Ness after 1.0.4 patch

[Noa.]

Ness doesn't really have a lot of range in this game. There's still a mess of characters that outrange him on a regular basis. And this has been one of his longest struggles since like Melee.
Fair nerf is freakin huge. Not only in terms of range, but damage. What the hell is the point of a combo move that does such pitiful damage now? 7% come on man...
I mean, it could be used for the neutral game because of its lingering hitbox and range... if that didn't get nerfed too >_>
Retreating fair defensively has never been so... bad. At least, not since Smash 64.
Dair nerf makes the move like useless on stage. I used to think it was one of the best dairs in Brawl. Now I think it's one of the worst. You can't use the vertical knockback as a combo tool like... ever anymore, and the hitbox is finnicky as all hell.

His combo game is alright, would be better if fair did **** for damage. And dthrow got nerfed in damage too, our main combo starter, that helps tons. Bthrow kills at "okay" percents. Ludicrous is pushing it. It actually kills at later percents than in Brawl. "Ludicrous" is Bowser's Down B move, or PKT2. Bthrow really just kills at the same percentage most other kills moves do (130%+).

Ness was considered to have a promising future in Brawl at first due to his straight buffs from Melee. This was before the first official tier lists came out with him around mid I think. Just like we're discussing how well he'll do right now, before the first official tier list is out. But instead of straight buffs, he's recieved a plethora of nerfs to accompany them.

His matchups are already looking bad as is, struggling with a lot of considered top tiers like Sheik and Rosalina. I haven't been keeping up with tournament results enough, but I haven't heard of him taking 1st at any noteworthy tournaments yet.

You're looking at ness in a vacuum and not comparing him relative to other characters in this game. Ness's fair only does 7 percent, but this is in a game where damages across the board have been nerfed compared to previous games. And with Ness's fair your almost always guaranteed at least one more fair, and sometimes even two. Ness's bair does 15 damage. That's ridiculous in this game. Nair is 11, uair is 13, and dair is 12. All the rest of his aerials do a serious amount of damage. Fair is not as strong as it used to be but Ness has been improved in many other areas. Uair is a much more potent KO move and bthrow is just as strong as in previous games. It cannot be understated just how much of the cast has problems killing before 140 or 150.

 

[Luco]

Ness doesn't really have a lot of range in this game. There's still a mess of characters that outrange him on a regular basis. And this has been one of his longest struggles since like Melee.
Fair nerf is freakin huge. Not only in terms of range, but damage. What the hell is the point of a combo move that does such pitiful damage now? 7% come on man...
I mean, it could be used for the neutral game because of its lingering hitbox and range... if that didn't get nerfed too >_>
Retreating fair defensively has never been so... bad. At least, not since Smash 64.
Dair nerf makes the move like useless on stage. I used to think it was one of the best dairs in Brawl. Now I think it's one of the worst. You can't use the vertical knockback as a combo tool like... ever anymore, and the hitbox is finnicky as all hell.

His combo game is alright, would be better if fair did **** for damage. And dthrow got nerfed in damage too, our main combo starter, that helps tons. Bthrow kills at "okay" percents. Ludicrous is pushing it. It actually kills at later percents than in Brawl. "Ludicrous" is Bowser's Down B move, or PKT2. Bthrow really just kills at the same percentage most other kills moves do (130%+).

Ness was considered to have a promising future in Brawl at first due to his straight buffs from Melee. This was before the first official tier lists came out with him around mid I think. Just like we're discussing how well he'll do right now, before the first official tier list is out. But instead of straight buffs, he's recieved a plethora of nerfs to accompany them.

His matchups are already looking bad as is, struggling with a lot of considered top tiers like Sheik and Rosalina. I haven't been keeping up with tournament results enough, but I haven't heard of him taking 1st at any noteworthy tournaments yet.

Retreating Fair isn't actually that bad, it's the lack of a C-stick for most people that makes it seem so.

7% is pretty eh by itself granted, but you can guaranteed get 2 or 3 in after a Dthrow, and that combo alone is something like 30% not including damage from PK fire which usually starts the combo up. The characters that generally outrange Ness are generally the slower characters that have more startup on their moves (such as Ike and Shulk) who we have to be wary against but we don't necessarily lose against. I'd like to know who you think outranges Ness who has quick moves bar Sheik.

Speaking of match-ups, Sheik and Rosalina have been nerfed. The Luma respawn time is big because it means Luma is out for 160% of the time it used to be which means our grab game works better.

And Ness and Lucas were not mid tier for the first tier list in brawl http://smashboards.com/threads/the-official-sbr-brawl-tier-list-v1-0.192028/

And finally for tournament results, in my own region, V uses Ness and Villager and in a recent tournament we had in our best region, she won both customs on and customs off tournaments. But in regards to big noteworthy tournaments, the weeklies and monthlies that have peeps like Nairo and Dabuz and such have seen NAKAT's Ness and Fox take first on several occasions, against other high tier characters. Now if one of the top regions in the world is seeing Ness consistently place high, I find it hard to believe he's just 'eh' material.

 

[Plain Yogurt]

Asked based Thinkaman in the patch thread and it is confirmed: Ness's PK thunder has slightly more end lag after the bolt hits something besides Ness.

 

[Earthbound360]

You're looking at ness in a vacuum and not comparing him relative to other characters in this game. Ness's fair only does 7 percent, but this is in a game where damages across the board have been nerfed compared to previous games. And with Ness's fair your almost always guaranteed at least one more fair, and sometimes even two. Ness's bair does 15 damage. That's ridiculous in this game. Nair is 11, uair is 13, and dair is 12. All the rest of his aerials do a serious amount of damage. Fair is not as strong as it used to be but Ness has been improved in many other areas. Uair is a much more potent KO move and bthrow is just as strong as in previous games. It cannot be understated just how much of the cast has problems killing before 140 or 150.

To be fair, you might be right about the vacuum thing. But in comparison to other characters, he STILL doesn't look that special to me. I mean, I can already see some extreme stupidity from ZSS and Yoshi that I feel like Ness just doesn't possess. Bair's damage is nice, but I'm pretty sure there are a lot of characters that have got that kind of damage on aerials. Bowser, Yoshi, Zelda, etc. Also,, and I could be wrong on this, but I'm fairly certain that Ness' bair always did similar damage.

Uair is one of my favorite changes though, I'll give you that.

Bthrow definitely kills at later percents than from Brawl. It used to be able to kill anyone from anywhere on FD at 130%, including Bowser grabbed on the right side thrown to the left. That's not gonna happen in Smash 4, especially with vectoring now.

Retreating Fair isn't actually that bad, it's the lack of a C-stick for most people that makes it seem so.

7% is pretty eh by itself granted, but you can guaranteed get 2 or 3 in after a Dthrow, and that combo alone is something like 30% not including damage from PK fire which usually starts the combo up. The characters that generally outrange Ness are generally the slower characters that have more startup on their moves (such as Ike and Shulk) who we have to be wary against but we don't necessarily lose against. I'd like to know who you think outranges Ness who has quick moves bar Sheik.

Speaking of match-ups, Sheik and Rosalina have been nerfed. The Luma respawn time is big because it means Luma is out for 160% of the time it used to be which means our grab game works better.

And Ness and Lucas were not mid tier for the first tier list in brawl http://smashboards.com/threads/the-official-sbr-brawl-tier-list-v1-0.192028/

And finally for tournament results, in my own region, V uses Ness and Villager and in a recent tournament we had in our best region, she won both customs on and customs off tournaments. But in regards to big noteworthy tournaments, the weeklies and monthlies that have peeps like Nairo and Dabuz and such have seen NAKAT's Ness and Fox take first on several occasions, against other high tier characters. Now if one of the top regions in the world is seeing Ness consistently place high, I find it hard to believe he's just 'eh' material.

It's not bad, but like I said, it's the worst it's ever been outside of Smash 64 (before it even produced sparkles). It was probably at its best in Melee, then toned down over the years.

I never said anything about outranges AND quick, but off the top of my head, DK sorta fits that bill. Might just be me, but Falcon's long ass legs annoy me too.

They have been nerfed yes, I'm happy about that. But Rosalina's instant "kill Ness" move is still a problem...

Lol okay, you got me on the tier list thing. I couldn't remember if they were just barely inside, or outside of mid tier.
And okay, you've got me on that tournament thing too. Like I said, I haven't kept up enough.

I've said this before, but once again I DO want to be proven wrong here, because deep down inside I still love Ness as a character. It's just when my favorite tools like fair and dair got nerfed and they didn't fix some of Ness' major problems, like PKT2 stopping when it hits something or the awful fsmash, it ticks me off.

 

[Ranias]

Asked based Thinkaman in the patch thread and it is confirmed: Ness's PK thunder has slightly more end lag after the bolt hits something besides Ness.

Noooooo.... PK Thunder juggle less viable....

 

[Noa.]

To be fair, you might be right about the vacuum thing. But in comparison to other characters, he STILL doesn't look that special to me. I mean, I can already see some extreme stupidity from ZSS and Yoshi that I feel like Ness just doesn't possess. Bair's damage is nice, but I'm pretty sure there are a lot of characters that have got that kind of damage on aerials. Bowser, Yoshi, Zelda, etc. Also,, and I could be wrong on this, but I'm fairly certain that Ness' bair always did similar damage.

Uair is one of my favorite changes though, I'll give you that.

Bthrow definitely kills at later percents than from Brawl. It used to be able to kill anyone from anywhere on FD at 130%, including Bowser grabbed on the right side thrown to the left. That's not gonna happen in Smash 4, especially with vectoring now.



It's not bad, but like I said, it's the worst it's ever been outside of Smash 64 (before it even produced sparkles). It was probably at its best in Melee, then toned down over the years.

I never said anything about outranges AND quick, but off the top of my head, DK sorta fits that bill. Might just be me, but Falcon's long *** legs annoy me too.

They have been nerfed yes, I'm happy about that. But Rosalina's instant "kill Ness" move is still a problem...

Lol okay, you got me on the tier list thing. I couldn't remember if they were just barely inside, or outside of mid tier.
And okay, you've got me on that tournament thing too. Like I said, I haven't kept up enough.

I've said this before, but once again I DO want to be proven wrong here, because deep down inside I still love Ness as a character. It's just when my favorite tools like fair and dair got nerfed and they didn't fix some of Ness' major problems, like PKT2 stopping when it hits something or the awful fsmash, it ticks me off.

I will say that dair is almost useless now. It's so hard to land and personally even when I do land it it's always sourspotted. Though all of those characters that do similar damage in aerials are slow. Except for Yoshi lol. But he's also quite ridiculous.

And idk I doubt that Ness's btrhow would kill snake or ddd at 130 from the center of fd. But I haven't seen a Ness bthrow Snake in a while so I can't really say much about that.

I do think that Ness is definitely high tier now. In a couple years I only see him going down the tier list though and not up. Ness seems like a pretty simple character and I think as people figure the matchup out he won't be as successful. But in this moment the tourney results don't lie. He's quite solid.

 

[Luco]

Noooooo.... PK Thunder juggle less viable....

It's not the PKT juggling that bugs me but combo-ing from PKT into an aerial when they're offstage. Makes me sad.

Just to quickly address the Bthrow thing, the only reason it's been "nerfed" is because of vectoring. Now, with vectoring having been patched out, you'll find Bthrow kills a lot earlier. Granted, against some characters like Samus, Dedede and DK, it's hard to kill them from the centre of FD until about 150 but tbh that was actually the case in Brawl, Ness' Bthrow didn't kill DDD until about the 150's/160's, so aside from a few characters being a tad heavier, Ness still has almost the same level of power if not the same level of power on the Bthrow. I think vectoring has just warped our perceptions of our moves at this early stage of the meta to be totally honest.

Ness' PKT is a bit of a bummer, but I think the overall buffs to it (faster, startup has Lucas' properties, can be used twice if you bounce off a wall) make Ness' recovery a different beast than it used to be.

I can see Ness potentially dropping over time maybe, but even if he does I don't think it will be far and people's perceptions of him are already in the top 15 and often top 10 atm, you might be surprised.

 

[Earthbound360]

The blastzones are much farther away in this game too, also contributing to bthrow killing later. You could say you blame that on the environmental changes, but then they should have buffed bthrow's knockback to compensate. Idk, it just feels like a very average kill move to me. It may be the strongest throw in the game, but that doesn't make it above average in terms of kill power with all moves considered. It is (and really always has been) fairly average in terms of kill power. When you've got things like Zelda's heels and Bowser's... everything, you realize that bthrow is actually just decent in terms of knockback, not ridiculous.

Ness is a character that just gets figured out. Remember back in early Brawl days when you could just throw PKT out and get a 50% KO with PKT2? Those were the days. Remember back in Smash 64 when DJC combos were the ****? Good times.
If he's just barely high tier right now, I'm expecting him to drop to mid once the first official tier list is out, then be low by the near end of the game's lifespan.
Like usual

 

[Noa.]

The big thing about bthrow is just how easy it is to land considering its strength. The majority of kill moves that kill at 120 are much much harder to land than a grab. It's why Ness's back throw is just one of the best kill moves in the game. It's so reliable and easy to land, and it is a grab so it's easy to mixup. I mean this is all obvious stuff but it's just more important in a game with generally poor ko options.

 

[Earthbound360]

Well okay, I misspoke. Yes, just like any knowledgeable Ness player, I appreciate the bthrow. It's not an "average kill move," just an "average power kill move."

But I want it to stay godlike is all. I'm probably going to do some extensive testing tomorrow and see just how different Brawl bthrow is to Smash 4 bthrow. I'm 90% sure it kills later in Smash 4.

 

[Noa.]

Probably. But almost everything kills later.

 

[Tikao]

Ness' fair range hasn't even been nerfed, the actual size of the hitbox has, but he leans forward in this animation, so the range is actually about the same, his hurtbox just gets extended, which makes retreating fairs indeed worse than it used to be

it is more of a combo move now, one deals pitiful damage, but you can chain them like crazy, so the actual damage output is good, if you can end the chain with an uair, then even better

and apart from the uair knockback buff, it actually got buffed in terms of range, both to the side and above him

Ness has no big struggles against getting outranged, because range in general got nerfed
the only characters which outrange us by a noticeable amount are actually ike and shulk, both are way slower than us
marth's and mk's range got nerfed, and dk's bair can be hit, because he extends his hurtbox over the entire move
compared to previous games, this should be less of a problem

bthrow got passively nerfed by a bit because of vectoring and the new side blastzones, but that affects other throws WAY more than Ness, so compared to others, it is actually a buff
Ness is the ONLY one with a good killing move in this game, we should keep that in mind
i feel like his grabrange got buffed (it is good overall) andf the grabs are still realy fast, so he has a reliable grab and a reliable killthrow

overall, Ness
still has range, while range overall got nerfed, giving him less problems against that
still has reliable killmoves and the only good killthrow in the game, while a lot of stuff from others kills way later
got good 'combo' (string) potential, and actual good damage that way (actually one of his biggest problems in brawl)
got his recovery buffed by a lot actually (I'm not saying it is perfectly save now, would be dumb to say that, but it is better than it ever was)
and a decent projectile

Ness is looking way better than he ever used to be, Ness never looked as good as that

 

[MrWhYYZ]

Question regarding the 1.0.4 patch.

Could someone with both versions available check if you have more time to combo after tripping your opponent with d-tilt?

 

[Tenchi Boom]

So only his dthrow was nerfed? Thank God. This is why I hate patches that change characters, it frightens me not knowing if Ness is going to be nerfed or not. He doesn't need it (although he is amazing in this iteration).

 

[Uffe]

Well okay, I misspoke. Yes, just like any knowledgeable Ness player, I appreciate the bthrow. It's not an "average kill move," just an "average power kill move."

But I want it to stay godlike is all. I'm probably going to do some extensive testing tomorrow and see just how different Brawl bthrow is to Smash 4 bthrow. I'm 90% sure it kills later in Smash 4.

I was going to test the differences between Brawl Ness and 3DS Ness, but I can't seem to get audio or video input with my new TV. Glad someone will be getting on this.

 

[Ranias]

So uh. How 'bout that patch?

Maybe we can discuss how we can adapt to the nerfs.

Like since the down throw is nerfed in damage a bit, we should probably mix up our throw choice more right?

And since the PK Thunder lag is extended, it's probably less safe to use at close range and such.

 

[Earthbound360]

Ness' fair range hasn't even been nerfed, the actual size of the hitbox has, but he leans forward in this animation, so the range is actually about the same, his hurtbox just gets extended, which makes retreating fairs indeed worse than it used to be

it is more of a combo move now, one deals pitiful damage, but you can chain them like crazy, so the actual damage output is good, if you can end the chain with an uair, then even better

and apart from the uair knockback buff, it actually got buffed in terms of range, both to the side and above him

Ness has no big struggles against getting outranged, because range in general got nerfed
the only characters which outrange us by a noticeable amount are actually ike and shulk, both are way slower than us
marth's and mk's range got nerfed, and dk's bair can be hit, because he extends his hurtbox over the entire move
compared to previous games, this should be less of a problem

bthrow got passively nerfed by a bit because of vectoring and the new side blastzones, but that affects other throws WAY more than Ness, so compared to others, it is actually a buff
Ness is the ONLY one with a good killing move in this game, we should keep that in mind
i feel like his grabrange got buffed (it is good overall) andf the grabs are still realy fast, so he has a reliable grab and a reliable killthrow

overall, Ness
still has range, while range overall got nerfed, giving him less problems against that
still has reliable killmoves and the only good killthrow in the game, while a lot of stuff from others kills way later
got good 'combo' (string) potential, and actual good damage that way (actually one of his biggest problems in brawl)
got his recovery buffed by a lot actually (I'm not saying it is perfectly save now, would be dumb to say that, but it is better than it ever was)
and a decent projectile

Ness is looking way better than he ever used to be, Ness never looked as good as that

Range is relative to how far the hitbox reaches from the character. If he's extending his own hurtbox into the range of fair, then it has in effect lost range because the point of range is to be able to attack from a distance to avoid danger. Even you mentioned how this can be a nerf when referring to DK's bair later in your post. In addition to that, he leaned forward in the other games too, in fact it seems like he twists his body more on the Z axis in this game.

I think the damage should have been left alone on fair personally. It really shouldn't be delegated to being ONLY a combo move. It used to do it all, and that's what I love about Ness. It had duration, range, defensive properies, comboability, decent speed, and healthy damage. The new fair lost its range, which as a result diminished its ability to be used defensively, and of course a lot of damage too. Duration, comboability, and speed are all still there at least.

Yes, Marth and MK got nerfed, but they're still plenty good, and I can still see them posing a threat to Ness. If you seriously think he's got an easy matchup against those characters now, I would love to see your reason why. You've still got to work to beat them. And to be quite honest, I don't think Ness outright beats Shulk or Ike either, ESPECIALLY now with the buffs they received (and MK). And I forgot to mention Rob and his giant hitboxes. I honestly just don't see any easy A's on Ness' matchup chart so far, and you need that to even contend for being high tier. Please tell me, what matchups do YOU genuinely believe Ness dominates? I'm having trouble finding them.

No one really killed with their throws in Brawl anyways. It's not like it really affected them at all actually. The only ones that I can think of off the top of my head were Olimar's blue bthrow and purple uthrow, and Lucas' dthrow. Lucas is gone and I guess that's a shame for Olimar, but he got the mess nerfed out of him to the point where I feel like Olimar players are just numb now.
Saying that bthrow is the ONLY good kill move in this game is a mass overstatement though. What about Mac's 3 fsmashes? Rosalina sending Luma out and mirroring usmash? Bowsers.... everything? Saying Ness has the only good kill move is just not true. In fact, I wouldn't even label it the BEST kill move out of all the good ones.

In conclusion, I think Ness has slightly above average range, still failing to compare to Ike, Shulk, and Rob.
Still has some reliable kill moves. Bthrow and dair were nerfed, uair was buffed. But that's a 2 for 1 exchange.
Comboability is good but the damage nerf on fair sucks.
And his recovery in undoubtedly better, but they DID remove magnet stalling.
I'm not discrediting everything you're saying, but for almost every thing Ness got buffed, there's a nerf to accompany it. You just have to identify it.

 

[Tikao]

Range is relative to how far the hitbox reaches from the character. If he's extending his own hurtbox into the range of fair, then it has in effect lost range because the point of range is to be able to attack from a distance to avoid danger. Even you mentioned how this can be a nerf when referring to DK's bair later in your post. In addition to that, he leaned forward in the other games too, in fact it seems like he twists his body more on the Z axis in this game.

I think the damage should have been left alone on fair personally. It really shouldn't be delegated to being ONLY a combo move. It used to do it all, and that's what I love about Ness. It had duration, range, defensive properies, comboability, decent speed, and healthy damage. The new fair lost its range, which as a result diminished its ability to be used defensively, and of course a lot of damage too. Duration, comboability, and speed are all still there at least.

Yes, Marth and MK got nerfed, but they're still plenty good, and I can still see them posing a threat to Ness. If you seriously think he's got an easy matchup against those characters now, I would love to see your reason why. You've still got to work to beat them. And to be quite honest, I don't think Ness outright beats Shulk or Ike either, ESPECIALLY now with the buffs they received (and MK). And I forgot to mention Rob and his giant hitboxes. I honestly just don't see any easy A's on Ness' matchup chart so far, and you need that to even contend for being high tier. Please tell me, what matchups do YOU genuinely believe Ness dominates? I'm having trouble finding them.

No one really killed with their throws in Brawl anyways. It's not like it really affected them at all actually. The only ones that I can think of off the top of my head were Olimar's blue bthrow and purple uthrow, and Lucas' dthrow. Lucas is gone and I guess that's a shame for Olimar, but he got the mess nerfed out of him to the point where I feel like Olimar players are just numb now.
Saying that bthrow is the ONLY good kill move in this game is a mass overstatement though. What about Mac's 3 fsmashes? Rosalina sending Luma out and mirroring usmash? Bowsers.... everything? Saying Ness has the only good kill move is just not true. In fact, I wouldn't even label it the BEST kill move out of all the good ones.

In conclusion, I think Ness has slightly above average range, still failing to compare to Ike, Shulk, and Rob.
Still has some reliable kill moves. Bthrow and dair were nerfed, uair was buffed. But that's a 2 for 1 exchange.
Comboability is good but the damage nerf on fair sucks.
And his recovery in undoubtedly better, but they DID remove magnet stalling.
I'm not discrediting everything you're saying, but for almost every thing Ness got buffed, there's a nerf to accompany it. You just have to identify it.

Ness' fair is worse as a defensive option, since his hitbox range has been nerfed, that's right, but it still has range forward, even if he can get hit while doing so. It's not like dk's bair range is 0, he can get hit there, which is obviously worse than not being able to be hit there, but that doesn't mean he got no range there

Ness' fair range hasn't realy been nerfed, his hurtbox just got nerfed, which passively limits the option of abusing that range for retreating fairs ... but it's still a nerf, never said anything else

it is way better in terms of chaining moves and other fairs together though, Ness' fair couldn't realy do that in a reliable way unless the opponent got realy low % in brawl

fair overall is nerfed, but overall still a good move, and you will need to use it diffrently


bthrow is the only good killTHROW in this game, typed that worng once, it is far from being the best killmove


i also never meant to say ness destroyes or even wins all those matchups against marf ike etc., he just won't be destroyed that hard by range anymore, he could still be kinda bad against them, but there will be no marf-like MU like in brawl (part of that was the deathgrab, but this still would've been the worst and a realy bad MU for him if there wouldn't have been that deathgrab in the game)


overall changes to ness :

+

deathgrab removed (biggest plus)

uair buffed by a lot (and it even used to be a good move before)

dthrow buffed (less damage, but you can combo out of it in a reliable way which usually results in a higher damage output than it used to be)

pkt1 buffed (a decent projectile now, not realy sure if it is bad now in 1.0.4, but overall it shoudl still be buffed)

pkt2 buffed in tearms or recover power (you can't just jump above ness to kill him, more range, either slides up walls or gives you a 2. pkt2 if you bounce of the wall, still gimpable though)

pk-fire slightly buffed (fire pillar hitbox is slightly harder to escape, and the first hit has less knockback, so the hits connect better)

all smashes slightly buffed (still only mixups)

grabrange buffed (?) not sure about this one, but kinda seemed so for me

psi magnet range buffed

-

fair different, but nerfed overall

dair is nearly useless

bthrow kills a bit later (vectoring is different or removed in 1.0.4, so it should kill slightly early than in 1.0.3, but it will probadly still kill later, BUT the only good killmove in the game)


there might be slight changes to other stuff, but that should be the important stuff, overall he is buffed by a lot acdtually (even keeping brawl ness and removing only the deathgrab would be a huge buff)
How good he'll be depends on his MUs, and specially his MUs vs top/hightiers, but ness is good in this one, specially after 1.0.4 where a lot of better charakters got nerfed while ness only recieved tiny nerfs


Edit: wow, wall of text xD

Edit 2 : just a disclaimer, everything i wrote here is just my opinion, there is hardly any metagame and i haven't even been able to play the game with a gcc, the metagame will evolve and so will MUs and charakters
those are all just speculations of me saying ness has a lot of potential on paper to become a realy great charakter in this game, if there turns out to be one dominant charakter (like mk in brawl) and ness will have a bad MU against said charakter, then hardly any speculation will help you there

just thought i had to add that

 

[Luco]

Just to clarify, the nerf on Fair was probably justified in order to give Ness' moveset a more overall strong feel rather than him being a one trick pony-kind of thing, but I could be wrong.

I think we've kinda come to the point where we have to let the results speak for themselves. When it comes to match-ups, Ness I feel goes even with both Marth, MK, and yoshi, beats Lucario, Villager, Bowser (heavily - there's your easy A match-up XD ), loses to Rosaluma and maybe still sheik a little... but I can't quantify that right now, so I look at results which are currently telling us that he must be okay at the very least if he's winning against some top players.