Mixing Up Your Style

[Metatitan]

Yoshi has far more mixups than most people think... yaddi yaddi yaddi... same description as the egg toss one, post mixins because im too lazy to post any atm.

 

[VSC.D-Torr]

Jab mixups

Jab -> Jab
Jab -> Ftilt
Jab -> Dtilt
Jab -> Dsmash
Jab -> Fsmash??? (Bwett is too good)
Jab -> Pivot grab
Jab -> Down B
Jab -> Utilt

Are there any more?

Also, let's talk about the effectiveness of each of them.

Edit: I know there are other mix-ups for other attacks. I just put up Jabs first just as a start to this discussion.

Edit 2: Thanks Meta for pointing out Jab to Utilt.

 

[chimpact]

Why make topics without putting any input in them. It's so stupid. THis post is stupid as well but needs to be said.

 

[Metatitan]

Why make topics without putting any input in them. It's so stupid. THis post is stupid as well but needs to be said.

Because unlike you, other people are capable of making worthwhile posts because they actually know mixups . Just because I won't put input in at the start doesn't mean input won't be made period.

I've done jab up tilt D-Torr

 

[chimpact]

Empty short hop
SH DJ rising bair
SH DJ rising nair
SH reverse egg lay

 

[BoJangles]

Because unlike you, other people are capable of making worthwhile posts because they actually know mixups .

Was that necessary? Despite the smilie, it comes off as extremely rude.

Of the mix-ups that D-torr posted, I think that Jab to F-smash is probably the least likely to be successful. I feel that every character would have to opportunity to shield/dodge and punish. That said, because it's meant to be a mix-up, I know it's not all about being safe. D-torr, have you ever done this to anybody?

 

[VSC.D-Torr]

No I haven't done Jab to Fsmash. I put that there because I saw it in Bwett's new combo vid. I'm skeptical about it as well, but yes, it qualifies as a mixup, albeit the least likely to work.

I want to discuss the usefulness of each of these Jab mixups, and how to apply them and such.

 

[Metatitan]

Was that necessary? Despite the smilie, it comes off as extremely rude.

Of the mix-ups that D-torr posted, I think that Jab to F-smash is probably the least likely to be successful. I feel that every character would have to opportunity to shield/dodge and punish. That said, because it's meant to be a mix-up, I know it's not all about being safe. D-torr, have you ever done this to anybody?

You'll come to learn that I don't care whether I'm rude or not on the internet .

Mindgames:
As you've seen in billy's combo video, if you jump past their shield and reverse egg lay, it works. Trust me i tried it this sunday and it works really well.

Rising Nair really is amazing. If DDD is near the edge it will kill earlier than you could ever hope with uair

Jab F smash means you've done a lot of jab cancels and they've learned to spotdodge them. f smash is laggy enough to **** them after the spotdodge. You're reading their read of you

Double jump tricksies are always nice

DJC egg lay combined with simple reverse egg lays (or even regular egg lays) and with spaced bairs, full hop bairs, rising nair and a plethora of other tricks really are what is key to keeping you unreadable and unpredictable. That said, this takes FOREVER to learn and is part of the reason yoshi has such a high learning curve. Unpredictability is hard =/

And many other things

 

[Deleted member]

Jab mixups

Jab -> Jab
Jab -> Ftilt
Jab -> Dtilt
Jab -> Dsmash
Jab -> Fsmash??? (Bwett is too good)
Jab -> Pivot grab
Jab -> Down B
Jab -> Utilt

Are there any more?

Also, let's talk about the effectiveness of each of them.

Edit: I know there are other mix-ups for other attacks. I just put up Jabs first just as a start to this discussion.

Edit 2: Thanks Meta for pointing out Jab to Utilt.

Jab to any aerial is hella good, particularly bair. Jab to do nothing is amazing haha. Jab to grounded egg lay.
A lot of the jab cancel stuff is to create the responses you want, and then punish accordingly. Jab to foxtrot away and see what they do. they spot dodge, next time you jab you can fsmash, or jump behind and bair. Or say you jab to down b and they punish by shielding the whole thing, next time you jab to pivot grab.

Jab is amazing, but besides that, yoshi has a ton of other stuff.
Approaching: Yoshi's approaches are all punishable, but they are all punishable by different stuff, so similarly to jab cancels, you can punish their punishes with one of yoshis other options.
You also dont always have to straight up approach, you can SH bair to RDJC egg lay which is amazingly amazing and it owns everyone

Eggs: The most important egg mixup imo is when you are on the edge. Some yoshi players, even some good ones, think that the best way to ECE is to throw eggs at the enemies shield directly, all the time. Cuz u know, it wears down their shield, some people fall for it.
But its very important to mix up your eggs. Throw a lobbing egg that waits for a second and hits the top of their shield, causing them not only to use more of their shield, but now they have to be careful with the timing, especially if theye been trying to powershield eggs. This is very important against good players playing cahracters that can **** you on the ledge (marth, MK), cuz if you get predictable they can punish it.

 

[VSC.D-Torr]

Thanks Burntsocks.

Also, you are so right with SH Bair to RDJC Egg Lay. Too good.

 

[Delta-cod]

Socks got to most of the ones I like to use.

About the ECE, it's even better if you lob it high and soft. It will take long to hit their shield, AND it can bounce off their shield, then explode on the shield for further damage. It's sexy. Also, if you do this, you can launch another egg auickly right at them, ant it will hit nearly immediately after. If they've been powershielding, they will most likely get hit.

 

[Airborne]

jab to fsmash is very reliable against a player that likes to spot dodge immediately. fsmash has enough starting lag to time it to when the spot dodge is ending, so the fsmash can make contact.

mixups for when approaching a grounded opponent:
backwards SH to bair
backwards SH to egg toss
backwards SH to DJC egg toss
backwards SH to turnaround egg lay
backwards SH to DJC egg lay
backwards SH to uair right before you land

most of those are to punish shield and spot dodge, while the egg toss shenanigans are good to **** with the opponent. =P

 

[Depster]

I like to ECE an egg straight up without much power then nair off the ledge once they catch on to the ledge camping =0

 

[bigman40]

Uh.....Depends on your situation I guess. I know that some people that are trying to camp can get stuck by a trap I do every now and then:

DJ egg toss -> Pivot grab/Usmash

There's just a lot of different options Yoshi can do depending on what type of player does things in certain situations.

 

[YoshiIslander77z]

ppl should start using dj egg tosses, karamarty uses it well with approaching

 

[~Firefly~]

So I was messing around with Yoshi today with lvl. 9 CPUs (lol) and I was playing around with DR, as usual. I figured I'd start using it as a fake-out, so I tried dashing at the opponent and DRing backwards, and that got me thinking about approaching grounded opponents. Airborne posted a nice list of short hopped approaches, but what about simply dashing? There doesn't seem to be a lot of options, but when you take dash -> DR backwards into account for fake-out, there are a few different tools we can use to keep our opponent guessing. The DR option allows us to mess with out opponents timing, and could be very effective when mixed up with the standard attack options: dash -> USmash, dash -> dash attack, dash -> dash grab. And then, there's also dash -> spotdodge and dash -> shield, which are a lot riskier than dash -> DR, but they could probably find their own applications as well.

I haven't actually put any of this into practice yet, but I'll try and get my dash -> DR timing down to try these out against human opponents.

PS: Sorry for the necropost. I hope this was worth bumping for. >_<

 

[Deleted member]

Nice work firefly.
Im gonna resume my DR training, and thats probably the main application i can see, as far as defensive usage goes.
Not only does this make your approaches hard to read, but you can mix it up with a DR in to down tilt.

 

[bigman40]

Because words don't say enough.
​

 

[T3h Albino]

wait how long ago was dr discovered again?

 

[Shiri]

I discovered it three weeks ago while I was at this coffee shop down the street.

Don't ask.

Incredibly long story.

 

[Delta-cod]

6/09/2008.

Over a year ago.

 

[~Firefly~]

PS: Sorry for the necropost. I hope this was worth bumping for. >_<

You know, if you thought that post was redundant, you could've just said so. I was only trying to get a bit of intelligent discussion started regarding a technique that's been largely ignored, but I guess that was too much to ask. =/

 

[bigman40]

It's not that you brought up a technique that barely anyone will even attempt to use. It's the fact that I almost KNOW they won't care for it even if people talk about it.


....Zuzuzu....

 

[~Firefly~]

Well, it's still better than nothing. Even if it's extremely unpopular, discussing the applications of some obscure and likely under-used (or un-used) technique is considerably more productive than sitting around doing nothing, which is pretty much what's been happening on these boards lately. I mean, burntsocks showed some interest in this, so it can't be completely useless, right?

 

[bigman40]

Well, it's still better than nothing. Even if it's extremely unpopular, discussing the applications of some obscure and likely under-used (or un-used) technique is considerably more productive than sitting around doing nothing, which is pretty much what's been happening on these boards lately. I mean, burntsocks showed some interest in this, so it can't be completely useless, right?

Stocky has told me multiple times that he was gonna learn DR, then never does it.

Bwett told me that he'll learn it if I showed what it's worth was, but now he's not concentrating on Yoshi as much anymore from what I understand. He's just going to secondaries (if I'm wrong, then correct me).

Meta thinks it outright sucks.

Other Yoshis that aren't using it think it's too hard and not worth the rewards, and the few stray Yoshis that are learning it, or show any type of interest in it are trying to get a handle of it.

If people ask me about it, I'll tell them what I think about it's uses are, but you're not going to get much of any productiveness from this as far as I see. Sry if it's not what you wish to hear coming from me.


...Zuzuzu...

 

[Deleted member]

SHHHH!
10IcanDRurdumbillshowuintourny

 

[~Firefly~]

Stocky has told me multiple times that he was gonna learn DR, then never does it.

Bwett told me that he'll learn it if I showed what it's worth was, but now he's not concentrating on Yoshi as much anymore from what I understand. He's just going to secondaries (if I'm wrong, then correct me).

Meta thinks it outright sucks.

Other Yoshis that aren't using it think it's too hard and not worth the rewards, and the few stray Yoshis that are learning it, or show any type of interest in it are trying to get a handle of it.

If people ask me about it, I'll tell them what I think about it's uses are, but you're not going to get much of any productiveness from this as far as I see. Sry if it's not what you wish to hear coming from me.


...Zuzuzu...

Fair enough. I acknowledge that most Yoshis don't think much of DR, and I'm okay with that. I was just a little annoyed at the facepalm pic. =3

I've played around with the application I mentioned, and it is a lot of fun to use. I'm pulling it off fairly consistantly mid-battle with CPUs, and I think that with a bit more practice, I could make some real use of it against human players. It may end up not being worth the effort, but I look forward to the day when I play a match with somebody and pull off something really weird and awesome with this. It may be gimmicky, but it's a fun gimmick. ^.^

Also, has anybody ever typoed DR to get DDR? Because I just about did just now.

 

[bigman40]

Fair enough. I acknowledge that most Yoshis don't think much of DR, and I'm okay with that. I was just a little annoyed at the facepalm pic. =3

I've played around with the application I mentioned, and it is a lot of fun to use. I'm pulling it off fairly consistantly mid-battle with CPUs, and I think that with a bit more practice, I could make some real use of it against human players. It may end up not being worth the effort, but I look forward to the day when I play a match with somebody and pull off something really weird and awesome with this. It may be gimmicky, but it's a fun gimmick. ^.^

Also, has anybody ever typoed DR to get DDR? Because I just about did just now.

Hey, go with what you choose to do. The mid-level Yoshis are keeping this place alive right now. So, if you want any information about DR, then just let me know.


....Zuzuzu....

 

[Airborne]

mid-low.
who said everyone was mid level that is keeping this alive? >______>
you have to be decently good at something in order to be mid level right?
^dat ain't me.

 

[bigman40]

mid-low.
who said everyone was mid level that is keeping this alive? >______>
you have to be decently good at something in order to be mid level right?
^dat ain't me.

I'm pointing out the general Yoshi mains. Not the top or the new Yoshi mains.


....Zuzuzu....

 

[Airborne]

well at least i'm common. =\

 

[CelestialMarauder~]

Short hop Uair
Short hop Uair/Bair> DJC egglay
Short hop Uair/Bair> Rising aerial
Short hop Uair/Bair> That super jump thing (lol don't know the name)

Uhh thats all i got lol