Social Lower Norfair

[NintenRob]

My Top 2 are Skull Kid and Bandana Dee, Ridley was 3.

Things are actually looking pretty good so far.

 

[Aetheri]

I already got Dark Samus and Ridley so I got two out of my Top 3 newcomers. Unfortunately Midna was confirmed as an assist so there's not much hope for her to be playable. Unless the unlikely scenario of her Twili form being an echo of Zelda happens.

Other than them Crash Bandicoot, Elma and Impa are relatively high wants. Cautiously optimistic for all three.

 

[Diem]

The thing to keep in mind about newcomers is that the final project plan for Smash Ultimate was finished in December 2015. Stuff like Skyrim and Crash Bandicoot on Switch probably weren't even in talks by then. Also, it seems that newcomers are heavily based off the ballot results (hence King K. Rool and Ridley), so characters like Elma who were new and wouldn't have much support at that time are also unlikely.

As DLC? Anything is possible. Sakurai is said that their plans for post-launch content are blank, since they're currently just focusing on the base game until it's done. Maybe they'll do a second ballot for DLC and we'll get characters from the last three to four years who wouldn't have otherwise gotten support during the ballot. But right now, adjust your hopes for characters from 2015 and earlier, and make your voices heard once DLC plans begin.

That's why Waluigi isn't in the game. Because his support is due to becoming a meme in 2016 or so, after the ballot and project plan were in the works. People were certain (and some still are, bafflingly) that he would be a playable character because of his support in recent years, but it was too recent for it to have an impact.

 

[Arcanir]

So does anyone here have a 2nd newcomer they're hoping for? I'm rooting for Elma.

Technically third, but I'm hoping for Elma as well.

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

My top 2 was Ridley and Pig Ganon. Still waiting on him though.
Also found this, thought the humanization was cute.
https://kira-vera.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F176977217798

 

[Aeon Lupin]

The thing to keep in mind about newcomers is that the final project plan for Smash Ultimate was finished in December 2015. Stuff like Skyrim and Crash Bandicoot on Switch probably weren't even in talks by then. Also, it seems that newcomers are heavily based off the ballot results (hence King K. Rool and Ridley), so characters like Elma who were new and wouldn't have much support at that time are also unlikely.

As DLC? Anything is possible. Sakurai is said that their plans for post-launch content are blank, since they're currently just focusing on the base game until it's done. Maybe they'll do a second ballot for DLC and we'll get characters from the last three to four years who wouldn't have otherwise gotten support during the ballot. But right now, adjust your hopes for characters from 2015 and earlier, and make your voices heard once DLC plans begin.

That's why Waluigi isn't in the game. Because his support is due to becoming a meme in 2016 or so, after the ballot and project plan were in the works. People were certain (and some still are, bafflingly) that he would be a playable character because of his support in recent years, but it was too recent for it to have an impact.

I think in the case of someone like Waluigi, he'd need to have overwhelming support to be even considered for the roster, as he is just not that significant of a character. That said, while I do think the Ballot heavily influenced many newcomers, I believe there is at least one more newcomer that was Sakurai's decision. He has really good judgement, and knows who people would respond well to, even if no one really asked for them. Greninja immediately comes to mind.

 

[CrowGoesCaw]

With my most wanted Ridley in, I'd be fine with not getting another of my wanted characters in. (Even if Midna still being an assist makes me a little sad)

But my most wanted of those not already shown to not be playable, is Shantae. I hadn't thought she could get in, but shovel knight being an assist trophy has me reconsider.

During the ballot Shantae and Shovel Knight were generally neck and neck on fan polls. And she's more popular in japan than shovel knight. It would seem odd to me if one gets something and the other doesn't. So maybe she'll be playable. Or also an assist trophy, which I'd be happy with too.


Eitherway though, Ridley will be my main.

 

[Diem]

I think in the case of someone like Waluigi, he'd need to have overwhelming support to be even considered for the roster, as he is just not that significant of a character. That said, while I do think the Ballot heavily influenced many newcomers, I believe there is at least one more newcomer that was Sakurai's decision. He has really good judgement, and knows who people would respond well to, even if no one really asked for them. Greninja immediately comes to mind.

His overwhelming support isn't on places here like Smashboards and stuff. It's more like on YouTube and other more casual places, because he's just seen as a meme because he's a weird character. Very few people have a genuine emotional attachment to the character. They definitely exist, but they're the minority. It got to the point, though, that Reggie confirmed that Sakurai is aware of the "demand," so he might show up as DLC, or at least in the next game, whenever and whatever that is.

Yep, Sakurai's good at giving people what they didn't know they wanted, like the stage transition feature. No one even thought of that, but Sakurai did, and everyone was blown away by it (except for those who complained that you can only select two stages). And the weirder character picks, like Game & Watch, R.O.B., etc. I really wanted Dark Samus in Brawl, but we got R.O.B., who I would've never considered, and he became my main for a long time.

We'll have to see who the final characters are, though, before we know if Sakurai made a pick of his own or not. I think Smash 4's vanilla newcomers were mostly underwhelming, save for Mega Man. Not bad picks, but nothing that made people go nuts until the DLC. Maybe Inkling was the least surprising/mindblowing reveal, but generally every character has made some large demographics jump out of their seats. Any weird/unpopular pick at this point would just be disappointing.

Which is why I'm still skeptical of a Gen 7 Pokémon. Vergeben says it'll happen, a lot of people expect it to happen, but Gen 7 wasn't even announced in 2015 when the ballot was ongoing. Decidueye or Lycanroc seem to be the most popular picks, but Vergeben says that it isn't them. People are offering Tapu Koko as a possibility, but that's going to be underwhelming as hell compared to everyone else. Hopefully Vergeben is being fed false information on that one, but he's been right about everything so far.

 

[StormC]

Which is why I'm still skeptical of a Gen 7 Pokémon. Vergeben says it'll happen, a lot of people expect it to happen, but Gen 7 wasn't even announced in 2015 when the ballot was ongoing. Decidueye or Lycanroc seem to be the most popular picks, but Vergeben says that it isn't them. People are offering Tapu Koko as a possibility, but that's going to be underwhelming as hell compared to everyone else. Hopefully Vergeben is being fed false information on that one, but he's been right about everything so far.

I'm pretty sure it's Incineroar, given that Ash was in his concept art, so TPC would definitely suggest him to Sakurai in late 2015.

He has some haters but overall I think he would be a pretty neutral addition in terms of hype.

 

[soviet prince]

I'm pretty sure it's Incineroar, given that Ash was in his concept art, so TPC would definitely suggest him to Sakurai in late 2015.

He has some haters but overall I think he would be a pretty neutral addition in terms of hype.

hope not, incineroar is just awful

 

[NintenRob]

hope not, incineroar is just awful

Agreed, it baffles me that thing has somehow gained a following, it was probably the most hated of the three starters when it was first seen.

How Kitten became that I have no idea

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

I kind of want Primarina...

 

[NintenRob]

While I really like Decidueye, I think Tapu Koko should / will be our new Pokemon

 

[soviet prince]

Agreed, it baffles me that thing has somehow gained a following, it was probably the most hated of the three starters when it was first seen.

How Kitten became that I have no idea

I loved the first two evolution then we get that thing that looks nothing alike the first two.

 

[Rizen]

I'm boarding the Incineroar hate train, choo choo. Never liked the design.

What's the deal with this social having 100+ pages when most others are dead? Katamari effect?

 

[Diem]

Incineroar is humorous in the fact that it's based off of wrestling, and its Z Move is called "Darkest Lariat," which equal parts hilarious and awesome. I picked him because it was the first Fire type since Gen III that I liked.

But as a Smash character? I think Decidueye would've been cooler, and also give us a Grass starter. Or Mimikyu, giving us a Ghost type. I wouldn't hate Incineroar, but I don't think it's the best choice at all.

What's the deal with this social having 100+ pages when most others are dead? Katamari effect?

New character that is also one of the most requested characters since the first game. Much more exciting and inviting to discussion than, say, the Dr. Mario social thread, where it's an old character and there's not much to discuss.

 

[AustarusIV]

What's the deal with this social having 100+ pages when most others are dead? Katamari effect?

This thread was already pretty huge prior to Ridley's confirmation, having close to 100 pages before the E3 Direct. Confirmed newcomer threads in general tend to be a lot more popular than veteran threads because they're what most people are excited for, and Ridley happens to be one of the most popular newcomers for this game because of how requested he was, with only K. Rool possibly superseding him in terms of hype.

 

[soviet prince]

anyone here have a buisness or school email I can use temp to sign up for resetera with ?

 

[IsmaR]

I'm assuming Incineroar would be another heavy/possibly a grappler, so I'd be happy from a gameplay perspective. Funny that there's a justified "too many evil heavies" bias for once.

Not my first/preferred choice by any means, but then again neither was Greninja. I would want to see them in action before passing judgment.

What's the deal with this social having 100+ pages when most others are dead? Katamari effect?

The funny thing being this is actually relatively tame compared to past versions of Ridley threads. Thousands of pages/multiple threads are the norm.

 

[IronWarrior94]

Eh, Incineroar has grown on me, but after hearing pitches for Topu Koko and Silvally as the possible Gen 7 rep, I don't think I would get too excited if Incineroar ends up being the confirmed pick.

 

[OmegaX5000]

I wouldn't really mind playing as Incineroar, having used one in Sun. But one thing that it would have to have is Flamethrower as its neutral special with its hilariously placed CROTCH FIRE!!! as well as its Z-Move Malicious Moonsault being the Final Smash, where it would trap opponents in the energy/fire-based wrestling ring and body slamming the opponents into submission/KO. Darkest Lariat would make for an interesting side special though, especially since it hilariously T-poses while spinning and engulfed in fire.

That's all I can really say on the matter of Incineroar, I used one in Sun, found it to be a good Pokémon and kind of forgot it existed until these leaks/rumors started circulating around it.

 

[vVv Rapture]

I'm super indifferent on Pokemon picks currently, there isn't a Pokemon I *need* and the game already has a bunch of Pkmn reps as it is.

 

[Cosmic77]

Had to check this thread's title to make sure I didn't mistakenly click on a Pokemon support thread.

Honestly, most of the reasons why Incineroar isn't liked is our own fault. It started with us assuming he'd be another Fighting type. We hated him for that, and we were wrong. Then Smash gets announced, and everyone assumed Decidueye was the next closest thing to confirmed. Today, a lot of people are completely uninterested in speculating which Pokemon could get in Smash just because they feel pessimistic about Decidueye's chances and there aren't many other choices they genuinely care about. It's not Incineroar's fault you put all your eggs in one one basket. And finally, people write Incineroar off as a boring addition. Don't entirely disagree with this, but it's not fair to either Incineroar or Sakurai if you bash on something you haven't even seen yet.

Incineroar is far from my first choice too, but give him the benefit of the doubt. I warmed up to Greninja, so maybe I'll warm up to anthro wrestler cat too.


Regardless, this thread has nothing to do with Pokemon. Back to the topic of Ridley, which of the three non-Echo newcomers do you think would be Ridley's toughest and easiest match-ups? Personally, I'd say Simon and K. Rool respectively.

 

[OmegaX5000]

Yeah, we better get back on topic. I think that the Belmonts will be a tough matchup for Ridley, especially with their long range options thanks to their whips and projectiles. It'll really make using Ridley's fireballs even more risky than before since the Belmonts can hit from even farther than most characters. But then again, any character with a projectile will make that move risky to use, and we have no shortage of projectile users in the game already!

 

[Rizen]

The main reason I wouldn't want Incineroar in smash is there are a hundred better, more deserving pokemon.

TBH I don't think Ridley will be very good, unless he gets a stupidly powerful ding-dong combo. He looks balanced around his command grab, which is great for controlling space, then setting up gimps. But his fire looks slow and too risky for anything but long range pressure. His sweet spot tail move seems like a hard read, unless he can footstool into it or something. In general he seems like a big punching bag who will get walled hard.

 

[Diem]

Had to check this thread's title to make sure I didn't mistakenly click on a Pokemon support thread.

Honestly, most of the reasons why Incineroar isn't liked is our own fault. It started with us assuming he'd be another Fighting type. We hated him for that, and we were wrong. Then Smash gets announced, and everyone assumed Decidueye was the next closest thing to confirmed. Today, a lot of people are completely uninterested in speculating which Pokemon could get in Smash just because they feel pessimistic about Decidueye's chances and there aren't many other choices they genuinely care about. It's not Incineroar's fault you put all your eggs in one one basket. And finally, people write Incineroar off as a boring addition. Don't entirely disagree with this, but it's not fair to either Incineroar or Sakurai if you bash on something you haven't even seen yet.

Incineroar is far from my first choice too, but give him the benefit of the doubt. I warmed up to Greninja, so maybe I'll warm up to anthro wrestler cat too.

Regardless, this thread has nothing to do with Pokemon. Back to the topic of Ridley, which of the three non-Echo newcomers do you think would be Ridley's toughest and easiest match-ups? Personally, I'd say Simon and K. Rool respectively.

Yeah, there's not much to talk about regarding Ridley now that we're two months in and have seen pretty much all that we're gonna get to see until the next Direct at least, or release at most. But in the meantime, we can build camaraderie. Maybe a few pranks here and there. Who's hand are we going to stick in water while they're sleeping?

It will be really odd if Decidueye isn't in the game, because it's the most obvious choice. Grass type, archer-style, and a bird design. All of those are fairly unique not just within the Pokemon reps, but in Smash as a whole. It's the Greninja of Gen VII in terms of cool style and design that steals the thunder of the other two starters. So it makes sense that everyone assumed it would be that, and apparently all other popular choices are out of the running. Which is why I'm skeptical, because the announcement of an unpopular Pokemon beside Simon Belmont, King K. Rool, and Ridley would be a legendary drop in hype, especially with so many other huge requests on the table.

Yeah, we better get back on topic. I think that the Belmonts will be a tough matchup for Ridley, especially with their long range options thanks to their whips and projectiles. It'll really make using Ridley's fireballs even more risky than before since the Belmonts can hit from even farther than most characters. But then again, any character with a projectile will make that move risky to use, and we have no shortage of projectile users in the game already!

When I saw that the chain blocked Samus's missile, I was like "Oh nooooooo" since my new main is Dark Samus. But does it work against all projectiles? Would Ridley's fireballs go through them? Because Samus's missiles explode, but what would Ridley's fireballs do if they hit the chain?

Eh, they'll probably be blocked. Richter blocked Dracula's fire in the trailer. At least Ridley only has one projectile, and the rest of his moves are pretty good. But that whip is going to be a huge problem for large characters, that's for sure.

Started replaying Metroid Prime 3 last week, and boy Ridley is cool during the Norion mission. Makes me sad that his projectiles are just fireballs from the older games, and that we didn't get the plasma laser that Meta Ridley has.

 

[SmashingXan2]

So, let's try to revive this thread by asking a question: what was your Ridley theory movesets before he was announced. What moves did you think he would have, including final smash?

 

[AustarusIV]

Hot take: I’d much rather have Incineroar in as a playable character than Decidueye. Decidueye to me always came across as a very boring addition that most people only bandwagoned around because we apparently “needed” a Grass-type starter to complete the elemental trio. Incineroar is a lot more appealing to me because of the potential it holds as a Zangief-type wrestler, and as someone who likes playing as Bowser, Ridley, and Charizard, it holds a lot more appeal to me than Decidueye’s zoner playstyle, which is just plain boring to me.

The fact that it was my starter in SuMo is an extra bonus. But hey, all the power to your favorites if you want them, and I’m not really holding out for any Gen 7 Pokemon to get in at this point tbh.

 

[meleebrawler]

I think we're overblowing the risk of his fire breath a little. Sure it's kind of slow and you have to mind other projectiles when using it, but unless those projectiles are Sheik needles fast you shouldn't be getting blown up too often. And once the stream is going only powerful charged or transcendent projectiles will be getting through. I don't think getting "walled" will be a huge concern in most matchups with this in mind, along with his competent mobility, range and multiple jumps. Blocking a full charge fire breath is a bad idea since it is frame-positive for Ridley and gives him a chance to close in. Quite the opposite, I fear more the rushdown characters with even better frame data and mobility who can move uncomfortably close at an alarming rate and bypass his spacing and zoning. You know, like how beating Ridley in his 2D appearances comes down to being better with your offensive pressure than he is.

Simon & Richter dominate in mid-range for sure, but they're probably pretty slow and Ridley's fireballs outrange all of their options. I'd say it's even since they seem equally vulnerable to juggles.

When I saw that the chain blocked Samus's missile, I was like "Oh nooooooo" since my new main is Dark Samus. But does it work against all projectiles? Would Ridley's fireballs go through them? Because Samus's missiles explode, but what would Ridley's fireballs do if they hit the chain?

Eh, they'll probably be blocked. Richter blocked Dracula's fire in the trailer. At least Ridley only has one projectile, and the rest of his moves are pretty good. But that whip is going to be a huge problem for large characters, that's for sure.

Started replaying Metroid Prime 3 last week, and boy Ridley is cool during the Norion mission. Makes me sad that his projectiles are just fireballs from the older games, and that we didn't get the plasma laser that Meta Ridley has.

I'm currently playing through Super Castlevania IV that features the whip twirl, and you can destroy a lot of projectiles in that game with Simon's whip. It's a weak attack however (the twirl), so it's doubtful that damage is the reason for it being able to destroy projectiles in Smash without clanking.

Oh, and we get the laser breath in his final smash.

 

[Rizen]

When I saw that the chain blocked Samus's missile, I was like "Oh nooooooo" since my new main is Dark Samus. But does it work against all projectiles? Would Ridley's fireballs go through them? Because Samus's missiles explode, but what would Ridley's fireballs do if they hit the chain?

How it worked in SSB4 was if a projectile wasn't transcendent, and an attack with 8% (iirc) or more damage than it hit it the projectile would be canceled. Something like this is probably true in SSBU as well.

 

[RetroMetalSonic]

I kind of want Primarina...

Ah, and I thought that I was the only one who wanted Primarina. Good to know that I'm not alone.

 

[Giga Kaiju]

That is actually a good question now that some of you have mentioned it.

Regardless of tier lists and such selections. You guys think that Ridley might fare well against other characters? Would his size be a factor against him? Would there be ways to gain the upperhand as him against other characters?

Just some food for thought...

.

 

[soviet prince]

Had to check this thread's title to make sure I didn't mistakenly click on a Pokemon support thread.

Honestly, most of the reasons why Incineroar isn't liked is our own fault. It started with us assuming he'd be another Fighting type. We hated him for that, and we were wrong. Then Smash gets announced, and everyone assumed Decidueye was the next closest thing to confirmed. Today, a lot of people are completely uninterested in speculating which Pokemon could get in Smash just because they feel pessimistic about Decidueye's chances and there aren't many other choices they genuinely care about. It's not Incineroar's fault you put all your eggs in one one basket. And finally, people write Incineroar off as a boring addition. Don't entirely disagree with this, but it's not fair to either Incineroar or Sakurai if you bash on something you haven't even seen yet.

Incineroar is far from my first choice too, but give him the benefit of the doubt. I warmed up to Greninja, so maybe I'll warm up to anthro wrestler cat too.


Regardless, this thread has nothing to do with Pokemon. Back to the topic of Ridley, which of the three non-Echo newcomers do you think would be Ridley's toughest and easiest match-ups? Personally, I'd say Simon and K. Rool respectively.

I have seen him though, he design is ugly as hell

 

[Wiinner159]

Might as well throw my non-existent hat into the ring here, first off I'm not the biggest fan of Incineroar either, never cared for the fire starters oddly enough (big fan of burning things to ashes in games though) and I think his design is a bit meh. Personally would like Decidueye since I'm a grass starter guy and admittedly, because I want to see a solo grass starter mon in Ultimate (yeah it's not a good reason, I will acknowledge that).

Now that that's over with though might as well answer the question posed earlier. I think like all heavyweights Ridley will definitely struggle with some of the more combo-oriented fighters (so basically most of the cast) but I think his damage output and potential stage control with forcing people off the stage with the command grab can definitely help. His fireballs seem like they could be very useful for edgeguarding since he shoots out a good group of them and essentially drawing a short-lived line preventing recovery options that Ridley wouldn't be able to easily follow up on. I think the extra jumps too could definitely help him keep enemies offstage as much as possible while also reassuring Ridley's safe return back. And while the opinions on the move are all over the place his down b when used right could be extraordinarily useful, since it pretty much gives him the ability to set you into kill range from just one good read. Overall I'd guess that as it is, on a general tier list sort of thing I'd place Ridley a bit above average, there's not much so far that makes him look extremely good but he has some really nice tools to help mitigate the drawbacks of being a heavyweight, and quite honestly I'm fine with that, wouldn't want another Bayonetta on our hands would we?

 

[Spatman]

I'm pretty sure it's Incineroar, given that Ash was in his concept art, so TPC would definitely suggest him to Sakurai in late 2015.

He has some haters but overall I think he would be a pretty neutral addition in terms of hype.

Neutral in all aspects: a very boring and so underwhelming addition, imo.
Pokemon has to offer much more interesting concepts: Decidueye, PRIMARINA (!!!), Zeraora, a Tapu or a Tapu tag team, and surely there are also other possibilities.
But also a Sceptile, very relevantduring ballot days and the end of project plan

 

[IsmaR]

Moving things away from Pokemon for the sake of this being the Ridley thread and all, some more Ridley footage got uploaded by Nintendo.

Seems Ridley's side B has some interesting properties when used on/during either (or both) Stage Morph transitions and on uneven terrain like Brinstar.

 

[Cosmic77]

Seems Ridley's side B has some interesting properties when used on/during either (or both) Stage Morph transitions and on uneven terrain like Brinstar.

We also got to see something as rare and epic as this:

Sakurai wasn't kidding when he said it'd be easier to land with multiple players.

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

Man I'm hoping that Dark Samus and Ridley work together in Story Mode.
That or Dark Samus gets decloned in future Smashes.

 

[IsmaR]

Man I'm hoping that Dark Samus and Ridley work together in Story Mode.

Essentially, this exact scene should be recreated.

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

Essentially, this exact scene should be recreated.

So Ridley is Bucky in this context because of the whole parent murder thing?