Newbie 19/Paper Mario: TTYD mafia // Game Over! Who won?

[Vinylic.]

Alright, so you mentioned hipster this if you wanted him to join your wagon on bw and ask thoughts about ran?

 

[Vinylic.]

Hipster I don't have a read on atm, I have yet to re-read to see if what Benji says is true at the current moment. ;P I'll get back to ya on that.

Then what was the point of this post?

It'll be the chat of Hipster getting a bunch of votes.

Would you care to join getting votes, Vinyl?

 

[HipsterSister]

Ben, what post number are these accusations in? Completely missed it somehow because I can't remember any of that...

 

[#HBC | J]

Then what was the point of this post?

You asked me what type of "chat" it would be. I was making it a funny pun of me going to be looking into her/pressuring her about it.

Can you also re-word your other post a bit because I don't understand what you are trying to say haha.

 

[Vinylic.]

You asked me what type of "chat" it would be.

Can I join in on this chat?

10noididnt

Can you also re-word your other post a bit because I don't understand what you are trying to say haha.

Alright, so you mentioned hipster that if you wanted him to join your wagon on bw and ask thoughts about ran.

Fixed. Also, yeah, go ahead and out with your reads on hipster when ready.

 

[Vinylic.]

So guys, what are current thoughts at this prior minute about J?

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

also, Rake, i did read a lot of your post. i follow your opinion on badwolf. the evidence you showed has really increased my suspicions on him. i am going to vote him for the first day because im sure that he is, and then i want to see who dies. a few thing i dont agree with tho. homeslice has changed opinions a good bit, but to tell you the truth, based on how well i know her, thats just the way she is. i know that it comes across as suspicious on the internet, but when somebody i know posts somthing, i try to imagine them saying it, and in her case it doesnt seem off to me (yes, even the hawk screech. she really would do that). i know its not the best idea to go against the most powerful player in the game this early, but i honestly dont believe its her. the only defense against this on the internet that i can provide is that she is not a newbie mafia player and she would not make the rookie mistake of switching around so much. i think that she is just overposting beecause lets face, it, if all of us posted all of our opinions whenever they changed, this page would be 4 times as long. also, hipster and homeslice are close friends in real life, so i expect them to respond to each other a lot. i do suspect hipster still.
i am aslo considering lolilovesrain her playstyle so far has been to say her opinion, good or bad of a person and then to back off. she never alignes herself with a person totally, and she is keeping a low profile. this way, she can put others into the spotlight so that they get attacked and then she can back off by quoting herself to say that she never was really for/against them. its a pretty good defense if you ask me...

Vote: BadWolf28738

Most powerful player in the game ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lb8fWUUXeKM

I doubt that highly.

the only defense against this on the internet that i can provide is that she is not a newbie mafia player and she would not make the rookie mistake of switching around so much

Wait...wut ?

i think that she is just overposting beecause lets face, it, if all of us posted all of our opinions whenever they changed, this page would be 4 times as long

Yes, but you don't have to dedicate a wall like I do. You could just post something you noticed and comment on how it effected your read. Plus 4x the length = 4x the content to read and thus make reads on.

I know your trying to defend Homeslice, but honestly the fact that Homeslice isn't a newbie is why I point these switches out. She has IRL experience correct ?

And I don't take issue with the over-posting i take issue with the fact that the posts just seem not to go cohesively together. She seems to swap too much, and It doesn't mesh with townie intentions in my opinion. I wish Homeslice around to defend against this, but until she is I will hold my suspicions

just one last note before bed, hipstersister, you have had a lot of serious accusations thrown against you by Rake, and you havent responded at all. all you are doing now is trying to get people to look at others and targeting them. this is really a bad indication. if you were a villager, you would be going against his argument instead of trying to get others to find yours more relevant and bringing up what other have done? right now you are showing a solid mafia tactic and im more suspicious now.

Actually I'm pretty sure everything I have right now is in regards to Homeslice.

Can you quote where I post agaisnt Hipster ?

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

Clover just claimed VT out of the blue, which isn't good play

I agree to this fully. I don't like people claiming Townie even as an afterthought. I don't like the idea that he found it necessary to claim this early in the game.

Underlined, you see Clover states he doesn't have anything to say yet. Yet, in the next page, when asked, he DOES have opinions to give. This shows that he wasn't trying to be pro-active, but when called out, he had 'opinions to give'.

This doesn't strike me as much as the claiming.

Clover starts to latch on to everything I say. He agrees with me quite a bunch. Am I really that awesome? Course I am. It seems like he is trying to 1-up anything I say to seem like he is contributing, and to seem town.

While yes you are pretty awesome, I don't see him following you as a good sign. Following people on everything is bad, it says that you don't have a mind of yourself.

I also don't like how he gives suspicion towards Rake, yet states that he is willing to give him more leeway because his questions have been a bit more productive.

Also agree with this, decent questions are not decent answers.

All in all Clover's playing like I did in 18.

 

[#HBC | J]

10noididnt

My bad, I explained it so you would know what you were getting into so that was my fault there.

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

Wait a second...I was supposed to look at Ran's case on Clover...
*Goes back

 

[Vinylic.]

But, lol it was obvious for me that you were suspecting him becuase you italicized the word chat.

Reminder that I am aware of people's expressions throughout this game.

 

[HipsterSister]

Ben I've literally reread all of Rake's posts in the last three pages and I can't find anything in regards to myself. If you're confusing me and Homeslice I'm going to beat you...

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

He doesn't want reasons to clear himself as town, He doesn't want reasons to look at other people while there are votes on him, He doesn't want reasons to scum hunt. He wants reasons not to die.

I'm sorry I didn't realize that I had to lie down and take it like a *****.

I want a case so I can respond. Simple as that.

 

[Vinylic.]

So yeah, hipster, get on with it with J after he outs his read's, lol.

 

[Vinylic.]

If you know what I mean.

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

I'm sorry I didn't realize that I had to lie down and take it like a *****.

I want a case so I can respond. Simple as that.

Oh Badwulf...
So do I, I feel your case pain...

BTW: Thoughts on Homeslice's play ?
Mightbebenjamin brought up some points , do you know / have any idea of Homeslice's play that would confirm what he said ?

 

[#HBC | J]

But, lol it was obvious for me that you were suspecting him becuase you italicized the word chat.

That's because I said, "If I found it to be the case" I had no evidence to suggest as such so I was just more trying to strike fear into Hipster's heart so that she would have trouble sleeping at night if she was scum.

However...I can't find what Benji is talking about atm so Hipster still remains null in my reads because she doesn't have much going for her at the time. A bit fluffy for my tastes at the moment and want to actually see her do something.

 

[Vinylic.]

That's because I said, "If I found it to be the case" I had no evidence to suggest as such so I was just more trying to strike fear into Hipster's heart so that she would have trouble sleeping at night if she was scum.

[/quote]However...I can't find what Benji is talking about atm so Hipster still remains null in my reads because she doesn't have much going for her at the time. A bit fluffy for my tastes at the moment and want to actually see her do something.[/QUOTE]

I really like Benji's 308. I feel I am getting a really good view of his thoughts this game and I like his direction.

And also, you don't have to just look at only benji in order to find your reads toweds hipster. There are more people here that post, so you can find what you're looking for and help you with your thoughts, cases, and such throughout this thread, And I know that you know this.

 

[Vinylic.]

That sucked.

EBWOP:

However...I can't find what Benji is talking about atm so Hipster still remains null in my reads because she doesn't have much going for her at the time. A bit fluffy for my tastes at the moment and want to actually see her do something.

I really like Benji's 308. I feel I am getting a really good view of his thoughts this game and I like his direction.

And also, you don't have to just look at only benji in order to find your reads toweds hipster. There are more people here that post, so you can find what you're looking for and help you with your thoughts, cases, and such throughout this thread, And I know that you know this.

 

[HipsterSister]

Vinyl: J is one of the hardest players for me to read. In Newbie 17 I totally thought he was town and he turned out not to be, and I could never pin him when we had an IRL mafia game marathon one day. I know that he tends to have a town buddy when he plays scum, so his agreeing with Ben's posts worries me. I want to see who he decides to go after and how he peruses them to help me gain a more solid opinion,

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

the only defense against this on the internet that i can provide is that she is not a newbie mafia player and she would not make the rookie mistake of switching around so much

This really doesn't help her case Benji, it's just saying at this point she's making newb mistakes, therefore furthering her read as scum. Heck this entire post made me realize how much she was scum.

@Everyone: If we lynch Homeslice toDay will anyone want to look into Benji for buddying her?

i am going to vote him for the first day because im sure that he is

Wow great argument "He is because I say he is" no evidence whatsoever.

Thoughts on Homeslice's play ?
Mightbebenjamin brought up some points , do you know / have any idea of Homeslice's play that would confirm what he said ?

Homeslice is being all over the place. She's keeping all of her posts really open so she can backpedal, never once has she had a solid read on someone.

@Anyone voting for me: Can I please have a freaking case? Cause right now all I've heard were people throwing accusations my way without a single quote.

 

[Shun Goku Satsu Rake]

quoted for emphasis / note to self

@Rake
have patience, brodax.

There is a distinct possibilty I am trying to pressure you by doing nothing.

get's called on case...
back-pedals

And thanks Kary, extra eyes and everything : )

 

[Vinylic.]

I mean the J is messing up more, but then has fair reasoning, but then I overrule the reason and give out another fair one.

Like. Idk, it's like eating a whopper sandwich where a pickle falls out and then you put it back in so It can continue tasting great.

 

[#HBC | J]

And also, you don't have to just look at only benji in order to find your reads toweds hipster. There are more people here that post, so you can find what you're looking for and help you with your thoughts, cases, and such throughout this thread, And I know that you know this.

I do like Benji's post and that didn't relate to my Hipster read until his next post where he pointed out something that would be really scum-telling of Hipster which would be ignorance.

 

[#HBC | J]

I mean the J is messing up more, but then has fair reasoning, but then I overrule the reason and give out another fair one.

Like. Idk, it's like eating a whopper sandwich where a pickle falls out and then you put it back in so It can continue tasting great.

So you feel I'm town that just keeps on having wording slips in your eyes? o_O

*that's how I read that but then again, that's a unique analogy you got there haha*

Plus I don't feel I am slipping, more that we are not agreeing to what I have said/done.

 

[Vinylic.]

Well, of that's the case then alright. I don't think I have any other thing to point out.

But, can your quote and highlight what benji said that would provide suspicion on hipster?

 

[HipsterSister]

@Everyone: If we lynch Homeslice toDay will anyone want to look into Benji for buddying her?

Ben definitely knows her really well so I think there's a good chance he's being genuine about defending her... It's worth looking into though either way.

 

[ranmaru]

The awaited response. For being such bros, check this out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IlxozJh2JNo&feature=autoplay&list=FLsA9LEXqfMxLgaFcrxLjuFA&playnext=1



@Clover: http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=14568843&postcount=284

Simple RVS, no more, no less.

I know. It was just a vibe that I felt like pointing out. It's not important to the case.

As I mentioned, that was in order to be open. I realized that there was no need to, I didn't feel pressured. It was a direct, purposeful choice.

Of course. Yet, you felt like 'opening' up to us so that people COULD see that you were someone trustworthy, when that isn't the case at all. You didn't HAVE to claim in the first place, there was no reason. You should be focusing on finding scum, not trying to appease to others.

I wasn't trying to be pro-active at that point, but I determined later that it'd be the best way to go about things. I initially hadn't felt like my opinions would be useful, but realized that it would be more useful than not answering.

See, this is the problem in the underlined. You replied to my questions with opinions, even though you said you felt like you had little to nothing. Basically, you answered with opinions because, as you said, you'd feel it would be better to give opinions in response then none at all, since it could make you look bad. If you really were genuine, you'd have not stated that you had any opinions, and you'd not feel like giving opinions to appease me. It's ok for people to be truthful if someone really doesn't have opinions. This is something you all should learn.

Thing is, even though you had nothing, you didn't try to gain more. This is where questioning and queries come in. You can't expect scum to hand themselves over to you, you have to force them. You state that you can't use tones/expressions to see if a person is scum or not, but you have tools to find scum in a forum as well. You have to talk, and you have to force scum to talk. The more scum talk, the bigger the chance of them slipping up. Now, you ask "HOW DO I MAKE THEM TALK?" Simple. Just prod them, or ask them a simple question to get them involved in discussion. Like "Hey, Clover, why are you lurking?" "Hey J I see you there! What's your thoughts on this person/the current events?"

If it gets SOOOOO bad that the town basically becomes a lurker town (where more slots then the known number (or assumed number in a closed game) of mafia are lurking), then this would be when you'd want to lynch a lurker or two. Doesn't necessarily have to be the most scummy one, just the one that is trying to seem townier then the others, or the scummy one. You'd have to choose wisely

Now remember. Rake was calling you out for lurking, and your response was that you weren't posting as much because you didn't have enough helpful opinions as of that time. This shows that you only posted this because Rake was pressuring you out of lurking. You didn't post without anyone calling you out. Now then, I'd expect a little more from you later on if you had little to nothing in the beginning. Some people just don't start off right. Yet, you still aren't voting, nor do you really have a developing read nor do I see you trying to. The closest I see you to doing things is #201 and #299. After you get responses to those, I'd like to hear your conclusions.

Intermission: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKrtbUinWOU&feature=mr_meh&list=FLsA9LEXqfMxLgaFcrxLjuFA&playnext=0

Haha, you kinda do come across well in terms of awesomeness. But, your advice was good, and I was just attempting to be helpful. Your actions also generally seem pro-town, so I felt comfortable associating with you.

REALLY? Heh, I'm flattered.

I appreciate you being helpful, yet it doesn't invalidate you trying to seem town along with it. Yet, along with that, you focused too much on the filler, and not enough on looking for scum. Now, where exactly do you come from? You seem to have played IRL, right? Have you played with anyone from SWF? How do you usually play via IRL maf? (your playstyle, etc) and how do you find scum, what methods do you use?

Looking back, this seems logical, and it goes along with your next point.

Ok.

That was not my intended desire. How would natural (over)defensiveness be scummy? I realized that there were no accusations, but I was hoping to also prevent any unnecessary ones by having already given my role.

It's scummy if you thought someone was attacking you and you felt it was necessary to claim to get pressure off you, when in reality there was no pressure at all. You admit that my thought process is logical when it comes to that, so I'm sure you can see why that would be scummy, rite?

Underlined, that wasn't necessary. If someone were to accuse you, it shows that town is doing their job in making others explain their actions, town or mafia. Town should be truthful, and should explain their actions so people can understand why they did whatever they did. Preventing people from accusing you, shows that you would rather not be accused, and it prevents people from understanding why you did a particular action. That, isn't helpful to town. This also prevents them from garnering a read on you, because if they could understand how you were thinking or why you did something, they might have a better chance at reading you.

Especially claiming your role, so pre-maturely. Sure it shows that you don't have the room to counter-claim or fake claim a role, yet it doesn't that you are indeed, town. Claiming Vanilla Townie doesn't prove your innocence. I want you to explain why you thought claiming Vanilla Townie would have gained other's trust, did you think people would believe you? Why if so?

Third response on here. Your question prompted my realization to be more open with my opinions.

Yeah, the thing is you only gave suspicions on the people I asked about. Also, in one post, I only asked about Benji. Why didn't you post your other opinions at that time, since you might have felt that being open about your opinions was ok at that time?

A serious accusation has a high probability of being correct. A non-serious accusation has a lower probably of being correct. I hadn't wanted to potentially mislead anyone.

I think all accusations are serious past the RVS. It's either, RVS, or serious. That's it. If you feel there is still some line between serious and not serious that exists even now, then it's time you explain.

If someone has the potential of being scum, and they ask questions that lead to insight, such as the likelihood of another player being town, isn't that a valid question? I still had my suspicions of Rake, but I felt it necessary to look into other players before continuing a pursuit of Rake.

What do you mean? Can you quote?

I understood that you were fine with him because he was being a bit more productive, and I don't remember you accusing him of not being productive enough. If you have, I'd like for you to quote and underline where you have said this.

If you were interested in how he developed a read, I can see why you'd want to wait on him to contribute before attacking. Yet, I don't see how this would make you like him or be ok with him at that time. So, has he developed this read? What did you think of it, and are you now dead set on pushing on him (and by voting)

I haven't voted since there is still ongoing discussion that could lead to productive results that could change how I'd want to vote. I've listed my suspicions for today in #201 along with reasons why.

At this moment: Rake first > Badwolf second > Benji third

I think it is about time you do vote. If you still don't, I'd like for you to be a bit more involved in the discussion at least.

What is your opinion on J, Homeslice, and VitaminC? How has your read on Loli been holding up?

Any further questions?

No. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVYza0NiWuU&feature=autoplay&list=FLsA9LEXqfMxLgaFcrxLjuFA&playnext=3

 

[ranmaru]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EvB-lIcHHPQ&feature=mr_meh&list=FLsA9LEXqfMxLgaFcrxLjuFA&playnext=0

Homesliceeee. You need info to prove things if you ever want to make a case against someone. Also I'd rather you explain your contradiction than appease me (or tenderize me oh god D: ) I get where you're coming from with the options open thing, but you definitely need more than feelings to know someone's scum.

I wanted to comment on this. This isn't really a "You need to do this" and more of a playstyle difference. To me, Homeslice seems like a gut player (I think), and I think it's harder for people like that to show to others, what exactly they see. Although, they should be able to quote posts (along with underlines to be specific) where they 'get' the vibes. It's as simple as pointing out a quote and saying "I find this scummy". This is why I have been asking Homeslice to quote where she may have seen some 'scumminess' from Hipster, yet she couldn't deliver, and I find it odd that she can't.

I as a player, I always feel the need to get solid evidence. This is why I tend to ask questions so I can develop my reads, and I then push.

I think you stated back in the thread that you felt that this seemed like the player was trying to reach to make up their own stances. I have been accused of reaching, plenty of times. I just always state what comes to mind, without thinking at first. I can understand why you may feel this way, but I think it can also be the other person trying to show others what they see.

This all comes down to communication. You have to be able to clearly show what you mean, and let others understand your meaning. If they don't understand, it'll only come down to small quibbles, that can be distracting. At times, it is necessary to question and ask for clarification, to come to an understanding.

Something Xonar has taught me, is to underline what I find scummy. If I can't fully explain what I mean, at least others can see what part of the quote I find scummy, and i think this would help players who go by gut as well, to show what they see to others that would rather lynch/vote by looking at solid evidence

@Ran : Do Not Call Me Lolicains >_>

In regards to your opinion on Clover. Honestly when I was reading your broken down, underlined version of his posts my jaw dropped and I was pretty amazed but I wouldn't even be able to vote for Clover until I heard his (what is it called? like...rebuttal?) rebuttal.

@Rake: You write long walls of texts. If my rainbow color is too much I could always...change it....if you really want me to. :( Also, it's Loli not Lolli

THE TAGGGSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS

Lol. Anyways, I would now like your comments on my case on Clover. You said you'd reserve your opinion until he gave a rebuttal, and he gave it. It's now time for you to deliver.

So Rake, are you still looking at Clover? What do you think of Ran's case?

VitaminC, I think it's time you comment on the case as well. And Rake should comment on it whenever he gets the chance to post next.

@Ran Lolipop, LoliCanoli, Loli, LoliLovesRain, LLR, or my real name Brianna or Bri are all fine. I think someone mentioned someone called Rain and I remember skipping through those simply because I didn't realize it could have been me... so for future any of those names will do. Also, I'll stop typing with rainbow text so that it is easier for anyone who wants to quote me. This way it's a bit better for you.

Alright, gotcha!

Also IC question : Is the second part of this A.t.e ? It seems like it falls under some form of A.t.e to me.

I hope this was directed at Badwulf, because as I recall my vote is on Swords

I don't think that statement is Ate. I think this might be a good example for ATE:

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?p=3096580#p3096580

OBV example of ATE:

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?p=3180126#p3180126

I'll get more into ATE later. Now that you mentioned this:

@Everyone: What is your opinion on ATE? Do you use it? How would you apply it as a tell?

---

And lol, I already knew you were voting Swords. It was indeed addressed to Mr. Wolf.

@People that suspect Benji: Can you go into why you feel this way?

I have explained. I didn't like his initial post, where he asked a question towards Rake and then me, and yet went into circles without arriving at a conclusion. I found it slightly suspicious because he wasn't being pro-active, yet it seemed a bit trolly (and funny, I laughed at it too), so this is why I wouldn't have him as a priority.

I am actually wondering why he hasn't replied to my #285, and why he hasn't commented on my Clover case as of yet, (while giving a stance on Clover). That is my only thoughts about him.

@Everyone: If we lynch Homeslice toDay will anyone want to look into Benji for buddying her?

I wouldn't look into Benji because it didn't seem like he was buddying. Just genuinely stating how he would feel she would act. I think Benji would have to be lynched first before actually finding out how she would be read in retrospect to his flip, because he is the one who is defending her for how she usually acts. This is separate from his individual actions.

@Everyone: I also want everyone's opinion on Connections and connection cases. How would you handle them? When would you carry out a lynch due to a connection?

 

[ranmaru]

@Benji: I also want you to respond to my #285.

 

[#HBC | J]

I'm in the middle of a post but I will finish tomorrow when I wake up.

Gotta love summer haha.

Ran, I have never seen you play this way before. Change of playstyle? Also if you can't get Clover as a lynch toDay, would you settle for Wolfy with me?

I find it funny the two ICs pushing in different directions/leading. xD

 

[ranmaru]

What do you mean, the walls? xD I just have so much to touch upon. I generally don't like walling. Don't expect it in any games besides newbs. : P (The second post just... somehow turned into a wall ;-; )

I'd settle for Wolfy as a comprimise yes, but I'd really really love a Clover lynch. :3 Meaning that I won't give up on it yet. Same question to you about, but reverse of course. ;D

And lol yes I find that interesting too. Nice yummy competing wagons! Yay. : D

 

[#HBC | J]

I could possibly join a Clover lynch but I am still contemplating what you have posted. I have the same dilemna you do, I feel much stronger about Wolfy being scum.

Idk, I guess it would be you skipped the pointless questionairre thing you usually do and went straight into raving mad lynch hungry on Clover and also, yes the walls. ;P

Alright, Ran, talk to me about your wagon being of Homeslice/Wolfy. What do you make of their jump-ons? I am bringing this up in my post but yeah I want your opinion on it.

 

[ranmaru]

I understand.

Well, I didn't have to ask as much questions this time around. Others have already done questioning, and I poked further wrt Clover. I then posted what I saw, was scummy, in case form. Simple as that. As you know, I'll be trying to post in short bursts, because I like to post quickly. (I also am impatient and always want people to respond asap, and the sooner I post, the sooner they'll post) Walls are just a 'as necessary' thing. : D Do you like the walls better? : P

I saw Homeslice's vote hop to be natural, since she has given a scumread on Clover before hand, and since I asked her to join me.

I also asked Wolfy to join, yet I didn't expect him to just vote when I posted the case. This was why I asked him to post what exactly he agreed with. Now, him joining me, doesn't tell me anything because he didn't give any opinion on Clover before hand. He just stated that since he hasn't played with him before, that he wouldn't have been able to come to a conclusion (earlier on). Now, I don't find his vote to be scummy, just unexpected. Again, it felt like he voted because he saw a case, instead of actually figuring out if the case had merit. (His reaction was, "Welp, he has a case, k vote: DIS GUY")

 

[#HBC | J]

Ooooh, you need to read my post then. Wolfy, did have an opinion on Clover beforehand and actually had called him Town. Gimme 5-10 more minutes, I decided to continue it because I got a second wind of interest.

I do agree with you on his vote seeming to be opportunistic on the fact of just a magical case appearing on someone.

 

[ranmaru]

I will eagerly await it then.

And I didn't know he called Clover town deff want to see this

 

[#HBC | J]

Now when everyone is asleep, I can finally post/read the game haha.

I have to say, the person I dislike the most is Wolf. The reason why is because he is being contradictory with his reads and also giving hallow responses as to why he has certain reads.

Lemme explain:

His niceness is just a happy side effect. The real reason I have a town read on him is because of his sum-hunting. He is actively asking and answering questions. That's really towny to me. I don't take niceness as a town read because I was perfectly pleasant in 18 and was scum.

Within the bolded Wolf states that he has a town-read on Clover, yet let us take a look at the vote-count as of late:

Clover (3) - Ranmaru, Homeslice, BadWolf

What changed that? BadWolf was skeptical when Ranmaru was hinting at his Clover suspicion but the very next post that pops up after Ran's case from Wolf is this:

Welp L-4 for Clover.
Vote: Clover
Please give a counter to his case.

Wolf does not give any explanation whatsoever for his Clover jump-on and it just looks like he is trying to bandwagon onto the Clover wagon because of the fact that Ranmaru posted a case.

IC Note:

Bandwagon - This is a common term used in mafia used to describe popular wagons (or voting trends) that are beginning to happen. A bandwagon will be vote train of people that are currently on the "Wagon" of someone's lynch. Jumping on the bandwagon is a common term of just basically going with the flow or joining with minimal reasoning. In mafia, this term can be taken many ways as up to a persons on depiction of the event of how a bandwagon vote comes about. Watch voters carefully because votes are a very important paper trail to follow in mafia!

I do not like Wolf's vote on Clover because it just reeks of him being opportunistic on the fact of another wagon, that is not his own, being up for a lynch and trying to save his own butt. He never fully explained his flip-flop from CloverTown to CloverScum.

I have a question. You modded the last game, so I want to know. What did Rake do to get lynched as scum? I want to know if it's different from here. (Also I totally thought it was Zen )

I want to know your opinion on him, and others as well.

Well Rake got lynched D1 in Newbie 18 because he kept messing up in his posts w.r.t. his reads and what he was saying. The reason he got lynched was contradictions getting the better of him. His inactivity didn't help but that was for a completely legitimate reason. From this game, he is more "opinionated" would be the best word to say. He is different from his Newbie game, I can say that much.

Also were you asking for my opinion on others or others opinions on Rake?

@J

I'm not trying to strike fear into people, I'm just trying to make them realize to look at all the options, and to make their own opinions. Also, I've known Hipster longer than you have (so maybe I have an upperhand in how to read her posts). But I could be wrong.

@Hipster
I'll retract my feelings for now, but I'm watching you ( LIKE A HAWK *sqqqwwuuaaaakkk!*)

She says it was because she has known Hipster longer than I have (which is very very true haha) but then she says "I could be wrong" which is a back-door to possibly changing her mind on her whenever it comes her fancy, but then she adresses Hipster by saying "I retract my feeligns" which is like "....? Whirlwind change much?"

Idk if it's more the fact that she is actively being scummy or the fact that Homeslice is that sporatic (which I can say is a personality aspect of her but it's making it harder for me to be able to tell her true motives).

What makes you of Homeslice vs. Hipster? Who would you lynch more?

GR. NO GOOD WITH FINDING CONCRETE INFO. I'm just saying that I don't have actual facts. NO GOOD WITH THAT. And I completly agree with your play style (im like that in RL- wait you know that already) Don't be confused- you're not really scumy.
Let me change this:

Clover or J
How's that? I'll save you for later (takes out meat tenderizer )
I'll be happy to answer anymore questions you might have.

This is something I also wanna point out w.r.t. Homeslice. Here in the bolded/underlined bit, she says to Hipster "You are not really scummy" which is another one of her little whirlwinds because she completely takes Hipster off her scum-list and doesn't explain why Hipster isn't really that scummy. She does not seem serious at all in what she is doing with her suspicions. She says she'll "Save you(Hipster) for later" which is kind of odd that she is putting her on the back-burner when she isn't doing anything else really with her Clover/J reads. Plus it also seems contradictory to her saying "You are not really scummy" thing because why would she say that she would save her for later if she wasn't that scummy?

@J - Look at the quality of #275 compared to his initial posting style. After the initial suspicions, the in-depth analysis seems to be an attempt to restore faith in him as town, and, I'm not quite sold. I do look forward to hearing several of those answers from that post, but, it's just a massive shift that Rake is trying to explain away. Along with previous suspicions, Rake comparatively has the most potential for scum, in my eyes.

Well alright, he has explained it much more now in his walls so what do you make of him now that you have gotten answers? Also most potential for being scum? Can you explain this one a bit more because I would like you to flesh out your RakeScum suspicion more because I am having him as a null at the moment. Plus the only one to also have Rake suspicion is Kary, but he hasn't done anything with it at all yet besides state it and try and strike fear into Rake.

just one last note before bed, hipstersister, you have had a lot of serious accusations thrown against you by Rake, and you havent responded at all. all you are doing now is trying to get people to look at others and targeting them. this is really a bad indication. if you were a villager, you would be going against his argument instead of trying to get others to find yours more relevant and bringing up what other have done? right now you are showing a solid mafia tactic and im more suspicious now.

Well, of that's the case then alright. I don't think I have any other thing to point out.

But, can your quote and highlight what benji said that would provide suspicion on hipster?

The bolded above is what I was agreeing with w.r.t. Benji.

=============

Alright, now I am going to be giving a basic low-down on my thoughts on people in the game now and what I am feeling/who I want lynched/why I am feeling certain ways.

Here are a few of my reads on a few of the people that are more prominent at the moment:

Benji: I actually find myself liking Benji the more he fleshes out his reads on people. Although he needs to learn how to format his posts so that it is easy on people's eyes, I don't find myself having a problem with what he is posting. Thing is, I would like more of a questioning/trying to find scum but what he is doing at the moment isn't bad in terms of getting his reads out there and also trying to flesh out what he feels about certain things. His opinions are a little weird but not completely off the grid that would make someone suspicious of him. People say that they disliked his entrance to the game, but I found it more of a joke post instead of actually being real. No one has really commented on his reads or his Wolf vote.

Badwolf/Homeslice have already been explained above as to why I find them both scummy soooo yeah haha. ;P Basically for me it goes like this for me

My vote is on Wolfy while my

FoS: Homeslice is there.

Clover is another person I want to talk about because of the fact that he is a major topic in this game. I could see myself being on a Clover lynch but at the same time, I am not really feeling the fact that he may be scum. Ran has posted a case against Clover, but as Clover has said in different responses, there are two sides to every point Ran has that can be true. His posts are reading genuine to me especially when he began posting his feelings on the game in the beginning. However, there are a few points of dislike I do find myself having on Clover like the fact that Clover has not really explained any of his reads in detail lately but has detail when talking about defending himself. I have also yet to see much urge of "scum-hunting" from Clover and trying to look for scum or use his vote to try and do things there.

Clover would not be the biggest lose to my reads but I would much rather prefer one of Wolfy/Homeslice going toDay.

I like Vinyl this game oddly enough. For me, I find Vinyl somewhat easy to tell what is going on in his head as long as I can see the intent in what he is trying to accomplish. I like his little push he had on me because he seemed to be trying to find out if I was scum or not and came to a conclusion after his questioning. Yes, he is hanging around in the back but it isn't that much of a problem for me because when he does post it isn't scummy. However, I wouldn't mind if he got into the fray more because it would not hurt. ;P

Loli is sitting in the middle and is probably one of null-very slight scum-lean haha. She is being very wiffly waffly with her posts and is not really doing much by herself nor is she willing to stick to her own reads when push comes to shove. I want more from Loli and want to see what she intends to do with her vote she has.

So Loli, can you explain to me why you haven't voted yet. There are two wagons at the moment, the Clover wagon and the Wolfy wagon. Which wagon do you feel like you would like to join more and why?

The rest of the cast is null/non-existant/Ranmaru*need more time to get a concrete read on him due to being the other IC*

So yeah, my lynch line is Wolfy>Homeslice>Tentatively Clover.

 

[ranmaru]

Good stuff. I'll comment later, since I'm tired. (Also prolly after people answer my questions and comment on my clover case)

 

[Homeslice2332]

Well...I feel attacked in my sleep. Time to get to work!

All of the options that Homeslice has managed to cycle through.
Homeslice claims to be wanting to show everyone all the angles, but it seems more like newbie scum trying to keep all the options open.
For one, let's be blatantly clear here, yes, I am trying to keep all the options clear, because I'm not entirely set on who's scum. I was in my RVS, is what it's called, i think. I'm not even trying to show people all the angles. I'm not a leader either, so I tend to go off of what others think too. That's why I agree with Ran's case. If that's a bandwagon move in your eyes, well, sorry.
He then discredits his own suspicion on Hipster, someone who he has stated a bad vibes case on and who he had as people he'd be interested in seeing lynched today. So he flips, he then tries to substantiate the filp weakly , he flops , tries to substantiate that weakly and when he gets called on it , backs off completely.
Yup, everyone's got that about right with me. I HATE making decisions. Absolutely hate it. I'm really wishy-washy, and I know that's bad and that it makes me look scummy, but I honestly was just trying look at all the possibilities


Homeslice then switches right into what appears to be Him buddying ran's case on Clover, after not long ago posting saying :
Oh, is that what buddying is? I didn't know it was wrong to agree with someone. I just simply thought that Ran made a good case.




Plus he directs his possible vote as if trying to appeal to Hipster and even manages to make it sound like he plans to flip on his read on Hipster , again.
Okay, that's me just being confusing. Here's the dealzies, they aren't really 'scum reads'. I'm not seriously accusing anyone. I just felt bad that I didn't have concrete eveidence, yet I sounded like I was accusing. Also, I don't really think Hipster is scum. I've thought it over, and that was me just jumping the gun. I don't really think ahead of myself.


He's trying to keep the options open. But there's an enormous difference between what Homeslice says he does and what he's actually been doing. He's flipped on Hipster way too many times already. And has flipped on Clover too.
I'm just wishy-washy, geez! It seems like you're saying the same thing over and over again about me, just wording it differently. The bottom line is, is that you only have one thing against me, but you're buffing it up to look like more than it really is. Like you're trying to frame me of something.

Then he questions his own method, like he's seeking guidance or attempting to look open with his approach. But if he had town intentions, why would he be questioning his own method of scum hunting ? It looks like Homeslice is trying to appeal to the rest of the player list when he says :
Okay, let me tell you something that I've learned in life, always listen to what people say. It's just that I question myself because throughout my life I've always been hammered in to thinking 'there's always someone better than you'. I always question myself, because truth is, I always lose games and fail.

Also IC question : Is the second part of this A.t.e ? It seems like it falls under some form of A.t.e to me.
What's an A.t.e?


So he's admitting to buddying Ran's case.
He seems to be leaving himself open to be able to quick out of Clovers flip (assuming a hammer) were to result in a town flip.
Again, not trying to have a back-door escape plan. I just take this game slowly (even though I post a lot it seems) I want to get the eveidence first, so I keep saying that I'm not entirely sure as of yet.

Plus look at the beginning : For now.
So he's admitting he could flip flop on his vote or opinion again. Should the opportunity present itself.
Um, isn't that normal? Yes, I can flip-flop, but so can everyone else. I'm taking when you say 'oppotunity' as in 'if the facts point towards', then yes.


So his vote on Clover is a safety precaution , against what exactly ?
Why would someone with town intentions need a safety precaution ?
It seems like Homeslice is intent to be on the Clover lynch as long as need be because it keeps his slot and reasons safe.
I don't know why I said 'safety percaution'. Probably just in case if Clover does end up being scum, then my vote was good. If not, then oh well.

Not to mention this further suggests he'll be following other peoples reads without doing any of his own real leg work.
Fyi: I'm a girl. Isn't it okay to follow people's reads? Sorry if I'm a slow worker.
By keeping his options open, he has his "safety precaution " and by keeping his vote where Ran's interests (as well as some others, I cannot remember who currently is on the Clover wagon). He keeps himself under the radar

Honestly, if I wanted to keep under the radar, you wouldn't have 'so much' evidence against me. But like I've said above, you're just saying the same thing over and over again.

*cracks knuckles*

While I do agree you shouldn't trust people, I don't believe in the "Give people a chance" mentality either. I'm more of a guilty until proven innocent fan. And that's how I intend to go about this game.
I was actually going to say the innocent until proven guilty, but thought that too cliche. I agree with you on that, nad you make good cases based on what I've seen so far.

Did you feel pressured into creating that list ? No, I don't get pressured. I'm pretty laid back, until I have to fight.
Was it an attempt to draw reactions ? so, you see me real intentions, eh? I thought it was a good way to see how people would try to defend themselves, but it ended up just adding more confusion.

What if I told you that your sudden jump from "too early to point fingers " and "give everyone a chance" mentality, to creating a scum list this early in the game, was scummy activity to me ? Well, that's what you think. Sorry bout being confusing, I do tend to bounce off the walls. It wasnt really a list, just possible suspects

@Homeslice : Lets disregard the scum list for a second.
Had you already decided on who would receive this "Give everyone a chance mentality ?
No, and that's not really my mentality. First impressions are important, are they not? And first impressions aren't just the first thing you post- to me, it's your style in playing and wording.


2) Why do you wonder what J's doing ? As I recall J posted directly above you (not sure on post order right now you can correct me if you like ). Were you planning on buddying J until you saw the buddying post and decided to comment and disagree with it ?
I'm kinda a slow typer. No, I wasn't planning on buddying with J. I was just legit curious because in RL he has a lot to say.

@HomesliceWhy does J's lack of content surprise you ? Is this part of your suspicion on J ? No it's not. I was just wondering. I think you're over-analyzing my personality a bit much, Rake.

Here you have already pushed J and Badwulf's chance out the window I assume ? No, I have not. Anything can change. Technically, I said that I don't think Badwolf is scum. I never said J was scum either. I was just pointing out an obvious possiblity.
Does your caution at J's play over-ride this chance you give to players ? Um, I don't think so.

@Homeslice: Right now if you had to peg Badwulf's play , would it be scummy or towny ?
Towny. I know Badwolf, and sometimes he gets angry pretty quickly. When he doesn't like something, he usually makes it loud n clear.
Are you aware you did the same thing you condemn J for doing ?
What do you mean? I think I would know if I was scum or not. I was just trying to contribute to the possibilities of who's scum.


Again, very open stance wrt to J. I'm leaning on J, but it could change. What would change it exactly ? If J successfully kills off scum ? If J becomes the popular town pick ?
What could change it is how he acts during the game. I don't care whoever kills off scum or if he's a popular town pick. What I think is what I think.


@Homeslice: Will you be focusing on J all game ?
I won't exactly be focusing on him the whole game like i'm narrowed minded or something, but I am trying to watch what he does.

through all of the posts, whenever people put up a list of who they want to lynch, i've noticed that i keep popping up in third place a lot. any particular reason for this?

... homeslice has changed opinions a good bit, but to tell you the truth, based on how well i know her, thats just the way she is. i know that it comes across as suspicious on the internet, but when somebody i know posts somthing, i try to imagine them saying it, and in her case it doesnt seem off to me (yes, even the hawk screech. she really would do that). i know its not the best idea to go against the most powerful player in the game this early, but i honestly dont believe its her. the only defense against this on the internet that i can provide is that she is not a newbie mafia player and she would not make the rookie mistake of switching around so much.
Thanks for trying to help Benji. Yeah, the thing is , is that I do switch around a lot, because my mind 1- wanders frequently, and 2-my mind works really fast, and I don't always catch the reason why my opinion changed.

I am getting the feeling that you said that last sentence in there so that if Homeslice does continue being all "Happy-go-lucky" and people get a problem with it, you can just pull that quote up and join in the Homeslice dislike.
THANK YOU J! I am a bit happy-go-lucky, and sometimes that makes me a bit of a goofball and a bit crazy. It's just my personality.

Hmm, let's make this a run-on sentence so I can talk more in it haha, basically what I am feeling with Homeslice is that her posts just are giving me a bad gut vibe in terms of her being very eager for lynches and also posting a lot of scum-reads that don't have much backing to them and then after like 1-5 posts, she changes her mind, so her sporaticness is what gives me the bad vibes.I, actually, don't mind her buddying nature nor do I find it that scummy because it does not seem manipulative. In fact, it seems more like she is using that buddying in order to be on the offensive. Like she is attacking people, while buddying them haha.
Like I told Rake, I'm just bouncing off the walls, and I'll soon simmer down, it's just that I was excited about playing this online (like my first online gameing experiance ever), and I wanted to make a good impression. Also, I don't work well alone offensivly, if you couldn't tell how I can't find good info.


Idk if it's more the fact that she is actively being scummy or the fact that Homeslice is that sporatic (which I can say is a personality aspect of her but it's making it harder for me to be able to tell her true motives).
My true motives? Find the scum and lynch'em to death. KILL IT WITH FIRE!



This is something I also wanna point out w.r.t. Homeslice. Here in the bolded/underlined bit, she says to Hipster "You are not really scummy" which is another one of her little whirlwinds . She says she'll "Save you(Hipster) for later"
It was just a random accusation (for the first part) The second part was me trying to make a creepy joke (I love doing that to Hipster- wish I could see her face right then) I'm not actually saving her for later, unless I find concrete evidence as to why she may be scum.


FoS: Homeslice

Sorry, but what's a 'Fos'?


Final notes

Here's the basic low down on Clover:
It was really fishy to me how it seemed that when his name was mentioned, but not in an accuasation, he was all fired-up. Also that early on he was like me and said he doesn't know who's scum for sure, but already had his opinions. It was like he was hiding information from us, almost like he was afraid we'd find something.

Here's the basic low down on me:
I'm just a really undecisive person, and I know that's bad. It seems like scummy activity to most people, but'cha gotta hear me out when I say that that's just who I am. So stop saying that over and over again (how I change my opinions) because that's honestly not scummy. That's just someone, yes, keeping their options open. Not for a back-door, but for finding all the possibilities and trying to not miss anything. Honestly, I'm not angry or anything at Rake for thinking I'm scummy, because form what he's said, anyone would follow him. But here's the thing. He's wrong. That's all I gotta say right now. I'm not saying this so you guys won't lynch me, I'm saying this because it's the truth.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

SO MANY FREAKING WALLS I am getting SICK OF THIS

I have so much headache right now. Post to come... probs. tonight.

Rake you need to clear up this 'I didn't read my role PM' business (c.f. #275, #304)
At what point pre-game (ideally give me a post number) did you read your role PM by?
How is editing your confirmation post relate to this?

I don't think this is a very good defense. You could look for posts that you find scummy and call them out specifically instead of focusing on buddying one person. You also said that buddying Vinyl helped you to get reads; has it thus far? What are your reads on him?

@Hipster: Can't say one way/other about Vinyl yet. Important to look at people that aren't in the spotlight.

TTFN