Isaac for DLC - One day. Some day. Golden Sunday.

[Spootondorf]

I was thinking today about whether Djinn attacks should be special moves or normal moves. I came up with a "rule" that might help: rock- and plant-based Venus Psynergy should only work when you're on or near the ground (and ones like Spire would only work with a ceiling above you, so they'd need to be fused with a Psynergy that works on the ground to be very useful). I figured that would rule out such Psynergy for specials, since specials don't tend to differ depending on your on-the-ground status. However, then the thought occurred to me that Isaac could lure opponents into traps if he could use such Psynergies while in the air, the effect of the Psynergy being on the ground below him. Suppose he had Gaia as a special and used it while jumping over an enemy on Final Destination. Instead of Gaia being cast at Isaac's location or next to him, as it would be if he were grounded, it's cast on the ground below him, damaging his opponent and possibly hitting him into the air for Isaac's aerials to take care of. Whether or not this works, perhaps giving him specials that don't work in the air, or that function differently and less effectively in the air, would be part of the strategy involved in selecting amongst his customs.

If the Djinn were specials, though, I could see them being like almost every other character's specials: the two custom options would only alter the properties of the default special, since there's not a ton of Smash-feasible variety among Venus Djinn. This is in contrast to Psynergy being specials, as the two custom alternatives to a default special could be entirely different -- Quake versus Nettle, for example.

What do you guys think? Should Djinn, having less variety than Psynergy, be specials or normal attacks?

 

[N3ON]

It's probably the same reason Pokemon get cut each time, to make room for new ones. They just don't want to spend the time to bring back all the old ones and implement all the new ones. I have to imagine there were new ATs that didn't make it to the final version either.

The question is why certain characters. I don't really think technical limitations played a part in it, there are some pretty intricate ATs programming-wise that still showed up, but who really knows. Though Jill was probably cut because Sakurai felt it might've been unnecessary to have both her and the drill arm item. As for the others (other than Grey Fox) the most you can do is guess... some are probably easier to guess than others, like Resetti was probably due to the fact that nobody liked him and it took a lot of work to include all the text and all those translations, Ray (although popular compared to some others) hadn't had a game in a while, same with Helirin, and maybe Excitebike ran into technical problems, but Barbara and Isaac... who were both among the more popular characters that were ATs... *shrugs*

Isaac being planned for more wouldn't surprise me, nothing else really makes sense, but Barbara though, your guess is as good as mine. She was still a trophy, and her series is still as popular and current as it ever was.

 

[Apollyon]

Not sure if anyone noticed Hackintosh_HD's research already, figured I might as well link it.

Here is the link to Hackintosh's post.

Basically, Isaac is the third/fourth most requested newcomer among the recent polls.

Something I noticed, if Hackintosh removes the "botted votes" that went around for Daisy, Paper Mario, KRool, and Banjo, then Isaac becomes the most requested character overall. Supposedly over KRool.

Here is something else Hackintosh noted:

By far, the most interesting thing to me was when I organized the Votes by Franchise. Of course, Mario takes first place; if I had divided Mario into subcategories like Super Mario RPG and Paper Mario, then it might just have been second place to Donkey Kong, which had a whopping 27.3% total representation. Which is followed right after by Golden Sun (8.9%), which is surprising because only one character from Golden Sun was requested, and it managed to score above StarFox and Pokémon.

What think guys?

 

[N3ON]

He really shouldn't have counted polls that were clearly botted, or at least removed those specific character results from the character's average. The more those results get spread around, the more people believe them to be accurate and actually start rallying behind the characters who were botted to the top. But considering he took them all from reddit (he should've had a wider net) characters like Daisy were probably botted on all of them.

Though I don't think Isaac is more requested than K. Rool, he would've won that poll anyway.

 

[Falgor]

He really shouldn't have counted polls that were clearly botted, or at least removed those specific character results from the character's average. The more those results get spread around, the more people believe them to be accurate and actually start rallying behind the characters who were botted to the top. But considering he took them all from reddit (he should've had a wider net) characters like Daisy were probably botted on all of them.

Though I don't think Isaac is more requested than K. Rool, he would've won that poll anyway.

That's only Reddit's point of view, but besides the popularity, there's the unpopularity. In the ballot that technically doesn't mean anything, but even if K. Rool has a massive fanbase, I was really surprised to learn that there's also a significant part of players that don't want him to be in Smash. Like, a ton more than people don't wanting Isaac. There were lots of comments saying they don't like K. Rool, and they were upvoted. On the same thread, the... two (three at most) people saying they don't want Isaac were, on the contrary, downvoted to oblivion.

Now, the chance of Nintendo not only working on the ballot's data but also looking for what people say on Smash communities is probably infinitesimal.

In the end, I strongly think that Isaac and K. Rool should be the first (and maybe the last, sadly) two newcomers to get in from the ballot, they both deserve it.

 

[LasermasterA]

I made this. It's kinda embarrassing posting it because I only took some stuff and put it together but it's an idea that randomly popped into my head the other day.

I'm not gonna win any awards for banner making. I downloaded a special font for the "Vote Isaac" part. It's called "Franchise" and I think it really pops.

Here is an award for poster making! I love it!

Quick!!! Post it in a Pokemon thread for free votes!!!

Not sure if anyone noticed Hackintosh_HD's research already, figured I might as well link it.

Here is the link to Hackintosh's post.

Basically, Isaac is the third/fourth most requested newcomer among the recent polls.

Something I noticed, if Hackintosh removes the "botted votes" that went around for Daisy, Paper Mario, KRool, and Banjo, then Isaac becomes the most requested character overall. Supposedly over KRool.

Here is something else Hackintosh noted:

What think guys?

Interesting. I just checked it out. Funnily enough, in his graph he wrote Isaac (Golden Sun) as Issac....

 

[Coaltergeist]

I resized the infographic I made last night (I also removed the typos (turns out Judgment doesn't have 2 e's)). I don't know how many people here saw it, but I think All the art we are getting from the community is great!

Hope you guys like it (it's 2 pics heads up)!

EDIT: Also @ N3ON I would like to be added to the list. Thanks!

 

[Skyblade12]

In the case of AT's, Isaac was a well-liked Assist Trophy, with no known problems on 3DS.


Excitebike and Custom Robo both could've had issues on the 3DS hardware, so they just decided to drop them. Drill Dozer and Barbara could've been cut because Drill Dozer was a one-off game and Barbara was from a smaller franchise and neither were that interesting. The only one I feel who could've feasibly been consider as playable is Isaac... I guess MAYBE Ray, too.


Resetti and Helirin were probably cut because Helirin was useless and people HATED Resetti.

Ray was tiny, and would have been difficult to see on the 3DS screen. He also had a lot of projectile spam, which would have been hard on the processor. Those two combined were my thoughts on why he was cut.

Though it was sad, as he was another AT I really liked.

 

[N3ON]

K. Rool might be more popular, but I think we all know who's coming first.

See? It's inevitable!

 

[FalKoopa]

K. Rool might be more popular, but I think we all know who's coming first.

See? It's inevitable!

Quite a coincidence (or is it?) that Mega Man, Li'l Mac, Pac-Man and Mewtwo were revealed in exactly that order. Must be a conspiracy.

 

[Skyblade12]

Quite a coincidence (or is it?) that Mega Man, Li'l Mac, Pac-Man and Mewtwo were revealed in exactly that order. Must be a conspiracy.

If we get Professor Layton before K. Rool, the Geno fans are going to flip out and take it as a sign.

 

[EmeraldDragonair]

Quite a coincidence (or is it?) that Mega Man, Li'l Mac, Pac-Man and Mewtwo were revealed in exactly that order. Must be a conspiracy.

Not only that each of them have two reveal trailers between them (don't count as they weren't reveals, the game was out).
, then , then , now ,??
and finally...


Illuminati confirm the battle!

Edit: Also... the area with the red rope was clearly predicting the DLC part of the roster.

 

[Bassoonist]

Golden Sun is on sale in the eShop right now for $5.59.

Hopefully this will raise awareness of the game and Isaac!

 

[Strider_Bond00J]

Quite a coincidence (or is it?) that Mega Man, Li'l Mac, Pac-Man and Mewtwo were revealed in exactly that order. Must be a conspiracy.

And then we get Krystal alongside Wolf.

 

[LasermasterA]

K. Rool might be more popular, but I think we all know who's coming first.

See? It's inevitable!

The artist must be getting tons of exposure because of this.

I remember finding this pic waaaayyy before Smash 4 reveal with Megaman. What sheer coincidence...... or not. Anyway Isaac's next so we need not worry.

So that means we will get Krystal, Layton and Waluigi all before K. Rool. Sorry DK fans, the prophecy has been said

 

[Cutie Gwen]

The artist must be getting tons of exposure because of this.

I remember finding this pic waaaayyy before Smash 4 reveal with Megaman. What sheer coincidence...... or not. Anyway Isaac's next so we need not worry.

So that means we will get Krystal, Layton and Waluigi all before K. Rool. Sorry DK fans, the prophecy has been said

It means K.Rool and Ridley will eventually happen I'm happy enough

 

[JohnnySparkxs]

K. Rool might be more popular, but I think we all know who's coming first.

See? It's inevitable!

I bet the artist is Master Hama.

 

[ferioku]

It means K.Rool and Ridley will eventually happen I'm happy enough

Isn't Ridley a stage hazard though.
o.o

 

[Storm Eagle]

Isn't Ridley a stage hazard though.
o.o

Irrelevant. Duck Hunt dog is a stage hazard.

 

[fogbadge]

Irrelevant. Duck Hunt dog is a stage hazard.

more of a platform than a hazard

 

[Coaltergeist]

Irrelevant. Duck Hunt dog is a stage hazard.

Besides, haven't you played other m? They can just breed a NEW Ridley

 

[Leafeon523]

I just put in my vote for Isaac. How did I do?

Everyone was very disappointed to see Isaac's assist trophy absent from smash bros Wii U. It would be even better if he could come back as a full-fledged fighter! Isaac is a character with great moveset potential as well. He could use his sword, Psynergy, Djinn, and even summons for his attacks. The Golden Sun series as a whole has not been represented in smash bros barring a few musical tracks. Please consider letting Isaac join the fray!

 

[LasermasterA]

I just put in my vote for Isaac. How did I do?

Doing great! Now let's just get more people to vote!

 

[Falgor]

I remember that we talked about Isaac in Project M, at one point. Do you think that Isaac's inclusion via DLC will hurt his chances in PM?

I was talking with someone who thinks it's worse, now. Not sure of why.

 

[N3ON]

I remember that we talked about Isaac in Project M, at one point. Do you think that Isaac's inclusion via DLC will hurt his chances in PM?

I was talking with someone who thinks it's worse, now. Not sure of why.

They might be a little worse, but I think he's far enough in development for P:M they're not going to abandon him at this point.

 

[StrikeBlade]

Someone should make an image like this with a possibile Isaac's moveset to convince people to vote for him

I'll get workin on this.

 

[N3ON]

Added more of the support banners and videos to the 2nd post of the OP.

And for those people asking about the supporter list, may I re-direct you to its architect, @True Blue Warrior.

 

[DustyPumpkin]

I'll be honest here, I'd kind of like Matthew to be the default so whenever he's KO'd a censored speech bubble can randomly pop out

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I'll be honest here, I'd kind of like Matthew to be the default so whenever he's KO'd a censored speech bubble can randomly pop out

...That should be a KO thing in general...Why does Mega Man get a unique death animation and no one else? This coming from a huge fan of the blue bomber

 

[DustyPumpkin]

...That should be a KO thing in general...Why does Mega Man get a unique death animation and no one else? This coming from a huge fan of the blue bomber

Yeah it really kinda sucks I would've loved Pac-Man's Star Ko to have been the classic Pac-Man dying noise

 

[N3ON]

I'll be honest here, I'd kind of like Matthew to be the default so whenever he's KO'd a censored speech bubble can randomly pop out

When Isaac (or Matthew) idles a random speech bubble should totally appear. Or maybe one that relates to how you're faring in the match.

It could also work as a taunt. Like Pac-Man's, but a little different.

It'd be a great, albeit completely unnecessary touch.

 

[StrikeBlade]

I have to go to work soon, but I'll continue this tonight when I get back.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I have to go to work soon, but I'll continue this tonight when I get back.

Nice artstyle!

 

[JohnnySparkxs]

I have to go to work soon, but I'll continue this tonight when I get back.

Lookin' good.

 

[Smash_Veteran_Amtoj]

I have to go to work soon, but I'll continue this tonight when I get back.

I'm liking this already.

 

[Altais]

I have to go to work soon, but I'll continue this tonight when I get back.

Hmm, those are pretty good and descriptive drawings; definitely better than what I could do.

After jumping in the air or walking off a platform, I've always imagined Isaac's descending animation would look a lot like his pose on the Golden Sun box art. [EDIT] Also, it would be pretty cool if the Cloak psynergy was his dodge animation, for both the air and ground; like Mewtwo, Isaac would disappear, but unlike Mewtwo, Isaac would have a white outlining.

 

[Spootondorf]

Funny you mention Cloak for dodging -- I was trying to come up with a moveset again today, and suddenly remembered Cloak and put it either on his air dodge or spot dodge. Rolling was Sand.

I really think that item-bestowed Psynergy should also be part of his moveset, especially if he could equip the Cyclone Chip (don't remember if he can), which could provide a good up special. The Grip Crystal, from Dark Dawn, would also provide a good up special. Speaking of DD, I think Sakurai shouldn't shy away from using new moves from there, too, as long as Matthew could use them. That would not only make sense within the world of Golden Sun, but it would work for Isaac's alternates, as well, such as Matthew.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Psynergy stone as an item: Removes all staling and evens boosts the power of your next move, make sure it hits!

 

[DustyPumpkin]

Would He HAVE to use a Sword tho, I mean Issac/Matthew can equip Maces and Axes too

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Would He HAVE to use a Sword tho, I mean Issac/Matthew can equip Maces and Axes too

His artwork usually has a sword so unfortunately it seems so