Make Your Move 17: Next contest begins March the 24th; get your Iron MYM'er 1st day sets ready!

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@ Munomario777 Munomario777 :
Honestly though, what I would have done for Silver's pummel if you want to go with something like that is to copy-paste the frame data and damage from the foe's pummel rather than their jab, and have the animation look more like they're pummeling themselves. There are characters that a "pummeling themselves" animation doesn't work on, but for those you probably just substitute them punching themselves in the face (or hitting themselves in the face with whatever other limb if they don't have arms). For example: Marth would be forced to curl up and knee himself in the face; Lucario would end up palm-striking himself in the face with both hands simultaneously, looking like he's accidentally double-facepalming so hard he snaps his neck back.
 

Munomario777

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@ Munomario777 Munomario777 :
Honestly though, what I would have done for Silver's pummel if you want to go with something like that is to copy-paste the frame data and damage from the foe's pummel rather than their jab, and have the animation look more like they're pummeling themselves. There are characters that a "pummeling themselves" animation doesn't work on, but for those you probably just substitute them punching themselves in the face (or hitting themselves in the face with whatever other limb if they don't have arms). For example: Marth would be forced to curl up and knee himself in the face; Lucario would end up palm-striking himself in the face with both hands simultaneously, looking like he's accidentally double-facepalming so hard he snaps his neck back.
Ooh, I like that! I'll probably change that in the next edit.
 
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@ ChaosKiwi ChaosKiwi : Unless you've fixed it since I looked, Starman the third lacks a Forward Aerial.

Also, does that Up Throw really leave the foe in helpless fall? If so, then… just don't get grabbed by Starman near the edge of the stage I guess, as Up Throw to Repulsion Field is a guaranteed KO at any percent.

Also, how fast does the Forward Throw carry the foe? Is Starman able to outrun it? Also, does it have any residual knockback after the Cosmic Rod lets go of the foe? Is there anything to stop Starman from simply ending the throw on top of a Repulsion Field or Black Hole to make sure it affects the foe, even though they're unaffected while being pushed?

Also, if it were me I would've made it so Stellar Blast could be grav-lensed slightly by Black Hole, as well as by the Up and Down Smashes. On the subject of Stellar Blast, you say Starman can only have 3 of them on the field at a time. How long does a Stellar Blast last for, then?
 
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ForwardArrow

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Jamie, can I make a request that you do something besides nitpick individual moves in your comments? You say fairly little about the set on a whole when you do that, and maybe its not fair for me to tell you how to comment, but I'd like to see any thoughts on the overall concepts presented rather than just nitpicking minor incongruous things(though I actually think the Up Throw bit is a remotely big deal and Kiwi needs to fix that) because MYM is not entirely about technical implementation even if balance is a factor, we're not asking the Brawl modders to jam our sets directly into the game.
 

Munomario777

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Jamie, can I make a request that you do something besides nitpick individual moves in your comments? You say fairly little about the set on a whole when you do that, and maybe its not fair for me to tell you how to comment, but I'd like to see any thoughts on the overall concepts presented rather than just nitpicking minor incongruous things(though I actually think the Up Throw bit is a remotely big deal and Kiwi needs to fix that) because MYM is not entirely about technical implementation even if balance is a factor, we're not asking the Brawl modders to jam our sets directly into the game.
Indeed. I do think that fixing little things like this can help improve a set, but you should also focus on the big picture a bit more when commenting.
 
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Jamie, can I make a request that you do something besides nitpick individual moves in your comments? You say fairly little about the set on a whole when you do that, and maybe its not fair for me to tell you how to comment, but I'd like to see any thoughts on the overall concepts presented rather than just nitpicking minor incongruous things(though I actually think the Up Throw bit is a remotely big deal and Kiwi needs to fix that) because MYM is not entirely about technical implementation even if balance is a factor, we're not asking the Brawl modders to jam our sets directly into the game.
Well, most of my moveset-design and balancing experience actually comes from the Brawl modding community, so I'm probably approaching this contest with the wrong mindset.

That said, there's a reason I asked the questions I did. If Starman can outrun his own FThrow, that opens up a lot of combo opportunities depending on how long it takes for him to recover the Cosmic Rod when he calls it back. For example, he can FThrow, then run ahead of it, call his rod back and smack the foe with a sweetspot FSmash, or just a jab combo if he feels like it/wants to keep FSmash fresh.

Also, grav-lensing a Stellar Blast using a Black Hole would be just cool.

As for the overall playstyle? Well, I somehow get the feeling that the elaborate setups Starman is designed for aren't the optimal way to play him. They may work for damage racking, but I think as far as actually KOing things goes that he'll basically want to set up an outward- and downward-aimed Repulsion Field either side of the stage and smack the foe into one of them. The limitation on how close together he can place Repulsion Fields prevents him from walling an area off entirely though, so there's that.

His gimp game is pretty strong, though. Repulsion Fields die after use, so he can FThrow someone into a diagonally-downward Repulsion Field and then just keep setting more Repulsion Fields in the same direction wherever the foe tries to recover to.

Any attempt at elaborate setup is likely to be denied by the foe simply paying attention to where you put Repulsion Fields and Black Holes, especially with the proximity limitation in play. I think Starman lacks the tools to set up no-win situations for foes with his traps and his aerials in combination, but I could be wrong on that.
 

ChaosKiwi

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You guys are so mean omg this is worse than how you treat [BIONICHUTE]

I've updated Starman.3, added some suggestions and clarified some things (gravitational lensing, etc.). I've nerfed Repulsion Fields slightly-- they no longer basically guarantee KOs when pointed down over pits. Up Throw was also nerfed, and Forward Throw clarified. I also added a new projectile option, seen in the forward smash.
 
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Muskrat Catcher

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Thanks for the feedback on my flygon moveset for those who have ranked/reviewed it. I now realize how much of an eyesore the color yellow is when reading such a long post. I basically just wrote the entire moveset on my iPad, and just copy-pasted the words from my note-taking app into this forum, and slapped on a picture of flygon. I spent a lot of time on content, but none on presentation. Also, I previously wrote all my posts in yellow since I had my posts set to yellow in my settings, but I now realize that it looked like I was trying too hard to draw attention to my posts, so I changed it to default white. Sorry about that eyesore, it should be a better read now!
 
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Munomario777

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I tend to write mine in old conversations to get the BBCoding right and to have a safe place to keep them stored
Same. I made a convo just for drafts, asked the other person to leave, and then edited what I had already said in that convo to use as the drafts. Make sure you write a few messages before they leave, since you can't actually add new messages to "empty" conversations.
 

ChaosKiwi

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Guys, Star Man and Starm*n are delayed until next week, so don't hold your breath for them. Instead, youll get 1 or 2 sets this weekend that are not starmen, so, uh, rejoice?
 

Munomario777

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Boxboy.png

Qbby
aka BoxBoy!


Hey, you! Yeah, you! Have you heard of a little game called BoxBoy? No? Well, I don't blame you. It's an eShop 3DS puzzle-platformer by none other than HAL Laboratory! Hmm, does that name sound familiar? Well, it should, because HAL also worked on Kirby (hence the simplistic character design) and, funnily enough, Super Smash Brothers! It's a critically acclaimed and yet somewhat overlooked 2D game about making blocks and using them to block things, climb up things, and more. I've heard it's pretty good; might give it a shot sometime. Anyway, that brings us to our newest fighter, Qbby! Qbby (pronounced "cube-y" (I think)) is the protagonist of this game, who has the power to create boxes from his equally boxy self and use them to solve puzzles. So, let's see what moveset potential this concept has, shall we? As always, this set is made for Smash 4's engine, fighters, balance, et cetera. Anyway, let's move onto the set!

stats

Weight: Bowser Jr.
Size: A crate
Traction: Wario
Ground Speed: Villager
Jump Height: Ganondorf
Air Speed: Kirby
Fall Speed: Villager
As you can see, Qbby is a rather interesting fighter in terms of stats. Since Qbby is, well, a cube, it made sense to compare his size to another cube in Smash Brothers rather than a regular fighter. He's got the weight and traction of champions, but he's floaty, and he lacks in mobility. Since he lacks in normal mobility, Qbby must rely on other means to get around. You'll see what those are later on. For now, just know that Qbby makes up for his stats in his moves.

animations

Overall:
As you'd expect, Qbby is, quite simply, a cube with eyeballs on the camera-facing side of his head that blink every now and then. He may not have any arms, but he does have legs. Whenever he turns around, Qbby's eyes simply move to that side of his head, but they're always on the side that's facing the camera. When Qbby is facing the camera, his eyes are simply in the center.
Standing:
Qbby simply stands in place, squatting ever so slightly and bending his knees every so often.
Walking:
Qbby walks, and as you'd expect, he puts his feet forward one after another. He seems to almost glide along as his boxy body stays at the same height, while his feet seem to only propel him forwards as he simply floats in the air. This keeps Qbby's body level throughout the animation (this is true for most of his animations), which might not seem very important, but it will later on, trust me.
Running:
The walking animation, but faster.
Dashing:
The running animation, but faster.
Crouching:
Qbby's legs simply disappear, leaving him as a simple cube on the ground and reducing his height ever so slightly. Of course, this grouch isn't very useful, so once again, Qbby has to rely on other means for dodging and blocking attacks.
Jump:
Qbby squats slightly and then jumps into the air, keeping his body level.
Double Jump:
Qbby doesn't do any flips or anything; instead, he simply jumps into the air again, with the only real animation being his legs going downwards.
Aerial Movement:
Qbby's legs sway side to side as he moves forwards and backwards, but once again, his body always stays level.
Spot Dodge:
Qbby turns to face the screen and leans backwards, going completely on his back with his eyes closed (as if he's scared) for about .5 seconds and wiggling his legs before getting back up. This is rather laggy for a spot dodge, but Qbby has other ways to defend himself.
Dodge Roll:
Qbby rolls as well as you'd think a cube would roll, which is to say, not very well. He does manage to lean backwards enough to land on his back though, and after that, his eyes and legs move to treat his old back as his new "bottom". This has an extremely short distance, and it's rather slow. He can make up for this through other means, though.
Air Dodge:
Qbby shifts to the background as his legs sway and his eyes close, since he can't bear to see what horrible things could be in front of him. This is actually a decent air dodge, in contrast to his spot dodge and roll.
Shielding:
Qbby... doesn't have a shield. He will close his eyes when you hold the shield button, but it won't do much. Again, make up for this weakness with his other moves (which I'll get to later).
Holding Items:
Since Qbby doesn't have arms, and he needs his legs to, you know, walk, Qbby simply takes advantage of his boxy self and places held items on top of himself. Whenever he uses these items, Qbby simply moves his body to do so, and the items don't fall off. Opponents can pick them up as normal from Qbby's top, but he will automatically "pick up" items whenever they land on his head. Qbby can "hold" multiple items as a result, and he'll cycle through them. When Qbby falls, any items on top of him will seem to "lift up" off of his top as if they were falling, but they won't fall off and will move sideways as he does.
Entrance Animation:
Qbby first appears on the screen as simply a flat square, sporting the same white color and black outline as his normal form. He then extends upwards and turns into a cube, his eyes appear (closed shut and slanted downwards, as if he's angry or concentrating), and he "pops" up into the air as his legs appear underneath him and his eyes open. He then enters a normal idle pose.
Up Taunt:
Qbby faces the screen and takes a "bow", in the same vein as Ness's up taunt.
Side Taunt:
Qbby spins around rapidly and jumps at the end, somewhat similarly to Kirby's side taunt.
Down Taunt:
Qbby flips upside down onto his head and wiggles his feet, like a beetle trying to get off its back. Of course, he eventually succeeds.
Death Animation:
Qbby explodes into a bunch of tiny squares. Think Mega Man's death animation, but with squares instead.
Victory Pose:
Qbby uses his box powers to draw a shape, including a smiley face and the word "YAY!"

unique mechanics

So, Qbby's first unique mechanic is the fact that, well, he's a box! As such, he essentially acts as a solid platform; he stops piercing projectiles (although he still gets damaged by them), you can't walk through him, things can go on top of him, etc, but he can still be dodge rolled around. Also, his rounded edges make it impossible for opponents to grab onto his sides. This means that opponents can stand on top of Qbby and take advantage of this, but he has a few ways of getting opponents off of him. Aside from certain moves (which I'll get into later), Qbby's taunts also fling opponents off! Anyway, this can somewhat hinder Qbby's offstage edgeguards, since opponents can simply go on top of him and get back to the stage. However, he does have ways to get around this.

Qbby also has another unique mechanic, but instead of going into it here, I'll take it to the Specials, since it's just tied so deeply into that move. So let's go there, shall we?

specials

Neutral Special: Box Place
Damage: 5%
So, before I get into that unique mechanic, let me go over what this move actually does. For as long as the button is held, Qbby's legs disappear into his boxy body and his eyes shut, slanted slightly inwards; during this time, his fall speed is reduced to a quarter of what it is normally. During this time, four red arrows appear around him; one in each main direction (up, down, left, and right); these and other red things I'll mention later on also change for each player color (red for P1, blue for P2, etc). Pressing one of these directions while the button is being held will make a box on that side of Qbby. Wait, what's a box?

Boxes are that second unique mechanic I told you about earlier. Basically, a box looks exactly like Qbby, but without the legs or eyes or anything really besides, well, the box. They behave the same way as him when it comes to solidity (as well as fall speed), but opponents can't roll around the boxes if there are two or more next to each other ("boxes" in this context includes Qbby himself). Qbby can have up to five boxes out at a time, but only one group of connected blocks (unless they're separated, which I'll get into later). Blocks become connected when Qbby makes more than one with the Neutral Special. So, how does that work? Well, when Qbby presses a direction, a box comes out of Qbby on that side of his body as he shakes a bit. Once that box extended, it gets a red "1" put on it, and the red arrows move to the new box. Pressing in the direction the box came from will retract the box, but pressing a different direction will make another box in that direction! The number and the arrows then move to that box, and the "1" changes into a "2". This goes on until you either release the special button or reach five boxes; there's a bit of a delay between each box. When you do reach five boxes, the only arrow that appears is the one in the direction the box came from, since there's a limit of five boxes. If you make a box towards the ground, Qbby and the formation of blocks are raised up by one, and the same principle applies for walls and ceilings. If Qbby can't move in that direction due to a lack of physical room, the red arrow for that direction won't appear. Oh, and by the way, if a box extends and hits an opponent, it deals 5% of damage and minor knockback.

Anyway, when you release the special button, Qbby returns to normal with the formation of boxes attached to him. He's free to move around, jump, etc, but he can't use any moves, dodging, etc except for the specials. These are used to interact with the boxes while they're already attached to Qbby. First, thought, let me go through some more attributes of the boxes. Each box has 13 stamina, and can be attacked by opponents. When it runs out of stamina, the box will simply "pop" out of existence, and if it was holding different groups of boxes together (i.e. the middle box in a row of boxes), they will break apart. This is the only time that Qbby can have two different groups of boxes out at once. This may seem rather situational, but Qbby can also attack the boxes himself! This allows him to break up his boxes for more strategy, but he also sacrifices boxes in the process. Boxes will also split apart if they're forced to by a moving platform, and in that case, they'll break apart between the two center boxes. If it's an odd number, the middle box will simply pop away. While Qbby has boxes attached to him, he can retract them all quickly by pressing Neutral Special again, which causes them to retract back into each other and eventually into Qbby, so he can start over if he messes up when making blocks.

If there is already a group of blocks in play and Qbby tries to create some more, then the old ones will simply "pop" out of existence. Boxes don't quite operate on normal physics; as long as some part of the box/group thereof is on the ground, it won't fall. So you can have a four-box-long line and have three over the edge and one on solid ground, and they'll still be straight up. In fact, boxes will never tilt side to side, and don't have any sense of balance. If Qbby's boxes cause him to hang in midair, he'll look a bit helpless and wiggle his feet below him. If his boxes connect to him on his bottom side, he won't be able to move until he releases the boxes (more on that later on). As one final note, if a box "crushes" an opponent between a box and either another box or a solid platform, the opponent will be dealt 10% of damage and be pushed until they're not between them anymore. Soft platforms don't do this; instead, the opponent will simply drop through. This doesn't happen with Qbby himself; opponents are simply pushed out of the way. Anyway, now onto the rest of the specials and what Qbby can actually do with these boxes!

Side Special: Box Toss
Damage: 2~10%
So, Qbby has some boxes. What can he do with them? Well, first off, by using the Side Special, Qbby can toss them in front of himself! This does what you'd expect; the boxes will fly through the air in front of Qbby, travelling in an arc until they hit a surface. The distance and damage depend on how many boxes there are in the clump:
1 box travels 5 SBB, deals 2% of damage, and minor knockback.
2 boxes travel 4 SBB, deal 4% of damage, and minor knockback.
3 boxes travel 3 SBB, deal 6% of damage, and moderate knockback.
4 boxes travel 2 SBB, deal 8% of damage, and moderate knockback.
5 boxes travel 1 SBB, deal 10% of damage, and good knockback that KOs at around 120%.
Of course, if the boxes crush an opponent between themselves and a surface (or other boxes), they'll deal the usual 10%. As you can see, this gives Qbby a decent projectile option, but he has to sacrifice range if he wants some good damage out of the deal. This can be good for positioning your boxes on the battlefield, though. Oh, and by the way, if Qbby doesn't have any boxes attached, this doesn't do anything. However, if there are boxes adjacent to Qbby, he'll still toss them as normal. If the formation of the blocks makes it so that Qbby can't toss them upwards, he'll simply detach from the blocks (again, more on that later).


Up Special: Box Retract
Damage: n/a
So, Qbby has some boxes. What can he do with them? Well, via the Up Special, he can do something similar to the "start over" function (where all the blocks are retracted into Qbby), but instead, Qbby will go to the farthest block instead of the other way around! However, this only works for grounded blocks; if the end block isn't grounded, Qbby goes to the last grounded block there is (and the other ones are retracted into him), and if no blocks are grounded, it just acts like the "start over" function. Anyway, this is the best way for Qbby to recover, since Box Place slows his fall to give him time for block-placing. However, Qbby is definitely a tricky character to recover with, and this is one of his biggest weaknesses. Like with the Side Special, this will also work with blocks adjacent to Qbby but not actually attached. So you can leave a line of blocks along the edge, and if you're falling off, just use the Up Special to retract them. Just be careful not to let your opponents mess with it and destroy it before you can use it!

Down Special: Box Release
Damage: n/a
So, Qbby has some boxes. What can he-- Okay, I'll skip it this time. Anyway, the Down Special is about as simple as it sounds. Qbby disconnects from the blocks, which doesn't move them, but it does free Qbby up to move around without the blocks limiting his actions. This is a crucial technique for Qbby to use in order to build and easily deploy structures, and although it's very simple, it plays a big part in Qbby's playstyle. If Qbby is next to a clump of blocks, he'll simply re-attach to them, so you can easily re-position things when need be.


standards

Jab: Tiny Box Punch
Damage: 4%

Qbby's eyes close and slant inwards, like his poses from the Neutral Special, crouching, etc, and once again, his legs retract. However, this time, instead of making big boxes extend from his body (ala the Neutral Special), Qbby makes little tiny boxes extend from his body! This will pop up throughout the set, but here, there are two very tiny boxes with one slightly larger box at the end of those, like an arm with a boxing glove on. This formation of blocks extends from Qbby's front side, and it has a reach of about 1/3 of Qbby's own width. This jab is nice and quick, but it knocks opponents too far away to get more than a two-hit combo at most. When the jab is done, the boxes retract back into Qbby's body and his legs extend again, but this can be rapidly used without these animations interrupting it. Worth noting is that these tiny boxes don't count as the same type of boxes spawned by the Neutral Special, so this won't cause the full-size boxes to disappear. Of course, this applies to all attacks that use these tiny boxes.

Forward Tilt: Back Kick
Damage: 8%
Qbby leans backwards and falls on his back, so that his legs are facing forwards. This falling has about .5 seconds of startup, since Qbby struggles a bit to go on his back but then falls after he gets past that "tipping point". Anyway, after this, his legs extend to Qbby's own height, giving this tilt an impressive reach! It can also be angled up and down, but the tilt somewhat lacks in damage. It only deals moderate knockback as well. However, at the end of the tilt, Qbby will lower his legs to the ground, still extended, and he nearly instantly pulls his body to this point. This means that Qbby moves ever so slightly forwards from his original position. Worth noting is that Qbby falling on his back also has a hitbox; it deals 10% of damage but barely any knockback, just like if a box falls on an opponent. Yes, that's right; the stronger hitbox is actually behind Qbby! This leads to some interesting usage of the tilt, almost akin to fighters like Wii Fit Trainer.

Up Tilt: Stilts Fo' Legs
Damage: 7%
Qbby crouches down slightly for a moment, and then he closes his eyes and slants them inwards. However, instead of retracting, Qbby's legs extend far beyond their normal size! Specifically, they extend to Qbby's own height, giving this tilt a great reach. Qbby's whole body serves as a hitbox during this attack, and it deals 7% of damage and moderate knockback. This move is best used as an anti-air attack or to get unwanted opponents off of Qbby. It'll also leave Qbby in the air at the end, allowing for some interesting follow-ups.

Down Tilt: Tiny Box Trip
Damage; 7%
Qbby once again shuts his eyes and his legs disappear, and he creates another formation of tiny boxes similar to the jab. However, this one is much lower to the ground; in fact, it's practically level with the ground. Anyway, Qbby extends this extremely low formation of boxes, which once again has a range of 1/3 of Qbby's own width. This deals 7% of damage and little knockback; instead, it trips opponents, allowing for an easy follow-up. Like the jab, this can be rapidly mashed; it's somewhat like Ness's down tilt, actually.

Dash Attack: Boxes Can't Quite Roll
Damage: 8%
While running, Qbby jumps up a tiny bit and his legs disappear. He then closes his eyes and starts to "roll", or rather, he tips over and rotates 90 degrees forwards. Like the dodge roll, his eyes and legs then move to accommodate this change. This deals 8% of damage and can KO at around 130%, but it is a bit laggy at the start and end.


smashes

Up Smash: Rectangle
Damage: 10~16%

So, even a simple puzzle game like Qbby has at least one neat little NPC. In Qbby's case, he has his friend "Rectangle" to hang out with. He's like Qbby, but shaped like a rectangle. And for Smash, Rectangle taught Qbby some tricks to help prepare him for the fight! When Qbby starts charging this attack, his legs disappear and his eyes close. When the charge is released, he suddenly extends to twice his regular height, with his top acting as a hitbox. This deals 10~16%, and KOs at 140~100% depending on the charge. Qbby's bottom half will follow along right after, popping up when Qbby extends fully. This will leave Qbby in an aerial state, increasing its combo potential a bit.

Forward Smash: Horizontal Rectangle
Damage: 10~16%
Qbby once again takes a page from his friend Rectangle, and once again, he turns into the "squinty block" during the charge sequence. When the charge is released, Qbby's body extends forwards instead of upwards. The damage and knockback are the same, and Qbby once again becomes double his regular size. Once again, Qbby's backside follows the front, and he ends up travelling one crate forwards. If Qbby's front is in midair at the end of the animation, he'll retract his front instead.

Down Smash: Double Tiny Boxes
Damage: 8~14%
Qbby once again turns into the squinty block for the charging period, but this attack doesn't involve Rectangle. Instead, when the charge is completed, Qbby creates two lines of tiny boxes to either side of him, similarly to the Down Tilt. The length of these depends on the charge; they range from 1/3 of Qbby's width to his entire width. They'll deal 8~14% of damage and can KO at around 150~130% depending on the charge. This is good for catching rolls and the like. Now, you may have noticed that all of Qbby's smashes have the same charging animation. This is a good tool to use to throw off your opponents and keep them confused and guessing.


aerials

Neutral Aerial: Box Bash
Damage: 9%
Qbby turns into the "squinty box" and grows about 25% in size for a moment, which makes his whole body into a hitbox. It deals 9% of damage and moderate knockback, and will obviously get any unwanted opponents off of Qbby. This is a nice, quick midair attack option, but it lacks in range.

Forward Aerial: Long Legged Kick
Damage: 8%
Qbby quickly flips backwards 90 degrees, so that his legs are in front, and outstretches his legs to his own width. This acts as this attack's hitbox, and it deals 8% of damage and moderate knockback. This functions as a great wall of pain attack, like Jigglypuff's forward aerial. The only problem is that Qbby's mobility isn't as good as Jiggs's, so it might be tricky to use this effectively. It's still a good tool, though, especially due to its speed and range.

Back Aerial: Spinny Legs
Damage: 12%

Qbby flips forwards 90 degrees with quick speed, and once again uses his legs to attack behind him. However, this time, instead of extending his legs, Qbby spins them around like helicopter blades for a multi-hit attack. There are four hits, and they each deal 3% of damage for a total of 12%. This can KO at around 140%, and has a good damage output, but its range (or lack thereof) makes it hard to land.

Up Aerial: Tiny Box Uppercut
Damage: 8%
Qbby turns into a "squinty box", and creates a line of tiny boxes upwards out of the middle of his top. This can get opponents off of Qbby's top, but it's only 1/3 of his height, so it's a bit hard to land otherwise. This will deal moderate knockback, so it won't KO very often. It does have its uses, though.

Down Aerial: Leg Spike
Damage: 10%
Qbby bends his legs like he's crouching, giving this attack about .75 seconds of startup. Once that startup is over, Qbby extends his legs a bit past their normal length and straightens them to damage opponents. This will deal 10% of damage and a good meteor smash, but it's definitely not the strongest spike out there. Once the attack is done, Qbby's legs quickly shrink back to their regular size. This attack is quick at the end, but a bit slow at the start. It's still one of Qbby's best KO options, though.


grab game

Grab: Leg Hug!
Qbby turns onto his back and reaches forwards with his legs, as if giving the opponent a hug, but with his legs! Of course, this causes the grab state. It's a fairly standard grab besides the animation, but it is very slow.

Pummel: Tighter Leg Hug!
Damage: 1%
Qbby squeezes the opponent, tightening his grip like that clingy aunt that won't leave you alone. This is a fairly fast pummel, but it only deals 1% of damage.

Up Throw: Tiny Box Tower
Damage: 5%
Qbby tosses the opponent up a bit, flips right side up again, and extends a tall tower of tiny boxes out from his head. This tower of blocks hits the opponent (dealing 5% of damage), but it doesn't stop there; the opponent is carried up until the tower reaches its maximum height of 2 Qbbys tall. Then the tower stops and the opponent flies up into the air with knockback that can KO at around 130%.

Forward Throw: Rectangle Push
Damage: 8%
Qbby contracts for a split second, and then extends into the rectangle shape! He becomes twice his regular height, but since Qbby is on his back, he's really extending forwards. This pushes the opponent forwards, and the damage and knockback are similar to that of the Forward Smash, but a bit less damage in favor of higher knockback (KOing at around 130%). After the throw ends, Qbby retracts his bottom half and returns to normal size before retracting his legs and moving them underneath him, while his eyes move to accommodate this.


Down Throw: Cube Crush
Damage: 10%
Qbby turns rightside up and turns into the squinty block after jumping up a bit, and falls onto the opponent. As you'd expect, this deals the same amount of damage as a regular block falling onto an opponent would, that being 10% of damage. This doesn't deal much knockback, but it does slide the opponent in front of Qbby for a good follow-up opportunity.

Back Throw: Tiny Box Spin
Damage: 5%
Qbby retracts his legs, and in their place extends an arm of tiny boxes, which grabs the opponent. Qbby's legs then extend from Qbby's bottom side, and his eyes move as well. Qbby then spins around rapidly ala Mario's back throw, and after about a second of spinning, he lets go of the opponent and they're sent flying! This will KO at around 120%, and deals 5% of damage.


miscellaneous

Final Smash: Unlimited Boxes
Damage: n/a

Qbby got the Smash Ball! What will he do? Well, he'll do what he does best; make boxes! "But he can already do that!" I hear you saying. Well, this Final Smash is simple in concept, but deadly in execution. It removes the five-box limit for the Neutral Special. "...That's it?" you ask. Well, think of the potential this has! Knock an opponent offstage, and then make an incredibly high wall to edgeguard! Make a platform that extends to the ledge, and throw the opponent off walkoff style! The possibilities are nearly limitless! This lasts for ten seconds, and the extra boxes will disappear when it ends.

Miscellaneous:
Qbby's alternate costumes are some of the costumes from BoxBoy, including (but not limited to) this amazing rapper getup:


playstyle

So, you wanna play Qbby, do ya? Well, here's what you need to know. At first glance, Qbby might seem rather... underpowered. His attacks are weak, he has small hitboxes, his mobility is bad, and heck, he can't even shield! However, to truly unlock Qbby's potential, you'll need to play like you're playing BoxBoy itself; make boxes! Boxes here, boxes there, boxes everywhere! Boxes can do so much for Qbby. Need to get up to the stage? Make boxes to the ledge and pull yourself there. Need to block an attack? Use a box as a shield. Need to land a vertical KO? Make a tower of boxes and KO the opponent from up there. Need to land a horizontal KO? Make a bridge of boxes over the ledge and KO them. Need a projectile option? Make boxes and throw them! Need to edgeguard an opponent? Block the ledge with boxes! Heck, you can even make a super fortress of boxes to force opponents to break through! However, Qbby can only commit to one of these at a time, since there can only be one clump out at a time. He can start over rather quickly, though. The boxes are really the star of the show, and I'm not sure that I can fully convey the possibilities of having five connected boxes in any shape you want. Just think about the possibilities. Overall, Qbby is a fighter with mediocre stats and attacks, but more than makes up for that with his ability to control the stage's layout to his very whim, and control his own shape as well. As always, feedback is greatly appreciated, and I hope you enjoyed the set! :)

Like what you see? See some more over at my Make Your Move Hub! :D
 

FrozenRoy

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 26, 2007
Messages
1,067
Location
Las Vegas, Nevada
I write my movesets up in Notepad and tend to then C+P them into posts, helps me edit it cleaner (Especially with coding) and creates redunacy in saves (So I don't lose my work).
 

ChaosKiwi

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Feb 1, 2014
Messages
104
NNID
ChaosKiwi
Note: Set was started in December, far before certain leaks occurred. In other words: I ain't rippin' anythin' off intentionally! Hell, I'm not even gonna watch/read any stuff 'bout him until after this is posted! :4ryu::4ryu:


"戦いの中に答えはある!"

Ryu. A man with a purpose in life. He's a wanderer, a world warrior, a street fighter. His goal in life is to improve, no matter what personal cost it takes. He's driven to be the absolute best, and nobody's gonna stop him.

His outfit is iconic-- A plain white gi, red headband, and lack of shoes (By choice, mind you! He says it builds character). His techniques, also iconic-- The Hadouken, the Shoryuken, the Tatsumaki Senpukyaku, and more. Overall, he's the most iconic character in all of fighting games, and despite what some would say, fully deserves a place in Smash. To him, it's just another crossover where he can wreck shop.


STATS

Size- 8
Weight- 7
Jumps- 4
Ground Speed- 5
Air Speed- 7
Fall Speed- 7


SPECIALS

Neutral Special- Hadouken >> Shakunetsu Hadouken

It's his signature move, kids. Cupping his hands together, Ryu begins charging energy between his palms. You can charge this, but it doesn't change anything in until max charge (which we'll get to later). Once the attack is released, Ryu thrusts his palms forward, releasing a surging ball of energy at his foe. The ball travels fairly faster than Ryu's running speed, and will go two-thirds of Battlefield before dissipating. It deals 10% on contact, and knocks foes backwards. Meanwhile, Ryu is free to move about and attack, but he cannot use Hadouken again until the first one is gone. If he tries, it'll wiff.


Now, when it's fully charged, the Hadouken becomes the Shakunetsu Hadouken. In this state, it is smaller, and faster. At about half the size of the regular Hadouken, it travels a little faster than Sonic's run, and covers the same distance. Meanwhile, it deals 15% in fire damage instead, and does a good amount more knockback. Overall, it's a stronger version, but riskier, as the charging time leaves you completely open to attacks for a moment. Since you can't save the charge, you have to start over if you roll or flinch out of

Side Special- Tatsumaki Senpukyaku >> Shinku Tatsumaki Senpukyaku

Ryu begins to perform a spinning kick, carrying himself forward while dealing three hits. Each hit deals 5%, and the whole move travels two Battlefield platforms forward. The first two hits carry the foe with Ryu, while the third is the only one with actual knockback-- Hitting foes up and forward and potentially KOing at as low as 120% if you hit with all three kicks! Intense! Ryu gains slight super armor during the second and third kicks. But that's not all-- like the Hadouken, Tatsumaki Senpukyaku can be charged to max to perform an enhanced variant----


The Shinku Tatsumaki Senpukyaku! This move is a definite buff-- The kick count is boosted to 5-- allowing you to travel three and a half Battlefield platforms, each still dealing 4% (bringing the total potential damage to 20%). The charge time for this move is longer than any of Ryu's other chargeable specials-- Which makes sense, because it's the one that gains the biggest boost! In addition to hits and distance, it gains a slight vacuum effect, drawing in foes who are behind or in front of him, similar to the Mario Tornado. Watch out, punks!

Up Special- Shoryuken >> Shin Shoryuken

This is exactly what you expected. Upon input of the up special, Ryu performs his patented Shoryuken! A spinning uppercut that takes Ryu about one and a half Battlefield platforms up, this punch deals 12% on impact, and sends the foe straight up with strong knockback. Afterwards, Ryu falls helpless, as per usual with up specials.


However, like his prior two specials, Ryu can charge up this special! At full charge, it becomes the Shin Shoryuken, which doubles the distance traveled and the speed at which he travels, as well as amping the damage to 16%. It's a simple power boost, but it's pretty good for getting at falling enemies.

Down Special- Alpha Counter

Ryu follows the animation above-- He holds out his fist, aiming to parry an enemy's blow. Should he succeed, he takes the damage of the attack he blocked, but none of the knockback, while he also delivers to them a swift, strong uppercut. Not exactly a Shoryuken, but still a strong hit nonetheless! It hits foes straight up, setting them up for a followup Shoryuken or aerial combo. The damage, by the way, is equal to the damage of the attack Ryu is countering, meaning countering a strong attack is worth it-- because you'll perform an equally strong attack in return!

That version of the counter only happens when the enemy attacks you from melee distance, however-- When hit with a ranged attack, Ryu will instead fire a Hadouken at his enemy! It is smaller and faster than the one in his Neutral Special, due to it being reactionary, but it's no slouch, again dealing the same amount of damage as the countered attack on contact and travelling through walls. However, it's subject to the same range limitations as his regular Hadouken, meaning foes with more long range projectile capabilities are entirely safe from this counter.


TAUNTS

W-what?! A section, specifically for describing his taunts?! Well, yes. But only one! For you see, it's the only one worth explaining. It doesn't do any damage, of course. That would be unfair. But it does have a certain... usefulness to it.

Side Taunt- Hado no Kamae
Ryu strikes the pose he takes while doing his Hadouken, and then thrusts his palms forward... but nothing comes out! You see, this is a feint, used to disorient and confuse the foe! One of two things will happen: Ryu will scare off an aggresor with the threat of a Hadouken, or the foe will simply not care, thus revealing they are a reckless, possibly insane masochist!


STANDARDS

Jab
A jab with a slight overhead arc, dealing 4% per hit. When mashed, the jab combo is a series of straight punches instead, dealing 2% per hit. The end of the combo is an overcut, similar to the single jab, dealing 5% and causing foes to fall prone (the kind that takes longer to get up from).

Side Tilt- Senpukyaku
Ryu performs a single spin kick-- similar to those he performs during his Tatsumaki Senpukyaku-- along with a small leap, carrying him forward slightly. This simultaneously allows him to avoid any very low attacks, while also hitting his foe in the head or jumping foes. However, it's hard to hit short foes with this! Anyway, on contact it deals 10%, and knocks foes straight back.

Up Tilt
An uppercut. Unlike the Shoryuken, it does not lift Ryu off the ground at all, and he doesn't spin even a bit. It's just a regular uppercut, not much flair to it! But, it has deceptively long range, and deals a good amount of damage for a tilt-- 13%-- and is fairly easily to juggle with due to its somewhat low knockback

Down Tilt
It's a simple low kick type move. Ryu crouches, placing his hands on the ground before him as he sweeps his forward facing leg at his foe's lower half, aiming to trip them. He only deals 4% like this, but it's fast-- nearly as fast as his jab-- meaning it's a fairly sure hit unless you telegraph it something fierce, like some sort of nincompoop. So, yeah, don't telegraph it!

Dash Attack- Seichuu Nidan Tsuki
Ryu holds out his elbow, stopping slightly short while jutting forward. It deals 12%, and, on most human sized/anatomically correct foes, will hit 'em right in the solar plexus, so you know it hurts! It knocks foes down, and leaves them prone. Since Ryu stops short, he can easily follow it up with a down tilt, or charge up a Down Smash to hit them as they get up!


SMASHES

Side Smash- Joudan Sokutogeri

The attack is a simple, yet strong, forward-stepping side kick! If it hits, the opponent is sent flying. When released, Ryu takes a step forward first, giving the move a slightly longer startup than most smashes but a very high range! The regular percentage of damage is between 17% and 24% depending on the charge, and the regular knockback is enough to KO at 110%. You can even angle it slightly, like other side smashes, changing whether Ryu kicks up or down! But, there's a sweetspot!

Said sweetspot is at the end of Ryu's foot. It deals between 20% and 28%, again depending on charge level, and does a lot more knockback, KOing at as low as 90%! It even causes foes to bounce off of walls, back to Ryu, no matter what percentage they have, leaving them open for a second attack on their way back if you use this move intelligently! So, yeah, be intelligent!

Up Smash- Hadou Shoryuken
Ryu is a master of the Hadouken and the Shoryuken-- so why not combine them!? This move is an uppercut similar to the standard Shoryuken, but it carries him up less distance, only barely taking him off the ground. However, it hits multiple times, with the number of times depending on the charge rate. Each hit deals 5% at no charge, and he hits three times. Meanwhile at full charge, he hits five times and deals 4% per hit.

But that's not all! Should he manage to connect every hit of the fully charged variant of the Hadou Shoryuken, he follows it up by firing a small Hadouken from his fist-- straight up at the foe! This small blast deals an additional 5%, making it an excellent finisher.

The KO power of this move has three major points. The final hit of the uncharged variant, for instance, KOs at 120%. The final hit of the fully charged variant KOs at 110%-- but only if you don't hit with every punch. If you do, the final punch of the fully charged variant deals a lot less knockback, and the Hadouken becomes the KO dealer. The Hadouken KOs at 95%-- what a move!

Down Smash- Sakotsu Wari

Ah, the Sakotsu Wari. The move's name roughly translates to "Collarbone Breaker" or "Clavicle Splitter", so that should clue you in on what it's all about. It's a very powerful overhead punch, doing between 19% and 25% damage depending on how long you charge it. The knockback is downwards, but it causes foes to bounce even when they're at low percentages. But, this downward arc is fantastic for edge guarding, easily knocking foes into the abyss.

It's main function, however, is a shield breaker. You see, at no charge it's pretty standard fair for a smash, bringing down a shield a fair bit. But when it's fully charged? Well, it's a guard breaker in Street Fighter, and it's a guard breaker here! Even a completely full shield will be broken by a single strike from a fully charged Sakotsu Wari.


AERIALS

Neutral Aerial
Ryu performs a spinning kick, smacking foes on his left and right and dishing out 8% to all comers. It's only a single spin, but it has high knockback. It hits harder on the back side, however-- The back half of the spin is similar to a sweetspot, dealing much higher knockback. The back's knockback is enough to KO at 120%, even! It's really incredible. however, it's a slow move, so it might be hard to get the timing down to memory!

Forward Aerial
Ryu performs an axe kick mid-air, hitting above, below, and in front of him! It deals damage differently depending on where you hit with it.

At the top or the upswing, it deals 10%, and rather decent upwards knockback, but it's nothing to really write home about.

On the downswing, it deals 11%, and downward knockback. But again, it's not really that impressive. It doesn't have much KOing power, and the damage is fairly average.

Now, at the utter bottom of the kick, the end of the move? It deals 17%. Meanwhile, it meteor smashes foes, blasting them diagonally downwards and easily KOing over, say, a pit. Damn fine, if I do say so myself!

Down Aerial
Ryu punches straight downwards-- Similar to Little Mac's down aerial, but with a bit more range to it. It's simple. It deals 9%, but high downward knockback. Combined with the quickness of getting this move out, it's an excellent attack for gimping. Its quickness also means it can easily be shorthopped. Hell, you can use it twice in one shorthop if you have good timing!

Back Aerial
Ryu quickly turns, backhanding his enemies. It doesn't do much knockback, mind you-- almost none at all-- but it has incredibly high hitstun. Granted, not enough to be called regular stun, but enough that your foe will be open to a followup attack if you hit with it. It's short range, meaning your enemy needs to be right up there to be hit with it, but that's a fair enough trade off. On contact, it deals 7%.

Up Aerial
Taking a different approach, Ryu quickly turns onto his back in the air, before thrusting his palm straight upwards, charged with Hadou energy. It hits three times if you time it perfectly, dealing 4% per hit and, on the third and final one, high as heck knockback, making it excellent for KOing off the top boundary, if you're high enough up when you hit with it. Make it count! It's also fairly quick-- making it shorthoppable. This is that move you use for aerial followups, kids!


GRAB GAME

Grab
It's a grab! He reaches out his hand, and attempts to grip his foe. Simple as that, kids!

Pummel
Ryu punches his foe in the gut, dealing 4%. It's fairly strong but, like his grab, is a damn simple move. What else was I supposed to do, dawg?

Back Throw- Tomoe Nage

Gripping his foe by the chest, Ryu falls backwards as if he was performing a backwards roll. He plants a foe on the now off balance foe, and starts applying pressure. Ryu rolls onto his back as the foe is loft above him, before completing the flip, leaving the two lying down on the ground, head to head. The enemy takes 10%, and is left prone. They can't get up until after Ryu does. Ryu gets up automatically though, so you can't really exploit that. Still, there's an opening there, so use it! It's also good for getting foes off of a platform, as they'll fall off if used close enough to an edge!


Down Throw- Seoi Nage


The diagram above perfectly illustrates the animation for the attack, so I won't bother doing so in this textual description? Can't see the image, you say? ...Fine.

Ryu grips his foe tight, and flips them over his shoulder. This causes the foe to land hard on their back, falling prone while taking 12%. They'll have to wait a small amount of time before being able to recover-- a time frame which you can exploit, perhaps using the freedom for charging up a Shinku Tatsumaki Senpukyaku, a Sakotsu Wari, or whatever it is you wanna do!

Up Throw- Reppuu Jinrai Shou

Though smaller than usual, the animation demonstrates the series of strikes Ryu performs here. The combo, in total, deals 13% over several hits, and the Shoryuken at the end sends foes flying straight up, wide open for a followup by an actual Shoryuken, or what have you. It's a simple directional throw, but it's damn cool looking.

Forward Throw- Kyuubi Kudaki

Ryu punches his foe in the solar plexus-- that's what the name of the move is, of course. Solar Plexus Strike.-- and deals damage over two hits. The first hit leaves his foe stunned in front of him, and deals 7%. The second comes near immediately afterwards, dealing 7% again and blasting his foe back with great force.

The hitbox of the two punches actually extends past the enemy being thrown slightly. It depends on the size of the foe in question, extending half their width. Thus, you can use this throw to hit several foes all at once, not just the one you're currently throwing! The knockback and damage is the same for even the foes not being thrown directly, so they'll feel the hurt just as much!


FINAL SMASH
HADOU KAKUSEI

"Come on... Challenge me!"
Surging with an aura of light blue hadou energy, Ryu's eyes turn white, signifying an awakened state. In this mode, his attacks are enhanced, and his speed is increased as well. He has super armor, making him an inescapable force.

His Hadouken becomes the Shin Hadouken, a beam type attack that can bounce off of walls and travels the same length as a regular Hadouken, but has a two second cooldown, dealing 15% per hit.

Tatsumaki Senpukyaku, meanwhile, becomes the Shin Tatsumaki Sepukyaku. When performing it, Ryu is enveloped in a swirling tornado, which launches foes up and KOs at 40%.

His Alpha Counter is replaced with the Metsu Shoryuken-- An intense combo that deals 30% and KOs at 50% or above!

Admittedly, I added this gif because I love seeing Cody get his **** wrecked.

Hadou Kakusei lasts for 10 seconds, after which Ryu reverts to his original form.​
 
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Woohoo982

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Apr 26, 2015
Messages
149
Location
Clobberin' dat dere Kirby
GROUDON




----------------BASE STATS--------
Weight: Bowser+Kirby
Height: Double the height of Mario
Traction: Peach
Air Speed: Ganondorf
Jump Height: Bowser
Fall Speed: DK
Speed: Shulk(Shield Mode Shulk)
-------MOVESET------
Neutral B: Drought
Groudon makes it sunny, and a beam of light shines down on where Groudon started the move. This buffs Groudon's attacks, making them deal 6% more. Some moves also gain special effects. These special effects are in
blue. The ray of light will deal 1% continuous damage, and the sun lasts for 25 seconds, after which Groudon can't use this move for 30 seconds. Other characters may also be affected by the sun, too!

Custom 1: Rayless Drought
No ray of light appears where Groudon initiated the move, but it lasts longer(30 seconds.) The cooldown time is the same.

Custom 2: Desolate Land
Groudon's attacks get buffed to deal 8% more. However, the time the sun is up is only 20 seconds, and the cooldown time is 35 seconds.
---
Side B: Fire Blast
Groudon spews a star-shaped blast of fire. It deals 10% and has good knickknack. It travels 2 SBB.
If under the effect of drought, It will deal 16%(18% for Desolate Land) and make five pillars of fire when it lands. The pillars deal 8% each.

Custom 1: Precipice Blades
Groudon unleashes 3 pointy pillars of earth in front of it, pushing opponents back and dealing 3% per hit(21% if all hits connect) This move is not affected by Drought.

Custom 2: Solarbeam
Groudon unleashes an enemy-piercing beam that deals 7%.
In the sun, it deals 13%(15% for Desolate Land) and has 3 beams instead of one.
-----
Up B: Dragon Claw
Groudon makes several frenzied slashes upwards, dealing 25% if all hits connect and traveling 2 SBB. This move is not affected by Drought.

Custom 1: Flare Blitz
Groudon rushes upwards in a burst of fire. It deals 13% of damage and travels 2 SBB.
If under the effect of Drought, it will rush 3 SBB instead and deal 19%(21% for Desolate Land)

Custom 2: Dragon Jump
Groudon jumps 4 SBB, but does not deal any damage. This move is not affected by Drought.
---
Down B: Earthquake
Groudon creates an earthquake that deals 6% to anyone on the same platform as Groudon. This move cannot be used in the air. It is not affected by Drought.

Custom 1: Lava Plume
Groudon creates a pillar of lava that functions like PK Fire. It deals 8%.
If under Drought, it deals 14%(16% for desolate land) and makes the pillar move around.

Custom 2: Mud Shot
Groudon shoots mud at an opponent. They will be slowed down if hit.
------SMASHES-----
Fsmash: Groudon stomps in front of him. 16-26%.

Usmash: Groudon uses Solarbeam upwards. It deals 12-21%.

Dsmash: Groudon will summon two spikes in front of and behind him. 13-23%.
----Aerials----
Nair: Stone Edge
A circle of stones circles around groudon, dealing 10%.

Fair: Groudon claws in front of him. 12%.

Bair: Groudon uses Ember behind him. 8%.

Uair: Groudon headbutts the air. 11%.

Dair: Groudon falls to the ground with a stomp. 12%.
----Standards-----
Jab: A punch, then a punch. They deal 4% each.
If under the effect of Drought, there will only be one punch, but it has a flaming aura and deals 10%(12% Desolate Land).

Ftilt: A claw swipe forwards. 7%.

Dtilt: A lava pillar erupts in front of groudon. 6%.
If under the effects of Drought, 3 pillars erupt instead, dealing 7% each(10% for Desolate Land.)

Utilt: Groudon bites the air. 10%.

Dash Attack: Groudon claws forward while dashing. 8%.

Trip Attack: Groudon gets up while summoning 2 earth spikes. They deal 5%.

Ledge Attack: Groudon gets up and punches. 6%.
----Grabs----
Grab: Groudon grabs the opponent with his claw. No duh. Oh, and he can move around while grabbing an opponent, too.

Pummel: Groudon punches the opponent.

Uthrow: Groudon throws the opponent onto his back, then heats said back up. 8%.

Dthrow: Groudon throws the opponent to the ground, then flattens him/her. 14%.

Fthrow: Groudon throws the opponent forward. 7%.

Bthrow: Groudon throws the opponent behind him. 9%.
----Misc.----
Final Smash: Fissure
Groudon opens up a fissure, trapping any enemies within 2 SSB. It then deals 40% and launches them high up, OHKOing anyone at 0% except Bowser and other Groudon(but they will be within spitting distance of the upper blast line.) This can be used in the air, because logic.

Taunts:
Up: Groudon roars.
Side: Groudon spews a tiny flame.
Down: Groudon stomps and looks at the screen.

Custom Move Project sets:
1232 1113
1222 2121
1312 3111
3322 2312

Equipment available:
X Attack
Fake Nails

X Speed
X Defense
Badges

How other fighters get affected by Drought
All fire-based moves get 4% stronger.
Mario's FLUDD travels 1 SBB less.
Greninja gets weakened.
Sun Salutation heals WFT for 2% now.
Peach now has a 1/100 chance to pull a Bob-Omb.
Judge 6 has higher knockback.
Fire Bars,Fire Flowers,X Bombs and Beam Swords drop more often. Also, the roast chicken Food will be the only food that drops.

PLAYSTYLE
Groudon is extremely heavy, but really slow. His play style revolves around his smashes and special attacks. He also has a unique mechanic in Drought, powering up him and any other fighters with fire-based moves. Therefore, Groudon is surprisingly strategic for a fighter that seems to be another 'kill em all' fighter. A Groudon player must also know when to use Drought, as the cooldown time is long. However, he is very heavy, and light attacks will not make him flinch until around 100%. Also, while his grab may not be good, his Dthrow can combo into some smashes or a special move. You must also know where to activate Drought, as the damaging light does not follow Groudon.

tl dr: Groudon needs a lot of strategy and is boss in doubles.
 
Last edited:

ForwardArrow

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 17, 2011
Messages
423
Inkling
I owe you a comment on this since I mentioned I read it a while ago, but its a somewhat hard set for me to comment because there's nothing standout here that's really fundamentally wrong with the set. Its more a lot of little things that add up and make me think very little of the set. To start off, the inking mechanic feels really static when it has the same damage and duration in every instance, I think varying it up honestly would've been nice and while you might think it works for ease of reading it actually makes some moves very awkward to read as you have to remember the move does 15% more than you think it does and causes the opponent to trail ink. Its all very static and even if you always made the ink deal 3% per second on every input you could at least vary the duration, as on some moves I think it does make them do too much damage. I'm also not really sure quite how inking "stacks", like if you throw on another layer does it add another 5 seconds of 3% per second after the current ones? Just refresh the duration? Inkling has a lot of attacks that stack it, this is pretty important information to the set's balance because as is it honestly feels really strong, I don't know much about SSB4 numbers but her KO percents are pretty early(100% on a throw would be absolute murder in Brawl) and her damage is very high from the inking mechanic.

As for the ink itself once its on stage, you do provide a decent variety of options to use it on each Special and have any material to flow off it in the standards, which is good, and you at least removed the stupid grates property to prevent her from being too horribly gimped on Delfino Plaza. The problem is honestly as Custom Specials they feel very unrelated, not really being variations on a theme as literally entirely different specials in most cases past the Neutral Special. That said, at the very least the Specials themselves are not particularly bad, but the throws section is terrible, Inkling has way too much tying the opponent to the stage like some kind of cartoon villain and then dropping some bomb on them, which feels overly sadistic and bizarre on this character choice. It really doesn't help that the Sprinkler throw is a stun, so why not just regrab them and infinite them with it, its not hard. I also think the ink meter is a pretty unnecessary and annoying addition, ammo banks are rarely a good idea if you don't have much of a reason for them to exist, see Blocks over there for an actually good one, though it does at least make me less concerned about her being overpowered. I mostly just feel like it'd make her more frustrating to play than she really needs to be, forcing her to keep ink diving.

At any rate, I've ranted a lot, but the set has some decent Specials and Smashes and if it weren't for a lot of the random baggage on it I could see myself a little more open to what its trying to accomplish, but it just comes across as messy and ultimately doesn't accomplish anything interesting with a character who has so many props. If anything I think I prefer the MYM16 version because it has most of the actually decent things from this set and much fewer of the bad, so I'm afraid I have to give a thumbs down on this one.

Nights
This was probably my favorite of your original 4 Munomario, because the way the paralooping works is actually kind of unique even amongst MYM sets and was able to hold my interest more than I expected it too through the specials. The Neutral, Up, and Down Specials actually gave him decent material to play off the concept, but honestly, I find it really awkward to just have something like that simply tied to a flight mechanic when it deals damage and manipulates objects on the stage. The whole paralooping thing would feel very at home on Up Special, and as the Side Special is a pretty poor move overall(the main reason Wario's bike is interesting is because you can break it into parts, not because you get turned into a predictable moving obstacle) maybe you should've switched the flute move to Side B and just made Paralooping/Flight the Up Special. Either way, the standards, smashes, and aerials all have really nothing for me to talk about in them, the set's quality drops off hard at those points and the at least somewhat interesting mechanics you establish earlier may as well not exist. You bring it back in the grab game, but it mostly comes across as a gimmick here because the only thing it does new with paralooping is just getting more damage and knockback when the foe circles in that direction around you, and I think in most cases you'd just wait and throw them when they're in that position and its not really as dynamic as you'd probably want(I guess grab difficulty plays a part, but then you'd just use whatever throw comes first in that circle 99% of the time, which is kind of bad as it defeats the point of using any other throws at low percentages). Also for that matter, maybe the throw could do more when the opponent is thrown in the direction they are in the loop, like trigger the diamond blasting them immediately or something. Either way, the start's not bad, its more that any momentum the set had dies almost immediately.

Cat Mario
I found unlike Inkling and Nights, you were clearly struggling even in the Specials of this set, with the Neutral and Side Specials having nothing that actually makes them Special and the Up Special just being bizarre(why can he just summon this propeller platform, I know its in his game but it feels really tacky compared to Mario's regular set). I don't really think the set had much of a decent basis and that continues for the rest of the set, but one aspect of it did actually stick out to me and that was Down Smash, which actually was a pretty cool move and really should have been a Special instead of, at the very least, Side or Neutral Special. It even lightly interacts off Down Special, as you can create a huge block of coins for healing's sake, but sadly nothing that could make much use of it is ever brought up again. I feel like the autocancelling aerials and stage clinging abilities might at least give his air game any actual depth to them, though I wonder if the cancelling aspect is a bit too easy(I'm not as informed on how these kinds of mechanics would work in an actual game sadly, my knowledge of Smash mechanics is honestly pretty bad amongst MYM people), but at the very least that stuff and the Down Smash means the set wouldn't be completely boring if implemented, but the Specials are so horribly underwhelming the set needed something like that to not be less interesting than any existing Smash set that's not like, Dark Pit or something.

Plusle and Minun
This is my least favorite of your opening day sets Muno, because while duo characters aren't done often, this is not the kind of execution I'd hope for out of one. Plusle and Minun's separate attacks mostly just function like sweetspot/sourspots and that's not particularly interesting as its nothing a single character couldn't just have by themselves, and what's more is, of all the things you could've chosen to make Minun's attacks unique, you make them stun. People don't want to constantly get stunned for .5-1.5 seconds as the set has(though .5 isn't too bad I guess) Minun do in a lot of moves, and 1.5 is particularly egregious as it lets them follow up with basically any attack they could ever want too. You intended to give Minun some more interesting effects than Plusle but all it ended up doing is making him actively worse than a weaker, lower damage Plusle, which is a real shame. As far as what I'd actually like out of a duo character set, I made one last contest and it got 7th so while I don't like citing my own sets that's a good one to look at, and for that matter you could also check out Borth-Majar from MYM15, as it makes stronger use of 2 characters than this does fairly easily.

Starman (The Third One by Kiwi)
I should just go and read the other Starman sets one of these days, but this one is probably the most worth talking about. Reflecting projectiles about and using black holes to bend them around is not really terribly unique, it was done a long time ago by sets like Grand Doomer and is commonly included as a subtheme, but for what its worth, you do get decent mileage out of it with how free form his projectile set ups can be, and the fact that you have some standards that have some cool interactions off it(like putting a low gravity boulder through the circuit, or attracting rings from the Nair to black holes). While I gave Jamie some crap for his initial commentary, I actually think he had some worthwhile things to say, as the existing Up Throw is bad and should be replaced with something(even something generic) as soon as possible, and being able to create all these structures in mid air is kind of worrying as it makes him an insanely powerful gimper even with the nerfed energy field spikes. Aerial traps are a pretty dangerous business as far as balance goes, and it does scare me how easily this guy could probably gimp people. Regardless, I think with the addition of another projectile(the boulder) with different speed/power/whatnot its at least functional and interesting enough for me to like it at all, and think its on par with your best MYM16 works.


Parasect

I was really pleasantly surprised by this set because after introducing some pretty interesting mechanics on the Specials, you actually tied everything together pretty brilliantly with the Down Throw, which suddenly gave the set some very real substance, and honestly gave him a really unique playstyle as a super defensive but largely melee-oriented character. The set past that point is a bit less exciting, I don't expect a ton out of aerials from Parasect but I think you could've managed a better FSmash than THAT, but at the very least the moves feel functional and make any attempt to have actual subtance to them, though I pretty much agree with what Warlord said in regards to filler either way. I'm just complaining about filler because honestly, I think I could really like the set if it had a couple more ways to expand off the spores/leech seeds/mushroom expansion, but you are playing a dangerous game with the spores given their effects are fairly stun-like, so maybe its for the best you didn't try to mess with them much further than you did. I really do wish changing the size of the mushroom had a little more too it than just expanding some hitboxes, I'm sure you could've done something with bouncing a foe off a bigger mushroom in Up Throw for example.

Blocks
Its probably not going to surprise much of anyone when I say this is my favorite set of the contest, but it is. Blocks does some fairly cool stuff with making structures out of his bodymass, increasing his size at the cost of weight while providing many other benefits, or copying the opponents moveset and making minions that have functional copies of their abilities. It honestly has fairly little filler even if at points its a little disjointed, and a little disjointedness is fine when the set has to account for the opponent's moveset potentially being at his disposal as well. That's not to say what he does with the structures and body type isn't cool though, some standouts being the Dash Attack allowing him to walk on top of his Up Throw rockets and put his gigantic body out of reach when enlarged, or just the Up Smash in general as a really fun way to incorporate one of his most fun attacks from the show. I find the bits where he plays off opponents being covered in parts of his mass to create a minion a little bit weird at points, as that aspect of his game borders too much on stun abuse for my liking, but eh, its a good set albeit one I'm having some trouble describing actually commenting it. If I was Rool, I'd probably say that its because like Blocks, its not really set in its ways and is constantly changing, but I'm not Rool so the actual reason for that is probably because I read it a while ago.
 
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Munomario777

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Thanks for the comments! :)
Inkling
I owe you a comment on this since I mentioned I read it a while ago, but its a somewhat hard set for me to comment because there's nothing standout here that's really fundamentally wrong with the set. Its more a lot of little things that add up and make me think very little of the set. To start off, the inking mechanic feels really static when it has the same damage and duration in every instance, I think varying it up honestly would've been nice and while you might think it works for ease of reading it actually makes some moves very awkward to read as you have to remember the move does 15% more than you think it does and causes the opponent to trail ink. Its all very static and even if you always made the ink deal 3% per second on every input you could at least vary the duration, as on some moves I think it does make them do too much damage.
Good idea. I'll probably vary things up from attack to attack to keep the damage in perspective and to make it more interesting.
I'm also not really sure quite how inking "stacks", like if you throw on another layer does it add another 5 seconds of 3% per second after the current ones? Just refresh the duration?
At the moment, it would just reset the timer. This may need changing if I do vary it up, though.
Inkling has a lot of attacks that stack it, this is pretty important information to the set's balance because as is it honestly feels really strong, I don't know much about SSB4 numbers but her KO percents are pretty early(100% on a throw would be absolute murder in Brawl) and her damage is very high from the inking mechanic.
Very good point. I'll apply a bit of a knockback nerf when I go back through the set.
As for the ink itself once its on stage, you do provide a decent variety of options to use it on each Special and have any material to flow off it in the standards, which is good, and you at least removed the stupid grates property to prevent her from being too horribly gimped on Delfino Plaza. The problem is honestly as Custom Specials they feel very unrelated, not really being variations on a theme as literally entirely different specials in most cases past the Neutral Special.
There are themes in there. The Side Specials all make a steady, straight trail of Ink as they move along the ground, the Up Specials all have Inkling become a squid and launch into the air, and the Down Specials are all about placing something on the ground that makes Ink. They're not as similar as, say, Mario's customs of course, but I was going for a more "varied" approach like what, say, Palutena and the Miis use. I honestly think that they should have done this with all of the customs, but oh well.
That said, at the very least the Specials themselves are not particularly bad, but the throws section is terrible, Inkling has way too much tying the opponent to the stage like some kind of cartoon villain and then dropping some bomb on them, which feels overly sadistic and bizarre on this character choice.
Inklings don't really have a set personality, but I do agree that this is a bit out of character in retrospect.
It really doesn't help that the Sprinkler throw is a stun, so why not just regrab them and infinite them with it, its not hard.
Very true.
I also think the ink meter is a pretty unnecessary and annoying addition, ammo banks are rarely a good idea if you don't have much of a reason for them to exist, see Blocks over there for an actually good one, though it does at least make me less concerned about her being overpowered. I mostly just feel like it'd make her more frustrating to play than she really needs to be, forcing her to keep ink diving.
Diving into Ink really is the Inkling's best mobility tool (going from Robin's ground speed to Captain Falcon's is a godsend), so I expect players to use it a lot. The meter will refill a bit when you're not inside Ink as well, so it shouldn't hamper Inkling that much.
At any rate, I've ranted a lot, but the set has some decent Specials and Smashes and if it weren't for a lot of the random baggage on it I could see myself a little more open to what its trying to accomplish, but it just comes across as messy and ultimately doesn't accomplish anything interesting with a character who has so many props. If anything I think I prefer the MYM16 version because it has most of the actually decent things from this set and much fewer of the bad, so I'm afraid I have to give a thumbs down on this one.

Nights
This was probably my favorite of your original 4 Munomario, because the way the paralooping works is actually kind of unique even amongst MYM sets and was able to hold my interest more than I expected it too through the specials. The Neutral, Up, and Down Specials actually gave him decent material to play off the concept, but honestly, I find it really awkward to just have something like that simply tied to a flight mechanic when it deals damage and manipulates objects on the stage. The whole paralooping thing would feel very at home on Up Special, and as the Side Special is a pretty poor move overall(the main reason Wario's bike is interesting is because you can break it into parts, not because you get turned into a predictable moving obstacle) maybe you should've switched the flute move to Side B and just made Paralooping/Flight the Up Special.
I feel like the flight mechanic replicates the feel of the original NiGHTS games, and that tacking the paralooping onto a move would sort of lower the versatility and feel of the technique as a whole. One would have to play it yourself to see whether or not it works well, but I think that this is the way to go. I do have an idea to replace the Side Special, though,
Either way, the standards, smashes, and aerials all have really nothing for me to talk about in them, the set's quality drops off hard at those points and the at least somewhat interesting mechanics you establish earlier may as well not exist.
I've gotten comments like this in the past. I'll see what I can do to make the moveset tie into the flight mechanic a bit better.
You bring it back in the grab game, but it mostly comes across as a gimmick here because the only thing it does new with paralooping is just getting more damage and knockback when the foe circles in that direction around you, and I think in most cases you'd just wait and throw them when they're in that position and its not really as dynamic as you'd probably want(I guess grab difficulty plays a part, but then you'd just use whatever throw comes first in that circle 99% of the time, which is kind of bad as it defeats the point of using any other throws at low percentages). Also for that matter, maybe the throw could do more when the opponent is thrown in the direction they are in the loop, like trigger the diamond blasting them immediately or something.
I might lower the bonuses to make it a bit less one-sided (or whatever you'd like to call it). I think using the diamond may make it a bit too situational.
Either way, the start's not bad, its more that any momentum the set had dies almost immediately.

Cat Mario
I found unlike Inkling and Nights, you were clearly struggling even in the Specials of this set, with the Neutral and Side Specials having nothing that actually makes them Special and the Up Special just being bizarre(why can he just summon this propeller platform, I know its in his game but it feels really tacky compared to Mario's regular set).
The Side and Neutral Specials actually came rather naturally; they're two signature abilities of the power-up in 3D World. I do agree that the Up Special is rather odd for the character and all, but I'm not quite sure what else one could do for an upwards recovery move for this sort of character. Actually, now that I think about it, I could just leave vertical recovery to the climbing and use the Up Special for a different kind of attack. I'll play around with this and see what I get.
I don't really think the set had much of a decent basis and that continues for the rest of the set, but one aspect of it did actually stick out to me and that was Down Smash, which actually was a pretty cool move and really should have been a Special instead of, at the very least, Side or Neutral Special.
This could replace the Up Special in some way. I'll see what I can do.
It even lightly interacts off Down Special, as you can create a huge block of coins for healing's sake, but sadly nothing that could make much use of it is ever brought up again.
Very true. I'll work on this once I get it into a special.
I feel like the autocancelling aerials and stage clinging abilities might at least give his air game any actual depth to them, though I wonder if the cancelling aspect is a bit too easy(I'm not as informed on how these kinds of mechanics would work in an actual game sadly, my knowledge of Smash mechanics is honestly pretty bad amongst MYM people), but at the very least that stuff and the Down Smash means the set wouldn't be completely boring if implemented, but the Specials are so horribly underwhelming the set needed something like that to not be less interesting than any existing Smash set that's not like, Dark Pit or something.
Auto-canceling is, normally, when you land during the very few first or last frames of an aerial. This makes it so that the landing lag you'd usually suffer if you landed in the middle of an attack doesn't happen, and you instead go through the regular landing animation (if you just jumped and landed without doing anything). Many aerials have a specific duration that makes it so that if you short hop and perform the aerial, the attack will enter these special frames right when you land, and it autocancels. With Cat Mario, he has a mechanic where this can happen during the entire attack rather than just those few frames, essentially removing landing lag altogether.
and Minun
This is my least favorite of your opening day sets Muno, because while duo characters aren't done often, this is not the kind of execution I'd hope for out of one. Plusle and Minun's separate attacks mostly just function like sweetspot/sourspots and that's not particularly interesting as its nothing a single character couldn't just have by themselves, and what's more is, of all the things you could've chosen to make Minun's attacks unique, you make them stun. People don't want to constantly get stunned for .5-1.5 seconds as the set has(though .5 isn't too bad I guess) Minun do in a lot of moves, and 1.5 is particularly egregious as it lets them follow up with basically any attack they could ever want too. You intended to give Minun some more interesting effects than Plusle but all it ended up doing is making him actively worse than a weaker, lower damage Plusle, which is a real shame.
Very true. Perhaps instead of stun and all, I could give Plusle the damage and Minun the knockback, or something along those lines.
As far as what I'd actually like out of a duo character set, I made one last contest and it got 7th so while I don't like citing my own sets that's a good one to look at, and for that matter you could also check out Borth-Majar from MYM15, as it makes stronger use of 2 characters than this does fairly easily.
I'll give those a look. Thanks once again for the comments! :)
 

ChaosKiwi

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Feb 1, 2014
Messages
104
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ChaosKiwi
FA, I updated the up throw like four years ago, keep up.

As for more Starman, one maybe soon. After I finish my current one day.
 

ϟPlazzapϟ

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Nov 30, 2014
Messages
95
I've mostly been doing stuff of the whiteboard and there are a few sets that really deserve some feedback, especially that yo-kai watch monster someone posted

ill be sure to post my criticism after im done with this set, which only lacks the flavor, situational attacks and some fixing up here and there
 

ChaosKiwi

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Feb 1, 2014
Messages
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ChaosKiwi
Time for Kiwi's KComment Korner, kids. I won't be commenting on every set of he contest so far, just the ones that are the quickest for me to reread. I'll be commenting on the longer ones/ones that need more in depth comments probably this weekend.

Now, I'd like to note: A lot of these are overtly negative, because I am a negative person. Don't let that discourage you, though. Use my vicious insults to improve, alright?


Garnet, Amethyst, and Pearl... and Sakurai!
Steven Universe by @Reigaheres

I'm a fan of the show, so like, I'm gonna be a bit harsher than I would be otherwise. Character bias, and all that. Now, first thing's first, it's clear you like the character, and wanted to put in as much stuff as possible to represent him. That's good, and all, but at the end of the day it was executed fairly poorly.

First of all, the shield. The fact that Steven's whole thing in the show is his shield should translate to an excellent shield game, not the pretty nerfed, almost useless shield you gave him (I'm referring to the bubble shield, not the one in the NSpec).

As for the neutral special shield, its function as a counter/reflector is just... odd, I guess? It sort of fits how it's mainly reactionary in the show, yeah, but gameplay-wise it's just wonky. Why not make it sort of like Pit's old down special, the mirror shield? Have it stay out as long as you hold the button. Any foes who physically hit the shield would be, say, stunned for a moment to be open for attack, and projectiles would still be reflected. However, Steven and Lion would still be open from behind, keeping it from being OP.

The cheeseburger backpack is just overpowered, man. Cookie Cats and Chaaaaaaaaaaaaaps can restore a total of 60%? Way too much, man. It'd be better if it let him, say, pull out things other than healing items? Or at the very least, balance them out some more? And, yeah, make it more obvious what Steven's pulling out, like Pac-Man's NSpec.

The watermelon Stevens are quite out of place in this set. A minion that only lasts four seconds (not a lot of time in the grand scheme of things), can be spammed up to four times in a very short period, and has very high damage output? Yeah, no, doesn't work. Plus, they're just sort of crammed into the set. Nothing else interacts with them, man. What if they can bring Steven items, or travel through his portals, or something? You need to put more thought into it. Either give them a purpose or don't include them. At most, they work as meatshields while you dig through your bag for an OP healing item.

Also holy ****, too much stun.

The specials, despite being meh at best, are the most interesting things in this set. The other moves are just generic attacks that don't have any flow or coherence. None of them really seem to work together, and just from reading it I don't see any actual playstyle or combo potential. And, like I said above, nothing really interacts. They're all very unrelated.

Now, Lion. My first qualm is just, like, why doesn't Steven ride him the whole time? Why is it only in one move? It'd make a lot more sense, and would be leagues less needlessly complex.

Moving on.


Pichu Bros.
Plusule +- Minun
by @ Munomario777 Munomario777

Others have said a lot of what I was gonna say, so I'll keep this brief. I like the duality thing, where they have different hitboxs and junk. It kinda reminds me of my own Borth-Majar, but, you know, different. Now, when you said it was a Pikachu semi-clone I was expecting "Two Pichus taped together", or something. I'm glad to see it wasn't that.

But still, there isn't really a lot going on here other than the semi-uniqueness of these semi-clones. The attack mechanics get interesting a few times, but you never really do anything with it. It's the same problem a lot of people have: A lack of interaction. Hell, not even that, just a lack of exploitation. You have this neat positive/negative thing going, but you barely do anything at all with it. I recommend trying this again in the future, when you have a better grasp on complex playstyle type stuff.


Freddy Krueger
Nights
by @ Munomario777 Munomario777 and @StaffofSmashing

Don't use other characters as stats.

Give Nights a Flight mode specific attack is neat, but the one you gave him (her? (it?)) isn't really great. I would have preferred just being able to use aerials, frankly. And Acrobatics is... yeah, just let them use aerials. Plus, I don't think the flight lasts long enough, guys. It seems like it would take more than the allotted time to Paraloop and then make use of said paralooping. Like, the Dream Diamond following Nights doesn't do much when you only have a half second of flight left, you know?

Now, I'm only gonna comment on specials, otherwise I would just quote the segment from Steven Universe about how none of the attacks seem to be connected or coherent. It's a problem a lot of people have, actually, so I'm just gonna say "See that part on Steven" when I wanna bring it up later in this post. Now then, moving on to specials.

Dream Diamond is underdecribed. You say it lasts ten seconds-- why? Does it fire out more than one laser? If so, how many and how frequently? Can enemies destroy the diamond? If they can, how much HP does it have? Can Nights have out more than one at a time? This stuff is important info. Include it.

The side special is jarringly out of place. I would have just made it the Drill Dash. A completely new form (which doesn't have any interactions with the rest of the set) with no benefits I can actually see is pointless and useless. I mean, like, what benefit is there to vehicle mode? You lose all of your ranged attacks, throws, etc. and gain nothing.

Dream Flute is... comparatively fine, sure, but it really should interact with his other moves somehow. Why not make it so the windbox moves his Dream Diamonds, or moves his sparkle mist thing around, or something.

The minions don't have any interactions aside from Paralooping. The rocket is pretty overpowered for a guidable projectile, and the dragon and dolphin seem to be exactly the same, except the dragon breathes fire and is a better option overall.

Like I said, not going into anything but the specials. But there you have it.


Adware Jumpscare
Springtrap
by @StaffofSmashing

I won't lie to you, SoS. The formatting here is just horrid. Formatting is a very important aspect of setmaking, enough to make a bad set look better than it actually is or enough to make a good set unreadable and thus detract from its quality. This set is a combination of not great and poorly formatted, so it doesn't go over well.

I'm gonna harp on the formatting a bit more. I am begging you to edit this set. I get what your intention was. You kinda wanted to do a jumpscare thing, yeah? To fit the game and all. A valiant effort, sure, but all it does is stretch the page. Scrolling through page one is a goddamn hassle because of this. For the sake of everyone, please remove 90% of the line breaks. And the links, too. I don't want any damn viruses.

Now, off formatting and on to something else: The moveset itself, special by special.

Jumpscare makes no sense? The swim thing that even you are confused about is pointless. Just say he walks forward or somethin'. Second, 20% to their... face? Aside from being somewhat overpowered in terms of damage, a one second stun is nuts. What's to stop you from just doing this over and over again?

I have managed to decipher the side special. First of all, stop using characters for units of distance, it's hard to follow. Second, this move is almost useless. 5 seconds of setup time? That's nuts. You'll be wide open. Also, what is the present? What does Marionette look like? You need some accompanying images, preferably ones that aren't blurry like the one you actually have.

Give Life is just... what the hell is up with all these day one sets having underutilized/out of place/weirdly implemented minions? It doesn't seem to even fit the character, unlike Steven or Nights' minions. I have seen, like, one LP of FNaF, but I'm fairly certain none of them actually summon the Atari lookin heads, right? Aren't those just dreams? Point is, this move is a sufferer of "Comes out of nowhere and adds nothing of value" syndrome.

The up special is just generic, but fine.

A lot of the tilts and smashes n junk are just props from the games. Fine, whatever, but they don't really fit, do they? I would have preferred simple punches and kicks to pulling out random objects out of nowhere, with no rhyme or reason. It's tacky.

Overall, I don't like this set. It's hard to look at and hard to read, not just because of the formatting but cuz of the lolrandumz stuff you kept putting in. Try keeping things more coherent next time, man. Please.


Narghtsheid
Nightshade
by @ Bionichute Bionichute

Oh thank god, it's well formatted. I can always count on you for quality formatting, Bion. As for quality movesets... different story, that is.

Geto said a lot of what I wanted to: It starts strongish, but farts out around 40% through. The specials are interesting an have quite a bit of potential for interaction, if slightly underused potential. Perhaps play off the thief master aspect more, yeah? Moves that give him the ability to steal items or projectiles, moves that let him stealthily place traps on enemies (like how you can plant bombs on people with Snake), or the human shield idea, also suggested by Geto?

The Unvisibility is an interesting implementation of invisibility that I can't remember seeing before, so kudos for making ti cool. I don't know if it'd work so well in practice, it seems a bit unbalanced, but still, points for tryin'!

Overall, not much to say. It's not great, but certainly a breath of fresh air after the others.


Bionichute's Mother
Puggly
by @ Purin a.k.a. José Purin a.k.a. José

This is your first set, right? Well, it's certainly an interesting character choice to say the least. Let me walk you through this, help you out with some things:

Generally, the jab is meant to be one attack that deals less than, say 5% per hit. Some people have jab combos, but that's a little more rare. So saying that it does "10% overall" doesn't really mean anything. Instead, describe the damage of an individual lick.

The rest of the tilts are just underdescribed-- I'll get to that point later.

I'm sincerely hoping the side smash is a joke. I can't tell what charging it does, the damage is abysmal, but the 0% KO thing is really bad.

For smashes, they are chargeable attacks, always. Thus, describe what the difference is between no charge and full charge, in terms of damage and knockback. As some people have mentioned, the scaling for damage is that full charge does 1.4x the damage of an uncharged smash, while the knockback is more up to your discretion.

A long range attack dealing 45% is insane, man, even if you have to charge it. Burp OP, please nerf. The up special lasts way too long. Otherwise...

All the attacks share one problem: You barely describe them. A good rule of thumb is that if a move is described in one sentence, you aren't saying enough. Describe the animations, describe the uses of the moves, just fill the space somehow. Otherwise, it's just nothing of substance. Though it's very curious you decided to add frame data.

Also, his final smash is, uh, remarkably unclear.

Overall, I've seen worse first sets, but you should definitely practice, improve, and put some real elbow grease into your next set.


GARBAGE
Junk Warrior and Junk Synchron
by @ W Woohoo982

God, images would help this set so much, as somebody else who shall remain nameless suggested. Without them, I can't visualize any of this stuff, and I actually watched 5Ds. Include pictures of a card when you mention it, otherwise its just word salad.

Now then. The neutral special could easily be any tilt or smash, it has nothing going for it that earns it its status as a special. It's just a combo-- what does it do? How does he slash the blade? What can you follow it up with, where does it knock foes, etc.

Just like the last set-- You barely describe anything in this set. Please, next time you make a set spend some actual time on it. Really think everything out, try to figure out how moves interact, etc. Otherwise, its just a waste of space and time, without any actual substance or anything memorable. To the point where I can't really comment on the rest of these specials cuz, well, there's nothing to comment on!

Let me give you a specific example. Instead of saying:
Junk Warrior uses Junk Gardna's shield. It reflects projectiles from the front.
Try:
Junk Warrior holds out the shield of Junk Gardna, using it to defend his front side. It acts similarly to Pit's old Mirror Shield: While he holds it up, any projectile attacks that hit it will be reflected back to their source, dealing the same amount of damage they would have dealt to Junk Warrior. There's no time limit on how long he can hold out the shield, but it's not recommend you hold it for too long, because Junk Warrior can't move during the special, and the shield won't block physical attacks, leaving you open to punishment!
It explains the uses, limitations, and animations involved in the move, while also being at least slightly interesting to read. This problem affects pretty much every single input on both Junk Warrior and Junk Synchron, so I'm not gonna repeat it.

As for another thing that affects all of the moves you wrote: See that part on Steven.

Now, let's move on to the next and last set in this comment dump. It's gonna be short.


I Hate You, You Hate Me, Let's Team Up and Kill Barney
Barney
by @AlRex

God, the purple is hard on my eyes.

Barney's moves, on an individual, functional level, are fine. But that's the thing: Individual functions. Short version: See that part on Steven.

Long version: There's no playstyle here. There's clearly an attempt at a pacifistic, anti-violence type thing, which is fine an all, but hard to make work. Make it work you did not. Like I said, the individual moves are fine, but at no point do they converge and become a cohesive, flowing playstyle. This set almost seems like a joke set, what with the character choice, no-fighting style of fighting, and the like, but its very clearly meant to be taken seriously/was done seriously when you were making it.

So, uh, its not a bad set, but its not good, really. You have a lot of potential, definitely. You remind me of me when I started, actually. You have a lot of interesting concepts, you just need to learn to expand on them and connect them. Keep it up.

Sorry if this last comment wasn't really well stated. I admit to being super tired/not exactly functional at the moment.



Tune in tomorrow, when I make Munomario cry.
 
Last edited:

Munomario777

Smash Master
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Pichu Bros.
Plusule +- Minun
by @ Munomario777 Munomario777

Others have said a lot of what I was gonna say, so I'll keep this brief. I like the duality thing, where they have different hitboxs and junk. It kinda reminds me of my own Borth-Majar, but, you know, different. Now, when you said it was a Pikachu semi-clone I was expecting "Two Pichus taped together", or something. I'm glad to see it wasn't that.

But still, there isn't really a lot going on here other than the semi-uniqueness of these semi-clones. The attack mechanics get interesting a few times, but you never really do anything with it. It's the same problem a lot of people have: A lack of interaction. Hell, not even that, just a lack of exploitation. You have this neat positive/negative thing going, but you barely do anything at all with it. I recommend trying this again in the future, when you have a better grasp on complex playstyle type stuff.​

As I said in the other comment, I plan to change up some of the mechanics, themes, etc of the set in my next edit, whenever I do end up doing that.
Freddy Krueger
Nights
by @ Munomario777 Munomario777 and @StaffofSmashing

Don't use other characters as stats.
Why not? I feel it gives a nice in-game analog (and plus, not all stats have been fully analyzed in Smash 4 yet).
Give Nights a Flight mode specific attack is neat, but the one you gave him (her? (it?)) isn't really great. I would have preferred just being able to use aerials, frankly. And Acrobatics is... yeah, just let them use aerials.
You can easily exit flight, perform an aerial, and re-enter flight without a hitch. Executing aerials in flight might be a bit awkward, since the control stick would then be both controlling flight and the aerial you use.
Plus, I don't think the flight lasts long enough, guys. It seems like it would take more than the allotted time to Paraloop and then make use of said paralooping. Like, the Dream Diamond following Nights doesn't do much when you only have a half second of flight left, you know?
You can also use the grab for paralooping things like the Dream Diamond, which won't count towards flight time.
Now, I'm only gonna comment on specials, otherwise I would just quote the segment from Steven Universe about how none of the attacks seem to be connected or coherent. It's a problem a lot of people have, actually, so I'm just gonna say "See that part on Steven" when I wanna bring it up later in this post. Now then, moving on to specials.
Right, I'll work on that.
Dream Diamond is underdecribed. You say it lasts ten seconds-- why? Does it fire out more than one laser? If so, how many and how frequently? Can enemies destroy the diamond? If they can, how much HP does it have? Can Nights have out more than one at a time? This stuff is important info. Include it.
Will do.
The side special is jarringly out of place. I would have just made it the Drill Dash. A completely new form (which doesn't have any interactions with the rest of the set) with no benefits I can actually see is pointless and useless. I mean, like, what benefit is there to vehicle mode? You lose all of your ranged attacks, throws, etc. and gain nothing.

As I said in the other comment, I have an idea to replace the Side Special, which I plan to implement.
Dream Flute is... comparatively fine, sure, but it really should interact with his other moves somehow. Why not make it so the windbox moves his Dream Diamonds, or moves his sparkle mist thing around, or something.
It does sort of play into the other moves like the Dream Diamond in that it increases the speed of flight. You can move the Dream Diamond around at a higher speed, the Dream Dust trail can be longer, et cetera.
The minions don't have any interactions aside from Paralooping. The rocket is pretty overpowered for a guidable projectile, and the dragon and dolphin seem to be exactly the same, except the dragon breathes fire and is a better option overall.
True. I'll definitely take this into account.
Tune in tomorrow, when I make Munomario cry.
Yay! I can't wait...​
 
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purinsmash
Bionichute's Mother
Puggly
by @ Purin a.k.a. José Purin a.k.a. José

This is your first set, right? Well, it's certainly an interesting character choice to say the least. Let me walk you through this, help you out with some things:

Generally, the jab is meant to be one attack that deals less than, say 5% per hit. Some people have jab combos, but that's a little more rare. So saying that it does "10% overall" doesn't really mean anything. Instead, describe the damage of an individual lick.

The rest of the tilts are just underdescribed-- I'll get to that point later.

I'm sincerely hoping the side smash is a joke. I can't tell what charging it does, the damage is abysmal, but the 0% KO thing is really bad.

For smashes, they are chargeable attacks, always. Thus, describe what the difference is between no charge and full charge, in terms of damage and knockback. As some people have mentioned, the scaling for damage is that full charge does 1.4x the damage of an uncharged smash, while the knockback is more up to your discretion.

A long range attack dealing 45% is insane, man, even if you have to charge it. Burp OP, please nerf. The up special lasts way too long. Otherwise...

All the attacks share one problem: You barely describe them. A good rule of thumb is that if a move is described in one sentence, you aren't saying enough. Describe the animations, describe the uses of the moves, just fill the space somehow. Otherwise, it's just nothing of substance. Though it's very curious you decided to add frame data.

Also, his final smash is, uh, remarkably unclear.

Overall, I've seen worse first sets, but you should definitely practice, improve, and put some real elbow grease into your next set.

It is my first set! Thanks for the criticism. I will improve next time, and patch Puggly again. It may take some time, but practice makes perfect! :kirby:
 
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The Make Your Move Rooligan Society
GROUDON

I kind of wanted to a boss set for Primal Groudon, whom I think has a way more cool design than Groudon.

Few people attempt sets for Legendary Pokemon in this day and age, so seeing a set for one piqued my interest. Almost no one has ever made a set for an uber, given they're huge and how it would be out-of-character to be like, Bowser-sized, but I'm glad you were able to find a middle ground between "bigger then Bowser" and "smaller than actual Pokeball Groudon".

As Muno stated, the set lacks detail, and this is especially apparent during the playstyle summary when you bring up points that would be impossible for readers to have surmised while reading the set - those points being his smashes and the D-throw, neither of which were given adequate elaboration when describing them, let alone the entire set. How does D-throw combo into the Smashes and Specials? Why are the Smashes important to Groudon's game? (if anything they seem fairly normal, bar the U-Smash which -could- be a projectile given it's a beam) Though Muno mentioned Dr. Slavic's movesetting guide, I also think you'd benefit from reading other sets to see exactly what kind of details you're missing out on. For starters, you're missing out on basic details like knockback and lag for your attacks, but the animation descriptions are also bare-bones so something like "Groudon uses Ember behind him" is incredibly vague as we don't know how big the embers are compared to say, Groudon's claws, let alone how long they last for. It's hard for -us- to get excited for set, and those kinds of details would improve it exponentially.

Drought's timers are very extreme (maybe 10 seconds instead of 25-30?), but I think it's a pretty decent base in that it forces Groudon to remain stationary to fight to its fullest, maybe even use its massive size to corner enemies as given he's "twice Mario's height" I'd imagine he'd be very wide. Yes, even something like a character's size and body physique can be used to make a set unique and interesting. The other Specials are somewhat interesting, but underelaborated upon, especially the ones that involve firing multiple projectiles under Drought, along with the ones that create fiery pillars. When firing a Drought Solarbeam, do the beams get fired one at a time or all at once on different angles? How long do the fiery pillars last? How big are they? How much area does Mud Shot cover? How much does it slow opponents down by, and how long does the effect last? I think you get the point; there are many missing details, and by filling them in you'd have a much better set on your hands at the very least. Also, it's a bit weird to envision Groudon slashing upwards for a recovery (I imagine he'd use Earth Power to ride on a piece of ground instead, better fitting his status as a legendary), and the F-Smash doesn't feel "legendary" enough when the animation seems more suited for a tilt.

Hopefully I was of some help, so then you'll learn from your mistakes and make an even better set next time! That, or you could just fix up Groudon if you really like him as a set/character. Nobody would stop you from doing that.
 
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