Isaac for DLC - One day. Some day. Golden Sunday.

[JaidynReiman]

I'm calling it right now Shulk and Isaac are both in.
I suppose there's a reason that Isaac's Assist Trophy hasn't been shown yet and Shulk has been likely for a while anyway, so I'm pretty confident in saying they're both in.
I'm a little optimistic.

I think they're both in as well, although I still say I'll laugh if Shulk doesn't make it in. Not because I hate Shulk, not because I want to piss off Shulk fans, but because of the ignorant people who believe that a character is "guaranteed" to be playable when nothing at all hints at it except leaks which are no guarantee about anything. Especially when it comes to the whole Chrom debate, everyone saying that Robin had no chance and that Chrom was a shoe-in. The Shulk situation is almost exactly the same at this point.

I wouldn't compare Isaac to Shulk-- If Shulk is getting in, it'll be because his series is new, with another game on the way. If this was the case with Isaac, I think he'd be guaranteed, but he's sort of in that position where he's neither a retro character or a modern one. I think Rhythm Heaven would be a more direct comparison, since that series also originated on the GBA, and has since gained increasing popularity.

Pokemon is the only "brand new" franchise to ever get a playable rep in a Smash Bros. game. A new franchise actually hurts Shulk's chances of being into the game.

 

[SvartWolf]

at first i though that Isaac and Robin would be redundant since the whole magic swordsman gimmick is used by Robin, then i thought a little more, and beside the most obvious one that Isaac only use earth based attacks (Robin have not a single based earth attack) Maybe Isaac unique Gimmick could be that his moves get radically changed on ground or on air? I'm not saying god on earth fool on air littlemac style, but just radically different. stuff like on ground he have a projectile that goes forward (traveling through the ground akin to pikachu), but on air the very same projectile goes completly downwards.

 

[SirRob]

Pokemon is the only "brand new" franchise to ever get a playable rep in a Smash Bros. game. A new franchise actually hurts Shulk's chances of being into the game.

I think that has more to do with timing, priorities and viability more than anything else. How many other series have been in the same position as Xenoblade?

 

[shinhed-echi]

I wouldn't say Robin holds the spot for Magic/Sword gimmick.

How many SWORD only gimmick characters are there? I'm sure another sword/magic user doesn't hurt.
Especially Earth based. And hopefully with changeable stats in mid-fight. :D

 

[JaidynReiman]

I wouldn't say Robin holds the spot for Magic/Sword gimmick.

How many SWORD only gimmick characters are there? I'm sure another sword/magic user doesn't hurt.
Especially Earth based. And hopefully with changeable stats in mid-fight. :D

Changeable stats is the one thing I don't want. Find some other way to make a Djinn-based moveset work.

 

[ThatShadowLink]

I was thinking that they could mix up his moveset a lot. Like, say, have Psyenergy and Djinn as his standard, tilts and smashs, and sword attacks for his specials and air moves. It would be a pretty unique concept. We don't really have many characters who rely on their sword as a backup. Even Robin still uses his sword for the majority of his attacks.

 

[SirRob]

Yeah, I don't think Isaac has any competition in terms of a unique moveset. Golden Sun's gameplay is unique among other Nintendo series, so if that quality is worked into a playable Isaac, then he'll have no problem standing out.

 

[JaidynReiman]

I was thinking that they could mix up his moveset a lot. Like, say, have Psyenergy and Djinn as his standard, tilts and smashs, and sword attacks for his specials and air moves. It would be a pretty unique concept. We don't really have many characters who rely on their sword as a backup. Even Robin still uses his sword for the majority of his attacks.

I don't see how Sword attacks for his specials will make him special. At best, he should only use his sword for a few attacks, but most of his standards will be psynergy and his specials be djinn-based.

 

[Deleted member]

Just like last week when we got Takamaru, right?

This might not actually be the case, but I'm just feeling as if this might be the Assist Trophy week since we're a month away from Smash Bros. being released in Japan. I hope I'm not right, but I want to know for sure what the aim is this week.

For the record the game sold incredibly well for the way it was produced, unlike Golden Sun, Xenoblade was sold through a single retailer and at a limited quantity,and they sold out.
So, in other words it wasn't the fans fault it sold bad, it was Nintendo's.

Actually, Nintendo of America. Reggie Fils-Aime is the kind of guy who, in the words of Herb Powell, instead of giving people what they want, he tells them what they want. He's gotten better at this, such as Tomodachi Life, which I never thought would come here, but the goofs of the past will remain a negative mark on his career with NoA.

When you step back to realize all the cool stuff Nintendo of Europe has given its fans and the stuff Nintendo of America has... you have to wonder.

Back to Isaac, I agree he should have a Djinn-based moveset, but I want him to stay entirely with Earth moves. Going too wild with his moveset can get awful confusing and it would be better if the Djinn affect Isaac's stats as opposed to the moves Isaac can pull off. I would also like the idea of a summon-based Final Smash based on how many Djinn are available when Isaac pulls it off. If you want Earth Djinn involved, we know the drill:

*1 Djinni gets Venus.
*2 Djinn gets Ramses.
*3 Djinn gets Cybelle.
*4 Djinn gets Judgment.

I'd personally would consider sticking with Judgment to make it easy, but it would be an interesting element to dictate the strength of Isaac's Final Smash.

 

[ferioku]

I wouldn't compare Isaac to Shulk-- If Shulk is getting in, it'll be because his series is new, with another game on the way. If this was the case with Isaac, I think he'd be guaranteed, but he's sort of in that position where he's neither a retro character or a modern one. I think Rhythm Heaven would be a more direct comparison, since that series also originated on the GBA, and has since gained increasing popularity.

1.You can't really compare Rhythem Heaven to Golden sun because they aren't even in the same genre 2. Rythem Heaven was released on the DS not the GBA. Unless you're talking about Rythem Tengoku, which is a Japanese exclusive title to the game boy advance.

 

[Bassoonist]

This might not actually be the case, but I'm just feeling as if this might be the Assist Trophy week since we're a month away from Smash Bros. being released in Japan. I hope I'm not right, but I want to know for sure what the aim is this week.

Why exactly would you hope you aren't right?

Listen, I want Isaac to be playable really badly. However, if he isn't, and if he's an Assist Trophy, delaying showing him as such isn't going to change his status.

On the other hand, Assist Trophy week (whether that actually happens or not) doesn't mean that Isaac will be shown. He could have been upgraded, or he could be 'unlockable' and secret. Either way, an Assist Trophy week would help narrow down our speculation.

Of course, I hope he isn't an AT, so an AT week would be a very stressful time if that turns out to be true, but, on the other hand, it's nice to get solid answers on characters inclusions.

 

[Spazzy_D]

Changeable stats is the one thing I don't want. Find some other way to make a Djinn-based moveset work.

Ha, Isaac actually makes more sense for the "stance stat change" mechanic Shulk was rumored to have in that one recent (and extremely suspect "leak.") I never really thought about that until now.

It would be a very clunky mechanic though, it could seem very strategic on the surface, but the fact that you would have to cycle through your different stats as opposed to automatically picking them on the fly would make it near worthless.

Isaac is definitely unique enough without that.

 

[Arteen]

I would love to see anything Golden Sun show up on the site in the next few weeks. Even if Isaac's an assist trophy again, I'd rather see it now than be left in the dark like with Brawl.

 

[SirRob]

1.You can't really compare Rhythem Heaven to Golden sun because they aren't even in the same genre 2. Rythem Heaven was released on the DS not the GBA. Unless you're talking about Rythem Tengoku, which is a Japanese exclusive title to the game boy advance.

I'm not taking genre into consideration-- if genre WAS a factor, then Rhythm Heaven would have an even better chance over Golden Sun, since WarioWare is the only series that treads on the same ground.

Of course, I hope he isn't an AT, so an AT week would be a very stressful time if that turns out to be true, but, on the other hand, it's nice to get solid answers on characters inclusions.

It'd be nice to have that closure before the game's released. It'd be a real downer if he just sorta... shows up in the game as an AT, without any fanfare.

 

[GM_3826]

Yeah, the whole reason Xenoblade Chronicles X is being made is because the game sold surprisingly well in the West: There was literally so much hype surrounding the games, yet they didn't look into the possibility that they were understocked,and the game sold out. A second batch came in, and you can find the game used at GameStop nowadays, but then the game gained a reputation of being "hard to find"... Really, if Nintendo hadn't made the game GameStop exclusive, they would have quite a bit more money than they did previously. Maybe not enough to save them from losees. But a lot.

 

[Spazzy_D]

I'm not taking genre into consideration-- if genre WAS a factor, then Rhythm Heaven would have an even better chance over Golden Sun, since WarioWare is the only series that treads on the same ground.

It'd be nice to have that closure before the game's released. It'd be a real downer if he just sorta... shows up in the game as an AT, without any fanfare.

I think unlockable ATs from new franchises are a bad idea for just that reason.

Another thing I am really hoping for is that we see stages for characters that aren't playable. If Shulk and/or Isaac are Assist Trophies I could take major solace in playable stages. Same with revealed ATs like Takamaru and Dillon - they could both have AWESOME stages.

Also, @ GM_3826 I know you mean well, but let's leave Shulk's merits to his own thread. Shulk and Isaac have A LOT of over lap in support and I'd hate to see this devolve into people trying to prove one deserves a spot over the other.

 

[shinhed-echi]

Golden Sun needs another game which doesn't get localized in the west, so that people give it a heckload of attention, and BAM, localization + guaranteed sequel. :D

 

[N3ON]

I'm still thinking Sakurai didn't really mean them to be in All Star-mode, just figuratively saying that the ATs are also "All Stars" akin to playable characters. (Which I find kinda happy to hear). I already posted on one other thread about how in earth might that work, such as Lyn being too OP (because giving extra animations to her would be quite some work) and also other ATs that don't fight seem also bit odd to implement and chaotic to deal with if there's also fighters in the fray. Also, do you have to defeat them or will they be an annoying thorn on your side? I keep thinking such fights as Andross + Star Fox teaming up on you.

In anycase, I'm really hopin' Isaac's still not "next in line". Maybe these deconfirmations might hint at something?

To be fair, this isn't some fan translation, this was an official Nintendo translation done for a Direct in which ATs were literally said to "figure into All-Star mode". It doesn't sound like there's a lot of room for interpretation, only more clarity on the matter.

Wow, didn't realize how many haters Isaac has, everywhere I go, there is also someone posting about how much they don't want him in the game and how they would rather have characters such as K rool and Ridley T_T!

I don't think it's people hating on Isaac as much as it is them preferring K. Rool and Ridley.

Yeah, the whole reason Xenoblade Chronicles X is being made is because the game sold surprisingly well in the West: There was literally so much hype surrounding the games, yet they didn't look into the possibility that they were understocked,and the game sold out. A second batch came in, and you can find the game used at GameStop nowadays, but then the game gained a reputation of being "hard to find"... Really, if Nintendo hadn't made the game GameStop exclusive, they would have quite a bit more money than they did previously. Maybe not enough to save them from losees. But a lot.

And if they hadn't released it two years late they would've saved themselves from the game being pirated a few hundred thousand times. They screwed up with Xenoblade in a lot of ways, but that's a risk you take when you ignore the fans.

At least they did end up recognizing its success.

Golden Sun needs another game which doesn't get localized in the west, so that people give it a heckload of attention, and BAM, localization + guaranteed sequel. :D

I'm not sure if it always works like that.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

To be fair, this isn't some fan translation, this was an official Nintendo translation done for a Direct in which ATs were literally said to "figure into All-Star mode". It doesn't sound like there's a lot of room for interpretation, only more clarity on the matter.

Well, if that's how you put it...

I guess I'm just confused about how there's been next to nothing talked about this... unless we gotta wait for all playable characters to be shown in order to proceed "safely". However, I'm so curious yet perplexed by how is this going to look or work like (incase they truly do "figure into All-Star Mode" in a literal sense.) But that's to be seen.

I don't wanna hold my breath to a mode that would basically make up for everything about Assist not getting recognition because a mode dedicated solely to them or have them be a major part would be just AWESOME. Especially if I'll one day will be screaming at likes of Lyn or Saki for being so "damn hard" to defeat and I need to train against them. Oh man. That'd turn my respect and love the Assist-roster up to eleven, and I bet it would do amazing marketibility on them to rest of the Smash-audience globally.

 

[N3ON]

Yeah, I'd guess that we know so little about All-Star mode so far because it deals with a fair amount of content that hasn't been revealed yet, including the entirety of the roster.

And it would be very neat to fight the ATs somehow in All-Star, but I'm not going to hold my breath that Sakurai went to that amount of effort. Who knows though, they have to factor in somehow.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

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Call me perhaps too early and now just following the quotas here but if we're now getting all these ATs being shown rather more frequently... What if they might lead up to the All-Star Mode's revea? (Since they were said to be part of them).
Even if I admit Takamaru and Sable might not be as big names as Ashley or Skull Kid to begin that with.

Also I better get back on-topic.

 

[ferioku]

@ N3ON True, most people that say that they don't want isaac usually always mention K.Rool Ridley, Dixey Kong and Shulk.

@ SirRob In terms of Genre, I'm pretty sure RPG wins.

 

[JaidynReiman]

@ N3ON True, most people that say that they don't want isaac usually always mention K.Rool Ridley, Dixey Kong and Shulk.

Its "Dixie Kong." Honestly I want all of them except Shulk, with the additions of Isaac and Lip (although I don't think Lip is likely at all). I'd like at least K. Rool, though, preferably both K. Rool and Isaac.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Yeah, I'd guess that we know so little about All-Star mode so far because it deals with a fair amount of content that hasn't been revealed yet, including the entirety of the roster.

And it would be very neat to fight the ATs somehow in All-Star, but I'm not going to hold my breath that Sakurai went to that amount of effort. Who knows though, they have to factor in somehow.

I wonder if there will be another Smash Direct this month to elaborate on this. This is definetly something that should be clarified before the Japanese release of the 3DS version.

 

[N3ON]

It's funny because if Isaac was more expected he'd also be more wanted.

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Call me perhaps too early and now just following the quotas here but if we're now getting all these ATs being shown rather more frequently... What if they might lead up to the All-Star Mode's revea? (Since they were said to be part of them).
Even if I admit Takamaru and Sable might not be as big names as Ashley or Skull Kid to begin that with.

Also I better get back on-topic.

I personally don't expect All-Star to be shown off until more of the roster is known, because they still play a key role in the mode as well. I think the increase in recent AT showings have just been due to impending release.

I wonder if there will be another Smash Direct this month to elaborate on this. This is definetly something that should be clarified before the Japanese release of the 3DS version.

Well it's not like we wouldn't be able to figure out how it works upon release should they not clarify it prior.

 

[SirRob]

@ SirRob In terms of Genre, I'm pretty sure RPG wins.

Well I'm not gonna get into an argument of whether one genre of games is better than another, but we've already got Pokemon and presumably Mother representing RPGs. If Isaac is going to be included, it won't be because RPGs need representation in Smash.

 

[N3ON]

Well I'm not gonna get into an argument of whether one genre of games is better than another, but we've already got Pokemon and presumably Mother representing RPGs. If Isaac is going to be included, it won't be because RPGs need representation in Smash.

Characters aren't included to represent the genre they hail from in the first place.

 

[Skyblade12]

Is Isaac too overpowered to return as an Assist Trophy now anyway?

With swimming gone, pushing a character off the stage in a water based level would be an instant-KO, wouldn't it?

 

[SirRob]

Characters aren't included to represent the genre they hail from in the first place.

I'd agree with you, but I dunno if Sakurai's ever explicitly said that. We do have a wide range of genres represented in Smash Bros, from racers, to shooters, to simulation and fitness games. I think it goes hand and hand with representing a variety of Nintendo games, which I certainly hope is a factor in deciding the roster.

 

[N3ON]

I'd agree with you, but I dunno if Sakurai's ever explicitly said that. We do have a wide range of genres represented in Smash Bros, from racers, to shooters, to simulation and fitness games. I think it goes hand and hand with representing a variety of Nintendo games, which I certainly hope is a factor in deciding the roster.

Well that's because Nintendo just has a variety of successful series from different genres...

Sakurai has never once mentioned the genre of the series mattering when it comes to inclusion, so you're the one connecting dots that aren't there it seems. Sakurai pretty much just takes from the biggest or most impacting Nintendo series, and they happen to come from different genres because Nintendo has a fairly diverse output. Going by his statements all Sakurai cares about is apparently what the character can bring to the table in their implementation, not what style of series they might've come from.

Is Isaac too overpowered to return as an Assist Trophy now anyway?

With swimming gone, pushing a character off the stage in a water based level would be an instant-KO, wouldn't it?

It'd be pretty much like any other stage.

 

[SirRob]

Well that's because Nintendo just has a variety of successful series from different genres...

Sakurai has never once mentioned the genre of the series mattering when it comes to inclusion, so you're the one connecting dots that aren't there it seems. Sakurai pretty much just takes from the biggest or most impacting Nintendo series, and they happen to come from different genres because Nintendo has a fairly diverse output. Going by his statements all Sakurai cares about is apparently what the character can bring to the table in their implementation, not what style of series they might've come from.

With that logic, I guess Isaac's not gonna be playable before Shulk, Chorus Men and Duck Hunt Dog.

 

[JaidynReiman]

With that logic, I guess Isaac's not gonna be playable before Shulk, Chorus Men and Duck Hunt Dog.

Where do you get that idea from? Golden Sun had a much bigger impact than both Duck Hunt (which has never seen the light of day since the NES) and Xenoblade, at least sales-wise. And the odds are that about 5-6 different Rhythm Heaven characters would get in over Chorus Men.

 

[N3ON]

Well this time Sakurai is also clearly giving a lot of attention to post-Brawl stuff, but he still chooses from among Nintendo's biggest and most impacting series (excluding retros ofc).

 

[Sabrewulf238]

You know, Prince of Sable appearing as an assist trophy makes it abundantly clear that Sakurai is really caring about the portable side of Nintendo. The 3DS version isn't just the side project.

That can only be positive for Isaacs chances.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

I actually never thought of that. Hopefully that will only benefit Isaac.

So when do you guys expect the next Smash-related Direct to be? I think it will be somewhere in the middle of this month.

 

[Skyblade12]

I actually never thought of that. Hopefully that will only benefit Isaac.

So when do you guys expect the next Smash-related Direct to be? I think it will be somewhere in the middle of this month.

One month before the Japanese release sounds correct to me.

 

[Arteen]

If there is another Direct, it might just be a general Nintendo Direct with a Smash trailer added in somewhere.

We had a big Smash Direct in April, but it'd be great to see another one.

 

[JaidynReiman]

If there is another Direct, it might just be a general Nintendo Direct with a Smash trailer added in somewhere.

We had a big Smash Direct in April, but it'd be great to see another one.

I think we will definitely get another Smash Direct. Pokemon X/Y got two Directs as well.

 

[ThatShadowLink]

Yeah, we'll probably get a Wii U centric Smash direct talking about the single player mode(s) in it.

 

[Arteen]

In that case, another Smash Direct seems highly likely. Sometime this month is a good bet. Maybe they'll reveal an awesome handheld character to go along with the first handheld Smash game. That would rock.