Is Sing Useless?

[BobEugCox]

I have loved Jigglypuff since the Smash 64, but have noticed that Sing has been essentially useless since Brawl. I watched a YouTube video of her gameplay in Sm4sh and noticed it seems unchanged. You sing, your opponent falls asleep and wakes up before or right when you're through with your pretty song.

Does anyone know how to make good use of this move?

 

[ZeroJanitor]

It puts enemies asleep longer at higher percents in Brawl, but it's still totally unsafe and punishable unless you get really lucky. Puff mains generally only use it to ledgestall, if that.

Smash 4's Sing actually seems to be an improvement at it appears to activate the sleepbox sooner.

 

[Morbi]

Jigglypuff's sing has been useless since Brawl? I did not believe that it was useful in Smash 64 or Melee either...

I am not sure what has changed to be honest. I am probably going to use Hyper Voice.

 

[Spirst]

Jigglypuff's sing has been useless since Brawl? I did not believe that it was useful in Smash 64 or Melee either...

I am not sure what has changed to be honest. I am probably going to use Hyper Voice.

It wasn't, really. It was never that good of a move in the first place regardless of which Smash iteration you're talking about.

I'm going with hypervoice too. Maybe then Up-B will have some semblance of usage.

 

[Jigglymaster]

It has its uses sometimes. If you can catch an opponent off guard, you can catch them with a ledge cancelled sing into rest. Maybe on stage is 100% useless, but it has its moments on the ledge.

However, Im looking forward to that Custom reflect sing, that supposivly turns opponents around when they get hit by it. Imagine edgegaurding with that like it's Mario's cape.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

Ledge-cancel Sing has been the only way to properly use it ever, and since that's back its usage hasn't really changed. Still, ledge-cancelling it should only ever be done as a wild card.

I think the second Sing customization is the best version of it though, the damage dealing one, if only because it seems okay-ish as an edge-guarding tool. Still, I'd prefer going out there and B-Air/F-Air my opponent instead.

 

[DarkKry4]

I think the second Sing customization is the best version of it though, the damage dealing one, if only because it seems okay-ish as an edge-guarding tool. Still, I'd prefer going out there and B-Air/F-Air my opponent instead.

agreed.... though the back-turning song looks like a fun move to troll with in team fights hehe

 

[The Puffer]

For me it's really useful ON team matches

 

[KingofPhantoms]

Well for one thing it was fun to troll people online with.

Really though it never really had much of a use outside the occasional surprise ledge attack. I use Jiggs quite a lot in both Brawl and Melee and can never recall attempting to use Sing in a serious match. I'm glad customization's offered up some new options for her in it's place.

 

[Chauzu]

If Sing has been buffed as it looks (and buffed enough) maybe it will be worth using more to set-up for Rest?

Heck, just Jiggly having anything useful as up special would be neat.

 

[Krynxe]

Is sing useless?

yes



was that question so hard guys? haha i'm just playing though, but i don't think sing will be good competitively

 

[Ray_Kalm]

A different point of view, I think sing will have practicable uses now. It has less lag and puts people to sleep longer, and with the different mechanics in play, characters will more often run into sing themselves than be forcibly be sung at.

 

[guedes the brawler]

it's great for a grab release combo on doubles.

if you get a good read on rolling, it works well too...

 

[HeavyLobster]

It still isn't very good, but it does look somewhat usable as a roll punish at high %s, or just the usual ledge-cancelled gimmicks. It's probably the best it's been in the series, though you still probably won't want to use it much.

 

[Jiggsbomb]

I have loved Jigglypuff since the Smash 64, but have noticed that Sing has been essentially useless since Brawl. I watched a YouTube video of her gameplay in Sm4sh and noticed it seems unchanged. You sing, your opponent falls asleep and wakes up before or right when you're through with your pretty song.

Does anyone know how to make good use of this move?

I mostly use it to ledgestall , when i play for glory, online. But every now and then i use it too be a "Cheeky bugger". So sing can be good, depending what situation you´re in.

 

[Downsider]

I've used it twice so far, and both times I was able to combo into rest. Both times I used it in a situation where I thought my opponent would use a get-up attack from the ledge.

If they DO use a get-up attack from the ledge, you can put them to sleep during their get up animation before the attack comes out, at least on Captain Falcon. Then, if you activated it early enough, you will have enough time to combo into rest.

 

[Critzilean]

I really wish they gave Jiggs a new Up Special and just made Sing a taunt with a secondary effect (Like Luigi and Greninja Down Taunt), but alas, too late now.

 

[Bedoop]

a taunt with a secondary effect (Like Greninja Down Taunt)

That has a secondary effect?
What does it do? '-'

 

[Critzilean]

That has a secondary effect?
What does it do? '-'

It pops enemies up and does 2%

 

[Doroco]

jump up really high, cast sing, fall onto ground, watch people fall asleep in the middle if charging their smashes, initiate operation resterino

 

[BambooEarpick]

First off, I'm pretty new to smash. I don't know a lot of things but anyway...
So, I think non-custom sing has two hit boxes. I've only tested this on the training dummy (mario) so I don't know if this is for all characters or anything.
If Mario is far away but within sing range he will fall asleep and wake up before Jiggly stops singing. However, if I have Jiggly right up against Mario when I start sing Mario will sleep through the entire attack and there's enough time to get off a rest.
Of course, since this is a dummy there's no mash to end sleep going on but I'm pretty sure there are two sleep hitboxes to sing.

 

[lRasha]

I played a friend's 3DS recently. I tested Jigglypuff's Sing a little bit. I put Megaman at 51%. When I used Sing, Megaman slept long enough for me to use Rest.

 

[BobEugCox]

@lRasha
Nice! I'm a big fan of both Sing and Rest, but I guess just like Jigglypuff in general they're high risk... high reward.

 

[Zippy]

I can say I've been using Sing & Rest a LOT online.

Sing is really useful if your opponent is just a little too close to the ledge - no one ever really expects me to ledge-cancel my Sing, lull them to sleep, and land a rest. Your opponent is usually sleep long enough passed 55~65% damage.

 

[Krynxe]

http://smashboards.com/threads/analysis-sing-custom-upbs-and-sing-stopped-attacks.373896/

 

[Elthon]

Sing rules now IMO. Roll out canceling and ledge guarding. But I use it frequently coming back down from the air. Since rest has a bigger hit box its so much more convenient now after a combo. :]

 

[Sakuraichu]

Sing+Side B combo says no. You just need to be close.

 

[OddCrow]

Sing is def. usable. You just have to know how to punish with it - learn opponent's habits, bait them and sing em. It works well for catching people who recover high

 

[Thinkaman]

Roll out canceling

What??? I want more words!

 

[Krynxe]

Sing is def. usable. You just have to know how to punish with it - learn opponent's habits, bait them and sing em. It works well for catching people who recover high

You could also just punish them with attacks or rest. If your opponent recovers high, then they're not on the floor and can't be put to sleep until they land, meaning they're have to be in freefall falling directly above you THUS they recovered terribly. In an actually high level match, this would not happen, and if it did you could simply punish with rest instead of taking the extra risk. In general, when you learn your opponents habits you want to capitalize with normal attacks to rack up damage and be safe, and use rests for hard reads and punishes. Sing will almost always be risky and unnecessary against competent players

What??? I want more words!

I think he means cancelling rollout by grabbing the ledge, which doesn't actually help puff that much, not sure though

 

[Coonce]

Building off what Krynxe said... It takes quite a few frames for the actual hitbox of sing to come out whereas rest only takes 1 frame. If you honestly have enough time to punish with sing, you have enough time to short hop and rest.

 

[PeachPlumPear]

It's definitely not useless, but it's almost never the best option, either. If you read the opponent well and they have a high %, you can cancel a lot of horizontal attacks that opponents use (such as Charizard flare blitz), but in general they're playing badly if you have enough time to punish that with Sing.

 

[RedBeanPorridge]

Has the hitbox for it increased? I feel like the third hit when she says "puff~" might have a larger hitbox than the first two hits? I havent tested to make sure but today I used sing while next to a stationary opponent , who stopped moving when they saw that I used sing likely because they weren't very experienced and were not sure what it was capable of.

He was just outside of jigglypuff's sing rings which made me think "damn I missed, I'm gonna get punished for sure" however just as jigglypuff's sing was about to end, my opponent fell asleep.

I'll test this out later to see if it is true.

 

[RedBeanPorridge]

Has the hitbox for it increased? I feel like the third hit when she says "puff~" might have a larger hitbox than the first two hits? I havent tested to make sure but today I used sing while next to a stationary opponent , who stopped moving when they saw that I used sing likely because they weren't very experienced and were not sure what it was capable of.

He was just outside of jigglypuff's sing rings which made me think "damn I missed, I'm gonna get punished for sure" however just as jigglypuff's sing was about to end, my opponent fell asleep.

I'll test this out later to see if it is true.

Alright I tested it out with multiple characters and it turns out it may have just been because of the character's idle animations making them just touch sing's hitbox.

 

[Saikyoshi]

I use Sing to punish opponents climbing up the ledge, and then finish them with an FSmash, all the time. Takes a little reading, but it's pretty reliable if you know how to do it.

 

[misterOWAIN33]

A good combo I like to use: Sing. As they wake up, use Rest.
Of course, you do have to know the hitbox for rest and you have to time Sing.
But if you do...

 

[Elthon]

What??? I want more words!

Hahaha, Im sorry for the lack of details! I have not figured all the percentages out yet and when this will always work, but for alot of characters that dash/ roll at certain times you can just sing when they are dashing/ rolling at you and stop them in their tracks. Which can lead to a rest punish/ combo. But I don't think sing will be good competitively, its way to risky.

 

[Deadshot]

You'll only get sings off a ledge stalling, really only works on people who don't know about it. I like to throw them out once in awhile just for mindgames. They'll either back off or so go for a smash thinking I'll do a 2nd one, it's a dece fake-out.

 

[TimeSmash]

Well in For Glory doubles, which isn't saying much haha, I can land Sing a LOT easier. I took advantage of two aggro people on the other team and their landing lag, used Sing and nailed them both and killed one with Rest. Amazing

 

[UTSmash]

Sing is pretty bad... I wish they'd make it last longer so it would be worthwhile...