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Is SBB ruined?

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kitsuneboy_geoff

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jul 29, 2005
Messages
182
Dude you honestly know nothing about Melee then if you think competitive play is seizuring along the ground.

Melee was a faster game then the first one we all know. Some characters could move insanely fast (Fox). But Fox doesn't need to be played insanely fast to win. You have to be smart too.

There is no combo ability in Brawl, there is like no stun either.

I played Brawl. As I said before great party game bad competitive

EDIT: Smash64 Brawl is nothing like Melee or 64
No, I don't believe that. I know the depth of competitive play. It was kinda intended as a joke, but I guess people didn't take it that way.

I play against tournament-goers/pro players on a regular basis. I'm sorry if I offended you. ^^;;
 

Dragonboy2k4

Smash Ace
Joined
Jun 3, 2006
Messages
723
Location
Location: 1vs1 no items online at this very moment

kitsuneboy_geoff

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jul 29, 2005
Messages
182
You didn't offend me you just made it seem like you knew nothing about it.
Okay, gotcha. :D

I still disagree with you though. How much have you played Brawl? It's perfectly possible to combo, you just have to learn a bit of new timing. It's tougher; I'll give you that, but I've got off four+ hit combos based around Pika's upsmash, u-air, and neutral air. Predicting the course of action that your opponent will take is more important, though, due to the floatiness. And, if they out-play and out-guess you, they'll be able to escape.

The increased floatiness also makes it far easier to jump off the stage after your opponent and finish him or her off without screwing up and dying yourself. Some of the most interesting fights occur off the sides of the stage. You can try to go over, under, or just through, people trying to do this, as well.

I think there's lots of new strategies... certainly I have been discovering new tricks and tactics during the time that I've played it. I've logged 7-10 hours on it. Not as much as some people, but enough to begin realizing that the game really does have potential depth.

Baily, you and the other nay-sayers should just give it a year or two... It took me a long time to reach my current skill level in Melee and it'll take a long time for me to get as good in Brawl.
 

Bailey

Smash Hero
Joined
Feb 9, 2006
Messages
5,057
Location
Rockland County,NY
Dragonboy has yet to prove a point in this thread.

Also Kitsune I played Brawl for about 5 hours. It didn't seem like there is combo ability there is virtually no stun and all moves just don't connect to each other as well. Unless your Marth's F-air
 

Chexr

Smash Ace
Joined
Jan 23, 2004
Messages
817
Location
Minnesota
Maybe you just suck at it? Cause I was combo'ing fairly well.

Also

Melee = tech skill
Brawl = mind games

choose your style
 

Chexr

Smash Ace
Joined
Jan 23, 2004
Messages
817
Location
Minnesota
LOL, no but the games are certainly based more to that style of play. Lets try not to be so insulting next time.
 

Bailey

Smash Hero
Joined
Feb 9, 2006
Messages
5,057
Location
Rockland County,NY
No they aren't you ******.

You don't win with Tech Skill alone. You need to be smart holy cr@p you are honestly the dumbest member I have ever seen.
 

Chexr

Smash Ace
Joined
Jan 23, 2004
Messages
817
Location
Minnesota
Why would I bother arguing with the ******* on this board I dont know.

Brawl takes more mind games to succeed than melee does.
Melee takes more tech skill to succeed than brawl.

Don't you question my smash intelligence I've been playing competitively for 6 years and certainly know more than you seem to.
 

Chaosblade77

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 1, 2007
Messages
1,958
I think Brawl has combos, I've seen plenty in videos. Now, this is an impression simply from videos, but it looks like Brawl is more difficult to play well than Melee.

This is actually caused by the moves that are more difficult to combo and the fact there is such little stun time. You can't just Marth fair a few times and say "lol combo" you will have to vary it a bit more based on prediction. I think that will play a huge role in Brawl, much MUCH more than it did previously.

In the end, technical skill is less important than it was because mindgames and more advanced character knowledge would be virtually required. Basically, the quicker-thinking players will have the largest advantage in Brawl. Being able to pick out every single option your opponent has and predict which one option they will take, all in the time between your attacks. Then you add in even the minor technical skills Brawl has, and it's has it's depth.

As for why it's deeper than Melee in that aspect, potentially, is because of less stun time, your opponent has more options. More prediction required.

As I said, I haven't played it, but that is my impression from videos.
 

Chexr

Smash Ace
Joined
Jan 23, 2004
Messages
817
Location
Minnesota
Ok now I know you're trolling me.

Btw I just watched some of your youtube vids. LOL

Chaosblade said it perfectly.
 

firexemblemxpryde

Smash Lord
Joined
Dec 20, 2005
Messages
1,440
Location
Burnaby, BC
I didn't like Brawl that much. But I had lots of fun, Pikachu can actually do moves now.
It just appeared to me like the fun would end within... a few months of playing it? But I could be wrong. I mean maybe humans will find ways to get really good at the game. From what I saw/played, the difference in skill between "top" and "pro-am" players will be... not much.

And that's what made melee a lot of fun for me... getting better. And exploring/doing things with my character I hadn't done before. How high can the learning curve for brawl be? I'm not quite convinced yet.

Auto sweetspot? Even with grapples? And are there any infinites found yet? Upon first playing the game, it seemed like the perfect game for those people in melee who thought they were really good, and were decent, just before seeing how huge the game really is. You know, that kid who plays his friends and beats them all the time because they're noobs, and he knows how take advantage.

Not for someone who loves the game and is willing to pay hundreds and hundreds of dollars to travel to another country/state to see how he/she fares against some of the best.

But then again, it's a different game. And maybe I'm just a noob.
 

kitsuneboy_geoff

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Jul 29, 2005
Messages
182
:) Gald to see that you agree.

Kitsuneboy:Yo,since you do have the game man,could you try out something with Mario for me? I need to know if Mario can use Fludd pack to gain momentum back to safety.I seen videos of those crazy Japanese players do it with Squirtle.
Heh... I don't own the game. I just play it up at my University on occasion (read: quite frequently). Trust me, I'd have a lot more than 7-10 hours if I owned it. Anyway, you'd probably be able to find an answer faster online. I probably won't be playing again 'till Monday at least.
 

firexemblemxpryde

Smash Lord
Joined
Dec 20, 2005
Messages
1,440
Location
Burnaby, BC
I'm implying they are not. I'm comparing infinites with autosweetspots and auto-grapples. Which I've heard suck.

I heard lots of dumb things. Like if you are Fox and you get someone against a wall, you hold down and you spam B, and it's an infinite. Is this BS? And I've heard Falco can dthrow -> laser for way too long.

I heard edgehogging grappling characters ***** them. Doesn't that kinda ruin a few characters?

and that tone of voice is rather aggressive, RedMage. Maybe you can enlighten me by replying to the rest of my post, I'm no brawl expert.

edit:// this thread is in bad need of an "overly-optimistic /obviously-trying-to-assure-oneself" check. I smell a lot of unfounded optimism.
 

Dragonboy2k4

Smash Ace
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Jun 3, 2006
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723
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Location: 1vs1 no items online at this very moment
Heh... I don't own the game. I just play it up at my University on occasion (read: quite frequently). Trust me, I'd have a lot more than 7-10 hours if I owned it. Anyway, you'd probably be able to find an answer faster online. I probably won't be playing again 'till Monday at least.

Thats cool,just PM me the answer or whenever you have time man to play it man.Cuz as for me being a Mario main,its really uber diffcult to find out what Mario can really do especially here on this site/videos because everyones picking all the new characters and such.
 

TheBigBadCow

Smash Cadet
Joined
Oct 28, 2007
Messages
33
If brawl is ruined, its only cause you guys keep nit-picking it to death.

Melee had problems. Huge balancing problems, for one. Yet we took them all in stride. Why can't we do the same for Brawl?
 

Darkslash

Smash Master
Joined
Feb 1, 2008
Messages
4,076
Location
Strangereal Equestria
No he's not... he's just saying that mind games are more important in Brawl. Jeez

How did such a belligerent member become a mod?
The World Works in Mysterious ways.

with alot of people Relying on AdvTechs, maybe they will say Brawl sucks becuase they removed AdvTechs. Which is plain stupid. Well not the removal of the AdvTechs that is...
 

Endless Nightmares

Smash Master
Joined
Sep 23, 2006
Messages
4,090
Location
MN
I'd expect better from a moderator, actually. Don't you guys have a rule against 1-liners?
No he's not... he's just saying that mind games are more important in Brawl. Jeez

How did such a belligerent member become a mod?
I'd just like to point out that not a single moderator has posted in this thread >________>

I agree on the belligerent part though :laugh:
 

Endless Nightmares

Smash Master
Joined
Sep 23, 2006
Messages
4,090
Location
MN
WHY IS A TROLL TOPIC GETTING THIS MANY POSTS!

I guess I'm not helping, but still >_>
Well.... The Online Mode IS pretty bad. BUT theres is one. Melee did NOT have that. Wavedashing IS NOT needed to play smash. Wavedashing was JUST a GLITCH. How did you expect them to not come acrossed it? And melee had 7 Alike Characters out of 25. Thats a little more than 1/4.... Brawl has 6 Alike Characters out of 35... Thats 1/5 the roster..... There are less clones and more characters in brawl..... And well i didnt really like wave dashing and neither did alot of ppl..... Well there i just made brawl good again...
BTW this guy's a ****ing idiot
 

Endless Nightmares

Smash Master
Joined
Sep 23, 2006
Messages
4,090
Location
MN
I'm really not a Big fan of Wave Dash. That's the one reason i don't like Melee Wave Dash :ohwell: Ohh well



FLAMESHIELD UP
Man I HATE competitive posters like you! FlameShielding is a ****ing GLITCH that should've been removed from the last version :mad::mad::mad:

I hope it gets taken out just like DoublePosting was!
 

Zeyeth

Smash Cadet
Joined
Feb 15, 2008
Messages
33
Location
Atlanta GA (Originally from St.Louis MO_
So I'm gonna like say that everyone is a clone because all of their up-b's are used to recover. And every character that has a projectile is a clone cause they all throw something and it hits someone from a distance. Mario and Marth are clones cause they both start with "MAR" and are 5 letters!

facepalm
 

chms

Smash Rookie
Joined
Feb 11, 2008
Messages
9
Location
MA
I will first start by saying that brawl is in no way a BAD game. It is different. I have a close friend with a japanese copy of brawl and a japanese wii. i have logged well over fourty hours of playtime in the game. I play against Korean DJ, Omega Black Mage, and other tournament calibur players. I also play at my college's gaming club, where casual gaming is emphasized. I have not played any of the single player, as I do not speak or read japanese, therefore I will not comment on that. I also have not used the WiFi settings, as all of my friends who are interested in brawl go to the same school as me.

I have some legitimate complaints, and praises regarding brawl. I apologize if I am repeating things that have already been said. Even though they may not be original, these are my observations about the game. I am not the final authority on the game by any means, nor am I trying to appear so. Rather I am giving my opinion. Please don't flame me.

There is a much stronger emphasis on casual gaming, which reflects Nintendo’s general migration towards party games. The technical skills that separated tournament players from a casual gamer are now gone. You can no longer L cancel (which leads to no shuffling or wave dashing). I do admit that casual gaming can be very fun. Many gamers don't like competitive games, and just want to relax with their friends. This is fine. However, the fact that technical moves exist does not take away from casual gaming. You DON'T have to use them. I consider myself a competitive gamer, but when I played with my friends who weren't I would hold back. In melee I would play bowser and mewtwo against my casual gamer friends and it worked fine. By removing the technical aspects of a game, you don't enhance the casual game. You only remove the potential for people to play competitively. As I (as a competitive gamer) acknowledge the fun of just chilling with your friends, playing a videogame, casual gamers must acknowledge that there can be (and for many people is) a great deal of fun in mastering a game through working out the technical aspects and playing competitively. This is my main criticism of brawl.

Along the same line of thought, I do not like the difficulty of edge guarding in brawl. Everyone's recovery is SO good that it is nearly impossible. I remember hitting a luigi five times, while he was hovering around the edge, and he still managed to recover successfully after I ran out of jumps (i was playing Kirby at the time). The game discourages me from working hard, and I personally find that aggravating.

There are many things that I like about brawl. Mainly the character selection. With the exception of Lucas and ness (and the recycling of some final smashes, eg the landmaster) There are no clones in brawl. Marth plays NOTHING like Ike. CFalc is not the same as gannondorf at all. The space animals (fox, wolf, and falco) have distinctive move sets and feels. Lucardio is mewtwo 2.0, but with the absence of mewtwo, that is not an issue. Also the addition of fresh characters is very welcome. There is something for everybody. Also, I have found that the characters are much more balanced in terms of priority vs speed vs power. It is much more difficult to define tiers (as reading many threads in the brawl character discussion further prove). I view this as a good thing. I was tired of facing only 4 characters at my local tournaments. I believe that these newly balanced characters will add more variety to the game's tournament scene which will help remedy the lack of technical moves.

Also, most of the stages are well designed. In general, your platforms are stable. The stage rarely kills you, which was one of my biggest pet peeves in melee. I especially love the Wario Ware stage, which is really fun when you can’t read the instructions on the minigames. The only stages I don’t like are the Mother stage (which is WAYYY too big), the new Final Destination (which traps you against the side of the stage with most characters’ recovery), the new DK stage (which resembles the ice climbers stage with pointy death spikes placed on various spots) and the 8bit DK stage (you can’t fall through the platforms, and the springs and original DK kill you way too easily).
 

chms

Smash Rookie
Joined
Feb 11, 2008
Messages
9
Location
MA
One other thing I forgot to mention about brawl: I love that airdodging doesn't suicide you anymore. That is a definate improvement over melee.
 
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