Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Trevenant]

Hey what if

if the spirit being promoted is in WoL, they straight up replace the Spirit battle with an Awakening battle? I.e. Min Min’s Spirit in the Light Realm becomes you freeing Galeem-controlled Min Min; and Octoling Girl/Boy in the Dark Realm becomes a Dharkon-controlled Octoling

yes there’s a spirit in the Light Realm named Octoling but it’s of the enemy variant. The playable Octo Expansion variant is called Octoling Girl & Octoling Boy

Do you even unlock the DLC characters in WoL? I thought it was solely based on how many fighters from base game you awakened. Either way I guess it would be cool although having both I think would be better as it's about .01 recurring lots of extra content and although it isn't a lot, it's extra stuff I guess. Aside from the very easy mode, I'm kinda surprised they haven't really touched WoL anymore. Not anything like story DLC but a bit more stuff

 

[Goombaic]

I'm surprised that's a common argument considering the infinitely more viable argument of "how on Earth are you supposed to tell Vegeta (SS) and Majin Vegeta apart while they're flipping around and there's explosions and stuff when the only difference is a tiny "M" on the forehead?"

Don't wanna get too off-topic since this isn't a DBFZ board, but SS and Majin should have different outfits (SS is armor and Majin is a jumpsuit)

That argument is used against SSGSS Evolved Vegeta, though.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Don't wanna get too off-topic since this isn't a DBFZ board, but SS and Majin should have different outfits (SS is armor and Majin is a jumpsuit)

Ah. Didn't know that.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Do you even unlock the DLC characters in WoL? I thought it was solely based on how many fighters from base game you awakened. Either way I guess it would be cool although having both I think would be better as it's about .01 recurring lots of extra content and although it isn't a lot, it's extra stuff I guess. Aside from the very easy mode, I'm kinda surprised they haven't really touched WoL anymore. Not anything like story DLC but a bit more stuff

None of FPV1 were spirits and neither was PP so they auto unlocked once you freed 10 peeps

since the ARMS rep and potentially others may be Spirits tho, esp if they’re found in WoL itself...

 

[KingofPhantoms]

The thing that really gets me is that some people pick and choose which "fan rules" are valid. Like "Banjo happened, fan demand is king!" and then go "Spring Man is the poster boy, its gotta be him."

It's partly 'cause of stuff like this that I'm not betting on any specific ARMS character to be the newcomer at this point.

It could be nearly any one of them for any reason. We'll only have a better idea of why it was who after they're revealed.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

One thing I can say for certain is that the beginning of the trailer will be this:

*drums*
*drums intensify*
*drums flourish*
ARMS X Super Smash Bros. Ultimate

 

[Cutie Gwen]

since Sakurai is probably recording the ARMS presentation at home, that means there's a very real possibility that Sakurai will bring his cat in and show it on video.

Sakurai, please show us your cat.

— Zachmin (@zach_min) June 19, 2020

I take it back I'm willing to watch this **** live now, worth the 3 months of radio silence even if it's ****ing Spring Man

 

[SKX31]

Do you even unlock the DLC characters in WoL? I thought it was solely based on how many fighters from base game you awakened. Either way I guess it would be cool although having both I think would be better as it's about .01 recurring lots of extra content and although it isn't a lot, it's extra stuff I guess. Aside from the very easy mode, I'm kinda surprised they haven't really touched WoL anymore. Not anything like story DLC but a bit more stuff

The DLC characters are unlocked in WoL after 10 base game characters are unlocked.

Regarding the poll, I'm sticking with Min Min. If spirits are enough to disqualify a character, then my pick would be Dr. Coyle, but I don't think that having a single PNG image in the game is enough to disqualify someone. (that wasn't the case for trophies back in Smash 4, though I'll admit that circumstances were different since Mewtwo and Lucas were veterans) I guess we'll find out for sure on Monday.

Honestly that depends on if Sakurai and co. still see Spirits as multiplayer / amiibo relevant or not. That feels incredibly weird to say, but Nintendo's home to viewpoints which are disconnected to the audience. It's worth remembering that in the November 2018 presentation Sakurai called Spirits a tool to use in multiplayer battles - balancing character / spirit combos against others. That said "Death of the Author" is in full effect here. Spirits are not only very unbalanced, but also a pain to set up for multiplayer matches unless the Spirit teams are intentionally pre-built. That's probably why most don't bother with Spirits in multiplayer matches and "PNG" became a thing.

If Sakurai and co. still put more stock in Spirits than most of us do... that's a wrinkle. Not automatically disqualifying, but a possible hindrance since they might not see as much of a need to promote. "You can already play as the Spirit!" as strange and disheartening as that sounds. That's not my opinion of Spirit promotion, I'm basing this off Nintendo's attitude towards making games: if it isn't reinventing the wheel gameplay-wise it's generally "We already made a game like this, go and play that!" (Generally, there are some exceptions like Mario Kart)

Of course, that view could've changed since then, but I'll reiterate that I believe the promotion when I see it.

 

[Cosmic77]

If the character already has a Spirit, they can just use alternate artwork and specify in the name that it's the Spirit for the fighter.

Even if the character is Spring Man, the amount of tweeking should be minimal. At worst, they'll rename the old Spirit(s) and prevent the AT from spawning when Spring Man is used.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

If the character already has a Spirit, they can just use alternate artwork and specify in the name that it's the Spirit for the fighter.

Even if the character is Spring Man, the amount of tweeking should be minimal. At worst, they'll rename the old Spirit(s) and prevent the AT from spawning when Spring Man is used.

I know but I was aiming for an extra step and full WoL integration by replacing the Spirit Battle in WoL with an awakening battle

 

[Evil Trapezium]

since Sakurai is probably recording the ARMS presentation at home, that means there's a very real possibility that Sakurai will bring his cat in and show it on video.

Sakurai, please show us your cat.

— Zachmin (@zach_min) June 19, 2020

Tempting but Nintendo hasn't advertised Sakurai's cat as a guest appearance so I'm not fooling for this.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Tempting but Nintendo hasn't advertised Sakurai's cat as a guest appearance so I'm not fooling for this.

That's because it's not a guest. It's a cameo where he just walks right in front of the camera much to the chagrin of Sakurai.

 

[Simplythe1]

I guess it's time for me to make a Spring Man summoning circle just to be safe....

 

[SneakyLink]

since Sakurai is probably recording the ARMS presentation at home, that means there's a very real possibility that Sakurai will bring his cat in and show it on video.

Sakurai, please show us your cat.

— Zachmin (@zach_min) June 19, 2020

I take it back I'm willing to watch this **** live now, worth the 3 months of radio silence even if it's ****ing Spring Man

1 minute for the fighter

34 minutes for Sakurai's cat

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Tempting but Nintendo hasn't advertised Sakurai's cat as a guest appearance so I'm not fooling for this.

This is all I have to get excited for don't you even ****ing TRY to get rid of this for me

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I guess it's time for me to make a Spring Man summoning circle just to be safe....

Is that where you draw a star shape with pizza slices and chant "Boyoyoing"?

 

[StormC]

I expect Spring-Man because that's just the way life goes sometimes.

It'd be great if Sakurai/Nintendo stopped being obsessed with the main character to a fault but alas.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

It'd be great if Sakurai/Nintendo never stopped being obsessed with the main character to great effect but alas.

Fixed.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I'll admit, I don't see why people seem to think Nintendo is obsessed with main characters.

Isn't that just how crossovers work? The majority of the time, its the main character chosen to star. Or at least a character who eclipsed the main character.

 

[StormC]

I'll admit, I don't see why people seem to think Nintendo is obsessed with main characters.

Isn't that just how crossovers work? The majority of the time, its the main character chosen to star. Or at least a character who eclipsed the main character.

MVC was more liberal with picking characters that aren't the main mascot, among a few other crossovers.

MVC3 didn't even have Mega Man!

 

[Guynamednelson]

MVC3 didn't even have Mega Man!

Probably not the best argument in favor of not picking the main character first when that was a common complaint about MvC3's roster.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

MVC was more liberal with picking characters that aren't the main mascot, among a few other crossovers.

MVC3 didn't even have Mega Man!

Wasn't MvC3's biggest complaint no Mega Man? Heck X got the most votes in the poll purely because of that.

That said...

MvC3 still kept to main characters for the most part. The only franchises included that didn't have one were Mega Man, and Darkstalkers which is an odd case cause Morrigan took over the franchise.

 

[StormC]

Probably not the best argument in favor of not picking the main character first when that was a common complaint about MvC3's roster.

I wasn't arguing in favor of it, I was arguing there is precedent for it.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I wasn't arguing in favor of it, I was arguing there is precedent for it.

True, but if the lack of Mega Man were perceived as good by the community, X wouldn't be the literal first thing they revealed for Infinite.

 

[StormC]

True, but if the lack of Mega Man were perceived as good by the community, X wouldn't be the literal first thing they revealed for Infinite.

I mean it doesn't have to be about Mega Man. Nobody gave a crap that Demitri got usurped by Morrigan. There are obviously series where people will be upset that the main character gets dropped, and Mega Man is one of them. I don't think that's the case with ARMS, not many people are attached to Spring-Man, so I understand the disappointment that the pick might still be him.

 

[Knight Dude]

Anyway, on the 5% chance its him, we're apart of the Misango gang. The Aztetic Aesthetic can't be beat.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

not many people are attached to Spring-Man, so I understand the disappointment that the pick might still be him.

You misunderstand.

People who don't care all that much about ARMS don't like Spring Man much.

Spring Man is one of the more popular characters in the ARMS community.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Honestly after all is said and done, I'm wondering about the Mii costumes and what those implications may bring.

Imagine if, in one fell swoop, Heihachi, Geno, or another character are wiped out and Costume'd? That'll shake things right up.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I mean it doesn't have to be about Mega Man. Nobody gave a crap that Demitri got usurped by Morrigan. There are obviously series where people will be upset that the main character gets dropped, and Mega Man is one of them. I don't think that's the case with ARMS, not many people are attached to Spring-Man, so I understand the disappointment that the pick might still be him.

There's a good amount of people who like Spring Man, actually.

The only reason it's not as apparent as other characters is that a lot of the vocal ones for Smash only support Spring Man because they believe an AT getting promoted means their most wanted AT/Costume/Spirit is now a "guarantee"

It's the whole Grass-type Pokemon/Edelgard's axe situation again where the support base is a mix of genuine fans and people who just care about their own definition of "proper representation"

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Honestly after all is said and done, I'm wondering about the Mii costumes and what those implications may bring.

Imagine if, in one fell swoop, Heihachi, Geno, or another character are wiped out and Costume'd? That'll shake things right up.

Just give me a Madeline costume with a song and all will be right in the world

 

[Nanami77]

Honestly after all is said and done, I'm wondering about the Mii costumes and what those implications may bring.

Imagine if, in one fell swoop, Heihachi, Geno, or another character are wiped out and Costume'd? That'll shake things right up.

Please no

 

[DarthEnderX]

How does that make sense? That's literally speculation.

Yeah, dumb fan rules are literally speculation.

You can argue the dumb part, but any limitation not specifically stated by Nintendo as BEING a limitation is, by definition, a fanrule. You can make a case that some of the fan rules make sense and have a ton of precedent, that doesn't make them any less fan rules.

 

[Nekoo]

Honestly after all is said and done, I'm wondering about the Mii costumes and what those implications may bring.

Imagine if, in one fell swoop, Heihachi, Geno, or another character are wiped out and Costume'd? That'll shake things right up.

Thanks to reminds me of the potential Bloodbath incoming Sco-
Always a pleasure, and almost as exciting as knowing the new fighter ngl

 

[Dragoncharystary]

I imagine the Nintendo characters will all have some sort of relevancy to the Switch. less Dixie/BanDee/Waluigi.

But all three of those are in games on the Switch.

I'll give you Dixie only has a port of a Wii U game but the other two are in multiple Switch games.

 

[-crump-]

On the topic of Mii Costumes, do you all think the Premium Mii costumes (costume+music) will get a new addition this time around? And if so, do you think the trend of indie games getting represented this way will continue?

Undertale and Cuphead both have a significant following in Japan as well as in the West, so I was wondering what other indie games could have this merit. Personally I would LOVE a Hat Kid costume with "Your Contract Has Expired" as a bonus track, but I don't know if A Hat In Time has the same reach.

 

[Knight Dude]

Dragon Ball Fighterz and Super Smash Bros. are very different games though.

With Goku, Vegeta, Goku, Vegeta, Goku, Vegeta, Vegito, Gogeta, Goku, and Goku, Dragon Ball Fighterz clearly gives no cares about two characters being in the same place.

Super Smash Bros. on the other hand, tends to try and make sure that this doesn't happen beyond multiple players picking the same character, like how King Dedede is removed from Dream Land. Granted, it's not completely consistent (Duck Hunt isn't removed from Duck Hunt when Duck Hunt is present...I hate how that makes perfect sense in context) , but there is at least a precedent for this attention to detail. It's not to say that they can't ignore something like this, but it's also not to say it's completely ridiculous to think it would need to be addressed.

True, to a certain extent. But the fact that we even have these exceptions, The Duck Hunt Stage situation you mentioned, Chrom still in Robin's Final Smash, and to a much lesser extent Samus and ZSS being playable as separate characters isn't too far removed from Teen Gohan and Adult Gohan in DBFZ as an example.

The only issue with ATs is that we haven't seen it happen before. And that's only if Spring-Man is chosen and not Ribbon Girl/Min-Min/Ninjara or whoever else.

Street Fighter, MK, UMVC3, Injustice, ect. all have examples of cameo characters eventually being playable. People are just a lot more uppity about when it comes to Smash because of how many potential characters are feasible, so everyone has to try and get their piece of the pie, so to speak.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

View attachment 275349
This is all I have to get excited for don't you even ****ing TRY to get rid of this for me

This is a truly exciting time for you. First your most wanted was revealed last year, now we could be getting your second most wanted, Spring Man!

MVC was more liberal with picking characters that aren't the main mascot, among a few other crossovers.

MVC3 didn't even have Mega Man!

And that was a mistake that huge amount of complaints. Thankfully speaking, Smash would never have a roster decison as poor as that.

 

[Nekoo]

On the topic of Mii Costumes, do you all think the Premium Mii costumes (costume+music) will get a new addition this time around? And if so, do you think the trend of indie games getting represented this way will continue?

Undertale and Cuphead both have a significant following in Japan as well as in the West, so I was wondering what other indie games could have this merit. Personally I would LOVE a Hat Kid costume with "Your Contract Has Expired" as a bonus track, but I don't know if A Hat In Time has the same reach.

If it continue, I can see something like Cadence / Gunvolt / Shantae getting a premium Mii Costume.
If not, I also believe that Geno can become a Premium Mii Costume with a sweet remix to actually make him look like GENO and not a weird ass Mii face

 

[Knight Dude]

Honestly after all is said and done, I'm wondering about the Mii costumes and what those implications may bring.

Imagine if, in one fell swoop, Heihachi, Geno, or another character are wiped out and Costume'd? That'll shake things right up.

If Heihachi gets costume'd again, I'm still shilling for Jin Kazama until further notice.

On the topic of Mii Costumes, do you all think the Premium Mii costumes (costume+music) will get a new addition this time around? And if so, do you think the trend of indie games getting represented this way will continue?

Undertale and Cuphead both have a significant following in Japan as well as in the West, so I was wondering what other indie games could have this merit. Personally I would LOVE a Hat Kid costume with "Your Contract Has Expired" as a bonus track, but I don't know if A Hat In Time has the same reach.

If they don't get a salty runback as a character, I'd imagine Shovel Knight and Shantae could be Mii costumes. Though I think only Shovel Knight could work as a Premium suit since he doesn't have a unique face to animate. While Cuphead and Sans have weird faces that can be made into masks.

Maybe Geno gets that if he also doesn't get the salty runback.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

If not, I also believe that Geno can become a Premium Mii Costume with a sweet remix to actually make him look like GENO and not a weird ass Mii face

I can actually see that happening.

That won't go over well.