Name any dumb character request for smash

[oZzIIgk]

I would absolutely love an all Pokemon Smash Bros game. It's such a perfect format for it, the only problem would be trying to balance all the characters, I want all the original 151

You could increase the ridiculousness of the scale of that game by giving each player 6 stocks, and they have to assign one Pokemon to each.
/s
darude sandstorm for smash guys

 

[ELITEWarri0r115]

Surprising that this thread has gone from bad ideas to debate STILL. possibility for making a new thread about this debate?

 

[Burb]

First of all, Smash is not just for "iconic" or the most popular characters. Smash is not a meaningless advertisement and marketing tool. It's supposed to be about highlighting Nintendo's history and important aspects of the Nintendo mythos which is why we see characters on the roster like ROB and Wii Fit Trainer who no one thought of or would have wanted if they were proposed beforehand.

Right.

Geno fits the description of absolutely nothing you mentioned here.

He's not important to Nintendo's history/mythos, and he is a character people thought of (as stupid as an idea as it is) and want. He's not like Wii Fit Trainer in any way, shape, or form. If anything, he's the exact opposite (People ask for him, he never returns. Nobody asked for WFT, she's in Smash).

You must not have been around much for Brawl speculation, by the way, because R.O.B. was actually a pretty commonly guessed character up until the R.O.B. enemies were spotted in SSE screenshots (which led to most people thinking he was disconfirmed).

Secondly you're forgetting that Geno's situation is very very different from most other characters. The reason he wasn't featured in subsequent Mario games had nothing to do with his worth or his popularity. It was because Square and Nintendo feuded for 10 years because Square decided to release FF7 for the PS1 and not the N64. It is only in recent years that they buried the hatchet which is why SMRPG fans are clamoring for Geno to be in Smash in the first place. The whole point is to put him into the spotlight they feel he deserves and was wrongly denied because of the feud. This is why arguments such as "If Geno was popular he would've been in other games besides SMRPG!" are meaningless. He simply couldn't because of the feud.

This is also why other post-hoc arguments such as "If Geno was a part of Nintendo then I think he'd actually be acknowledged in Nintendo games beyond Superstar Saga. He hasn't." are meaningless. The reason the Superstar Saga Geno cameo happened in the first place was because Alphadream (which is staffed by Square migrants who worked on the original SMRPG) went to Square and pulled strings. Alphadream is the company that really kind of holds the keys to the SMRPG castle, not so much Square. Even with them, after being told in an interview how popular Geno and Mallow are, they decided to try to give them another cameo in a future game.

No, nobody's forgetting that.

The reason why he hasn't appeared outside a minor cameo is the same reason why he has no chance whatsoever of being in Smash or any other Mario game except maybe an Alphadream RPG. He's owned by Square Enix and isn't worth the effort of getting the rights to.

Even if it weren't the case, he probably wouldn't have re-appeared anyway. Square still would've owned him even had they not jumped ship to Sony platforms (and thus, they'd still need to get the rights from Square to use him). Keep in mind that characters introduced in future RPG games have never re-appeared outside the RPGs outside the Paper Mario Star Spirits showing up in Mario Party 5. Given that and the fact that the developers of Sticker Star were told by Shigeru Miyamoto to use existing characters and limit the amount of new ones introduced (suggesting he's not big on the RPG characters), it's quite clear that he never would've been an important part of the Mario series regardless.

Geno has most certainly not fallen out of the spotlight due to lack of popularity, nor does his lack of inclusion make him a "minor" character. Geno's legal situation is very complex, and without an understanding of it we end up coming to foolish conclusions like the kind you and others are kind of arguing here. Geno and Mallow haven't been in obscurity because of a lack of popularity. They've been that way because of the feud between Nintendo and Square and because of a lack of awareness on Alphadream's part of Geno and Mallow's true popularity, which is quite immense. It is why we Geno fans go to such painstaking lengths to put Geno out there, so they can see how much people truly want them back. The whole point is to fix what we perceive is a great wrong and to argue that the only characters who should get into Smash are those who fit our subjective and poorly defined standards of who is "deserving", "important" or "relevant" would cause us to miss out on many otherwise good and popular characters (and like it or not, Geno is still a pretty big fan favorite), and I'm not just talking Geno -- you could make those same arguments about King K. Rool or most other retro characters, especially most Square characters people want.

Whether you care to admit it or not, Geno's Smash popularity has plummeted in the years between the release of Brawl and SSB4. He still shows up on wishlists, but he's not the force he was pre-Brawl. He's no longer the most requested character from the Mario RPG sub-series, let alone the Mario series as a whole. He routinely loses to troll characters like Shrek and Goku on "Most wanted character" polls.

Geno has some popularity, and there's definitely a demand to get him back. It doesn't need to be in Smash, though, and it really has no reason to be in Smash. Bring him back in some Mario RPG and leave playable spots in Smash for characters who actually represent their series. A one-shot character from a spinoff that wasn't even initially released worldwide doesn't represent what the Mario series is about. If one of the first things that comes to mind when you think of Mario is the half-naked doll from SMRPG, something is seriously, seriously wrong.

Surprising that this thread has gone from bad ideas to debate STILL. possibility for making a new thread about this debate?

I know, man, I'm surprised a topic dedicated to mocking other people's ideas would end up being a hostile environment.

It's just shocking.

 

[Geno Boost]

Right.

Geno fits the description of absolutely nothing you mentioned here.

He's not important to Nintendo's history/mythos, and he is a character people thought of (as stupid as an idea as it is).



No, nobody's forgetting that.

The reason why he hasn't appeared outside a minor cameo is the same reason why he has no chance whatsoever of being in Smash or any other Mario game except maybe an Alphadream RPG. He's owned by Square Enix and isn't worth the effort of getting the rights to.

Even if it weren't the case, he probably wouldn't have re-appeared anyway. Square still would've owned him even had they not jumped ship to Sony platforms (and thus, they'd still need to get the rights from Square to use him). Keep in mind that characters introduced in future RPG games have never re-appeared outside the RPGs outside the Paper Mario Star Spirits showing up in Mario Party 5. Given that and the fact that the developers of Sticker Star were told by Shigeru Miyamoto to use existing characters and limit the amount of new ones introduced, it's quite clear that he never would've been an important part of the Mario series regardless.



Whether you care to admit it or not, Geno's Smash popularity has plummeted in the years between the release of Brawl and SSB4. He still shows up on wishlists, but he's not the force he was pre-Brawl. He's no longer the most requested character from the Mario RPG sub-series, let alone the Mario series as a whole. He routinely loses to troll characters like Shrek and Goku on "Most wanted character" polls.

Geno has some popularity, and there's definitely a demand to get him back. It doesn't need to be in Smash, though, and it really has no reason to be in Smash. Bring him back in some Mario RPG and leave playable spots in Smash for characters who actually represent their series. A one-shot character from a spinoff that wasn't even initially released worldwide doesn't represent what the Mario series is about. If one of the first things that comes to mind when you think of Mario is the half-naked doll from SMRPG, something is seriously, seriously wrong.



I know, man, I'm surprised a topic dedicated to mocking other people's ideas would end up being a hostile environment.

It's just shocking.

There is no proof that shows Geno has no chance to be in smash from Nintendo plus he was already in sakurai poll since melee and he still hold up to this day. If Geno has no chance then no one would request him but people still request him because they know that he have a chance and he wasn't deconfirmed by Nintendo. And not every character in smash was perfect choice they all have negative reasons and positive reasons at the same time, you can only think of negative things but there is always positive things
Geno already follows sakurai 4 main rules for the character who has a chance, you can call Geno lickley or unlucky but you can't call him impossible if he already follows the rules

 

[Burb]

There is no proof that shows Geno has no chance to be in smash from Nintendo plus he was already in sakurai poll since melee and he still hold up to this day. If Geno has no chance then no one would request him but people still request him because they know that he have a chance and he wasn't deconfirmed by Nintendo. And not every character in smash was perfect choice they all have negative reasons and positive reasons at the same time, you can only think of negative things but there is always positive things

"People request them, and that means they have a chance!".

Makes perfect sense to me.


By the way, it's not "negativity" for me. I don't want Geno in Smash. How am I being negative by saying a character I don't want has no realistic chance? It's negative to you, but it's not negative to me.

 

[Geno Boost]

"People request them, and that means they have a chance!".

Makes perfect sense to me.

Yes it does if he already follows sakurai 4 mains rules for the character who has a chance

 

[Burb]

Yes it does if he already follows sakurai 4 mains rules for the character who has a chance

You mean the "four rules" you think he has?

It's funny you mention the Melee polls......because James Bond was on those same polls. Y'know, a character who originated in a novel. And judging from info uncovered by @PushDustIn, Sakurai himself said Bond was considered for Melee (Source: http://www.sourcegaming.info/2015/04/13/the-definitive-unused-fighters-list-in-smash/). Outside of being mentioned on a poll, there is absolutely nothing to suggest that Geno was ever even put into consideration. A book character who's most known for movies was likely closer to getting into Smash than Geno. Let that sink in for a minute.

Even if this ruleset held any water whatsoever, he still wouldn't have a chance. The demand for him is far lower than it was before Brawl. It doesn't match the amount of effort it would take to secure the rights to use him. They could please more people by putting in a Mario character they actually own the rights to that more people are asking for.

 

[Geno Boost]

You mean the "four rules" you think he has?

It's funny you mention the Melee polls......because James Bond was on those same polls. Y'know, a character who originated in a novel. And judging from info uncovered by @PushDustIn, Sakurai himself said Bond was considered for Melee (Source: http://www.sourcegaming.info/2015/04/13/the-definitive-unused-fighters-list-in-smash/). Outside of being mentioned on a poll, there is absolutely nothing to suggest that Geno was ever even put into consideration. A book character who's most known for movies was likely closer to getting into Smash than Geno. Let that sink in for a minute.

Even if this ruleset held any water whatsoever, he still wouldn't have a chance. The demand for him is far lower than it was before Brawl. It doesn't match the amount of effort it would take to secure the rights to use him. They could please more people by putting in a Mario character they actually own the rights to that more people are asking for.

But he wasn't added in the end whatsoever

He is still the most requested square Enix character since brawl

 

[Burb]

But he wasn't added in the end whatsoever

He is still the most requested square Enix character since brawl

You know who else wasn't added?

Geno.

 

[Geno Boost]

You know who else wasn't added?

Geno.

I know but all the smash characters that we got did follow sakurai main rules but James bound didn't

 

[Burb]

I know but all the smash characters that we got did follow sakurai main rules but James bound didn't

 

[Jetmann]

Dry Cyan Platinum Baby Warosalina

 

[LIQUID12A]

The meme characters, to start off with. Reckless Safety Man was funny for about a day but it's spread like wildfire and somehow makes people suggest things like the eShop bag and others.

Apart from those, the only character I truly believe is a dumb choice is Geno. To some extent most indies, but even they are more logical picks than the doll.

 

[DarkDragonVG]

Chrom.
because we totally need half the FE cast to be from waifu emblem.

 

[kiteinthesky]

I don't have time to go through every single point made rebutting my post at the moment, but allow me to take issue with this:

Right.

Geno fits the description of absolutely nothing you mentioned here.

He's not important to Nintendo's history/mythos, and he is a character people thought of (as stupid as an idea as it is) and want. He's not like Wii Fit Trainer in any way, shape, or form. If anything, he's the exact opposite (People ask for him, he never returns. Nobody asked for WFT, she's in Smash).

Now that's just not true. He is important to Nintendo's history because of the fact that he's the most popular character from SMRPG, which was the first RPG ever made for the Mario series and was the precursor for Paper Mario and the Mario & Luigi RPG saga. Without it we wouldn't have those two popular series. That's very important in Nintendo history. SMRPG was also an important game in that it was a very close collaboration between Square and Nintendo, a collaboration that was symbolic of an alliance that was sadly destroyed because of the feud that took place afterward. It is one of the most classic RPGs (and video games, period) ever made and represents an important era in gaming which isn't really represented very well in Smash. Square's closeness with Nintendo at that time created many classics and SMRPG best represents the classic SNES RPGs because of the fact that the two companies worked together on it. What made that game so popular was in large part its unique cast including Mallow and Geno who were so popular that players expected them to be recurring characters in the Mario mythos which sadly did not happen. The feud between Square and Nintendo itself is an important part of Nintendo history. And Geno represents all of this, because he is the most popular character originating from Super Mario RPG. He is the face of the game. When people think SMRPG, they think Geno, much the same way people think of Terra when they think of FF6. You simply can't find another Square character who is that unique and who plays that unique role of being a link between companies. I don't even think you could find another character like that, period, but feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

No, nobody's forgetting that.

The reason why he hasn't appeared outside a minor cameo is the same reason why he has no chance whatsoever of being in Smash or any other Mario game except maybe an Alphadream RPG. He's owned by Square Enix and isn't worth the effort of getting the rights to.

Two words describe this argument: Circular Reasoning. He hasn't been used because he hasn't been used. Which is foolishness, because we've already seen that Nintendo is more than happy to work with third parties and put them in Smash in a way such that they are true to the game they come from. Just because Square Enix owns him doesn't mean Nintendo couldn't approach them about the subject; clearly Square is willing to let companies use Geno if they asked seeing as that's how the Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga cameo happened in the first place.

Which brings us to the next fallacy implied here: Post Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc. If it was gonna happen, it would've happened already. It hasn't happened, therefore it will not happen. Even though the real world doesn't work like that and there are any number of different reasons why Geno hasn't made it into Smash yet. It is unfalsifiable foolishness that is very presumptive of Nintendo's motives with no evidence to back up such presumptions.

Even if it weren't the case, he probably wouldn't have re-appeared anyway. Square still would've owned him even had they not jumped ship to Sony platforms (and thus, they'd still need to get the rights from Square to use him). Keep in mind that characters introduced in future RPG games have never re-appeared outside the RPGs outside the Paper Mario Star Spirits showing up in Mario Party 5. Given that and the fact that the developers of Sticker Star were told by Shigeru Miyamoto to use existing characters and limit the amount of new ones introduced (suggesting he's not big on the RPG characters), it's quite clear that he never would've been an important part of the Mario series regardless.

This is baseless speculation that can be interpreted to prove the opposite of how you're interpreting it. The fact that the Paper Mario Star Spirits even showed up at all in Mario Party 5 shows that they're willing to re-use RPG characters. Do you have a source that proves that the decision to stick to existing characters proves that Miyamoto dislikes the RPG characters instead of the real reason the developers stated in interviews, which is:

Previous Mario RPG titles featured partners or sidekicks that teamed up with Mario throughout his adventure, yet this game doesn't seem to follow that approach in the same way. How did the development team come to that decision? Were partners removed to focus more on the sticker aspect of the game?

Mr Kensuke Tanabe: That’s right. As we were working on using stickers in battles and in puzzles the things you could do often seemed to conflict with the use of partners. For Sticker Star we decided to prioritise the sticker theme and so remove the partners.

Which has nothing to do with any baseless speculation on Miyamoto "not liking the RPG characters".

Even the execs at Alphadream themselves acknowledge Mallow and Geno's popularity and decided to consider giving them cameos in future games, so there's no reason to think at this point that he probably wouldn't have re-appeared anyway. The only thing that stopped it from happening was the Square feud. Paper Mario was even originally called Super Mario RPG 2 and had more elements from SMRPG, but they had to be removed because of the feud which is why we have the Paper Mario series we know and love today.

Whether you care to admit it or not, Geno's Smash popularity has plummeted in the years between the release of Brawl and SSB4. He still shows up on wishlists, but he's not the force he was pre-Brawl. He's no longer the most requested character from the Mario RPG sub-series, let alone the Mario series as a whole. He routinely loses to troll characters like Shrek and Goku on "Most wanted character" polls.

No, this is something that honestly saddens me. From what I understand, when Geno didn't make it into Brawl the Geno fanbase's hopes were crushed and the movement scattered, which is why it's smaller today than it was then. I have seen people from the fanbase here, on Tumblr and Facebook and I see (and you can do a bit of searching too) that there are still lots of people outside of Smashboards that support Geno. We at Smashboards are doing what we can to bring back as many people from back then and around the internet as possible. I personally don't understand why Geno not making it into Brawl made the movement fall apart in the first place.

Geno has some popularity, and there's definitely a demand to get him back. It doesn't need to be in Smash, though, and it really has no reason to be in Smash. Bring him back in some Mario RPG and leave playable spots in Smash for characters who actually represent their series. A one-shot character from a spinoff that wasn't even initially released worldwide doesn't represent what the Mario series is about. If one of the first things that comes to mind when you think of Mario is the half-naked doll from SMRPG, something is seriously, seriously wrong.

This is just your opinion which you need to back up if you want to present it as a serious argument against Geno's inclusion.

The argument that Geno's return has no reason to be in Smash doesn't hold water. You can argue that point about any game. ANY game. Why does it have no reason to be in Smash? In my opinion Smash would be a more appropriate place for him to return because of the fact that Geno's identity mainly revolves around his combat skills, special attacks, and the fact that he's so OP in battle in SMRPG. He's a fighter, indeed his backstory consists of the fact that he is a star that comes down from the Star Road not to play a passive role like other stars in the games but to fight, particularly in a humanoid form. And Smash is about putting obscure characters like him in the spotlight (like Ness), so why would Smash be an inappropriate place to bring him back?

Secondly you're misrepresenting what Geno represents, which is the bond between Square and Nintendo and the 90's SNES RPG era his game comes from, not the entire Mario series.

(I'd honestly be happy to see him and Mallow in almost anything at this point, but you know...)

And "A one-shot character from a spinoff that wasn't even initially released worldwide" and "the half-naked doll from SMRPG" just reeks of the kind of "He's stupid! I dun wanna stupid character I don't like in Smash!" sentiment I'd expect from GameFAQs. You can do better than that.

EDIT: I found the other post I wanted to respond to, here we go:

You mean the "four rules" you think he has?

It's funny you mention the Melee polls......because James Bond was on those same polls. Y'know, a character who originated in a novel. And judging from info uncovered by @PushDustIn, Sakurai himself said Bond was considered for Melee (Source: http://www.sourcegaming.info/2015/04/13/the-definitive-unused-fighters-list-in-smash/). Outside of being mentioned on a poll, there is absolutely nothing to suggest that Geno was ever even put into consideration. A book character who's most known for movies was likely closer to getting into Smash than Geno. Let that sink in for a minute.

Even if this ruleset held any water whatsoever, he still wouldn't have a chance. The demand for him is far lower than it was before Brawl. It doesn't match the amount of effort it would take to secure the rights to use him. They could please more people by putting in a Mario character they actually own the rights to that more people are asking for.

1. Define "chances" and your evidence, criterion, and methodology for calculating a character's "chances". Demonstrate to us that you have enough insider knowledge from Nintendo or a powerful enough crystal ball to let you know the inner workings and motivations in Smash development. A few statements from Masahiro Sakurai won't cut the mustard here -- development decisions for Smash have been made that contradict statements he made before, such as Ryu getting in despite the fact that Sakurai has told us not to expect too many third parties in Smash and even stated that Megaman was a "special case".
   
2. The fact that James Bond was even considered for Melee at all negates the point you're making, nor does the fact that he was considered for Melee in the past mean he has "zero chances", whatever that's supposed to mean.
   
3. We know hardly anything about who is actually considered for Smash aside from the few characters discussed in interviews, so just because there is no mention of Geno being considered at all doesn't mean he actually wasn't or that James Bond was closer to Smash than Geno is. Or any other character for that matter.

 

[LIQUID12A]

I really don't care for the above debate, but there are two things irking me:

1) I personally don't understand why Geno not making it into Brawl made the movement fall apart in the first place.

2) This is just your opinion

1) Because in most cases, when a character fails to make it in, support vanishes or at best drops to an all time low. People lose hope. Brawl was made in a time with no DLC, so understandably the movement scattered for Geno and any massively hyped character. Support for any character that is now an Assist Trophy or with an in game role in Sm4sh barring Ridley has dropped massively. It's just pure logic.

2) Is this a tagline for Geno supporters now? I can't go a few posts without seeing some combination of these words from a Geno supporter any time they are engaged in debate. "Support Geno, anything opposing him is the other person's opinion!" is the only vibe I'm getting.

 

[kiteinthesky]

2) Is this a tagline for Geno supporters now? I can't go a few posts without seeing some combination of these words from a Geno supporter any time they are engaged in debate. "Support Geno, anything opposing him is the other person's opinion!" is the only vibe I'm getting.

No, I don't think that way at all. Burb's last argument was extremely subjective and genuinely just came across as him not liking the character. The statements he was making are even statements that Geno haters have made time and time again and give the impression that the character simply doesn't appeal to them, and for that there really is nothing one can say other than "Well that's just your opinion!" since it really is. I don't know how "the half-naked doll from SMRPG" is a legitimate criticism of the character.

 

[LIQUID12A]

No, I don't think that way at all. Burb's last argument was extremely subjective and genuinely just came across as him not liking the character. The statements he was making are even statements that Geno haters have made time and time again and give the impression that the character simply doesn't appeal to them, and for that there really is nothing one can say other than "Well that's just your opinion!" since it really is. I don't know how "the half-naked doll from SMRPG" is a legitimate criticism of the character.

Let me attempt to reason here.

Just because someone uses arguments made by haters does not automatically mean "omg hater he hates my character qq"(in most cases). Now, it may look that way, but people become cold engines of logic when debating. They will use every argument possible to defend their point. If I used the same arguments that Burb is using, would you automatically brand me a hater, regardless of how peacefully I tried to tell you them, respectful of your own stance? I think the character is a very lackluster choice, but as the title says "dumb", well, just me fitting in. Unless a supporter for any character goes completely balls and begins disregarding logic and saying dumb things or becomes flat-out annoying, then I have no ill will towards them.

Oh, and because I'm sure you think I'm pulling the original point out of my rear, here's a very vocal Geno supporter's post history with usage of those words during any Geno debate, with maybe one exception. And I've bore witness to nearly all of these.

 

[kiteinthesky]

Let me attempt to reason here.

Just because someone uses arguments made by haters does not automatically mean "omg hater he hates my character qq"(in most cases).

Condescending remarks aside, that would be all well and good if the arguments Burb was making at the end of his post weren't subjective declarative statements that genuinely do sound like just his opinion, and if he didn't say outright:

By the way, it's not "negativity" for me. I don't want Geno in Smash. How am I being negative by saying a character I don't want has no realistic chance? It's negative to you, but it's not negative to me.

I'm sorry if it offends you but it genuinely DOES sound like "just his opinion". Unless you'd care to explain how "that half-naked doll from SMRPG" is a legitimate criticism of the character and not just an insult.

Now, it may look that way, but people become cold engines of logic when debating. They will use every argument possible to defend their point. If I used the same arguments that Burb is using, would you automatically brand me a hater, regardless of how peacefully I tried to tell you them, respectful of your own stance? I think the character is a very lackluster choice, but as the title says "dumb", well, just me fitting in. Unless a supporter for any character goes completely balls and begins disregarding logic and saying dumb things or becomes flat-out annoying, then I have no ill will towards them.

Oh, and because I'm sure you think I'm pulling the original point out of my rear, here's a very vocal Geno supporter's post history with usage of those words during any Geno debate, with maybe one exception. And I've bore witness to nearly all of these.

And like I said before, I genuinely don't feel the way you seem to think I do at all. Just because I called out the last part of his post as "just his opinion" doesn't mean I'm automatically labeling him a hater. Nor do quotes from one other person, with no real context, represent the entire Geno fanbase. You're making the same assumptions and generalizations about me you assume I'm making about him, even though I have said once and will say again, quite emphatically, that I'm not. I have no idea whether Burb is a "Geno hater" or not. I do know, from his own words, that he does not want Geno in, and the end of his post does come across as "just his opinion" whether you like it or not. The last paragraph of his post mostly consisted of declarative statements.

Here's a better way to approach this: how is "that half-naked doll from SMRPG", in the context he wrote that statement in, not "just his opinion"? How is it a legitimate criticism?

 

[oZzIIgk]

Chrom.
because we totally need half the FE cast to be from waifu emblem.

Smash 4 really needs another Marth clone, right guys?
Also, although I think Geno would be weird in Smash, I wouldn't put bets on the fact that any character wouldn't make it into Smash just because the last guy who did that had to send nudes to his grandpa.
i'll say it again, tsarevna of smash is still imminent

 

[Burb]

I don't have time to go through every single point made rebutting my post at the moment, but allow me to take issue with this:



Now that's just not true. He is important to Nintendo's history because of the fact that he's the most popular character from SMRPG, which was the first RPG ever made for the Mario series and was the precursor for Paper Mario and the Mario & Luigi RPG saga. Without it we wouldn't have those two popular series. That's very important in Nintendo history. SMRPG was also an important game in that it was a very close collaboration between Square and Nintendo, a collaboration that was symbolic of an alliance that was sadly destroyed because of the feud that took place afterward. It is one of the most classic RPGs (and video games, period) ever made and represents an important era in gaming which isn't really represented very well in Smash. Square's closeness with Nintendo at that time created many classics and SMRPG best represents the classic SNES RPGs because of the fact that the two companies worked together on it. What made that game so popular was in large part its unique cast including Mallow and Geno who were so popular that players expected them to be recurring characters in the Mario mythos which sadly did not happen. The feud between Square and Nintendo itself is an important part of Nintendo history. And Geno represents all of this, because he is the most popular character originating from Super Mario RPG. He is the face of the game. When people think SMRPG, they think Geno, much the same way people think of Terra when they think of FF6. You simply can't find another Square character who is that unique and who plays that unique role of being a link between companies. I don't even think you could find another character like that, period, but feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

And why, exactly, does SMRPG in particular, of all Mario games, deserve a playable character in Smash? It's a one shot game from 19 years ago that sold poorly and wasn't even released worldwide initially. Furthermore, why should SMRPG result in Geno taking priority over characters like Paper Mario and Daisy who routinely out-perform him in "Most Wanted SSB4 Character" polls?

It doesn't matter if you expected them to be regular parts of the Mario series; fact of the matter is, they weren't.

Two words describe this argument: Circular Reasoning. He hasn't been used because he hasn't been used. Which is foolishness, because we've already seen that Nintendo is more than happy to work with third parties and put them in Smash in a way such that they are true to the game they come from. Just because Square Enix owns him doesn't mean Nintendo couldn't approach them about the subject; clearly Square is willing to let companies use Geno if they asked seeing as that's how the Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga cameo happened in the first place.

Alphadream asking to use him in a tutorial minigame in a Mario RPG is hardly the same thing as Sakurai asking to use Megaman in Smash Bros.

In order to take the time and effort needed to go and ask permission to use the character and then take the time to make a moveset and program him, they need to have reason to actually go ahead with it. None exists.

"It would be cool!" and "I think it'd represent Square and Nintendo's history!" =/= good reasons. His popularity isn't really a good reason, either; he's not the most wanted Mario character. He's being beaten by at least two characters they could use without having to go to Square. There is no benefit to using Geno over them or just about any other character they use that are outperforming Geno on the polls (And there is a lot of them).

Which brings us to the next fallacy implied here: Post Hoc Ergo Propter Hoc. If it was gonna happen, it would've happened already. It hasn't happened, therefore it will not happen. Even though the real world doesn't work like that and there are any number of different reasons why Geno hasn't made it into Smash yet. It is unfalsifiable foolishness that is very presumptive of Nintendo's motives with no evidence to back up such presumptions.

You seem to be a smart guy.

Which makes it kinda sad that you think Nintendo and Square Enix, despite having shown absolutely no interest in ever using these characters again (And Square has actually made at least three games using the Mario IP since SMRPG's release, and only one of them featured a SMRPG reference of any kind), would collaborate to put Geno in Smash Bros to appease a dwindling, niche fanbase on the internet.

I've already given every reason in the book as to why he's not in Smash (and it's not a "yet" thing; it will never happen). I'll go ahead and repeat them, though.
- He's a third party character representing a first party series, and he's not the most requested character from said first party series (In nearly every poll I've seen, he's less wanted than Paper Mario and Daisy. Often times Captain Toad and Waluigi as well). There is absolutely no benefit to them in reaching out to Square Enix to use this character, when they'd be fulfilling more people's wants just by using characters they don't need third party permission to use.
- His parent company has no interest in using the character ever again, including on games they've produced using the Mario IP. So, even if by some miracle, Nintendo chose Geno of all characters as DLC, there is a very high chance Square would request that they instead use a character from one of their own IPs such as Final Fantasy or Dragon Quest.
- Mario RPG characters never appear outside of the Mario RPGs other than one isolated incident.
- His fanbase is dwindling. Demand for Geno is not as high as it was leading into Brawl.

This is baseless speculation that can be interpreted to prove the opposite of how you're interpreting it. The fact that the Paper Mario Star Spirits even showed up at all in Mario Party 5 shows that they're willing to re-use RPG characters. Do you have a source that proves that the decision to stick to existing characters proves that Miyamoto dislikes the RPG characters instead of the real reason the developers stated in interviews, which is:

Mario Party 5 was developed by Hudson Soft. Not Nintendo.

Their usage of the Star Spirits was equivalent to Alphadream using Geno. Your point is moot.

Which has nothing to do with any baseless speculation on Miyamoto "not liking the RPG characters".

Even the execs at Alphadream themselves acknowledge Mallow and Geno's popularity and decided to consider giving them cameos in future games, so there's no reason to think at this point that he probably wouldn't have re-appeared anyway. The only thing that stopped it from happening was the Square feud. Paper Mario was even originally called Super Mario RPG 2 and had more elements from SMRPG, but they had to be removed because of the feud which is why we have the Paper Mario series we know and love today.

I'm not even going to comment on the part about Alphadream somehow disproving that Miyamoto is against using the RPG characters. It makes absolutely no sense. Judging from that and the statement above about Mario Party 5, I'm beginning to think you don't quite understand the difference between a developer and a publisher.

The "feud" has been buried for over a decade. Again: Square Enix has made at least three Mario games since then: Mario Hoops 3-on-3, Mario Sports Mix, and Fortune Street. The only Super Mario RPG reference in any of them is a single music track in Fortune Street. Geno doesn't appear. Mallow doesn't appear. There are no locations from SMRPG in any of them.

Once more: Mario RPG characters have never become re-occurring characters in the series. Even if the companies hadn't fallen out, we probably still wouldn't have seen Mallow or Geno again. The fact that Paper Mario was originally called SMRPG2 is irrelevant, and the idea that it would have "elements from SMRPG" is conjecture. We have screenshots from that time in the game's development. If anything, it was closer to Yoshi's Island than SMRPG, given the presence of Blaargs and Poochie.

No, this is something that honestly saddens me. From what I understand, when Geno didn't make it into Brawl the Geno fanbase's hopes were crushed and the movement scattered, which is why it's smaller today than it was then. I have seen people from the fanbase here, on Tumblr and Facebook and I see (and you can do a bit of searching too) that there are still lots of people outside of Smashboards that support Geno. We at Smashboards are doing what we can to bring back as many people from back then and around the internet as possible. I personally don't understand why Geno not making it into Brawl made the movement fall apart in the first place.

It fell apart because people grew up and realized that it was a stupid idea.

This is just your opinion which you need to back up if you want to present it as a serious argument against Geno's inclusion.

This whole topic is about opinions.

You know what sparked this argument? Someone posting an opinion that Geno is a stupid idea.

This whole argument is based on opinions. What's the point of mentioning it? There's opinions on both sides. For example.....

The argument that Geno's return has no reason to be in Smash doesn't hold water. You can argue that point about any game. ANY game. Why does it have no reason to be in Smash? In my opinion Smash would be a more appropriate place for him to return because of the fact that Geno's identity mainly revolves around his combat skills, special attacks, and the fact that he's so OP in battle in SMRPG. He's a fighter, indeed his backstory consists of the fact that he is a star that comes down from the Star Road not to play a passive role like other stars in the games but to fight, particularly in a humanoid form. And Smash is about putting obscure characters like him in the spotlight (like Ness), so why would Smash be an inappropriate place to bring him back?

You're presenting an opinion as an argument here. "Geno would be cool and unique cause he's OP in SMRPG and he's a star that became a doll and its neat and cool and Ness is in Smash so Geno should be too, and ...." is an opinion.

Secondly you're misrepresenting what Geno represents, which is the bond between Square and Nintendo and the 90's SNES RPG era his game comes from, not the entire Mario series.

You don't know what he'd represent, because he's not in Smash. Your word on this is as good as mine or anyone else's.

You're literally the only person I've heard say this, by the way. Everyone else mentions him representing the Mario RPG spinoffs as a whole.

And "A one-shot character from a spinoff that wasn't even initially released worldwide" and "the half-naked doll from SMRPG" just reeks of the kind of "He's stupid! I dun wanna stupid character I don't like in Smash!" sentiment I'd expect from GameFAQs. You can do better than that.

Your entire reasoning for wanting Geno in Smash can be summed up as "It'd be cool!" and "I think it could happen!".

You may have a better grasp on the English language, but when it comes down to it, you're every bit as clueless as the other Geno fans I argued with in this topic.

EDIT: I found the other post I wanted to respond to, here we go:

1. Define "chances" and your evidence, criterion, and methodology for calculating a character's "chances". Demonstrate to us that you have enough insider knowledge from Nintendo or a powerful enough crystal ball to let you know the inner workings and motivations in Smash development. A few statements from Masahiro Sakurai won't cut the mustard here -- development decisions for Smash have been made that contradict statements he made before, such as Ryu getting in despite the fact that Sakurai has told us not to expect too many third parties in Smash and even stated that Megaman was a "special case".
   
2. The fact that James Bond was even considered for Melee at all negates the point you're making, nor does the fact that he was considered for Melee in the past mean he has "zero chances", whatever that's supposed to mean.
   
3. We know hardly anything about who is actually considered for Smash aside from the few characters discussed in interviews, so just because there is no mention of Geno being considered at all doesn't mean he actually wasn't or that James Bond was closer to Smash than Geno is. Or any other character for that matter.

1. Perceived likelihood. Everyone knew that Little Mac and Palutena would be playable in SSB4. Everyone except you and the other Geno fans knew that Geno would not be.
2. How? My point was that Geno Boost's list of requirements to get into Smash wasn't even actually true. James Bond wasn't turned down because he's from a novel. He was turned down because of his third party status and usage of real world firearms.
3. In Melee, he most definitely was. The feud you like to mention so much? It was still ongoing during Melee's development.

No, I don't think that way at all. Burb's last argument was extremely subjective and genuinely just came across as him not liking the character. The statements he was making are even statements that Geno haters have made time and time again and give the impression that the character simply doesn't appeal to them, and for that there really is nothing one can say other than "Well that's just your opinion!" since it really is. I don't know how "the half-naked doll from SMRPG" is a legitimate criticism of the character.

And the arguments you gave are ones I've seen Geno supporters make time and time again. Including in this topic before your arrival.

I'm not a "hater", either. I don't hate or like Geno as a character. I nothing him. Yes, I think him in Smash is a stupid idea that will never be made a reality. Yes, I'm vocal about it.

Even if you were right and I did have this searing hatred for this character I'll probably never see again outside of subsequent SMRPG and M&L:SS playthroughs......what difference does it make? This thread's purpose is for people to post character ideas they think are stupid. Guess what ideas people might find stupid? Characters they hate.

I'd put "He's a star that decided to fight as a humanoid!" on the same level as "Half-naked doll from SMRPG", by the way.

Smash 4 really needs another Marth clone, right guys?
Also, although I think Geno would be weird in Smash, I wouldn't put bets on the fact that any character wouldn't make it into Smash just because the last guy who did that had to send nudes to his grandpa.
i'll say it again, tsarevna of smash is still imminent

I actually bet the entire Leaks group that Ridley would not be playable in SSB4. I put my username on the line and won.

I'd be thrilled to make a bet with any of these guys that Geno will never be playable in SSB4. I'd even extend it to any future Smash game, but then there'd be no endpoint.

 

[dy831532sssfjhhggb2224523]

Hector and Lyndis from Fire Emblem.

Spoiler

They don't have nearly as much going for them in terms of being unique in compairson to Eliwood.

Ike is already a slow yet hard-hitting character, making Hector entirely redundant, and Ike could easily be given a combination of swords and axes to tackle the "but muh axes are unique!" deal since he uses both in Radiant Dawn, similar to Hector's Great Lord promotion, if Sakurai really cared. I'm not going to call it an issue because they really aren't unique, saying "An axe would be unique!" with nothing to elaborate on further for uniqueness besides maybe Hand Axes is something I was exhausted on hearing years ago. If you want a unique sword and axe character, the only viable option seems to be Felix and Isaac from Golden Sun. The Sword of Seals and Roy's animations have much, much more declone potential on Roy than Hector does on being unique if they ever want to go that route. Hector's just the third wheel in his own game, even in his mode which requires beating the game once, at least Ike is much more important and relevant to the series for the slow, hard-hitting role, and Roy is much more important and relevant than Hector, accomplishing much more than him and being Elibe's main hero. Roy surpassed his predecessors, and even Hartmut, so having someone with lesser achievements from the same world when there's still more worlds not shown doesn't seem fitting. Hector has little screenshot/reveal potential with so few ties to Roy. He's not fitting alt costume material for Ike, since his Brawl outfit is a much better choice, and he doesn't fit on any characters that would benefit further FE representation. Hector truly is a bad idea for anything but a Mii costume. But Mii Swordfighter is perfect for him: They both revolve around being really sluggish and missing everything.

Lyndis for blade and bow? Ehh. Link, Young Link, Toon Link, Pit, and Dark Pit already do this. If you want more variations on bows, they have custom specials for that. I feel that bow combat for a melee+ranged user is maxed out on as it stands. 4/5 of them are currently in Smash, and Young could happen as DLC for all we know. Lyn doesn't have much going for her in Elibe, let alone Fire Emblem as a whole, due to her simply being FE7's first lord and being a much less important character for the vast majority of the game. She serves as a supporting character, which fits her role as an Assist Trophy. Fans who tire of sword users but request her and deny other swordsman fans are hypocrites. Making her DLC or removing her as an Assist in any future Smash would directly remove content from the game, which is really bad when she has much less going for her than Little Mac. Another character I feel is dwarfed by Roy's declone potential if they really do want a unique swordsman.

Eliwood has a few of the same flaws going against him, but not quite as many. A mounted character who primarily uses lances in ways that make lances stand out from traditional Smash fighters has much more potential for a unique newcomer or alternate costume for a Jugdral character, new blood in FE representation. Lances can have angled tilts and smashes, have altered toss trajectory, serve as strictly vertical/horizontal poking tools which is new, have charge-based movement, have a chain lance based on FE's GBA generals that can tether/grab, be used to set tall obstacles/traps, and be based on their medeival usage. I don't see this potential for axes or bows. Little blade usage can cover blind spots, create unique attacks like the ones listed in my thread, and add spice to the moveset. He is much more important to Elibe and Fire Emblem as a whole than the other two, and has infinite reveal potential with Roy now in. My support thread is mainly a ploy to get him in Fates and Project M, and to see non-fighter content, but he's still easily a better choice than the other two Elibe lords not in. He is FE7's main character and remains a vital figure in FE6 and its manga, unlike the other two lords. He is also Roy's canon father, which is a lot on its own. He's not the best idea, but he fits Sakurai's criteria much better than his fellow lords.

 

[Geno Boost]

Again There is no proof that shows Geno has no chance by Nintendo or sakurai whatsoever

 

[Neckbeards]

Someone voted for Falco even though he's already in the game.

 

[ELITEWarri0r115]

Someone voted for Falco even though he's already in the game.

I never knew my trolling suggestion would work...

 

[LIQUID12A]

Condescending remarks aside, that would be all well and good if the arguments Burb was making at the end of his post weren't subjective declarative statements that genuinely do sound like just his opinion, and if he didn't say outright:



I'm sorry if it offends you but it genuinely DOES sound like "just his opinion". Unless you'd care to explain how "that half-naked doll from SMRPG" is a legitimate criticism of the character and not just an insult.

And like I said before, I genuinely don't feel the way you seem to think I do at all. Just because I called out the last part of his post as "just his opinion" doesn't mean I'm automatically labeling him a hater. Nor do quotes from one other person, with no real context, represent the entire Geno fanbase. You're making the same assumptions and generalizations about me you assume I'm making about him, even though I have said once and will say again, quite emphatically, that I'm not. I have no idea whether Burb is a "Geno hater" or not. I do know, from his own words, that he does not want Geno in, and the end of his post does come across as "just his opinion" whether you like it or not. The last paragraph of his post mostly consisted of declarative statements.

Here's a better way to approach this: how is "that half-naked doll from SMRPG", in the context he wrote that statement in, not "just his opinion"? How is it a legitimate criticism?

If a person makes an opinion based on fact, then it really isn't "just an opinion". It's an opinion based on facts they are willing to back up and stand for. It's just really straightforward logic.

Also, "that half naked doll" isn't even an opinion. It's just a label, albeit one used in a negative commotion. This point would be more fitting if he said "the lame and useless half naked doll", because THEN it is fully an opinion and criticism, which "half naked doll" by itself is not. And it's perfectly capable of being used in a context that isn't perceivable as rude. "Hey, remember that buff Scottish guy from SPM?" "What was that guy's name...the half naked doll..."

 

[DarkDragonVG]

I remember someone saying issac was confirmed because he wasnt an assist trophy.
not saying I dont like Issac, but that could also mean that mario could be confirmed for dlc.

 

[Burb]

Again There is no proof that shows Geno has no chance by Nintendo or sakurai whatsoever

There's more than enough reason to think that he doesn't.

What difference does it make, anyway? This is a topic about what character suggestions people think are stupid. Some of us think that Geno is a stupid suggestion. What you think of his chances is completely irrelevant.

This whole argument makes no sense to begin with. You guys are getting angry at people for doing what the topic asked of them.

 

[Geno Boost]

There's more than enough reason to think that he doesn't.

There is also a reason why he does, all what you think about this guy is negative reasons but there is always positive reasons not every character in smash was perfect choice after all

 

[Burb]

There is also a reason why he does, all what you think about this guy is negative reasons but there is always positive reasons not every character in smash was perfect choice after all

The reasons why he doesn't outweigh the reasons why he does.

And we've been over the reasons why about a dozen times now. The last time you and I talked about them, you got so mad that you were reduced to a belligerent mess typing in bold, red-colored lettering.

Why does it bother you so much that people think Geno is a stupid idea that will never happen? I get that he's your favorite, but the fact that it upsets you this much and leads to us having the exact same argument over and over and over again is pretty ridiculous. Maybe you should put me on ignore or something, instead of pitching a temper tantrum every time I post about Geno.

 

[Geno Boost]

The reasons why he doesn't outweigh the reasons why he does.

And we've been over the reasons why about a dozen times now. The last time you and I talked about them, you got so mad that you were reduced to a belligerent mess typing in bold, red-colored lettering.

Why does it bother you so much that people think Geno is a stupid idea that will never happen? I get that he's your favorite, but the fact that it upsets you this much and leads to us having the exact same argument over and over and over again is pretty ridiculous. Maybe you should put me on ignore or something, instead of pitching a temper tantrum every time I post about Geno.

So does dr. Mario and toon link and greninja? Yes (in my opinion) but it's only depends on your opinion of the character, there isn't any proof shows he does or doesn't and sakurai didn't state something more than the 4 main rules I can easily give paper Mario more negative than his positive but does that mean he has no chance? No

I am fine if people like Geno or not but saying no chance without a proof from the company is a problem

 

[Burb]

So does dr. Mario and toon link and greninja? Yes (in my opinion) but it's only depends on your opinion of the character, there isn't any proof shows he does or doesn't and sakurai didn't state something more than the 4 main rules I can easily give paper Mario more negative than his positive but does that mean he has no chance? No

I am fine if people like Geno or not but saying no chance without a proof from the company is a problem

I have no clue what you're even trying to say here. What, exactly, does Dr. Mario, Toon Link, and Greninja have to do with anything? They're all in Smash. Geno is not.

Your four made up rules hold no water, I've already debunked them.

And again, I've given plenty of reasons why Geno will never happen. You don't need Sakurai to come out and say "NOPE." in order to know it's not gonna happen. He never came out and said Master Chief is never gonna happen, did he? We just know he's impossible. The same goes for Geno.

And that last sentence is what I'm trying to say: why do you care so much that people think Geno has no chance? It really shouldn't bother you this much.

Would you be willing to make a wager on this? Because I'm so certain that Geno's not gonna get in, that I am.

 

[LIQUID12A]

it's only depends on your opinion of the character

"I'm a Geno supporter and I think that anything an opponent says is their opinion" cliche.

there isn't any proof shows he does or doesn't and sakurai didn't state something more than the 4 main rules

 

[Geno Boost]

I have no clue what you're even trying to say here. What, exactly, does Dr. Mario, Toon Link, and Greninja have to do with anything? They're all in Smash. Geno is not.

Your four made up rules hold no water, I've already debunked them.

And again, I've given plenty of reasons why Geno will never happen. You don't need Sakurai to come out and say "NOPE." in order to know it's not gonna happen. He never came out and said Master Chief is never gonna happen, did he? We just know he's impossible. The same goes for Geno.

And that last sentence is what I'm trying to say: why do you care so much that people think Geno has no chance? It really shouldn't bother you this much.

Would you be willing to make a wager on this? Because I'm so certain that Geno's not gonna get in, that I am.

Yes but I can give negative reasons more than positive reasons but they were ended in smash I was like you in the past saying "Greninja have no chance because of blah blah blah..." but he ended up in smash after that I relized that negative reasons are not the only thing that he has but he has positive reasons as well. Geno is just like every character who's getting requested, he has positive and negative at the same time but that didn't make the character stand no chance

Still none of the character of who didn't follow sakurai rule did get into smash I will only agree if we got James bound for real

I can give reasons why it can happen every person can do the same thing so there isn't something different.
Master chief never appeared in a Nintendo console wich is why people already know it won't happen

If I said bandana dee have no chance in any place it will bother a lot of people because people already can prove this is wrong with a real proofs

Well for me Geno is possible because that's what I know about him

 

[Burb]

Yes but I can give negative reasons more than positive reasons but they were ended in smash I was like you in the past saying "Greninja have no chance because of blah blah blah..." but he ended up in smash after that I relized that negative reasons are not the only thing that he has but he has positive reasons as well. Geno is just like every character who's getting requested, he has positive and negative at the same time but that didn't make the character stand no chance

"People said this character had no chance and they made it, so anyone can!"

Greninja didn't have the same roadblocks as Geno. He's not third party, and he didn't have characters from X/Y who were more requested (in fact, no X/Y Pokemon were really highly requested. The only standouts from the Pokemon series as a whole I remember were Mewtwo and Sceptile).

This is an apples-to-oranges comparison. I don't even remember people labeling Greninja as a no-chance character, anyway. The ones that made the roster I recall people saying had no chance were Duck Hunt Dog and Dark Pit.

Still none of the character of who didn't follow sakurai rule did get into smash I will only agree if we got James bound for real

Sakurai stated the reason why he didn't make it in was because of how difficult it would be to get the rights to use him, and the character's use of real world firearms.

None of the four reasons on your made-up list of requirements was a factor.

I can give reasons why it can happen every person can do the same thing so there isn't something different.
Master chief never appeared in a Nintendo console wich is why people already know it won't happen

Exactly. He has something major blocking his entry. People know this, so they dismiss his chances.

It's the same thing with Geno. Geno is owned by Square Enix, represents a series that already has a ton of characters, and isn't even the most wanted character from that series.

There is absolutely no good reason to go to the effort to get the rights to use Geno from Square when they'd please a larger sum of people by putting in a character who's in higher demand like Paper Mario.

If I said bandana dee have no chance in any place it will bother a lot of people because people already can prove this is wrong with a real proofs

And I'd call them out for taking issue, too.

This is a thread where people are asked to say ideas that they think are stupid. If someone thinks Bandanna Dee is a dumb idea, they should be allowed to say it without getting chewed out by Bandanna Dee fanboys.

Well for me Geno is possible because that's what I know about him

"he's possible cuz I know he is"

 

[Geno Boost]

"People said this character had no chance and they made it, so anyone can!"

Greninja didn't have the same roadblocks as Geno. He's not third party, and he didn't have characters from X/Y who were more requested (in fact, no X/Y Pokemon were really highly requested. The only standouts from the Pokemon series as a whole I remember were Mewtwo and Sceptile).

This is an apples-to-oranges comparison. I don't even remember people labeling Greninja as a no-chance character, anyway. The ones that made the roster I recall people saying had no chance were Duck Hunt Dog and Dark Pit.



Sakurai stated the reason why he didn't make it in was because of how difficult it would be to get the rights to use him, and the character's use of real world firearms.

None of the four reasons on your made-up list of requirements was a factor.



Exactly. He has something major blocking his entry. People know this, so they dismiss his chances.

It's the same thing with Geno. Geno is owned by Square Enix, represents a series that already has a ton of characters, and isn't even the most wanted character from that series.

There is absolutely no good reason to go to the effort to get the rights to use Geno from Square when they'd please a larger sum of people by putting in a character who's in higher demand like Paper Mario.



And I'd call them out for taking issue, too.

This is a thread where people are asked to say ideas that they think are stupid. If someone thinks Bandanna Dee is a dumb idea, they should be allowed to say it without getting chewed out by Bandanna Dee fanboys.



"he's possible cuz I know he is"

For me he had a lot of negative reasons of why I was thinking he had no chance

I will only agree if he was in smash already

The same as Geno!? What!? Master chief is waaaay too complicated

"There is no absolute good reason" here we go again... there is both negative and positive reasons if we are talking about this

You can think of character ideas being stupid feel free to do it but saying "no chance" with no real proofs is worse

 

[Burb]

For me he had a lot of negative reasons of why I was thinking he had no chance

You're not really a good judge of these things.

I will only agree if he was in smash already

This isn't an "agree or disagree" type thing. It is a fact.

I provided you a link to a translation of it. Sakurai himself said that Bond was considered and decided against due to licensing and the use of guns. The fact that he's not a video game character was completely unmentioned.

You keep telling me that there's no facts or evidence that prove Geno has no chance. I provided actual, genuine, irrefutable evidence of my claims about Bond. How is that not good enough for you?

The same as Geno!? What!? Master chief is waaaay too complicated

As is Geno.

"There is no absolute good reason" here we go again... there is both negative and positive reasons if we are talking about this

You can think of character ideas being stupid feel free to do it but saying "no chance" with no real proofs is worse

There's more in the favor of him not being in than there is that he could get in. You keep mentioning that there's no proof he has no chance, but there's also no proof that he has one. Given the stronger evidence on the side of him having none, it's a safer assumption to say he has none.

I offered to make a wager over it, and you completely ignored me on that. Something tells me you're not as certain as you seem to think.

 

[Geno Boost]

You're not really a good judge of these things.



This isn't an "agree or disagree" type thing. It is a fact.

I provided you a link to a translation of it. Sakurai himself said that Bond was considered and decided against due to licensing and the use of guns. The fact that he's not a video game character was completely unmentioned.

You keep telling me that there's no facts or evidence that prove Geno has no chance. I provided actual, genuine, irrefutable evidence of my claims about Bond. How is that not good enough for you?



As is Geno.



There's more in the favor of him not being in than there is that he could get in. You keep mentioning that there's no proof he has no chance, but there's also no proof that he has one. Given the stronger evidence on the side of him having none, it's a safer assumption to say he has none.

I offered to make a wager over it, and you completely ignored me on that. Something tells me you're not as certain as you seem to think.

For me it was I did bring a lot of negative points in the past (before I was on smashboards)

Then why we don't have a real life character yet in smash? Not in brawl? not in smash 4? Mii is a thing now and you create real life characters there

Being not in a Nintendo console make it waaaay complicated you can't compare Geno to master chief if it's about smash

"There is more favor of him not being in" I can think of more positives than negative so this is only depends on our opinion
"There is no proof that shows king k. Rool has a chance" you are acting like this right now, the character appearing in the poll and not being hated by sakurai and being one of nintendos part alone can give a character a chance

 

[LIQUID12A]

"There is more favor of him not being in" you sound like a troll

Saying a character has more points in favor of them not being in isn't trolling. It's explaining. Have the definition of trolling:

troll2
trōl/
verb
gerund or present participle: trolling

1. 1.
   informal
   make a deliberately offensive or provocative online posting with the aim of upsetting someone or eliciting an angry response from them.
   "if people are obviously trolling then I'll delete your posts and do my best to ban you"

Simply explaining why a character is highly unlikely for Smash is not trolling. You're only perceiving the explanation as trolling because this is your pipe dream character for Smash and how dare anyone explain why he's unlikely to be in.

 

[Geno Boost]

Saying a character has more points in favor of them not being in isn't trolling. It's explaining. Have the definition of trolling:

troll2
trōl/
verb
gerund or present participle: trolling

1. 1.
   informal
   make a deliberately offensive or provocative online posting with the aim of upsetting someone or eliciting an angry response from them.
   "if people are obviously trolling then I'll delete your posts and do my best to ban you"

Simply explaining why a character is highly unlikely for Smash is not trolling. You're only perceiving the explanation as trolling because this is your pipe dream character for Smash and how dare anyone explain why he's unlikely to be in.

Spoiler

I am not good at English so I don't know if the word "troll" is the right word I should use
And doesn't "has more favor" means people wants more?