(I like the metaphor)
Why not just wait for the next boat so you can see how the first one went?
[Translation]
Can't we just wait until everyone plays the game...THEN worry?
-
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M2K says "Olimar is Top tier"
- Thread starter Me14k
- Start date
Why not just wait for the next boat so you can see how the first one went?
[Translation]
Can't we just wait until everyone plays the game...THEN worry?
Oceanborn
Smash Journeyman
Haha True, that metaphor was humorously genius. And I definitely agree for the most part.
Needle of Juntah
Smash Champion
olimar isnt top teir olimar is broken teir.
hes to small. any other fighting game with a char that small, get banned for that sole reason. Olimar is the only char that has moves you cant block. thats like 1 of 10 reasons.
hes to small. any other fighting game with a char that small, get banned for that sole reason. Olimar is the only char that has moves you cant block. thats like 1 of 10 reasons.
spiritdragon
Smash Ace
Vids of Olimar being good plz
KingTejada
Smash Rookie
(Against Champ's Fox)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYKR_tCNzfY
(Against Lucky's Marth)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gjNH-zOCpt0&feature=related
(Against Gimpy's Metaknight)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gjNH-zOCpt0&feature=related
Topic: I would say that as of now Olimar is definitely looking at a High Tier position. The one reason that he might not be Top Tier is due to his Recovery Move, which seems to be much more important now than it was back in Melee. Lacking this is definitely something to consider.
Needle of Juntah
Smash Champion
without looking at those vids, ill tell you right now DSF's olimar is garbage
Yukiwarashi
Smash Champion
Pichu was banned in Melee?!
Rhyme
Smash Lord
TL wasn't banned in Brawl? No really, I'm being serious.
Anyway, thought you guys would be interested in this. After all, we knew M2K wasn't the only one who gets an opinion, it's just been hard to find one from anyone else up until now (at least for me).
I, for one, am very happy with this alternate analysis.
This made me think of Scar's SPOC (either 2 or 3) where M2K saw me and Lord Knight playing 3rd Strike...LK was playing Chun-Li, and M2K said "Chun-Li? Isn't she the one that dances around like 'da da da da da, low kick, super?!'"
M2K's dance nearly killed me
olimar is better than people play on youtube play him. there are a lot of things that people just don't seem to do, like manage pikmin order, latch + grab, etc. he's not top tier - because his fault is a pretty huge fault and while it can be countered, it's not easy to counter edge hogging with olimar - but he is probably a top 10 character. echo has a pretty good olimar from what i've seen, his later vids show the latch recovery that counters edge hogging.
you really have to give it time, though. everyone seems to say "yea he's hard to master," so do you expect everyone to have mastered him by now? of course not. but as far as i can tell, he's a very good character now, and learning to manage pikmin along with combos may put him at top tier later.
his biggest problem are characters like marth and MK who have disjointed hitboxes and small lag between attacks which affords them the opportunity to attack pikmin. all that really does though is stop you from camping with pikmin throw, but i think when people learn how to play olimar, he can be played very aggressively because of his range on a lot of his attacks/grab.
i guess you could call me a naturally talented player, but unfortunately i probably won't be playing brawl for a while. ;(
you really have to give it time, though. everyone seems to say "yea he's hard to master," so do you expect everyone to have mastered him by now? of course not. but as far as i can tell, he's a very good character now, and learning to manage pikmin along with combos may put him at top tier later.
his biggest problem are characters like marth and MK who have disjointed hitboxes and small lag between attacks which affords them the opportunity to attack pikmin. all that really does though is stop you from camping with pikmin throw, but i think when people learn how to play olimar, he can be played very aggressively because of his range on a lot of his attacks/grab.
i guess you could call me a naturally talented player, but unfortunately i probably won't be playing brawl for a while. ;(
ChronoSquare
Smash Ace
OMG, I just realized... if Olimar does make top tier... that means for two Smash games in a row a Space creature will reign top XD
Oceanborn
Smash Journeyman
I honestly can't see how Olimar's top tier. I mean, as we speak I'm developing major combo techniques but compared to, say, Fox back in Melee, I just can't see it. I guess what I'm trying to say is, Olimar's definitely good, but he's not THAT good. The whole managing and throwing thing doesn't work especially when your opponent likes to stick close to you. I guess there are alot of ways you can go about such a situation, but still, it's a major thing when alot of damage can come out of picking the right Pikmin to smash/throw with.
*shrugs*
*shrugs*
David Mathis
Smash Cadet
holy ****, thats awesome. wow. go to youtube and look for olimar chain grab. it rules, a great combo.. kinda gay.. and chaep.. but it works.
gonna have to try that...
gonna have to try that...
EternalCrusade
Smash Journeyman
well if M2K says it then it must be true...
OK, just to clarify, I'm not insulting M2K, or Olimar, or Me14K, or smashville, or your pet dog, when I say 'screw tiers'. they only cause problems.
1. I mained shiek in melee, not because she was high tier or any of that, but because she was my favorite character and because she was a ****in awesome ninja, but then I find out years later about tiers and now everyone and their mother blames my wins and their losses on the character I choose, as if I have no real skills whatsoever
2. my best friend is having the same problem with brawl. regardless that there are no tiers yet in brawl, my friend is already being told that 'oh, well Lucario is just a cheap ***, hes overpowered' when he said a long time ago when we first found out the roster he wanted to main him because he's cool and he fits his style of play
3. It gives people an excuse to yell about when they lose and this causes even more bad sportsmanship, its just rediculous to blame your loss on your opponent's character, but it happens, no matter how vastly obvious the gap between skill levels are between the two people. I mean, at least blame it on your controller...
4. tiers are just a popularity contest anyways, right? I mean, they are made by whichever character wins the most tournaments, so if a hundred times more people play as fox and enter tournaments with fox than people do with yoshi, then of course, odds are that there will be more people better with fox than yoshi
5. I dont really have a number 5, but its a good number to stop at
OK, just to clarify, I'm not insulting M2K, or Olimar, or Me14K, or smashville, or your pet dog, when I say 'screw tiers'. they only cause problems.
1. I mained shiek in melee, not because she was high tier or any of that, but because she was my favorite character and because she was a ****in awesome ninja, but then I find out years later about tiers and now everyone and their mother blames my wins and their losses on the character I choose, as if I have no real skills whatsoever
2. my best friend is having the same problem with brawl. regardless that there are no tiers yet in brawl, my friend is already being told that 'oh, well Lucario is just a cheap ***, hes overpowered' when he said a long time ago when we first found out the roster he wanted to main him because he's cool and he fits his style of play
3. It gives people an excuse to yell about when they lose and this causes even more bad sportsmanship, its just rediculous to blame your loss on your opponent's character, but it happens, no matter how vastly obvious the gap between skill levels are between the two people. I mean, at least blame it on your controller...
4. tiers are just a popularity contest anyways, right? I mean, they are made by whichever character wins the most tournaments, so if a hundred times more people play as fox and enter tournaments with fox than people do with yoshi, then of course, odds are that there will be more people better with fox than yoshi
5. I dont really have a number 5, but its a good number to stop at
Oceanborn
Smash Journeyman
I assume you're referring to the Textbook Combo? There's a whole thread about it, lol. Respectively (invented) by Textbook Ninja. Unforunately it's easy to counter, or at least, it is for more experienced players. It works sometimes though, even with them. Gotta love Oli's grab.
abit_rusty
Smash Lord
Was toying around with him to see what the hype around his pikmin throwing was all about...then I saw how I easily racked up 150+%in mere seconds with all of my pikmin latched onto an opponent....WOW...
Oli's pretty hardcore.
Oli's pretty hardcore.
Very nice posts Truth, defiantly worth my time. Although I think you yourself read into things a little too deeply, nothing wrong about that. *Starts stalking your posts*
When I first started using him it seemed fairly easy for me to play? Some people say he's tricky/difficult, and I feel the complete opposite. The only bigger irony is that all these people came to that conclusion after seeing me playing as him. xP
Maybe its just me or because of my previous obscure mains in Melee that make it easy.
(They were Peach, Ice, and Jiggly by the way.)
How did other Oli mainers first feel?
Also I know some tier lists have different rules as to the organization of characters, but for a generic one isn't the ease of a newcomer picking up the character calculated into it?
Defiantly not top tier, but very likely to land in high tier.
Someone mentioned broke tier... Whoever that was you do realize that Olimar (disregarding the fact he is a powerhouse) has average recovery and is the lightest character in the game?
At least that is how I see him being balanced out.
When I get smashed at like around sixty percent I always start my cursing chant "****! ****! ****! ****! ****!" (The "S" word for poop.)
When I first started using him it seemed fairly easy for me to play? Some people say he's tricky/difficult, and I feel the complete opposite. The only bigger irony is that all these people came to that conclusion after seeing me playing as him. xP
Maybe its just me or because of my previous obscure mains in Melee that make it easy.
(They were Peach, Ice, and Jiggly by the way.)
How did other Oli mainers first feel?
Also I know some tier lists have different rules as to the organization of characters, but for a generic one isn't the ease of a newcomer picking up the character calculated into it?
Defiantly not top tier, but very likely to land in high tier.
Someone mentioned broke tier... Whoever that was you do realize that Olimar (disregarding the fact he is a powerhouse) has average recovery and is the lightest character in the game?
At least that is how I see him being balanced out.
When I get smashed at like around sixty percent I always start my cursing chant "****! ****! ****! ****! ****!" (The "S" word for poop.)
TrueRedemption
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Mar 26, 2007
- Messages
- 278
Actualy Mcnichoj I was similar, i felt very comfortable with Oli at 12:25 that sunday morning, well to be fair as comfortable with him as any characters in a slightly more floaty world thay I'd ever known. I'll have to admit though, its probably due to my slightly OCD prowling of these boards, Echo's guide certainly helped a great bit for that and really just general discussion and videos, so maybe me naturally picking up Olimar wasn't so natural at all. I also played a lot of peach in SSBM, so that could be part of it, a broader sense of timing. Unfortunately though last I saw ease in picking up a character was not considered in tier list status, honestly with all the incessant mostly unintelligent debate going on in all the forums I'm allowed to see, I figure I'll just wait till we get something official, and listen to the justification provided then. (I'm assuming theres some nice respectful intelligent thread in the back room that I'm not able to see =( ) Just a clarification issue as well, Olimar has surprising weight about him, not the lightest character in the game by any means, part of what makes him... weird. I'm not certain, not finding the post quickly right now that had character weights, but I believe olimar is actually the same weight class as mario, middle of the pack ish. Olimars recovery however is certainly a balancing factor for his range, which sorta makes sense, if your the best at keeping them away your not gonna be good at getting back once they get to you. To wrap things up though back on topic, the majority of the tier list is determined by current meta game and tournament results, meaning we quite literally determine where Olimar ends up on the tier list. Yeah, you, me, anyone reading this fighting with or against Olimar. And just like many other things in the world, if you start off poorly and have to play catchup its a lot harder than starting at the top, lets make olimar look good, cause he is good, and cause we enjoy being successful with him =)
-True
-True
Odd thing is, I wasn't really planning on using Oli. Sure I saw the Gimpy matches back when he first got them up but I was too busy paying attention to MK.
Also, I want to take back the weight thing, I think the amount of Pikmins in his "tail" alter how far he gets knocked back. Need to do testing.
Also, I want to take back the weight thing, I think the amount of Pikmins in his "tail" alter how far he gets knocked back. Need to do testing.
Rhyme
Smash Lord
I'll give you a perfect example of the validity of tiers and then maybe you'll think differently.
I went to Smashtaclysm in CT, arrived on time and played ALL day which was awesome. I was a Samus main back in Melee, and that whole first day I played about 80% of all my matches as Samus as practice for the upcoming pools and tournament.
The following day I sat down at a setup with this random dude I'd been talking with the day before and we were soon joined by Vidjo and shortly after Cactuar. I got to play at least a dozen matches against Vidjo's Peach with my Samus. After about four matches, I switched to Marth, and he selected Dreamland64. (It's important to know that I'm not a Marth player and haven't played Marth in at least a month, probably more.) I did better as Marth--on one of Peach's best levels--than I did in any of my ten other matches with Samus. Also keep in mind that Vidjo must play MANY different Marths and KNOWS the matchup, while I'm sure he plays far fewer if any Samuses and probably doesn't know that matchup very well.
So as you can see, I did better using a character who I rarely use, a character who a pro knows how to fight against, than a character who is my main and who he probably doesn't play against many of. And I attribute this to exactly one reason: Marth is high tier.
Players should have every right to complain about tiers because they also have the right to use tiers in their own favor. Tiers exist. I truthfully do not care if that makes me sound elitist for I sleep better at night knowing that I'm right.
Ch0zen0ne
Smash Lord
Discuss .
This is nothing new, but at least he continues to be honest.
So stop being such a butthole please?
by far the best post in my short stay here
SKEET SHADY
Smash Journeyman
Once again, my vote is to put Olimar in the broken tier.
CommanderC00L
Smash Cadet
Olimar is borderline... I think I saw him driving a car with a rainbow flag on the antenna =/
Arash
Smash Lord
i'm with m2k, this thread is made of fail.
lots of people say lots of things about tiers right now, but there are two things to remember about any game's tier list..
1. tier lists cannot be made within 3 months or so without being incredibly inaccurate.
2. tier lists are usually based on tournament performance / character potential. if olimar does end up top tier but nobody can win with him, then of course he's going to get moved down.
lots of people say lots of things about tiers right now, but there are two things to remember about any game's tier list..
1. tier lists cannot be made within 3 months or so without being incredibly inaccurate.
2. tier lists are usually based on tournament performance / character potential. if olimar does end up top tier but nobody can win with him, then of course he's going to get moved down.
Ch0zen0ne
Smash Lord
JonnyManya
Smash Apprentice
Olimar in my opinion, is deffentily not top tier.
He's easy to juggle, easy to KO, and you could easily get rid of the Pikmin if Olimar throws them at you.
There are way other characters out there who could be Top Tier right now, nobody can make a "Offical Tier List" after a few months of playing the game.
He's easy to juggle, easy to KO, and you could easily get rid of the Pikmin if Olimar throws them at you.
There are way other characters out there who could be Top Tier right now, nobody can make a "Offical Tier List" after a few months of playing the game.
scalpel
Smash Journeyman
I believe Olimar will be considered a top tier character, for all of the reasons already mentioned. The only reason that potentially rules out Olimar from being a top tier character is his recovery, as everyone has already said. In spite of that, I still believe Olimar is a top tier character. I just see too many pros about Olimar to not acknowledge him as a high, if not, HIGHEST tier character.
Sinistar
Smash Journeyman
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!
Olimar I think is overrated <_<. His smashes do come out very fast and he does have huge range on them, but his recovery being tether based and Pikmen related I think makes a huge weakness when combined with the fact that he's a light weight. You don't have to knock him completely off the stage, but just enough to have time to grab the ledge. If he hits you with his Up B while you're on the ledge, he's not going to grab it. By "top tier" you'd say he's probably the best character in the game or ties with someone for that which he's not >_>. People just don't know how to deal with him ~_~.