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Social Link checked the thread. Wow! This is a nice thread!
- Thread starter Rizen
- Start date
Himura Kenshin
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Feb 2, 2015
- Messages
- 248
RIP one of the greatest years I've ever experienced.
Jason the Yoshi
Watching Me, Wanting Me
I'd say good riddance. My favorite sports team, the Minnesota Twins became the laughing stock in the 2016 season with the worst record in all of Major League Baseball.
What's worse is that Breath of the Wild is looking like a stereotypical Banjo Kazooie Nuts and Bolts.
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Rizen
Smash Legend
The next four years will get much worse.
Uncharted 4 is fun but more like an interactive movie than a game. I'll save some money and get Skyrim soon. I still need to finish Yoshi Woolly World too.
Edit, this thread's funny.
https://smashboards.com/threads/cheap-vs-overpowered.444467/#post-21602960
Uncharted 4 is fun but more like an interactive movie than a game. I'll save some money and get Skyrim soon. I still need to finish Yoshi Woolly World too.
Edit, this thread's funny.
https://smashboards.com/threads/cheap-vs-overpowered.444467/#post-21602960
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TDK
Smash Master
So in Radiant Dawn I was looking at the wiki to see how to recruit characters in each chapter and it turned out I missed a character called Meg, so I was debating resetting.
...then I saw Meg's stats and growths and decided to just continue with the game.
...then I saw Meg's stats and growths and decided to just continue with the game.
Himura Kenshin
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Feb 2, 2015
- Messages
- 248
My team is Cleveland, so 16 was great. Trump is president so that makes it all the more sweeter. I also got engaged, so there's that. 2016 is my favorite year so far.
Rizen
Smash Legend
Congrats on getting engaged but Trump is a maniac who got in by Russian hacking influencing the election. He denies our CIA and FBI intelligence agencies information on it. He has no prior political experience. He claims to be a businessman but filed his Casinos for bankruptcy four times. He's made racist comments about a judge because of his Mexican heritage. Insulted parents of a Muslim army officer, had his real estate company sued twice for racial discrimination, been endorsed by the KKK and refused to condemn them, spread the birtherism conspiracy about Obama then denied it later, and several other racist things. Said Mexico is bringing drugs, crime and rapists to the USA. He's made numerous sexist comments and had lawsuits around them including calling them "fat pigs, dogs, slobs and disgusting animals". Tried to sexually assault married women when he was married as proven by this tape of him. He wants to get rid of net neutrality. He denies climate change. Trump's VP wants creationism taught in public schools. His cabinet is filled with the richest, most corrupt people in the USA despite him claiming to "drain the swamp". His secretary of education is against public education and supports child labor. His wife plagiarized a speech from first lady Michelle Obama. Trump is against people from other countries working illegally in the USA even though his wife did it in 1996. Trump never released his tax returns that all other presidents since Nixon had. Trump threatened per-emptive strikes against North Korea on Twitter. He's already backed away from his (insane) campaign promises to his followers. His university has had civil fraud lawsuits. He used $250,000 in charity money to settle his lawsuits. Trump says he doesn't need daily intelligence briefings presidents get because he "is a pretty smart guy". The house GOP tried to get rid of independent ethics office. Clinton even won the popular vote by over 2 million votes.
He's an insane narcissist. He's incompetent to manage even a freaking restaurant. He cons people, pathologically lies and thinks he's above everyone else. He's dumb as s***. He's a racist, sexist, xenophobic, maniac. His administration is strait fascism in many regards like ignoring intelligence, discriminating against specific religions, genders, races, trying to alter the government structure to give them more power, abusing government positions for personal gain. I say all this, with sources and without hyperbole. This is the biggest attack on democracy and science in US history!
Rizen
Smash Legend
Sounds like a low budget soap opera doesn't it?
Trump Towers
Melania: "Oh Donald, how could you?! You promised to be faithful and now I find you lusting after another wife's womanhood?"
Audience: "Ooooooooooo"
Donald: "Oh Melania, my love I made a grievous mistake. But you don't know how hard it is being god's gift to women, nay all of America. Can you ever forgive me?"
Melania: "Oh dahling, I forgive you!"
[Cue kissing]
Audience: "Awwwwwwwwwww"
Melania: "But Donald, the election! How will your public react to this?!"
Donald: "Don't worry Ivana- I mean Melania. I could shoot somebody and I wouldn't lose voters."
Donald winks at the camera.
[Cue laugh track and fade out.]
Roll credits.
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Jason the Yoshi
Watching Me, Wanting Me
I got engaged in 2016 too. I just don't consider it a good year because my dad passed away in February.
But as far as 2017 goes for baseball, I think it's going to be a World Series between the Rangers and Pirates.
And no good is going to come from that racist ******* being president, I'll tell you that much.
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Rizen
Smash Legend
^I'm pretending I didn't hear that.
Anyone know the band Queensryche? I found them recently and kind of like 'Chasing Blue Skies' and 'Miles Away'. DF might know them. I'm checking out more of their songs.
I vote we bring the 'no politics' rule back in. This is exactly why it was brought in after all.
Jason the Yoshi
Watching Me, Wanting Me
I second that. It's like they always say, EVERYONE has something that they disagree with you about.
Heck, I can't even talk politics with my mom.
Rizen
Smash Legend
Fine. Want to see a doggy say "I love you"?
Jason the Yoshi
Watching Me, Wanting Me
I'm trying to get myself to playing Twilight Princess again, but I'm too busy listening to 80's rock music with my fiancée lately.
And on top of that, my fiancée's probably gonna need my help with the Shadow Temple pretty soon.
And on top of that, my fiancée's probably gonna need my help with the Shadow Temple pretty soon.
Rizen
Smash Legend
Jason the Yoshi
Watching Me, Wanting Me
Mostly just Bon Jovi and Boston.
Rizen
Smash Legend
I like me some 'Blaze of Glory'. I haven't heard Boston; I'll check them out.
TDK
Smash Master
You guys are listening to music older than I am
Himura Kenshin
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Feb 2, 2015
- Messages
- 248
At least politics made this place active again. For a few weeks there was like 0 posts
Karaoke Man
Smash Apprentice
Yoo, I'm actually from Cleveland too.
Himura Kenshin
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Feb 2, 2015
- Messages
- 248
WHAT ARE THE ODDS?
Roughly 97/1,850,000.
Jason the Yoshi
Watching Me, Wanting Me
Hey, don't rub it in. I've only met 3 people in SmashBoards from my home state of Minnesota.
Speaking of which, I bet it's colder up here than it is in the mountains of Snowhead before the fall of Goht.
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8MAN
Smash Apprentice
I've been wondering lately, which character has the best zair? Samus's beam has good reach and can hit grounded opponents pretty well, Gay's hookshot has no landing lag, and ZSS and Lucas's aerial mobility let them use it to poke or retreat.
Rizen
Smash Legend
All Zairs have 8 frames of landing lag. ZSS's Zair is the best, starts frame 9, 2 hits for 3 then 6%. It's long, unlike TL/Lucas' and has the best damage. Link's Zair starts frame 12 and hits 2x for 2.5 then 4%. Because everybody knows Link and Samus are much better characters than ZSS and needed weaker Zairs to compensate
I got Skyrim, super fun game.
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JayE
Smash Journeyman
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- NNID
- PinoyPlayerJ
- 3DS FC
- 2982-0290-3968
I figured ZSS zair was the best... although zairs are pretty good in general. And Link's has two hits I thinkAll Zairs have 8 frames of landing lag. ZSS's Zair is the best, starts frame 9, 2 hits for 3 then 6%. It's long, unlike TL/Lucas' and has the best damage. Link's Zair starts frame 12 and hits 2x for 2.5 then 4%. Because everybody knows Link and Samus are much better characters than ZSS and needed weaker Zairs to compensate
For zairs, the actual frame that they can hit after extension begins (i.e. zss f9) is less important than how fast they fully extend. This is because you want to space a zair and hit at the tip, especially for zairs that sweetspot at the tip. the only way to get that f9 hitbox is to jump then fall right next to the opponent and start a zair, which isn't reasonable or safe unless you're doing it to the back of a large framed character's shield (Marss vs Raffi). The ordering for zair full extension times from shortest to longest is:
Lucas>Samus>ZSS>Tink>Link
Zair range, longest to shortest:
Samus>ZSS>Link>Lucas>Tink
The Metroid zairs extend quickly over long ranges which make them ideal for spacing. The speed on Lucas' zair extension plus low SH means he can SH rising zair some standing opponents as opposed to all of the other zairs.
Samus has the best zair for spacing because of this and the fact that the tip, like Link's, is multihit so it can't be powershielded, which IMO potentially gives it more utility than ZSS' zair. It also combos into dash attack at low percents for lots of damage and easy CS tech chases at kill percents. However, ZSS is very fast and can confirm boost kick off of zair at high percents, her zair does 6% and it's just a little slower to extend than Samus's zair and has good range, so it's also very good at spacing. The extra damage on her zair means that if she catches an opponent near the blastzone while edge guarding with it, it will kill. It's probably the best.
It doesn't seem like the other zairs have as much followup potential. If I had to make a zair ranking:
ZSS > Samus >> Lucas > Link > Tink
Lucas>Samus>ZSS>Tink>Link
Zair range, longest to shortest:
Samus>ZSS>Link>Lucas>Tink
The Metroid zairs extend quickly over long ranges which make them ideal for spacing. The speed on Lucas' zair extension plus low SH means he can SH rising zair some standing opponents as opposed to all of the other zairs.
Samus has the best zair for spacing because of this and the fact that the tip, like Link's, is multihit so it can't be powershielded, which IMO potentially gives it more utility than ZSS' zair. It also combos into dash attack at low percents for lots of damage and easy CS tech chases at kill percents. However, ZSS is very fast and can confirm boost kick off of zair at high percents, her zair does 6% and it's just a little slower to extend than Samus's zair and has good range, so it's also very good at spacing. The extra damage on her zair means that if she catches an opponent near the blastzone while edge guarding with it, it will kill. It's probably the best.
It doesn't seem like the other zairs have as much followup potential. If I had to make a zair ranking:
ZSS > Samus >> Lucas > Link > Tink
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Rizen
Smash Legend
IMO it's more like ZSS>Samus/Link/Lucas>TL. ZSS has the best. Vanilla Samus has better frame data but worse damage by 2% total than Link/Lucas' (4.5% vs 6.5/6.8%). Samus's DA a good move and helps make that combo. Lucas' Dair not reaching as far means he can't harass long sword esc characters like Marth/Rosa etc as well. Link trades worse frame data for both length and damage. TL's is the worst with short reach and only 1 hit for 4% starting frame 11.
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Actually, Lucas' zair has deceptive range and it's almost as good as Link's.
I think the separation between ZSS and Samus is slight and that the separation between those two and the rest is significant.
ZSS would be unique in her ability to get consistent followups off of zair because of her speed, but Samus's dash attack mobility burst, the speed of CS, and the speed/range of zair give Samus followups at most percents. At low percents it combos into dash attack, at high percents it combos into another zair, but the main thing it has is forcing tech chases at 80-130 depending on floatier vs fast faller.CS covers tech roll in, out, regular tech, and no tech unless the opponent picks the right option with the perfect timing. There's a "golden percent" like with sour ftilt and jab combo where CS will always hit from a zair tech chase because it was designed with the perfect speed.
This is better than what ZSS gets off of zair, the difference for me though is that ZSS can mixup zair with three other safe on shield options plus her mobility plus her grab and paralyzer, and her jab is f1 and can cover whiffs and blocks with zair...
Their zairs being electric give them more hitstun than the others, and Samus's zair has the most range by a fairly large margin while also extending very fast and being un-powershieldable. It lets her get advantage extensions as well since she can get a ranged hitbox out much faster than if she had run (for instance, covering off stage options without actually jumping off stage). It seems like Samus's zair has a very generous hitbox size compared to the others, but I don't have a way of testing that.
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Rizen
Smash Legend
I wasn't aware electric attacks had more hitstun. That helps make up for Samus' lower damage.
Link's Zair has good reach, as long as shulk's Fsmash. I couldn't find Samus' and can't directly compare them.
https://youtu.be/zheUdc5bIPI?t=132
If we're going by their full Zair game and not just the move, Samus probably has the best. ZSS doesn't use Zair as her main combo starter and like you said Samus' charged shot is a great tech-chase kill move.
Don't underestimate Link though, he has 2 important things that other characters don't: a 90% fall speed increase FF and bombs. Link's the only character who can plant a 'detection hitbox' on his feet when he Zairs (TL's bombs explode when they hit the ground). FF makes it so Zair can cover a large vertical area quickly and Link can FF>airdodge from high over the stage and tether the ledge like no other.
Link has some combos from Zair but I'm not sure which are true.
Fox Is Openly Deceptive
might be able to help with that one. Link's ground spin attack is frame 8 and can be done from a dash.
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I wrote a bunch of stuff that I never actually bothered to post in the meta, instead I just inserted it directly into the meta OP. So under all the moves for example (though there are other sections you will find it in too), you'll see all this text outside of spoiler-quotes, and it adds up to being kind of like a guide of sorts. Anyway,I wasn't aware electric attacks had more hitstun. That helps make up for Samus' lower damage.
Link's Zair has good reach, as long as shulk's Fsmash. I couldn't find Samus' and can't directly compare them.
https://youtu.be/zheUdc5bIPI?t=132
If we're going by their full Zair game and not just the move, Samus probably has the best. ZSS doesn't use Zair as her main combo starter and like you said Samus' charged shot is a great tech-chase kill move.
Don't underestimate Link though, he has 2 important things that other characters don't: a 90% fall speed increase FF and bombs. Link's the only character who can plant a 'detection hitbox' on his feet when he Zairs (TL's bombs explode when they hit the ground). FF makes it so Zair can cover a large vertical area quickly and Link can FF>airdodge from high over the stage and tether the ledge like no other.
Link has some combos from Zair but I'm not sure which are true.
here's a snippet taken from the Zair write-up:
While the first hitbox of Zair can combo into things if used at close range, this is usually a bad idea due to how ineffective the first hitbox of Zair is on shield, the fact that you do in fact have landing lag even if it isn't much, and also due to the fact that the first hitbox of Zair is very small and comes out from the middle of Link, meaning that Zair has a blind-spot beneath Link such that if your opponent challenges you from below they will win. If you want to combo out of it you have to commit to using it as a combo tool rather than a spacing tool, because of course you will land soon after Zair comes out. And in the end, we're talking about an extra 2.5% here; most of the time you would have been better off simply not using anything in the air and just FFing instead of committing to the Zair. Having said that, up-close Zair will combo slightly better as the percents get higher, and so there is the very real possibility of comboing into F-smash, and before that things like D-tilt and D-smash, for what it's worth, which isn't much I would stress.
Kirby Phelps (PK)
Smash Journeyman
Yo...um...so, how do you escape Link's down throw into up smash combo? My friend keeps doing it to me and I can't escape it...
Depends on your character. There is no one trick fits all. And sometimes you can't.
JayE
Smash Journeyman
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well at higher percents it just won't work. If you're a fastfaller its harder to get out, but my opponents have jumped out of the down throw and avoided the down smash. I guess you just have to be quick enough. And I don't think you can interrupt the combo with an aerial, I could be wrong
He said USmash, not DSmash. DSmash sucks out of DThrow.
Kirby Phelps (PK)
Smash Journeyman
I was using Ness and Shulk. On that note, Shulk just doesn't seem to do well against Link in general. It's impossible to get in.