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Marth has a huge advantage on dreamland

F

fr0st2k

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Dreamland should have never been a legal tournament stage

Why? Because Marth's short hopping sets up for many of his best combos. And the moving platforms give him an advantage.

Going along with that. When considering a stage to be tournament worthy, you would have to look at all characters positives and negatives in certain positions. Is pichu particually good while jumping around in pokefloats? Realistically, is sheiks air stronger than foxes? Does this one board favor being in the air over the ground?
 
Snakeee

Snakeee

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Moving platforms???? o_O I know you're talking about Fountain of Dreams, but you should specify lol

Anyway, every stage is going to have an advantage for certain characters, that's why we have counterpicks.
 
J

Jammer

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Yeah, you're talking about Fountain of Dreams, right?

I personally don't really see how moving platforms = huge advantage for shorthoppers. I'm not really sure why you think that.

Also, Marth isn't the only character that uses shorthopping a lot, if you haven't noticed.

fr0st2k said:
Why? Because Marth's short hopping sets up for many of his best combos. And the moving platforms give him an advantage.
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I'd say about 2/3 of the characters in Melee use shorthopping to set up for many of their best combos.

And, like Snakeee said, "Counterpicks".

I don't see the problem here, fr0st2k.
 
GOTM

GOTM

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fr0st2k said:
Dreamland should have never been a legal tournament stage

Why? Because Marth's short hopping sets up for many of his best combos. And the moving platforms give him an advantage.

Going along with that. When considering a stage to be tournament worthy, you would have to look at all characters positives and negatives in certain positions. Is pichu particually good while jumping around in pokefloats? Realistically, is sheiks air stronger than foxes? Does this one board favor being in the air over the ground?
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this might be one of the least informed posts ever made. first of all, dreamland has no moving platforms. second of all, if you do mean FOD, marth can get ***** there just as much as he can ****. it depends on the player jeez.

all the neutral tourney stages are perfect. if you can name better ones...actually...no you cant, because they have been modified to be the way they are by people who have experienced everything...trust me
 
D

Deleted member

Guest
Most of the characters in the game use short hops to set up combos...? I.E. Falco's SHL approach to a pillar... The point of a level is to provide fairness (which is why levels like Yoshi's Island [Pipes] is banned), and the legal levels don't provide a way of stalling or an extreme advantage to one character...
 
W

Winged Messiah

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So moving platforms give Marths short hop attaack game (which is apparently better than everyone elses) a massive advantage? O.o

Elaborate, please.
 
Aaryk

Aaryk

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wow, define counterpick for me.
this is like saying Yoshi's Story should be banned because its small size gives Bowser a strength advantage.
 
S

shadydentist

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Marth actually doesn't do that well on fountain of dreams. In battlefield and Yoshi's story, the platforms are at tipper height. In FoD, they're usually a little too low.
 
undyinglight

undyinglight

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The neutral stages try to make things fair, not perfect. Some characters may be at a slight advantage or disadvantage on some neutral stages, for example FoD is often counterpicked against Falco because it makes it more difficult to efffectively SHL.
 
F8AL

F8AL

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Marth is generally good with levels with platforms because he can uthrow and do combos on his opponents. I would pick Yoshis Island too because you can tipper your opponnents quite easily.
 
Snakeee

Snakeee

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F8AL said:
Marth is generally good with levels with platforms because he can uthrow and do combos on his opponents. I would pick Yoshis Island too because you can tipper your opponnents quite easily.
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Yeah with the platforms, but it's weird trying to fsmash someone to edgeguard, stupid angle costed me a win in pools at VLS.
 
Binx

Binx

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Snakeee said:
Yeah with the platforms, but it's weird trying to fsmash someone to edgeguard, stupid angle costed me a win in pools at VLS.
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Your lack of skill cost you the a win. Your lack of foresight cost you your smashboards pride. For everything else there is ducktape and febreeze... and also Mastercard.
 
Snakeee

Snakeee

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Binx said:
Your lack of skill cost you the a win. Your lack of foresight cost you your smashboards pride. For everything else there is ducktape and febreeze... and also Mastercard.
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Yeah, it was a stupid move, but wtf...o_O

I don't know if this was something I'm supposed to get mad about, or a joke...
 
ArcNatural

ArcNatural

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Snakeee said:
Yeah, it was a stupid move, but wtf...o_O

I don't know if this was something I'm supposed to get mad about, or a joke...
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I think it's a proven fact now that some people just can not sense jokes or sarcasm on the internet. It was a joke. Most likely Binx will reply to this response by saying he wasn't joking and he was being serious. Leaving you more cunfuzzled than before.

This is a better Shiek stage than Marth stage overall. But it is definitely a good Marth stage, no point in denying that. But that's why there are stage bans. You basically have 3 stages you would have to pick to ban if you are playing against Marth. Battlefield, Yoshi's Story, and Fountain of Dreams are those picks. Sheik it doesn't matter because she does just as good if not better on all those stages. I think as Fox FoD is the worst, Peach is the same on all 3 stages as well probably with FoD being the worst. The list goes on. If anything you could be mad at FoD because of Sheik as well. If you aren't, then you just haven't played a good enough Shiek.
 
Snakeee

Snakeee

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Arcnatural said:
I think it's a proven fact now that some people just can not sense jokes or sarcasm on the internet. It was a joke. Most likely Binx will reply to this response by saying he wasn't joking and he was being serious. Leaving you more cunfuzzled than before.
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Yeah, I kinda knew but whatever. I get defensive because my Marth really isn't that good. :urg:
 
M

Miztik

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WHOA dreamland platforms move lol where have i been lol but there is nothin wrong with FOD, man characters have advantages on the neutral stages. and also if you have a problem with fod just ban it before your set begins or whenever you ban stages

if any stage gives marth and advantage its Yoshi Story, and Battlefield, cuz his sword and hit you while your on the platforms and allows him to start combos there
 
Fortress | Sveet

Fortress | Sveet

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a stage shouldn't, and never has been, banned because a character does well on the stage. the only reason stages are banned are because of tactics that are completely unbeatable. this isnt "advantage" this is unbeatable. think fox on hyrule. hyrule wasnt banned because fox can combo well, it was banned because he can shoot one laser and win the match because of it. the only other viable character on the stage might be c. falcon because he might be able to catch fox (but even then fox > falcon so it wouldnt be a fun match)
 
J

Jammer

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I always thought Hyrule was banned because of the anti-KO aspects of the tunnel part. It's easy to tech the landings on the walls and floors and ceiling, and stay alive even up to 999%.

If your opponent picks Fox on Hyrule, you can pick Fox yourself, and then it would ostensibly bean even match, but of course that isn't fair to people who don't play Fox.

So, why was Hyrule banned again? Was it a combination of those reasons?
 
KevinM

KevinM

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@Sveet

They basically banned Onett just because of Fox It was either Cort or Zoso said that a REALLY good Fox should NEVER lose on Onett lol...

Figured that needed to be stated, otherwise you were sorta right
 
Fortress | Sveet

Fortress | Sveet

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KevinM said:
@Sveet

They basically banned Onett just because of Fox It was either Cort or Zoso said that a REALLY good Fox should NEVER lose on Onett lol...

Figured that needed to be stated, otherwise you were sorta right
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i think it was probably something like fox could camp one side of the houses and then shine infinite or waveshine them off the screen. also because you can dthrow people into cars. personally i would rather play on onett than green greens, thats a stage thats broken for fox if ive ever seen one (puff dies at like 20%-30%)
 
Z

Zialox

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As I quote, it all depends on the player.
Also, who exactly are you complaining to, just the world in general??
jus' wonderin' :chuckle:
 
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