Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Daedulus]

Veteran: (she can actually move fast!)

lol, my friend found out that she moved as slow as boswer in smash 4.

 

[FlawedAI]

lol, my friend found out that she moved as slow as boswer in smash 4.

That's an upgrade for Robin, anyway. Bowser in 4 is pretty fast, so I'll gladly take it.

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

https://www.gameinformer.com/interv...lant-spirits-and-20-years-of-super-smash-bros

While every character in Super Smash Bros. history is in this game, several new characters have also been added. What is the process of deciding new characters to add to the roster?
It is a project after all, so we take into consideration things like labor, man-hours, the time in which the title will be sold. We decide on the fighters from the very early planning stage, and from there, we calculate and begin production. We don’t add or remove any characters during the project.
We do things like base our consideration on the results of the Smash ballot, and also balance things out so that there’s a difference in the types of fighters.
By the way, as for Incineroar, during our planning stage we knew that a new Pokémon game was coming, so we intentionally kept one spot open for that, and we decided which character to create once we received more info on the title.
...
The Super Smash Bros. series has always spawned much fan speculation for characters that will be included, but with Piranha Plant, you have given players one of the most unpredictable inclusions. How does it feel to be able to still surprise fans even so many years later? What that one of the intents of the inclusion of this character?
I’m actually not paying too much focus on the surprise element when we introduce a new fighter. The surprise element quickly fades once the announcement has been made.
Rather, I believe it’s important to have a good balance as a game. In the past titles in the series, Mr. Game & Watch, R.O.B. and Duck Hunt Dog were some of the examples we offered outside of people’s typical expectations. However, if we don’t have these types of fighters, and we only had typical “hero/heroine” type fighters in the lineup, there’s not much difference. It’s probably not very interesting. Correct?
Also, unlike some main characters from some (not widely known) franchises, Piranha Plant is a character everyone knows well. And, I want to make sure to remind everyone that it is a limited-time offer fighter everyone can get for free as an early-purchase bonus.

 

[Midoriki]

https://www.gameinformer.com/interv...lant-spirits-and-20-years-of-super-smash-bros

Nice information, thank you for sharing this!

I'm curious how similar the process was for picking the DLC characters. I'd guess its mostly the same, only with Nintendo providing the list of characters that then get turned into the project plan.

Of course if the list Nintendo provided was fairly short then Sakurai's criteria have less impact, and if they gave a prioritized list and said something like "make as many of these as you can in this order" then the final choices might have been heavily based on a character's ability to make Nintendo $$$

I'm also curious if Piranha Plant was part of the "selection made by Nintendo" or not. As Sakurai points out "Piranha Plant is a character everyone knows well" so its quite possible Nintendo thought they would sell well enough to select them as a potential DLC character.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

What do y'all want for dlc (no predictions)

• I would like to see a Rhythm Heaven character that accurately represents the entire series. I don't believe the Chorus Kids can do this and would rather have either Karate Joe or the series' latest mascot.
• Elma would be a really cool character to add if they incorporated her Soul Voices to allow her to call either Lin or Cross to do an attack similar to assists in traditional fighting games.
• Bandana Dee could be an interesting summoning character using the friend hearts. Besides this, we could get a Kirby stage based off of a game that wasn't made before Kirby Returns to Dreamland.
• Amaterasu. A dynamic character with a gorgeous stage and an amazing soundtrack to go with it? All of my yes!
• Rayman, while probably the most basic of the aforementioned characters would still be a welcome addition in my eyes.

 

[RileyXY1]

Hitagi just claimed that the reports that gave him the DLC (including Steve and a DQ character) are fake.

https://www.reddit.com/user/Senjougahara__Hitagi/comments/9yzt7h/z/ea72kkr/

 

[TheCJBrine]

Hitagi just claimed that the reports that gave him the DLC (including Steve and a DQ character) are fake.

https://www.reddit.com/user/Senjougahara__Hitagi/comments/9yzt7h/z/ea72kkr/

It turns out Steve is real:

https://www.reddit.com/user/Senjoug...yzt7h/lol_u_guys_are_funny/ea7a3oo/?context=3


can I hype now

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

It turns out Steve is real:

https://www.reddit.com/user/Senjoug...yzt7h/lol_u_guys_are_funny/ea7a3oo/?context=3


can I hype now

You might need an avatar change though. That doesn't look like a very hyped-up face, heh.

 

[Daedulus]

It turns out Steve is real:

https://www.reddit.com/user/Senjoug...yzt7h/lol_u_guys_are_funny/ea7a3oo/?context=3


can I hype now

Steve in smash????? yeah right

 

[TheCJBrine]

Steve in smash????? yeah right

Steve is an obvious inclusion when you think about it.

Nintendo and Microsoft "Better Together" stuff over Minecraft, Nintendo's Minecraft stuff, Minecraft used as the face of their "Family games" category on their Holiday thing, Minecraft being a videogame phenomenon...

Microsoft is even more lenient with Minecraft than any of their other IPs, though I guess that's because Mojang already had it on other platforms before Microsoft bought them.

 

[FlawedAI]

Steve is an obvious inclusion when you think about it.

Nintendo and Microsoft "Better Together" stuff over Minecraft, Nintendo's Minecraft stuff, Minecraft used as the face of their "Family games" category on their Holiday thing, Minecraft being a videogame phenomenon...

Microsoft is even more lenient with Minecraft than any of their other IPs, though I guess that's because Mojang already had it on other platforms before Microsoft bought them.

I have a big problem with Steve in Smash, and it's this: I don't think a Steve moves could do Minecraft justice. Steve is even more of a blank slate than someone like Corrin or Mario. He's much more akin to Miis, but with none of the versatility to make something like Mii Fighters because of the source material. I don't think a Steve moves could really capture what Minecraft is about: the building and doing of whatever you want. Besides, it's not like you can build someone based on personality, like Incineroar, because Steve literally has none. I also have trouble seeing him "dance" in Smash. How would he move? Would he use the weird gliding thing in Minecraft, or would the joints be articulated like in Story Mode? Those are the two fundamental problems I have with Steve in Smash, and I think Sakurai might object for the same reasons. Remember, even though Nintendo is choosing the characters, Sakurai has to approve them.

 

[TheCJBrine]

I have a big problem with Steve in Smash, and it's this: I don't think a Steve moves could do Minecraft justice. Steve is even more of a blank slate than someone like Corrin or Mario. He's much more akin to Miis, but with none of the versatility to make something like Mii Fighters because of the source material. I don't think a Steve moves could really capture what Minecraft is about: the building and doing of whatever you want. Besides, it's not like you can build someone based on personality, like Incineroar, because Steve literally has none. I also have trouble seeing him "dance" in Smash. How would he move? Would he use the weird gliding thing in Minecraft, or would the joints be articulated like in Story Mode? Those are the two fundamental problems I have with Steve in Smash, and I think Sakurai might object for the same reasons. Remember, even though Nintendo is choosing the characters, Sakurai has to approve them.

I can imagine some animations for Steve even with his stiff limbs, though there are some I have trouble with tbh; his animations could also just be taken from Minecraft: Dungeons, which is much better than Story Mode and stays true to Minecraft's normal style.

His artstyle could take from the official Minecraft website and merchandise, and for emotions they could change his face's "texture" (maybe just his eyes specifically) or simply take from the Dungeons game.

Tbh I'm not sure about his moveset, but there is a lot Sakurai could take from, plus Sakurai himself likes the game so he may want to try making a playable character if he thinks it's possible.

 

[RileyXY1]

It turns out Steve is real:

https://www.reddit.com/user/Senjoug...yzt7h/lol_u_guys_are_funny/ea7a3oo/?context=3


can I hype now

Considering how much he's flipflopped (especially regarding Katalina), I don't think he's very credible.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Considering how much he's flipflopped (especially regarding Katalina), I don't think he's very credible.

I'm still keeping him in mind because of Vergeben.

Although, Vergeben himself makes Steve somewhat likely anyway I guess...

 

[RileyXY1]

I'm still keeping him in mind because of Vergeben.

Although, Vergeben himself makes Steve somewhat likely anyway I guess...

Verge has only said that Minecraft is getting some form of representation. He never said anything specific.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

If Steve gets into Smash. I congrats his supporters. I'd much prefer Banjo honestly but if we can manage to get both that'd even be better. Either way this is Sakurai's game so he can do what he wants.

Only time I still feel Sakurai screwed the pooch is making Isaac an assist again since his fans had been asking for him as long as my boi. I still feel it ain't fair the fans and I got King K. Rool but they didn't get Isaac.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Verge has only said that Minecraft is getting some form of representation. He never said anything specific.

Yes, but that still adds to Steve's chances. There's no way there's Minecraft content in the base-game and it's not shown off before release.

Although, we could get Banjo-Kazooie with a Minecraft stage/Mii Costume/Spirits or something, or both Banjo-Kazooie and Steve (which is what I'd prefer).

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Spoiler: Here is my take on Steve's implementation: (not actually any spoilers)

• Because he serves no purpose other than to be the default avatar, Steve's moveset has to represent Mincraft's core ideas more than it has to represent the character itself. However, creating a wall that completely shields him from damage with just a few button presses is incredibly broken even just considering casual play. One way to circumvent this is to require him to use a workbench to do any building. This would allow him to create various structures (including a 1x1 block to allow creative building) without making instantaneous damage absorbing walls the size of most characters. You would also need to allow players to grab on the new terrain created by Steve, as well as allow players to instantly destroy terrain above them by any ledge get up option. And to make sure the character is not immediately banned competitively, allow characters getting knocked into terrain to damage said terrain and destroy it if the knock back is high enough.
• On the subject of animation, Steve is severely gimped. His only joints are his shoulders hips and neck, and he doesn't have any facial expressions. Since Steve isn't really a character (more of a symbol really) the latter doesn't matter too much, but it would still be weird amongst the other characters. You can certainly make the most of his five joints to make a moveset, but no matter what you do with it Steve still won't feel as powerful as the other characters due to the various animation techniques being impossible, and the sound effects being ripped from Minecraft.

So while Steve could be implemented in Smash, it could be a bit more trouble than its worth since the character could still seem out of place or less satisfying to play as even after all the hard work. Keep in mind that my fixes were thought up in about an hour so there could still be (and probably are) glaring holes in it (aside from not explaining how absolutely everything would work in excruciating detail as this isn't the place for that anyway).

Yes, but that still adds to Steve's chances. There's no way there's Minecraft content in the base-game and it's not shown off before release.

Although, we could get Banjo-Kazooie with a Minecraft stage/Mii Costume/Spirits or something, or both Banjo-Kazooie and Steve (which is what I'd prefer).

I wouldn't be surprised if we got Banjo & Kazooie and a Minecraft stage, or Steve with Banjo as an alternate costume. I don't think characters would be added, but I suppose at this point anything is possible (and not just because of Piranha Plant). I wouldn't mind having both so long as they bring interesting mechanics to the table.

 

[FancySmash]

I just wonder what Vergeben's current stance is on Hitagi after all the backpedaling that's been happening. Does Verge still think Hitagi is credible?

 

[Ridrool64]

All the leakers really need to know is what stages are DLC, since that gives away the new fighters by proxy. Plus, it'd be easier to figure out what stages are in since they're not as well guarded as Fighters.

For example, they hear about a Minecraft stage, we get Steve. They hear Spiral Mountain/Gruntilda's Lair, we get Banjo.

And even if it's from a series already repped in Smash, we can still make accurate judgements. We get an Alola stage? Presumably Lycanroc. We get a Gyromite stage? Professor Hector.

 

[Daedulus]

I have a big problem with Steve in Smash, and it's this: I don't think a Steve moves could do Minecraft justice. Steve is even more of a blank slate than someone like Corrin or Mario. He's much more akin to Miis, but with none of the versatility to make something like Mii Fighters because of the source material. I don't think a Steve moves could really capture what Minecraft is about: the building and doing of whatever you want. Besides, it's not like you can build someone based on personality, like Incineroar, because Steve literally has none. I also have trouble seeing him "dance" in Smash. How would he move? Would he use the weird gliding thing in Minecraft, or would the joints be articulated like in Story Mode? Those are the two fundamental problems I have with Steve in Smash, and I think Sakurai might object for the same reasons. Remember, even though Nintendo is choosing the characters, Sakurai has to approve them.

In my personal opinion, minecraft has taken a turn for the worst and has turned into real ****hole now, but that's beside the point that YOU CAN'T BELIEVE EVERYTHING YOU READ, sengo-kohara, was talking about katalina for heaven sake! He hasn't talked about the stages or music tracks so you shouldn't get hyped about a character that's not even IN YET, that's what happened with the Grinch leak, and that's we are all in disappointment after, DON"T COUNT CHICKENS BEFORE THEY HATCH.

 

[Flyboy]

In my personal opinion, minecraft has taken a turn for the worst and has turned into real ****hole now, but that's beside the point that YOU CAN'T BELIEVE EVERYTHING YOU READ, sengo-kohara, was talking about katalina for heaven sake! He hasn't talked about the stages or music tracks so you shouldn't get hyped about a character that's not even IN YET, that's what happened with the Grinch leak, and that's we are all in disappointment after, DON"T COUNT CHICKENS BEFORE THEY HATCH.

Minecraft is good man, get it on Switch, it's a whole bunch of fun.

The thing regarding Verge and Hitagi is that Hitagi came out of nowhere and Verg has always, always been quick to state that while he has met Hitagi in real life and believes him to be a trustworthy person, none of Hitagi's claims have been ones Verg heard. This is explained by them having different sources (and Hitagi in general seems to be a lot more callous with the info given) but from day one the idea has been to take it all with a grain of salt.

We know companies sprinkle red herrings. The idea is that Hitagi got a few of them, but the one place that Verg and Hitagi cross over is "Minecraft content". Maybe that's a stage. Maybe that's a character. We just don't know yet.

Semi-related, I'm with some others in that I just don't see how a playable Minecrafter can do the game justice. I want to be proven wrong, but movesets are hard for me to conceptualize for a Minecraft avatar as a rep. A Steve Mii costume and Minecraft stage that shifts and changes and maybe even has random elements would be great though.

 

[Daedulus]

Minecraft is good man, get it on Switch, it's a whole bunch of fun.

The thing regarding Verge and Hitagi is that Hitagi came out of nowhere and Verg has always, always been quick to state that while he has met Hitagi in real life and believes him to be a trustworthy person, none of Hitagi's claims have been ones Verg heard. This is explained by them having different sources (and Hitagi in general seems to be a lot more callous with the info given) but from day one the idea has been to take it all with a grain of salt.

We know companies sprinkle red herrings. The idea is that Hitagi got a few of them, but the one place that Verg and Hitagi cross over is "Minecraft content". Maybe that's a stage. Maybe that's a character. We just don't know yet.

Semi-related, I'm with some others in that I just don't see how a playable Minecrafter can do the game justice. I want to be proven wrong, but movesets are hard for me to conceptualize for a Minecraft avatar as a rep. A Steve Mii costume and Minecraft stage that shifts and changes and maybe even has random elements would be great though.

1 minecraft is NOT GOOD ON switch, I've played Java like 5 years ago, but now they're phasing the LITERAL best platform by far, in favor of a ****ty kids Ipad version, Microsoft have ruined the game, that's just my opinion.

Just cuz Verg gave us the go-ahead doesn't mean that Hitagi is reliable, he has to prove his worth first, just like how verge got all of that backlash with grinch leak, just cuz verg says he's reliable, doesn't mean we should be so quick to say YES.

Minecraft likely won't get any representation, and I'm fine with that, not everybody has to be Smash Brother.

 

[Flyboy]

Nah man Minecraft's good. It's real good. Love it.

Verg getting backlash with the Grinch leak was stupid because Verg hadn't gotten everything wrong but everyone wanted to believe a flawed banner despite the clear and obvious flaws. And you know, I was one of those people who wanted to believe it too. Hitagi doesn't have a track record, you're correct. It's just a major misconception that they're credible or even "backed by Verg" when the truth is a lot more innocuous.

It's fairly simple. Verg, who has an excellent track record, says there is "Minecraft content". Hitagi, who has no track record in Smash speculation (but does have credibility in the FGC), has also heard that there is Minecraft content, though is claiming playable Steve. Vergeben has met Hitagi, and therefore believes Hitagi has no reason to lie. However, Verg does not substantiate Hitagi's claims as he has not heard them from his own sources.

All I'm saying is it looks like we may get some kind of Minecraft representation in the game. Playable avatar or Mii costume or stage or none of that, we just don't know.

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

Granted, they could also just both be wrong on that matter too. No one is infallible after all.

 

[Flyboy]

Granted, they could also just both be wrong on that matter too. No one is infallible after all.

Of course they could. For all we know all their sources got confused and we have Dragon Quest Builders as a stage or something.

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

Of course they could. For all we know all their sources got confused and we have Dragon Quest Builders as a stage or something.

As a stage "representing" Minecraft, that sounds quite preferable.

 

[Guynamednelson]

I'm betting on a Mii costume that's an homage to Minecraft.

 

[Daedulus]

Nah man Minecraft's good. It's real good. Love it.

Verg getting backlash with the Grinch leak was stupid because Verg hadn't gotten everything wrong but everyone wanted to believe a flawed banner despite the clear and obvious flaws. And you know, I was one of those people who wanted to believe it too. Hitagi doesn't have a track record, you're correct. It's just a major misconception that they're credible or even "backed by Verg" when the truth is a lot more innocuous.

It's fairly simple. Verg, who has an excellent track record, says there is "Minecraft content". Hitagi, who has no track record in Smash speculation (but does have credibility in the FGC), has also heard that there is Minecraft content, though is claiming playable Steve. Vergeben has met Hitagi, and therefore believes Hitagi has no reason to lie. However, Verg does not substantiate Hitagi's claims as he has not heard them from his own sources.

All I'm saying is it looks like we may get some kind of Minecraft representation in the game. Playable avatar or Mii costume or stage or none of that, we just don't know.

Ok, your not going to get me to play mince raft(that was intentional), but I do agree that the Grinch leak was too real to believe. I never said I BELIEVED IT, BOTH SIDE HAD VALID POINTS, and do you get my point about Hitagi know?

I'm pretty sure minecraft will just have a stage or a music track, he said there would be an SE and Minecraft stuff in base game, what's going on with that?

 

[Flyboy]

Ok, your not going to get me to play mince raft(that was intentional), but I do agree that the Grinch leak was too real to believe. I never said I BELIEVED IT, BOTH SIDE HAD VALID POINTS, and do you get my point about Hitagi know?

I'm pretty sure minecraft will just have a stage or a music track, he said there would be an SE and Minecraft stuff in base game, what's going on with that?

what

 

[GoodGrief741]

Ok, your not going to get me to play mince raft(that was intentional), but I do agree that the Grinch leak was too real to believe. I never said I BELIEVED IT, BOTH SIDE HAD VALID POINTS, and do you get my point about Hitagi know?

I'm pretty sure minecraft will just have a stage or a music track, he said there would be an SE and Minecraft stuff in base game, what's going on with that?

Mince raft? That’s not even clever.

 

[Daedulus]

what

Mince raft? That’s not even clever.

Wasn't trying to be.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Just remember, bashing games doesn't make your point remotely good. You don't have to be interested in a series. Using derogatory terms for it just worsens the argument you have against it instead.

You also have to remember Verg did note that his information was updated and that MInecraft and Square-Enix could be DLC. While it's fair to say he backpedaled, he did acknowledge it wasn't guaranteed base game well before the game went gold. Meaning he already has the impression they could be a DLC character as a possibility.

Steve being DLC has good chances of happening. Especially if Nintendo didn't give Sakurai a large list to choose from. If they gave him five characters, he's almost guaranteed at this point. Or if you will, all but confirmed.

 

[Daedulus]

Just remember, bashing games doesn't make your point remotely good. You don't have to be interested in a series. Using derogatory terms for it just worsens the argument you have against it instead.

You also have to remember Verg did note that his information was updated and that MInecraft and Square-Enix could be DLC. While it's fair to say he backpedaled, he did acknowledge it wasn't guaranteed base game well before the game went gold. Meaning he already has the impression they could be a DLC character as a possibility.

Steve being DLC has good chances of happening. Especially if Nintendo didn't give Sakurai a large list to choose from. If they gave him five characters, he's almost guaranteed at this point. Or if you will, all but confirmed.

I never added to the fact that I don't like minecraft to my arguments, I just said I don't like it. We thought shadow was all but confirmed, but loom what happened, the thing we should ALL LEARN is that you shouldn't count your chickens before they hatch, that's why we were all so disappointed about the smash direct, we took the Grinch leak as god spoken, and when they said "That's all the characters", we got pissed because we thought WE WERE PROMISED MORE. NEVER TAKE A LEAK OR ANYTHING FOR GRANTED BECAUSE ON DAY IT WILL BITE YOU IN THE ASS.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I never added to the fact that I don't like minecraft to my arguments, I just said I don't like it. We thought shadow was all but confirmed, but loom what happened, the thing we should ALL LEARN is that you shouldn't count your chickens before they hatch, that's why we were all so disappointed about the smash direct, we took the Grinch leak as god spoken, and when they said "That's all the characters", we got pissed because we thought WE WERE PROMISED MORE. NEVER TAKE A LEAK OR ANYTHING FOR GRANTED BECAUSE ON DAY IT WILL BITE YOU IN THE ***.

Shadow had nothing going for him beyond "oh, coincidence." Missing AT and easy Echo since we saw Richter. Nobody credible was vouching for him being playable. Besides that, Ken is the only echo Verg leaked. But more importantly, that echo also was within Incineroar's trailer. It's also possible he never mentioned Richter to keep a few surprises up. His information matched up with almost every trailer, but he knew nothing of K. Rool anyway. He heard rumors we had no DK newcomer, but didn't believe it, thus, never releasing his opinion on it.

It's not a remotely good comparison at all. Honestly, Steve is an iconic character from a series Nintendo and Microsoft are working together with. He's being pushed way more than Shadow lately, having even more merchandise out there. That alone makes Steve likely, since he's a highly popular character, will sell well(though perhaps not as well as some due to controversy), and Nintendo clearly has no issues promoting Minecraft content on their own systems. There's a Creeper 3DS. That proves how Minecraft is important to Nintendo too. Besides that, Sakurai has proven he wants iconic characters too. Steve is vastly more recognizable than the other Rareware choices available(which is mostly Battletoads, Jago, Fulgore, and Banjo & Kazooie at the moment for notable ones. With mainly B&K being the most highly requested).

No, some took the Grinch leak for granted. It was wishful thinking and many ignored the severe issues with the banner. Like how way too convenient each spot was for a newcomer. It was a photoshop job that certainly took more effort than some, but was blatantly a photoshop. It didn't even use the official background correctly, which was 100% the same in every single real mural. The only thing it got remotely close was that Ken was in a similar place and a somewhat similar action pose. That was it. I never thought it was actually real. I was skeptical from the start, and thanks to actual points brought up, found it fake. It was nice fanservice if true, I'll give it that. But it also went against the idea of a "few more coming". It lacked Incineroar, who actually had good reasons to believe he was in, even without Verg. At best he just make people aware of the Pokemon being a viable choice.

You seem to think everybody thought that way. I wasn't even mad the leak was fake. I was more annoyed that it could get a good person in serious trouble than some people being fooled. Again, I'll give it some credit; it certainly was easy to take people in. The issue is some defended it without bothering to give actual evidence. It came out as "It's real cause I said so". That was just awful to deal with, especially for the Moderation. It being fake is what it is. Also, if you paid attention to Sakurai, he said "a few more newcomers left". That would've been almost 10 including Isabelle. That is not a few by any means. 3-5 was the most realistic set of leftover characters to announce by that point. And we got 4 later anyway(1 is DLC).

Verg meanwhile has been actually accurate and made sure to update us on information when it came up. Even if it means he made a mistake earlier, he admitted it. Don't compare it to a bad photoshop leak that did nothing more than cause a split in the fanbase and get people's hopes up just to troll them. Frankly, with the real mural background out, it'd be nice to see actual fun fan murals. Sadly we'll just see bad leaks instead.

 

[Daedulus]

Shadow had nothing going for him beyond "oh, coincidence." Missing AT and easy Echo since we saw Richter. Nobody credible was vouching for him being playable. Besides that, Ken is the only echo Verg leaked. But more importantly, that echo also was within Incineroar's trailer. It's also possible he never mentioned Richter to keep a few surprises up. His information matched up with almost every trailer, but he knew nothing of K. Rool anyway. He heard rumors we had no DK newcomer, but didn't believe it, thus, never releasing his opinion on it.

It's not a remotely good comparison at all. Honestly, Steve is an iconic character from a series Nintendo and Microsoft are working together with. He's being pushed way more than Shadow lately, having even more merchandise out there. That alone makes Steve likely, since he's a highly popular character, will sell well(though perhaps not as well as some due to controversy), and Nintendo clearly has no issues promoting Minecraft content on their own systems. There's a Creeper 3DS. That proves how Minecraft is important to Nintendo too. Besides that, Sakurai has proven he wants iconic characters too. Steve is vastly more recognizable than the other Rareware choices available(which is mostly Battletoads, Jago, Fulgore, and Banjo & Kazooie at the moment for notable ones. With mainly B&K being the most highly requested).

No, some took the Grinch leak for granted. It was wishful thinking and many ignored the severe issues with the banner. Like how way too convenient each spot was for a newcomer. It was a photoshop job that certainly took more effort than some, but was blatantly a photoshop. It didn't even use the official background correctly, which was 100% the same in every single real mural. The only thing it got remotely close was that Ken was in a similar place and a somewhat similar action pose. That was it. I never thought it was actually real. I was skeptical from the start, and thanks to actual points brought up, found it fake. It was nice fanservice if true, I'll give it that. But it also went against the idea of a "few more coming". It lacked Incineroar, who actually had good reasons to believe he was in, even without Verg. At best he just make people aware of the Pokemon being a viable choice.

You seem to think everybody thought that way. I wasn't even mad the leak was fake. I was more annoyed that it could get a good person in serious trouble than some people being fooled. Again, I'll give it some credit; it certainly was easy to take people in. The issue is some defended it without bothering to give actual evidence. It came out as "It's real cause I said so". That was just awful to deal with, especially for the Moderation. It being fake is what it is. Also, if you paid attention to Sakurai, he said "a few more newcomers left". That would've been almost 10 including Isabelle. That is not a few by any means. 3-5 was the most realistic set of leftover characters to announce by that point. And we got 4 later anyway(1 is DLC).

Verg meanwhile has been actually accurate and made sure to update us on information when it came up. Even if it means he made a mistake earlier, he admitted it. Don't compare it to a bad photoshop leak that did nothing more than cause a split in the fanbase and get people's hopes up just to troll them. Frankly, with the real mural background out, it'd be nice to see actual fun fan murals. Sadly we'll just see bad leaks instead.

I know people are DIFFERENT, BUT AS A WHOLE, the entire smash community seemed to be disappointed, and if you do think Verg is reliable, then please keep in mind that if he's wrong, don't be dissapointed with what we get, a leak should not influence what think about a character.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I know people are DIFFERENT, BUT AS A WHOLE, the entire smash community seemed to be disappointed, and if you do think Verg is reliable, then please keep in mind that if he's wrong, don't be dissapointed with what we get, a leak should not influence what think about a character.

No, not as a whole either. Just some people. I wasn't all that disappointed in the mural being fake. I was very prepared for a tiny newcomer list. You're generalizing too much here. Some didn't even mind. Not everybody cared about Geno. Not everybody cared about Isaac. And so on.

The biggest disappointment came from those who felt the finale of Incineroar and Ken specifically wasn't all that hype. The mural leak was a separate issue in comparison.

Verg is blatantly reliable in Smash Ultimate. There has been absolutely zero evidence if him actually being wrong. He's been completely truthful and didn't release any information he wasn't sure of. He's the most credible leaker we've had the entire cycle. Meanwhile Loz only had just the first bit right and was unreliable after e3. Either he got bad information or was outright lying. Verg changed from being a pretty crappy leaker to one of the best possible. He matured. Other than being a jerk, he has been very very honest. If we don't get Minecraft content, it just means he had a bad source. However, we know for a fact that Bandai-Namco gives out false information to catch leakers. Which just means he wasn't lying in any intentional way either. He is risking his entirely credibility on it and clearly cares about it. No way he's lying at all either. It's definitely possible he got false information to catch the leakers, though. Which is way more likely than him attempting to lie.

He's credible. There's kind of no point in trying to believe otherwise. Hitagi, on the other hand, really isn't.

 

[Daedulus]

He's credible. There's kind of no point in trying to believe otherwise.

Never said he wasn't, just saying that you should keep your hype and wants in check.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Never said he wasn't, just saying that you should keep your hype and wants in check.

Who says I wasn't. I expect Minecraft content as is. If there's Microsoft content among even the base, I expect it among there. Just not found out yet.

I don't outright expect Steve as part of the Fighter's Pass. He's a contender for sure. I do think we're guaranteed Minecraft DLC in some way if it was never shown in at base.

Besides, Verg's statement on Steve is "he may be a DLC character".

 

[KMDP]

Who says I wasn't. I expect Minecraft content as is. If there's Microsoft content among even the base, I expect it among there. Just not found out yet.

I don't outright expect Steve as part of the Fighter's Pass. He's a contender for sure. I do think we're guaranteed Minecraft DLC in some way if it was never shown in at base.

Besides, Verg's statement on Steve is "he may be a DLC character".

To be honest.

Vergeben's been saying "Minecraft content" for a very long time, but... we kinda know that it can't be DLC based on that.

Because Smash's DLC was only decided within the past few weeks, and Vergeben's been saying "Minecraft Content" for months.