"It's only the rain" - Dante for Smash Ultimate (Mii Costume'd)

[Deleted member]

I'm not going to lie, until that rumor from the guy who leaked some DMC5 stuff got people thinking, I never gave the idea of Dante being in Smash any form of credit. But after that guy got some stuff in DMC5 right, I got thinking and eventually became very interested in the idea. Sure it's already been debunked, but I am now a fan of Dante as a Smash character. Count me in as a supporter.

 

[ThatShadowLink]

Wait it's been debunked?

 

[Deleted member]

Wait it's been debunked?

Yup. By the Devil May Cry 5 producer no less.

 

[Robertman2]

Yup. By the Devil May Cry 5 producer no less.

Right after he teased it a ton

 

[ThatShadowLink]

We're live up on Source Gaming. Let's start the party!

 

[KHJason95]

While I least likely expect this. He is a hope.

 

[Boo Jr.]

Hmmm. I honestly didn't expect this turn of events...

 

[Dr. Jojo Phantasma]

No matter how many times Dante gets put down, he just keeps on coming back!

 

[Izanagi97]

Welp, I'll wait till the next direct (I wonder if anything is played in October)

 

[Eldrake]

No matter how many times Dante gets put down, he just keeps on coming back!

Just like how he just shrugs off getting stabbed.

 

[Schnee117]

I still have extremely high doubts on all of this Dante stuff but damn.
Never expected one of my absolute most wanted to get traction like this though

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

Hmmm. I honestly didn't expect this turn of events...

Could just be a lucky guess remember that

Besides the “ins” are from Vergeben leaks

 

[Eldrake]

Could just be a lucky guess remember that

Besides the “ins” are from Vergeben leaks

I am cautiously skeptical of that post, but that post did predict Isabelle as a fighter of her own when most people thought she'd be an echo fighter at best. She got her own trailer, so I think that gives that post some credibility.

 

[Smashoperatingbuddy123]

I am cautiously skeptical of that post, but that post did predict Isabelle as a fighter of her own when most people thought she'd be an echo fighter at best. She got her own trailer, so I think that gives that post some credibility.

Agreed

Dante could be a WTF character of the game potentially

 

[Aeon Lupin]

Honestly, way too much evidence is mounting in Dante's favor, that I totally see him as the last reveal. The only thing really against him is that Matt said he wasn't, but he always says too much. Not a guarantee, but I would not be surprise.

 

[Megadoomer]

Hmmm. I honestly didn't expect this turn of events...

That could easily be a coincidence (a stopped clock is right twice a day; throw out enough claims that a certain character will be the next one revealed and one of them would be true); I'd be disappointed about the lack of Skull Kid, but Dante would certainly be exciting.

 

[Tornado_Man]

Dante getting in would definitely be the most hype reveal for me. This is one of the few "leaks" I'd like to be true.

 

[TheCJBrine]

I am cautiously skeptical of that post, but that post did predict Isabelle as a fighter of her own when most people thought she'd be an echo fighter at best. She got her own trailer, so I think that gives that post some credibility.

It said nothing about whether she was an echo or unique.

 

[Aeon Lupin]

Let's go over all of the pros and cons for Dante after this direct


PROS

-July 2018 /v/ leak of DMC5 that listed several things about the game. Said details such as dynamic music, V's design and training mode were confirmed real. Same leak claimed Dante was in Smash, and even predicted a giant dragon (Rathalos) before he was revealed.
-Rathalos is a new bit of Capcom representation, unrelated to SF or Megaman. The last time a 3rd party company got new representation in the form of Bomberman, we got Simon and Richter.
-During a youtube Capcom podcast, the DMC5 team immediately shifted away from a question asking about Dante for Smash.
-In February 2016, Hideki Kamiya tweeted to fans which version of Dante they'd want to see collaborate with Bayonetta. DMC4 Dante won out, which actually lines up with the July 2018 leak, which claimed the Dante being used for Ultimate is his DMC4 incarnation. Said tweet even occured around the time the Smash Ultimate project plans concluded.
-A 4chan post that was made on September 11 predicted Isabelle to be the next newcomer revealed also claimed Dante was indeed a newcomer as well.


CONS

-Matt Walker, a producer at Capcom directly said Dante was not in Smash. If he were under an NDA, he'd have avoided giving a definitive answer.
-DMC has had no main games on a Nintendo console, so Dante could be seen as low priority compared to other Capcom characters with stronger ties to the company, such as Monster Hunter or Phoenix Wright.
-The July 2018 /v/ leak, which got info on DMC5 had the same trailer description as another leak that included Simon and K. Rool. Said leak got details on K. Rool and Simon wrong.


If there's anything I missed, please say so.

 

[Astroworld]

Hmmm. I honestly didn't expect this turn of events...

Not that hard to guess tbh

I could’ve just randomly made an easy guess like “Screencap this, Daisy will make it in as a Peach clone” earlier this year.

Honestly, way too much evidence is mounting in Dante's favor, that I totally see him as the last reveal. The only thing really against him is that Matt said he wasn't, but he always says too much. Not a guarantee, but I would not be surprise.

Is there really though? I love Dante and i’d lose my **** if he made it in but I don’t think it’s even close to happening

 

[Aeon Lupin]

Is there really though? I love Dante and i’d lose my **** if he made it in but I don’t think it’s even close to happening

I've compiled all the pros and cons.

Let's go over all of the pros and cons for Dante after this direct


PROS

-July 2018 /v/ leak of DMC5 that listed several things about the game. Said details such as dynamic music, V's design and training mode were confirmed real. Same leak claimed Dante was in Smash, and even predicted a giant dragon (Rathalos) before he was revealed.
-Rathalos is a new bit of Capcom representation, unrelated to SF or Megaman. The last time a 3rd party company got new representation in the form of Bomberman, we got Simon and Richter.
-During a youtube Capcom podcast, the DMC5 team immediately shifted away from a question asking about Dante for Smash.
-In February 2016, Hideki Kamiya tweeted to fans which version of Dante they'd want to see collaborate with Bayonetta. DMC4 Dante won out, which actually lines up with the July 2018 leak, which claimed the Dante being used for Ultimate is his DMC4 incarnation. Said tweet even occured around the time the Smash Ultimate project plans concluded.
-A 4chan post that was made on September 11 predicted Isabelle to be the next newcomer revealed also claimed Dante was indeed a newcomer as well.


CONS

-Matt Walker, a producer at Capcom directly said Dante was not in Smash. If he were under an NDA, he'd have avoided giving a definitive answer.
-DMC has had no main games on a Nintendo console, so Dante could be seen as low priority compared to other Capcom characters with stronger ties to the company, such as Monster Hunter or Phoenix Wright.
-The July 2018 /v/ leak, which got info on DMC5 had the same trailer description as another leak that included Simon and K. Rool. Said leak got details on K. Rool and Simon wrong.


If there's anything I missed, please say so.

Also, avoid double posting.

 

[Boo Jr.]

-The July 2018 /v/ leak, which got info on DMC5 had the same trailer description as another leak that included Simon and K. Rool. Said leak got details on K. Rool and Simon wrong.


If there's anything I missed, please say so.

To be fair, if you're referring to this, it doesn't actually describe the actual trailer and the final smash is different from the DMC5 leaker. Similar, but different (activate devil mode and then combo like Little Mac vs. suck in a cinematic a la Shulk's).

By the way, after sleeping on the direct, I came to the conclusion that the Isabelle as newcomer leak is probably just a lucky guesser that piggybacked Vergeben. In the last month I saw TONS of fake leaks that predicted Isabelle as an Echo of Villager, but after rereading Vergeben's post I realized that he only supposed she will be an actual echo. Why this is important?
Because if we assume that Vergeben actually have legit info about Smash (up until now, it appears so), we have to look at the whole picture:
- got Ridley right
- no cuts + Snake returning
- Simon

But he also said:
- Isabelle is in (Isabelle will be playable, presumably as an Echo Fighter of Villager.) (note "presumably")
- a pokemon from GenVII (not Decidueye, Lycanroc, or Mimikyu)
- Ken is in, as echo of Ryu (the only real predictable echo)
- a Square-Enix newcomer

and finally, more important:
- “half a dozen newcomers” left to be revealed, but he didn’t know who any of them were aside from Simon

The last one make sense, if we consider that Sakurai after bringing back EVERY veteran including Snake and Cloud specifically said "I hope you don't expect too many new fighters". (echoes are not included in neither Sakurai nor Vergeben statements)

Now, half a dozen newcomers heh? We got Simon, King K. Rool and now Isabelle. That leaves us with three more, one of which is a pokemon (and note he NEVER said was Incineroar, as opposed of the Isabelle leak), a Square-Enix rep and one last to be determined. Could be Dante? Yes. But the last leak specifically said Geno is NOT in, knows that Dante is the last one but apparently doesn't acknowledge the existence of the supposed Square-Enix rep.

So to recap, Vergeben leaks (that up until now seems to be legit) and the new Isabelle one appear to be incompatible. Of course this statement is just what I could came up with, other possibilities are possible (Vergeben doesn't know about Dante/the Square-Enix rep is a fake source/Geno is the actual Square-Enix rep and Isabelle leak is a lucky guess/and so on), but as usual take everything with a grain of salt. Also, please don't believe to insane stupid far fetched theories like "chairs are cleary an hint"...

 

[Hydra of Chaos]

Now, half a dozen newcomers heh? We got Simon, King K. Rool and now Isabelle. That leaves us with three more, one of which is a pokemon (and note he NEVER said was Incineroar, as opposed of the Isabelle leak), a Square-Enix rep and one last to be determined. Could be Dante? Yes. But the last leak specifically said Geno is NOT in, knows that Dante is the last one but apparently doesn't acknowledge the existence of the supposed Square-Enix rep.

So to recap, Vergeben leaks (that up until now seems to be legit) and the new Isabelle one appear to be incompatible. Of course this statement is just what I could came up with, other possibilities are possible (Vergeben doesn't know about Dante/the Square-Enix rep is a fake source/Geno is the actual Square-Enix rep and Isabelle leak is a lucky guess/and so on), but as usual take everything with a grain of salt. Also, please don't believe to insane stupid far fetched theories like "chairs are cleary an hint"...

"A Square-Enix-rep" and Geno are NOT the same thing. Of course, Geno would be the most logical one, but it could really be anyone

 

[NukeA6]

I don't believe he'll get in but if he does, I'm too much of a fan of DMC to not accept it. This would be the first Dante x Bayonetta crossover too (unless that happened in Project x Zone). Nobody can ignore that.

 

[Boo Jr.]

"A Square-Enix-rep" and Geno are NOT the same thing. Of course, Geno would be the most logical one, but it could really be anyone

True. Maybe my bad english betrayed me, but that exactly what I wanted to say. But keep in mind that the Isabelle leak didn't say who the supposed Square-Enix rep is. And if we want to trust Vergeben, there should be one.

A little update. Reading Smash Bros Gamefaq to taste some salty tears after the Isabelle reveal, I stumbled on this:

Amazon UK claims 71 Fighters total

Yet to be confirmed, as stated in the thread it wouldn't be the first time Amazon screwed up.
But this would fit my previous idea regarding the last newcomers: a pokemon (Incineroar?), a Square-Enix rep (apparently Geno got a huge blow to his chances; read from page 13) and one last final surprise. Whoever this last character might be, its pretty safe that will be a big hype announcement. Could be Dante for real? Time will tell.

If I'm actually right, then its a R.I.P. for every other non-echo character, including Isaac, Skull Kid, Banjo and Kazooie (I'll never forget you guys), Elma, and my most wanted Shantae.

Also, fun fact: by browsing the italian version of the Smash ufficial site, I discovered that the italian name of Isabelle is "Fuffi". Lol...

 

[TheCJBrine]

True. Maybe my bad english betrayed me, but that exactly what I wanted to say. But keep in mind that the Isabelle leak didn't say who the supposed Square-Enix rep is. And if we want to trust Vergeben, there should be one.

A little update. Reading Smash Bros Gamefaq to taste some salty tears after the Isabelle reveal, I stumbled on this:

Amazon UK claims 71 Fighters total

Yet to be confirmed, as stated in the thread it wouldn't be the first time Amazon screwed up.
But this would fit my previous idea regarding the last newcomers: a pokemon (Incineroar?), a Square-Enix rep (apparently Geno got a huge blow to his chances; read from page 13) and one last final surprise. Whoever this last character might be, its pretty safe that will be a big hype announcement. Could be Dante for real? Time will tell.

If I'm actually right, then its a R.I.P. for every other non-echo character, including Isaac, Skull Kid, Banjo and Kazooie (I'll never forget you guys), Elma, and my most wanted Shantae.

Also, fun fact: by browsing the italian version of the Smash ufficial site, I discovered that the italian name of Isabelle is "Fuffi". Lol...

Actually, Amazon just get's their fighter count from the website's total of current fighters:
https://www.smashbros.com/en_US/about/index.html

I believe it counts each of Pokémon Trainer's Pokémon separate, as well as each Mii Fighter.

 

[ThatShadowLink]

Amazon UK claims 71 Fighters total
.

That was taken from the Smash website, which totaled 71 fighters (counting Pokemon Trainer as one) before Isabelle was announced.

 

[Boo Jr.]

Actually, Amazon just get's their fighter count from the website's total of current fighters:
https://www.smashbros.com/en_US/about/index.html

I believe it counts each of Pokémon Trainer's Pokémon separate, as well as each Mii Fighter.

Right, most likely have to be updated after the Isabelle reveal.

 

[Izanagi97]

I don't believe he'll get in but if he does, I'm too much of a fan of DMC to not accept it. This would be the first Dante x Bayonetta crossover too (unless that happened in Project x Zone). Nobody can ignore that.

Bayonetta wasn't in Project X Zone.... Now I want a 3rd Project X Zone

 

[Knight Dude]

Not in my top 5 of all time wanted characters, but Dante's still one of those pipe dream characters I'd be happy about. And he's got so much potential as far as moves go.

 

[Eldrake]

I just realized something. If Ken is in Smash as Ryu's Echo Fighter, that might actually increase the chances for a third unique fighter from Capcom! Ken's presence would show that Sakurai negotiated with Capcom for more than just Ryu and Mega Man. We got Monster Hunter content, showing how much they're willing to put in Smash. So if Sakurai went that far to get extra content AND an echo fighter for Ultimate, then why not negotiate for an extra unique fighter from Capcom? It's not necessarily Dante (It could be Phoenix Wright, Leon or even Amaterasu depending on who Sakurai felt would fit Smash best) but it increases Dante's chances.

The last time we got content beyond the returning third party IPs, we got Konami's Bomberman as an assist trophy. Next Smash Direct, turns out we got not only Simon, but also Richter as an echo fighter from Konami. Same direct, we got Capcom's Rathalos as an assist trophy. Combined with the rumored Ken as Ryu's echo fighter, the odds for an additional unique fighter from Capcom is actually quite high.

 

[Boo Jr.]

Vergeben basically confirmed box theory, only newcomer left is Incineroar and Ken is (of course) an echo fighter.
The supposed "Square-Enix rep" will probably be a DLC like Mewtwo was.

No Dante, no Shantae, no Elma, no Isaac, and so on...god I hope he is wrong this time...

 

[Xgears]

Vergeben basically confirmed box theory, only newcomer left is Incineroar and Ken is (of course) an echo fighter.
The supposed "Square-Enix rep" will probably be a DLC like Mewtwo was.

No Dante, no Shantae, no Elma, no Isaac, and so on...god I hope he is wrong this time...

Sort of? he said that at least those are the final newcomers, but there's no definitive confirmation.

 

[Boo Jr.]

Sort of? he said that at least those are the final newcomers, but there's no definitive confirmation.

Sure, but he didn't said "Ken, Incineroar, a Square-Enix rep and maybe one more", he confirmed the first two (which fit the box theory) and is still unsure about the Square-Enix rep, that could be either wrong, the first DLC or another newcomer (that would break the box theory, but non necessarily confirm ANOTHER newcomer after that).

Its worth noting that he was, up until now, right about everything. But he doesn't have all the info, for example he didn't know about Ritcher or King K. Rool.
There's a tiny hope for other characters, but set you expectations very low for the next direct...

 

[Xgears]

Sure, but he didn't said "Ken, Incineroar, a Square-Enix rep and maybe one more", he confirmed the first two (which fit the box theory) and is still unsure about the Square-Enix rep, that could be either wrong, the first DLC or another newcomer (that would break the box theory, but non necessarily confirm ANOTHER newcomer after that).

Its worth noting that he was, up until now, right about everything. But he doesn't have all the info, for example he didn't know about Ritcher or King K. Rool.
There's a tiny hope for other characters, but set you expectations very low for the next direct...

I after K. Rool I dropped my expectations for other characters. I think this game will go crazy with DLC though.

 

[Pakky]

I support Dante... Waht of the guns though, how would that work?

Also its funny MVCI is being eaten up by Dragonball and Smash.

 

[ramon_zer0]

"There's no confirmation as of this moment whether or not that will be it for the launch roster." (You'd also want to at least set aside your thoughts on the box theory for this.)

Also, Dante using Ebony & Ivory's a bit of a moot point considering that Bayonetta has Love Is Blue, and E&I's more realistic designs can be countered either by not using them that much or the massive use of every other weapon Dante is packing.

 

[Eldrake]

Vergeben basically confirmed box theory, only newcomer left is Incineroar and Ken is (of course) an echo fighter.
The supposed "Square-Enix rep" will probably be a DLC like Mewtwo was.

No Dante, no Shantae, no Elma, no Isaac, and so on...god I hope he is wrong this time...

"There's no confirmation as of this moment whether or not that will be it for the launch roster."
How do people read this and jump to the conclusion that Vergeben says that there's only two characters left?

 

[Boo Jr.]

"There's no confirmation as of this moment whether or not that will be it for the launch roster."
How do people read this and jump to the conclusion that Vergeben says that there's only two characters left?

From my personal point of view, I can answer with odds and low expectations.

The box theory says that we're gonna get one echo and one newcomer, and Vergeben confirmed exactly that echo and the newcomer. He didn't namedrop the Square-Enix character because he's still not sure about him, even if it "comes from someone who's never had a habit of being wrong ", and much less any other character.
And right now is looking for confirmation about the box theory, meaning that even him thinks its in the realm of possibilities.

So, with Sakurai statement in mind, right now Ken+Incineroar being the last new characters seem to have much higher chances than an hypotetical Ken+Incineroar+Square-Enix Rep, and the latter doesn't even account for eventual more characters.

Could Vergeben be wrong? Yes, of course, he have a spotty record regarding his leaks. Could be characters he's unaware of? It already happened within this game alone. Can the box theory be wrong? Of course, and I sincerely hope so.
But right now the most likely result its Ken as echo of Ryu and Incineroar as the last in game character. DLC are still a guess.

 

[ramon_zer0]

"low expectations"

That's legitimately a good mentality to have on account of how much hype can go into our heads and get us worked up on things that have a long shot of happening... exactly like what this thread's about.

I want Dante in, but he's probably a good example of having low expectations for in the long run. The sheer fact that he's still pretty unlikely despite/in spite of whatever stunts people try to pull on his behalf means that there's a good chance he isn't on the roster. That wouldn't be too much of a bitter pill to swallow; on the flip side, those who want him in badly are likely going to POP THE UNGODLY HELL OFF super hard if he does get in.