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Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

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Slime Master

Smash Ace
Joined
Jun 16, 2019
Messages
560
Location
Boingburg, SL
So when I was younger and only just started learning about the smash speculation scene (this would be after Brawl came out) I liked Geno as a character but when people brought him up as an option for smash I thought "why tho?". Meanwhile, while I didn't really know much about K. Rool, when people would mention the main villain of the DK series I would think "Yeah, that makes sense, why isn't he already in smash?". I don't know how common this sentiment was among smash fans who didn't pay attention to speculation, but if it was that common, that would be a big difference between K. Rool/Ridley and Geno/Isaac. Just something to think about I guess.
 

SNEKeater

Smash Master
Joined
Sep 4, 2019
Messages
3,375
I don't have any attachment to Geno, and it's true that sometimes some fans overestimate the chances of their fave character. I think it happens more with Geno because he's one of the characters with a larger fanbase, but it also happens with other characters.
Then, about his support, while I'm pretty much indifferent towards Geno, I think it has a good amount of merit that he still has a strong support after all these years, specially when he's a side character from one single game. I can see that.

At the same time, I don't think that supporting a character for a long time makes your request more valid or makes him a fighter in the same league of iconic and important characters such as Master Chief. I mean, if Geno gets in most people will react like they did with Banjo, but I think that's because they're characters with supporters who wanted them since years and that for many people they seemed impossible, not because they're videogame legends or something like that.

If Geno's in I'd okay with that and happy for his fans, I'm pretty sure he would be fun to play with. In my eyes I don't know how to feel about his chances, after Banjo I don't think he's impossible but I believe that he being in pass 2 depends a lot on which other characters we will get, if we don't get any character who could be considered a popular fan request, then I could see Nintendo picking him to cater these fans. If the pass already has 1-2 popular fan requests, then I'm not really sure Nintendo would approach Square for Geno, specially with the interesting library of characters and IPs they have besides Geno.
 

MisterMike

Smash Champion
Joined
Jul 22, 2019
Messages
2,252
Fountain of Dreams is one of my favourite stages. Crying shame it's not viable for competitive stages.
Look at the bright side, every stage is viable in Battlefield form! :p
... except for Garreg Mach Monastery Battlefield form.

You want wild? I'll give you wild



5/6 of these characters are playable in Smash
I legit miss Lanky Kong.

I know it's impolite to rain on someone's support parade, but christ is Geno support a bubble.

These guys are putting Geno up there with Dante, Crash, Sora, and Master chief like they're on the same level. Sure, he's a character with a legacy of support like Banjo -- which lends to his chances -- but Banjo was also one of the mascots of the N64, and one of the faces of late 90's gaming nostalgia, and not a side character with one appearance in a 25 year old spinoff game. I feel like the only reason people are still asking for Geno is because they've already been asking for him for 10 years.

I know 'attacking' the biggest support group on the site (and the mascot of the biggest name in smash speculation) comes off as aggressive, but I really need to know what this whole Geno thing is about. What about him is worth supporting him for 10 years, even as the goal posts get further and further away?
Geno's support basically boils down to the same things that every character is pushed for, the most common and most prominent of which being nostalgia. Maybe you grew up with the character or grew up playing their games, or maybe you had a bad day and playing their games made you feel better. Maybe you lived life with some sort of affliction, either physical or mental, and those games and/or the characters in those games made you feel better about yourself. You may find it silly, but I'm sure everyone's had that kind of experience.

There's also representation which, while seemingly not considered the most important thing to Sakurai and company, is often given by people as a reason for a certain character, or a certain type of character, should be in. Perhaps you think the roster has too many heroes or heroines, perhaps you think a certain franchise has been neglected for too long and could use a couple more characters, perhaps you think a game or series should be given a little bit more love, perhaps you feel that a certain type of character is too numerous and you think it should be balanced out with character who do something else, or maybe you have this innate desire to see percieved patterns filled. Either way you slice it, there's something you think Smash's roster is lacking, so you rally behind characters whose inclusion would fix that.

There's also their moveset potential. There's some sort of aspect about their design that would make them stand out compared to the other 70+ characters currently in the game, and as such you feel they'd be a great addition to the game. This can be anything, from a certain type of weapon they brandish to a specific kind of playstyle they'd most likely adopt, there's something mechanically that you feel they could bring to Smash that would enrich the gameplay.

Or perhaps you're like me, someone whose already long gotten all of the characters you've wanted for Smash, but still love the whole speculation thing, and so you elect to hang around and support characters who you feel have a shot and who might have a lot of things going for them in terms of rumors and circumstantial evidence.

TL;DR Think of why you like/support a character for Smash, and you'll understand.

Honestly it's kinda sad they dedicate so much time into it when they could do something more worthwhile.
That's pretty much everyone on this site though, if we're being honest. No reason for a bunch of 15-40 year-olds to hang around online ******** at eachother about which fictional character is going to become playable in this game.

I just hate that you can’t have a rational conversation if you even slightly suggest that Geno may not be as likely as they think or may come back as a Mii costume. Just about every argument devolves into using “well they COULD put him in” as evidence. Like don’t get me wrong, I’ve wanted Geno for years, but I don’t think he’s coming.
Funny, that's exactly what I tend to hear on the other side of the aisle. Every time some rumor or potential leak comes around that may mean good things for Geno, you always have people trying to disprove it by simply going "Well, it COULD be fake, though.".

For example, when the Mii Costume List came around (a list of names first shared back in mid/late July that included all of the Mii Costumes from Banjo's wave sans Sans, plus Chocobo, Mallow and Smithy), certain Wynn-esque people who shall remain nameless would often counter this by saying "Well, it COULD be fake, though.". And I agree, it's possible that this whole list could be fabricated. But given that it correctly called 4 costumes out of the 7 names listed, which we know due to it originally being posted back in mid/late july before the September Direct, it seems much more likely that it's legit.

This then leads those people to modify their argument into "Well okay, those costumes were legit, but the three that didn't get revealed were probably faked, though.", followed by their reasoning being "The guy who posted it probably threw in those fake names alongside the real names in order to troll Genobros, because he knew that they'd see the real ones get confirmed come September and think that those other three have to be legit.". And at that point the argument just sort of ends, because neither party can really prove anything either way anymore.

You can't entirely prove that it's real because, while it did get 4 out of the 7 names listed correct, there's not enough conclusive evidence to definitively claim that those last three names are real. But you can't entirely disprove it either, because while it's possible that it could've been faked, there's not enough evidence to definitively prove that's the case. Also, I question the likelihood of this being a troll job due to the sheer ridiculousness it suggests:

So a dude who leaks legit information decides one day, out of the blue, to troll Genobros. To do this he adds Chocobo, Mallow and Smithy to a list of legit names and privately passed it on to about 3-4 people on Discord, one of which being the ever-skeptical PapaGenos. He then waits for PapaGenos to reveal this list publicly around mid-October (which he knew would happen, apparently), which would in turn get Genobros to believe that Geno had a chance as a fighter since he wasn't with the names. He then waits until some time next year for the Geno costume to come back alongside who the hell ever, at which point most people will have forgotten about him and his list, and has a nice, hearty laugh at their expense when it turns out that Geno is costume'd again or simply doesn't appear.

And speaking about Geno being costume'd, I just have to ask: How exactly is coming into a character support thread and telling people that the character they most want is going to be relegated to a Mii Costume NOT at the very least a **** move? If someone came into your thread and told you that your most wanted character, a character who you think legit has a shot, would probably only be coming as a cosmetic for another character, wouldn't you be a little peeved by that? It's like someone coming into your house and critiquing your home decor. Are they actively trying to be assholes about it? Most likely not. Do they have a point? Perhaps. But is it rude? Most definitely.
 

PeridotGX

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 8, 2017
Messages
9,028
Location
That Distant Shore
NNID
Denoma5280
I'm not a fan of Geno, and his supporters can be a bit annoying at times. I don't have a problem with them though, and I find the haters to be even more annoying. The Geno fans, with all their crazy theories and blind following of uncredible leakers, at least are doing it out of positivity. On the other hand, there's a thread (or series of threads) on Gamefaqs that serve only to mock the Geno thread here on Smashboards. Why spend all that time on negativity?
 

Michael the Spikester

Smash Obsessed
Joined
Aug 31, 2018
Messages
29,662
Location
Canada
Switch FC
SW-0818-8347-0203
At this rate as much as I'd hate to say it to Geno fans I think he's getting the Mii costume treatment again.

Geno's demand has been always a bit overblown. I've always considered:ultbanjokazooie::ultkrool:and:ultridley:to be the Holy Trinity and now its complete. Yes there's Sakurai mentioning him for Brawl but for all we know he could have changed his mind since like how Dixie almost got in as an tag team with Diddy.
 
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Diddy Kong

Smash Obsessed
Joined
Dec 8, 2004
Messages
26,329
Switch FC
SW-1597-979602774
The Doom series has zero presence in Japan, it's a losing battle to get Doomguy in Smash Bros. At most he'll be a Spirit or Mii Costume, not paid DLC since that has to appeal to the Japanese audience.
This. I don't see why a Doom character is so often requested for Smash. The two franchises have nothing in common at all.
 

wynn728

Banned via Warnings
Joined
Jan 14, 2019
Messages
1,380
Not every character was gonna be playable regardless. I’d rather see Shadow and Bomberman as Assist Trophies than not at all. And Mii costumes are a great way to pay homage to characters that couldn’t make it in as playable. One of my buddies is a Nakoruru main in SamSho, do you really think he was upset that Terry was playable and Nakoruru wasn’t? Of course not, because Terry was always going to be playable first. Getting Nakoruru in a “playable” form was icing on the cake. And my uncle, who’s super into Warframe, do you think he was upset that Warframe got a spirit rather than a character? No, because he never expected it to get anything at all. And despite what you might think, Sakurai doesn’t equate everything to playable—if he did, Chrom and Dark Samus wouldn’t be playable now.

There’s more to Smash than being playable, Wynn. Hopefully one day you can see that—I think you’d appreciate the game a lot more.
It's a video game, the main appeal is actually playing the game, not watching an NPC randomly appear for 15 seconds when the game allows for it to happen or looking at a PNG. Yeah not everyone can be playable but "something" they try to implement is so much nothing that it would've been best that they didn't bother making it, that way they're not over worked. Who gives a crap you can see a picture of a character in a specific part of the menu, you got Google Image for that. Who would be upset if they couldn't see Bomberman move around for 15 seconds in a 1 in 59 random chance, nobody especially seeing how disappointed people were when he was first revealed.

A lot of times nothing is better than something. I rather never see a single character I like in Smash Bros being represented than see them as a bootleg costume, an NPC in a fighting game, or as a PNG that I can find online. I like to play the game, not just watch it.
 

RoboFist

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 10, 2018
Messages
374
Bold of you to assume that casual fans know or care about who is and isn't an Assist Trophy.
Good lord, this is why I hate Smash speculation bubble fanatics. Casual fans don't know what ATs are? Seriously? What world do you live in?

Y'all take this nonsense way too seriously and this environment of self-entitlement takes all the fun out of speculating. It's toxic as hell and only sets everyone up for disappointment and anger.

Screw this place, I'm leaving out.
 

Evil Trapezium

Smash Master
Joined
May 16, 2019
Messages
3,291
NNID
GuyManRunnin
Switch FC
SW-2246-2414-0334
This. I don't see why a Doom character is so often requested for Smash. The two franchises have nothing in common at all.
First of all, what do you mean by "The two franchises have nothing in common at all"?
Secondly, why is that a problem?

People want Doom Guy because he's cool, has the distinction of being the grandfather of First Person Shooters and has a healthy presence on Nintendo consoles.
 
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D

Deleted member

Guest
I'm not a fan of Geno, and his supporters can be a bit annoying at times. I don't have a problem with them though, and I find the haters to be even more annoying. The Geno fans, with all their crazy theories and blind following of uncredible leakers, at least are doing it out of positivity.
Not true. They're positive... as long as it doesn't come at the expense of their character. Back before Hero was revealed, the thread actively trashed Dragon Quest at least every other day. And I get it, they'd rather have Geno over Dragon Quest when it came to Square Enix. Didn't help if you were a Dragon Quest fan and had to deal with a bunch of people immediately dismissing the series for a number of arbitrary reasons and had to deal with a bunch of "fake fan" arguments. I tried to be a Geno supporter, even played Super Mario RPG, but damn they were anything but positive--and now they're just surrounded by drama frequently.

There are exceptional supporters I've met who are just cool people, but the Smashboards Geno thread is overall not a positive or interesting environment by any means. Never has been from my experience.
 
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P.Kat

Smash Champion
Joined
Jul 13, 2016
Messages
2,066
Location
Skypeia
It's funny, there is one character on Smash's roster that is equivalent to Geno's status...


Think about it, they both

  • had only appeared in really only one game
  • were not the main character of said game, like Shulk or Lucas or whatever
  • have a whole unique moveset, and don't have the excuse of being an echo fighter like Dark Pit
But the one big distinction between them, and it's a pretty big one, is the fact that Sheik is really just the alter ego of Zelda. She got into Smash as an extension of the latter's moveset, and was kept around even after transformations were cut because she was already grandfathered in.
Still one of my favorite characters from since Melee. I hope she stay in the next Smash game, if it comes
 

GoodGrief741

Smash Legend
Joined
Sep 22, 2012
Messages
10,169
This. I don't see why a Doom character is so often requested for Smash. The two franchises have nothing in common at all.
You don't understand why Western fans want Doom in Smash because it's not popular in Japan? People can want characters despite their perceived likelihood.
Good lord, this is why I hate Smash speculation bubble fanatics. Casual fans don't know what ATs are? Seriously? What world do you live in?

Y'all take this nonsense way too seriously and this environment of self-entitlement takes all the fun out of speculating. It's toxic as hell and only sets everyone up for disappointment and anger.

Screw this place, I'm leaving out.
Uhh, I never said that casual fans don't know what an AT is, just that they might not have memorized the list of characters who are because they might not care. That's self-entitled and toxic?
 

Cosmic77

Smash Hero
Joined
Dec 17, 2017
Messages
9,547
Location
On a planet far far away...
Switch FC
2166-0541-5238
I feel like the sanity of the Geno fanbase further deteriorates each time a character is revealed and it's not him. It wasn't nearly this bad in the base game, and I remember the Geno thread at least being somewhat supportive for non-Geno newcomers. Now it's gotten out of hand. The thread gets locked more frequently too because of how toxic the arguements can get.

I know it's not fair to lump everyone together with the Geno thread, but I swear, there has been a negative reaction to every DLC character thus far, Banjo included.
 
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Will

apustaja
Joined
Jan 18, 2014
Messages
33,961
Location
hell
Switch FC
SW-7573-2962-2407
Not true. They're positive... as long as it doesn't come at the expense of their character. Back before Hero was revealed, the thread actively trashed Dragon Quest at least every other day. And I get it, they'd rather have Geno over Dragon Quest when it came to Square Enix. Didn't help if you were a Dragon Quest fan and had to deal with a bunch of people immediately dismissing the series for a number of arbitrary reasons and had to deal with a bunch of "fake fan" arguments. I tried to be a Geno supporter, even played Super Mario RPG, but damn they were anything but positive--and now they're just surrounded by drama frequently.

There are exceptional supporters I've met who are just cool people, but the Smashboards Geno thread is overall not a positive or interesting environment by any means. Never has been from my experience.
Doesn't help that they're the cesspool of any leaker drama, including the infamous obeseguyonfrozenwater

As the OP of the Waluigi Support thread, I'm hoping Waluigi doesn't become a textleak staple name, I will die on a hill before I let my baby become something like the Geno support thread. Nothing wrong with chubbymaleon32degreesliquid being there, he's a very supportive guy and is the only guy I know frequently posting there, he just tends to bring a negative audience whenever he claims to have information. Thankfully, he only poses theories.

Not sure how else to emphasize that I'm not expressing hatred, but just know that I just don't want Waluigi to become the next Geno.
 
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Evil Trapezium

Smash Master
Joined
May 16, 2019
Messages
3,291
NNID
GuyManRunnin
Switch FC
SW-2246-2414-0334
The Geno thread is fine for the most part but people outside the fanbase keep coming in and antagonising them so is there any wonder why it gets so toxic in there? Every time I enter the thread, I just see another person coming in, asking why Geno is even popular and using it as an ulterior motive to keep annoying the fans. Then the thread gets locked because they won't go away and then time is wasted waiting for it to go back up. It's a vicious cycle.

Other than that, maybe some of them might get overly dramatic and may get overly attached to some leaks but from my experience, they're a friendly bunch. Granted I've never really experienced those who attack other support threads but I've never seen any attack Banjo & Kazooie when he was still in speculation.
 

Heoj

Smash Ace
Joined
Oct 26, 2018
Messages
545
i feel its a bit silly to actively call a whole fanbase toxic, like i hear people talk about how "the geno fanbase is X" or "the Sora fanbase is Y" all the damn time and none of it makes any sense at all. Fact is, there will always be a number of toxic people supporting different characters but you cant just see like 5 people who support a specific character and then just label the whole fanbase as the same.
Geno may be a side character ignored for many years but the fact hes still being talked about to this day definitely means something.
 

zeldasmash

Smash Lord
Joined
Jan 26, 2010
Messages
1,994
Location
Puerto Rico
This. I don't see why a Doom character is so often requested for Smash. The two franchises have nothing in common at all.
DOOM has a good presence on Nintendo consoles (the Switch essentially has or is going to have every mainline DOOM game) and is one of the most important franchises in gaming due to essentially pioneering and laying the groundwork or bedrock for the first-person shooter genre. You have a favorite FPS genre? It likely wouldn't exist without DOOM. That includes games like GoldenEye 007 or massive franchises like Halo. There is a reason why it's looked upon favorably as a request. That and Doomguy is a badass character that would be awesome to see in a game like Smash alongside people like Mario, Samus and Snake.

And....why is having nothing in common with Smash a problem? 95% of the franchises represented in Smash have very little in common with Smash's style with only Mario and Kirby being exceptions and Fatal Fury being a big inspiration for Sakurai.
 

TheCJBrine

Smash Legend
Joined
Jul 28, 2013
Messages
12,142
Location
New World, Minecraft
The Geno thread is good. People may be negative towards certain characters and maybe sometimes a bit rude, but the opinions are understandable as long as no one is trying to say things as fact; sometimes people can get a bit more negative than usual but it’s not much different from this thread and others. The problem is people will act like trolls sometimes going in there just to crap on the fans, claim he will be a Mii costume and then get defensive when people argue with them like it’s so confusing why, or ask why people like Geno and then keep asking, playing dumb or being rude when people tell them why.

Yes people theorize stuff or consider leaks in there, but the two leaks we have are understandably being kept in mind (I keep them in mind too) and the theories have some logic in them and aren’t treated as fact anyway, just fun ideas and whatever. Most talk is normal, friendly discussion and long arguments usually only start if a disagreement is had on a character or something or if someone who doesn’t usually partake or lurk in the thread argues with a particular theory or something by putting it down and being a bit rude to who posted it.
 

King Sonnn DeDeDoo

Smash Champion
Joined
May 4, 2014
Messages
2,649
Location
The basement of the Alamo
Been playing Yakuza 0 recently (seriously guys buy it, it's 5$ on Steam right now), so I decided to make a Spirit board for the Yakuza series if Kiryu got in Smash.
Kazuma Kiryu (Fighter Spirit)



Goro Majima
Fighter: :ultwolf: (Orange alt)
Type: Balanced
Rank: ★★★
Stage: Kamurocho
Battle Conditions: 1. Baseball bats appear in large quantities.
2. The Enemy is very fast and can't stop quickly.
3. The enemy can unleash powerful critical hits at random.


Goro Majima (Mad Dog)
Enhanced Spirit
Type: Balanced
★★★★


Taiga Saejima
Fighter: :ultincineroar: (white alt.)
Type: Grappler
Rank: ★★★★
Stage: Kamurocho
Battle Conditions: 1. The enemy has super armor and is hard to launch or make flinch
2. The enemy favors throws


Shun Akiyama
Fighter: :ultfalco: (Red Alt.)
Type: Defense
Rank: ★★★
Stage: Kamurocho
Battle Conditions: 1. The Enemy favors aerial attacks
2. The enemies' kicks have increased power.



Haruka Sawamura
Fighter: :ultisabelle: (Grey alt)
Type: Defnese
Rank: ★
Stage: Tomodachi Life
Battle Conditions: 1. The enemy avoids conflict.
2. Reinforcement (Kiryu) will appear during the battle.



Haruka Sawamura (Adult)
Enchanced Spirit
Type: Defnese
Rank: ★★★


Ichiban Kasuga
Fighter: :ulthero: (Erdrick alt)/ If Hero DLC not purchased:ultswordfighter: (Business suit)
Type: Attack
Rank: ★★
Stage: Yggdrasil altar/ Find Mii if Hero DLC is not purchased
Battle Conditions: 1. Take your strongest team into this no-frills battle!



Akira Nishikiyama
Fighter: :ultken: (white alt)
Type: Balanced
Rank: ★★★
Stage: Prism Tower (Top of tower portion)
Battle Conditions: 1. Stamina Battle
2. Bob-ombs will rain from the sky



Daigo Dojima
Fighter: :ultdoc: (Black Alt)
Type: Support
Rank: ★★
Stage: Kamurocho
Battle Conditions: 1. Defeat an army of fighters (:ultbrawler:)



Ryuji Goda
Fighter: :ultganondorf: (Brown alt)
Type: Attack
Rank: ★★★
Stage: Kamurocho
Battle Conditions: 1. The enemy's melee weapons have increased power.
2.The enemy starts the battle with an enhanced Killing Edge item.



Makoto Makimura
Fighter: :ultpeach:
Type: Support
Rank: ★
Stage: Kamurocho
Battle Conditions: 1. The stage is covered in fog.
2. Reinforcement (:ultwolf:) will appear during the battle.

 
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Evil Trapezium

Smash Master
Joined
May 16, 2019
Messages
3,291
NNID
GuyManRunnin
Switch FC
SW-2246-2414-0334
Been playing Yakuza 0 recently (seriously guys buy it, it's 5$ on Steam right now), so I decided to make a Spirit board for the Yakuza series if Kiryu got in Smash.
Kazuma Kiryu (Fighter Spirit)



Goro Majima
Fighter: :ultwolf: (Orange alt)
Type: Balanced
Rank: ★★★
Stage: Kamurocho
Battle Conditions: 1. Baseball bats appear in large quantities.
2. The Enemy is very fast and can't stop quickly.
3. The enemy can unleash powerful critical hits at random.


Goro Majima (Mad Dog)
Enhanced Spirit
Type: Balanced
★★★★


Taiga Saejima
Fighter: :ultincineroar: (white alt.)
Type: Grappler
Rank: ★★★★
Stage: Kamurocho
Battle Conditions: 1. The enemy has super armor and is hard to launch or make flinch
2. The enemy favors throws


Shun Akiyama
Fighter: :ultfalco: (Red Alt.)
Type: Defense
Rank: ★★★
Stage: Kamurocho
Battle Conditions: 1. The Enemy favors aerial attacks
2. The enemies' kicks have increased power.



Haruka Sawamura
Fighter: :ultisabelle: (Grey alt)
Type: Support
Rank: ★
Stage: Tomodachi Life
Battle Conditions: 1. The enemy avoids conflict.
2. Reinforcement (Kiryu) will appear during the battle.



Haruka Sawamura (Adult)
Enchanced Spirit
Type: Support
Rank: ★★★


Ichiban Kasuga
Fighter: :ulthero: (Erdrick alt)/ If Hero DLC not purchased:ultswordfighter: (Business suit)
Type: Attack
Rank: ★★
Stage: Yggdrasil altar/ Find Mii if Hero DLC is not purchased
Battle Conditions: 1. Take your strongest team into this no-frills battle!



Akira Nishikiyama
Fighter: :ultken: (white alt)
Type: Balanced
Rank: ★★★
Stage: Prism Tower (Top of tower portion)
Battle Conditions: 1. Stamina Battle
2. Bob-ombs will rain from the sky



Daigo Dojima
Fighter: :ultdoc: (Black Alt)
Type: Support
Rank: ★★
Stage: Kamurocho
Battle Conditions: 1. Defeat an army of fighters (:ultbrawler:)



Ryuji Goda
Fighter: :ultganondorf: (Brown alt)
Type: Attack
Rank: ★★★
Stage: Kamurocho
Battle Conditions: 1. The enemy's melee weapons have increased power.
2.The enemy starts the battle with an enhanced Killing Edge item.



Makoto Makimura
Fighter: :ultpeach:
Type: Support
Rank: ★
Stage: Kamurocho
Battle Conditions: 1. The stage is covered in fog.
2. Reinforcement (:ultwolf:) will appear during the battle.

If Haruka Sawamura is enhanceable, she would be the first enhanced support spirit.
 

3BitSaurus

Smash Master
Joined
May 6, 2019
Messages
4,298
Location
Nowhere (no, not the Islands)
Been playing Yakuza 0 recently (seriously guys buy it, it's 5$ on Steam right now), so I decided to make a Spirit board for the Yakuza series if Kiryu got in Smash.
Kazuma Kiryu (Fighter Spirit)

Goro Majima
Fighter: :ultwolf: (Orange alt)
Type: Balanced
Rank: ★★★
Stage: Kamurocho
Battle Conditions: 1. Baseball bats appear in large quantities.
2. The Enemy is very fast and can't stop quickly.
3. The enemy can unleash powerful critical hits at random.


Goro Majima (Mad Dog)
Enhanced Spirit
Type: Balanced
★★★★


Taiga Saejima
Fighter: :ultincineroar: (white alt.)
Type: Grappler
Rank: ★★★★
Stage: Kamurocho
Battle Conditions: 1. The enemy has super armor and is hard to launch or make flinch
2. The enemy favors throws


Shun Akiyama
Fighter: :ultfalco: (Red Alt.)
Type: Defense
Rank: ★★★
Stage: Kamurocho
Battle Conditions: 1. The Enemy favors aerial attacks
2. The enemies' kicks have increased power.



Haruka Sawamura
Fighter: :ultisabelle: (Grey alt)
Type: Support
Rank: ★
Stage: Tomodachi Life
Battle Conditions: 1. The enemy avoids conflict.
2. Reinforcement (Kiryu) will appear during the battle.



Haruka Sawamura (Adult)
Enchanced Spirit
Type: Support
Rank: ★★★


Ichiban Kasuga
Fighter: :ulthero: (Erdrick alt)/ If Hero DLC not purchased:ultswordfighter: (Business suit)
Type: Attack
Rank: ★★
Stage: Yggdrasil altar/ Find Mii if Hero DLC is not purchased
Battle Conditions: 1. Take your strongest team into this no-frills battle!



Akira Nishikiyama
Fighter: :ultken: (white alt)
Type: Balanced
Rank: ★★★
Stage: Prism Tower (Top of tower portion)
Battle Conditions: 1. Stamina Battle
2. Bob-ombs will rain from the sky


Daigo Dojima
Fighter: :ultdoc: (Black Alt)
Type: Support
Rank: ★★
Stage: Kamurocho
Battle Conditions: 1. Defeat an army of fighters (:ultbrawler:)



Ryuji Goda
Fighter: :ultganondorf: (Brown alt)
Type: Attack
Rank: ★★★
Stage: Kamurocho
Battle Conditions: 1. The enemy's melee weapons have increased power.
2.The enemy starts the battle with an enhanced Killing Edge item.



Makoto Makimura
Fighter: :ultpeach:
Type: Support
Rank: ★
Stage: Kamurocho
Battle Conditions: 1. The stage is covered in fog.
2. Reinforcement (:ultwolf:) will appear during the battle.
(Removed images for convenience)

These are some pretty good battles! I just hope "For Who's Sake" comes with Kiryu if he makes it in. I know Yakuza has a lot of cool songs, but that's no doubt the one I'd care about the most.

Also, having a trailer segment where it's just him throwing Wario's bike at someone is a must.
 

N3ON

Gone Exploring
BRoomer
Joined
Jan 6, 2008
Messages
21,444
Location
Vancouver
One of the big differences between the Geno fanbase and other fanbases which in the past became unwieldy and problematic, such as the Ridley thread last time, was the structure of the staff management was that so the mods could actually do more to mitigate the problems.

Now when problems arise, the best that happens is a band-aid gets put on it for a short period instead of addressing the factors that necessitate the intervention in the first place.

That’s not to shift blame away from the thread itself - I mean it is the only one this cycle that has required such a (wanting) degree of oversight. The thread really only remains on the track so long as there’s no blood in the water, otherwise it becomes a feeding frenzy.

It’s just that the current situation is owing as much to systematic negligence (imo) as the tribalism and mercurial nature of the mob itself.
 

Rangez

Dimensional Dile-Up
Joined
Feb 26, 2019
Messages
2,481
Not true. They're positive... as long as it doesn't come at the expense of their character. Back before Hero was revealed, the thread actively trashed Dragon Quest at least every other day. And I get it, they'd rather have Geno over Dragon Quest when it came to Square Enix. Didn't help if you were a Dragon Quest fan and had to deal with a bunch of people immediately dismissing the series for a number of arbitrary reasons and had to deal with a bunch of "fake fan" arguments. I tried to be a Geno supporter, even played Super Mario RPG, but damn they were anything but positive--and now they're just surrounded by drama frequently.

There are exceptional supporters I've met who are just cool people, but the Smashboards Geno thread is overall not a positive or interesting environment by any means. Never has been from my experience.
I remember back then with the SNK leak being popular in discussion, a lot of them were not taking the situation too kindly. There was even a point where an argument broke out about Terry being viewed as a "stereotype".
 
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MisterMike

Smash Champion
Joined
Jul 22, 2019
Messages
2,252
I feel like the sanity of the Geno fanbase further deteriorates each time a character is revealed and it's not him.
That's not exactly exclusive to the Geno Thread, though. This news drought we've been in since September has taken it's toll on just about everyone, on every website. The only difference is that the Geno Thread is the biggest and most active character thread on this website, and thus people are more likely to make their frustrations known there rather than just posting it on twitter. This means that you're more likely to hear about Genobros getting ansty about it than any other thread.

It wasn't nearly this bad in the base game, and I remember the Geno thread at least being somewhat supportive for non-Geno newcomers.
Again, that's not exclusive to the Geno Thread. Every single fanbase is all kinds and charitable before the full roster is revealed because, while we have no idea who's going to make it in, everyone genuine believes that their character, at the very least, will get in. "This game will be different!", they tell themselves. "Our character is surely going to get in this time!". But when the final base game roster is revealed and the DLC season begins, that feeling of "anything is possible" begins to evaporate and pleasantries are discarded, because it's do or die time, and everyone believes their character is going to win.

The less popular characters wane in popularity and are forgotten, because it becomes crystal clear that they most likely aren't coming, and the most popular ones stick around, with their supporters clawing at whatever rumors, "leaks" and speculation they can get that helps their case. People begin erecting all sorts of rules and stipulations that allow them to bolster their own choices while denegrating the choices of others, and battle lines are drawn. Certain fandoms become the subject of scorn and ridicule.

"Those guys are so annoying about their character!", despite them typically keeping to their own threads.
"Those guys are toxic assholes!", despite said toxicity being a vocal minority.
"Those guys aren't friendly to others!", despite others not being friendly or understanding in turn.

You complain about Genobros not being supportive of other characters, as you and many others in this thread complain about Geno and those who support him. You try and act as though you're so much more compassionate and understanding when it comes to character discussion, yet you feel fine in discarding certain characters the collective thread deems it okay to despise. You all like to act as though you're somehow different from everyone else, when in reality you're exactly the same as them, only from a different perspective, a different team.

I should stress that there's nothing wrong with not liking a character, that's not at all the point I'm trying to make here. I'm just sick of the double standards that go on here. You're not above any other thread. Your thread, your users, can be just as bad as any other threads or users on this website. Just because it isn't happening right now, doesn't mean it won't happen or hasn't happened. If memory serves, weren't there previous Newcomer Threads that had to be shut down and locked due to constant infighting?

Now it's gotten out of hand. The thread gets locked more frequently too because of how toxic the arguements can get.
Yeah, that's only because people keep picking fights with Fatman in there rather than taking it to DMs, and Fatman keeps going full not smart and does a heated kid in boiling water moment. Can't blame that on the whole thread.

I remember back then with the SNK leak being popular in discussion, a lot of them were not taking the situation too kindly. There was even a point where an argument broke out about Terry being viewed as a "stereotype".
Really? I don't really remember that happening. If anything, I remember people being very much in line with most people when it came to Terry: Not very enthused, but overall not too torn up about it. Then again, I have a sort of wonky memory sometimes.
 

Mamboo07

Smash Hero
Joined
Mar 23, 2019
Messages
9,552
Location
Agartha, Hollow Earth
A lot of fake leaks and other hints featuring the same characters can delude our fanbase into thinking a character is a lock.
Examples: KOS-MOS, Geno, Hayabusa and Doom Slayer
 

DarthEnderX

Smash Hero
Joined
Nov 10, 2014
Messages
8,421
The fact that OoT is a far more iconic game with bigger cultural impact than Super Mario RPG probably also helped.
Well, that and the fact that Sheik is, ya know, Zelda.

I'm sure if Geno was actually Peach in a little wooden suit instead of some proto-Luma, he'd be in Smash already.

Shadow being an assist trophy is the one decision for this game that truly bums me out.
It's, frankly, baffling.
 
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Koopaul

Smash Champion
Joined
Oct 29, 2013
Messages
2,336
Good lord, this is why I hate Smash speculation bubble fanatics. Casual fans don't know what ATs are? Seriously? What world do you live in?

Y'all take this nonsense way too seriously and this environment of self-entitlement takes all the fun out of speculating. It's toxic as hell and only sets everyone up for disappointment and anger.

Screw this place, I'm leaving out.
Sheesh calm down. What did he say that was so bad? I'm going to tell you that almost any and every time people who aren't excessive Nintendo fans decide to play with Assist Trophies, almost none of them know or care what wacky thing pops out of it.

Here are some of my favorite quotes from experience.

"Ah shoot I got this useless star thing!"

"Did I just kill you?"
"Nah. It was those floating pink balls that got me."

"Where did these numbers come from?"
"Oh I think it might be an Assist?"
"Weird."

They don't care.
 
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pinshadow

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 29, 2019
Messages
1,479
Well, that and the fact that Sheik is, ya know, Zelda.

I'm sure if Geno was actually Peach in a little wooden suit instead of some proto-Luma, he'd be in Smash already.
That's implying that reason Sheik is here isn't just because Sakurai thought the transforming gimmick fit well with Zelda and Sheik. Seriously, Sheik does literally nothing in OoT other than teach you songs and gets chucked by Bongo Bongo once. Her entire moveset is completely made up save for the teleporting I guess. Literally the only reason people tolerate Sheik is because she was in Melee. If Zelda was just herself in Melee it's not like Sheik would suddenly be this highly requested character, most of the other potential Zelda reps would easily still be more popular than her.
 
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Cosmic77

Smash Hero
Joined
Dec 17, 2017
Messages
9,547
Location
On a planet far far away...
Switch FC
2166-0541-5238
Sheik is a beneficiary of circumstance, just like Squirtle and Ivysaur. None of these characters probably would've gotten in Smash without a transformation gimmick.
 

Proceleon

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 22, 2015
Messages
463
Location
Yoshi's Island
NNID
Proceleon
3DS FC
2423-2553-2839
Switch FC
SW-6226-7752-8603
A really sadistic part of me wants Geno to be revealed as an Assist just to see the meltdown that would follow.
 

andree123

Smash Ace
Joined
Dec 18, 2016
Messages
752
Fighters Pass Vol. 1 builds
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1234737098617323520
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1234312602508918786
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1231413472203661312
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1230326362495275008
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1227427241031684096
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1226702491229683713
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1226340072821153792
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1224165722412072961
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1223441239908859905
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1223080757209391105
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1222717981282586624
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1222353927028396033
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1221991632649646081
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1220179486219485185
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1219454707929739264
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1219093056206458881
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1212932414193856513
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1210398287544471552
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1210396156049518592

P.plant builds
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1236125240314302464
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1224890568888573952
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1218729920228032518

Unknown builds (they could be made before fighters pass 1 was in developement, around the development of Fighters Pass Vol. 1, or after the completion of Fighters Pass Vol. 1)
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1235762078217932800
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1235399787471462401
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1235037385685008384
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1234675001699131392
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1233587718891823105
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1233225705615327237
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1232138487752617984
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1231776065380466688
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1231051100670660609
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1230689532154015744
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1229963984998060032
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1229601563695468544
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1229239427974619136
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1228876852778786816
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1228514455039819776
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1228152078855364610
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1227789628800790528
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1227064842999062528
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1225978238939222018
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1225615318220886016
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1225253092121182208
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1224528183862513664
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1223803288581066753
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1221629753192415232
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1221266927147839489
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1220904235698511873
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1220541858310307841
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1219817104519548929
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1218367457783533568
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1218005469320470528
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1217643095442935809
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1217280650127872002
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1216918386640207872
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1216555613389352961
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1216193755763494913
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1215831152881045504
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1215106175705833473
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1214743632449638401
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1214381603624894471
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1214019103402254337
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1213657035713069058
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1213295370219876352
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1212584976530604033
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1212208485242245120
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1211845285875351552
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1211491258465546240
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1211147684452519936
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1210777911361302534
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1233950143554023425

Earliest builds
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1232863657484177411
https://twitter.com/Sora_Sakurai/status/1232500719527137283 (The only screenshot that was confirmed by Sakurai to be a early build of the game)
 

Evil Trapezium

Smash Master
Joined
May 16, 2019
Messages
3,291
NNID
GuyManRunnin
Switch FC
SW-2246-2414-0334
I think we spend a lot of unnecessary time worrying about what casual players think because we think Nintendo and Sakurai mainly caters to them. I don't think Super Smash Bros is as mainstream as we think it is. Sure it's one of Nintendo's highest selling games, no doubt about that but I'm talking about Grand Theft Auto, Fortnite or Minecraft levels of Mainstream. That's the way I see people talking about Smash Bros in regards to casual players.

Terms like the "Smash bubble" always confused me like the main buyers of Smash DLC are most likely Smash fans anyway and even if there are casual players buying DLC. At that point, they're just as much smash bros fans as we are since they'd become invested in the game too. Not in the same way that like they've been playing since the first on the Nintendo 64 or desperately wanting characters so much they'll look into leaks but in the same way that we buy the DLC for the game to expand the roster.

I don't know it just seems we bring up casual players like it's an obstacle when it's really a non-issue.
 

Knight Dude

Keeping it going.
Joined
Mar 10, 2013
Messages
21,368
Location
The States
NNID
Kaine-Rodgers
3DS FC
0232-7749-6030
idk if DLC Assists have ever been a thing though...
They haven't been. If they were, you could've probably expected someone like Ryuji or Ann for Joker, or Geese with Terry's DLC, or One of those House leaders with Byleth.

Of course, if the new DLC promised a new AT with each pack, that's a different story, but I don't think that'd happen personally.
 

cosmicB

Smash Ace
Joined
Nov 28, 2019
Messages
657
I consider the "Smash bubble" to be people that are constantly plugged into Smash news online, which will always represent a fraction of the actual playerbase for massive games like this. The people even mildly active in the speculation scene across all social media likely doesn't even reach half a million, and that's being generous. By this point, Smash Ultimate should be at 18 million sales, meaning 500k wouldn't even represent 3% of the playerbase. It's a big bubble, but a bubble nonetheless.

The question is what percentage of that bubble is buying/paying attention to the DLC. I would assume more than half of that 18 million had no intention of spending more money once they already had the game, but that doesn't mean the always online smash bubble is where the bulk of the DLC sales are coming from. It's unfortunately impossible to know without Nintendo releasing the numbers.
 
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