My Marth needs improvement- Updated with NEW VIDS!!!

[Emblem Lord]

Here is the vid.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7CFv0sWt3hE&mode=related&search=

Woz (Fox) vs Emblem Lord (Marth)

I have been playing this game competitively for about a year and I know I still have lots of room for improvement. Please rate and critque my Marth. Criticism is welcomed and encouraged. This vid is about 2 months old, but my play style remains pretty much the same.

Update: NEW VIDS!!!!!!! Uploaded June 11th 2007

pockyD (Ice Climbers) vs. Emblem Lord (Marth) Match 1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sSMz6FVDdRI&NR=1

pockyD (Ice Climbers) vs. Emblem Lord (Marth) Match 2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pxdls0POeLI&NR=1


Please be brutally honest when critiqueing.

 

[Cactuar]

You fail. Quit life.

Jast Keeding. We've already discussed Marth strategy, so I'm not going to give out more personal strategy to the public.

EL's Marth = hawt.

 

[demonsbane105]

on school comp. can't load vid. sorry

 

[Mcscruff]

Your Marth isnt that bad... just work on your edge guarding, dont use the down b as much, and use the spike

 

[Cactuar]

Your Marth isnt that bad... just work on your edge guarding, dont use the down b as much, and use the spike

Lol. Semi-worthless advice. :D

 

[Emblem Lord]

Wow. 49 views, but only 4 responses?! Is my Marth really that horrible? C'mon guys help me out!

 

[booshk]

OMFG YES FINALLY
a marth that doesn't suck aZZ. ive seen most of the other videos and i havent commented them cause theyre so horrible =P
but yahh
i like ur marth =]

i dunno tho.
i would say n-air a tad less =P

 

[Cactuar]

Nothing against you boosh, but I hate it when people give advice like "nair less" but don't explain why. Like against fox it would be "because the lag from it is slightly higher and it gives him a bigger window to run in and grab you". You don't really have a problem with nairing too much, just where to place them, such as when the fox is approaching from the air, which WoZ doesn't really do against Marth unless he knows you are grounded and will probably shield.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Well, I'm glad people like my Marth. I guess that means this year of playing competitively wasn't entirely wasted. Still, if I wanted only Cactuar to give me tips I would just talk to him on AIM or call him.

Please help me out here people!

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

EL the only things i have to say are be a bit less predictable (my mindgames suck, and i find that even i was predicting everything by about the 2nd stock). for example, you died one of the stocks when u were falling down, right above the fox on the left edge, and you used your side b just before, and since u had done it like 10 other times that match, he waited for it and killed u in the lag.

i personally perfer fair to nair because of the range, and fox being so fast i think its safe to use fair. i did see some really nice nair usage though, and i need to use nair in my game so i cant really talk that much.

Oh yea, watch the lag of some moves. you went to DED, 2nd time in a row, and during that the fox jumped over you, and ran up behind you, and you continued doing the combo insuring that u would get hit. if u see him dodge it, immediately stop, and that will lower the lag.

 

[Emblem Lord]

YES!!! Some really useful advice from someone that I'm not friends with. This is what I'm talking about people! Thanks Sveet. Let's keep it up with this good advice.

 

[Zaromo]

You're Marth is a heck lot better than mine

 

[MC Mike]

I notice that after everytime you killed the Fox you would move around and when the Fox got back onto the stage every stock you would double jump and fall on a platform. I dont know if anyone else noticed that im guessing not since no one posted anything about it. Some people might not thinks its important but if you always do the same thing while ur opponent is in invincability they will eventually catch on and that is when your most vonerable. Good players will be able to take advantage of that one little mistake and turn it into something big for them.

Besides that i would say that you have a pretty solid marth just practice on not being so slow to read your opponents tech (guess sometimes what you think they're going to do, you might not always be right but when you are it pays off). Dont wavedash back and Nair so much, dashdance a little bit more. Develope more mindgames (thats what dash dancing is for). And just keep playing and asking questions.

 

[Thomaz]

Nair is a good move, but it has more lag then say for instance Marth's Fair. You got grabbed because of it quite a few times. I suggest you Fair a bit more because they lead to grabs far better then Nairs, since Nair usually hits them away.

Nair is mostly when either in a combo or when they drop on the platforms. I saw you use Fair there, but you can't really knock them away much, because that's what you want when they're on a platform, right?

One thing I noticed also, is that you're too much in your shield when the Fox runs towards you, in that situation, either try 'jabs' (lol, that sounds weird) to push them away or spotdodge the grab. Don't worry, I have the same problem and I'm trying to get rid of it. =(

And DI that Upthrow. I know that WoZ throws fast, but just try to hold a certain direction when thrown to make it more difficult for the Fox. You could also Smash DI the Uairs, but that's hard and few people can do that consistently, lol, so don't worry about that yet.

Other then that, I liked your Marth, good stuff. ^_^

 

[Emblem Lord]

OMG!!! Thomaz!!!!!
You are never in the hub anymore and that makes me a sad panda.

Get Ryuker in here so he can help me out too! Pretty please?

<3 Thomaz and Ryuker

Edit: Whenever I spot dodge grabs vs Fox players that are actually good I get shined as soon as my spot dodge ends. So I cut down my spot dodging when I play Fox because of that. The nairs on the ground were to bait him into trying to attack me so then I could dash back from his grab attempt and then dash back in for a grab or just get in a free attack if I timed it correctly. I knew he would try to capitilize on the lag so if I spaced myself correctly I could get in a free grab when he tried to grab me. If I used fair the same mindgame wouldn't work as well because he would be weary of rusing me afterwards, knowing that fair has very little lag. Of course my mindgame didn't always work, which is when I got punished for it.

Thanks guys! I appreciate all the help! Please keep it up!

 

[Sol]

i'll have to watch it when i get home

 

[D1]

Hmm a few times I noticed if Fox was on the right platform you'd bair him and then get punished for it. The first time u didn't really get punished but the 2nd time u attempted the same thing he pulled an upthrow uair after SG'ing it. A key factor in winning this matchup is grabs. Whoever gets in the most grabs wins basically. One nifty trick most Marth's do when attempting to CG a Fox from 0 is instead of shooting for an early uthrow, just fthrow and then regrab afterwards 90% of the time this works as long as they don't roll/dodge away (most Foxes don't) plus u get an easy 9% from the early fthrow on the Fox so the rest of the CGing w/ uthrow should be easy from there. I saw ur mindgame w/ the nairs working for the most part but don't rely on 'em too much. If Fox is ever running in ur face shoot for a dtilt instead of the neutral A swipes dtilt is his fastest move its probably like the equivalent of Fox's jab...if ur ever in a pinch and someone's dashing at you instead of shielding, shoot for a dtilt (most of the time dtilt's yield free grabs for Marth which is a plus ).

Um, I'll rewatch the vid to see if there's anything else I missed...I'm startin to love Marth more than Fox nowadays he's so much cooler and IMO takes more work

 

[Emblem Lord]

Marth takes more work with mindgames. Fox takes more work technically.
My grab game takes a hit on dream land, because of the platforms. Although they can give me a free nair, it's not like other platforms which can lead to free tippers. Thanks for the tips man.

People I know you can catch more mistakes in that vid. Come on! Help me become uber plz!!!

 

[BrTarolg]

seriously i thought your marth was very good...
it was partly due to being unlucky, and some VERY small things as to the reason why you lost.

i *think* it has something to do with your playstyle. although its very clean, and very well executed <you dont make that many mistakes>, you arnt using marth to his full.

the best advice i could give is just to be more varied and inventive.

whilst its OK to use your one particular playstyle over and over again <as some people have pointed out things youve done in this thread> - because youve played it so much you know exactly how to recover when things go wrong and what to do, perhaps you might want to try some different marth combos, or different kinds of approaches.

like, maying trying to approach more with double fairs, or instead of dodging alot attempt shieldgrabbing <i didnt see fox shine much in that match>, or you can try light shielding, and then wavedash out of shield to grab, or jump our of shield to fair.

its generally the choices you made wernt too bad, but there were a few instances where you coulda done something better.

 

[Emblem Lord]

* Nods head* Wheeeeeeeeee!!!! Yay!! Good tips make Emblem a happy camper!!!!

 

[flaco]

Well marth is actually a good charecter to star using I have been using marth for like 3 to 5 months now and I had been doing preety good i won one torny on springfield mass and also Iwent to guanlet so I think is pretty cool marth game is all about spacing and mindgames,my friend go to my thread at novice marth trainig for any help.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Ummm. Ok, the point of this thread is to comment of the vid and give me tips on how to improve. Not to tell me why Marth is good and how long you have been playing etc. Not trying to be mean. Just want the thread to stay on topic.

Plus I kind of the get the impression that you think I'm a newbie. Which isn't true. But w/e.

 

[flaco]

well bro i didnt mean it like that but you got it the wrong way is all good and I didnt say you were a newbie you use marth better that me when i saw the vid but am just giving you a different prespective thats all dam bro you up tight dam

 

[Emblem Lord]

No, I don't think I am. It's just that once a thread gets off topic it's pretty hard to get it back on track. Plus the thread could be closed. That's why I just want to keep it on track.

 

[Cactuar]

Yeah flaco... telling us you went to Gauntlet is pointless. Didn't you get like 27th or something? EL's Marth is better than mine and I got third at the last Gauntlet I went to. Everything you have posted in that so called newbie thread is somewhat worthless to us. You haven't given any perspective or advice on his Marth in either of your posts.

@ EL: Are you going to come down with Woz this Saturday?

 

[flaco]

aight bro getting back on track of the thread your marth is pretty good actually I think you might need to work on the l cancels and wd and also spacing but thats pretty much it well good luck bro and am sorry about trying to messed up your thread aight bro I hoped these helped.

 

[Cactuar]

Hey EL. Lrn 2 l cancel nd wd nd space ur sword.


Think he even watched the video?

 

[flaco]

dude the hell is your problem man just drop it dude am not gonna go around your thread talking **** making fun of people dude dam bro and i said am sorry aight.

 

[Warrior of Zarona]

Stop sucking and you'll be better.

Good advice imo

 

[Emblem Lord]

^ GTFO my thread plz.

Yeah Charles, I'm coming over your place with Andrew this Saturday.

 

[sup]

woa nice moves you were doing good at the begginig but you lost at the end.Well am asking you for help how do you space that much i space but not that much and one more thing I dont do against foxes I fear them becuase of there l cancel shine trick how do you evade that,anyway sup flaco you going to that torny last time you won but these time am about to win lol.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Sup: lol. If you want tips then send me a pm plz. If you post something that doesn't contribute to the thread then mods will get upset and they will warn you, neg rep you, mess up your posts etc. I just don't want someone new to get in trouble right from the start.

 

[Cactuar]

Hahaha. Sup sounds exactly like flaco. EL, I've got some new stuff to show you later. Also, you should really start trying to use Marth's uair more. If you are close to the ground right under the enemy, hit with center of the sword so it barely pops them up and just gives them a decent hit stun, then tip them with the fsmash. Works very well against any non-floaty character. Probably my favorite thing to do against Sheik, Falcon, and space animals. Roy combo's ftw.

 

[metroid1117]

Your Marth is very solid, for the most part. I really liked how clean your waveshielding was, and how well you used it in the beginning of the match. In my opinion, you could use more double short-hop FAirs, and maybe even FAir -> UAir in the same short-hop; it's hard to do, but if you can get it down, you can start some easy juggles against fastfallers if you tip the UAir. Regarding your edgeguarding, there were some moments where you could've jumped out and hit WoZ with B. Either that, or you can use BAir instead of FAir for knocking him out of Firefox; FAir may knock them upwards and aid their recovery.

Also, as a side note, you should try DI'ing out of Fox's UThrow; I think that was the only throw he used for the entire match. You could also try using Counter after the UThrow, because it's easy to tell that there's definetely going to be an UAir coming up.

 

[Warrior of Zarona]

Also, as a side note, you should try DI'ing out of Fox's UThrow; I think that was the only throw he used for the entire match. You could also try using Counter after the UThrow, because it's easy to tell that there's definetely going to be an UAir coming up.

You know, I always tell him to DI.

 

[flaco]

well these tip would help me a lot i lost to a fox on guanlet he up throw me and I di and he still follow my di he hit three times up in the air am like the hell is these o well thanks anyway.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Bumpage ftw

 

[Emblem Lord]

NECROOOOOOOOO POWAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!

Technically it's not a double post because the last post is from last year.

Anyway, the vid is old, but it's still one of my best matches.

MORE TIPS NOA!!!!!

 

[darkshy]

I would say less nair's they got a little predictable. Improve your spiking it helps alot! Since this is a fox player don;t forget you can chain grab him since he's an FF.

Other than that I guess that's it.

 

[Cactuar]

Lol. How generic. "Don't forget you are Marth and can cg space animals."

You don't need to cg Fox/Falco to do well.