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New samus player, got vid.

chainmaillekid

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Ok, so I was going to post in the Celestial archive or watever... But it seems like you're not allowed to just post a your vid to get simple feedback.

It has to be all elaborate and proper and... Yeah.

Anyway, so I just picked up samus a few weeks ago.

I've done my reading, etc.


I made a quick vid, just a few replays thrown together.
its not the BEST for critiquing, as
A: its Vs Compys.
B: Was edited. ( And NOT edited w/ critiqing in mind. However, it does have footage from just about every samus replay I have. And Considering I recorded a replay every few matches during the session where I was recording replays, I feel it's a fairly decent sampling. )

So because of that, there is no point in giving real specific advise on what I am doing.

BUT, you can still mention things that Im NOT doing, that I should.
Key elements that are missing from my gameplay.

Thats the kinda input Im hoping to get.

So, without any further preface, Here is my video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NnlMM4bXuo

Read description too ;)
 

NO-IDea

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Welcome to the Samus boards.

For starters, I don't normally critique videos with AIs. You just got here, so here's your freebie.

Watch your d-tilt usage. If you plan on using it as a kill move, you need to learn not to stale it. Remember, z-air does not count towards the stale move count, and it takes 9 moves to completely refresh it. And because z-air doesn't count, nine is actually a substantial number.

With this said, at 0:35 you use grab to pummel, great job. You don't do it here however, even though you literally landed d-tilt a little bit earlier. I'm also assuming, that immediately after that, you messed up grounded up+b by jumping. Be wary of this.

*In other news, this is information you should know. As well as the fact that pummeling too fast will mean not all pummels will count towards the stale counter.*

On the concept of pummeling and grabs, I didn't see any pivot grabs. And with the AI being so predictable with landing, I would have thought to see more pivot grabs from you. Work on implementing that in your game and learn all kinds of scenarios where you can do it (reading an air dodge, from jab cancel, after a whiffed aerial, after a projectile, etc..) Pivot grab won't always be there to use alone.

Other things I noticed:

Spiking is great with Samus, but acknowledge that during certain situations, there can be a better option. For example, here you could have easily gimped the Wolf, leading to an immediate stock. Learn to tether gimp or at least up+b the ledge for invincibility frames instead of going for the spike.

Also, here you should have footstooled. What if you had missed that d-air? What if ROB had waited on using fuel to recover (like a human player would?) A commitment like that d-air isn't worth it, especially if you're equal on stocks. Footstool him, then d-air his next recovery attempt after you regain your second jump from touching the ledge.

Your f-air usage is decent. One problem I saw was this where you f-air canceled into d-tilt, which is great. Learn to space the f-air cancel better though.

Another thing I saw was your d-air spacing. Acknowledge that it will not work against a competent player on the offensive. If a computer can get through, like this and this, what makes you think a human player can't do it. Nearly every character in the roster has a f-air/b-air that can counter your d-air tactic. Use it less, and also learn when you'll need to fast-fall it. Also learn situations where RARing (reverse aerial rush) can be more effective simply because the hitbox comes out sooner.

Also learn that b-air is your spacing punisher and you should be using it if you need to retreat from your opponent (which you will HAVE to do in higher level play.) You did it here which is nice but was hoping to see it more as well.

Your jab cancel to d-smash roll punisher on Lucario was great. (Not great in a tech sense, but great in a smart sense.) Learn to do this more (punish rolls), as well as more jab cancel options.

And on that note, when you take away someone's second jump (via missile/z-air/etc,), it opens a multitude of options for you. Learn to capitalize on this. From far away, you can time fully charged shot to ALWAYS hit even if they air dodge. From close up, if they return with air dodge, learn to charge d-smash to punish. (Recognize that this will not work on all characters. DK/Lucario with momentum canceling moves (side+b and d-air respectively) are examples of characters that can avoid this. Samus has a move like that as well: bombs.) If you learn to punish these three defensive options: spot dodge/roll/air dodge, and furthermore, learn to apply this knowledge by forcing these situations, you as a player will grow exponentially.

Your bomb usage is rather extraneous. If it works, it works, but otherwise lessen up on that. U+smash as well, although in general your u+smash usage was greatly timed/performed. Also don't roll towards your opponent with Samus, ever. Away, fine, towards no. I saw it once, don't let me see it again. Only certain characters can get away with forward rolling. If you're interested, look here for more details.

I believe that's all for now. I'd like to see you against a human eventually, in a high-level match would be even better. You'd be able to get better criticism from me with the latter.

Good luck, and again, welcome to the Samus boards.

EDIT: Where are my manners... your Samus is pretty good for just picking her up! lol It flows nicely and shows you have control over your character.

I would highly suggest you fix your internet connection and play with the Samus players here. You can pick up tips and different playstyles from the following people: IsmaR and her n-air usage, Cherry and his u-tilt, Raigoth with bombs. Also watch videos of Rhyme and how he spaces f-air, Carter for his b-air usage, Jasona with his jab canceling, n00b and his pivot grabbing, and Xyro for how he plays in general (I sum up his playstyle with this quote:"good and gay keep the pro players away.") Look out for Xyro's OoS up+b, FF u-air, charge shot and z-air usage especially. If you're looking for creativity and inspiration, the European players are the best at that. Look for L!te, and more recently, quiksilver and their respective combo videos. If you need a good wi-fi training partner, I'm sure KillerJawz would be more than welcome to comply.

Stray away from watching the trick videos you see for Samus. It's good to know and learn them, but otherwise they're not too useful.

Don't play with me online, I'm absolutely horrible on wi-fi and cannot do ****.

Good luck.
 

chainmaillekid

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LOL, wow!

I've never had such an in depth critique :chuckle:

And you even linked to specific parts!

Time to get out my highlighter!


Few things, There were some pivot grabs in some of the parts that got edited out.
Im not yet very confident with samus's grabs.

Overall, many of samus's moves are still fairly unfamiliar to me and diffiult to use, paticularly Nair and Bair.
Something about the rate at which they come out, combined with samus's floatyness tends to throw me off.

I come from characters with Super fast ariels, fast tilts, and quick manuverability.
Pikachu, and Sheik.
Not having a move that comes out in 2 frames is taking a bit of getting used to.

And, of course, playing a new character, I miss some of the things unique to my other characters. :urg:
I wish Samus could QAC.
And I wish Pikachu could shoot missles.


[edit] Killerjawz profile says he's from london D:
I don't think that'll work very well for wifi :p
 

NO-IDea

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QAC is fun indeed. I use Sheik extensively as well (on a good day I can get DACUS off 90% of the time.) And I'm switching between the two as well. It's just something you get used to. I'm picking up Pit as of now, and Pit's aerial mobility is a middle ground between the two. You just need to get used to floaty characters and you'll be set.

As far as n-air and b-air go, I stated earlier what I deem the Samus players that are best at utilizing those moves. Check out their videos or play them over wi-fi (no internet lag johns. Get that **** fixed! xD)

Come to me if you ever need videos analyzed. I generally respond within a reasonable time.
 

chainmaillekid

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QAC is fun indeed. I use Sheik extensively as well (on a good day I can get DACUS off 90% of the time.) And I'm switching between the two as well. It's just something you get used to. I'm picking up Pit as of now, and Pit's aerial mobility is a middle ground between the two. You just need to get used to floaty characters and you'll be set.

As far as n-air and b-air go, I stated earlier what I deem the Samus players that are best at utilizing those moves. Check out their videos or play them over wi-fi (no internet lag johns. Get that **** fixed! xD)

Come to me if you ever need videos analyzed. I generally respond within a reasonable time.
I don't DACUS. I learned at one point, but...
It was impossible online.

Im more then willing to play people online, there's a chance I might have a decent connection. Its just that... I usually dont.


And it doesn't look like anyone is paticularly close to me. :(

Any samus users close to the Intermountain west?
Or Southwest?
 

IsmaR

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Arizona close enough? Basically in between Cali(southwest) and Texas. I'd be glad to play you.
Whatever did happen to that Samus finder thread?

Also, really good post(s) NOID.


And as-stated-already-but-throwing-it-in-for-the-hell-of-it, bienvenido a los foros de Samus.
 
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NOID your posts are just to ******* ****. I would like you to stick around the boards for a while first before you play us (Wifi or IRL for americans I guess), since I wouldn't like our critiques to go to waste. Since you are a wifi/beginner Samus im sure some online matches with myself, IsmaR or Cherry will really help you out.

Here are the MAJOR things you need to work on in your playstyle:

Zair more. You rely a bit to much on Samus' Fair for an approach, I admit, it's a decent move, but don't overuse it, it gets predictable really quickly, and unlike fair, opponents can't do much about zair <3

As NOID said, your use of bombs is a TAD excessive, but I like that your incorporating them into your style, don't use them to close to your opponent as a human opponent WILL punish you for it. Keep using your missles in a combination.

Your jab cancelling is actually really nice, a fair speed aswell. Just make sure you perhaps try linking it to a fsmash or dsmash (honestly, nobody EVER expects it).

I gotta say though, your Samus is coming along nicely, i reckon if you read up on some guides and get to play a few of us (even if it is wifi), you will quickly get the grasp of it.

Oh and @NOID, you used mah video for an explanation, im touched <3.

Oh, btw

NO-IDea said:
If you need a good wi-fi training partner, I'm sure KillerJawz would be more than welcome to comply.
IM NOT A WIFI SAMUS D:. This doesn't mean I won't play you though. I love playing other samuses on wifi, especially NOID because Skype is just hilarious. So yeah, Im not a Wifi samus, but Im not terribad on it so you can expect something somewhat challenging xD.

chainmaillekid said:
Killerjawz profile says he's from london D:
My connection is solid, I can play NOID most of the time with no screen lag (a bit of input lag I admit, but that's about it), and Cherry's matches didn't lag much either, so it's all good <3.

Oh and I mained Pikachu before I mained Samus, so if you would like some critiques on your Pikachu, i'd be more then happy to help out <3
 

chainmaillekid

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My connection is solid, I can play NOID most of the time with no screen lag (a bit of input lag I admit, but that's about it), and Cherry's matches didn't lag much either, so it's all good <3.

Oh and I mained Pikachu before I mained Samus, so if you would like some critiques on your Pikachu, i'd be more then happy to help out <3
Oh, so you're one of THOES people. :p

I'd like to face your pikachu.
Arizona close enough? Basically in between Cali(southwest) and Texas. I'd be glad to play you.
Whatever did happen to that Samus finder thread?

Also, really good post(s) NOID.


And as-stated-already-but-throwing-it-in-for-the-hell-of-it, bienvenido a los foros de Samus.
Az should be good, I've got decent connections w/ people there before.

I have time to play tonight :D
To both of you!
 
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yes he called you british

hahah lol

naw man jk
Ummmmmmmmmmm........................................................................What? lol

I guess I just don't understand your sence of humour D:
 

Mr9

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its not really a joke its more of how a nation thinks...

you know americans think their better than anyone ells.....

man we're stupid
 

chainmaillekid

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:D

Ok, so Im back.
I actually havn't touched brawl since I made this topic >.>
I've been busy.

But today's my last day of school, so I figure I could afford to have a little fun :D

Bit of an interesting request today.
Was wondering if people would be willing to critique my friends vid for me :p
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6NDPtaCfQb0

Basicly, He's one of the only samus's I play, and one of the few people I play regularly. Although, online.
And I've requested he send me a bunch of replays to watch, which I'm going to do.
So Im more then likely to adopt a style similar to his, and probably pick up some of his habbits.

So if i could get a critique of what he's doing, I might possibly avoid picking up any undesirable habits :p
It will also help me to think more about what he's doing while Im watching as well I think.
Which in turn will help me to think more about what I'm doing.
 
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Okay well he isn't actually to shabby, he's got the basis of Samus down and makes good use of zair, however, there are some GLARING flaws that I noticed a good Ike player would have capitalised on, or any player for that matter:

1) Don't overuse dair for combos, it's good online, but offline it can become predictable and punishable.

2) Samus can spam offstage, he doesn't need to keep rushing back to it whenever he is sent off. Let off some missles and bombs to stall, Ike can't gimp us.

3) Use uair more for strings, don't use zair ALL the time, there are other option.

4) More homing missles, it's harder for slower characters like Ike to avoid them.

I do however LOVE his use of bombs, that was very impressive, he knew where Ike would recover so he obviously has experience in this matchup, very nice.

Overall he's ok. Needs some work definatly, tell him to stop here more oftenly and read up on some threads, I would recommend Xyros and Lancersterns or look for posts by NO-IDea (he really does have an idea <3) or IsmaR, they are both geniuses when it comes to Samus <3.
 

chainmaillekid

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Okay well he isn't actually to shabby, he's got the basis of Samus down and makes good use of zair, however, there are some GLARING flaws that I noticed a good Ike player would have capitalised on, or any player for that matter:

1) Don't overuse dair for combos, it's good online, but offline it can become predictable and punishable.

2) Samus can spam offstage, he doesn't need to keep rushing back to it whenever he is sent off. Let off some missles and bombs to stall, Ike can't gimp us.

3) Use uair more for strings, don't use zair ALL the time, there are other option.

4) More homing missles, it's harder for slower characters like Ike to avoid them.

I do however LOVE his use of bombs, that was very impressive, he knew where Ike would recover so he obviously has experience in this matchup, very nice.

Overall he's ok. Needs some work definatly, tell him to stop here more oftenly and read up on some threads, I would recommend Xyros and Lancersterns or look for posts by NO-IDea (he really does have an idea <3) or IsmaR, they are both geniuses when it comes to Samus <3.
I noticed the bombs as well, And the Dair...
One thing I've noticed, I don't know what anyone else thinks, but I really don't think Dair is really that good for hitting people below you. It seems to consistently be either too slow, or outranged, or something.
I've had much more success using the hitbox when its at samus' sides.
On one side it comes out quick(er) and on the other Its got some pretty nice range, If you can space it just right so you're hitting with just the tip of the arm cannon, you can really keep your self pretty far away.

Additionally, Offstage Generally your opponent will be traveling in an upwards direction, and after a dair, you will likely be traveling downwards. So if you're approaching directly from above with a dair...
Even if you take full advantage of the dairs range below you, If you don't do it just right, and it ends up missing. Well, the distance between you and your opponent is going to be gone rather quickly.

Where as, by approaching from the side, you can preserve some of that distance more effectivly, and its much more defendable.

And when I noticed ewic Jumping directly over Ike in order to dair, and I was just :urg:


The other thing I noticed was a few times he jabbed, but instead of following up with a tilt or whatever, he would jump away. I couldn't tell if he was purposfully using it as an escape option, of if it just ended up that way. Or if that would even work.
 

chainmaillekid

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NOID said enough already but..

your youtube video is pretty cocky. You're only fighting computers.
In the context...
Not really :p

Im fully aware of the situation with compy's. In fact, Im probably more familiar then most people since I play about 50/50 compy's and people.
I know all the matchups vs compys, but only a few vs people.


The description is for my subscibers/friends.
the whole "Some people might be surprised that im even this good" bit is kinda a joke.

I once made the mistake of trying to give some helpful tips to someone after losing to them in a challenge.
After which he and his possy trolled me for about a month every time I posted, Trying to discredit everything that I said on the basis of how much I sucked.

So for a while there was a sort of bandwagon of people going on about how much I sucked.
Which I really didn't mind, as I was really not that good, nor was I really trying to be.

So, yeah, thats really more of a joke :p


And as for making a deal of this being made after only three days of using samus...
There's context for that too.
I had been developing a 'training method' for Vs. compys with the goal of helping people ( specificly, Me ) learn new ( new, because of the limitations of compys ) characters/matchups much faster.
In three days, I was able to learn a secondary that was better then my previous secondary ( marth ) whom I had invested twice the hours in.

The three days comment was a way to bring attention to the fact that I considered this venture to be a success. ;)

My samus may suck, But Im proud of the progress I've made. :bee:
 
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I noticed the bombs as well, And the Dair...
One thing I've noticed, I don't know what anyone else thinks, but I really don't think Dair is really that good for hitting people below you. It seems to consistently be either too slow, or outranged, or something.
You can't just go out all guns blazing when you use dair, you have to time it so the opponent's move is either about to start or just ending, or when they are in a position that they cannot react (after a roll/spotdodge).

Additionally, Offstage Generally your opponent will be traveling in an upwards direction,
That is character specific and opinionated. Why would jiggs need to come up from below? She can easily stall in the air and never need to go upwards in a manner in which you can punish.

and after a dair, you will likely be traveling downwards. So if you're approaching directly from above with a dair...
This is why we use missles instead, because you don't have to below or above the opponent, you don't always need to dair, and more then likely, you will not land it because it's just to **** predictable.


Even if you take full advantage of the dairs range below you, If you don't do it just right, and it ends up missing. Well, the distance between you and your opponent is going to be gone rather quickly.
That is just your own mistakes. When I use my dairs, they pressure the opponent into a airdodge or to return the ledge, in which case, I can just wreck their attempts to get back on with stalls/bombs.

Where as, by approaching from the side, you can preserve some of that distance more effectivly, and its much more defendable.
Missles. - Seriously, he rarely used the homing ones, power missles are awesome and all, but homing missles force Ike to shield them, putting us in a position to the continue the spam.

And when I noticed ewic Jumping directly over Ike in order to dair, and I was just :urg:
Good decision you made to :urg:. Ike outranges us hard, spam is the way to beat ike, don't try and dair him like that x.x.

The other thing I noticed was a few times he jabbed, but instead of following up with a tilt or whatever, he would jump away. I couldn't tell if he was purposfully using it as an escape option, of if it just ended up that way. Or if that would even work.
Samus is floatly, and can easily escape jabs from Ike, so for him to actually back away was a wise decision IN SOME CASES. He could have lead up with an fair near the ledge.


Basically, there are more options then dair, it can be hard to land if you don't space yourself right, it's why people choose to use a rising dair as opposed to using her other aerials.
 

chainmaillekid

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Basically, there are more options then dair, it can be hard to land if you don't space yourself right, it's why people choose to use a rising dair as opposed to using her other aerials.
So... dair isn't aways a good option, AND Im not even doing it right :p

U-air and Nair for safer gimping options, correct?

I've been trying to stick with U-air for a lot of things, Well, to get familiar.
We're just getting aquanted :)
Going steady, you know?

Anyway, I think thats about as much input as I can use for now.
Thanks for the help again.
 

ewic

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Yo I'm that Ewic guy in that video. killerJawz we should play or something!
 
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