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Ike Boards General/Q&A Thread

Blubolouis

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 11, 2010
Messages
1,005
Location
Paris, France
Be very patient in this mu, focus on PSing stuff and not taking stupid damage. So even if you'll have to close the distance sometimes, walking is very important. When you get hit by a bomb or a boomerang, look out for TL's positioning so that you don't airdodge too soon -even though you might get frame trapped anyway. A good timing on the dodge+good SDI on the bomb if you see it coming can prevent him from actually taking your stock.
Some of TL's stuff is unpunishable if he can manage his space well (retreating fair, full hop retreating nair, even spaced dtilt on shield...). Try and learn to recognize when you can actually punish something or when you should just take the occasion to get more ground control, which is equally, if not more, important.
You might find easier to punish TL's landing than go looking for him in the air. Finally, it's supposedly easy to edgeguard him offstage, pressuring him with fair, dair, nair, and even a counter in his upB. I suck at it though.

For Peach: if she's a super campy peach, you must take advantage of her pulling turnips to gain stage control, or to dash attack her offstage. Each character strives on pressuring the other when he doesn't have enough room to move around and space as he wishes. So if she camps, it opens opportunities for her (punishing more aerials, strings, etc) but she leaves some room for you. If (or simply when) she tries to pressure you, you can try and jab when she's actually on the ground, but be careful that she doesn't bait you into that. She doesn't have a whole lot of reasons to try and fight your jab up close without first landing an autocancelled and unpunishable fair, or stuff like that.
Once you've gained enough stage control, you can try a regular form of aerial keep away game, mainly based on bair. It's your best answer to both turnips throws, and her aerials approaches (seriously, it'll stuff ALL her float options, and can catch turnips).
Random tips: always DI up vs Peach. Always. Her only vertical killmove is Usmash (which shouldn't touch you) and I guess Uair, at very high%. A good DI will allow you to live to annoyingly high %.
Same as TL, can be pressured offstage. Fair, or (my favorite) take the edge, wait for commitment such as fast-fall or sideB, ledgedrop doublle-jump Bair all work great. Don't go for a counter unless she's already used her DJ.

Both characters have some gimmicks on the edge, but can be kept there for a long time with patience. If a peach has saved her float before taking the edge (she only regains it after using it if she touches the actual ground, not the edge), she has one more options, which is basically a wavedash onstage with more invincibility. Careful with your fair pressure if she has that option. Prefer reacting to her options with shield+jab or grab.
 

Teh Brettster

Smash Master
Joined
Nov 30, 2008
Messages
3,428
Location
Denton, Texas (Dallas)
Just about every other move toon link uses is highly punishable...look for those openings and wreck shop. Rave is 100% correct about jabs. Combat walking is hella hard for a TL to get out of until its done a lot of damage. Up tilt is great for when the TL trys to get in close after his inevitable projectile wall spam.
This post is about 100% incorrect. True, TL's weight and tendency to be in the air make him a good combat walk target if he messes up. The rest is dumb.
 

Heartstring

Smash Legend
Joined
Jun 12, 2009
Messages
11,129
Location
England
This post is about 100% incorrect. True, TL's weight and tendency to be in the air make him a good combat walk target if he messes up. The rest is dumb.
Pretty much this, even then, Combat walking shouldnt happen beyond 3 reps before they SDI out of it, otherwise its just a bad opponent.
That said, Cheers for posting that wall Blubo, will check it out when i have some time on my hands
 

Oddyesy

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 15, 2013
Messages
954
Location
Dallas, Texas
NNID
Oddyesy
Hey there guys, I've always mained Ike since launch (because Roy was better than Marth and Ike replaced Roy as the FE rep other than Marth). But I've only recently decided to actually try and be good better at Ike. I've been playing with other people and they've told me that I: spam shield grabs, dodges, and QD, I SD randomly 'cause I suck at paying attention, and that I suck at spacing. I know that there's probably a bunch more that I could improve on, and if you could help me then that'd be awesome.

Friendly neighborhood Spiderman reminder that the next Ike biweekly is this Sunday, August 4th at 3CST (4EST, 2PST, etc). Join dat Skype chat!
Huh? what's this?
 

Pheta Ray

Smash Ace
Joined
Oct 14, 2012
Messages
816
Location
Kerry, Ireland
if you could help me then that'd be awesome.
QuickDraw: Here's your first problem: you're using QD in-game. Stop using it entirely. When you get better, you'll know when you can start using it. I only know of one Ike who uses QD for movement and he's absolutely perfect at it. For now, stay away from QD as much as you can unless it's a last ditch effort for recovery.

Spacing: (Fair and Nair) Well, it'll take a bit. But try to make it so that the edge of Ragnell, just as it turns into a diamond shape, is hitting the shield of the opponent. If that's too far, move it just a bit closer. I'm not gonna lie, it will take a while.

Fixing Spam Shield Grabs: You have better OoS (out of shield) options than pressing A while shielding. Buffering a jab works a lot better OoS, and in my opinion is generally a lot safer. A whiffed grab can get you punished, but a whiffed jab1 can turn into a jab combo if the opponent is hasty. I struggle with this a bit too. Just work on staying in shield more, and instead of going for shield grabs, drop shield and jab, Nair, Fair, or Bair if the opponent is behind you. Grabbing is good, just not spammable.

SDing: Four words for you. Nair off-stage is bad. With a 74 total frame completion, it's no wonder people SD with it all the time. Try to be more careful if you're Nairing off-stage. If it's just because you're distracted by the guy next to you texting your mom about pizza tomorrow night, one, beat the living crap out of that guy and two, try to pay attention on the match itself. Focus is key to a great Ike game.

Another thing. Learn to jab cancel. If you do know how, great. If not, learn. Ike without jab canceling is like Kirby with 2 jumps; you see the problem there? Go for jab1>jab1>jab2>jab3 at first, then string into jab1>jab2>jab1>jab2>jab3 later on. Then mix it up a lot more, after you've mastered it.

Also, Ike has a guaranteed combo. It's Bthrow to dash attack. Around the time Ike kicks the opponent behind him, input a dash. As soon as he starts moving, hit down on your C-stick. You'll know that you've buffered the dash if no smoke comes out of Ike's heels when he starts moving.

Speaking of C-sticks, if you'd like to make life a bit easier, I recommend changing from Smash Stick to Attack Stick. That is, setting C-stick to attack instead of smash. This allows for Nairs with C-stick (you heard right), a Dair that doesn't fastfall (allowing for walk-off Dair spikes), and much easier usage of Utilt. Anything I missed, the other guys will cover.

what's the Ike social bi-weekly?
Every 2 weeks in the Skype chat, Meneil or Berserker Swordsman will host the Ike bi-weekly, a tournament designed to see who the best Ike in the chat is. It's a round-robin tournament and it's a great way to meet people and play them. If you get shut out 0-2 every game, don't feel bad. That's my record from the past 2 bi-weeklies I attended.

If you'd like to join the Ike social Skype group, one, make a Skype. You can't join with an AIM account. Two, add either myself (rolex890), Waldo (hotsuma.1) or Berserker Swordsman (kitekirby). Just tell them Rolex sent you, and that you'd like to join the Ike social and perhaps the Ike bi-weekly. That's up to Meneil and Berserker, though.



Much said, much accomplished I hope. Welcome to the family.
 

Oddyesy

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 15, 2013
Messages
954
Location
Dallas, Texas
NNID
Oddyesy
QuickDraw: Here's your first problem: you're using QD in-game. Stop using it entirely. When you get better, you'll know when you can start using it. I only know of one Ike who uses QD for movement and he's absolutely perfect at it. For now, stay away from QD as much as you can unless it's a last ditch effort for recovery.

Spacing: (Fair and Nair) Well, it'll take a bit. But try to make it so that the edge of Ragnell, just as it turns into a diamond shape, is hitting the shield of the opponent. If that's too far, move it just a bit closer. I'm not gonna lie, it will take a while.

Fixing Spam Shield Grabs: You have better OoS (out of shield) options than pressing A while shielding. Buffering a jab works a lot better OoS, and in my opinion is generally a lot safer. A whiffed grab can get you punished, but a whiffed jab1 can turn into a jab combo if the opponent is hasty. I struggle with this a bit too. Just work on staying in shield more, and instead of going for shield grabs, drop shield and jab, Nair, Fair, or Bair if the opponent is behind you. Grabbing is good, just not spammable.

SDing: Four words for you. Nair off-stage is bad. With a 74 total frame completion, it's no wonder people SD with it all the time. Try to be more careful if you're Nairing off-stage. If it's just because you're distracted by the guy next to you texting your mom about pizza tomorrow night, one, beat the living crap out of that guy and two, try to pay attention on the match itself. Focus is key to a great Ike game.

Another thing. Learn to jab cancel. If you do know how, great. If not, learn. Ike without jab canceling is like Kirby with 2 jumps; you see the problem there? Go for jab1>jab1>jab2>jab3 at first, then string into jab1>jab2>jab1>jab2>jab3 later on. Then mix it up a lot more, after you've mastered it.

Also, Ike has a guaranteed combo. It's Bthrow to dash attack. Around the time Ike kicks the opponent behind him, input a dash. As soon as he starts moving, hit down on your C-stick. You'll know that you've buffered the dash if no smoke comes out of Ike's heels when he starts moving.

Speaking of C-sticks, if you'd like to make life a bit easier, I recommend changing from Smash Stick to Attack Stick. That is, setting C-stick to attack instead of smash. This allows for Nairs with C-stick (you heard right), a Dair that doesn't fastfall (allowing for walk-off Dair spikes), and much easier usage of Utilt. Anything I missed, the other guys will cover.



Every 2 weeks in the Skype chat, Meneil or Berserker Swordsman will host the Ike bi-weekly, a tournament designed to see who the best Ike in the chat is. It's a round-robin tournament and it's a great way to meet people and play them. If you get shut out 0-2 every game, don't feel bad. That's my record from the past 2 bi-weeklies I attended.

If you'd like to join the Ike social Skype group, one, make a Skype. You can't join with an AIM account. Two, add either myself (rolex890), Waldo (hotsuma.1) or Berserker Swordsman (kitekirby). Just tell them Rolex sent you, and that you'd like to join the Ike social and perhaps the Ike bi-weekly. That's up to Meneil and Berserker, though.



Much said, much accomplished I hope. Welcome to the family.
I use the Nunchuk/Wiimote control setup. Yes, I know that it isn't as good as the GC controller, but it's always worked out for me. I suppose that I should start practicing with the GC controller. Thanks for everything. If I do join the bi weekly, I'll probably 0-2 everything. Not even kidding. As for the QD, I usually use it to KO at high percentages and for approaching/recovery. I know that when I play Ike they shouldn't get up to too high of a percentage if I play right. Again, thanks for taking the time to help me. Now, to go join the bi weekly!
 

ravemaster47

Smash Ace
Joined
Apr 12, 2008
Messages
939
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a dark place
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Ike also has a wall infinite grab on most characters. You grab and throw them forward towards the wall. Grab and repeat. I tend to use utilt to finish them off. You van also do it with bthrow but you need two walls close together.
 

Pheta Ray

Smash Ace
Joined
Oct 14, 2012
Messages
816
Location
Kerry, Ireland
I use the Nunchuk/Wiimote setup.
Use whatever feels right. If you switch to GC halfway through learning a character, its basically like picking up a new character all together. I know many people who use Wiichuk, and they're all fine players.

Also, one last note. I personally won't be on Skype today for the bi-weekly, so add Waldo or Berserker Swordsman to get into the chat.
 

Oddyesy

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 15, 2013
Messages
954
Location
Dallas, Texas
NNID
Oddyesy
Use whatever feels right. If you switch to GC halfway through learning a character, its basically like picking up a new character all together. I know many people who use Wiichuk, and they're all fine players.

Also, one last note. I personally won't be on Skype today for the bi-weekly, so add Waldo or Berserker Swordsman to get into the chat.
Ok. I added all of you. I know what the differences are between the Wiichuk and GC, but what makes people think that the GC is better?
 

ReggieY.

Smash Rookie
Joined
Aug 4, 2013
Messages
2
Location
Wisconsin
Ok. I added all of you. I know what the differences are between the Wiichuk and GC, but what makes people think that the GC is better?
I'd have to say because most if not all players just transitioned straight from melee. I used to use the classic controller waaaaay back when but grabbed my GC controller and everything seemed so fluent. And I really miss playing. It's been..... Idek haha. Been to caught up with school, and work. But I guess I'm back -Reg
 

Oddyesy

Smash Ace
Joined
Jul 15, 2013
Messages
954
Location
Dallas, Texas
NNID
Oddyesy
I'd have to say because most if not all players just transitioned straight from melee. I used to use the classic controller waaaaay back when but grabbed my GC controller and everything seemed so fluent. And I really miss playing. It's been..... Idek haha. Been to caught up with school, and work. But I guess I'm back -Reg
Well, welcome back! Well, I was pretty young back when Melee was out and about. I do remember that I rocked as Roy. Been a long time though, the disc my cousin have to me got pretty scratched up.
 

ReggieY.

Smash Rookie
Joined
Aug 4, 2013
Messages
2
Location
Wisconsin
Well, welcome back! Well, I was pretty young back when Melee was out and about. I do remember that I rocked as Roy. Been a long time though, the disc my cousin have to me got pretty scratched up.
Thanks I appreciate it haha. And that was my main as well
 

Ahenobarbus

Smash Cadet
Joined
May 8, 2011
Messages
72
Location
South Bend, IN
Hey guys, I was looking at the latest MU chart (http://smashboards.com/threads/official-swf-matchup-chart-v3-0.338390/) and the Ike/IC's MU is listed as even. What options does Ike really have against IC's? When I watch Vinnie/Esam/9B, the desync walls seem (to me at least) to force Ike to approach. All I can think that would work as an approach (i.e. mostly unpunishable on a powershield) is RAR autocancelled sh bair, which IC's down+b outranges. Now I understand that jab is our best defense against being grabbed and should probably be subbed in for most scenarios when my instinct would be spotdodge, but how does Ike approach in that MU? Also, any good vids you guys can suggest?

Alternatively, maybe the chart was made without consulting any Ike mains?
 

Ussi

Smash Legend
Joined
Mar 9, 2008
Messages
17,147
Location
New Jersey (South T_T)
3DS FC
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Yes it was made with ike main opinions.

I don't think it should be 0 until ROB and Pit are 0 as well

IC is dumb cause grab armor exists.
 

Berserker Swordsman

Smash Lord
Joined
May 24, 2008
Messages
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Philadelphia, PA
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KiteKIrby
Ike should not approach ICs, IMO. Have them come to you. It's not like a Falco/Pit/Fox scenario where they can just sit back and rack up damage from afar. Also, according to Ryo, Fair outranges Blizzard. He's also mentioned grab being a good option if used smartly and safely. From having played Roller and Lain, Roller at least seems to agree on the grab part. I guess I'm just too timid about losing a stock to think of doing such a thing.
 

Ussi

Smash Legend
Joined
Mar 9, 2008
Messages
17,147
Location
New Jersey (South T_T)
3DS FC
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Just YOLT it


I'm playing final fantasy 7 cause like i have nothing to do. I named everyone after pokemon. Surprisingly i'm using the max characters i can use and fitting all the names.

Cloud - Gallade
Barret - Infernape (i debated between magnezone and Infernape here. Barret is a monkey in the end though)
Tifa - Gardevoir
Aeris - Vanilluxe
Red XIII - Stoutland
Yuffie - Lilligant

Haven't reached cat sith, Cid, and Vincent yet. Will think of pokes then.
 

YagamiLight

Smash Champion
Joined
Feb 2, 2008
Messages
2,411
Location
California
Aeris seems more like Cresselia to me, truth be told. Moon stuff, sacrifces self, etc etc.

Also Cid is straight up RAYQUAZA.
 

Ussi

Smash Legend
Joined
Mar 9, 2008
Messages
17,147
Location
New Jersey (South T_T)
3DS FC
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Thing is i'm naming them all after the pokes i've used in a pokemon mod called pokemon reborn. So I've been picking from a choice of 18 pokes.

This is mainly so i feel better attachment to the names i choose. Cress does make perfect sense, but like i've never even used her before. I went with Vanilluxe cause well whatever its ice cream.

So i'll probably name Cid Staraptor.. Vincent.. I dunno what i can name him. Probably Scrafty as that's my only dark type
 

san.

1/Sympathy = Divide By Zero
Moderator
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Oct 26, 2008
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Rochester, NY
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You guys are still doing biweeklies? I am actually home for a while so I can go to the next one if I remember, although I cannot use my LAN adapter..

Surprised by the updated MU chart, nice job from Ryo and friends, the FL influence is quite apparent.

Also, I recently got Shin Megami Tensei IV after playing fire emblem: awakening for a bit. I am putting awakening on hold, since I kind of made my guys so overpowered that at this point, it's just going through the motions until I beat the game. I am around chapter 20.

SMT IV is pretty great, what I expect from the series. I have my minor gripes, especially with the influence of RNG, since there is an overpowered feature called "smirk" after landing critical blows. Smirk increases damage by 160%, 95% chance to crit, cancels weaknesses, and dodges almost any attack, until you use your next turn.I think I am 60-70% done with the game at 45 hours.

Of all the stats, I decided to dump them all in luck. Sounds crazy, but after 120 luck or so, the build really picked up. I was getting criticals all the time (which also gives extra turns) and status effects landed nearly 100% of the time. At 245 luck right now and my instant death spells are nearly 100%, utterly ridiculous. My crit rate is also nearly 75% right now, so I almost always get a crit with multi-hit moves, and luck affects the chances of getting smirk, which is also nearly 100%. My next playthrough will be even tougher- pure agility build (hit rate/evasion).
 

YagamiLight

Smash Champion
Joined
Feb 2, 2008
Messages
2,411
Location
California
I think I'll drop by the next biweekly. Didn't even realize that was still a thing. They are (or were, at least) pretty fun.

Been looking at Shin Megami Tensei as a whole, never played any of it. I think I might give it a go since it seems interesting.

Dunno why I'm posting on the Ike message board at 3AM. Call it a lack of priorities, I guess.
 

Heartstring

Smash Legend
Joined
Jun 12, 2009
Messages
11,129
Location
England
So like, I've been absent because I forgot about smashboards momentarily. I have a question for people:
I'm teaming with a wario main tomorrow, I just want to know how that team would work? I know it's a good team but like, which characters does what?
 

theeboredone

Smash Legend
Joined
Mar 18, 2008
Messages
12,398
Location
Houston, TX
I need to get added to this thing, given my phone has me on Skype 24/7. I just figure since no one posted in the bi-weekly thread, it was dead.
 

Pheta Ray

Smash Ace
Joined
Oct 14, 2012
Messages
816
Location
Kerry, Ireland
Once someone adds Bored to the Skype chat, I'd like some help.

Yesterday I went to a Smashfest at my friend's house, about 9-10 people were there so I had plenty of people to play with. The good news is that because I play with you guys on wifi so much, my Ike has gotten astronomically better (compared to the awful Ike it was before, that's still not that good). Jab canceling is down to a science and I pulled off [Jab1>Jab2]x3 flawlessly several times. Didn't miss a Bthrow follow-up. I was frankly on point yesterday.

The bad news is that I struggled against players who main Wolf and Falco against me.

Wolf always seemed to outspace me with laser, and when I got close I was either Fsmashed, Dsmashed, or jab comboed. I couldn't get in with ease, and though I did manage to take Wolf to last stock 90% of the time, I couldn't ever beat him unless he SD'd. The same for Falco. Whenever I tried to approach, with both Nair and Fair, I was outspaced with lasers, then got slapped with a reflector. For some reason I never asked about this MU, and for some reason it never occurred to me to ask because this is my hardest MU at the moment.
 

theeboredone

Smash Legend
Joined
Mar 18, 2008
Messages
12,398
Location
Houston, TX
Sounds like Wolf for sure is playing that 2008 style. Honestly at that point, you gotta do a bait and counter. I mean, if you expect him to do an f-smash/d-smash the majority of the time once you get close, just shield and counter. Getting through Wolf's lasers is much easier than Falco's. Just mix up jumps, fast falls, short hop air dodges, and shielding (perfect shielding helps). Wolf is pretty easy to jab cancel due to his weight. You can definitely get some 1, 1, 1, and finish it up. If he tries to DI, you can possibly sneak in an b-air or up-tilt.

Your goal against either character is to get them off stage and make the correct read. For both, luring them into their Illusion maneuver is just asking for a potential kill on your end. You can do the classic hang on edge of stage as if you will grab the ledge, and once they get close enough, retreat back and do a reverse up-smash. Wolf's up+b doesn't automatically grab the ledge, so you can potentially d-tilt or f-smash him there as well.

Also, the higher you get them to use their Illusion, the more useless they will be, given they become a dead weight in the air.

Wolf becomes significantly harder if he learns how to start properly spamming and spacing with B-air. But from what you're telling me, sounds like he's just picking him up or stuck in 2008.
 

Pheta Ray

Smash Ace
Joined
Oct 14, 2012
Messages
816
Location
Kerry, Ireland
Aside from Wolf, how about Falco? I know there has to be a better way for Ike to take the match than trying to run down Falco and get him.
 
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