Ivysaur League Graduates: The Ivysaur Social Thread

[TheReflexWonder]

Correct; it takes 22% of healing now.

 

[Meme]

Well, with the buffs she received it's sort of easier and safer to charge Sola Beam... at least to me

 

[TheReflexWonder]

It is, period. The hold-for-two% thing doesn't work as well because healing starts a little later, but the landing cancel, ability to fastfall, and pop-up hitbox all help significantly.

 

[bubbaking]

I've also noticed that there is now a reason to use each of her grabs. Ranges, both horizontal and vertical, and lag times have been tweaked. Her dash grab is still the best one, though, and her pivot grab is still second, but at least it's a start, and I don't feel like standing grabs are completely inferior anymore. Cool...

 

[choknater]

sup guys, i played 2.6 and this character feels really really good. subbing to this thread to talk about ivysaur

 

[Sol_Vent]

Correct; it takes 22% of healing now.

Please don't mistake this for a pointed question, but how much did it take before?

Unrelatedly, CPUs are amusingly bad at avoiding seed bomb. This is a fun thing.

 

[bubbaking]

Apparently, it took 18% before.

 

[MrBigstuff]

I'm absolutely loving the angled down B. Juggling with it is so much easier and I've gotten so many more kills with it off the top.

 

[TerryJ]

Yo. New to project M but I've been playing it for the past few days. The Bulbasaur line is my favorite and I picked Ivysaur up because of that. :D

I've got a few questions though. I haven't played Brawl in a years so I don't know where to go for skins. Is there a list of AT's somewhere? And how can I convert my replays into video?

Also, Ivysaur is a boss.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Ivysaur doesn't really have any ATs that aren't universal (wavedashing, L-Canceling, etc.).

As far as converting replays to video, you'll need a capture card for that. Most people looking to do it quick and dirty-like buy a Dazzle DVC100, as it's the cheapest you'll usually find (at $30-40).

 

[TerryJ]

Ivysaur doesn't really have any ATs that aren't universal (wavedashing, L-Canceling, etc.).

That's what I'm wondering though, what universal AT's are in PM? I know all the Melee ones but I don't know anything about Brawl AT's.

As far as converting replays to video, you'll need a capture card for that. Most people looking to do it quick and dirty-like buy a Dazzle DVC100, as it's the cheapest you'll usually find (at $30-40).

I was actually thinking about getting PM to run on my emulator and just putting the replay onto that and recording it. Main problem is though, I don't know how to get PM on Dolphin.

 

[SpiderMad]

That's what I'm wondering though, what universal AT's are in PM? I know all the Melee ones but I don't know anything about Brawl AT's.
.

People have made lists but RARing for one (Jumping backwards from a dash forward)

Universal
AGT http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=DwiQJbmy4Uk&t=55

http://smashboards.com/threads/item-jump-glitch-easter-egg.338484/#post-15672263


Semi-Universal (Distance-wise)
Glide Toss http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHcWCsLuAgc

Semi-Universal
DACUS http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5cy6uqC0Os

I was actually thinking about getting PM to run on my emulator and just putting the replay onto that and recording it. Main problem is though, I don't know how to get PM on Dolphin.

https://forums.dolphin-emu.org/Thread-updated-first-post-how-to-play-brawl-project-m-etc-unofficial
If you get a file save problem check this post
https://forums.dolphin-emu.org/Thre...project-m-etc-unofficial?pid=224278#pid224278

To get the replay on Dolphin you have to save it to your Wii, use this Homebrew App to extract the Savegame which will contain the replay: and then put that savegame into Dolphin. You can't just put the replay itself into Dolphin and get it to work sadly.
http://wiibrew.org/wiki/Savegame_Manager

Chances are you are lazy like me, and won't get this set-up though you said you would (maybe not even try); if that's true then just get a cheap capture card which is a bit less of a hassle (not really) or record your TV with a phone.
http://smashboards.com/threads/me-need-a-cheap-decent-quality-capture-card.337777/#post-15615539

http://smashboards.com/threads/wher...ion-video-thread.331656/page-15#post-15772931

 

[Swann]

Ivy still seems very polarizing. I spent a good part of today playing 2.something with a PMBRoomer and other friends and there was some serious salt being passed around, at times...

 

[TheReflexWonder]

I think she's alright. Probably mid tier now. Still pretty polarized on the whole.

Who'd have thought?

 

[Swann]

Obviously nobody of importance...

I'm surprised you think she's mid, at best. I don't know if we're playing the same character. Where/against whom does she struggle the most?

 

[TheReflexWonder]

Same characters as before. People who can make her move forward while still having a superior neutral game ruin her day. Marth, Sheik, Falco, Wolf...Maybe some of the traditionally projectile-y characters, like Link and Zero Suit Samus.

The thing is, she's still a lot like 2.1, but she has better combo opportunities now and is safer in specific positions. A lot of things end up being matchup inexperience, I think. Despite DK being a huge guy, Strong Bad has played me enough to know how to mitigate my combo options. Knowing how to (S)DI her stuff often turns a 60% combo into a 20-30% combo, and she's still not very good in neutral position, so I feel that once people understand how the matchup is played, things are going to go downhill for her. She just can't do enough to threaten people in neutral, so in the end, her changes primarily make her better against the characters she was already good against.

 

[Shiny Mewtwo aka Jigglysir]

Obviously nobody of importance...

I'm surprised you think she's mid, at best. I don't know if we're playing the same character. Where/against whom does she struggle the most?

Marth Falco Fox Falcon Lucas are her worst mathcups (out of matchups that I have experience in) imo

Well, except Sonic.

**** the Spring

**** Sonic

 

[Swann]

I could agree with most of that. I'd say I have the most trouble with Marth & Sheik, then Fox, Falcon, and Sonic (though not so much in 2.6... but really **** the spring). I honestly think that Falco/Wolf swings mostly in Ivy's favor if for nothing else than her outright gimp potential and ability to (for the most part) box these characters out.

I'm glad to hear you confirming a lot of what I was thinking last night: namely, that Ivy's punishes are only currently so crazy because nobody seemed to know how to DI them properly. I mean, lots of what I was hearing reminded me of, like, super-old, early-meta complaints vs. melee high tiers ("omg guise so broken").

I haven't reached a conclusion on Ivy in neutral. Can you elaborate? I feel like her projectiles combined with the ability to force an approach (synthesis) invalidate a lot of the traditional mindset toward the neutral position.

Offtopic: Bthrow->uair spike is hilarious

 

[Shiny Mewtwo aka Jigglysir]

Offtopic: Bthrow->uair spike is hilarious

Uair spike in general is hilarious.

 

[TreK]

Yo, just picked up PM, and Ivy is the main reason for it. (I'm a Brawl Diddy main, but PM's Diddy is... ugh...)
Just wanted to say hi to the other Ivies :V

 

[bubbaking]

I've got a few questions though. I haven't played Brawl in a years so I don't know where to go for skins. Is there a list of AT's somewhere? And how can I convert my replays into video?

What SpiderMad said. Also, there are B-reversals and reverse B-revesals (RBR), also called wavebounces.

Ivysaur doesn't really have any ATs that aren't universal (wavedashing, L-Canceling, etc.).

Well, I would think that land-cancelled SHFF nB's are an AT for Ivy now, especially OoS. It's no less of an AT than Falco's laserhopping, IMO. On the subject of her nB, I think it gives Ivy a fairly useful OoS/anti-pressure attack now if one doesn't want to go for nair.

 

[Célja]

I've been playing Ivy in P:M since 2.5, thought she was weird at first, but eventually she became my favorite due to that solarbeam.

Her Seedbomb is great now in 2.6 since you can angle it, and I feel like Razor Leaf got a good improvement, despite being limited on multiple usage.

I have to say though that Charizard is probably my best pokemon that I have between Ivy and Zard, though it's pretty close (Don't ask about my bad Squirtle). Charizard's got the power, flight, and tech chasing. Though Ivysaur's got the combos, trickery and the ability to heal.

I do love the new textures as well for Ivy and Zard. Squirtle however I'm not that pleased with.

 

[Yomi-no-Kuni]

Hey everyone...

Like the 2.6 ivy and thought i check out the ivy boards because i don't really know alot about her
hope i'm welcome :D

 

[TreK]

As a Brawl player, I'd like to ask the opposite question of what's been asked above. What Melee ATs are necessary ?
I can wavedash, waveland, L cancel (and shffl), dash dance, crouch cancel and edge cancel on command, though I've yet to add everything to my playstyle. The problem is, these are pretty much the only Melee ATs I know of. Anything else I should be told about ?


Edit : btw, welcome Yomi :V

 

[SpiderMad]

Anything else I should be told about ?

C-stick buffering http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=auuxj7hq0LA&t=185
and Crouching during a Dash to cancel it (may be in Brawl). [Marths dashing, presses down, F-smashs)
Isai dropping. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u1kVmRoiTvE All good Falcos use it on laser platforming
Shield dropping. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nML5GOxTWNM

Someone could post a Melee thread that lists them all and only one or two wouldn't be in P:M.

What SpiderMad said. Also, there are B-reversals and reverse B-revesals (RBR), also called wavebounces.
.

How'd I miss that one, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3c_iPK38R1o

 

[TreK]

^ Thanks, I'll train at these.

Btw, who do you think is Ivysaur's best double partner ?
inb4Olimar, btw. That team is gonna rule everything.

 

[Machiavelli.CF]

Ivysaur's best double partner?

Fox

 

[Swann]

Double Ivy is pretty ridiculous. Try Ivy/DDD: perpetual solarbean + a bazillion heal %.

Ivy in doubles in general is bonkers. She's almost certainly one of the best partners in the game.

 

[bubbaking]

Ivy/Zard seems like it might be a good team. Ivy/ROB as well. Ivy/Fox is probably way better than both of those, though. Yeah, I can see Ivy being a great teammate because she can support pretty well and can net gimps pretty quickly. In addition, if her teammate's good at walling, she gets more chances to heal/charge, and her Solarbeam can probably catch opponents out of anything her teammate would set up with. I'm kinda scared of her being easily gimped by some chars, though...

As a Brawl player, I'd like to ask the opposite question of what's been asked above. What Melee ATs are necessary ?
I can wavedash, waveland, L cancel (and shffl), dash dance, crouch cancel and edge cancel on command, though I've yet to add everything to my playstyle. The problem is, these are pretty much the only Melee ATs I know of. Anything else I should be told about ?

C-stick buffering http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=auuxj7hq0LA&t=185
and Crouching during a Dash to cancel it (may be in Brawl). [Marths dashing, presses down, F-smashs)
Isai dropping. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u1kVmRoiTvE All good Falcos use it on laser platforming
Shield dropping. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nML5GOxTWNM

Someone could post a Melee thread that lists them all and only one or two wouldn't be in P:M.
How'd I miss that one, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3c_iPK38R1o

You still missed a couple for Melee. There's also jump-cancelled (JC) grabs and dash-cancelled grabs (also called boost grabs). Oh yeah, and true pivots. I'm not sure if stutterstep fsmash is a true pivot in vBrawl, but in Melee/P:M, one can also pivot ftilt and pivot jab.

Edit: And true-pivot grab.

 

[Vickyboi]

Am I the only one that loves synthesis so much that I wish solarbeam was double press so I can keep doing synthesis pressure and OoS?

 

[Dng3]

You're not =(. I often waste a good solarbeam when I try to break out of pressure, forgetting I cant' use synthesis anymore. I've only realize how decent it is at breaking combos.

 

[Vickyboi]

Synthesis is probably my favourite move.
I have wasted solarbeams just so I can use synthesis, it's that good in my opinion.

 

[Yeerk]

Not really new to the Ivy boards, but never posted here. Hi. I'm Yeerk.
What do people think will be changed about Ivy this winter? Just speculation. I know a lot of people think she's in the top 10. I haven't seen her placing towards the top in big tourneys (am I missing something?), and I'm not saying there aren't good players that use her, but i haven't seen evidence that she'll receive many nerfs, if any. However, I think seed bomb is too strong. Regardless, I'm excited to see what changes for her this winter.

 

[Dng3]

I hope nothing gets changed about her moveset. It's too early to be nerfing anything even if people speculate she's up there with the upper tiers, and if that is even the case, then the team has succeeded in bringing another character up to fox and falco's level =). Seed bomb can useful but it doesn't skew her character design to be reliant on it.

I'm probably bias but the buffs from 2.5 to 2.6 Ivy made the character perfect for me.

I'm curious if Reflexwonder can share any information on what we can expect since he's been pretty influential in the backroom for balancing Ivysaur.

 

[KariteSama]

I think seed bomb is useful but it's pretty easy to deal with if you see it coming. I think it's great as a mix up but not something you can really rely. That's just me though.

I just want them to fix the Randall bug with her tether. Drives me crazy...

 

[TheReflexWonder]

I've only ever really used it as a vertical combo finisher when nothing else will reach, but I hear that locking people down with Forward-B -> Down-B is brain-dead easy and effective.

 

[Ogopogo]

If someone DI's incorrectly from a dthrow you can run, jump and down b to launch them and set them up for maybe more down b's. A good player can avoid them well so you have to be tricky with it, with b-reversals and angles and stuff. Hitting Jigglypuff and Wario again after you've launched them is difficult to say the least. Also down b is good to just throw out when you and your opponent aren't hitting each other and you're generally out of their range. You can catch them by surprise and if you're lucky, stun them for a usmash if a kill percents or a dair to lead into some kind of combo. I don't know how effective this is but I think using it to help you get down works.

 

[TheReflexWonder]

I guess the stupidity that is F-Throw could cause someone to DI incorrectly, but the best way to DI both U-Throw and D-Throw is to hold forward.

Unless you're fighting a fastfaller, Down-B should never lead into other Down-B hits. They're easily clankable with aerials as the opponents fall down.

 

[Yeerk]

fyi I was talking about it as a combo finisher, considering how high it goes; I like it's other properties.

 

[Yeerk]

I found this paper mache Ivysaur for me at a party last night.