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Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

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Dalek_Kolt

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Smash fans should not be expected to put in the research towards a character they don't know. No, I don't care how "easy" it is to google a character and see their gameplay, franchise and impact on the world, the burden of proof falls on Sakurai and the fans of said character to explain who they are and the reasons they were put in Smash.

And guess what, Sakurai has explained who these characters are; I knew jack and spit about Terry, and watching Sakurai school me on who Terry was and why I should care has probably been some of the most educational and engaging Smash discussion I have heard for Ultimate.
 
D

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Smash fans should not be expected to put in the research towards a character they don't know. No, I don't care how "easy" it is to google a character and see their gameplay, franchise and impact on the world, the burden of proof falls on Sakurai and the fans of said character to explain who they are and the reasons they were put in Smash.

And guess what, Sakurai has explained who these characters are; I knew jack and spit about Terry, and watching Sakurai school me on who Terry was and why I should care has probably been some of the most educational and engaging Smash discussion I have heard for Ultimate.
Honestly, this is where no trophies descriptions become an issue. Because now I cant read a small paragraph summary over characters and their items.
 

Scoliosis Jones

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It really just depends on what you think Smash is. People have varying degrees of "Nintendo connection" they're willing to accept before a character seems out of place. For some people, third party characters were a mistake. For others, who cares about Nintendo connection? And there's a ton in between those two. Like @Garteam said, Smash is going through an identity crisis, and different people have different expectations of what Smash is and should be. So tension between those different perspectives at this point is unavoidable unless all character picks appeal to the lowest common denominator (and even then you have people who are against "expected characters", which makes pleasing everyone impossible).
I'm not sure I agree. Is Smash going through an identity crisis? Or are fans expectations being subverted based on the direction the game itself is going?

I mean sure, fan interests are one thing. But Sakurai himself has referred to the game as the "biggest gaming crossover ever" the packaging and website describes it as "gaming icons clash".

If you ask me, that's the reality we are in. Smash has outgrown being simply a Nintendo crossover. Folks can love it or hate it, but that's the reality we're in. You can either continually resist and be frustrated that it doesn't fit the "ideal" image of what Smash is "supposed to be" (though, who are we to say what it should or shouldn't be?), or you can embrace the growing crossover element and embrace the exposure to gaming franchises that, to certain people, are previously unknown?

What's most ironic is that it seems the group steering Smash in the "gaming crossover" vision is none other than Nintendo themselves. Sure, it started with Sakurai planning to bring everybody together in this game, but Nintendo willingly continued with it.

I don't think it's the game having an identity crisis. I think it's the fanbase grappling with the direction the series has taken.
 
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Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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Smash 4 is when I started going for hype Captain Falcon and Ganoncides, so it's honestly all I needed.

Smash Tour was weirdly fun with friends despite not beinh Smash Run.

The DLC newcomers were extremely fun even if I conceptually gave no ****s about Ryu or Cloud. Cloud's dumb bustersword was so fun.
I played Smash Tour with just computers myself. It was honestly pretty fun. Smash Run with computers is... meh. I'd love just to have a longer Smash Run with a very specific goal to meet, instead of a mediocre 5 minute time limit. It was still fun, though.

And nice. I never really went into the Ganoncide and similar type of stuff myself among the Smash games. Still an effectively tool regardless. I think the best part is that "you're coming with me to hell!" is just fun to invoke sometimes.

Bayonetta was easily the DLC character I flowed with the most. I loved Cloud being in it(and to be honest, I felt he had a massively good chance anyway for a FF character. It doesn't help the other animal mascots weren't the real face of the franchise either, like Pikachu/Slime were, so I had little reason to think they could potentially be chosen or at least considered. Either way, I'm glad Sakurai did note Slime, despite not wanting him. The costume is still awesome either way).

The funniest moment that happened to me is being asked in DM's who I thought was more likely; Brian or Cloud. This was, I dunno, months before Cloud's reveal and all. I instantly said Cloud. It was a no-brainer to me. He's the RPG Character, for cripes' sake. That's all I needed to know. And I don't even like Cloud or his game in general. I barely played through it and only knew some story bits, but didn't even watch a LP by that point. I actually didn't experience the story via a full LP till way later. I didn't know at all how Materia worked. ...Though admittedly it's kind of confusing but so are the Guardian Forces in FFVIII. Either way, I had no idea of how he'd fully play besides obviously being a sword user. So he was an awesome surprise when he came along~ (I knew less about Bayonetta, one of my other favorite additions, heh).
 

Cosmic77

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Smash fans should not be expected to put in the research towards a character they don't know. No, I don't care how "easy" it is to google a character and see their gameplay, franchise and impact on the world, the burden of proof falls on Sakurai and the fans of said character to explain who they are and the reasons they were put in Smash.

And guess what, Sakurai has explained who these characters are; I knew jack and spit about Terry, and watching Sakurai school me on who Terry was and why I should care has probably been some of the most educational and engaging Smash discussion I have heard for Ultimate.
I feel like this is greater emphasised when you remember that this is a product we're paying for. If you're a business trying to sell a product, then your job is to make that product look appealing to consumers. So why are people acting like it's our job to sell ourselves a product Nintendo wants us to buy?

In my opinion, the quick summaries Sakurai has been providing are more than enough for people to decide whether or not they'd like a franchise.
 

SMAASH! Puppy

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She licked to me.
*snickers in immaturity*

I tried to look up what a prude is and...
Google said:
a person who is or claims to be easily shocked by matters relating to sex or nudity.
Merriam_Webster said:
a person who is excessively or priggishly attentive to propriety or decorum
Dictionary.com said:
a person who is excessively proper or modest in speech, conduct, dress, etc.
Now I'm more confused...

Here is my response:
"Spring Man stretches his arms!"
It's not quite as snappy in my opinion. Also, huge missed opportunity to use ARMS in place of arms, 'cuz that's where the pun is.
 

Scoliosis Jones

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Smash fans should not be expected to put in the research towards a character they don't know. No, I don't care how "easy" it is to google a character and see their gameplay, franchise and impact on the world, the burden of proof falls on Sakurai and the fans of said character to explain who they are and the reasons they were put in Smash.

And guess what, Sakurai has explained who these characters are; I knew jack and spit about Terry, and watching Sakurai school me on who Terry was and why I should care has probably been some of the most educational and engaging Smash discussion I have heard for Ultimate.
I disagree with the first part.

I can talk about how cool and interesting a particular character is. But if you or others are not going to actively entertain the ideas, then you're guaranteed to not get anything from it.

Believe me, I teach middle schoolers. You're right when you say things need to be framed in such a way that it draws an interest, but it is still important for the party who is unfamiliar to have an interest in broadening their horizons and learning something in the first place. Otherwise it just gives off a sense of a lack of interest and willful ignorance.
 
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SMAASH! Puppy

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Nitpick but why people use "into" in literally every fanmade tagline? It feels forced when people add that to every verb without thinking if it actually fits or not.
Likely because the only one that doesn't do this (in recent memory) is "Banjo & Kazooie are raring to go!"

Though I do question how stretching is a form of locomotion.

EDIT: Well...Roy sealed the deal so I guess that's not really the case that most of them do this.
EDIT EDIT: Perhaps just "Spring Man stretches in!" would suffice.
 
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osby

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Likely because the only one that doesn't do this (in recent memory) is "Banjo & Kazooie are raring to go!"

Though I do question how stretching is a form of locomotion.

EDIT: Well...Roy sealed the deal so I guess that's not really the case that most of them do this.
EDIT EDIT: Perhaps just "Spring Man stretches in!" would suffice.
"Joker steals the Show"?
"Hero Draws Near"?
"Terry Faces the Fury"?
"Byleth joins Smash House"?

You can do a lot of creative puns without resorting to verb+into+Smash (again, this really isn't anything important, just something small that bothers me)
 

CaptainAmerica

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Granted, I haven't looked much, but I've mostly seen people saying "Who is this" in terms of "I don't know them," it's everyone else that morphs that into "Literally nobody knows who they are." Probably because the latter is a strawman and is easier to attack than to admit that maybe there are people who don't know certain characters and that's okay.

It seems like most of the arguments coming from the "try it, you'll like it" crowd so far revolve around the idea that if someone tries the game, then they'll 100% love it, so anyone who doesn't like it just hasn't played it enough. Even just reading the last pages of arguments has gone that way.

"I don't like character X"
"But you don't have the right to an opinion since you never even looked up who they are!"
"Ok, I googled them and read their Wiki article. Still not a fan."
"Obviously, you can't get that from reading it. You need to see the game!"
"I read the game reviews and watched some Youtubers go through it. Now I confirmed that I don't like the character."
"You need to experience it yourself or else your opinion is invalid!"
"So I bought the console and game and forced myself to play through it. Now I hate it more than before."
"You just don't know them like I do!"

It seems that there's no line where the argument of "I don't like it" becomes valid. And it's an opinion anyway, so it's inherently personal.

I feel like this is where the 'anime swordsman' came from: someone doesn't like a character, but the peanut gallery doesn't accept "I don't like them" as an excuse, so they need to come up with a fully-referenced thesis on what they don't like. It's an opinion, people are allowed not to like things. People are allowed to like things. But none of that changes who's in or not. If I say I don't like a character in the pass, I'm suggesting that I'd prefer someone else and that I'm not going to buy them since I don't think they're worth spending money on. I mean, yeah, I'll be frustrated that I didn't get a character I'd like to see, but there's not much I can do about it. It is a bit disappointing to me that almost every one of the characters I did want got shot down one by one while there are people who are shouting "All 3 of my top most wanted got in as DLC!" Congrats to them, but can I have a turn please?

Again, the idea of "I don't know them" becoming "I'd rather someone else" is directly related to the limited number of slots. Yes, we could open our minds to other characters, but of course we'd prefer a character we wanted in the first place. Even if we use Snake as an example, I didn't really care much when they announced him in Brawl. Yeah, no clue who he was at the time. But that was Brawl, so I didn't really have a list of characters I wanted. Snake's absence in Sm4sh didn't really affect me, though.

...and yeah, it does seem a bit lopsided that most of the non-Nintendo third parties so far have been PS exclusive or focused. Understandable, but still feels lopsided.

Let's face it: If by some miracle I get my most wanted in, I know exactly what I'm gonna hear. "Ugh, another swordie! Too many disjointed hitboxes!" "Ugh, ugly Western character contaminating my Japanese game!" "Ugh, Todd Howard is just like EA. Worst company ever!" "Ugh, that game is so old and irrelevant now. Who cares about Skyrim anymore?" "Ugh, Doomguy deserved it so much more!"

Yeah, it'll be annoying, but I'll be too busy learning a new main to care. I'd love it if people would see him and go "Wow, so cool, I want to get involved in this series. Can someone give me the history of this game?" (PS don't ask me this, I don't have time to write a 200 page thesis, but I probably would do that as a response). But I can't expect everyone to like my favorite. I can't be mad if people don't like him and don't want to buy him.
 

Cosmic77

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I disagree with the first part.

I can talk about how cool and interesting a particular character is. But if you or others are not going to actively entertain the ideas, then you're guaranteed to not get anything from it.

Believe me, I teach middle schoolers. You're right when you say things need to be framed in such a way that it draws an interest, but it is still important for the party who is unfamiliar to have an interest in broadening their horizons and learning something in the first place. Otherwise it just gives off a sense of a lack of interest and willful ignorance.
Since this is something people can spend real money on and not just charity work, I don't necessarily agree.

If Nintendo reveals a product and we're not immediately sold on the idea, they should do everything in their power to win us over so we'll spend our money. That's how practically every single product we buy in stores is handled. Some products are easier to win people over than others, and that mostly depends on what the consumers want. If we're hesitant or unwilling to buy something, then that's not a sign that we're the ones that need to change. That's a sign that the business selling the product needs to either (1) step up their game and try harder to make it appealing, or (2) make different choices going forward that would lead to more sales.

In other words, if Nintendo didn't do enough to convince me and hundreds of other people to purchase Hero, Terry, or some other third character in the pass, it's not my job to pick up their slack and sell myself their own product, even if I'm fueled by a lack of interest or willful ignorance.
 
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Guynamednelson

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Spring Man Springs Free Of Assist Trophy Hell!
It'd be cool if a DLC fighter that's a promoted AT/spirit/Poke Ball/stage cameo references their previois status with their tagline, but they should be more subtle. "Bounces Back!" would be a good example of that.
 

osby

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In other words, if Nintendo didn't do enough to convince me and hundreds of other people to purchase Hero, Terry, or some other third character in the pass, it's not my job to pick up their slack and sell myself their own product, even if I'm fueled by a lack of interest or willful ignorance.
I know you dislike third parties but really PP, Byleth, and "an ARMS character" seem like they created the least excitement among DLC characters and that's coming from someone who loved Byleth.

I don't think it's strictly third party characters Nintendo "didn't do enough to convince hundreds of other people to purchase".
 

Opossum

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"Joker steals the Show"?
"Hero Draws Near"?
"Terry Faces the Fury"?
"Byleth joins Smash House"?

You can do a lot of creative puns without resorting to verb+into+Smash (again, this really isn't anything important, just something small that bothers me)
It actually goes further than that.

Ridley Hits the Big Time.
Simon Lashes Out.
Richter Crosses Over.
King K. Rool Comes Aboard.
Isabelle Turns Over a New Leaf.
Ken Turns Up the Heat.
Incineroar Enters the Ring.
Piranha Plant Pipes Up.


And for Smash 4:
Villager Comes to Town.
Mega Man Joins the Battle.
Wii Fit Trainer Weighs In.
Rosalina and Luma Launch Into Battle.
Little Mac Punches In.
Greninja Makes a Splash.
Palutena Alights.
Pac-Man Hungers for Battle.
Lucina Wakes Her Blade.
Robin Brings the Thunder.
Shulk Forsees a Fight.
Bowser Jr. Clowns the Competition.
Duck Hunt Takes Aim.
Here Comes a New Challenger: Ryu.
Cloud Storms Into Battle.
Corrin Chooses to Smash.
Bayonetta Gets Wicked.


Literally only Rosalina and Cloud used "Into Battle."
 

I.D.

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I'm not sure I agree. Is Smash going through an identity crisis? Or are fans expectations being subverted based on the direction the game itself is going?
I can't wait for Harada to replace Sakurai as the director of the next Smash game and subvert my expectations by putting Negan in the game
 

SMAASH! Puppy

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Okay I think I got one

"Spring Man reaches the Spring break!"

I don't know...
Sounds like someone can't wait for their week off.

Literally only Rosalina and Cloud used "Into Battle."
Ah, so it is creative bankruptcy then. (or just the first idea) lol

I can't wait for Harada to replace Sakurai as the director of the next Smash game and subvert my expectations by putting Negan in the game
Harada would not be able to handle directing Super Smash Bros. He'd probably end up deleteting his Facebook/Twitter account(s) if he became the director.
 

GoodGrief741

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I'm not sure I agree. Is Smash going through an identity crisis? Or are fans expectations being subverted based on the direction the game itself is going?

I mean sure, fan interests are one thing. But Sakurai himself has referred to the game as the "biggest gaming crossover ever" the packaging and website describes it as "gaming icons clash".

If you ask me, that's the reality we are in. Smash has outgrown being simply a Nintendo crossover. Folks can love it or hate it, but that's the reality we're in. You can either continually resist and be frustrated that it doesn't fit the "ideal" image of what Smash is "supposed to be" (though, who are we to say what it should or shouldn't be?), or you can embrace the growing crossover element and embrace the exposure to gaming franchises that, to certain people, are previously unknown?

What's most ironic is that it seems the group steering Smash in the "gaming crossover" vision is none other than Nintendo themselves. Sure, it started with Sakurai planning to bring everybody together in this game, but Nintendo willingly continued with it.

I don't think it's the game having an identity crisis. I think it's the fanbase grappling with the direction the series has taken.
If the series is going in a direction that the fanbase is split on, that's still an identity crisis. Is what Smash is becoming really Smash, or something else? I don't think it's as clear cut as you put it. For a crossover that purports being about all gaming, we still get tons of Nintendo newcomers, and the argument could be made for several of the third party characters that they're honorary Nintendo characters. If the game itself doesn't go all in with a new direction, it's only natural that the audience doesn't either.

But even if we assume that Smash is no longer restricted to Nintendo, that there's no question about it, and that it's now just a gaming icons crossover. That means there's an even higher bar for characters. A character must be iconic to get in, and being iconic means that people must recognize you. Therefore, the logic goes that if I don't recognize a character, then it isn't iconic.

If you tell people a crossover is between iconic characters, the expectation is that they'll know the character, not that they will be learning new things.
 

Cutie Gwen

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Sounds like someone can't wait for their week off.


Ah, so it is creative bankruptcy then. (or just the first idea) lol


Harada would not be able to handle directing Super Smash Bros. He'd probably end up deleteting his Facebook/Twitter account(s) if he became the director.
Bruh Harada would never delete it, instead he'll go "I'm going to blacklist every character suggestion I've gotten in the past 50 hours"
 

Schnee117

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Sakurai really did say it best huh
"People who don't want to listen, won't"

Bruh Harada would never delete it, instead he'll go "I'm going to blacklist every character suggestion I've gotten in the past 50 hours"
Finally, no more newcomers.
 

Cutie Gwen

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If the series is going in a direction that the fanbase is split on, that's still an identity crisis. Is what Smash is becoming really Smash, or something else? I don't think it's as clear cut as you put it. For a crossover that purports being about all gaming, we still get tons of Nintendo newcomers, and the argument could be made for several of the third party characters that they're honorary Nintendo characters. If the game itself doesn't go all in with a new direction, it's only natural that the audience doesn't either.

But even if we assume that Smash is no longer restricted to Nintendo, that there's no question about it, and that it's now just a gaming icons crossover. That means there's an even higher bar for characters. A character must be iconic to get in, and being iconic means that people must recognize you. Therefore, the logic goes that if I don't recognize a character, then it isn't iconic.

If you tell people a crossover is between iconic characters, the expectation is that they'll know the character, not that they will be learning new things.
Bro it's not an identity crisis on the game when the game still has a clear vision it wants to uphold, an actual example of a game with an identity crisis is **** like Chibi Robo where the devs have no clue what they're doing and hoping that their newest idea will be the one that sells billions.

This assumes the bar of 'Iconic Nintendo characters' ever existed when we get **** like Ness and Ice Climbers
 

osby

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If the series is going in a direction that the fanbase is split on, that's still an identity crisis. Is what Smash is becoming really Smash, or something else? I don't think it's as clear cut as you put it. For a crossover that purports being about all gaming, we still get tons of Nintendo newcomers, and the argument could be made for several of the third party characters that they're honorary Nintendo characters. If the game itself doesn't go all in with a new direction, it's only natural that the audience doesn't either.

But even if we assume that Smash is no longer restricted to Nintendo, that there's no question about it, and that it's now just a gaming icons crossover. That means there's an even higher bar for characters. A character must be iconic to get in, and being iconic means that people must recognize you. Therefore, the logic goes that if I don't recognize a character, then it isn't iconic.

If you tell people a crossover is between iconic characters, the expectation is that they'll know the character, not that they will be learning new things.
I don't see why Smash should only ever include the biggest franchises ever just because it's not Nintendo exclusive anymore. It's not really a realistic expectation to have and doesn't accomplish much aside from creating an excuse for purist fans to gatekeep characters they don't deem worthy.

Also, "iconic" isn't really an objective term as you make up to be. Let's be honest, a lot of characters iconic in their own circles can be unknown to a different demographic.
 
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SMAASH! Puppy

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...an actual example of a game with an identity crisis is **** like Chibi Robo where the devs have no clue what they're doing and hoping that their newest idea will be the one that sells billions.
Chibi-Robo deserved so much better than Nintendo making a cheap novelty game where Chibi-Robo can pop out of a roll of toilet paper, then testing the waters with a game that is absolutely nothing like the game that was actually praised and assuming people don't like the series. Why didn't they just port the first game onto the Wii?
 
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Shroob

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Well, that's another point I was getting at. How much knowledge does it take before people will finally respect your negative/neutral opinion of a DLC character?

A lot people have the mentality that if you've never actually played the game, then you have no right to complain about the character being in Smash. They'll respond to you in a way that suggests they think you haven't done enough research, and some will take it a step further and assume that the content in Smash is the only knowledge you have of the franchise and its characters.

There are a couple of characters in this pass that I had barely heard of prior to their announcement. Did a little bit of research, but I wasn't won over. I don't think my opinion that they should've chosen someone else is invalid, and I don't think it's fair for anyone to assume I'm picky or at fault for not forcing myself to show interest in playing a new game. New characters aren't always a positive experience for everyone, and that's something people will just have to respect.
Man, this line right here reminds me of another game that I still to this day see used as an argument to defend it.
 

GoodGrief741

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Bro it's not an identity crisis on the game when the game still has a clear vision it wants to uphold
Does it?
It's not really a realistic expectation to have and doesn't accomplish much aside from purist fans to gatekeep characters they don't deem worthy
Also, "iconic" isn't really an objective term as you make up to be. Let's be honest, a lot of characters iconic in their own circles can be unknown to a different demographic
Precisely! It isn't objective at all! Which is why you're going to have a lot of people with tons of different experiences and different definitions of the concept arguing over whether a character is or isn't worthy of being included. That's not something that can be solved with "lol just Google them". It's a deeper issue than that. If you tell somebody they have to Google a character, that just confirms to them that the character isn't iconic.
 

Scoliosis Jones

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Since this is something people can spend real money on and not just charity work, I don't necessarily agree.

If Nintendo reveals a product and we're not immediately sold on the idea, they should do everything in their power to win us over so we'll spend our money. That's how practically every single product we buy in stores is handled. Some products are easier to win people over than others, and that mostly depends on what the consumers want. If we're hesitant or unwilling to buy something, then that's not a sign that we're the ones that need to change. That's a sign that the business selling the product needs to either (1) step up their game and try harder to make it appealing, or (2) make different choices going forward that would lead to more sales.

In other words, if Nintendo didn't do enough to convince me and hundreds of other people to purchase Hero, Terry, or some other third character in the pass, it's not my job to pick up their slack and sell myself their own product, even if I'm fueled by a lack of interest or willful ignorance.
I'm not talking about Nintendo. What you've said is obvious, and I agree with you.

I'm talking about this forum we're on right now, and others like it. I can name particular times when I've presented an idea and people just passed it by, no effort made, and then the same folks later saying, "Yeah I think that's overrated/not happening". That's what I'm referring to, and it hasn't just happened to me.
 
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Al-kīmiyā'

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I'm not sure I agree. Is Smash going through an identity crisis? Or are fans expectations being subverted based on the direction the game itself is going?

I mean sure, fan interests are one thing. But Sakurai himself has referred to the game as the "biggest gaming crossover ever" the packaging and website describes it as "gaming icons clash".

If you ask me, that's the reality we are in. Smash has outgrown being simply a Nintendo crossover. Folks can love it or hate it, but that's the reality we're in. You can either continually resist and be frustrated that it doesn't fit the "ideal" image of what Smash is "supposed to be" (though, who are we to say what it should or shouldn't be?), or you can embrace the growing crossover element and embrace the exposure to gaming franchises that, to certain people, are previously unknown?

What's most ironic is that it seems the group steering Smash in the "gaming crossover" vision is none other than Nintendo themselves. Sure, it started with Sakurai planning to bring everybody together in this game, but Nintendo willingly continued with it.

I don't think it's the game having an identity crisis. I think it's the fanbase grappling with the direction the series has taken.
What if the next Smash game includes non-gaming characters? What if it includes extreme gore? What if it includes nudity? Would you so easily dismiss complaints about those changes?
 

Cutie Gwen

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Chibi-Robo deserved so much better than Nintendo making a cheap novelty game where Chibi-Robo can pop out of a roll of toilet paper, then testing the waters with a game that is absolutely nothing like the game that was actually praised and assuming people don't like the series. Why didn't they just port the first game onto the Wii?
Chibi Robo stands out so much to me because they changed the genre and what kind of game it was 3 goddamn times out of desperation
Does it?


Precisely! It isn't objective at all! Which is why you're going to have a lot of people with tons of different experiences and different definitions of the concept arguing over whether a character is or isn't worthy of being included. That's not something that can be solved with "lol just Google them". It's a deeper issue than that. If you tell somebody they have to Google a character, that just confirms to them that the character isn't iconic.
Yes, the only vision Smash seems to not grasp is the vision is Nintendo allstars, which let's be real, was NEVER true even in 64.


Well guys, sorry, I had to google who Link was back in 2008, the Zelda franchise isn't iconic, it sells worse than the niche **** that is my current avi too, RIP
 

Curious Villager

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I don't think it's so much as a series having an identity crisis as much as some design decisions or directions dividing a fanbase a little.
Its not so much something like what happened with Chibi Robo, then something with, say, the Wind Waker and its art direction. Although even then not as drastic as Smash going from a Nintendo Crossover to a general gaming crossover isn't anywhere near as controversial as the former was, just something that some fans might have some hangups with.

I think its more accurate to say that Smash is currently in a transitional period, where not getting a bunch of third parties that never touched a Nintendo console in their lives straight out of the gate, otherwise, we would have had a bunch of Sony, Microsoft and probably even some PC and Mobile gaming characters a long time ago.

Rather their just taking things slowly, we get our Clouds and Jokers once every blue moon while Nintendo fans still get their Nintendo characters and their Simon's and Banjo's along the way.

I don't think Smash will go all out with the whole general gaming crossover thing until maybe the next game I think, much like how Brawl gave us an initial taste of third parties in the first place with just Snake and Sonic.

But that's just my two cent's on that..
 
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Shroob

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What if the next Smash game includes non-gaming characters? What if it includes extreme gore? What if it includes nudity? Would you so easily dismiss complaints about those changes?
Big jump from:


Haha Joker Personaman in Smash


To

Barney the Dinosaur wearing a g-string coming out and stabbing Mario in the face
 
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