New Smash Bros for WiiU

[Berserker.]

I have a few questions for you guys, and I want your honest answers.

Can you memorize this phone number (it's made up btw): 14378826739

When you think simplicity, what comes to mind?

Where do you think execution should come into play?

What do you think is the best way to introduce players to Smash that doesn't affect veteran players?

Do you think DI should be on every move or should it vary from character to character?

Do you like combos? If so, do you prefer the combos short and sweet or long and humiliating?

Are you ok with having combos where if the conditions are right, you lose a life from a mistake?

Do you believe there is more skill in doing long combos or getting plenty of damage off of resets and mixups? Do you think it depends?

1.) Yeah

2.) ........... UHHHHHH (Dumb face)

3.) Character

4.) Pretty much I guess

5.) Depends actually on the character

 

[Holder of the Heel]

I do not want, and I'm sure I speak for most, three Links. Toon Link needs to stay and take on his DS (and/or potential future 3DS title) in the next one. Young Link would be stretching it, a villain character would be better, even Skull Kid would be better (though Ghirahim is my fabulous fave).

Anyways, a few pages back people were talking about third parties... Why were people saying things like Black Mage and Slimey for Square? @___@ If anything from them, it better be a Kingdom Hearts rep that has already appeared once and going to again for the 3DS (though personally I don't want Sora). And I know Megaman is kind of likely, I've been thinking how much more sense Amaterasu would make and how beautiful and uniquely made his moveset could be. Just me though.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

You can bet on some form of Child Link to appear (Toon Link/Young Link). Either one could apear, leaving the other one behind. I'd place my bets on Toon Link though.

Young Link with Masks would be better. It's a lot more original than the current versions.

Toon Ganondorf... I wouldn't expect him at all because 1) The current Ganondorf needs some long-awaited tweaking to his moveset 2) Toon Zelda would be the next Toon character, and 3) Toon Link's games don't seem to be producing anything new at the moment.

1) They can do that using Toon Ganondorf with two swords. I mean, it's not like they didn't tweak him after giving him the TP Treatment. It's the only version of Ganondorf left.

2) Less likely in general. Toon Zelda would just be yet another clone at this rate. Likewise, she wasn't even planned for Brawl, Tetra and Toon Sheik were.

3) Then there wouldn't be any Toon Zelda either. Likewise, at this rate, there won't be a new Ganondorf either. Meaning that he'll either reget his OOT appearance, or his WW appearance. With the WW appearance he gets two swords, can use his Energy Balls and still play the same. He's actually agile, fast, and you know, those swords. They make all the difference in the world. Having one sword won't cut it anymore. There's too many single sword users, and they may make him a clone to a Fire Emblem character instead of Falcon. Neither is acceptable anymore.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

I do not want, and I'm sure I speak for most, three Links. Toon Link needs to stay and take on his DS (and/or potential future 3DS title) in the next one. Young Link would be stretching it, a villain character would be better, even Skull Kid would be better (though Ghirahim is my fabulous fave).

Anyways, a few pages back people were talking about third parties... Why were people saying things like Black Mage and Slimey for Square? @___@ If anything from them, it better be a Kingdom Hearts rep that has already appeared once and going to again for the 3DS (though personally I don't want Sora). And I know Megaman is kind of likely, I've been thinking how much more sense Amaterasu would make and how beautiful and uniquely made his moveset could be. Just me though.

Well, see, I never said there WOULD be three Links. That count of 8 comes from replacing Toon Link. I think regular Link and an original Child Link is well and good.

 

[yani_]

Hey poppybro, how are you planning for MM Link to work?

 

[Shorts]

LADY GODGA JOINS THE FRAY~

[COLLAPSE="Recolors, so far"]

[/COLLAPSE]


[COLLAPSE="Moveset (So Far)"]A,A,A - (As seen in Poker Face Music video at various points) Gaga thrusts a limp wrist forward while leaving the other arm at her sholder. He next move she drops to her knees quickly with her hand smacking the opponent down with her. Lastly she finishes it with her signature "love glue gunin'" pose and on one knee makes a gun with her fingers. From here you can keep pressing a, for her to repeatedly "fire" the gun. (Think Fox's kick)

USmash "Monster Claw" (As seen in Bad Romance 0:56) - Gaga pulls her fingers back tightly, and cross her arms horizontally in front of her chest. Facing the camera, she releases her arms and they create this heart shaped reach for the sky.

Side Smash "Clap Clap, CHOMP" (As seen in Telephone 6:45) - Mama Monster charges up her hands, by holding them wid open verticle ways. When released she lunges forward, smacking them together twice, and then making a chomping motion with her teeth.

DSmash "Disco Stick (As seen in Love Game 0:15) - Godga widens her legs, and drops down low, holding both her hands to the side of her. When you Release this attack, she pulls out the disco stick, in it's crystally aura emminating glory, and swings it from left to right.


Basic B "Gaga Gleam" (As seen in Poker Face) - Lady Gaga tilts her head slightly, and curves an OK sign over her eye. A beam of PINK will shoot out forward, and cause who ever it touches first to dance. (Same amount of time as Jiggly's sing)

Down B "Money Shot (As seen in Paparazzi) - This move acts as a CANCEL, a puff of Gaga dollars flash right afte using it. Combo like the Queen little monsters~

Over B "Someone's on the other line" (As seen in the Telephone 6:18) - Gaga suddenly stops on the field, and magically her telephone headpeice appears on her head ringing. She puts her finger out with patience, and grabs the phone with the other hand. If she is attacked in this timeframe, she picks the phone off the hook and "Honey B" Beyonce's verse screams through the other line. The music notes that beam out of the phone knock the opponent away. Think Lucario/Marth counters. If the opponent is KO'ed she let's out a sassy, "Mmm, mmm Honey Bee" (As seen in Telephone)

Up B "Mermaid Tail" (As seen in You and I) - Lady Gaga's feet morph into a sea greeny-blue tail, and she diagonally upwards, smacking opponents behind her with her tail, and prodding opponents ahead of her with her hands.

Taunt 1 "My cool Nebraska Guy" - (As seen in You and I 2:03) Just watch the hand motions please.

Taunt 2 (As seen in Judas 0:51 Gaga does a wheelie on a motorcycle with her one arm around Judas' waste, and the other up in the air.

Taunt 3 "Kiss my Ace" (As seen in Poker Face 1:16) Gaga flips in ace card off the front of her teeth and winks at the camera.[/COLLAPSE]

[COLLAPSE="Stage Concept and Music (Likely to CHANGE)"]

Poker Face Pool - The stage is pretty straightforward, a simple stage that has two small levels of staircases that would function JUST AS IF you were regularly walking. The stage changes from this luxurious day look, to a super wild, steamy party scene at night. The stage itself is very very basic, but that's just what you need when trying to accent a colorful battle.


Music Selection: I would like to say I choose NOT to do instrumentals, because I feel the songs do not, and were not intended to stand on their own without vocals. They would pale in comparison to the actual song. HOWEVER, if you would like to imagine them being vocaless, do so! :3

Poker Face - The Fame
Just Dance - The Fame
LoveGame - The Fame
Beautiful, Dirty, Rich - The Fame
Bad Romance - The Fame Monster
Telephone - The Fame Monster
Teeth - The Fame Monster
Judas - Born This Way
You and I - Born This Way
The Edge of Glory - Born This Way
Heavy Metal Lover - Born This Way
Sheibe - Born This Way[/COLLAPSE]

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Hey poppybro, how are you planning for MM Link to work?

Sorta like Zelda/Sheik. Each of the four forms(Deku, Goron, Zora, Hylian) has a different moveset with Down Special being a transformation.
Hylian to Deku, Deku to Goron, Goron to Zora, Zora to Hylian. Each form also has different attributes. Deku has quick attack speed, but is very light and doesn't do much damage. Goron is very heavy and powerful, but is very slow and has very low jumps. Zora is the middle ground. Young Link himself is exactly like his Melee self, with a changed Side Special(Bombchus) and transformations.

 

[Claire Diviner]

I do not want, and I'm sure I speak for most, three Links. Toon Link needs to stay and take on his DS (and/or potential future 3DS title) in the next one. Young Link would be stretching it, a villain character would be better, even Skull Kid would be better (though Ghirahim is my fabulous fave).

Anyways, a few pages back people were talking about third parties... Why were people saying things like Black Mage and Slimey for Square? @___@ If anything from them, it better be a Kingdom Hearts rep that has already appeared once and going to again for the 3DS (though personally I don't want Sora). And I know Megaman is kind of likely, I've been thinking how much more sense Amaterasu would make and how beautiful and uniquely made his moveset could be. Just me though.

I can't really see Sora, since his only appearance has been in handhelds, and I think Sakurai's requirement for third-parties is for the character to have appeared on a console. I may be wrong though. I honestly couldn't begin to imagine a character from Square to be in Sm4sh, as there are so many to choose from.

Also, I thought Amaterasu was a "she".

 

[Zzuxon]

Sora isn't representative of Square. You think first of either Dragon Quest or FF. That's why I support Slime and Chocobo.

 

[Claire Diviner]

LADY GODGA JOINS THE FRAY~

[COLLAPSE="Recolors, so far"]

[/COLLAPSE]


[COLLAPSE="Moveset (So Far)"]A,A,A - (As seen in Poker Face Music video at various points) Gaga thrusts a limp wrist forward while leaving the other arm at her sholder. He next move she drops to her knees quickly with her hand smacking the opponent down with her. Lastly she finishes it with her signature "love glue gunin'" pose and on one knee makes a gun with her fingers. From here you can keep pressing a, for her to repeatedly "fire" the gun. (Think Fox's kick)

USmash "Monster Claw" (As seen in Bad Romance 0:56) - Gaga pulls her fingers back tightly, and cross her arms horizontally in front of her chest. Facing the camera, she releases her arms and they create this heart shaped reach for the sky.

Side Smash "Clap Clap, CHOMP" (As seen in Telephone 6:45) - Mama Monster charges up her hands, by holding them wid open verticle ways. When released she lunges forward, smacking them together twice, and then making a chomping motion with her teeth.

DSmash "Disco Stick (As seen in Love Game 0:15) - Godga widens her legs, and drops down low, holding both her hands to the side of her. When you Release this attack, she pulls out the disco stick, in it's crystally aura emminating glory, and swings it from left to right.


Basic B "Gaga Gleam" (As seen in Poker Face) - Lady Gaga tilts her head slightly, and curves an OK sign over her eye. A beam of PINK will shoot out forward, and cause who ever it touches first to dance. (Same amount of time as Jiggly's sing)

Down B "Money Shot (As seen in Paparazzi) - This move acts as a CANCEL, a puff of Gaga dollars flash right afte using it. Combo like the Queen little monsters~

Over B "Someone's on the other line" (As seen in the Telephone 6:18) - Gaga suddenly stops on the field, and magically her telephone headpeice appears on her head ringing. She puts her finger out with patience, and grabs the phone with the other hand. If she is attacked in this timeframe, she picks the phone off the hook and "Honey B" Beyonce's verse screams through the other line. The music notes that beam out of the phone knock the opponent away. Think Lucario/Marth counters. If the opponent is KO'ed she let's out a sassy, "Mmm, mmm Honey Bee" (As seen in Telephone)

Up B "Mermaid Tail" (As seen in You and I) - Lady Gaga's feet morph into a sea greeny-blue tail, and she diagonally upwards, smacking opponents behind her with her tail, and prodding opponents ahead of her with her hands.

Taunt 1 "My cool Nebraska Guy" - (As seen in You and I 2:03) Just watch the hand motions please.

Taunt 2 (As seen in Judas 0:51 Gaga does a wheelie on a motorcycle with her one arm around Judas' waste, and the other up in the air.

Taunt 3 "Kiss my Ace" (As seen in Poker Face 1:16) Gaga flips in ace card off the front of her teeth and winks at the camera.[/COLLAPSE]

[COLLAPSE="Stage Concept and Music (Likely to CHANGE)"]

Poker Face Pool - The stage is pretty straightforward, a simple stage that has two small levels of staircases that would function JUST AS IF you were regularly walking. The stage changes from this luxurious day look, to a super wild, steamy party scene at night. The stage itself is very very basic, but that's just what you need when trying to accent a colorful battle.


Music Selection: I would like to say I choose NOT to do instrumentals, because I feel the songs do not, and were not intended to stand on their own without vocals. They would pale in comparison to the actual song. HOWEVER, if you would like to imagine them being vocaless, do so! :3

Poker Face - The Fame
Just Dance - The Fame
LoveGame - The Fame
Beautiful, Dirty, Rich - The Fame
Bad Romance - The Fame Monster
Telephone - The Fame Monster
Teeth - The Fame Monster
Judas - Born This Way
You and I - Born This Way
The Edge of Glory - Born This Way
Heavy Metal Lover - Born This Way
Sheibe - Born This Way[/COLLAPSE]

This probably goes without saying, but don't forget a red and green color... y'know, for Team Battles. XD

 

[MechaWave]

I'm going to have to top Shorts.

My shorts have a ¼in. inseam.

@Shortie: Awesome idea, but what the **** is an "Over B"?

 

[Claire Diviner]

@Shortie: Awesome idea, but what the **** is an "Over B"?

I'll hazard a guess he meant Up B?

EDIT: Maybe Side B.

 

[MechaWave]

>hazard a guess

ohok.

 

[MechaWave]

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 9 (8 members and 1 guests)
MechaWave, TheFirstPoppyBro, HyperFalcon, JavaCroc, ---, Shortiecanbrawl, berserker01, Zaxis

SOMEONE POST. I swear they'll be like 14 people here and no one will post.

 

[Berserker.]

asdfghjk;

All I'm doing is watching some guy using Wright in tourneys

Off for now lol

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 9 (8 members and 1 guests)
MechaWave, TheFirstPoppyBro, HyperFalcon, JavaCroc, ---, Shortiecanbrawl, berserker01, Zaxis

SOMEONE POST.

I have posted. Have I pleased the Smashboards gods? :D

Anyway, I have a new topic: Pikmin stage ideas. Anyone have any?

 

[Holder of the Heel]

I can't really see Sora, since his only appearance has been in handhelds, and I think Sakurai's requirement for third-parties is for the character to have appeared on a console. I may be wrong though. I honestly couldn't begin to imagine a character from Square to be in Sm4sh, as there are so many to choose from.

Also, I thought Amaterasu was a "she".

Ah my bad, I actually knew that and I still did it. X_X Quite embarrassing, especially since I remember liking the game a lot when it came out for the Wii.

And you do raise a good point about Sora, you may be right. I was just thinking that if anything is to be said for Square, it could be him. Though Geno would be that as well, wow I am quite forgetful tonight. =P

@Poppy, Pikmin stages should not be even thought of at the moment, Pikmin 3 will definitely be the basis for any Pikmin-ness in the next Smash Bros., most definitely. And since we know nothing of it...

 

[yani_]

Sorta like Zelda/Sheik. Each of the four forms(Deku, Goron, Zora, Hylian) has a different moveset with Down Special being a transformation.
Hylian to Deku, Deku to Goron, Goron to Zora, Zora to Hylian. Each form also has different attributes. Deku has quick attack speed, but is very light and doesn't do much damage. Goron is very heavy and powerful, but is very slow and has very low jumps. Zora is the middle ground. Young Link himself is exactly like his Melee self, with a changed Side Special(Bombchus) and transformations.

I agree with all of your attributes, but I think a lot of people would find having to go through 3 other transformations would be annoying, what I thought of would be on the character select screen, it would be young link and behind him would be the three forms, and you can click on one to choose and during the battle you will only be able to switch between YL and whichever mask you picked. Final smashes would be fierce deity regardless of who they're playing as. OR maybe just have all 3 mask characters playable without actually playing as Young Link, though I'm sure a lot of people would dislike that idea. But anyway can't wait to see your move set!

 

[Pachinkosam]

You can't replace sheik with Impa. The reason Sheik is a transformation with Zelda IS BECAUSE THEY ARE THE SAME PERSON. Zelda and Impa are, in case you didn't know, different people. I don't even know why someone brought that, up, it simply doesn't work.

very well then
sheik needs to be a costume.

 

[Metal Overlord]

any big news?

Goddammit no. Just stop. You come on here every day and ask that same ****, I swear

Does it look like there's been any big news yet?

Is it true btw that Lady ****ing Gaga is a playable character in Street Fighter..??

Someone must answer this for me

EDIT: Um, hello? I know all y'all is browsing the thread, I didn't stutter

 

[---]

Goddammit no. Just stop. You come on here every day and ask that same ****, I swear

Does it look like there's been any big news yet?

Someone must answer this for me

1. Just ignor him. If he isn't smart enough to know when to stop he isn't worth your time. Not to mention IF there was news, everyone on SWF would be talking about it non stop.

2. My guess would be photoshop or a SF4 PC hack.

 

[Oasis_S]

Alright, this has been bothering me.

What would Roy and Mewtwo be called?

They're not exactly newcomers, and they're not exactly veterans.

Returners? THAT'S STUPID.

 

[Metal Overlord]

1. Just ignor him. If he isn't smart enough to know when to stop he isn't worth your time. Not to mention IF there was news, everyone on SWF would be talking about it non stop.

2. My guess would be photoshop or a SF4 PC hack.

Thanks, I was about to say, Lady Gaga in Street Fighter would be pretty random to say the least

I try to be nice to him tho since he's only like 14

 

[Pachinkosam]

well just ignore me just like --- said.

 

[---]

Thanks, I was about to say, Lady Gaga in Street Fighter would be pretty random to say the least

I try to be nice to him tho since he's only like 14

That would be random. Also I don't think saying **** to someone is being very nice. lol

As for what Oasis said, I'm pretty sure they'd be veterans.

 

[Metal Overlord]

That would be random. Also I don't think saying **** to someone is being very nice. lol

As for what Oasis said, I'm pretty sure they'd be veterans.

I'm sorta like Iblis in the sense that when I cuss at someone I don't mean it to be offensive, 'tis only the way I operate

@Mewtwo and Roy thing- I don't see why they wouldn't be considered veterans if they actually returned

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

I agree with all of your attributes, but I think a lot of people would find having to go through 3 other transformations would be annoying, what I thought of would be on the character select screen, it would be young link and behind him would be the three forms, and you can click on one to choose and during the battle you will only be able to switch between YL and whichever mask you picked. Final smashes would be fierce deity regardless of who they're playing as. OR maybe just have all 3 mask characters playable without actually playing as Young Link, though I'm sure a lot of people would dislike that idea. But anyway can't wait to see your move set!

Well, what about a midway? How about we make it like Pokémon Trainer, where you pick one by clicking their picture on character select, but you can still swap between all of the forms. You don't automatically swap when you die, though. You stay in the same form.

 

[Holder of the Heel]

Alright, this has been bothering me.

What would Roy and Mewtwo be called?

They're not exactly newcomers, and they're not exactly veterans.

Returners? THAT'S STUPID.

I see no reason why they wouldn't be considered veterans. Bowser and characters introduced in Melee were considered veterans, and that was there second entrance. Mewtwo and Roy would qualify for that. Not sure being cut once takes away a veteran stance to the series.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Well, what about a midway? How about we make it like Pokémon Trainer, where you pick one by clicking their picture on character select, but you can still swap between all of the forms. You don't automatically swap when you die, though. You stay in the same form.

That's what I was thinking. You'd cycle through characters with Down B, naturally being unhittable during the time(although you would not be able to move at all, but still affected by gravity).

I thought the KO Swap made sense on Pokemon Trainer since when a Pokemon is KO'd... you switch them. This isn't the case for characters like Zelda/Sheik etc. since they're one person.

 

[yani_]

Well, what about a midway? How about we make it like Pokémon Trainer, where you pick one by clicking their picture on character select, but you can still swap between all of the forms. You don't automatically swap when you die, though. You stay in the same form.

Actually yes. And the transformation can be really quick, cus in MM you can skip the whole... errrr ughhh REEEEEUEGUEGHEUGHEGUHEHGUH so it wouldn't be as bad anyway!

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

That's what I was thinking. You'd cycle through characters with Down B, naturally being unhittable during the time(although you would not be able to move at all, but still affected by gravity).

I thought the KO Swap made sense on Pokemon Trainer since when a Pokemon is KO'd... you switch them. This isn't the case for characters like Zelda/Sheik etc. since they're one person.

Yeah. What about swimming time? I was thinking this: Deku-Hops 5 times, then drowns; Goron-Can't swim, drowns immediately; Zora-Can swim indefinitely; Hylian-Average swim time

What do you think?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Yeah. What about swimming time? I was thinking this: Deku-Hops 5 times, then drowns; Goron-Can't swim, drowns immediately; Zora-Can swim indefinitely; Hylian-Average swim time

What do you think?

Gorons should be able to last very short. Like 5 seconds. Deku, 10 seconds. Zora, 50 seconds.(being able to do that infinitely is too good), and whatever Link's would be via Toon Link.

 

[Spydr Enzo]

I've been thinking about it, and I feel like the chance of seeing Wuhu Island as a stage in some form is extremely likely. I mean, it's even appeared in Mario Kart 7. Anybody have any idea how a Wuhu Island stage would work? Perhaps like Delfino Plaza?

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Gorons should be able to last very short. Like 5 seconds. Deku, 10 seconds. Zora, 50 seconds.(being able to do that infinitely is too good), and whatever Link's would be via Toon Link.

All right. I kinda did that for Starfy. In my Starfy moveset, Starfy can swim a long time, but once he starts thrashing in the water, he drowns really quickly.

Don't know why I didn't think of those for the transformations...
Ah well.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

All right. I kinda did that for Starfy. In my Starfy moveset, Starfy can swim a long time, but once he starts thrashing in the water, he drowns really quickly.

Don't know why I didn't think of those for the transformations...
Ah well.

No biggie. I just remember crap.

I tried to have it somewhat fair.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

No biggie. I just remember crap.

I tried to have it somewhat fair.

True. It's fine.

On another note, I say Resetti for Sm4sh.
His AT is a premonition, like how Silver was in Green Hill Zone in Brawl, then Generations came out.

In Brawl, Resetti says, "If I could run around? Join this here brawl? -Character name-... -Character name-... You'd be running home to momma!"
Resetti confirmed.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

True. It's fine.

On another note, I say Resetti for Sm4sh.
His AT is a premonition, like how Silver was in Green Hill Zone in Brawl, then Generations came out.

In Brawl, Resetti says, "If I could run around? Join this here brawl? -Character name-... -Character name-... You'd be running home to momma!"
Resetti confirmed.

Be honest: Is there any other good choice for Animal Crossing besides the master of Trolling himself?

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Be honest: Is there any other good choice for Animal Crossing besides the master of Trolling himself?

No there is not.
I honestly think Resetti's AT was the biggest Nintendo troll move ever. XD

 

[yani_]

True. It's fine.

On another note, I say Resetti for Sm4sh.
His AT is a premonition, like how Silver was in Green Hill Zone in Brawl, then Generations came out.

In Brawl, Resetti says, "If I could run around? Join this here brawl? -Character name-... -Character name-... You'd be running home to momma!"
Resetti confirmed.

FINALLY SOMEONE SEES IT! He has a score to settle with everyone on the battlefield, I know where he'd like to shove that pickaxe of his

 

[victinivcreate1]

I have been doing an SSB4 Wii U tier list fpor the last week and i am done.
(Note some will include stuff from ssbwiki.com).

Stier
1. Fox
The Melee favorite is back at god tier. Fox is most notorious for his speed. He has the second fastest dash speed, tied with Marth for the fastest walking speed, the fastest normal falling speed, the third fastest fast falling speed, fast dash-dancing, and fast attacks. His fast fall and low, fast short hop contribute to an extremely quick SHFFL. Fox has high-damage and flexible combos, including several infinite combos (e.g. his famous waveshine infinite). When it comes to KOing, Fox has very powerful up-sending finishers (particularly his up smash and his up aerial), and his shine spikes are deadly against the majority of the cast. Projectiles are generally ineffective against Fox due to his reflector, which comes out in one frame (making it tied for the fastest move in the series with Jigglypuff's Rest). Fox's Blaster can easily rack up damage because it is very quick and covers a great distance. However, it does not make opponents flinch. Thus, it can't be used to break approaches. Fox has highly variable approaches, including SHDL (Short Hopped Double Laser)/SHDB approaches, SHFFL'd aerials, and a good wavedash. Fox can also wall jump.
As with any other character, Fox's strengths comes with major weaknesses. Fox is very easily KO'd due to a combination of being a light-weight, having the slowest air speed (along with Falco), and having the fastest falling speed. Additionally, though it covers a great distance, Fox's recovery can be caped and edge-guarded easily due to its linear nature. His extremely fast falling speed makes him easy to combo and chaingrab (although he is difficult to shield grab because of his shine), and works against him when . His pros outshine his cons, however, and Fox is notable for being one of only four characters in all of the Smash games to have no disadvantageous match ups. Fox has two even match ups, one vs. Mewtwo and the other vs. Ryu Hayabusa.


2 Snake
Snake is a super heavyweight character, despite not being as large as the other super heavyweights. His disproportional weight along with his great momentum cancelling abilities make him one of the most difficult characters to KO, especially vertically. He is well known for his strong, relatively quick tilt attacks and his neutral attack combo. His best killing move is his up tilt due to its power, speed, and large disjointed hitbox, rather than one of his smash attacks (while his forward smash can KO at very low percentages, it is one of the laggiest smashes in the game). Snake's forward tilt is also a good KO move because it has the knockback, reach, and damage of a smash attack with the speed of a tilt attack. A Snake with good directional influence will usually not get KOed until around 150% or even as high as the mid-200% against most characters (except powerful characters like Donkey Kong) outside of meteor smashing him out of his Cypher. Snake is also known to have the lowest crawl in the game and is able to dodge spammable projectiles. He also has the most projectiles in the game (five, or seven when counting his Final Smash and taunt), and a variety of edge-guarding techniques, including C4, the Remote Missile, landmines, his forward aerial meteor smash, and his back aerial. His Hand Grenade can be used for camping, the effectiveness of which can be increased by shield-dropping the grenades then picking them up to throw them with more strength, though unlike other explosives, they do not detonate on contact. They can be used defensively by holding one until it's about to detonate, then shielding just before it goes off. The explosion will damage anyone nearby but not Snake, so it's useful for stopping approaching opponents and then launching a counter-attack. His up smash, the mortar, has the greatest vertical reach of any attack in the game. In addition, the up smash is also known to have a great Smash-Boost that makes Snake cover a lot of distance very quickly, compensating for his slow dash speed while at the same time releasing a projectile. His C4 has a variety of applications, aside from placing it on the stage itself as a defensive move, as it can be used in team battle to create a "suicide-bomber" (where the C4 is placed on a teammate like a Gooey Bomb), as well as being used on Snake himself to regain his recovery move, the Cypher.
On the down side, Snake has a fast falling speed, making him juggled by ground attacks fairly easily. He is also fairly vulnerable to the major chain grabs because of his heavyweight and quick falling speed. Other problem areas are aerial attacks and recovery. Although all of his aerials deal both high damage and knockback, they have long ending and landing lag, in particular his neutral, forward, and down air attacks, as these a large amount of time to complete and can easily lead Snake to his death if there is no ground beneath him. The Neutral and Down Aerial can also be escaped by players with good Smash Directional Influence and/or Quarter-Circle Directional Influence, which prevents him from getting the last hits on the attacks with strong knockback while also leaving him open for punishment. Snake also has the slowest ground jump in the game (10 frames slow). With the disadvantages of having a fast falling speed, very slow ground jump and long start-up, ending, and landing lag on his aerial attacks, Snake has one of the worst aerial games (although his aerials themselves are stronger than his tilts) which makes him vulnerable to counter-picking on stages like Rainbow Cruise and Norfair where he is forced to attack in the air. In recovery, while he can plant C4 to make his recovery nearly infinite, its slow and predictable nature leaves him vulnerable to meteor smashes when recovering from below. It is common for professional Snake players to have good Directional Influence, as this increases Snake's longevity exponentially. Also, grab releasing him (even with special grabs such as Wario's Chomp) after he's used his Cypher but before he's landed on the stage does not make him regain his Cypher recovery, as these moves do not cause flinching and his Cypher doesn't put him in a helpless state. Forced air releases against Snake after using Up b can be survived by using a C4 but if the opponent grabs the Cypher, they'll take 2-6% damage but will make Snake fall without his Cypher, with too little time to pull out a C4 recovery in almost all non-banned stages.