Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Koopaul]

It never has disqualified him, but his origins are from reality itself.

But you said he's not a video game character. Which is how this whole conversations got started. I'm confused.

Now you're making this whole conversation an essay on ROB's personality.

I never said anything about personality I... Oh, your trolling me. Well played.

 

[Dark Bagel]

w a c k

Anyways, back on the topic of DLC, I just did a bit of research into what's popular in Japan, and did an educated guess on the last two DLC.
Assuming this next DLC follows a West/East dynamic as well as the "cute/cool" rule, these are my guesses.

Spoiler: Actual Smash DLC talk

One proposal is an Undertale rep and a Resident Evil rep. Horror and whatever genre Undertale is aren't repped in Smash (well, RPGs are, but Undertale plays nothing like any RPG I've seen), there's new releases for both on the horizon (those new RE remakes shown at E3, Deltarune Chapters 2+, etc), both are popular in Japan/States, yadda ya. The only things I can really think that take away from this are that neither would be exceptionally favored in the West (unless RE has a much larger following than I've perceived), and UT hate is almost as common as love for the game. Both'd be pretty neat though

The other one I propose would be a combination of Phoenix Wright and Doomguy. This is much more polarizing than the previous ones, but with PW practically being a Nintendo exclusive and Doom not only having every game (except three, but aren't they doing something w that?) on a Nintendo console but also being personally praised by Sakuri as the father of modern shooters, I think they've both got a fair shot. Detractions are in the ultra-violence of Doom (which can be toned down, but there'll be complaints apparently), and how leakbaity either are (but I guess that can apply to my other combo as well).

I am fully aware that names like Doom and Resident Evil are tossed around here like a baseball, but that's not a baseless assumption that they're likely- they are popular, and popularity gets characters in (Inkling, Hero).

If these were the DLC, how would y'all react?

Both pairings would be pretty hype, although I more personally prefer the latter paring involving Doomguy and Pheonix. But although I think a Capcom rep is almost a guarantee for this fighter pass, for the case of Doomguy, I'd rather have him co-star alongside another familar Capcom IP...

So picture this: a new smash trailer is showcased. Pit is in a space station fighting off against hordes of demons until they eventually overwhelm him. Cue Doomguy coming in to save him.

Doom Slayer rips and tears!

Cut to gameplay, then back to the CG trailer where both Doomguy and Pit are having trouble against a boss demon, and it seems like they're done for. Until a new figure swoops in...

Dante starts the party!

Then cut to gameplay, and end trailer. Both characters are revealed within the same trailer as the final 2 fighters, with said trailer being named "Demon Hunters".

 

[ROBnWatch]

Spoiler: Actual Smash DLC talk

One proposal is an Undertale rep and a Resident Evil rep. Horror and whatever genre Undertale is aren't repped in Smash (well, RPGs are, but Undertale plays nothing like any RPG I've seen), there's new releases for both on the horizon (those new RE remakes shown at E3, Deltarune Chapters 2+, etc), both are popular in Japan/States, yadda ya. The only things I can really think that take away from this are that neither would be exceptionally favored in the West (unless RE has a much larger following than I've perceived), and UT hate is almost as common as love for the game. Both'd be pretty neat though

The other one I propose would be a combination of Phoenix Wright and Doomguy. This is much more polarizing than the previous ones, but with PW practically being a Nintendo exclusive and Doom not only having every game (except three, but aren't they doing something w that?) on a Nintendo console but also being personally praised by Sakuri as the father of modern shooters, I think they've both got a fair shot. Detractions are in the ultra-violence of Doom (which can be toned down, but there'll be complaints apparently), and how leakbaity either are (but I guess that can apply to my other combo as well).

I am fully aware that names like Doom and Resident Evil are tossed around here like a baseball, but that's not a baseless assumption that they're likely- they are popular, and popularity gets characters in (Inkling, Hero).

If these were the DLC, how would y'all react?

Reactions would be:

Undertale: NO (Would produce a negative reaction from me)
RE: I mean...I guess so? (This would probably bring out the least of any reaction, positive or negative, from me)
Phoenix Wright: Interesting, but would rather have someone else. (Wouldn’t be negative, but certainly not overly enthusiastic)
Doom Guy/Slayer: Understandable. Still would’ve preferred someone else. But understandable. (Of the 4 choices, probably the one I’d be most “hype” for, though not nearly as hype for me personally as some characters we got from Smash 4-present time Ultimate)

As some of you may know (and see) from my reactions...I’m not too big on more third parties joining. A little more familiarity would be nice. But with the Fighters Pass going the way it is, it’s with good reason most people are speculating more of them.

 

[Deleted member]

Isn't Quote and Cave Story owned by Nicalis nowadays? I remember reading about it as the situation was kind of ****ty.

 

[Megadoomer]

Both pairings would be pretty hype, although I more personally prefer the latter paring involving Doomguy and Pheonix. But although I think a Capcom rep is almost a guarantee for this fighter pass, for the case of Doomguy, I'd rather have him co-star alongside another familar Capcom IP...

So picture this: a new smash trailer is showcased. Pit is in a space station fighting off against hordes of demons until they eventually overwhelm him. Cue Doomguy coming in to save him.

Doom Slayer rips and tears!

Cut to gameplay, then back to the CG trailer where both Doomguy and Pit are having trouble against a boss demon, and it seems like they're done for. Until a new figure swoops in...

Dante starts the party!

Then cut to gameplay, and end trailer. Both characters are revealed within the same trailer as the final 2 fighters, with said trailer being named "Demon Hunters".

I'd love it if those were the last two DLC characters, though while it would be awesome, I'm not sure if they'd share a trailer. The only time I can think of where a third party character shared a trailer with another character (or when any character shared a trailer with another character, for that matter) was when they were echo fighters, like Ken or Richter. (the only other times that I can think of where characters shared reveal trailers were Lucina and technically Dark Pit)

If they were revealed in the same Direct, I could see one trailer being at the start and one at the end, with those trailers being tied together like K. Rool's and Banjo's. (or they could do that even if those characters were revealed at separate times)

 

[Dark Bagel]

As some of you may know (and see) from my reactions...I’m not too big on more third parties joining. A little more familiarity would be nice. But with the Fighters Pass going the way it is, it’s with good reason most people are speculating more of them.

In that case, I have a question. Out of curiosity, do you believe we'll be getting a second fighter pass based primarily off Nintendo characters at some point in the future (such as an echo fighter pass)? And if so, what are at least three characters you want and/or predict will be included?

 

[ROBnWatch]

In that case, I have a question. Out of curiosity, do you believe we'll be getting a second fighter pass based primarily off Nintendo characters at some point in the future (such as an echo fighter pass)? And if so, what are at least three characters you want and/or predict will be included?

I don’t think we’ll get one, but if the last 2 in the Fighters Pass don’t include a first party I would very much like a second, Nintendo themed pass. As for character ideas, I have 3 along with an Echo. First, I’d like Porky, in part because I’m an EB fan and in part because he’s not represented in Ultimate yet. Some other first parties could include Dixie Kong and Bandana Dee, two first parties that have been speculated since Smash 4 DLC, and would make some fans very happy. The Echo I’d most want to see is Octoling over Inkling.

 

[tenworldsguy]

Cut to gameplay, then back to the CG trailer where both Doomguy and Pit are having trouble against a boss demon, and it seems like they're done for. Until a new figure swoops in...

Dante starts the party!

Then cut to gameplay, and end trailer. Both characters are revealed within the same trailer as the final 2 fighters, with said trailer being named "Demon Hunters".

Dante was deconfirmed by dev.
</3

Isn't Quote and Cave Story owned by Nicalis nowadays? I remember reading about it as the situation was kind of ****ty.

That explains why they were listed as first party in Blade Strangers. Even if they are owned by a non-indie atm I still consider em indies, like how I consider Steve an indie character despite having been purchased by a seperate company for many years now. If they were made by an indie, they're an indie, in my eyes.
Is that company being Square to CS? If so that really sucks. Rip Quote

 

[Dark Bagel]

Dante was deconfirmed by dev.
</3

Oh...

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Would you guys consider Master Chief and Sora to be deconfirmed too? I certainly do

 

[Michael the Spikester]

B-But guys! Remember what Grant Kirkhope said about Banjo! How he said "Not holding your breath about Banjo"! Look how that turned out!

 

[GoodGrief741]

Would you guys consider Master Chief and Sora to be deconfirmed too? I certainly do

Yeah, without a doubt.

 

[KingBroly]

Would you guys consider Master Chief and Sora to be deconfirmed too? I certainly do

I'd consider both de-confirmed as I don't see another Square or Microsoft rep being added. Banjo-Kazooie feels like Cloud. The history behind them makes their inclusion extra special.

I still think Ryu Hayabusa gets in.

MY WILD CARD PICK is

Spoiler

Q-Bert

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Are people forgetting what Grant Kirkhope said about Banjo tho?

 

[DrifloonEmpire]

Are people forgetting what Grant Kirkhope said about Banjo tho?

When did he say that? Could've been before he was asked to compose the Banjo remixes for the game and simply didn't know about it yet.

 

[Slime Scholar]

The tweet in question:

I wouldn't hold my breath if I were you .......

— Grant Kirkhope (@grantkirkhope) May 31, 2019

A fan expresses wanting to see Banjo and Kazooie in Smash, Kirkhope responds by telling him not to hold his breath. This was less than two weeks before E3, so he clearly knew by then that they were in. I see the point being made here; people under NDA don't always need to respond with silence- they could be like Grant here and engage in... disinformation, we'll call it.

Having said that, I still think it's best to take disconfirmations from developers/publishers at face value. Grant has always been pretty cheeky, and him taking a minute to mess with Banjo fans when their reveal was imminent seems like the exception rather than the rule. When a publisher/dev says "our character isn't in Smash" they are, in all likelihood, telling the truth.

Spoiler

Also it's probably not worth splitting hairs on this, but he didn't actually say that they weren't in Smash, he just said not to hold your breath. Not the most meaningful distinction but it technically doesn't make him a liar.

 

[N3ON]

The tweet in question:
A fan expresses wanting to see Banjo and Kazooie in Smash, Kirkhope responds by telling him not to hold his breath. This was less than two weeks before E3, so he clearly knew by then that they were in. I see the point being made here; people under NDA don't always need to respond with silence- they could be like Grant here and engage in... disinformation, we'll call it.

Having said that, I still think it's best to take disconfirmations from developers/publishers at face value. Grant has always been pretty cheeky, and him taking a minute to mess with Banjo fans when their reveal was imminent seems like the exception rather than the rule. When a publisher/dev says "our character isn't in Smash" they are, in all likelihood, telling the truth.

Spoiler

Also it's probably not worth splitting hairs on this, but he didn't actually say that they weren't in Smash, he just said not to hold your breath. Not the most meaningful distinction but it technically doesn't make him a liar.

Agreed. Are characters that have been deconfirmed by their devs 100% out of the running? No, but using one misdirect to set precedent rather than to prove the exception is a mindset that will lead to disappointment. In these situations, truth is not the rarity.

 

[Megadoomer]

Dante was deconfirmed by dev.
</3

Oh...

To clarify, Matt Walker (one of the producers for Devil May Cry 5) said that Dante wasn't in Smash Ultimate, though that tweet was in August 2018, before Smash Ultimate released. (meaning that it was referring to the base game, since it was before DLC was decided on) This past February, Hideaki Itsuno (the director of DMC2-5) said that Dante would likely need a game on a Nintendo console before he could be considered for Smash. By sheer coincidence, a port of Devil May Cry 1 came out a few months later.

I don't know how long it takes to make a port, so I'm not sure if the Switch version of DMC1 was already being worked on when he made that comment; either way, his inclusion still seems like a possibility, though I'm not sure how likely it is.

 

[Nquoid]

Decided to go through all the rumours that have definitively named characters and came up with this list of 8. Obviously we have a few generics like "A Capcom/Namco Rep". And not all of these are from rumours that are as valid as others (some have been completely debunked). But how would people rank these 8 from most to least excited if they were to be the last characters in the fighters pass?

Edelgard
Sylux
Doom Slayer
Monster Hunter
Lloyd Irving
Crash Bandicoot
Ryu Hayabusa
Steve

Also please feel free to remind me of anyone other rumours that still hold some credibility.

 

[Megadoomer]

Decided to go through all the rumours that have definitively named characters and came up with this list of 8. Obviously we have a few generics like "A Capcom/Namco Rep". And not all of these are from rumours that are as valid as others (some of been completely debunked). But how would people rank these 8 from most to least excited if they were to be the last characters in the fighters pass?

Edelgard
Sylux
Doom Slayer
Monster Hunter
Lloyd Irving
Crash Bandicoot
Ryu Hayabusa
Steve

Also please feel free to remind me of anyone other rumours that still hold some credibility.

1. Doom Slayer - he's easily one of my most wanted. I only got into Doom through the 2016 game, but based on that alone, he'd be a ton of fun to play if they could incorporate Doom's emphasis on the idea that you should constantly be moving and getting up close and personal with your opponent. (at least, that's what I took from the gameplay)

2. Crash Bandicoot - I haven't played much of the Crash Bandicoot series (the Wrath of Cortex on Gamecube, and the N. Sane Trilogy and Crash Team Racing on the Switch), but seeing as Crash is a character with a ton of history behind them, and arguably the mascot of the Playstation 1, he'd make a ton of sense to include.

3. Ryu Hayabusa - while I haven't played much, if any, of the Ninja Gaiden series, I've looked up gameplay on Youtube, and he seems like he would be a fun addition who would easily transition into Smash.

4. Edelgard - I haven't played Fire Emblem: Three Houses (this is starting to be a running theme in this list, isn't it?), so I don't know much about the character, but my main problem with Fire Emblem in Smash 4 was how much focus it got while other series were completely ignored in terms of playable characters (it's spread out a bit better in Ultimate, so it's not as much of an issue for me now). I don't know how important Edelgard is compared to Dimitri and Claude, but it seems like she'd stand out more among that cast than another blue-haired sword lord.

5. Sylux - I wouldn't want them to go overboard with adding Metroid characters (we already got Ridley and Dark Samus, which is WAY more than what I was expecting), but Sylux would be all right. I'd probably be more excited if we knew more about Metroid Prime 4, given how long the developers have been building up his role in that game.

6. Steve - if you asked this before Banjo was revealed, he'd be at the bottom of the list. While I could see the reasons behind it, I'd find it hard to be excited about any Microsoft-owned character getting in if it meant that Banjo and Kazooie could have gotten in but were left out because Microsoft wanted to promote something. With Banjo and Kazooie in the game, I'd be interested to see how he would work, though I'd be more excited for the stage possibilities, to be honest.

7. Lloyd Irving - he'd be all right, but there are Namco-Bandai characters that I'd want more, such as Heihachi and Agumon.

8. Monster Hunter - my only experience with Monster Hunter is Tri on the Wii. Maybe the character gets more interesting, or more fun to play as, in future games, but from what I've seen, all but one of the weapons (the sword and shield) are extremely slow and laggy, the traps don't seem like they'd work nearly as well as what I'm used to from Snake (then again, I was early on in the game - maybe some more effective traps are unlocked later), and I could easily name half a dozen Capcom characters, at least, that I'd be more interested in. (Dante, Amaterasu, Viewtiful Joe, Leon Kennedy, Jill Valentine, Morrigan...)

 

[Will]

Decided to go through all the rumours that have definitively named characters and came up with this list of 8. Obviously we have a few generics like "A Capcom/Namco Rep". And not all of these are from rumours that are as valid as others (some have been completely debunked). But how would people rank these 8 from most to least excited if they were to be the last characters in the fighters pass?

Edelgard
Sylux
Doom Slayer
Monster Hunter
Lloyd Irving
Crash Bandicoot
Ryu Hayabusa
Steve

Also please feel free to remind me of anyone other rumours that still hold some credibility.

You gonna mention Sylux but not my man Porky?

4. Edelgard - I haven't played Fire Emblem: Three Houses (this is starting to be a running theme in this list, isn't it?), so I don't know much about the character, but my main problem with Fire Emblem in Smash 4 was how much focus it got while other series were completely ignored in terms of playable characters (it's spread out a bit better in Ultimate, so it's not as much of an issue for me now). I don't know how important Edelgard is compared to Dimitri and Claude, but it seems like she'd stand out more among that cast than another blue-haired sword lord.

Lore wise, her kingdom is the big daddy. The Faerghus Kingdom and Leicester Alliance all derive from riots or rebellions made from her kingdom, so it's historically the oldest and technically most powerful since it's still the biggest. People also say she's the most important of the three but I disagree.

Smash wise, she has an axe. Hector gang cries itself to sleep.

 

[Nquoid]

You gonna mention Sylux but not my man Porky?.

If you can point me to the rumour, that the speculation scene has entertained, that has had Porky in it, I'd gladly include him over the two 1st party characters there.

 

[Will]

If you can point me to the rumour, that the speculation scene has entertained, that has had Porky in it, I'd gladly include him over the two 1st party characters there.

What rumor is bringing up Sylux, first of all?

 

[Nquoid]

What rumor is bringing up Sylux, first of all?

This one. Which whilst being dubious as hell still hasn't been debunked. I'm not even saying I believe it, but it is one that keeps coming up.

 

[Will]

This one. Which whilst being dubious as hell still hasn't been debunked. I'm not even saying I believe it, but it is one that keeps coming up.

4chan text leaks huh? Search deep enough you'll find one for everything that exists on the planet.

 

[Nquoid]

4chan text leaks huh? Search deep enough you'll find one for everything that exists on the planet.

Good thing I'm not entertaining it as true and just using it for a fun diversion whilst we wait for something more credible or news of a direct then huh?

 

[Will]

Good thing I'm not entertaining it as true and just using it for a fun diversion whilst we wait for something more credible or news of a direct then huh?

i wonder who shows up the most in these 4chan text leaks

someone used to keep track but they stopped after like a month

 

[ROBnWatch]

Decided to go through all the rumours that have definitively named characters and came up with this list of 8. Obviously we have a few generics like "A Capcom/Namco Rep". And not all of these are from rumours that are as valid as others (some have been completely debunked). But how would people rank these 8 from most to least excited if they were to be the last characters in the fighters pass?

Edelgard
Sylux
Doom Slayer
Monster Hunter
Lloyd Irving
Crash Bandicoot
Ryu Hayabusa
Steve

Also please feel free to remind me of anyone other rumours that still hold some credibility.

This post is made up of characters who are part of rumors that haven’t been debunked, hence why Porky isn’t in this list. Going to the rankings though...

Tier 1: Characters I’d be interested in/would be happy for their fans

1. Sylux
2. Crash Bandicoot
3. Doom Guy/Slayer

Tier 2: Characters I’d be less interested in/have inexperience with their series

4. Ryu Hayabusa
5. Lloyd Irving
6. Edelgard
7. Monster Hunter

Tier 3: Please no

8. Steve. I’ll give a short explanation for this one. I don’t hate the character or Minecraft, I just don’t really see it fitting in Smash, nor do I really want to see it.

 

[Guynamednelson]

You gonna mention Sylux but not my man Porky?

Imagine thinking the only Nintendo characters without spirits are villains

This post was made by Sami/Tibby gang

 

[Will]

Imagine thinking the only Nintendo characters without spirits are villains

This post was made by Sami/Tibby gang

damn didnt know adeleine was a villain this whole time

bet she broke kirbys friendship bracelet or something

 

[Door Key Pig]

Imagine thinking the only Nintendo characters without spirits are villains

This post was made by Sami/Tibby gang

Ayyyyyyy I too would take any Rhythm Paradise rep I can get. It's been a bit longer from his game release than even DQ's most recent protagonist-made-fighter, but he's also the most "story-related" host of the franchise.

Decided to go through all the rumours that have definitively named characters and came up with this list of 8. Obviously we have a few generics like "A Capcom/Namco Rep". And not all of these are from rumours that are as valid as others (some have been completely debunked). But how would people rank these 8 from most to least excited if they were to be the last characters in the fighters pass?

Edelgard
Sylux
Doom Slayer
Monster Hunter
Lloyd Irving
Crash Bandicoot
Ryu Hayabusa
Steve

Also please feel free to remind me of anyone other rumours that still hold some credibility.

1. Crash Bandicoot - Blahblahblah I'd really want to see him in now that his chances are the best they've ever been blahblahblah it'd be so cool to see him finally meet both Sonic and Mario blahblahblah etc.

2. Doom Slayer - This one's tough; Doom is a classic, beloved game that would be crazy, yet fitting in Smash Bros, but I'd really be disappointed if he was to be the next Western rep over Crash and then that was it for Ultimate DLC. Especially after all those little hinty details of something going on w/ Bethesda. And I don't think we'd be getting two Western fighters to round out the pass?

3. Steve - I guess should have similar reasoning to Doom Slayer for being a Westie, but kinda seems out of the running anyway because of ol' Banjo. Uh, kinda indifferent? other than how he would technically sorta be the first indie fighter in Smash Bros, which would be... Kinda neat, I guess?

4. Ryu Hayabusa - Indifferent. Neat I guess in terms of rounding out (?) the classic NES stars after already getting Simon Belmont in there too.

5. Lloyd Irving - Heh heh, Lloyd.

6. Monster Hunter - Annoyed because they weren't just in the base game whilst bringing in Rathalos, making us think they'd leave the MH representation at that, but nooooooooooope.

7/8. Sylux & Edelgard - "Oh great, another Metroid/Fire Emblem character!" And just when it seemed like their odds were in question, too, with the releasing periods of both Metroid Prime 4 and Fire Emblem Three Houses?

 

[Will]

7/8. Sylux & Edelgard - "Oh great, another Metroid/Fire Emblem character!" And just when it seemed like their odds were in question, too, with the releasing periods of both Metroid Prime 4 and Fire Emblem Three Houses?

Oh God, people are complaining about Metroid's character count now? Sounds like some traitors to Ridley Gang to me.

 

[Door Key Pig]

Oh God, people are complaining about Metroid's character count now? Sounds like some traitors to Ridley Gang to me.

I know, times have changed, but Metroid did just get two new characters (both of long fan want) in the same game. I imagine Sylux would be the Corrin to Metroid's Fire Emblem; sudden positive multiple representation for an existing franchise with a new clone and original character in the base game, that wears out its welcome with ANOTHER unique character for DLC?

 

[Guynamednelson]

Oh God, people are complaining about Metroid's character count now? Sounds like some traitors to Ridley Gang to me.

When the Metroid character the fanbase wanted more than any other has been added, is it any wonder people are losing interest in wanting more Metroid?

 

[KatKit]

It'd probably be a licensing nightmare, but imagine if Cygames and Nintendo (and Sakurai) collaborated with Arc System Works (with a little input from PlatinumGames, who've briefly worked with Cygames on a Granblue title) to bring a Granblue Fantasy rep to Smash. Now, you may not know what that series even is, and until I buy the upcoming spin-off fighter developed by ArcSys and the upcoming ARPG (shameless plug), I can't properly explain it either, but just know that it would be cool (and honestly I just want Platinum and ArcSys to collab on something for Nintendo).

 

[TheCJBrine]

Decided to go through all the rumours that have definitively named characters and came up with this list of 8. Obviously we have a few generics like "A Capcom/Namco Rep". And not all of these are from rumours that are as valid as others (some have been completely debunked). But how would people rank these 8 from most to least excited if they were to be the last characters in the fighters pass?

Edelgard
Sylux
Doom Slayer
Monster Hunter
Lloyd Irving
Crash Bandicoot
Ryu Hayabusa
Steve

Also please feel free to remind me of anyone other rumours that still hold some credibility.

1. Steve - y’all already know, I assume.

2. Crash - he’s cool, liked the games of his I’ve played in the past.

3. Everyone else on the list - I don’t care either way.

 

[HyruleHero]

Decided to go through all the rumours that have definitively named characters and came up with this list of 8. Obviously we have a few generics like "A Capcom/Namco Rep". And not all of these are from rumours that are as valid as others (some have been completely debunked). But how would people rank these 8 from most to least excited if they were to be the last characters in the fighters pass?

Edelgard
Sylux
Doom Slayer
Monster Hunter
Lloyd Irving
Crash Bandicoot
Ryu Hayabusa
Steve

Also please feel free to remind me of anyone other rumours that still hold some credibility.

Honestly I'd be pretty bummed out by almost any of these characters, I want a character that make people go "Holy ****" not characters that are more "cool I guess" don't really know who that character would be at this point in the smash speculation scene but I still think Sora would be the most insane character to see (not that I see him happening at all). However I will rank these characters anyway:

1. Doom Slayer
2. Monster Hunter
3. Edelgard
4. Lloyd Irving
5. Ryu Hayabusa
6. Steve
7. Sylux
8. Crash Bandicoot

Doom is only at the top because I remember playing his old games growing up but I don't feel like he is much of a "character' per say.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Would you guys consider Master Chief and Sora to be deconfirmed too? I certainly do

Not disconfirmed, but highly unlikely. I still see Master Chief being #5 just due to the shock value alone.

A fan expresses wanting to see Banjo and Kazooie in Smash, Kirkhope responds by telling him not to hold his breath. This was less than two weeks before E3, so he clearly knew by then that they were in. I see the point being made here; people under NDA don't always need to respond with silence- they could be like Grant here and engage in... disinformation, we'll call it.

From what I've heard he wasn't even told about it. He just kinda guessed regarding the employer and request (It would be wierd if Nintendo made a Banjo-Kazooie game while they were still owned by Microsoft).

 

[TheCJBrine]

From what I've heard he wasn't even told about it. He just kinda guessed regarding the employer and request (It would be wierd if Nintendo made a Banjo-Kazooie game while they were still owned by Microsoft).

I think he found out it was in fact Smash before he made the composition.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Hideaki Itsuno (the director of DMC2-5) said that Dante would likely need a game on a Nintendo console before he could be considered for Smash.

That's funny given