News: Garchomp is banned from OU as of today

[MK26]

@blm: of course not

 

[UltiMario]

Uh? What kind of explanation for why we shouldn't ban abilities is that? Almost every pokemon has more than one ability. Banning the entire pokemon BECAUSE IT CAN USE ONE CERTAIN ABILITY just deprives players of the option to use said pokemon.

For example, I used Ninetales in 4th gen, before it had Drought. What if they decided Drought was overpowered, and therefore banned Ninetales? That would be pretty unfair to me, who likes to use Flash Fire Ninetales, wouldn't it? Same with Politoed.

And what if they decided Sand Stream was overpowered? Would they ban Tyranitar, Hippowdon, and Hippototas, despite the fact that they're perfectly usable with their other abilities? :/

And Speed Boost Blaziken makes me sad, but I don't think it's bannable.

Part of the issue is that most DW abilities aren't released and many Pokemon like TTar can't get them, forcing them to be banned.

For other ****, Smogon has set a standard from the past 4 Gens is that if a single Pokemon becomes broken because of an ability, you ban the Pokemon. 5th Gen set the standard that if a bunch of Pokemon make an ability broken, you ban the ability.

In other news PO sucks and I think PokeBattleCenter is like early B/W and everything else is negligible so who cares about other places banlist credentials!


@0RLy:

Have you seen rain teams.

8 turns of rain is ****ing nothing compared to what Rotom-Wl, Thundurus, and Toxicroak can do in unlimited rain. If you can wear it down with like 3 layers of spikes or something, IIRC Rotom-W can 2HKO Ferrothorn with Hydro Pump i Rain. It's a lot harder to make sure Rain is up on those crucial 2 turns with Damp Rock than it is with Drizzle, where Ferrothorn can just take its little time against basically every swift swimmer. OHKOs Omastar and Kabutops, like 2HKOs Ludicolo or something, can TWave your SSers.... and then you get only 7 turns to play around it. Drizzle Rain >>>>>> Damp Rock Rain.

Also why are we talking about ST Chandy is doesn't even exist. People, stop playing Dream World. It's not the standard anymore. Wifi, people, Wifi.

 

[0RLY]

Ah, I'm just so used to seeing offensive rain that I never considered what defensive Rain can do. I have doubts on washtom's 2hko on Ferrothorn, but it shouldn't matter if Ferrothorn ohkos washtom with Power Whip. I'm sure Kabutops could bring the butthurt to Ferrothorn with Low Kick or Superpower. In any case, Magnezone.

 

[Wave⁂]

So, how many of you guys here *****ing in this thread actually ladder?

 

[Deleted member]

Would you prefer playing on PO, where the ability Drizzle is banned?

Note that banning an ability and causing it to become crippled in OU still makes it a possibly strong option in UU, while banning the Pokémon altogether forces it into Ubers.

frankly gen 5 looks quite well balanced when DW abilities are eliminated. I mean, I'm only saying this from what I've seen on paper. my only real complaint for gen 5 if you take away DW **** is that they killed rotom's typing.

edit: no speed boost blaziken is stupid as ****. you take that **** back.

 

[Wave⁂]

I rather like what GF did to Rotom. I mean, it's not like there's a lack of Ghost-types. We've still got a Pokemon that's a great counter to Scizor and Metagross in Jellicent.

Oh wait, I forgot about Levitating Flying-type, I take that back

 

[Zankoku]

Also why are we talking about ST Chandy is doesn't even exist. People, stop playing Dream World. It's not the standard anymore. Wifi, people, Wifi.

I haven't gotten a chance to play with anyone else who owns a copy of the game, but I heard complaints while talking with people at a random Smash tournaments about, on Wifi, playing against Shadow Tag Chandelure and a Victini that used V-Create, among other things. As a result I'm a bit wary of how many people play legitimate teams.

 

[Wave⁂]

Wonder Guard Spiritomb is the worst, I know what you mean

 

[Night-san]

lets just stop baning things all togethee bcus we all no that evrything can be beeten in the rite situaton, u can even beet arceus if u play rite BAWWWW

 

[Chill]

What is rain without swift swim?

Pretty much... nothing.

I'm sure we'd all rather Damp Rock+Rain Dance to use Swift Swim over the former.

EDIT:
Speed Boost Blaziken does really stupid things. It can sweep AND Baton Pass. Very few Pokemon can do both as successfully as Blaziken. Those who can can't do it with as much ease. Sub up in front of Ferrothorn and go to town. It's also not that hard to anticipate your opponent predicting Protect and subbing against it. He starts Baton Pass chains all by himself, like Ninjask, but can also end one. Even without Baton Pass, people will play against with that move always on mind. Have you seen how much hurt +2 STAB HJK or Blitz does? Enough for him to be banned before Garchomp.

Baton pass is an egg move so this isn't even possible.

 

[Zankoku]

Why isn't it possible? Breed a female Speed Boost Blaziken with a male Ambipom that learned Baton Pass doesn't work?

 

[UltiMario]

1. V-Create Victini exists and it can even have Fusion Bolt now.
2. All DW Torchic are male.

 

[Asdioh]

edit: no speed boost blaziken is stupid as ****. you take that **** back.

Priority (mach punch, aqua jet, extremespeed) and blaziken walls (gliscor, jellicent, etc.) don't have too much trouble :/

I would never use SB Blaziken, simply because I don't particularly like Blaziken, but I don't have too much trouble against it.


edit: since this is the garchomp thread... Garchomp sux, play melee

 

[UltiMario]

edit: since this is the garchomp thread... Garchomp sux, play melee

Advice to live by.

 

[mood4food77]

it was still dumb as hell

comes in on something like blissey or ferrothorn, SD up, and now you got a blaziken at +2 attack and +1 speed, slap on protect and now he's sitting pretty at +2 for both, he already has enough power to 2HKO almost everything normally, now you add in ******** amounts of added speed and watch as he sweeps your team

the fact you need both priority and 2 walls to bring him down showed that giving speed boost to him was way too overpowering

so let's use SB sharpedo now

i see nothing wrong with garchomp, i find excadrill more annoying to deal with, seriously, if garchomp didn't have sand viel, he'd be comepletely fine

 

[Wave⁂]

SubSD Garchomp is dumb, discuss

 

[fkacyan]

It's the same either way.

lrn2orderofoperations scrub

Of course it is, but it's still infuriating.

 

[UltiMario]

It was only dumb if it actually worked. Also Skarmory.

 

[Asdioh]

comes in on something like blissey or ferrothorn,

Maybe I don't have a problem because I don't use NUBBY POGEYMANZ like those.

And you don't need two walls to beat Blaziken. One wall, or one powerful priority user is enough, and you should probably have both anyway.

Seriously, Jellicent is annoying as hell, and Blaziken probably can't touch it. Even if it does hit Jelli with like, Stone Edge or something, it probably has Cursed Body and Recover and will-o-wisp wait Blaziken is fire type

I dunno, I'd have to see some statistics to decide if Blaziken should be banned or not. I know from experience that he's absurd with Speed Boost and Baton Pass, but he can't legally have both of those so yeah.

Speaking of Baton Pass, if only Zebstrika could learn it, ohhh man that would be good. It has three abilities, which could allow it to switch in on an electric or grass move and gain either +1 attack, speed, or special attack. It has an awesome 116 base speed, and can learn Flame Charge or Agility for more speed boosts.

 

[ss118]

On the car ride to CEO, me and drugged fox played gen IV OU. No platinum or HG/SS with Garchomp and Salamence allowed.

It was the most fun I've had playing pokemon in forever.

 

[Wave⁂]

Speaking of Baton Pass, if only Zebstrika could learn it, ohhh man that would be good. It has three abilities, which could allow it to switch in on an electric or grass move and gain either +1 attack, speed, or special attack. It has an awesome 116 base speed, and can learn Flame Charge or Agility for more speed boosts.

I know you can't Baton Pass the effects of Unburden. Can you Pass Sap Sipper and Motor Drive?

 

[Asdioh]

I know you can't Baton Pass the effects of Unburden. Can you Pass Sap Sipper and Motor Drive?

Yes, because those abilities show "+1" under their respective stats. Unburden does not show
"+2" (which it would be) it just doubles speed.

Unburden Hitmonlee, behind any of Light Screen/Reflect/Safeguard, is beastly, by the way. Mine has Bulk Up/Stone Edge (best coverage move I could find)/Mach Punch/Hi Jump Kick with a Fight Gem. I usually Bulk Up first turn if possible, and again, preferably behind Screens, and Safeguard is in case of Scald/Thunder Wave/Will-o-Wisp users. A +1 HJK vs Conkeldurr, or a +1 HJK + fight gem vs a bulk-upped Conkeldurr, will 1hko.

tl;dr my Hitmonlee sweeps teams if I can get him to use a single bulk up and unburdened, and they don't have stuff like Gliscor or Jellicent left on their team.

Most people would use Fake Out + close combat, but the defense loss from close combat is enough to make hitmonlee get 1hkoed by priority, and people can predict Fake Outs with Ghosts or Protect (which is why I love using Bulk Up instead)

 

[Gamegenie222]

Man sometimes I wounder if Smogon uses thier brains when they make banning decisions like this or if they just whine alot about certain pokes Idk. If they ban Thunderous at the next suspect testing process, I will smack somebody with a book

 

[Enzo]

Thundurus is a gay piece of ****.

If they've banned chomp, ban him too.
i cant think of anything on the top of my head that can surely wall it and retaliate aside from rotom-w

 

[Wave⁂]

Judging by the huge response to my first post in this thread, I'll say that no one who has posted in this thread has anything remotely resembling laddering experience but Ulti.

 

[UltiMario]

Asdioh, like actually play WiFi instead of DW lol.

 

[Asdioh]

Man sometimes I wounder if Smogon uses thier brains when they make banning decisions like this or if they just whine alot about certain pokes Idk. If they ban Thunderous at the next suspect testing process, I will smack somebody with a book

I usually see Thundurus used as a lead more than anything else. My lead Golem usually KOes them if Rock Blast hits three times (Rock Blast is amazing for trolling Focus Sash leads)
If they don't use Thundurus as a lead... then it's no problem if I have Safeguard and/or Light screen up, and even if not it's not that hard. It's only difficult if it's in Rain, and since Drizzle is currently banned, that doesn't happen
100% accurate STAB Thunders and Hurricanes with Prankster for Twave and stuff is obscene.

Judging by the huge response to my first post in this thread, I'll say that no one who has posted in this thread has anything remotely resembling laddering experience but Ulti.

(22:14:00) +RankingBot: Your rank in Dream World is 1007/48272!

holy crap how did I get to 1000, I thought it was like 8000+
I have 1212 points, last I checked it was more like 1111 \(o_o)/

Asdioh, like actually play WiFi instead of DW lol.

BUT HITMONLEE WITH UNBURDEN

 

[Wave⁂]

It's a shame the only Pokemon who gets Hurricane / Thunder / any Water-type move with over 60 base power is Dragonite.

 

[Asdioh]

*tries to play Wifi*

(22:28:46) The following pokemons of your team are invalid (ban, level, moveset, item...) in Wifi, hence you can't choose that tier: Golem.

BUT WHY? He has Sturdy, which is not his DW ability... I tried deleting various moves to see if they were the problem, it still didn't work even when his only move was EQ or rock blast... I got rid of Custap Berry in case that was the problem and gave Salac... what's wrong? ._. is it my IVs or Nature or something?

Also, doesn't Wifi have that AWFUL team preview? Doesn't that kind of kill my element of surprise? :| :| :|

edit: apparently Salac and Custap were problems.
What to use instead... should I get rid of my 0def/0hp/0spD IVs, and use Leftovers or something?
Or isn't wifi the tier where you can't use more than one of the same item? ಠ_ಠ



(22:35:13) +RankingBot: You are not ranked in Wifi yet!


I'm scared. What will be different? :x

 

[Wave⁂]

Wifi definitely doesn't have Item Clause. You could try Leftovers, Lum Berry if it's allowed (doubt it), or some gimmick item like Red Card or Balloon.

 

[Asdioh]

Red Card

Hm.

Anyway, after figuring out that Custap/Salac were the problem, I tried to play and it was like "trolol you can't use hitmonlee or zebra with DW abilities"

and I was like :| nothx

Because the entire point of Zebra is Sap Sipper, and a large part of hitmonlee is Unburden.

Though... Reckless Hitmonlee with HJK behind screens and with Bulk Up would be MONSTROUS.

Still, I need Sap Sipper Zebra to counter Brelooms and Serperiors and Ferrothorns and.... ffff
SAP SIPPER AZUMARILL GOGO

*realizes his team doesn't have any water type moves*
:O


edit after making a team with sawsbuck and winning my first game by beating a freaking eeveelution team: (23:19:45) +RankingBot: Your rank in Wifi is 11414/62417!

WOO GO ME

edit: and then i managed to beat a guy because I predict Heatran using Protect vs my scizor with swords dance :3 he used protect because he had leftovers, and i could have won if i bullet punched but if i guessed wrong i'd lose. and yeah, scizor with occa berry behind light screen = survive flamethrower woo

editmore: hitmonlee is pretty bad without Unburden. Maybe a Choice Scarf would be good... :\

team preview is stupppppiiiiiid btw

and then I discovered that Leech Seed vs a Grass type with Sap Sipper = no sap sipper boost JFAJGDFIJGSFG


and then i was destroying a guy, then he DOUBLE CRITS which renders my light screen useless, and loses me the game.

 

[M.K]

Moved to Battle Tower.
Stay on Topic, guys.

 

[CT Chia]

comes in on something like blissey or ferrothorn, SD up, and now you got a blaziken at +2 attack and +1 speed, slap on protect and now he's sitting pretty at +2 for both, he already has enough power to 2HKO almost everything normally, now you add in ******** amounts of added speed and watch as he sweeps your team

You know what would be hilarious? If they read the SD and instead thunder waved you. GG Blaziken

 

[Wave⁂]

...Blaziken would still be faster than Ferrothorn. And by the time you are able to switch to a good counter and hit it with a move, Speed Boost will have given him 4-5 speed increases.

 

[mood4food77]

blaziken switches into ferrothorn, +1 speed
blaziken SDs, ferrothorn TWs, +2 speed, +2 attack
ferrothorn switches, blaziken attacks, +3 speed, +2 attack
blaziken uses protect, +4 speed, +2 attack

at this point, blaziken is 3/4s as fast as he would be if he wasn't paralyzed which, since you always max out EVs on him for speed, 213 (+nature), 194 (neutral), which is still faster than almost every wall out there (gliscor is the only noteworthy wall i know is definitely faster), and at +2, he'll definitely 2HKO anything he wants

 

[UltiMario]

Asdioh, in a few days you could hit me up on Skype or something and I could help you build a good and creative WiFi team. A lot of stuff like Serperior that's good in DW sucks on wifi. Might be good to get familiar and stuff.

 

[Enzo]

It's a shame the only Pokemon who gets Hurricane / Thunder / any Water-type move with over 60 base power is Dragonite.

(22:59:23) @HAL9000: Your rank in BW OU is 460/5049.
Haters gonna hate

 

[Bing]

Dragon's are supposed to be above average... thats why their difficult to capture when you play your way threw the game, and too make things better, they're generally pretty difficult to train to their final evolutionary form

 

[UltiMario]

Tell that to Druddigon and Altaria.

 

[mood4food77]

druddigon, flygon, and altaria really aren't that good

the new team I made really wishes garchomp wasn't banned, he could cover everything missing from my team and then really make sure nothing can switch in