Is there nothing we can do for our fallen heroes?

[lightdasher]

(I'm excluding Snake from this at the moment, as he is third-party and a whole different kettle of fish.)

With our cut veterans, Lucas, Ice Climbers, Wolf, Ivysaur, Squirtle, Roy, Pichu and even Mewtwo, is there anything we can do as a fanbase to bring any of these back? Obviously some characters are more popular than others, like Mewtwo or Ice Climbers or Lucas, others having their small fanbases here like Pichu, Roy ect. but this isn't about how big or small their fanbase is, it's the characters themselves and their placement within Smash.

But being a simple person I am, I can't help but feel like all I can do is just complain on random websites and blogs, but certain outcries and have managed to put in an influence within Smash Bros, just take a look at Sonic in Brawl, or Megaman and Mac in Smash 4, we do have some sort of power but it must be collected within the right places. Now obviously this isn't always true as there are some characters that are HEAVILY requested like Ridley or...errr...I can't think of an other example right now but regardless there are some limitations as to what can or cannot be done.

With the game already out we obviously don't have much say anymore, but we may be able to effect the Wii U, or even potential DLC content if it is ever added or considered, this goes for newcomers as well as veterans, I wouldn't know where to start with this, petitions obviously don't work and don't really reflect what people really want, (1,000 signatures for something paid doesn't mean 1,000 people are going to buy it for example) for all we know we could have already influence dlc without even knowing it.

Now there are some obvious and not-so-obvious reasons of a characters cut, Ice Climbers due to the 3DS' limitations (which just sounds like some bs to me) and low priority (why), Lucas and his merging with Ness (can you have 6 different versions of PSI Magnet?) Wolf (what about 9 versions of reflect?) Squirtle and Ivysaur (over repping a franchise? Mario has like 16 reps) ect. but are they truly dead? The Doc came back after skipping a game so clearly not, can we influence their return at all? I don't know, maybe there's someone out there who can help us regain our fallen heroes.

Every Franchise has their fans, this game was meant to be an improvement, so why the loss of content rather than the addition of.

Also sorry about going on about this, I just wanted to get this out of my chest even if it is a dead end case and I'm sure many other people who lost their main/s/favourite characters can understand.

(If there's a thread with anything similar to this and/or this thread isn't needed, could you merge or tell me so I could save this post?)

 

[Deleted member]

There is nothing you can do regarding the Ice Climbers. If the Ice Climbers had difficulty in being programmed on the 3DS / the 3DS not being powerful enough to load 8 models on screen at a time, they will not be in this installment.

 

[Zol]

there's nothing you can do to bring IC's back

they got the death penalty

and i watched

 

[lightdasher]

There is nothing you can do regarding the Ice Climbers. If the Ice Climbers had difficulty in being programmed on the 3DS / the 3DS not being powerful enough to load 8 models on screen at a time, they will not be in this installment.

Pretty sure how I read it was there was difficulty in getting them in the 3DS version, but because they weren't high enough priority they were cut to do other things

 

[Strofirko]

In tribute of roy we should change the forum banner for his new design.
In tribute of ice climbers we should offer dead ducks for their sanctuary.
In tribute of ivysaur/squirtle we should catch them all.
In tribute of mewtwo we should pack pills for his home.
In tribute of lucas and wolf we should paint their groves with dark.
In tribute of Pichu we should discover the cure of the cancer.

 

[Deleted member]

Pretty sure how I read it was there was difficulty in getting them in the 3DS version, but because they weren't high enough priority they were cut to do other things

"Sakurai claimed that technical limitations of the Nintendo 3DS prevented their inclusion; the two were reportedly difficult to implement on the console, and as the duo lacked the potential for a new game in their debut series, Sakurai intentionally gave the Ice Climbers a low priority on returning. While they could function on the Wii U, Sakurai decided to cut the characters in order to keep the playable roster between the games identical."

It was a combination of both.

 

[lightdasher]

This entire "same roster both games" thing is pretty stupid if there is no connectivity between games barring the custom moves.

But this thread isn't about how high or low he prioritized getting Icies to work on the 3DS.

 

[Wizela]

Pretty sure how I read it was there was difficulty in getting them in the 3DS version, but because they weren't high enough priority they were cut to do other things

People have misconstrued that statement. The reason for the Ice Climbers being excluded is solely because of the technical limitations of the 3DS, and we also don't know if it was because it was a completely insurmountable task that the 3DS could not handle no matter what, or if they simply ran out of time. Sakurai HAD the Ice Climbers running in the Wii U version, I wouldn't call that "cut because not high priority".

 

[Thunderfang747]

There is nothing you can do regarding the Ice Climbers. If the Ice Climbers had difficulty in being programmed on the 3DS / the 3DS not being powerful enough to load 8 models on screen at a time, they will not be in this installment.

Yep, the unfortunate truth. I really wanted ICs back. I would prefer almost any other cut, and wish they could be Wii U exclusive or something, but Sakurai seems set on the roster being identical. The only hope for them would be a Capcom esque "Ultra Super Smash Bros. for New 3DS" or something. Due to the huge amount of hatred those types of updates get I can't imagine it happening though.

 

[lightdasher]

Regardless of Ice Climbers, I don't see the reasons behind the cuts of other characters, and then Dr. Mario suddenly coming back.

 

[mario123007]

I don't know, even for them being a DLC character might be too far fetched.
We already know that there will be some characters get cut, but of course we didn't expect Sakurai will cut high fan fav characters like Wolf,Snake etc.
Ice Climbers was really a major blow since they were cut just because of 3ds' technical difficulties.
There nothing we can do make them come back, so.....guess that's it. This game is still awesome without them though.

 

[Renji64]

Nothing anyone can do they can't get them to run smooth on 3ds and they share the same roster it sucks but it is what it is.

 

[KaZe_DaRKWIND]

To be honest I don't think Sakurai really cares what we think.

People have misconstrued that statement. The reason for the Ice Climbers being excluded is solely because of the technical limitations of the 3DS, and we also don't know if it was because it was a completely insurmountable task that the 3DS could not handle no matter what, or if they simply ran out of time. Sakurai HAD the Ice Climbers running in the Wii U version, I wouldn't call that "cut because not high priority".

They weren't high enough priority to spend the resources to get them working on the 3DS is what he's saying.

 

[lightdasher]

You know, personally if you were to ask me, this "dropped because of 3DS limits" thing sounds really farfetched.

Not that I'm denying it or anything, it just really sounds bizarre.

 

[Wintropy]

Organise a concerted effort to elicit the attention of Nintendo and tell them, with all due professionalism and civility, exactly what you want. If enough people speak out and demand their favourite characters, there's a chance Nintendo will listen and consider it with regards to future developments.

Alternatively, accept that there are other characters to play as and move on. Sometimes you just have to live with the director's decisions, for better or for worse, and just learn to enjoy the game you have.

 

[Gnight]

I'm excluding Snake from this at the moment, as he is third-party and a whole different kettle of fish.

Why exclude snake and talk about Ice Climbers? They were also excluded for unique reasons.

 

[lightdasher]

Organise a concerted effort to elicit the attention of Nintendo and tell them, with all due professionalism and civility, exactly what you want. If enough people speak out and demand their favourite characters, there's a chance Nintendo will listen and consider it with regards to future developments.

Of course I've thought of this before, where and how to start however is a different question altogether.

Alternatively, accept that there are other characters to play as and move on. Sometimes you just have to live with the director's decisions, for better or for worse, and just learn to enjoy the game you have.

I will still be able to enjoy the game, but I probably wouldn't be able to shake the odd feeling off anytime soon

Why exclude snake and talk about Ice Climbers? They were also excluded for unique reasons.

This topic is not just for the Ice Climbers, and for Snake he's 3rd party, I really don't know how that works

 

[Gnight]

and for Snake he's 3rd party

What does being 3rd party have to do with it? Smash has 2 third party newcomers plus Sonic! What's the real reason Snake got excluded?

 

[Wintropy]

Of course I've thought of this before, where and how to start however is a different question altogether.

That's why God invented social media. Inaugurate a campaign to get the attention of Nintendo using their official pages and feeds and then get some catchy slogans and regular updates going. #MonadoMonday and the Kremling Kampaign have similar aims and they're pretty well-known and easy to use vox pop systems.

 

[lightdasher]

What does being 3rd party have to do with it? Smash has 2 third party newcomers plus Sonic! What's the real reason Snake got excluded?

Pff I don't know, too gritty? Snakes image has exclusivity at the moment? I'm not up to date with Snake stuff, hence why I left him out at this point.

That's why God invented social media. Inaugurate a campaign to get the attention of Nintendo using their official pages and feeds and then get some catchy slogans and regular updates going. #MonadoMonday and the Kremling Kampaign have similar aims and they're pretty well-known and easy to use vox pop systems.

Gee I've never been too good with this sort of thing, only social sites I know of are Facebook, twitter and tumblr.

But I am willing to try of course

 

[Gnight]

Sakurai should've stuck with the Wii-U.

 

[lightdasher]

Sakurai should've stuck with the Wii-U.

I did read up two different things, one that Smash was planned for just 3DS, and another that he had planned on dropping the 3DS version at some point, I don't have a source on either of these things though.

 

[Wintropy]

Sakurai should've stuck with the Wii-U.

It might be a tad harsh to alienate an entire potential consumer base due to technical limitations, how and ever. The 3DS is 99.9% the same as the Wii U in its fundamental physics and gameplay - dropping some characters is a sad but necessary price for the aility to play Smash on the go and appeal to a much wider demographic at that.

 

[lightdasher]

It might be a tad harsh to alienate an entire potential consumer base due to technical limitations, how and ever. The 3DS is 99.9% the same as the Wii U in its fundamental physics and gameplay - dropping some characters is a sad but necessary price for the aility to play Smash on the go and appeal to a much wider demographic at that.

While I can agree on cuts for a cruddy system, why does a far superior console have to suffer for it?

 

[Gnight]

It might be a tad harsh to alienate an entire potential consumer base due to technical limitations, how and ever. The 3DS is 99.9% the same as the Wii U in its fundamental physics and gameplay - dropping some characters is a sad but necessary price for the aility to play Smash on the go and appeal to a much wider demographic at that.

Welp, like I said in another thread, it's a cash grab. I personally couldn't care less about smash "on the go"

R.I.P.
Popo & Nana

 

[lightdasher]

Welp, like I said in another thread, it's a cash grab. I personally couldn't care less about smash "on the go"

R.I.P.
Popo & Nana

And the others.

You know, I'm surprised they didn't even get stages

 

[Wintropy]

While I can agree on cuts for a cruddy system, why does a far superior console have to suffer for it?

Because terms like "cruddy" and "far superior" are inherently subjective. Sorry to sound harsh here, but your priorities don't represent the overall Smash consumer base - I'd happily accept my losses of beloved veterans if it meant greater enjoyment for the greater population.

Incidentally, I play Lucas and Wolf in Brawl, so I do know how it feels to lose your favourite characters for technical , albeit not unjustifiable, reasons.

 

[Vintage Creep]

We can do nothing for anyone, but everyone still has a chance of being DLC. Yes even Ice Climbers.

 

[Gnight]

And the others.

You know, I'm surprised they didn't even get stages

I hope you don't mean Ice Climber stages! Yeah, let's tease the players with IC stages but no IC!

 

[lightdasher]

Because terms like "cruddy" and "far superior" are inherently subjective. Sorry to sound harsh here, but your priorities don't represent the overall Smash consumer base - I'd happily accept my losses of beloved veterans if it meant greater enjoyment for the greater population..

I think you may have misinterpreted what I said

 

[TheDMonroeShow]

Sakurai should've stuck with the Wii-U.

I would of prefered that personally but i dont think having both is a huge issue. I think it's more that Sakurai should of not let the Wii u version be held back and that's where the problem lies. Not in the 3ds version itself but the fact that its holding back the Wii u version.

There's really no reason for them to have the same roster if there was no cross play. The 3ds could of had another nes rep(rob?) or one ice climber or something...but I digress. Just wish there was something we could do.

 

[praline]

Honestly Mewtwo was the only one I cared about and if he's not dlc I won't lose sleep. Cause I never have any.

 

[Wintropy]

I think you may have misinterpreted what I said

It seems to me that you're saying you can understand the ICies being cut from the 3DS version, but that you'd be okay with them remaining on the Wii U version all the same.

The reason Sakurai opted for that contingency is because he doesn't want to play favourites with consoles. Everybody gets the same experience. You can stamp your feet and lament to the heavens all day and night that it's not fair that your character roster has to suffer because of it, but it's actually entirely fair. Nobody said fairness is fun or even nice, but Sakurai did what he thinks is best for the consumers, and that's something that we have to accept.

Quite frankly, I like the idea of your campaign. Your intentions are good and you have altruistic aims. The things you have to remember, though, are that Nintendo is a business, not a humanitarian organisation, and that they're interested in fans' opinions insofar as they provide them with sound data and potential product ideas. If you want this campaign to succeed, you're going to have to leave any and all biases at the door and approach it from a totally neutral, impartial perspective: don't just say "we want Ice Climbers because they're the best ever kthxbai", because then you'll just come across as a whiny fan that's throwing a temper tantrum because they didn't get their favourite toy. Tell them honestly and succinctly that you think the Brawl vets are an integral part of the roster and that you will be interested in seeing them as DLC in future. That means you've advanced from a shrieking fanboy who's only interested in their own needs and wants to a genuine concerned consumer that is giving them proper aid and cares about the future health of their business.

In essence, it helps if you do the thinking for them and are polite about it. If they see that you've got a real campaign going and that you're willing and able to motivate people to such common causes, they'll see that you're informed and educated and will pay more attention to you than if you just throw petitions at them and bombard them with Facebook messages and Twitter posts.

 

[Hayzie]

Smash 3ds should have just took the cuts to the roster, people would still be satisifed to have Smash on a portable. It already took cuts to the stages anyways with past stages representing most franchises. Let the Wii U version flourish as it's going to inevitably be beastly over the 3DS version anyways.

A simple "please understand" is all.

 

[lightdasher]

I did read all that you had and why do you still think this thread is JUST for Ice Climbers? I want to make this 100% Clear right now that I don't want JUST Ice Climbers, sure they're the one I'm most hurt about but I still want Lucas, Wolf and Mewtwo back

-Removed just so it doesn't clog up this reply-

In all seriousness though, I am willing, I just don't feel like I am capable on doing this all on my own, I mean campaigns like the K.K.Rool and MonadoMonday .ect aren't just one person are they?

And I'm sure I'd be able to remain neutral, a simple "think before you say something" hrm?

EDIT: Don't forget Japan is getting the N3DS very soon, so Icies in particular coming back on as DLC isn't that farfetched

 

[Wintropy]

I did read all that you had and why do you still think this thread is JUST for Ice Climbers? I want to make this 100% Clear right now that I don't want JUST Ice Climbers, sure they're the one I'm most hurt about but I still want Lucas, Wolf and Mewtwo back



In all seriousness though, I am willing, I just don't feel like I am capable on doing this all on my own, I mean campaigns like the K.K.Rool and MonadoMonday .ect aren't just one person are they?

And I'm sure I'd be able to remain neutral, a simple "think before you say something" hrm?

EDIT: Don't forget Japan is getting the N3DS very soon, so Icies in particular coming back on as DLC isn't that farfetched

I don't think it's all about the ICies. I'm using them as the most convenient example because that's what we were discussing immediately prior.

Every campaign has to start somewhere. Starting this thread is a good initial step, as it's helping to contribute to the movement's grassroots conceptions, so now you just need to get to know other like-minded people and formulate a decent campaign strategy. When lots of people who do things on their own come together, it can create quite a powerful influence for change.

 

[Gnight]

The reason Sakurai opted for that contingency is because he doesn't want to play favourites with consoles. Everybody gets the same experience.
.

So, no DLC Ice Climbers then?

 

[Wintropy]

So, no DLC Ice Climbers then?

If Sakurai can work out the technical limitations or alter their fighting style to work better on the system, sure.

Guys, I'm with you on this campaign, don't worry. I'm pretty confident DLC is a thing and we'll see the ICies back before long.

 

[lightdasher]

so now you just need to get to know other like-minded people and formulate a decent campaign strategy.

This is the part that trips me up. But I guess I'm already halfway there, what with people coming into this topic already.

 

[Gnight]

Ice Climbers is a big deal because normally someone gets cut due to unpopularity or sakurai just doesn't like the character (mewtwo),. That just did not apply to IC.