New Characters for Project M Discussion Thread (Voting Closed)

[Sour Supreme]

ANNOYING BIRD! I AM THE GREA-

*gunshot*

 

[Da Black Rabbit]

So everyone who voted for ya know, the one who was leaked.... Does that mean we get our votes back? I think I voted +1 for him. *Half to check*

I mean, the videos with said character and another character (trying to avoid majorly spoiling if anyone cares) where pretty convincing. Not saying that leaked roster is real but at least from the gameplay stand point Clown Car seems like a thing.

 

[Shin F.]

So everyone who voted for ya know, the one who was leaked.... Does that mean we get our votes back? I think I voted +1 for him. *Half to check*

I mean, the videos with said character and another character (trying to avoid majorly spoiling if anyone cares) where pretty convincing. Not saying that leaked roster is real but at least from the gameplay stand point Clown Car seems like a thing.

Everyone who voted for him should have been tagged in a post on the last page that told them that yes, they can re-cast the vote for that character.

 

[AuraShaman]

I'm guessing I can cast my votes by posting, so I'll be doing just that. Heeeeeeeere we go!
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+1 Ridley (can I add +4 just because I'm that desperate?.... Kidding. ^^'): Fifteen years of heated debate, and not once has this popular villain been playable in a mod as good as Project M. He and his fans have been the butt of Smash jokes for too long, and its time for his revenge! While his role in Smash 4 is debatable due to Sakurai's vague behavior (stacking up to how he's normally quick and straight to the point when he disconfirms a character), I feel it would be best to include Ridley in Project M just in case he becomes a boss again. This could very well be Ridley's only chance in being playable on a popular Smash game (yes, I consider Project M to be its own game).

This, however, should wait until Smash 4's Japanese release so we can discover the full roster, and not rely on any leaks! Ridley has been bigger than Samus in every game, so to keep to that tradition, Ridley should downscaled to a fair size, but still be noticeably bigger than Samus. Sometimes, you just need to throw logic out the window in order to please everybody.

Spoiler: a brief example of his moveset

Ridley should have brilliant air game, but rather sluggish on the ground; almost like Jigglypuff, but heavier, and arguably more handsome. All his tail-based attacks will have a sweetspot on the tip.

Since he has wings, it's obvious that Ridley needs a Special that transitions into a glide. I'd actually like his Neutral B to be two different variations; one is a rapid-fire fireball attack in which you tap the B button multiple times, and the other is a charge-up fireball that you hold down B for. Rapid-Fire shoots 5-8 fireballs in quick succession, and you can tilt his head to move your aim. Charge-up charges a giant fireball similar to Samus' Charge Shot, but with more explosive results!

Ridley's side B could be a fusion of Ike's Quick Draw, Ganondorf's Flame Choke, and Fox/Falco's side-B. Ridley can charge it up, and release to zip past enemies like his SSE boss incarnation. Also, you can press B before passing the target to transition into a command grab! On the ground, he mercilessly incinerates the target, and on the air, he plummets to the ground with his victim; good for a last-resort K.O.!

I want to see his pogo tail implemented in some way, either as a down B, or a down arial. Just something reminiscent to that. Also, maybe make his tail grind his dash attack? We gotta enforce that glorified arial game over sluggish ground game.

EDIT: I wanted to avoid suggesting an Up-B since I felt it wasn't original, but I might aswell. The ground version can be a damage-inducing version of Charizard's Down-B, but Ridley can also perform a Shuttle Loop and transition into a glide if you press Up-B again in the air. He will immediately Shuttle Loop if you press Up-B and he's already in the air. Again, didn't wanna share this because I felt it was unoriginal. (that, and it kinda supports the biased excuse that Ridley would be a Charizard clone)

The fans have suffered prejudice long enough; his debut is long overdue!

EDIT: If Ridley's wings are gonna be resized to be larger, I strongly recommend a Meta Ridley skin for one of his alts.
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+1 Bowser Jr.: Again, another one that should wait until Smash 4's Japanese release. After seeing the SS--whatever leak, I grew fond of him and his Koopa Clown Car. Does it make sense that it can't fly? Not really, but we can give it a spring for his ground jump! Maybe change his Up-B to something more unique, like him flying up while wearing a spiked hat. Maybe some attacks like throwing Bomb-ombs for his Down-B, and using robot boxing gloves for his jabs and tilts!
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+0.5 Paper Mario: People complain Paper Mario would be one Mario rep too many; I disagree. @aldelaro5 made a good point that Paper Mario would represent his own franchise, and has lots of moveset potential. Plus, everyone just plain loves him!
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+1 Black Shadow & New Ganondorf: I am one of the few people who likes Falcondork, especially the P.M. version! I love the concept of a an evil wizard that isn't afraid to bloody his knuckles, and amplify his hits with dark magic!

But...it would be both stubborn and bias of me to say no to change. I really do feel the Falcondork moves are more fitting for Black Shadow, and that Ganondorf needs more magic-centered attacks. I do, however, wish that not all his attacks consists of swords, as he doesn't even use them that much.
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+1 Waluigi: Because WARIO, DANGIT! WAAAAAAAAAAHHHH!!! Maybe replace Luigi's Waluigi costume with Dr. Luigi, or something in the lines of that. Or heck, more Mr. L colorations!

.....What, it's happening with the other new alts.
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+0.5 Ninten: I originally casted a downvote on him because he looks too similar to Ness, but the more I thought about it, the more hypocritical I felt about it. I'm a Dark Pit supporter, so you'd think I know how it feels to be looked down on for supporting a glorified Pit clone (which is so untrue!... The clone part), but apparently I wasn't thinking. Earthbound and Mother 3 have their reps, so why not add a rep for the first Mother? Still confused on how they'd give him new moves, and not mimic PK Starstorm/PSI Magnet/PK Thunder (I'm starting to think PK Thunder is becoming a staple move for the Mother reps). I'd rather want Ness to wear Ninten's clothes as an alt, but now that I think about it, it wouldn't be doing him justice. Save the Ninten/Ness alt as a condolence if he doesn't make it as a separate character.

Also, for the sake of nostalgia, give Ninten Ness' PSI sound clips. Oh, and some bubble/spiral-shaped PSI effects like how Ness' is spark-like, and how Lucas' is hexagonal.

Spoiler: Dark Pit-related

Note to PMBR: see if you can change the color of Dark Pit's bow to silver to make him an even more visually unique skin of Pit. Maybe even change the glow of his wings to purple, if that's possible. Thanks! :3

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-1 Hector: Same reason as I originally had for Ninten, except he's already an Ike alt. However, if Lyn gets in as a playable character, I'd love see Hector as a part of her Final Smash the same way Chrom is a part of Robin's Final Smash.
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-1 Pokémon Trainer: I personally find it too weird having a lone human trainer as a Pokémon rep that's already filled with nothing but Pokémon.
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-1 Masked Man

Spoiler

First post said it best; he's a walking spoiler.

Speaking of Masked Man, why not make a new Lucas alt with both the Masked Man outfit, and Claus' copper hair? Eh? Eeeehhhhh? *nudge-nudge*

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-1 Tom Nook: I feel like since Animal Crossing is already recieving representation in Smash 4, it would be pointless to add Tom Nook in PM at this point...unless you wanna rip Villager's moves straight-off.
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These are my votes for Project M. I really hope I didn't bramble for too much, and that my words mean something. Thank you for listening!




Man, I'm treating this as if it were an X-mas wishlist....








......Oh, and a +1 to K. Rool! I was originally gonna leave my vote out on him since I already casted five of my votes, but I couldn't resist. Memorable villain, Smash needs more villains, and isn't getting enough love from Nintendo.

 

[Shin F.]

I'm also confused on how they'd give him new moves, and not mimic PK Starstorm/PSI Magnet/PK Thunder.

You're free to still feel however you want about him, but if you want to see how he could have totally unique moves, you could always check out this moveset here.

http://smashboards.com/threads/clon...results-3-15-14.341479/page-291#post-16518709

 

[Sour Supreme]

I think Ninten looks too similar to Ness.

@ Solbliminal GET UP IN THIS SHIZZ AND SHOW HIM HOW WE DO.

 

[Exodo]

You're free to still feel however you want about him, but if you want to see how he could have totally unique moves, you could always check out this moveset here.

http://smashboards.com/threads/clon...results-3-15-14.341479/page-291#post-16518709

i love watching that moveset concept :3

 

[Exodo]

seriously again sorry dont know why it keeps doble posting

 

[Solbliminal]

@ Solbliminal GET UP IN THIS SHIZZ AND SHOW HIM HOW WE DO.

DA HELL DID I MISS?! I DO EET RIGHT NOW BRAH!!

- 1 Ninten: I'm sorry if I sound bias, but I think Ninten looks too similar to Ness. I used to think they were they same person before I did some research. I'm also confused on how they'd give him new moves, and not mimic PK Starstorm/PSI Magnet/PK Thunder. Again, because Ninten looks so similar to Ness, I'd be much more comfortable if he were a Ness alt.

Joke post from above aside, Ninten is actually quite different from Ness. Even in his original appearance. He is built differently in his clay model. Which compared to Ness, it really does look different. But if that really isn't enough, the chances are that Ninten is likely to receive a redesign to better fit the current, more modern character designs. Similar to how Pit and Ice Climbers were redesigned to fit Smash Bros. I've actually dedicated a bit of time to exploring his traits and composing a look for him that would set him apart. Here is the final design I've come up with:

As for his playstyle, people on this board such as Shin F., Psykid, and EdgeTheLucas have all defended how different this character would play from Ness. Because he would be different. This character's traits are vastly different from Ness, being that Ninten is more reliant on being the supporter / tool user of his group. If you want more details on that though, I would personally ask Shin F.

This post is in no way shape or form trying to make you change your vote, but to help you understand that this character can be different. Also, if you have been keeping up with the leaks on Smash 4:

Spoiler

We are likely getting Dark Pit as a character, so it isn't really that strong of an argument to say a character looking too much like another is really that big of a deal. Just saying.

 

[Sour Supreme]

seriously again sorry dont know why it keeps doble posting

doble

 

[Exodo]

doble

triple

 

[MLGF]

OK, I don't even care if Ninten is in or not. But don't use Dark Pit as a justification for similar looking characters. Dark Pit is clearly similar to Doc and Lucina, so he's clearly just a glorified Alt Color with a slightly modified moveset. That's fine in Sm4sh because they can put in any amount of characters and Dark Pit is just a nice padding bonus. In PM, we have five slots and that's a fixed number. Dark Pit does not have to deal with a fixed max, so he's excusable, Ninten does not have that luxury so him being similar is much more of a con in here then in PM

 

[Sour Supreme]

OK, I don't even care if Ninten is in or not. But don't use Dark Pit as a justification for similar looking characters. Dark Pit is clearly similar to Doc and Lucina, so he's clearly just a glorified Alt Color with a slightly modified moveset. That's fine in Sm4sh because they can put in any amount of characters and Dark Pit is just a nice padding bonus. In PM, we have five slots and that's a fixed number. Dark Pit does not have to deal with a fixed max, so he's excusable, Ninten does not have that luxury so him being similar is much more of a con in here then in PM

Did you just ignore the majority of the post.

 

[Solbliminal]

But don't use Dark Pit as a justification for similar looking characters.

I just did.

 

[Shin F.]

OK, I don't even care if Ninten is in or not. But don't use Dark Pit as a justification for similar looking characters. Dark Pit is clearly similar to Doc and Lucina, so he's clearly just a glorified Alt Color with a slightly modified moveset. That's fine in Sm4sh because they can put in any amount of characters and Dark Pit is just a nice padding bonus. In PM, we have five slots and that's a fixed number. Dark Pit does not have to deal with a fixed max, so he's excusable, Ninten does not have that luxury so him being similar is much more of a con in here then in PM

I know it's easy to only want super-unique characters, but let's not forget how much work PMBR have to put in to do these and that being similar is actually a bonus because it allows them to bring in new characters without putting in as many hours. In fact, you'll note that being unique and requiring a unique moveset is consistently listed as a con, not a pro. There's a reason for that.

The point with Dark Pit isn't an attempt to give reasons to add Ninten, it's a (valid) counter-argument to the idea that just because characters look similar, they should only be costumes.

 

[Exodo]

OK, I don't even care if Ninten is in or not. But don't use Dark Pit as a justification for similar looking characters. Dark Pit is clearly similar to Doc and Lucina, so he's clearly just a glorified Alt Color with a slightly modified moveset. That's fine in Sm4sh because they can put in any amount of characters and Dark Pit is just a nice padding bonus. In PM, we have five slots and that's a fixed number. Dark Pit does not have to deal with a fixed max, so he's excusable, Ninten does not have that luxury so him being similar is much more of a con in here then in PM

im guessing you understand what they mean with CLONE ENGINE CHARACTERS right?

what i mean is that they are supposed to resemble their character base in a way, and the model could be easily tweaked to differentiate from Ness

 

[Da Black Rabbit]

I just did.

But jeeze man, did you have too? Really rubs me the wrong way that Dark Pit might actually be playable... 3 games in its series, with only one of them being a major success and the franchise gets more reps then DK. That is BS...

Gaw.. don't mind me. I'm just salty about Doc and angsty emo pit. :/

 

[MLGF]

Did you just ignore the majority of the post.

I argued the only part that bugged me. The rest of it looked fine, but I think that's such a silly way to justify a character.

im guessing you understand what they mean with CLONE ENGINE CHARACTERS right?

what i mean is that they are supposed to resemble their character base in a way, and the model could be easily tweaked to differentiate from Ness

*facepalm*
No, that's not it. A clone character in this game is made from a base of another character and shares single player stats. It has nothing to do with how similar they are to another character.
Mewtwo and Lucario bare little resemblance, people are requesting Isaac, Ridley, etc. These characters don't bare any semblance with their origin. Clearly you have little idea of what you're talking about.

 

[AuraShaman]

DA HELL DID I MISS?! I DO EET RIGHT NOW BRAH!!



Joke post from above aside, Ninten is actually quite different from Ness. Even in his original appearance. He is built differently in his clay model. Which compared to Ness, it really does look different. But if that really isn't enough, the chances are that Ninten is likely to receive a redesign to better fit the current, more modern character designs. Similar to how Pit and Ice Climbers were redesigned to fit Smash Bros. I've actually dedicated a bit of time to exploring his traits and composing a look for him that would set him apart. Here is the final design I've come up with:

As for his playstyle, people on this board such as Shin F., Psykid, and EdgeTheLucas have all defended how different this character would play from Ness. Because he would be different. This character's traits are vastly different from Ness, being that Ninten is more reliant on being the supporter / tool user of his group. If you want more details on that though, I would personally ask Shin F.

This post is in no way shape or form trying to make you change your vote, but to help you understand that this character can be different. Also, if you have been keeping up with the leaks on Smash 4:

Spoiler

We are likely getting Dark Pit as a character, so it isn't really that strong of an argument to say a character looking too much like another is really that big of a deal. Just saying.

...You really want me feeling bad, don't you? Not only was I biased, but I appear as hypocritical because I actually support Dark Pit! ....Way to go to make me feel like a jerk.

 

[Shin F.]

I argued the only part that bugged me. The rest of it looked fine, but I think that's such a silly way to justify a character.

Like I said - it's not a justification so much as it is a counter-argument. People say he won't work because he looks too similar? Wasn't a problem with Dark Pit. It's not a reason for his inclusion, it's a statement that nullifies a reason against him - there's a pretty significant difference.

...You really want me feeling bad, don't you? Not only was I biased, but I appear as hypocritical because I actually support Dark Pit! ....Way to go to make me feel like a jerk.

We don't want you to feel bad. We just want to show that there can be more to him than just Ness 0.5.

 

[Sour Supreme]

...You really want me feeling bad, don't you? Not only was I biased, but I appear as hypocritical because I actually support Dark Pit! ....Way to go to make me feel like a jerk.

That's not it! Your opinions are perfectly fine! We just like to make sure people understand how we envision the character. If you still feel like downvoting Ninten go for it.

 

[MLGF]

Like I said - it's not a justification so much as it is a counter-argument. People say he won't work because he looks too similar? Wasn't a problem with Dark Pit. It's not a reason for his inclusion, it's a statement that nullifies a reason against him - there's a pretty significant difference.

Don't understand, I get that. I'm just saying while that's a great counterargument for Sm4sh, it is not a good one for Project M due to a limited amount of slots, meaning that having a similar looking character would receive more backlash then the alt clones are currently getting. That isn't to say there aren't good Ninten reasons, as so many of you supporters have passionately provided, but by god it's biased to say this is not a significant hindrance for the character.

Actually, in retrospect...
And before anything, this isn't out of spite. This is me kinda realizing that Ninten is being the most supported Mother character and I find that incredibly annoying.

Changing my 1/2 on Masked Man to a +1

-1 Ninten

My reasons being is that while he clearly does posses unique moveset potential, it's clear that he does not offer anything visually unique compared to the other series protagonists. While a trio finish would be nice, it's also important to consider how Ninten would end up looking extremely similar to other EB characters. People are either justifying him as a semi clone, or a new character with just a similar. Based on how he looks however, either way he would not be seen fondly due to his visual appearance would make either version of his inclusion feel weak. A complete change to his appearance also weakens his connection with his original design, so it's a very hard spot for the kid.
Masked Man on the other hand has very obvious moveset potential and visually stands out to the other Earthbound characters while clearly being within the same series. Him being very different from the other two feels much more fitting for his character and even a semi clone would be nicer simply due to offering a different visual style. Also his moveset potential is just by far the easiest to theorize for EB characters not already in. Yes, Lucas has the alt costume, but I think the kid has a bit more then just his uniform (his is a darker pallet anyhow) that's visually striking.

That being said, not a single vote matters this deep in, I'm sure the PMBR (They'll always be that in my heart :3) has already figured out who they want.

 

[Solbliminal]

...You really want me feeling bad, don't you? Not only was I biased, but I appear as hypocritical because I actually support Dark Pit! ....Way to go to make me feel like a jerk.

I wasn't at all trying to make you feel guilty. I would have to be able to read minds to have known you liked Dark Pit. It was just an example.

 

[AuraShaman]

We don't want you to feel bad. We just want to show that there can be more to him than just Ness 0.5.

I wasn't at all trying to make you feel guilty. I would have to be able to read minds to have known you liked Dark Pit. It was just an example.

That's not it! Your opinions are perfectly fine! We just like to make sure people understand how we envision the character. If you still feel like downvoting Ninten go for it.

Just edited my post to be a bit lighter on the guy. I'm still downvoting him, but I told the vote collecters to not count it if I sound hypocritical to them.

Still, I think it would be pretty cool and funny if Ness were to wear Ninten's original clothing as an alt. Ninten can still get the outfit @ Solbliminal had in mind if he makes it in.

 

[Sour Supreme]

Just edited my post to be a bit lighter on the guy. I'm still downvoting him, but I told the vote collecters to not count it if I sound hypocritical to them.

Still, I think it would be pretty cool and funny if Ness were to wear Ninten's original clothing as an alt. Ninten can still get the outfit @ Solbliminal had in mind if he makes it in.

Just as long as you don't feel like a jerk! You were actually just more respective than the usual.

 

[Shin F.]

This is me kinda realizing that Ninten is being the most supported Mother character and I find that incredibly annoying.

As always, you're free to vote however you want, but you realize this is completely false, right? Masked Man has a lot more support.

 

[Sour Supreme]

Ninten can't get no love.

 

[MLGF]

As always, you're free to vote however you want, but you realize this is completely false, right? Masked Man has a lot more support.

I feel he has lost some stream while Ninten is growing and I find that silly, Masked Man needs love.

Man, I love holding onto my votes for almost a year.

 

[Solbliminal]

, I think it would be pretty cool and funny if Ness were to wear Ninten's original clothing as an alt. Ninten can still get the outfit @ Solbliminal had in mind if he makes it in.

Oh no worries man. But honestly, I don't really see a point in making Ninten an alt. Regardless, I'm not nearly as strong of a supporter to Ninten as the others here. But the concept of the character intrigues me. I really do go out of my way to help the little guy out because I feel his existence as the original protagonist justifies him a slot on the roster. It wouldn't greatly upset me if he ended up not making it though.

 

[Sour Supreme]

As a supporter of Masked Man and Ninten, I can admit justly that Ninten is a better option for Project M.

That's not to say I wouldn't love MM. Anyone who remembers when I showed up knows that I was like a die-hard Masked Man supporter. But, Shin's moveset paired with his render, and Sol's reworked design of the fellow has helped me to get over the general negativity that is brought with the character. (Too similar to Ness, just another clone.)

Masked Man has some cool moveset potential, with his sword, cannon, wings, and PSI. But as far as who is logically superior, that's Ninten.

Masked Man is in one fight and pretty much uses the same attack over and over again. Ninten, on the other hand is in every fight for an entire installment of the series.

Tell me again he has less to work with than Masked Man.

 

[AuraShaman]

I've edited my vote on Ninten again. This time, I've given him a +1/2 to make it better. I also suggested the Ness alt as a condolence in case Ninten doesn't make it in.

 

[CBO0tz]

Soo when are we gonna see the new results for the vote of most popular top 5?

 

[Solbliminal]

Soo when are we gonna see the new results for the vote of most popular top 5?

When we put them up.

 

[GunBuster]

thread needs more Sami.

as far as i'm concerned snake got fixed by the PMBR and actually reflects his sneaky nature now. However his brute force play from vBrawl should be brought back on one of these CE characters, and it easily transitions itself to Sami. Hell, she could just have some tilts and smash attacks copied to her from other characters to cut the time needed down.

actually, you know what I want to see? some moves return from vbrawl (obviously buffed for the PM environment). like ganon's original ^smash and some of falco's moves. in fact, one of these clones should have captain falcon's forward smash from smash 64.

I can dream.

 

[GFooChombey]

thread needs more Sami.

View attachment 23188

as far as i'm concerned snake got fixed by the PMBR and actually reflects his sneaky nature now. However his brute force play from vBrawl should be brought back on one of these CE characters, and it easily transitions itself to Sami. Hell, she could just have some tilts and smash attacks copied to her from other characters to cut the time needed down.

actually, you know what I want to see? some moves return from vbrawl (obviously buffed for the PM environment). like ganon's original ^smash and some of falco's moves. in fact, one of these clones should have captain falcon's forward smash from smash 64.

I can dream.

I've wanted Falcon's 64 f smash back since I remembered it was different at Zenith. HYA!

 

[NisforSmash]

I've wanted Falcon's 64 f smash back since I remembered it was different at Zenith. HYA!

While Falcon's 64 fsmash was pretty awesome, i've always wanted Falcon's 64 falcon punch back. It was so much quicker than his melee and brawl version and could actually be used for finishing a combo/going for the kill. Not only that but if he were given it, it would further seperate his and ganondorf's movesets. He would have a quick and deadly irreversible punch where ganon would have the slow and reversible one he does now. Plus the sound effect from 64 combined with scream of whoever was unlucky enough to get hit by it was the most destructive/hype thing from that game. (Next to kirby's upsmash at high percentages)

 

[PlateProp]

I argued the only part that bugged me. The rest of it looked fine, but I think that's such a silly way to justify a character.


*facepalm*
No, that's not it. A clone character in this game is made from a base of another character and shares single player stats. It has nothing to do with how similar they are to another character.
Mewtwo and Lucario bare little resemblance, people are requesting Isaac, Ridley, etc. These characters don't bare any semblance with their origin. Clearly you have little idea of what you're talking about.

I just wanted to say that M2 is a special case, and that you shouldn't think that all the characters for clone engine(if made) will get this treatment.

Too many people fail to realized that clone engine characters will be most like Fox/Falco or Roy/Marth, instead of Lucario/M2

 

[-Nesta-]

+1 Masked Man
+1 Ninten



no bias

 

[PlateProp]

+1 Masked Man
+1 Ninten



no bias

All the bias

 

[Sour Supreme]

+1 Masked Man
+1 Ninten



no bias

Someone get this man a drink and a pat on the back.