Lie Detector: Death Note l OVER l Unfortunately they won't be making an appearance...

[The Real Gamer]

Lets get some activity going the more we communicate and work together the harder it is for Kira to hide and not risk making a mistake.

Badwolf is the only player not contributing.

Badwolf is most likely Kira.

Discuss.

 

[Handorin]

Badwolf hasn't really been active on the boards at all the past couple days. He only liked your post today. He isn't the player who would stay logged out to play. Little information is gleaned.

Next.

 

[The Real Gamer]

Who's your scum read so far then?

 

[The Phazon Assassin]

Just out of curiosity, how are we supposed to get Kira to "waste his guesses?" No matter what we do, he's not going to throw them away based on whatever we claim. At best, he takes one chance and sees how it flips, and if it's fails, he'll probably think that everyone lied about their name. I feel like we're the ones who're going to act first. Otherwise, it'll be a stalemate.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Once the identity of Kira is revealed, the detectives win.

That doesn't mean that we don't win in case Kira loses. If Kira loses but the town doesn't ID him - is it a draw?

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Just out of curiosity, how are we supposed to get Kira to "waste his guesses?" No matter what we do, he's not going to throw them away based on whatever we claim.

Well, I for one have openly revealed myself to be Bill Jones. Since Kira didn't kill me yet some possibilities appear to be more likely than others to me now.

 

[Handorin]

The game is simple:
Who is wearing a watch?

 

[BSL]

If only it were actually that simple, Handorin

Gheb, based on the mod's answer to your previous question I think it's safe to assume the only wincon we have is the one specified. If you'd like to keep this up we can wait on the answer to your clarified question, but let's move past it for now.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Actually, even if Kira whiffing his shots doesn't mean we win automatically, it still means that we are going to win eventually as we can put people on the lie detector with no further risk.

 

[BSL]

Ok, you're right.

But I don't want to play the game like that. I don't consider that playing the game, so let's decide as a group if we'll use Gheb's method or not.

Gheb's method: 1 (Gheb)
Not Gheb's method: 1(BSL)

 

[The Real Gamer]

I'm against I just want to play the game. Everyone's acting really timid right now.

 

[The Phazon Assassin]

Same here, someone's gotta take initiative. May as well be us.

 

[Xivii]

That doesn't mean that we don't win in case Kira loses. If Kira loses but the town doesn't ID him - is it a draw?

No, the game ends once a victory is obtained or there are no longer any possibilities for a victory.

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

Lets get some activity going the more we communicate and work together the harder it is for Kira to hide and not risk making a mistake.

Badwolf is the only player not contributing.

Badwolf is most likely Kira.

Discuss.

How exactly did you come to this conclusion? Why me? You did vote me first so, is it just an extension of that or what? What prompted you to vote me in the first place? (If you say RVS I'll blow your knees off with a shotgun)

I don't try to overload the thread with my posts but why is that a bad thing?

 

[The Real Gamer]

My general idea is to keep activity going. Like I said earlier the more that people post the more effort scum (Kira) has to put in to look like one of us, which means there's more opportunities for him to slip up. This is how I play Mafia at least honestly I'm not sure how effective that strategy would work in this game. That's the reason I prodded you at first.

The 2nd post you quoted was just an excuse to get some reactions out of people. I knew it was **** reasoning but like I said my main goal was just to get people talking. Unfortunately you and Hando were the only people who even bothered responding.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

My general idea is to keep activity going. Like I said earlier the more that people post the more effort scum (Kira) has to put in to look like one of us, which means there's more opportunities for him to slip up. This is how I play Mafia at least [...]

This isn't a mafia game and it's not like a mafia game. Kira doesn't know our identities, which means that he lacks the most fundamental advantage the mafiosi have in a mafia game. His wincondition isn't the same either. His goal is to find out who we are and then kill us, not to obtain a voting majority.

[...] the standard approach of a mafia game is reversed because Kira needs to find out who we are.

I'd still like to know why we're supposed to pretend this to be a mafia game and how that helps us to find out who Kira is. If people want to play this game different than how I suggested that's one thing but I'm not gonna let you guys do something stupid when I've come up with a plan that's at least viable. How are we going to win this game by approaching as if it were a mafia game? This question needs to be answered before I'll agree to any plan.

 

[BSL]

I agree with Gheb except for where he says his plan is viable.

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

I personally don't think that sitting passively could actually give us a decent lead on Kira, I think that we might have to sacrifice someone to see how exactly the mechanics work in our favor. I don't think that the first person we put on the DNA is going to be Kira, but I do think that it has to be done in order to get the game started almost.

Gheb, why exactly do you expect that Kira will try to use his kills without confirmation? It would make it very improbable to actually get one of us off of pure chance, and I personally wouldn't if I was him.

 

[The Real Gamer]

I'd still like to know why we're supposed to pretend this to be a mafia game and how that helps us to find out who Kira is. If people want to play this game different than how I suggested that's one thing but I'm not gonna let you guys do something stupid when I've come up with a plan that's at least viable. How are we going to win this game by approaching as if it were a mafia game? This question needs to be answered before I'll agree to any plan.

Because instead of focusing on how this game is different from standard Mafia I'm focusing on the similarities, and one of those similarities that benefits the town is information. Just like Day1 Mafia the more we communicate the more of an educated guess we could make if we ever have to put someone on the lie detector.

People keep saying there's no viable way to get information without connections available, and I say you're all wrong. Why? Cause just by communicating 2 pages into the game I'm already 80% sure Gheb isn't Kira and the reasoning is simple; everything he's been proposing goes directly against Kira's win condition. Think about it... In standard Mafia the only thing scum has to do during the day is simply survive until the night phase to perform night kills. But without night kills available in this game the only way Kira will be able to play to his win condition is to get people on the lie detector (literally anyone since there are no power roles to sniff out in this game) in any possible way he can. Gheb's philosophy towards this game so far goes directly against what Kira would want to do. If Gheb has actually been faking this whole time and he's Kira then I deserve to lose this game, but in this case I'm liking my chances.

So with Gheb out of the way (for now) there's only 5 people left on my radar... And just like that I've already directly put pressure on Kira without having to resort to putting someone on the lie detector. IMO this is how we're going to win this game; through communication, deductive reasoning, and process of elimination. Just like in Day1 Mafia the information needed to make the most educated guess possible is there... We're just going to have to dig harder in order to find what we need.

/my2cents

 

[Handorin]

I'm Kira. I'm not threatened from anything you just said.

 

[The Real Gamer]

Prob cause you aren't Kira.

At least Im throwing ideas out there. What have you been contributing exactly?

 

[Handorin]

Telling you that Kira won't be threatened by what you said. It's the wrong approach.

 

[Handorin]

Although it is quite telling of you.

 

[The Real Gamer]

Still waiting to hear what the "right" approach is.

 

[The Phazon Assassin]

@Gheb: In order to win, we have to put someone on the lie detector, preferably whoever we think is Kira. Like Badwolf said, we probably won't get him first shot, but as we narrow the field down, we'll get closer to catching him. Now, I'm not saying just go around throwing everyone up on the lie detector, but we need some type of action from Kira to really make any type of move. Otherwise, we're just spinning our wheel, not getting anywhere.

 

[Xivii]

Because instead of focusing on how this game is different from standard Mafia I'm focusing on the similarities, and one of those similarities that benefits the town is information. Just like Day1 Mafia the more we communicate the more of an educated guess we could make if we ever have to put someone on the lie detector.

No editing posts. Double posting is fine.

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

Because instead of focusing on how this game is different from standard Mafia I'm focusing on the similarities, and one of those similarities that benefits the town is information. Just like Day1 Mafia the more we communicate the more of an educated guess we could make if we ever have to put someone on the lie detector.

People keep saying there's no viable way to get information without connections available, and I say you're all wrong. Why? Cause just by communicating 2 pages into the game I'm already 80% sure Gheb isn't Kira and the reasoning is simple; everything he's been proposing goes directly against Kira's win condition. Think about it... In standard Mafia the only thing scum has to do during the day is simply survive until the night phase to perform night kills. But without night kills available in this game the only way Kira will be able to play to his win condition is to get people on the lie detector (literally anyone since there are no power roles to sniff out in this game) in any possible way he can. Gheb's philosophy towards this game so far goes directly against what Kira would want to do. If Gheb has actually been faking this whole time and he's Kira then I deserve to lose this game, but in this case I'm liking my chances.

So with Gheb out of the way (for now) there's only 5 people left on my radar... And just like that I've already directly put pressure on Kira without having to resort to putting someone on the lie detector. IMO this is how we're going to win this game; through communication, deductive reasoning, and process of elimination. Just like in Day1 Mafia the information needed to make the most educated guess possible is there... We're just going to have to dig harder in order to find what we need.

/my2cents

This right here is not pressure.

This is telling, but this is not pressure. Agree with Hando.

 

[The Real Gamer]

Hypothetical situation here Badwolf... lets say you are indeed Kira. I lay out my case on why we shouldn't put Gheb on the lie detector, which in effect narrows down our chances of IDing a dectecive this round from 6/7 to 5/7 (or chance to ID Kira goes from 1/7 to 1/6). In other words that makes one less dectective you have to hide behind.

Does this not in effect put Kira in a tighter position than before? If yes then how does that not qualify as pressure?

Maybe I'm not using the word pressure in the right context here idk.

 

[BSL]

There's no pressure, TRG, because every shot is a shot in the dark. When we put someone up there, if they aren't Kira, we gain NOTHING. Our next shot is another shot in the dark. Sure, the chances are better, but that doesn't benefit anything.

The tighter numbers don't equate to pressure because nothing but random chance is threatening Kira. That small amount of pressure offset by the fact that we're giving Kira names for him to win.


I'm still perplexed as to how we should go on.

 

[The Real Gamer]

Here's the thing though my idea doesn't involve puting someone on the lie detector. Instead of going straight for Kira we work on confirming town... working backwards as a means of process of elimination. We wouldn't be directly hunting for Kira per say we'd instead br focusing on limiting the amount of opportunities for Kira to hide.

 

[BSL]

How do you plan on confirming town, exactly?

 

[~ Gheb ~]

The whole pressure-apect of TRG's argument is pretty worthless. You can tell that an idea won't be successful when Hando can debunk it with semi-trollish one liners. I don't think anybody will slip up on anything under pressure, especially the mafia players.

But I can see the PoE part working out to some extent. And maybe a couple of things from mafia games *can* be used here. I'm pretty sure sheeping is still something we'd find suspicious and the fact that Kira will have to manipulate us into putting somebody on the detector might just be a source of tells to be dropped. Regardless, I still think that we should be conservative and avoid putting people on the detector. Trying to narrow down our lynchpool one by one and baiting misshots on the way is the safest thing we can do without doing nothing at all.

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

Hypothetical situation here Badwolf... lets say you are indeed Kira. I lay out my case on why we shouldn't put Gheb on the lie detector, which in effect narrows down our chances of IDing a dectecive this round from 6/7 to 5/7 (or chance to ID Kira goes from 1/7 to 1/6). In other words that makes one less dectective you have to hide behind.

Does this not in effect put Kira in a tighter position than before? If yes then how does that not qualify as pressure?

Maybe I'm not using the word pressure in the right context here idk.

No, because you're not sure of whether or not Gheb himself is Kira, while statistically not, it could be giving him one free kill PLUS assumption that he isn't Kira. He wouldn't even have to jump the wagon because the possibility of everyone else doing it. Effectively giving him town cred while still giving him a kill. IE, you're not giving pressure.

Other way around being that I'm Kira, why would I focus on only one subject? If people agreed with your Gheb case I would drop it. There wouldn't' be a point to continue down a road that would only give me bad cred in the future plus a possibility of losing the game because of the incorrect id of Gheb. IMO Kira won't be part of this game that much, he'll be watching but not actively participating until someone's about to be ID'd incorrectly.

#My2Cents

 

[Dabuz]

Soooooo

(Chew)

We out of that stage where no one can agree that we should do stuff for this game to advance yet?

 

[Handorin]

Vote BSL.

 

[BSL]

Soooooo

(Chew)

We out of that stage where no one can agree that we should do stuff for this game to advance yet?

Not as far as I can tell.

 

[Dabuz]

Not as far as I can tell.

Ok, I guess i'll check back in within a couple days.

 

[The Real Gamer]

No, because you're not sure of whether or not Gheb himself is Kira, while statistically not, it could be giving him one free kill PLUS assumption that he isn't Kira. He wouldn't even have to jump the wagon because the possibility of everyone else doing it. Effectively giving him town cred while still giving him a kill. IE, you're not giving pressure.

Other way around being that I'm Kira, why would I focus on only one subject? If people agreed with your Gheb case I would drop it. There wouldn't' be a point to continue down a road that would only give me bad cred in the future plus a possibility of losing the game because of the incorrect id of Gheb. IMO Kira won't be part of this game that much, he'll be watching but not actively participating until someone's about to be ID'd incorrectly.

#My2Cents

We've already clarified that the whole "pressure" aspect of my post was bad. I get it.

However I still think it's a legitimate plan in terms of limiting the amount of players Kira can hide behind.

Gheb already stated it might work... What does everyone else think?

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Everybody else doesn't think at all. They're just fish waiting to go with the flow.

But I really can see Badwolf as Kira.

Request Votecount

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

Everybody else doesn't think at all. They're just fish waiting to go with the flow.

But I really can see Badwolf as Kira.

Request Votecount

May I ask why?