Mega Man 1.0.4 Patch Notes Discovery Thread - New Frame Data (Buffs!)

[DRU192]

Don't know if this is useful or not but the bigger hitbox on Uair makes dash > short hop Uair a nice "combo" starter, I've been able to follow up with Fair but I need to experiment some more. Might be something worth looking into for you more experienced players. (Useful for punishing moves with ending lag)

EDIT: Dash > short hop > Uair > RAR Bair also works for a nice KO setup at high %

 

[an1bal]

lemons do feel bffed to me... they travel further dont they? also, dsmash knockback angle seems to have changed. can anyoneconfirmed?

 

[Locke 06]

Since I haven't patched yet, I'm planning on testing a few things that weren't tested before.

Range of lemons, distance of dtilt, lemon staling.

KO% of everything (including Nair and I'll test my own version of uair ko%)

Let me know if you need anything else tested before I patch tonight.

Edit: if lemons are buffed, I'm going to just laugh. They are already godly, but take away some staling% and add more distance? Mega man for high tier.

 

[~Burst~]

UAir is unchanged as well as buster shots.

 

[---]

Since I haven't patched yet, I'm planning on testing a few things that weren't tested before.

Let me know if you need anything else tested before I patch tonight.

Please double check knockback for me on the following:

Kill %s
Utilt - (both) Unchanged
Dtilt - Increased ~5%
Charge Shot - Unchanged
Fair - Decreased by 10%
Usmash - Full (unchanged), Not Full (may be up 5%)
Dsmash - Full (unchanged), Not Full (may be up ~10%)
Bair- Decreased by 5% (to 151%)
Dair - Decreased by ~5%
Danger Wrap - Unchanged

Here's the original knockback/kill % listings. It may also not hurt to check the sweet spot of N-Air.

Thought I'd share some progress, so here are rough estimates of kill percents:

Slide - 213
Mega Upper- 87 (Sweet Spot), Non (~175)
Charge Shot - Uncharged (155-160), Part-charged (~115+), Charged (86)
Flame Sword - 280
Air Shooter - ??? (~135+)
Hard Knuckle - (210 On the Stage)
Slash Claw - 156 (had the Mii jump so all hits would connect)
Spark Shock - Uncharged (124), Part-charged (110), Charged (91)
Flame Blast - Uncharged (83), Part-charged (73), Charged (59)
Danger Wrap - 138

Probably needs more testing, especially the Air Shooter (I had % all over for it). Didn't bother with every move, tested it all with a default Mii on FD Pac-Maze (it's easy to tell where the center is).

Am very surprised by the Mega Upper, there's almost a 100% difference.

B-Air and F-Air IMO are the most important. Will try to see if I can get my roommate to let me borrow his 3DS, but I'll have to see.

 

[Locke 06]

Will do. Test from the center of FD in training mode on default mii?

 

[---]

Will do. Test from the center of FD in training mode on default mii?

Yep. Pac Maze is best as it has a marker in the center. Default Mii is a Mii without any changes to height/weight in the Mii Channel.

Be sure to double check, as sometimes CPUs will use vectoring and mess things up.

 

[Abortion Doc]

I don't think Rush Canceling is completely gone. It's nerfed, but it's still hanging around.

What do you mean exactly? Are some moves still Rush Cancellable but not others?

 

[Kiyosuki]

I'm pretty sure the range on lemons was increased a little bit myself. They go as far as an uncharged F-Smash now.

Can't say 100% but I've used lemons a lot, and it sure feels longer.

 

[Locke 06]

I'm pretty sure the range on lemons was increased a little bit myself. They go as far as an uncharged F-Smash now.

Can't say 100% but I've used lemons a lot, and it sure feels longer.

I'll test distances for fsmash as well. In my memory, uncharged fsmash and lemons go the same distance.

 

[Kiyosuki]

It'll be appreciated, as this could be pretty critical. I should have paid better attention to this stuff. lol

It could be plecebo too but I dunno, it seems slightly longer but maybe I can't trust my memory.

 

[BBC7]

I posted this many times but...

Check the 0:21 and 0:49 mark, U-Air looks huge.

Foreshadowing.

Anyways, someone said that Crash Bomber only does 5%. Can someone confirm this?

 

[Fenrir VII]

Crash bomb still does 8%. people are just looking at the combo instead of the total damage. Crash bomb feels unchanged to me in length, duration, etc.

The fair landing lag reduction sure feels real in back to back comparisons with air dodge and bair landing lag...

I also confirmed that the phantom landing lag that got stored when you naired to land after an upB is gone. imo this is huge... allows us to nair after rushing out of a situation without thinking about it.

As other people have mentioned, you can no longer running usmash without a jump input... so for those of us with tap jump off, gotta throw a jump input in there too... that's a little annoying (but it applies to all chars)

 

[Greward]

Actually you can run to up smash without the jump input, you just have to press A when you have the control pad upwards and not while moving it from side to up.
This happens because they made it you can no longer cancel dash attack into upsmash.

 

[BBC7]

Crash bomb still does 8%. people are just looking at the combo instead of the total damage. Crash bomb feels unchanged to me in length, duration, etc.

The fair landing lag reduction sure feels real in back to back comparisons with air dodge and bair landing lag...

I also confirmed that the phantom landing lag that got stored when you naired to land after an upB is gone. imo this is huge... allows us to nair after rushing out of a situation without thinking about it.

As other people have mentioned, you can no longer running usmash without a jump input... so for those of us with tap jump off, gotta throw a jump input in there too... that's a little annoying (but it applies to all chars)

For Running U-Smash, I bet you can just hit X+A at the same time so it's not really an issue.

 

[noshadowkick]

I would definitely be interested to see video evidence that lemons travel farther. It certainly feels like they do to me, but I could be deceiving myself

 

[Locke 06]

I will check lemons in a couple hours. I won't have video, but I have a couple ideas for range estimation.

Uair is confirmed to be the same size visually and rush cancel is out through video evidence. http://youtu.be/gC9UGqMPT2s

 

[DRU192]

Did Nair (tip) do smash/KO damage before because it does now. Kills ZSS @ 240%

 

[Locke 06]

Did Nair (tip) do smash/KO damage before because it does now. Kills ZSS @ 240%

Can you test on a default mii in training mode? I'll test Nair kill% in 1.0.3

 

[ChopperDave]

Yeah, nair has always been able to KO with its knockback at high percentages--IIRC I've gotten the lightning effect with it before the patch, particularly when using it offstage.

Maybe it has had its knockback slightly buffed, if it's true what people were saying earlier about Mega Man's aerials having had their knockbacks buffed. Something worth testing, maybe.

 

[ChopperDave]

Can you test on a default mii in training mode? I'll test Nair kill% in 1.0.3

I'll do it. Just from his spawning location?

ETA: and which stage?

 

[Locke 06]

Training mode, any FD variation. Kill the default mii fighter and it will respawn your opponent in the middle, which is where KO%s should be tested.

 

[ChopperDave]

Training mode, any FD variation. Kill the default mii fighter and it will respawn your opponent in the middle, which is where KO%s should be tested.

Not all omegas are created equal. They all have slightly different blast zones, so you should standardize which one you use.

Here's what I got (all data for minimum nair KO % vs. default male Mii fighter from center of stage):

Vanilla Final Destination: 280%
Omega Wiley's Castle: 282%
Omega Spirit Train: 279%
Omega Gerudo Valley: 278%

 

[Azazel]

lemons do feel bffed to me... they travel further dont they? also, dsmash knockback angle seems to have changed. can anyoneconfirmed?

yes its longer

 

[Locke 06]

Not all omegas are created equal. They all have slightly different blast zones, so you should standardize which one you use.

Here's what I got (all data for minimum nair KO % vs. default male Mii fighter from center of stage):

Vanilla Final Destination: 280%
Omega Wiley's Castle: 282%
Omega Spirit Train: 279%
Omega Gerudo Valley: 278%

Wuuuuuuut? That's super surprising and super dumb about the stages. I've been using original FD, omega dk jungle and omega 3d land to test rough distances, and omega gerudo for music.

I'll test those 3 stages for the Nair, but I'll probably just so vanilla FD. Thanks for the data.

Edit: I'll look at dsmash angle.

 

[Greward]

I saw they changed Mega Man's air release animation, now he goes further away, so I tested in training if we were no longer ****ed by this and i saw that yoshi can air release us to dash attack or upsmash and it will count as a combo.
Can anyone test this with human beings?

 

[Fenrir VII]

Grab release combos did not exist against Mega in the previous release... no reason to believe they do now.

I was wondering about uair after I played... lol "it doesn't look that much bigger...."

Also I thought it was confirmed that blast zones on all the omegas were identical?? I'm confused about that one.

RE: pellets, tbh I wouldn't be surprised if they have more range or if they don't. The range is good on them, and that's all that matters. : ) That and bair can kill faster now.

 

[---]

Not all omegas are created equal. They all have slightly different blast zones, so you should standardize which one you use.

Here's what I got (all data for minimum nair KO % vs. default male Mii fighter from center of stage):

Vanilla Final Destination: 280%
Omega Wiley's Castle: 282%
Omega Spirit Train: 279%
Omega Gerudo Valley: 278%

More or less. Though for testing everything we already have marked down you have to use Omega Pac Maze, which is probably recommended as it'll match up easier with what I've previously recorded.

thoughtoriginallypacmazewouldbeeasiestduetothelineinthecenter

 

[Locke 06]

Omega pacmaze it is. I'll do vanilla FD for Nair though.

The respawn puts them at the center of the stage anyway, so I just went for music unless I wanted to use floor panels to estimate range.

 

[Tornado_Man]

Is it just me or does Dair have just a little bit more range?

 

[Crescent_Sun]

Lemons are the same. I know this because Shadow Blade goes the same length and lemons were always short of its range. Starting spawn point in Final Destination has always had the lemons die out at the middle of the stage. We don't really need the lemons to go further, so I'm not complaining.

 

[---]

According to this, Air Shooter is more than likely the same.

May just be that the animation is different only in that Wii U version.

 

[ChopperDave]

Wait, hold the phone.

It seems that nair actually has a slight sweet spot and sour spot effect, at least against default Mii fighter. I'm not sure why but it looks like there are two tiers of knock back here.

On Pac Maze, the earliest I was able to KO with nair was 264%. KO seems guaranteed starting at 283%.

 

[---]

Sure it's not vectoring? While testing everything else it's taken multiple times to be relatively sure of a general %.

The lack of the Player option in training mode for the 3DS is really annoying. CPUs just do whatever they feel like even on Stop. >_>

 

[Locke 06]

Sweet and sour spots on Nair seem dumb, but possible. MegaMan's body vs his buster.

 

[ChopperDave]

Sure it's not vectoring? While testing everything else it's taken multiple times to be relatively sure of a general %.

The lack of the Player option in training mode for the 3DS is really annoying. CPUs just do whatever they feel like even on Stop. >_>

I guess the CPU could be vectoring, IDK. At any rate 283% seems to be where a KO is guaranteed.

 

[Azazel]

Wait, hold the phone.

It seems that nair actually has a slight sweet spot and sour spot effect, at least against default Mii fighter. I'm not sure why but it looks like there are two tiers of knock back here.

On Pac Maze, the earliest I was able to KO with nair was 264%. KO seems guaranteed starting at 283%.

Are you sure it isn't the phantom pellet affecting the Nair. When Nair lands late, The lemon still flies but does 0%.

 

[Locke 06]

Stuff all from 1.0.3 (omega pac maze unless specified)
Knockback/KO%
- Dair has 2 different hitboxes with different KO%'s. I think we all knew this, but dismissed the lack of KO% data. If anyone wants old KO% data that doesn't matter, speak up.
- There is something very fishy about Fair. I think we might have a tipper box. (Dead serious) When spacing it where Mega Man's head is to the right of the first vertical of dots on the right of Pac Maze (3d off) I can kill at 273% always and get the KO vfx at 275%. Not really any way I can prove this, but it's a very slight tipper box since inside the arc kills reliably at around 283%. I have a feeling they took this out and just buffed it because nobody cared about such a small knockback increase.
- The rest of --'s kill%'s check out.
- Getting 278% for nair hitbox kill on Wiley. They're not going to be changing a kill% by 2%, so I'm going to say no buff/nerf.

Ranges to be compared with later (on mushroomy kingdom):
3 slides takes your left foot to the 6th line on mushroomy kingdom when you crouch (3rd block).
2-slides + 8 pellets pushes Link back out of range.
2-slides + 9 charged shots push Toon Link back out of range (had to use toon link, because Link's shield doesn't cover the charge shot completely... don't ask)
Pellets do indeed go a shorter distance than fsmash, although this could be due to the step forward he takes to fire his megabuster.

Lemon staling
6-11-16-21-26-30-34-37-41-44/ 48-51-55-58-62 (3, 4 pattern) in strings of 3
4-7-11-14-17-19-22-24-27-29/ 31-34-36-38-40-43-45-47-49-52 (3, 2, 2, 2 pattern) in strings of 2
2-3-5-7-8-9-11-12-13-14/ 15-16-17-18-19-20-21-22-24-25-26...39-40-42-43-44...57-58-60 strings of 1 (58-42 = 16, 40-24=16, therefore it's a pattern of 16 1's followed by a 2.)

You have until I come back from dinner (I'd say probably 45 minutes) to bring anything else up you want me to test in 1.0.3 before I update.

 

[BearUNLV]

The lack of Rush Cancel makes me wish I had my Rush Jet...

Also seems the Down Smash is faster to execute and less lag.

 

[Locke 06]

For frame data, I'm going to defer to @Doval . We have a lot of it from 1.0.3, so if we get frame data from 1.0.4 (or the Wii U which we assume to be the same), then you have your lag calculations.