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New Characters for Project M Discussion Thread (Voting Closed)

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THE_MAAFIA

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In my opinion, I think the project M back room should work on characters (for now) that are 100% not playable in smash.
I don't know why, but I have a weird and scared feeling Isaac will make it to sm4sh. So I think PM;BR should work on characters that are definitely not gonna be in Sm4sh so that they don't spend about 400 hours, then the character gets confirmed for smash 4 and there hard work gets scrapped. As much as i hate to say this, They should work on Isaac in the future. And work on characters like for example: Ashley, Waluigi, and others who are definitely not playable in Sm4sh
 

Empyrean

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In my opinion, I think the project M back room should work on characters (for now) that are 100% not playable in smash.
I don't know why, but I have a weird and scared feeling Isaac will make it to sm4sh. So I think PM;BR should work on characters that are definitely not gonna be in Sm4sh so that they don't spend about 400 hours, then the character gets confirmed for smash 4 and there hard work gets scrapped. As much as i hate to say this, They should work on Isaac in the future. And work on characters like for example: Ashley, Waluigi, and others who are definitely not playable in Sm4sh
This has been said maybe a thousand times, but if the BR starts working on Isaac before any type of confirmation for Smash 4, and then at some point Isaac becomes playable in Smash 4, then the BR will just continue their work and nothing would be scrapped. It's only if the confirmation happens before they start working that they will just forget about making Isaac.
 

SmashBrosPM

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I'm a bit disapointed with the top performers...
I'm totally fine with Isaac and Black Shadow/Sword Ganondorf... But If I were you, I would added only one new Metroid Characters. Ridley or Dark Samus. The 2 are really good so I can't say which one I prefer, but Dark Samus could be easier to do than Ridley (clonable).
As I said before, I'm totally against Lyn, because it will put the number of the Fire Emblem series roster to 4 (like the Mario Series) and that these 2 series haven't the same importance. Also, again a character using swords...
For King K. Roll, I don't know what to say... I think that Dixie Kong don't have much votes because many thinking of an apparence in SSB4... Dixie Kong is a female major character of the Donkey Kong Series, the main character in DC3, and is easily clonable! I think she has a better potential!
 

Ginge

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I think the Back Room can and will make their own choices on who they will work on and when.

Though if I had to bet, I'd say (official release) playable Waluigi is not likely to happen.
 

kyleglor

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My first vote goes to Skull Kid, it would be amazing to see his final smash be him spirit bombing the moon on the stage
 
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Phyvo

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The fact that you didn't know there was voting or who Isaac was tells me you didn't really read the OP at all...
I actually read a good deal of the OP, mainly the character grading, which evidently was not pertinent, and on other occasions I mainly read the latest posts (which at the time did not mention voting) I might have even read the Isaac entry but given it was probably a month ago, I didn't know who he was, I didn't know his series, and he wasn't a character I cared about, I'm not surprised that I forgot.

I'm not trying to say that anyone in here was somehow at fault for not informing me properly, rather, I thought that my ignorance of whole situation was pretty humorous.
 

Solbliminal

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Mfw, Ray has literally zero down-votes.

Edit: So does Lip, lol.
More like Solbliminal knows his marketing. If the community weren't so against Shadow from the beginning, he'd be at the top by now. :p
I didn't realize my words had that big of an impact. Wish I would have spoke up about characters like Ninten, Lip, and Ashley sooner.

Take those with a grain a salt. I never got to adding them to the OP, so it's not like people would go out of their way to vote against them.
To be fair, the fact they weren't in the OP also means people wouldn't go out of their way to vote for them as well. Generally, anyone active enough in this thread to vote on a character is also active enough to vote against a character. So I think Ray stood a pretty good chance from the start. His introduction was just late. Though I'm not too sure about Lip. I would hope she would do well, but something tells me she would be dubbed loli by an incoming majority, suffering the same fate as poor Sukapon.
 
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Friesnchip

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You know, I have a feeling that character discussion might halt without the voting system in place... so I wouldn't mind taking over for Anti Guy if people want to keep going with this thread...
 

arcticfox8

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Voting is over you could always vote for Lip you could vote for literally ANYONE
But now you can't because voting is over
Please understand
 

Shin F.

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You know, I have a feeling that character discussion might halt without the voting system in place... so I wouldn't mind taking over for Anti Guy if people want to keep going with this thread...
I thought about doing this as well, but I really don't have the time for it. Something else I thought about was that to save ourselves some time and effort, a few of us could share a Dropbox folder with the votes in a spreadsheet in it. That way, a number of us would be able to update the votes and it wouldn't be too much for any one of us to keep up with.
 

JCOnyx

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You know, I'd worry about someone taking over tallying the votes. If anyone eventually does, I'd hope they'd follow the same guidelines that Anti-Guy has already implemented and not allow any changes to previous votes (unless they get the spreadsheet) because of how difficult it would be to keep track. And also not allow any bias to influence who they put in the results (like if I took over and put Dracula in for instance, even though he conflicts with rule #1).

I would have been less worried if Shin F. did take over, but he has already stated he'd be too busy with school. Friesnchip did post on page 1 of this thread so he seems to have some credibility as well. I'd also nominate Sobliminal if he'd be up to the task.

I also wouldn't mind keeping track of votes myself, the only reason I really come to the boards is because of this thread to be honest. I haven't posted nearly as often as you guys but I'm in here at least once everyday. I'm also currently out of school so I'd only would have to worry about work getting in the way. You could refer to my Ease of Creation List for a reference on my work style:

List of possible Clone Engine candidates based on ease of creation:

- Dark Samus
- Ninten
- Shadow (If he remains extremely similar to Sonic, meaning no projectiles like guns or chaos magic)
- Knuckles
- Pichu (Based on Roy's implementation, I'm positive her workload would be a little more then people are estimating)
- Telda

- Micaiah (Because of her using Tomes, I've decided that her animations would most likely have to deviate some from Zelda's)
- Claus/Masked Man
- Liquid Snake (Can much more closely resemble Snake, animation wise compared to Sami/Andy. Would still require a pretty elaborate model to be made though)
- Bowser Jr. (hasn't moved because of peoples want to give him the paint stick, which would require more than just giving him Bowser's moveset, but could be a tier lower if they decided to do just that)
- Hector

- Sami/Andy (Their animations would probably have to be tweaked more so than Liquid due to their different body sizes and proportions)
- Tetra (It depends on how they'd want to make this character. She could be one rank higher if she had an extremely similar moveset like Tink or Shiek, but I don't see that happening)
- Lip (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge. Could possibly play more like Lucas or Ness to lessen the workload)
- Lyn (She could be more of a challenge if they decide to incorporate her iaido style swordplay. Even if they make the model from scratch, they have a decent base to follow)
- Samurai Goroh (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge. Even if they make the model from scratch, they have a decent base to follow)
- Waluigi (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge. Even if they make the model from scratch, they have a decent base to follow)

- Tails (Flight animations and balancing a speedy character who can possibly float cancel, definitely a challenge)
- Black Shadow/Ganondorf (Even though they'd just have to create a model for Black Shadow, creating Dorfs sword moveset would be a challenge. This also implies that they are working on two characters at once, which is a pain)
- Krystal (First ever staff user, would be a challenge since they have no animations to base hers off of)
- Toad (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge. Just porting him over Mario would look extremely awkward, as his arms are tiny and all of the punching moves would be off because of this. Would require a lot of new animations then people are estimating)
- Tom Nook (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge. Animations would have to be made from scratch, but aren't as difficult as some of the higher tiers)
- Kamek (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge. Animations would have to be made from scratch, but aren't as difficult as some of the higher tiers)
- Saki (Possibly much more of a challenge, but could potentially resemble Pit more so than I originally thought)

- Dixie (The hair would be quite a challenge, especially involving grabs and pummels. Animating it wouldn't be easy either)
- Skull Kid (Would require a creative moveset, and his animations could potentially be extremely difficult. They could just make them look bat**** crazy though and it would work for the character)
- Ridley (Animating winged character's is never easy, and creating a suitable model with fluid animations would be a challenge. The workload could be a little less if they try to make him resemble Charizard as closely as possible, but the same could be said about the opposite)

- Mach Rider (Possible projectiles, bike riding, and whip/tethers would be a challenge)
- Sukapon (Even if the model would be simple, creating such a unique moveset would be a challenge. Also, unorthodox hit-boxes and has no real base to work from. All animations would be made from scratch, even if they base some of his moves off of other characters)
- Pokemon Trainer/Red (Would require a very creative moveset, and even though balancing isn't being brought up as much, a character who can possibly throw out random pokemon via pokeballs would be a nightmare. Because of people's varying concepts, wanting pokemon to appear for certain attacks, among other things, animating all of this could be extremely challenging)
- Paper Mario (Since people seem to want his moveset have his party members come in to help him, I've decided to place him here because of all the extra modeling work that would require or if that's even possible to begin with, he's basically in the same boat as Pokemon Trainer/Red)
- Boo (A character that is always floating... I expect this would be extremely challenging)
- King K. Rool (With his only possible base being DDD, and even that is far stretched, he would be extremely challenging)
- Issac (Moveset would require a lot of creativity, his psyenergy would be a challenge)

- Pulse & Minun (See Ice Climbers)

*new change list 11/27*
- New tiers added
- Micaiah bumped up 1 tier due to the possibilities of her tomes creating more challenges in animating her attacks.
- Sami/Andy, Tetra, Lip, Lyn, Goroh, and Waluigi have moved to the new Light Orange tier because of their deceptive difficulty, could potentially be Yellow or Orange.
- Skull Kid, Dixie, and Ridley has been moved to the new Dark Orange tier because of their deceptive difficulty, could potentially be Orange or Red.
- Saki moved down 2 tiers due to possibilities of more closely resembling Pit and taking balancing out of the equation
- Pulse & Minun have a tier of difficulty all to themselves

*old change list 11/26*
- Black Shadow/Ganondorf moved up 1 tier due to possible challenges creating a decent sword moveset for Dorf



Please note that characters within each tier are not in any particular order.
Wow, sorry for making this post feel like a political campaign... but some of you probably have the same concerns I do.

EDIT: OMG the best kind of ninja. I love that idea Shin F. of a group of us keeping track of the votes and placing them in a dropbox. Who would all be up to it?
 
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CardiganBoy

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Dark Samus went up to 5th place?!
THANK YOU BASED GOD

Not that it means anything, of course, but it's awesome to know the support it got.
 
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andalsoandy

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We need a new thread with every new character idea we've come up with since the voting started. It's hardly fair that only the characters in the OP were really voted for when there have been tons of other characters discussed more than the ones in the OP.

I feel like at this point, every possible character has been brought up, and we need to restart voting.
 

Anti Guy

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Let me know if you need my spreadsheet if you want to go forward with that

It's hardly fair that only the characters in the OP were really voted for when there have been tons of other characters discussed more than the ones in the OP.
A lot of that is due to the people in this thread's tendency to dig in the bottom of the barrel. The recent flurry of group voting doesn't necessarily reflect the general population at all.
 
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andalsoandy

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Let me know if you need my spreadsheet if you want to go forward with that



A lot of that is due to the people in this thread's tendency to dig in the bottom of the barrel. The recent flurry of group voting doesn't necessarily reflect the general population at all.
Well the general population should probably at least know what all of the possible character choices are.

Take Ninten for example: if he had been in the OP with a few movesets and other ideas, he probably would have had a lot more votes than what he had in the end.
 

Anti Guy

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Well the general population should probably at least know what all of the possible character choices are.

Take Ninten for example: if he had been in the OP with a few movesets and other ideas, he probably would have had a lot more votes than what he had in the end.
While that's true, in the end it really hardly makes a difference. Ninten will never get that many votes, and his chances of actually being one of the five is virtually 0%, no matter how intriguing a moveset you can make. Probably the only one that's not in the OP and has somewhat of a chance is Ray.
 

JCOnyx

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Making a new thread probably wouldn't be worth the effort since it could generate just as much confusion from past voters as it would garner attention for newer clone candidates. The only issue I can see arising in this thread, is if we would want to update the OP we'd have to contact Anti Guy.

TBH we just shouldn't update the OP and bother Anti Guy at all unless we'd want to post the newest results, which should only be updated about every 2-3 months. But the biggest concern is if Anti Guy is willing to stick around for this thread at all anymore. Don't want to bother him if he's ready to let this thread go, I would completely understand after tallying votes for it for over 5 months.
 

Shin F.

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Making a new thread probably wouldn't be worth the effort since it could generate just as much confusion from past voters as it would garner attention for newer clone candidates. The only issue I can see arising in this thread, is if we would want to update the OP we'd have to contact Anti Guy.

TBH we just shouldn't update the OP and bother Anti Guy at all unless we'd want to post the newest results, which should only be updated about every 2-3 months. But the biggest concern is if Anti Guy is willing to stick around for this thread at all anymore. Don't want to bother him if he's ready to let this thread go, I would completely understand after tallying votes for it for over 5 months.
Isn't it possible for a mod or admin to make someone else the OP? I'm sure I've seen that done before.
 
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Anti Guy

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If you guys want to add in characters and stuff for me, just post it and I'll update it. The most annoying thing about updating the OP is that all the formatting gets messed up -- I dunno if it still does that since the last update though.
 

JCOnyx

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As I said in one of my first posts here, I wasn't much of a forum guy. The thought crossed my mind that it could be possible to change the thread owner, but I just wanted to check with Anti Guy about what he wanted to do first. Common courtesy and all you know.

I remember that you were having problems updating the OP as well with formatting issues, and to be honest, just when I tried to quote my own post all the colors got messed up and I had to fix them. I don't think that issue has been solved yet.
 

EdgeTheLucas

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While that's true, in the end it really hardly makes a difference. Ninten will never get that many votes, and his chances of actually being one of the five is virtually 0%, no matter how intriguing a moveset you can make. Probably the only one that's not in the OP and has somewhat of a chance is Ray.
This hurts me as a Mother fan

because I know it's true :(

I can already hear the whiners when he'd be theoretically revealed:

"What the ****? It's just Ness again, yo-yo and everything!"

"Why isn't the PMBR working on someone cool like Isaac instead?"

"They're paying WAY too much respect to a dead franchise like Mother. That series is saturated as ****. I mean now they have THREE characters? :facepalm:"

I mean I can counter all of those complaints, but I know it wouldn't do any good, considering the Smash fanbase...
 

Shin F.

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This hurts me as a Mother fan

because I know it's true :(

I can already hear the whiners when he'd be theoretically revealed:

"What the ****? It's just Ness again, yo-yo and everything!"

"Why isn't the PMBR working on someone cool like Isaac instead?"

"They're paying WAY too much respect to a dead franchise like Mother. That series is saturated as ****. I mean now they have THREE characters? :facepalm:"

I mean I can counter all of those complaints, but I know it wouldn't do any good, considering the Smash fanbase...
Unless 80% of the PMBR happen to be big Earthbound fans, pretty much.
 

andalsoandy

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I really think there have been ideas discussed in this thread that have been better than many of the characters in the OP.
 

Anti Guy

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This hurts me as a Mother fan

because I know it's true :(

I can already hear the whiners when he'd be theoretically revealed:

"What the ****? It's just Ness again, yo-yo and everything!"

"Why isn't the PMBR working on someone cool like Isaac instead?"

"They're paying WAY too much respect to a dead franchise like Mother. That series is saturated as ****. I mean now they have THREE characters? :facepalm:"

I mean I can counter all of those complaints, but I know it wouldn't do any good, considering the Smash fanbase...
I appreciate that you can see the difference between your opinion and desires vs what the big picture situation and likelihood are.. It doesn't happen much in this thread. :p
 

EdgeTheLucas

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@ arcticfox8 arcticfox8

Aww, I forgive you. :)

I just don't want to see more flame wars about Blackendorf or Pichu and a whole lot of other stuff because, quite frankly, what's the point if voting is finally over? I just want to discuss other stuff now.

@ P PsionicSabreur

Smashboards ate the above statement so I couldn't respond and say he wasn't being totally terrible in time. Has Smashboards been breaking for anyone else this frequently?
 
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JCOnyx

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Bowser Jr. is the Scrappy of the Mario franchise.

Even E. Gadd would be better.

if he was eligible, that is. :(
Well sorry that I like Bowser and would like a smaller, lighter version so he could actually be competitively viable. He's just the sandbag in disguise at this point now that people are learning the matchup.

That's not to say it's the only reason I voted for him. I like the character too somewhat... *sweat drop*
 

EdgeTheLucas

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Well sorry that I like Bowser and would like a smaller, lighter version so he could actually be competitively viable. He's just the sandbag in disguise at this point now that people are learning the matchup.

That's not to say it's the only reason I voted for him. I like the character too somewhat... *sweat drop*
Well, creating a new Bowser clone to make him competitively viable isn't really the answer. If he's doing badly then the PMBR will see fit to tweak him. Plus he's naturally a punisher anyway so the more people watch themselves the less well he'll do.

Don't worry, nobody is dumb for liking Bowser Jr. It's just a majority of Mario fans just don't like him all that much.
 

Shin F.

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Well, creating a new Bowser clone to make him competitively viable isn't really the answer. If he's doing badly then the PMBR will see fit to tweak him. Plus he's naturally a punisher anyway so the more people watch themselves the less well he'll do.

Don't worry, nobody is dumb for liking Bowser Jr. It's just a majority of Mario fans just don't like him all that much.
It's less that I dislike Bowser Jr (I'm neutral toward him), I just like the idea of Ray so much more.
 

JCOnyx

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I guess I worded that kinda wrong. I think that Bowser's biggest problems lie in his size and him being absolute combo fodder. With his moveset being placed on a smaller body with a weight that isn't as easily comboed, his playstyle would probably change drastically. I just find that proposition fascinating.

Heck, even people who dislike clone characters probably wouldn't have a problem with Bowser Jr. since he would play SO much differently from Bowser. And you know how difficult it can be to please those types of people.
 
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