Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[Kirbeh]

the MS sprites look very Looney Tunes/Golden Age of Animation-inspired to me.

The sprites are a blend of both, but my primary point was that the characters have pretty normal designs otherwise. It's really a matter of whether Sakurai would choose to represent the characters as they actually are or as direct translations of the sprites similar to how he approached Mega Man.

In regard to the terminology of scrimblo, my issue is with the overall inconsistency of its use. You, personally, describe characters as such, but as said in my last point many would disagree either your categorization or definition because it's so ill-defined. The latter also being an issue of its use as a term to begin with. It was coined as an insult but adopted sporadically as an actual descriptor.

 

[HyperSomari64]

In regard to the terminology of scrimblo, my issue is with the overall inconsistency of its use. You, personally, describe characters as such, but as said in my last point many would disagree either your categorization or definition because it's so ill-defined. The latter also being an issue of its use as a term to begin with. It was coined as an insult but adopted sporadically as an actual descriptor.

That's why people should use terms like "Mascot Platformer" or "Cartoon Platformer" instead.

 

[Kirbeh]

That's why people should use terms like "Mascot Platformer" or "Cartoon Platformer" instead.

Mascot platformer is the term I like best. Simple and descriptive.

Cartoon platformer I've actually not ever seen/heard be used, surprisingly. Though I'm personally not fond of that one either. I don't think there should be as much emphasis placed on a perceived art style. Cartoon can be used fairly broadly which is fine, but when half of mascot platformers are created by Japan it seems like it may be too western focused. And again, the art of animation is so varied, and many styles will also blend influences from both east and west, I think it fails to be fully accurate.

"Mascot" serves much better as it encompasses characters that can be human, animal or objects without necessarily being restrictive on art style.

And going back to scrimblo, I don't think that people shouldn't use it. I just think it needs to be properly defined first. If people want to adopt the term to be interchangeable with "a mascot platformer character" I think that's fine. It's just that whenever I do see the term, people often add more specifics to it, and it ends up muddying the meaning from person to person.

 

[Gengar84]

I never know how to define a particular style of art direction I’ve always liked. Basically, whatever WarCraft, StarCraft, League of Legends, Legacy of Kain and Darksiders is. They’re not really realistic but not cartoony or anime either. Not sure if there’s really a name for that style. Then there’s classic 90’s Battletoads that maybe leans towards cartoony but that one’s hard to classify too since it’s going for a whole different look compared to something like Banjo or Conker. The closest analogue I can come up with for all of these is something like “comic book style”.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Basically, whatever WarCraft, StarCraft, League of Legends, Legacy of Kain and Darksiders is. They’re not really realistic but not cartoony or anime either. Not sure if there’s really a name for that style.

It's hard to say for StarCraft 2 because its visual style is different for close-up and far away graphics.

Marine (StarCraft II)

The marine is the basic infantry unit of terran forces. The marine's ballistic alloy combat shield grants more HP, giving them more survivability against high-damage units. As long as the marine can survive a hit, a medivac dropship can quickly heal it.[1] Marines excel against immortals, given...

starcraft.fandom.com

Like, here you can see the Marine that'd actually be on the battlefield looks like a toy, but the unit portrait not so much.

 

[ninjahmos]

I think they should replace Green Hill Zone and add in one or two other zones from the Genesis era, like Casino Night Zone and Flying Battery Zone.

 

[Gengar84]

It's hard to say for StarCraft 2 because its visual style is different for close-up and far away graphics.

Marine (StarCraft II)

The marine is the basic infantry unit of terran forces. The marine's ballistic alloy combat shield grants more HP, giving them more survivability against high-damage units. As long as the marine can survive a hit, a medivac dropship can quickly heal it.[1] Marines excel against immortals, given...

starcraft.fandom.com

Like, here you can see the Marine that'd actually be on the battlefield looks like a toy, but the unit portrait not so much.

Yeah, I suppose I was referring to WarCraft 3 and the first StarCraft. The newer games tend to lean more towards a realistic art direction.

 

[Geno Boost]

What if we got a racing rep for Smash (besides Captain Falcon)? (E.G. Excitebiker, Mach Rider, Reiko Nagase (Ridge Racer), Hornet (Daytona USA))

man playable Hornet in smash is something that's begging to happen its so damn wild i want to see how would sakurai would deal with something like that

 

[cashregister9]

Racing character uhhhh

Gold Dry Bowser

Wreck-It Ralph

Team Fortress

 

[Geno Boost]

speaking of racing rep Toadette is one of them since she started in MKDD and became canon in recent years to the mario series and i can see a case for her being playable on her own if they give her Peachette transformaion as a gimmick but probably wont happen before Toad gets in first or being made as an alt for him

 

[DarthEnderX]

I think they should replace Green Hill Zone and add in one or two other zones from the Genesis era, like Casino Night Zone and Flying Battery Zone.

I think they should keep Green Hill Zone and add in one or two other zones from the Genesis era, like Casino Night Zone and Flying Battery Zone.

but probably wont happen before Toad gets in first or being made as an alt for him

 

[Will]

And Toadette too, I guess.

It seems Nintendo and I both forgot about Double Dash.

 

[Stratos]

If anyone wants a character in a future Super Smash Bros game that looks like a 1950's cartoon it's well known that Cuphead is the character we're looking for.

 

[HyperSomari64]

If anyone wants a character in a future Super Smash Bros game that looks like a 1950's cartoon it's well known that Cuphead is the character we're looking for.

You tried to meant 1930's.
1950's would be stuff like UPA and Hanna-Barbera.

(Art made by: MightyFilm)

 

[Sucumbio]

I never know how to define a particular style of art direction I’ve always liked. Basically, whatever WarCraft, StarCraft, League of Legends, Legacy of Kain and Darksiders is. They’re not really realistic but not cartoony or anime either. Not sure if there’s really a name for that style. Then there’s classic 90’s Battletoads that maybe leans towards cartoony but that one’s hard to classify too since it’s going for a whole different look compared to something like Banjo or Conker. The closest analogue I can come up with for all of these is something like “comic book style”.

"Stylized" seems to be the only word I can find, Warcraft is Stylized Fantasy, Daniel Cabuco is a Stylized designer of realism meeting fantasy, etc. I haven't played most of those games but another Stylized game I usually think of is re4 with its eerily "real" quality to.

 

[BritishGuy54]

I think they should replace Green Hill Zone and add in one or two other zones from the Genesis era, like Casino Night Zone and Flying Battery Zone.

I think we should have one classic stage, and one or two from the more modern side of the series.

Likely a Frontiers stage gets in next time. Then we may as well hope for a stage in between the two in terms of time, so probably an Adventure stage, Colours stage, or even bringing back Green Hill 2.

 

[Stratos]

You tried to meant 1930's.
1950's would be stuff like UPA and Hanna-Barbera.

(Art made by: MightyFilm)

Yes, you're right.

 

[Gorgonzales]

I think they should replace Green Hill Zone and add in one or two other zones from the Genesis era, like Casino Night Zone and Flying Battery Zone.

Agreed. Green Hill is iconic but I'mma be honest, I would not miss it one bit if it ever had to sit out. Studiopolis Zone would be a great stage too.

 

[Kirbeh]

I would like Green Hill more if the layout wasn't a destructible depression. If Brawl's Green Hill got cut and replaced with a Green Hill again but with a completely redesigned layout, I'd be okay with that. I do think the location is iconic/important enough to warrant inclusion, so I'd rather have it than not. That said, I would be in favor of dropping Windy Hill in favor of another stage(s) from more varied/iconic locations. Even if they chose another first level/basic location there's loads better to work with like Seaside Hill if they want something similar or City Escape if they want something entirely new.

 

[SpecterFlower]

I think we should have one classic stage, and one or two from the more modern side of the series.

Likely a Frontiers stage gets in next time. Then we may as well hope for a stage in between the two in terms of time, so probably an Adventure stage, Colours stage, or even bringing back Green Hill 2.

I don't think sonic should be a priority amongst 3rd parties, maybe another stage than green zone for sure, and a moveset rework, but sonic is represented well enough by sonic alone imo.

1 character, 2 stages work fine

the character needs a rework and the stages are garbage, you could gut both and the game would be better for it, so actually nvm i do agree,

the quantity of sonics rep is fine the quality is just not there

 

[Stratos]

I have a thought, maybe we also need characters that are from sports video games even though I don't like sports, i.e. football, baseball, basketball, skiing, snowboar, volleyball, tennis, etc. Although we already have Little Mac from the Punch-Out series, we might need others like Power Pro-kun from the Power Pros, Mark Evans from the Inazuma Eleven series, Ryota Hayami from the Wave Race series, and Kensuke Kimachi and Ricky Winterborn from the 1080° series.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I don't think Green Hill Zone should ever be cut.

Goodness I remember the hype that happened when that stage was revealed. It was THE expected and wanted stage back then.

We can get new things without having to throw out the old.

 

[SpecterFlower]

I have a thought, maybe we also need characters that are from sports video games even though I don't like sports, i.e. football, baseball, basketball, skiing, snowboar, volleyball, tennis, etc. Although we already have Little Mac from the Punch-Out series, we might need others like Power Pro-kun from the Power Pros, Mark Evans from the Inazuma Eleven series, Ryota Hayami from the Wave Race series, and Kensuke Kimachi and Ricky Winterborn from the 1080° series.

the issue is.

the big ones people know are licensed and based off real people.

and the ones you listed are niche dead or exclusive to one country, and not in a DQ way where its bigger in japan, it doesn't even exist in the west except for 1 game thats 2 bucks on the eshop.

unironically waluigi is the best sports rep

I don't think Green Hill Zone should ever be cut.

Goodness I remember the hype that happened when that stage was revealed. It was THE expected and wanted stage back then.

We can get new things without having to throw out the old.

i wouldnt say cut it, just fix it. its awful

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

I'm not going to say whether or not Sonic absolutely needs a newcomer, but when the franchise is in the Top 15 highest grossing video game franchises (10th overall that's 3rd party), has been featured in Smash since over a decade ago in Brawl, and has no shortage of potential options for a secondary character, during a point in time they are starting to show up in Smash....there is a noticeable void.

 

[SpecterFlower]

I'm not going to say whether or not Sonic absolutely needs a newcomer, but when the franchise is in the Top 15 highest grossing video game franchises (10th overall that's 3rd party), has been featured in Smash since over a decade ago in Brawl, and has no shortage of potential options for a secondary character, during a point in time they are starting to show up in Smash....there is a noticeable void.

that was way in the past though. other than movies the series is just coasting along now.


the series is really fine as is with whats there, it all needs a big change. eggman could be a good rep though, but its not an urgent void thats absolutely missing, just a future possibility that would be cool.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

I have a thought, maybe we also need characters that are from sports video games even though I don't like sports, i.e. football, baseball, basketball, skiing, snowboar, volleyball, tennis, etc. Although we already have Little Mac from the Punch-Out series, we might need others like Power Pro-kun from the Power Pros, Mark Evans from the Inazuma Eleven series, Ryota Hayami from the Wave Race series, and Kensuke Kimachi and Ricky Winterborn from the 1080° series.

I'd like to have at least one nod to Double Dribble by Konami, though fingers crossed we get the songs from the NES's soundtrack and not the arcade's given what it's in the latter...

 

[SpecterFlower]

I'm not going to say whether or not Sonic absolutely needs a newcomer, but when the franchise is in the Top 15 highest grossing video game franchises (10th overall that's 3rd party), has been featured in Smash since over a decade ago in Brawl, and has no shortage of potential options for a secondary character, during a point in time they are starting to show up in Smash....there is a noticeable void.

what are the other 10 btw.

Actually a COD character would be a great inclusion, they could add that ghost guy.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

that was way in the past though. other than movies the series is just coasting along now.


the series is really fine as is with whats there, it all needs a big change. eggman could be a good rep though, but its not an urgent void thats absolutely missing, just a future possibility that would be cool.

Counterpoint: You're just incorrect.

 

[SpecterFlower]

Counterpoint: You're just incorrect.

why?

i cant be incorrect when the statements are fact,

sonic games don't sell like they used to, sonics biggest game in decades only managed around 3.5mil as of may 2023 sonics around the same level as pikmin
its a series with a strong legacy that could use a newcomer and definitely needs some upgrade cause its representation is awful
but its not like a void thats unfilled, eggman would be cool (and a much better inclusion to rep the series than shadow imo)

last thing sonic needs is an echo fighter, ball 2, im honestly surprised they never touched up sonic after he was very clearly rushed for brawl.

 

[Kirbeh]

I'd like to have at least one nod to Double Dribble by Konami, though fingers crossed we get the songs from the NES's soundtrack and not the arcade's given what it's in the latter...

Ew...

Outside of the menu theme, does the game even have enough actual music? Most tracks are just very short jingles, aren't they? You could do an extension of the menu theme and a medley, but that's about it.

If we're doing music from sports games though, here's the obligatory Data East mention.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

what are the other 10 btw.

Actually a COD character would be a great inclusion, they could add that ghost guy.

-Tetris, which is horribly overdue for a stage.

-Call of Duty, which is one of the franchises that one could say "doesn't fit" Smash and actually have a point.

-Grand Theft Auto, which is another franchise that one could say "doesn't fit" Smash and actually have a point.

-FIFA, which you really CAN'T feature for obvious reasons.

-Minecraft, which already covers perfectly.

-Lego, which is a licensed IP. And no, we're not going to have Android 21 tier discussion over characters that made their first appearance in a Lego video game.

-The Sims, which I will not comment on since I'm unsure on what can be done and don't want to make definite claims on possibilty.

-Assassin's Creed, which could theoretically get someone like Ezio if the series being Z-rated in Japan isn't a barrier for representation past a costume for Miis (not going to make a definitive claim it is a barrier, but it is something to consider until a newcomer proves otherwise).


-Final Fantasy, which and . And fittingly was the first to get a non-Echo secondary character.

-Sonic the Hedgehog.

 

[SpecterFlower]

-Tetris, which is horribly overdue for a stage.

-Call of Duty, which is one of the franchises that one could say "doesn't fit" Smash and actually have a point.

-Grand Theft Auto, which is another franchise that one could say "doesn't fit" Smash and actually have a point.

-FIFA, which you really CAN'T feature for obvious reasons.

-Minecraft, which already covers perfectly.

-Lego, which is a licensed IP. And no, we're not going to have Android 21 tier discussion over characters that made their first appearance in a Lego video game.

-The Sims, which I will not comment on since I'm unsure on what can be done and don't want to make definite claims on possibilty.

-Assassin's Creed, which could theoretically get someone like Ezio if the series being Z-rated in Japan isn't a barrier for representation past a costume for Miis (not going to make a definitive claim it is a barrier, but it is something to consider until a newcomer proves otherwise).


-Final Fantasy, which and . And fittingly was the first to get a non-Echo secondary character.

-Sonic the Hedgehog.

GTA would make a perfect smash rep.


or does bayonetta not fit cause shes way worse.

 

[RealLuigisWearPink]

I remember once making “NES Sports Guy” a moveset and basing it off early NES games like Volleyball, Baseball, Soccer, Tennis, Ice Hockey,
and Golf. It’s not a concept I support but I found it fun lol

Spoiler: Sports game ost

Midway’s sports games are iconic and should be represented, imo. I know they were multiplat but I associate them with Nintendo mostly during N64 era

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Remade opening cutscene revealed!

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

GTA would make a perfect smash rep.


or does bayonetta not fit cause shes way worse.

Bayonetta? Worse than GTA?

 

[Stratos]

the issue is.

the big ones people know are licensed and based off real people.

and the ones you listed are niche dead or exclusive to one country, and not in a DQ way where its bigger in japan, it doesn't even exist in the west except for 1 game thats 2 bucks on the eshop.

unironically waluigi is the best sports rep

You mean all these characters exist as real people? As far as I know they existed as trophies and spirits in the Super Smash Bros series and Power Pro-kun from the Power Pros existed as a fighter in the DreamMix TV World Fighters video game. However, I totally agree that Waluigi is the appropriate character.

 

[Kirbeh]

You mean all these characters exist as real people? As far as I know they existed as trophies and spirits in the Super Smash Bros series and Power Pro-kun from the Power Pros existed as a fighter in the DreamMix TV World Fighters video game. However, I totally agree that Waluigi is the appropriate character.

What they mean is that all the really big sports titles on a worldwide scale are licensed games like FIFA and NBA2K. All those games use real teams and players.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

Yeah, now that I've mentioned it just above....

....why the **** don't we have a Tetris stage by now?

 

[BritishGuy54]

Yeah, now that I've mentioned it just above....

....why the **** don't we have a Tetris stage by now?

Tetris is a third party. Just putting that out there.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

Tetris is a third party. Just putting that out there.

And we've had Tetris songs since Brawl with copyright to The Tetris Company. Your point?