Of course, you could realize that from any game, but the way Okami's visual style is so distinct from anything else on the market (to this day even) is a testament to how great its art direction is. I wish super-stylized titles were more common.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Of course it's ridiculous because like I said, you ended up getting Lucas soon after that anyway, so it doesn't say anything. It's about as ridiculous as comparing yourself to Snake fans. You really cannot compare your experience of just simply not having your character in the base roster to them not having their character in the game at all. Stuff like that really has to sink in.

So we're just conveniently forgetting the part where Louie also mentioned hoping Wolf doesn't get cut again, because Wolf fits your description perfectly, but it feels like you're basically saying "No, you don't get it" because Snake got cut once and all his content got scrubbed because he's a third party that Nintendo doesn't own.

Heck, my original Melee main was Pichu and I have a very sentimental attachment to Pichu because he helped me cope with bullying when I was young, but you know what I did when he got cut in Brawl? I was sad for about 10 minutes and then kept playing Brawl because it's a character in a roster of a children's party game. Saying cutting a character is adding insult to injury and that preparing yourself just in case it happens is "accepting defeat" is such a baffling mindset to me.

Not to mention, for someone who isn't even a fan of Mother 3 and Lucas is not a favorite of theirs as you've said, you're so adamant about this for no reasons given other than "Well, the fans would feel bad" (even though Louie G., one of the fans you're speaking for, disagrees wholeheartedly with you), "People like Mother 3", "It could be a tribute to Iwata", and a bunch of whataboutism about "oh, what if they remove all of the Mother 3 content?" that even if you don't mean to, it feels like you're being inflammatory or contradictory on purpose for the sake of it.

 

[Noipoi]

Mother 3 just gets people riled up huh?

 

[Ivander]

Mother 3 just gets people riled up huh?

More like gets people heated up.

 

[Louie G.]

You're talking about attacking Sakurai and that's not what I'm saying. I said you can't blame them for feeling dissed. It's not immature to feel that way. I mean, it's bad enough that Mother 3 hasn't been localized. Cutting Lucas is like adding insult to injury.

Again, you're lecturing me on this as someone who doesn't even consider themselves a Mother fan. It's just odd that I'm on the receiving end of this argument, it's a little annoying. Nobody here has expressed feeling disrespected at the prospect of Lucas being cut, and I'm certain I'm not the only one here who loves this game. Why are you going to bat for how these people feel when none of them have expressed these feelings of personal anger at the prospect? It's not something any of us want to happen, but it's something most of us are prepared to deal with if it comes. I think people who are earnest fans of the series, like myself, can speak on whether or not to be insulted by this.

Similarly, most people who love the series have already played the fan translation and accepted it's unlikely to be localized. There's no injury here, it doesn't matter at this point. I've already played the game, anyone who wants to can easily play the game, and I could even buy a reproduction cartridge for dirt cheap and physically own it. The most insulted I've been by Nintendo in respect to Mother 3 was making those Switch icons region specific - even then, I found a workaround and nabbed all of them. In fact, they just released a full plushie set of Lucas, Claus, Kumatora and Duster that I plan on buying once it is restocked. Surprisingly, the Mother series is getting more official merch right now than many ACTIVE Nintendo series.

We're not THAT starved for content. Lucas being in three Smash games is a wonderful gift to the community that would not be soured by him being excluded next game. Most fans of this series know how to count their blessings. Given that it's unlikely for the Mother series in its entirety to be uprooted from Smash, I'm certain many of us will be happy having Ness around and maybe hoping Lucas can return as DLC or in a future title. Cutting both characters would be an insult, but cutting just one is... pretty standard, really.

Mother 3 just gets people riled up huh?

Not really.

 

[Lionfranky]

Sora is fighter # 82. If they aim to reach 100 fighters milestone(Of course, this is assuming they keep the entire roster), they would need to add 18 more fighters. Do you think this is ridiculous or worth shot?

 

[Perkilator]

Sora is fighter # 82. If they aim to reach 100 fighters milestone(Of course, this is assuming they keep the entire roster), they would need to add 18 more fighters. Do you think this is ridiculous or worth shot?

Counting the seven Echo Fighters, we technically have 89 playable characters. If we were to reach 100 fighters, ideally that should mean 8 more unique fighters and 3 more Echo Fighters.

 

[BuckleyTim]

Going for 100 characters in one game is not gonna happen unless next Smash is a direct port that sacrifices anything new in sake of hitting that milestone, but I wouldn't be surprised if the numbering system they used for Ultimate carries over in some form to the next game just so they can hype up "oooh, this is the 100th character to have ever been in Smash Bros" milestone.

Also as someone whose playing "regular" fighting games now that Smash is on break, I gotta say returning characters in other games are so much more interesting than Smash. Roy and Lucas just felt like "here they are with prettier visuals" in a vacuum of sorts, meanwhile when someone returns to Street Fighter you get to see what they're up to story-wise, and sometimes they even change somewhat between iterations to make them feel a lot more different. Heck, you look at the Capcom Vs. stuff and it makes you realize that I'd much rather have a roster with many and even odd blindspots as long as those characters actually get to interact outside of the darn ad trailers. Don't get me wrong, Smash has probably executed the concept as best as it can while juggle 50 different franchises, but now that the dust has settled I want more substantial crossover interaction stuff than just KI:U easter eggs... and I'd honestly be willing to part with a lot to get it.

 

[Wonder Smash]

So we're just conveniently forgetting the part where Louie also mentioned hoping Wolf doesn't get cut again, because Wolf fits your description perfectly, but it feels like you're basically saying "No, you don't get it" because Snake got cut once and all his content got scrubbed because he's a third party that Nintendo doesn't own.

We all hope characters don't get cut again. Your point?

Heck, my original Melee main was Pichu and I have a very sentimental attachment to Pichu because he helped me cope with bullying when I was young, but you know what I did when he got cut in Brawl? I was sad for about 10 minutes and then kept playing Brawl because it's a character in a roster of a children's party game. Saying cutting a character is adding insult to injury and that preparing yourself just in case it happens is "accepting defeat" is such a baffling mindset to me.

Oh, yeah, Pokemon, the series that has way more than just three games, way more than just two reps...wait, how does this compare to Lucas and Mother 3 again?

Not to mention, for someone who isn't even a fan of Mother 3 and Lucas is not a favorite of theirs as you've said, you're so adamant about this for no reasons given other than "Well, the fans would feel bad" (even though Louie G., one of the fans you're speaking for, disagrees wholeheartedly with you), "People like Mother 3", "It could be a tribute to Iwata", and a bunch of whataboutism about "oh, what if they remove all of the Mother 3 content?" that even if you don't mean to, it feels like you're being inflammatory or contradictory on purpose for the sake of it.

No, it doesn't. I've been consistent for the whole time and I personally don't see any reason to believe that Lucas is as likely to be cut as people here to seem to think and I also think it's unreasonable to think just because one person can take it well in the event that it does happen, everyone else should take it the same way.

Mother 3 just gets people riled up huh?

Actually, two posters (Speed Weed and Verde Coeden Scalesworth) got me riled up with false claims of me "using somebody's death". That's something I'm not going to tolerate.

Either they tell me they made a mistake and take back what they said or admit that they did that on purpose.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

We got a new Star Wolf remix in the game that Wolf got cut. Just saying.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Oh, yeah, Pokemon, the series that has way more than just three games, way more than just two reps...wait, how does this compare to Lucas and Mother 3 again?

Wow, I didn't realize my personal experience of a character I love getting canned, aka THE ENTIRE POINT OF THE ARGUMENT, for 17 years didn't matter because he's from a big franchise! News to me!

My point is that your points against cutting Lucas boil down to assuming how other people will feel about it (because you've stated yourself that you're not even a fan of Mother 3), statements that have no bearing on anything like "People like Mother 3", or whataboutism about removing content from the game for no discernible reason, which has never happened before except for Snake because he's third party.

Someone that's actually a fan of Mother 3 disagrees with you and now you're causing a stink over nothing because he said he would personally be okay and in his experience most Mother 3 fans will be as well. Louie never said EVERYONE who loses a character would feel the same way, but specifically he and the other Mother 3 fans he has interacted with have been prepared for it IF IT DOES HAPPEN.

AND I'D LIKE TO POINT OUT, nobody has disagreed with you that Lucas could come back as DLC anyway, we're literally just saying he could miss out on the base game, which is what most people mean when they say a character gets cut, since we know they can come back because of Smash 4 bringing back Mewtwo, Lucas, and Roy. So you're basically just disagreeing and arguing nonstop with people who don't even entirely disagree with you anyway.

You're genuinely acting like everyone is saying "lmao, get rid of Lucas, nobody likes him anyway" and coming to his defense when nobody said that or is even acting like that's the case. It's obnoxious.

 

[Opossum]

Going for 100 characters in one game is not gonna happen unless next Smash is a direct port that sacrifices anything new in sake of hitting that milestone, but I wouldn't be surprised if the numbering system they used for Ultimate carries over in some form to the next game just so they can hype up "oooh, this is the 100th character to have ever been in Smash Bros" milestone.

Also as someone whose playing "regular" fighting games now that Smash is on break, I gotta say returning characters in other games are so much more interesting than Smash. Roy and Lucas just felt like "here they are with prettier visuals" in a vacuum of sorts, meanwhile when someone returns to Street Fighter you get to see what they're up to story-wise, and sometimes they even change somewhat between iterations to make them feel a lot more different. Heck, you look at the Capcom Vs. stuff and it makes you realize that I'd much rather have a roster with many and even odd blindspots as long as those characters actually get to interact outside of the darn ad trailers. Don't get me wrong, Smash has probably executed the concept as best as it can while juggle 50 different franchises, but now that the dust has settled I want more substantial crossover interaction stuff than just KI:U easter eggs... and I'd honestly be willing to part with a lot to get it.

I can see that for Lucas, but Roy got significantly reworked when he came back in Smash 4. That's quite a big step up from how much Mewtwo or Lucas changed.

 

[Wonder Smash]

Again, you're lecturing me on this as someone who doesn't even consider themselves a Mother fan. It's just odd that I'm on the receiving end of this argument, it's a little annoying. Nobody here has expressed feeling disrespected at the prospect of Lucas being cut, and I'm certain I'm not the only one here who loves this game. Why are you going to bat for how these people feel when none of them have expressed these feelings of personal anger at the prospect? It's not something any of us want to happen, but it's something most of us are prepared to deal with if it comes. I think people who are earnest fans of the series, like myself, can speak on whether or not to be insulted by this.

Similarly, most people who love the series have already played the fan translation and accepted it's unlikely to be localized. There's no injury here, it doesn't matter at this point. I've already played the game, anyone who wants to can easily play the game, and I could even buy a reproduction cartridge for dirt cheap and physically own it. The most insulted I've been by Nintendo in respect to Mother 3 was making those Switch icons region specific - even then, I found a workaround and nabbed all of them. In fact, they just released a full plushie set of Lucas, Claus, Kumatora and Duster that I plan on buying once it is restocked. Surprisingly, the Mother series is getting more official merch right now than many ACTIVE Nintendo series.

We're not THAT starved for content. Lucas being in three Smash games is a wonderful gift to the community that would not be soured by him being excluded next game. Most fans of this series know how to count their blessings. Given that it's unlikely for the Mother series in its entirety to be uprooted from Smash, I'm certain many of us will be happy having Ness around and maybe hoping Lucas can return as DLC or in a future title. Cutting both characters would be an insult, but cutting just one is... pretty standard, really.

I just simply said that I wouldn't blame the fans if they felt disrespected. I said nothing about the way you acted. But for some strange reason, you misinterpreted that (which seems to be a constant problem here in this board) into being okay fans being outrage and lashing out and stuff.

What I also find strange is that after all that, you come right around and say you'd feel pretty much same way if other Earthbound content gets cut; insulted and frustrated. So I don't know why you were even debating with me in the first place when you admit that you would feel the same way about cut content.

Wow, I didn't realize my personal experience of a character I love getting canned, aka THE ENTIRE POINT OF THE ARGUMENT, for 17 years didn't matter because he's from a big franchise! News to me!

Well maybe next time, you should actually understand the arguments more before you dip in, so that you don't miss parts like:

If you're a fan, then you really can't blame them for that. Mario, Pokemon, and Fire Emblem, much larger series, have several characters that wouldn't surprise anyone if they get cut but Earthbound, a much smaller series, only has just two and THAT gets cut?

My point is that your points against cutting Lucas boil down to assuming how other people will feel about it (because you've stated yourself that you're not even a fan of Mother 3), statements that have no bearing on anything like "People like Mother 3", or whataboutism about removing content from the game for no discernible reason, which has never happened before except for Snake because he's third party.

Someone that's actually a fan of Mother 3 disagrees with you and now you're causing a stink over nothing because he said he would personally be okay and in his experience most Mother 3 fans will be as well. Louie never said EVERYONE who loses a character would feel the same way, but specifically he and the other Mother 3 fans he has interacted with have been prepared for it IF IT DOES HAPPEN.

AND I'D LIKE TO POINT OUT, nobody has disagreed with you that Lucas could come back as DLC anyway, we're literally just saying he could miss out on the base game, which is what most people mean when they say a character gets cut, since we know they can come back because of Smash 4 bringing back Mewtwo, Lucas, and Roy. So you're basically just disagreeing and arguing nonstop with people who don't even entirely disagree with you anyway.

You're genuinely acting like everyone is saying "lmao, get rid of Lucas, nobody likes him anyway" and coming to his defense when nobody said that or is even acting like that's the case. It's obnoxious.

Please! Nobody mentioned him coming back as DLC later. You just came up with that on your own. If that was the case, then he wouldn't technically be cut from the game, which is the whole point. Why in the world would anybody be talking about preparing themselves for a character just simply not being in the base roster...when he can still make it as DLC? That's ridiculous!

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Well maybe next time, you should actually understand the arguments more before you dip in, so that you don't miss parts like:

If you're a fan, then you really can't blame them for that. Mario, Pokemon, and Fire Emblem, much larger series, have several characters that wouldn't surprise anyone if they get cut but Earthbound, a much smaller series, only has just two and THAT gets cut?



Please! Nobody mentioned him coming back as DLC later. You just came up with that on your own. If that was the case, then he wouldn't be technically be cut from the game, which is the whole point.

See, this "point" you're making is literally a nothing burger. It's literally "these big franchises have expected cuts, why should any smaller series get cuts?" as if Wolf isn't literally a character from a smaller series that got cut completely, and it has thus happened before and has some kind of precedent. You can't have it both ways here.

Also literally everyone keeps saying he could come back as DLC BECAUSE IT'S HAPPENED BEFORE (if you were paying attention at all like you say I should be, I've been saying this the entire time) but it depends on how many characters get cut and who has the priority to bring back as veteran DLC.

I don't care how you see the phrase "cutting [insert character here]" as some grave disgrace and automatically means they're gone for good because I and most people I talk to about this understand that there's every chance they could come back anyway, just like Mewtwo, Lucas, and Roy.

Also, Louie didn't say he'd feel insulted if some of the Mother 3 content got cut like in your response to him, he said he'd feel insulted if ALL of it got cut, which is a completely different beast that has an incredibly low chance of happening.

 

[DarthEnderX]

So what do you guys think are Super Smash Bros.'s stages classics?

1. Big Blue
2. Big Blue
3. Big Blue
4. Fountain of Dreams
5. Big Blue

I'm surprised this hasn't been posted yet.

Some Dino Crisis fan community scammed the hell out of that. DC more popular than RE4? GTFO!

Hilarious that Q6 is just like "...no thanks."

 

[Wonder Smash]

See, this "point" you're making is literally a nothing burger. It's literally "these big franchises have expected cuts, why should any smaller series get cuts?" as if Wolf isn't literally a character from a smaller series that got cut completely, and it has thus happened before and has some kind of precedent. You can't have it both ways here.

Also literally everyone keeps saying he could come back as DLC (if you were paying attention at all like you say I should be, I've been saying this the entire time) but it depends on how many characters get cut and who has the priority to bring back as veteran DLC.

I don't care how you see the phrase "cutting [insert character here]" as some grave disgrace and automatically means they're gone for good because I and most people I talk to about this understand that there's every chance they could come back anyway, just like Mewtwo, Lucas, and Roy.

Also, Louie didn't say he'd feel insulted if some of the Mother 3 content got cut like in your response to him, he said he'd feel insulted if ALL of it got cut, which is a completely different beast that has an incredibly low chance of happening.

I don't know what point you're making with Star Fox. What are you trying to say?

And no, literally everyone did not mention DLC. You just brought this up on your own. You also need to stop speaking for Louie because you're not helping anything. I was the one who said Mother 3 content.

 

[Louie G.]

If I’m disappointed about a cut, I’ll rally for them to be DLC or come back next game.

As you can see here, I also acknowledged the possibility of returning as DLC. The premise here isn't that a character becomes exiled from the series forever... it's just that they get out-prioritized by other characters for the base game. Which, by most people's standards, means they got cut. It's just a temporary cut, maybe.

As for Lucas' odds as being sold back for DLC a second time... I dunno, I guess it depends who else would be cut in this scenario. Lucas was a significant loss during Smash 4, when we didn't lose all that many characters, but if we end up losing other big names this time around it may be steeper competition. But that's a conversation for later down the line, it hinges on too many what-ifs than I'm comfortable weighing out before the game is even officially announced.

Rule of thumb, if I talk about characters getting cut or their odds of being in Smash 6, yadda yadda, I'm talking about the base game. If it's about DLC and beyond I'll usually specify otherwise. The only characters I really feel like speculating on for DLC are third parties that I don't think are feasible for base.

You also need to stop speaking for Louie because you're not helping anything.

Poppy is reiterating what I've already said a few times now. I can only repeat it so many times myself, lol.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

I don't know what point you're making with Star Fox. What are you trying to say?

And no, literally everyone did not mention DLC. You just brought this up on your own. You also need to stop speaking for Louie because you're not helping anything. I was the one who said Mother 3 content.

Let me spell out my point so you get it.
Star Fox is a smaller franchise.
Mother is a smaller franchise.
Wolf got cut and did not return, despite being from a smaller franchise.
Lucas could thus get cut and not return, despite being from a smaller franchise.

Also telling me not to speak for Louie is hilarious when you've been speaking for the Mother 3 fanbase the entire time, despite not being a fan.

Which is why I said he might come back as DLC just like he did in 4, but it depends on which characters get cut and where the priorities end up.

Like don't get me wrong, I like Lucas, he just has a precedent because of Smash 4, and because of that I wouldn't be surprised if he got cut again.

And here's me literally saying I think he could be DLC, YESTERDAY, DIRECTLY TO YOU.

 

[Schnee117]

I was the one who said Mother 3 content.

This was the post you responded to that started this whole thing man

If they snub out Mother 3 content entirely, yeah.

If they bring back New Pork City, and if bed mech Porky were to return as a boss or something, then it would sting a bit less. I'm sure at least most of the music will return, lol. Both Assist Trophies are from EB already, and the items. So Earthbound in particular is likely to stay well represented, but if we see a more major content shift where most stages and an amount music are phased out then I can see myself being disappointed with the scope of the full series content.

Not factoring in a brand new stage, I'd probably bring back Magicant and New Pork City and cover most of our bases that way. If they brought in someone like Kumatora or Duster as an Assist Trophy in Lucas' wake then I'd be more than satisfied.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Sora is fighter # 82. If they aim to reach 100 fighters milestone(Of course, this is assuming they keep the entire roster), they would need to add 18 more fighters. Do you think this is ridiculous or worth shot?

Ultimate had 19 newcomers. I don't see why Smash 6 can't do the same.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

So uuuh back on the topic of stages. Super Smash Bros. actually doesn't bring back stages as much as I'd thought. There is no stage with perfect attendance (Battlefield and Final Destination technically show up in SSB, but neither are playable normally), and every stage introduced before SSB4 has skipped a game since it's inclusion (Melee stages usually skip SSB3DS, while Brawl stages usually skip SSBWIIU). SSBU is the first game to bring back more stages than create new ones, and the only one to bring back more than 30 (SSBWIIU had 18 at launch and 21 in total).

SSBU is probably going to be an exception, but I wouldn't be surprised to see a big jump in the number of returning stages (ignoring SSBU's numbers). I could see SSBNEXT having about 30-45 returning stages regardless of the total at launch. We could also pretty easily see stage DLC coming back as well, bumping those numbers up from there.

As far as how many stages goes, I think 60 is a reasonable minimum to expect (SSB4 had over 50 split across two versions), and as much as 100 could also appear, though I'm a bit skeptical of getting Ultimate numbers a second time.

 

[Wonder Smash]

This was the post you responded to that started this whole thing man

Nice try but wrong part.

In addition to that, you're talking about adding other Mother 3 content to the game without Lucas but what if that doesn't happen? What if all that gets cut with Lucas? And it really makes no sense to bring all that without Lucas. So...I can't picture the chances of that happening anyway.

Let me spell out my point so you get it.
Star Fox is a smaller franchise.
Mother is a smaller franchise.
Wolf got cut and did not return, despite being from a smaller franchise.
Lucas could thus get cut and not return, despite being from a smaller franchise.

Also telling me not to speak for Louie is hilarious when you've been speaking for the Mother 3 fanbase the entire time, despite not being a fan.


And here's me literally saying I think he could be DLC, YESTERDAY, DIRECTLY TO YOU.

Star Fox also has nearly 10 games (only released worldwide) and already has 3 reps, whereas Earthbound has just 3 games (only 2 worldwide) and only 2 reps. Though, I'm not denying that Star Fox is a smaller Nintendo series but I don't get what you're trying to say, as I never claimed it Lucas CAN'T be cut. I was talking about fans experiencing cuts.

And I also never claim to be speaking for the fanbase, as I only claim that I wouldn't blame them if they felt that way.

And once again, noticed how YOU brought up DLC on your own, like I said.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

So uuuh back on the topic of stages. Super Smash Bros. actually doesn't bring back stages as much as I'd thought. There is no stage with perfect attendance (Battlefield and Final Destination technically show up in SSB, but neither are playable normally), and every stage introduced before SSB4 has skipped a game since it's inclusion (Melee stages usually skip SSB3DS, while Brawl stages usually skip SSBWIIU). SSBU is the first game to bring back more stages than create new ones, and the only one to bring back more than 30 (SSBWIIU had 18 at launch and 21 in total).

SSBU is probably going to be an exception, but I wouldn't be surprised to see a big jump in the number of returning stages (ignoring SSBU's numbers). I could see SSBNEXT having about 30-45 returning stages regardless of the total at launch. We could also pretty easily see stage DLC coming back as well, bumping those numbers up from there.

As far as how many stages goes, I think 60 is a reasonable minimum to expect (SSB4 had over 50 split across two versions), and as much as 100 could also appear, though I'm a bit skeptical of getting Ultimate numbers a second time.

It might be because of how the naming scheme is;

-Final Destination was a name created for Melee outright. It's retroactively used for 64(and still accurate to Endpoint, the respective Japanese name).
-Battlefield is the same, but Duel Zone was only a 64 name. This also didn't have a dub name in 64, and Battlefield was created for Melee, but is the name in US and JP since then.

So they're kind of weird, yeah.

Anyway, those two oddities aside, I think 60 overall sounds pretty good to me. It's a good high number, which accounts for many iconic locations, new locations, and general franchises to get a reasonable amount. How many did we have for Ultimate? I forget.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Anyway, those two oddities aside, I think 60 overall sounds pretty good to me. It's a good high number, which accounts for many iconic locations, new locations, and general franchises to get a reasonable amount. How many did we have for Ultimate? I forget.

115 overall after DLC, 19 new, 96 returning for Ultimate.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Anyway, those two oddities aside, I think 60 overall sounds pretty good to me. It's a good high number, which accounts for many iconic locations, new locations, and general franchises to get a reasonable amount. How many did we have for Ultimate? I forget.

Super Smash Bros. Ultimate had 103, and upgraded it to 115 through DLC.

EDIT: 'd.

 

[Lionfranky]

Counting the seven Echo Fighters, we technically have 89 playable characters. If we were to reach 100 fighters, ideally that should mean 8 more unique fighters and 3 more Echo Fighters.

I guess they can change and stretch the current numbering for sake of reaching 100 fighters milestone.

Ultimate had 19 newcomers. I don't see why Smash 6 can't do the same.

Imagine next Smash is titled "Smash 100"

 

[Ivander]

Some Dino Crisis fan community scammed the hell out of that. DC more popular than RE4? GTFO!

Yeah, it's not exactly fun when "sending a message" goes too far. But that said, considering how much a Dino Crisis remake has been begged for, especially after RE2 and RE3 Remake and it still hasn't happened despite being one of the best opportunities to do so, I don't blame their desperation. And we know Dino Crisis fans alone weren't responsible for "Reboot previous IPs" being the Number 1 complaint.

 

[Wonder Smash]

As you can see here, I also acknowledged the possibility of returning as DLC. The premise here isn't that a character becomes exiled from the series forever... it's just that they get out-prioritized by other characters for the base game. Which, by most people's standards, means they got cut. It's just a temporary cut, maybe.

We were not talking about him coming back as DLC later, though. The whole point was of him getting cut period. Him being possible DLC was never the point.

Poppy is reiterating what I've already said a few times now. I can only repeat it so many times myself, lol.

It must be nice to have somebody who doesn't accuse you of using somebody's death to push a character...

 

[Scrimblo Bimblo]

Sora is fighter # 82. If they aim to reach 100 fighters milestone(Of course, this is assuming they keep the entire roster), they would need to add 18 more fighters. Do you think this is ridiculous or worth shot?

It is a bit ridicolous Indeed, but imo it's more likely than people think. Smash sequels have always gone bigger than the previous game, and 100 characters feels like a legendary, easily marketable milestone, that just like Everyone is Here in Ultimate has its one and only chance of being realized right here and right now. On the other hand though, 18 newcomers really is a lot and they would have to be made on top of an absurdly huge roster getting updated.
But also, if they actually go Smash as a service I think they'll at least try to keep everyone again. Smash taking the long-living game route without your favorite character right after the game that featured everyone would indeed sting for a lot of fans imo.

It really depends on which direction they choose to take the next game.

-

If they were to cut both Lucas and Banjo I don't know who I'd main. I think I'd probably just stick to Ultimate. I love Ridley and Diddy too but I don't click with those two as much...
Maybe I'd just go back to Ness like I did in Smash 4's first months.

 

[Kirbeh]

Obviously, I'd like for them to retain as many characters as possible, but as time goes on, I find myself caring less and less about cuts overall tbh.

Ultimate was a game full of crazy milestones, and it was great to see, but it's also the only Smash game I've put down for extended periods of time.

I just couldn't get into WoL, it felt like a chore for the majority of its run time. Same goes for spirit battles as a whole really.

And I know I'm in the minority, but something about the flow of matches in Ultimate has always felt off to me. I still have fun of course, but to this day, I feel as though as if I haven't gotten quite used to it.

For as much content as Ultimate has, regular versus matches and Squad Strike are all I really touch. That'd honestly be enough for me too if the online was better and had more options but it's Nintendo so

Where was I going with this?

I'm more concerned with the modes, gameplay/feel and the online experience now compared to the roster.

I guess that's been my stance for a while really. I've always seen cuts as a normal inevitability and as far as newcomers are concerned, I'm open to most anyone. I've got dozens upon dozens of characters I'd like to see, but I expect few to none of them. And I'm almost always down to learn about series I'm unfamiliar with, so "literal who's" are exciting to me as opposed to an issue like they seem to be for a good chunk of people.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Imagine next Smash is titled "Smash 100"

Smasherful 101.

 

[superprincess]

I'm usually not one to defend the "sanctity" of Everyone is Here or whatever, I find it pretty corny that people are so attached to the idea of the full roster returning every time.

But we're so close to the 100 characters milestone (probably closer than ever) that they might just commit to the bit. I don't like to admit this because I'd much prefer the focus to be placed on other content or polishing up the gameplay because Ultimate's meta sucks but... it's a possibility. The marketing material is too good.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I now want, expect and demand a Smash Bros with 100 characters.

Y'all have out that thought in my head. Prepare to face the consequences.

 

[NintenRob]

Smash Bros with 100 characters would be difficult to do. Even if porting over characters, allowing for quicker development, you'd also need to enough newcomers to compensate any cut third party characters. Because Third Party characters are very likely to be cut down (or at least saved for DLC).

Dealing with that many different companies for the games launch would be an absolute nightmare, at least with DLC you can sorta spread it out.

 

[Delzethin]

Bit late on this, but I've always thought the reason Roy's moveset got an animation overhaul when he came back was because the Smash 4 devs worked off of his unused concept for Brawl. That game did go out of its way to turn other Melee clones into semi-clones...

 

[Gengar84]

Bit late on this, but I've always thought the reason Roy's moveset got an animation overhaul when he came back was because the Smash 4 devs worked off of his unused concept for Brawl. That game did go out of its way to turn other Melee clones into semi-clones...

Yeah, I think part of why he was changed was likely due to him being DLC in that game. It’s hard to justify spending as much money on a clone with fewer changes. Since they took the effort to make Roy stand out on his own, more people could justify spending the money on him. I’m not sure if people would have been willing to pay that price for Lucina for example.

 

[NintenRob]

How much was Roy actually changed though? Obviously he got his redesign and some necessary new animations, but I feel like compared to Falco and Dorf (The Melee clones who were in Brawl), Roy doesn't feel that different. Like I feel Young Link is fairly comparable