New Characters for Project M Discussion Thread (Voting Closed)

[Malion]

Alright gon make some enemies righ chere.

Votes!
Toon Zelda
Tetra (with Toon Shiek alt costume or not whatevs)
Waluigi
Slippy (ah yeah son)
Tails

Half Votes
King K. Rool
Dixie
Bowser Jr.
Paper Mario

Down Votes
Shadow
Dark Samus

My old votes for reference.

Votes!
Toon Zelda
Tetra (with Toon Shiek alt costume or not whatevs)
Waluigi
Slippy (ah yeah son)
Leon

Half Votes
King K. Rool
Dixie
Skull Kid
Paper Mario
Goombella

Down Votes
Dark Samus (If only because I feel like metroid needs something better than just another samus...)

 

[Thane of Blue Flames]

Reasons for negatives:

Slippy: A member of the supporting cast in an already well-represented franchise. IMO I'm not going to argue relevance since he has as much or more of an impact on the series as Wolf, but Wolf was added by Brawl, not PMBR. Doesn't fit into the spacie combat archetype either due his role in the canon (mechie), but canon can be ignored to an extent. To an extent. Krystal as more room to be unique and is an actual competent combatant in-series (Maybe we could finally give someone the Adventures Staff). Overall, seems like a waste of a clone slot.

Waluigi: Another Mario character and one that was created so that Wario could have a doubles partner in Mario Tennis. Represents literally everything wrong with Nintendo's treatment of the Mario franchise in terms of over-saturation, over-commercialization and under-characterization of the series. Can't see him as offering much and he comes from a series brimming with representation. No thanks.

Tails/Knuckles/Shadow: Third party Sonic characters.

 

[dude1286]

+1
Black Shadow/Ganondorf
Even though my main character in PM is Ganondorf, I would accept Ganon to be reskinned as Black Shadow, as this would make a true representation of Ganon inside Smash, but also still have my favorite moveset still in the game. Definitely give Ganondorf his ground smash and light orb from OoT.
Dark Samus
As a huge Metroid fan, I feel the series deserves more representation than two versions of the same character. Dark Samus could be easily modified from Samus as a base, but could so entirely different, that she wouldn't even be considered as a clone by the community. She could be floaty and quick compared to Samus, and have much more brutal animations. Her Final Smash could include Metroid Prime or the Aurora Unit in some way.
King K. Rool
Donkey Kong is such a successful franchise, it's crazy to think that K. Rool is not in Smash yet. He would serve as the DK franchise's signature villain. You could use his helicopter backback as his ^B, a ground pound for his vB, and use his blunderbuss for his others, which could shot out the cannonballs and gas clouds. Out of all the villains in Nintendo's arsenal, it is amazing that K. Rool has not entered this fray.
Dixie Kong
Smash definitely needs more women in the game, it technically only has three out about forty characters. Dixie Kong has become a staple in the Donkey Kong universe and even had two games where she was the main protagonist. Her hair could make her stand-out among the crowd in smash, which is what is needed to be added to the game.
Sakupon
Sakupon could bring a unique taste to the Smash scene, and is also from a franchise that is forgotten due to the sands of time. Smash has always been known to bring back characters that nobody has ever heard of and introduce them to a new generation of gamers. Sakupon could give this feeling, and it would feel like as if the original creators created this group as DLC for the game.
+1/2
Bowser Jr., Toad, Krystal, Saki, Skull Kid, Pichu
-1
Ridley - As much of a fan I am of Metroid, I could never see Ridley as a PLAYABLE character in Smash. He's just too big (taking up at least 1/3 of Final Destination) and would require some major retweaking of his character as a whole to even fit him in. Ridley should just stay as an unplayable boss character, just like the Hands and Tabuu.
Tails, Knuckles and Shadow - I like all these characters, but they will not add anything to the table in terms of gameplay. If any Sonic character was added, it should be a villain like Eggman or Chaos (no Metal Sonic) that could add something in gameplay.

 

[Chzrm3]

Here's something I've been thinking about: What characters do you think have to most potential to be cloned? Who would have the most enjoyable alternate play style?

Oh, that's a pretty cool question. Based purely on playstyles that are really interesting/unique, I guess I'd say my top 5 picks would be:

DK: I'm a little biased here because he's my main, but I've loved his playstyle since the first game and I've felt for a while that a fast, lightweight take on DK would be fun.

Squirtle: Wouldn't it be fun to play as a bigger squirtle? He's got such a fun moveset, but he's also got really limited range. I'm not sure what the actual character would be, though.

Sonic: The PMBR made his moveset so much fun that I'd love a slower, heftier version. There's not a lot of love for Sonic characters in this thread, but I think that's okay - even if the Sonic clone wasn't from the Sonic franchise, that'd still be really fun to play as.

Sheik: Another one that's really fun, although this is also kind of tough. You can't really make a faster Sheik, since she's already so quick... but it's also weird to make a stronger Sheik, since she's so strong. Seriously what the $@#%, Sheik, calm down! But I guess a small Sheik that sacrifices Sheik's beastly uair/bair range would warrant some extra power.

Zelda: She's just so fun! As a lot pf people have said, the game could certainly use more mages, too.

So if you turned this list into characters....

DK - Dixie.
Squirtle - ??? Maybe Baby Bowser?
Sonic - ?!?!? Maybe Toad or Tails
Sheik - Tetra?
Zelda - Skullkid?

Hmm! That actually oddly works out in my favor. *rubs hands together maniacally*

 

[QQQQQQQ7777777]

Sonic - ?!?!? Maybe Toad or Tails

Toad? are you serious? With those legs? Do you even know how many kick attacks Sonic has?

 

[splat]

Here's something I've been thinking about: What characters do you think have to most potential to be cloned? Who would have the most enjoyable alternate play style?

This question got me thinking. I've been looking at different play styles: which ones have style that's interesting enough to use twice, but are also flexible enough so that it can be altered enough to be different from the original?

There's a few that I thought who fit the bill, so I started thinking of characters that could take the slot should that moveset be cloned. Then it dawned on me how wonderful Saki would fit as a clone of Zero Suit Samus.

The two have a similar physique: both are slender humans, and while their gender and art style is quite different, I'd say their bones would line up pretty good.
Both of them use a gun that's capable of switching to something different: while Zero Suit's turns into a whip, Saki gets something sword-like. Both characters are shown to be pretty agile as well.

Assuming that Zero Suit's whip can be turned into Saki's sword, almost all of the moves fit Saki to a certain degree (though honestly, all of my knowledge of Saki stems from a couple of YouTube videos). Of course, there's a few moves that would need tweaking to fit Saki, but I think most of them would work just fine. Here's what I think what'd have to be altered:
- Up Special: Saki doesn't have a whip so a tether doesn't make much sense; a new move is required.
- Side Special: Again, a tether doesn't make much sense; removing the tether function could be enough.
- Neutral Special: I don't think stunning characters is something that fits Saki, perhaps a combination of Zero Suit's and a spacie's neutral would be best.
- Down Smash: Remove the stun and put a hurtbox in its place.

 

[RPGsFTW]

Will probably have to edit this more later.

Full-Vote:
Waluigi
Ridley
King K. Rool
Samurai Goroh
Toad

Characters I like and can see fitting in Smash very well with a great multitude for unique and/or fun movesets.


Half-Vote:
Hector
Bowser Jr.

Characters I like a little less that I think would fit well in Smash but I wouldn't rank in my top five if I'm being limited to that. Axes and paintbrushes make for a really cool potential overall moveset.


Negative-Vote:
Pichu
Plusle & Minun
Dixie Kong
Paper Mario
Toon Zelda

I hate these characters, minus Paper Mario (I love Mario everything). And the only reason I don't want Paper Mario in is because I want as little duplicate characters as possible. DUPLICATE and not clone is what I said. Paper Mario, different moveset or not, is still Mario, and I only want ONE Mario in any way, shape, or form.

Toon Zelda fits the same for me towards normal Zelda as Paper Mario does to Mario.

Pichu and Plusle & Minun are a "Why?" for me. I don't like these Pokemon, and, to be completely honest, I hate all of the movesets each Pokemon has had in Smash thus far (minus Charizard in Brawl+).

Dixie Kong is that character that I had to play in the DK series that I never wanted to play nor did I enjoy. I wish she didn't have such a good chance of being in a Smash game.

 

[QQQQQQQ7777777]

Just wanted to throw together some opinions of my own. I don't really want to elaborate on why/how I chose each character for each spot.

Full-Vote:
Waluigi
Ridley
King K. Rool
Samurai Goroh
Hector
Toad
Bowser Jr.

Half-Vote:
Andy
Black Shadow
Dark Samus
Tom NookLyn
Isaac
Knuckles
Saki
Negative-Vote:
Pichu
Plusle & Minun
Dixie Kong
Paper Mario
Tetra
Krystal
Tails
Tetra
Shadow
Toon Zelda
Skapon
Sami

You can only "+1" 5 characters (stupid, I know) and you can downvote as many as you want, but you have to give reasons for every single one of them or they won`t count.

 

[RPGsFTW]

Oops, my bad. I was looking over everyone else's big posts and assuming I had to use every character listed. I'll fix that now.

 

[trojanpooh]

Being limited to 5 full votes is actually one of the things that actually make sense from the voting rules. 5 slots, 5 votes. The full votes are the 5 characters that you would implement if you had full control over the clone engine characters.

 

[andalsoandy]

Are we allowed to request characters to add to the OP? I feel like there are a lot more options than what is displayed.

I mean... why not Jeff?

 

[Starcutter]

Are we allowed to request characters to add to the OP? I feel like there are a lot more options than what is displayed.

I mean... why not Jeff?

jeff would be pretty cool with his bazooka and stuff.

doesn't he have a weapon called a shield killer or something? that would be cool if implemented.

 

[Shin F.]

jeff would be pretty cool with his bazooka and stuff.

doesn't he have a weapon called a shield killer or something? that would be cool if implimented.

Bottle rockets, bazookas, energy guns, shield killers, and I believe a device that converts PSI into health a la PSI Magnet. Jeff could work as a Snake clone, I guess. It would certainly be interesting to have a projectile-based character that can break shields like the Spacies' Reflectors...

I think Jeff is a pretty cool guy. Eh kills aliens and doesn't afraid of anything!

+1/2 for Jeff.

 

[Starcutter]

+1/2 a vote Jeff (Earthbound)

also he's an assist trophy.

 

[andalsoandy]

He'd almost be a Snake clone. I mean if the PMBR can reskin Mario's fireballs for Dr. Mario then it's probably possible to make Snake's artillery look a bit more cartoon-ish.
Plus he's already got a model in Brawl.

 

[AnOkayDM]

He'd almost be a Snake clone. I mean if the PMBR can reskin Mario's fireballs for Dr. Mario then it's probably possible to make Snake's artillery look a bit more cartoon-ish.
Plus he's already got a model in Brawl.

Assist Trophy models are too low-quality to use, so they're gonna have to make a new model no matter what characters they choose.

Jeff's not a bad choice. I'd still prefer Masked Man though.

 

[TopTierPichu]

Jeff could have specials cloned off of snake

 

[Starcutter]

He'd almost be a Snake clone. I mean if the PMBR can reskin Mario's fireballs for Dr. Mario then it's probably possible to make Snake's artillery look a bit more cartoon-ish.
Plus he's already got a model in Brawl.

I never thought of that.

plus we'd be able to get snake's side B back to people who used it. My friend mains snake and that's one of his biggest weapons.

 

[Shin F.]

He'd almost be a Snake clone. I mean if the PMBR can reskin Mario's fireballs for Dr. Mario then it's probably possible to make Snake's artillery look a bit more cartoon-ish.
Plus he's already got a model in Brawl.

I never thought of that.

plus we'd be able to get snake's side B back to people who used it. My friend mains snake and that's one of his biggest weapons.

Well, with the clone engine they can make completely different articles for characters anyway, I think. Yeah, Snake's rocket would work for Jeff for sure.

Assist Trophy models are too low-quality to use, so they're gonna have to make a new model no matter what characters they choose.

Jeff's not a bad choice. I'd still prefer Masked Man though.

So would I, and I'd like Ninten over him, but you have to admit, an Earthbound character who doesn't use PSI could definitely add to the game. If there's any character who can match Masked Man and Ninten on my list, it's Jeff. They wouldn't even need to replace or remove his Assist Trophy, just reskin it to be Loid.

 

[TopTierPichu]

I never thought of that.

plus we'd be able to get snake's side B back to people who used it. My friend mains snake and that's one of his biggest weapons.

he could have all of Snakes Smashes become the same way too, this is getting good,
his explosives could do less damage but come out a lot faster since they are all home made weapons pretty much maybe be like samus where attacks have different properties like freezing bombs and thunder bombs

take away my full vote from Plusle/Minun and give it to Jeff
+1 Jeff

 

[andalsoandy]

Assist Trophy models are too low-quality to use, so they're gonna have to make a new model no matter what characters they choose.

Jeff's not a bad choice. I'd still prefer Masked Man though.

The model doesn't look too bad, but then again they might have to add a few extra bones to the model (which is completely possible in BrawlBox and 3DS Max).

Then again, the PMBR likes to go the extra mile...

 

[TopTierPichu]

Well, with the clone engine they can make completely different articles for characters anyway, I think. Yeah, Snake's rocket would work for Jeff for sure.




So would I, and I'd like Ninten over him, but you have to admit, an Earthbound character who doesn't use PSI could definitely add to the game. If there's any character who can match Masked Man and Ninten on my list, it's Jeff. They wouldn't even need to replace or remove his Assist Trophy, just reskin it to be Loid.

was Lloyd even in Brawl? I dont believe Ninten was in either, I dont think they fit in the rules of the Clone Engine

 

[Shin F.]

was Lloyd even in Brawl? I dont believe Ninten was in either, I dont think they fit in the rules of the Clone Engine

They were, in fact, stickers :D

... Uh, I think. I'm 95% sure Ninten, at the very least, had one.

 

[QQQQQQQ7777777]

Well, with the clone engine they can make completely different articles for characters anyway, I think. Yeah, Snake's rocket would work for Jeff for sure.

they can`t make new ones, but they can change the articles that the character he is being cloned off of has.

 

[QQQQQQQ7777777]

was Lloyd even in Brawl? I dont believe Ninten was in either, I dont think they fit in the rules of the Clone Engine

Lloyd and Loid are two completely different characters.

 

[AnOkayDM]

The model doesn't look too bad, but then again they might have to add a few extra bones to the model (which is completely possible in BrawlBox and 3DS Max).

Then again, the PMBR likes to go the extra mile...

I think they said they'd make a new model for every character they pick, even ATs.

 

[Shin F.]

They were, in fact, stickers :D

... Uh, I think. I'm 95% sure Ninten, at the very least, had one.

I just checked. Ninten and Loid (mispelled Lloyd in-game for some reason) do indeed have stickers, as does Ana.

http://supersmashbros.wikia.com/wiki/List_of_stickers

 

[batistabus]

I don't feel as strongly about wanting a character in as I do about not wanting some of these in. I'll go down the list.

1. Pichu - I would ONLY want Pichu in if he was ported exactly the same as Melee. Sandbag character. Don't try to buff him.

2. Black Shadow over Ganon - I'm pretty positive this won't happen, so I'm not going to get into it.

3. Black Shadow/Goroh/Any other F-Zero character - F-Zero does not deserve another representative. Just because a franchise only has one playable character, that does NOT mean they need another. Every F-Zero game combined has sold around 5.8 million units worldwide...that's not very significant as far as Nintendo franchises are concerned. For perspective, Star Fox has sold 11.21 million units, Metroid has sold 17.59, Wario has sold 22.65, Animal Crossing has sold 24.75, Kirby has sold 33.38, Wii Fit has sold 43.98, DK and Zelda have sold over 70, Pokemon has sold 226.07, and Mario has sold...513.85. etc. etc.

Aside from the (lack of) significance of the franchise, none of these characters actually fight in their game, nor are they very popular, nor are they iconic, nor do they likely have fighting voice files that can be used, nor does F-Zero have a new game coming out that needs promoting by adding characters, nor would it be considered a retro franchise (it has somewhat recent games). There is no reason why an F-Zero character should be added if additions are limited.

4. Lyn - Fire Emblem has enough representatives relative to sales/novelty. There are already plenty of standard sword users in PM.

5. Hector - Same as above. An axe wielding character might be cool, but FE is adequately repped.

6. Sukapon - Has the obscure/retro appeal. I would be happy if he was included. Historically interesting to Nintendo even if not necessarily important.

7. Waluigi - I honestly find Waluigi hilarious. I would be happy if he was included as long as he's silly and annoying (in aesthetics, not spammy or campy). I like his design, and I would like to see a Wario Ware outfit version of him.

8. Andy - I'm really a fan of unlikely fighters in Smash, and I think Andy could potentially be a good addition. He's a little on the obscure side, but modern enough where people recognize the franchise. This is one of the few characters that the PMBR could actually just "hire" a voice actor to create sounds for.

9. Sami - Again, Advance Wars is pretty obscure (only having sold 2.3 million units), and it definitely doesn't deserve two characters. If this character is apparently more similar to Snake, I'd say forget it.

10. Ridley - He is already a boss (technically 2) in Brawl. If the PMBR ever gets around to editing the single player modes, I think he should definitely stay in that role and be improved on that front.

11. Dark Samus - PM/Brawl already has 2 takes on Samus, and Samus now has two stances. Aside from that, I think Metroid is fine with only really having Samus as a representative. Any of the hunters would just be based on a random pick, and while fondly remembered and well known, Metroid isn't large enough to the point where it TRULY deserves more reps.

12. Isaac - Despite being a sword user, he seems to have some really interesting potential for other unique moves. The franchise is on a similar level to Advance Wars, so one representative would be nice. Since he was an Assist Trophy (and based on how Sakurai wrote about him on the Dojo), I'd say there is a chance he could be included in Smash 4.

13. Dixie Kong - DK is definitely a very profitable franchise, but I don't think Smash needs Dixie. How different would she really be from Diddy? Do we really want another monkey running around with an even higher pitched voice? I'd say pass on her.

14. King K. Rool - I think he looks stupid as hell, but I'd prefer him over Dixie. Just a personal opinion.

15. Paper mario - I think he would be a very cool addition to Smash, but I feel like he would be a very difficult character to design. He'd be cool, but I'm not sure how "worth it" including him would be.

16. Bowser Jr. - I think Bowser is a very fun character to play (he's very popular as well), so a smaller but speedier version of him would likely be very fun. I wouldn't mind it if he were included.

17. Toad - Peach's B.

18. Saki Amamiya - Similar situation to Isaac and Andy. He'd probably have a fun, up-close, agressive playstyle perfectly suited for the Melee environment.

19. Krystal - Star Fox is adequately represented.

20. Tom Nook - Animal Crossing already has a stage in Brawl, and sales (and Smash 4) definitely indicate that it needs a representative. He is almost certainly not going to make it into Smash 4, and there are enough tools in Animal Crossing that wouldn't require him to be a clone of The Villager. I would like him, but his inclusion might be somewhat problematic depending on just how similar to The Villager he would have to be.

21. Masked Man/Claus - I think Mother is adequately represented. I don't feel strongly about him either way.

22. Tails/Knuckles/Shadow/Silver/Eggman/BigtheCat - NO SONIC CHARACTERS. If PM adds any of these, it will completely sully my perception of the back room. These characters should not even be brought up in BR discussion. Aside from the fact that these characters just simply don't deserve a role in Nintendo's All-Star lineup, third party characters are special guests, and only ONE character from any given third party franchise should be considered for inclusion. That decision should only be made by Sakurai, and the bureaucratic process for building a character based on another company's property is a nightmare in itself. Including 3rd parties into PM, despite the fact that they may exist in some form in Brawl, only exponentially increases the chance of a C&D.

To be frank, the more I think about it, the more I feel that adding a brand new character is just a bad idea. It's not worth the risk for a C&D, and even if a character is included that isn't in Smash 4, it still might be seen as competing. None of the options truly thrill me, and PM already has the most amazing roster of characters in any fighting game imo.

 

[andalsoandy]

Ninten could be like what Wolf is to Fox and Falco.

Anyone here really consider Captain Syrup? She could be a Sheik clone...

EDIT: She's not in Brawl. Never mind.

 

[Shin F.]

18. Saki Amamiya - Similar situation to Isaac and Andy. Another actual human female would be good for the cast, and she'd probably have a fun, up-close, agressive playstyle perfectly suited for the Melee environment.

He. Saki's a man.

Ninten could be like what Wolf is to Fox and Falco.

Anyone here really consider Captain Syrup? She could be a Sheik clone...

EDIT: She's not in Brawl. Never mind.

I came up with a general idea for a Ninten moveset here, if you want to look over it.
http://smashboards.com/threads/clon...ts-updated-11-13.341479/page-57#post-16015925
http://smashboards.com/threads/clon...ts-updated-11-13.341479/page-63#post-16019693

 

[red9rd]

Theres always Duster

 

[JCOnyx]

Where is all this hate for Dixie Kong coming from? With the amount of negative votes she has received recently, I wouldn't be surprised if she was in the red zone :/

 

[Shin F.]

Theres always Duster

You know, I never liked Duster. Something about him has always felt off to me. I guess he's not enough like Jeff and Loid to feel like a proper successor to them.

Where is all this hate for Dixie Kong coming from? With the amount of negative votes she has received recently, I wouldn't be surprised if she was in the red zone :/

Too many monkeys, mostly.

 

[batistabus]

He. Saki's a man.

Woops...

 

[andalsoandy]

I came up with a general idea for a Ninten moveset here, if you want to look over it.
http://smashboards.com/threads/clon...ts-updated-11-13.341479/page-57#post-16015925
http://smashboards.com/threads/clon...ts-updated-11-13.341479/page-63#post-16019693

I like it. Also, PK Beam could work like PK Fire/Freeze where it fires forward. I don't know the strength of that attack though, but I assume it has lower levels like alpha and beta in the EB games (Never played much of EB0, I couldn't put up with how slow it is).
I'd like Teleport for an Up-B. He'd first spin around like Ness does (Teleport beta) and then actually teleport, similar to Zelda/Mewtwo.

 

[ItsRainingGravy]

Updated my vote with the inclusion of Pokemon Trainer Red, Andy from Advance Wars, and Jeff from Earthbound. All of them have received a +1/2 vote from me. No other changes to the list have been made.

 

[Shin F.]

I like it. Also, PK Beam could work like PK Fire/Freeze where it fires forward. I don't know the strength of that attack though, but I assume it has lower levels like alpha and beta in the EB games (Never played much of EB0, I couldn't put up with how slow it is).
I'd like Teleport for an Up-B. He'd first spin around like Ness does (Teleport beta) and then actually teleport, similar to Zelda/Mewtwo.

PK Beam has levels, yes, but I envisioned it more like a slower, more powerful version of Fox's blaster, like a very thin, white ray beam.

Kind of like this if it's a normal special:

Or like this, if it's a Final Smash:

As for recovery, 4th-D Slip is an ability he uses to escape from battles instantly in the game, and given its name I figured it distorts time and space and could work like a teleport. It would be more convenient than PK Teleport, since it doesn't require a starting run and has no graphics in-game, so PMBR can be creative with how it's used and what it looks like.

 

[andalsoandy]

PK Beam has levels, yes, but I envisioned it more like a very slow, very powerful version of Fox's blaster, like a very thin, white ray beam.

Kind of like this if it's a normal special:

Or like this, if it's a Final Smash:

As for recovery, 4th-D Slip is an ability he uses to escape from battles instantly in the game, and given its name I figured it distorts time and space and could work like a teleport. It would be more convenient than PK Teleport, since it doesn't require a starting run and has no graphics in-game, so PMBR can be creative with how it's used and what it looks like.

True. Maybe Teleport could be his dash attack...

 

[JCOnyx]

3 is too many? I don't know about you, but 3 seems to be the magic number. 1 more Mother rep makes 3, there are 3 FE reps now with Roy, another Metroid rep would basically be 3, there are 3 Kirby reps, 3 Star Fox reps, and then we get into Mario, Zelda, Pokemon, and 3rd party titles.

I understand if you have a thing against monkeys, but 3 is not too many.

 

[EdgeTheLucas]

PK Beam has levels, yes, but I envisioned it more like a slower, more powerful version of Fox's blaster, like a very thin, white ray beam.

Kind of like this if it's a normal special:

Or like this, if it's a Final Smash:

As for recovery, 4th-D Slip is an ability he uses to escape from battles instantly in the game, and given its name I figured it distorts time and space and could work like a teleport. It would be more convenient than PK Teleport, since it doesn't require a starting run and has no graphics in-game, so PMBR can be creative with how it's used and what it looks like.

It would also be cool if Ninten's PK Beam worked exactly like SSB 64 Fox's blaster. Falco's Blaster doesn't quite work the same so if they want to borrow the move's properties from somewhere instead of making it a unique move it'd be cool.