I Will Believe In Myself: Miles "Tails" Prower Support Thread

Mewtwo

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Oooo, I really want Tails in Smash! (I'm new here hi)

Sonic the Hedgehog 2 was my first video game obsession, and even though I kinda took a very very long hiatus from the Sonic franchise, I've always been a fan of Sonic and Tails. Aaand, as has probably been pointed out in this thread already, Sonic has been in Smash for more entries than any other 3rd party character, really feels at home in Smash and on Nintendo consoles, and kinda 'deserves' another rep considering Street Fighter and Castlevania already have 2.

Plus, Shadow and Knuckles are already Assist Trophies but where's Tails? If Sakurai felt that Tails could be unique enough to not be an echo of Sonic, and we know the DLC fighters are not echoes, then maybe he was held off as a popular choice for DLC (which might also benefit SEGA more, as they would presumably get a cut of the DLC profits). Tails is pretty well-known to gamers so I could imagine many people wanting to purchase him as DLC, and it would finally fulfill the dream of having both Sonic and Tails in the game that we've had since Melee.
*steps down from soapbox*
 
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I still see no reason why Tails doesn't have decent odds. With Nintendo making the pics, he seems like a prime choice. He's a pop culture icon at this point, so there's no worry that his DLC and accompanying Amiibo would have trouble selling. Sega and Nintendo have been very cooperative for over a decade and half. And we know another Sonic game is inevitable, so cross promotion would work in their favor too.

I know we have no clue who has been picked. But it's not like we're backing a Literal Who, regional exclusive or AT/NPC character, so he chances are still strong if you ask me.
 

TailsFoxie

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I still see no reason why Tails doesn't have decent odds. With Nintendo making the pics, he seems like a prime choice. He's a pop culture icon at this point, so there's no worry that his DLC and accompanying Amiibo would have trouble selling. Sega and Nintendo have been very cooperative for over a decade and half. And we know another Sonic game is inevitable, so cross promotion would work in their favor too.

I know we have no clue who has been picked. But it's not like we're backing a Literal Who, regional exclusive or AT/NPC character, so he chances are still strong if you ask me.
Of Course its still strong,
I can Just Imagine The Feels i would have if
NINTENDO are the ones That Sets Tails Free.
Seeing The Success of Sonic Mania might help heh!
 

2BITfoxy

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I still see no reason why Tails doesn't have decent odds. With Nintendo making the pics, he seems like a prime choice. He's a pop culture icon at this point, so there's no worry that his DLC and accompanying Amiibo would have trouble selling. Sega and Nintendo have been very cooperative for over a decade and half. And we know another Sonic game is inevitable, so cross promotion would work in their favor too.

I know we have no clue who has been picked. But it's not like we're backing a Literal Who, regional exclusive or AT/NPC character, so he chances are still strong if you ask me.
Well, if you believe Spirits are deconfirmations, which actually looks frighteningly likely given recent evidence, then the only thing to back IS a "Literal Who" as you put it. Plus, uh... We are backing an NPC, remember Green Hill Zone? -_-

Tails might be the most likely Sonic character, but sadly Sonic characters aren't too likely. Sonic was big in the 90s and remains big in certain circles, but to the gaming world at large, the franchise is a joke that they feel should be ended. When you realize that, you stop being surprised that Sonic stays alone in Smash... Though no less sad...

I mean, I'm so saddened believing this, I feel like almost quitting Smash without trying Ultimate... My outlook for DLC couldn't be lower, I don't think we'll get a single thing I RECOGNIZE, much less want....
 

Mewtwo

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Yeah but Sonic Mania did perform well, and Team Sonic Racing is on the horizon, as well as a Sonic movie, right? Even though Sonic isn't quite way past cool anymore, the franchise is still relevant, and I think Sega is on good terms with Nintendo. Maybe Sega even approached Nintendo about adding in another character because honestly it would benefit them more. And Nintendo agreed because they're nice. Idk.
 

SonicMario

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The only things regarding Tails is two situations each with their own debate stuff going on.

First of which is Tails being a potential character in the fighter pass. Which to happen is the Spirits being deconfirmations argument needs to be put to bed. There's worry about more then ever before since it was found there is no Piranha Plant Spirit. (Though Petey Piranha who appears in the Final Smash does have a Spirit). And beyond that Tails being a character Nintendo putting on the list for Sakurai to choose from, and finally Sakurai choosing him from the list. We can debate if Nintendo and/or Sakurai have any strong feeling for the Sonic franchise at all enough to add another character. (Though I don't think Sakurai hates Sonic, there is at least one person that seemed to be misinformed about that in the Shadow thread) But if this one Fighter pass is all that's left for character DLC, we should keep expectations low and at least hope they re-sell the Mii costume at some point.

The 2nd possibility is of course there turns out being more then the fighter pass where there's echo fighters outside the fighter pass or a 2nd Season. I feel like Tails will be a strong possibility if this comes either way. Because if there is Echo DLC, we could very well see Tails be a Ken-level echo with a Chrom-level special move difference in the recovery. And if a 2nd Season comes, there's more room for Sega to get a spot. Only things Tails would have to worry about is if Sega decided to rep a different franchise such as Puyo Puyo or a character from ATLUS.
 
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Well, if you believe Spirits are deconfirmations, which actually looks frighteningly likely given recent evidence, then the only thing to back IS a "Literal Who" as you put it. Plus, uh... We are backing an NPC, remember Green Hill Zone? -_-

Tails might be the most likely Sonic character, but sadly Sonic characters aren't too likely. Sonic was big in the 90s and remains big in certain circles, but to the gaming world at large, the franchise is a joke that they feel should be ended. When you realize that, you stop being surprised that Sonic stays alone in Smash... Though no less sad...

I mean, I'm so saddened believing this, I feel like almost quitting Smash without trying Ultimate... My outlook for DLC couldn't be lower, I don't think we'll get a single thing I RECOGNIZE, much less want....
I would mention the GHZ stage appearance except that the precedent has been set that non-interactive background elements can still appear in a playable role. Spirit Tracks, Duck Hunt, and Dreamland 64 all have some form of a fighter appear in it. It doesn't guarantee anything, but it isn't like it wasn't done before. Plus Knuckles gets to be an AT despite also being a part of the same stage.

As for Spirits, I can't say if they do or don't, but I'm leaning towards them not. There are spirits of existing fights already found in the game, so it's not like they are preventing the fighters we already have. Plus, in the previous game, we did get two characters that we're originally non-playable trophies make it as DLC.

I'm not saying he's a guarantee or even the most-likely. But I feel that the pros for his inclusion still far outweigh the cons. The only true factor is if Nintendo wanted him as one of the 5 picks. It's too early to tell, but he has enough going for him to be a character they can get people to buy.
 

2BITfoxy

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Yeah but Sonic Mania did perform well, and Team Sonic Racing is on the horizon, as well as a Sonic movie, right? Even though Sonic isn't quite way past cool anymore, the franchise is still relevant, and I think Sega is on good terms with Nintendo. Maybe Sega even approached Nintendo about adding in another character because honestly it would benefit them more. And Nintendo agreed because they're nice. Idk.
The Sonic movie is neither here nor there, has nothing to do with Smash or Nintendo, and... we still don't even know if Tails will be in it o_O There's casting information for Sonic and Eggman but last I heard, nothing for Tails.

I do feel Sonic is still relevent, but I felt Sonic was relevent enough during the Smash 4 days and it didn't pan out :/

Now, if we get more DLC than the fighter pass, I'll feel a bit more hopeful. But if Smash ever gets to 100 characters and we STILL don't have Tails, Imma be PISSED...
 

SonicMario

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I do feel Sonic is still relevent, but I felt Sonic was relevent enough during the Smash 4 days and it didn't pan out :/
The difference between now and Smash 4 though is 3rd party franchises getting more then one character were completely off the table. Hell, it was doubtful in Smash 4's speculation that a company could get more then one character let alone per franchise until Ryu came in as DLC. It's easy to forget Smash 4 was actually kind of lax on 3rd parties when you really think about it base-game wise. We lost Snake, Sonic returned, and gained Pac-Man and Megaman. That's only a net gain of one more 3rd party.

We've gone from 2 to 3 (Base Game Smash 4) to 6 (Post-DLC Smash 4) to a whopping 10 in the base game for Smash Ultimate and we're certain to at least get 2 more 3rd parties in before we're done even if the FIghter Pass is all that's left.
 

volbound1700

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Yeah but Sonic Mania did perform well, and Team Sonic Racing is on the horizon, as well as a Sonic movie, right? Even though Sonic isn't quite way past cool anymore, the franchise is still relevant, and I think Sega is on good terms with Nintendo. Maybe Sega even approached Nintendo about adding in another character because honestly it would benefit them more. And Nintendo agreed because they're nice. Idk.
Sonic is not going anywhere because it is still the most financially successful SEGA franchise. In fact, SEGA continues to grow it because their other franchises are struggling. Yes, a lot of the games recently haven't been great but it isn't as bad as some of the posters make it out to be.
 
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I'm still keeping hope for Tails. While the whole spirit thing is a little iffy, he does seem like a strong choice for DLC. He's recognizable, beloved and marketable, which is ideal for a character you'd try to sell to the masses on his own merits. I can't see that many people opposing him overall, he isn't controversial or polarizing like other characters from his series or several of the top picks floating around the net. Ultimately, it'll be Nintendo's call, but I still feel he has a strong case for his inclusion.
 

fogbadge

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I'm still keeping hope for Tails. While the whole spirit thing is a little iffy, he does seem like a strong choice for DLC. He's recognizable, beloved and marketable, which is ideal for a character you'd try to sell to the masses on his own merits. I can't see that many people opposing him overall, he isn't controversial or polarizing like other characters from his series or several of the top picks floating around the net. Ultimately, it'll be Nintendo's call, but I still feel he has a strong case for his inclusion.
i hope so after four third party characters i was not happy about in a row itd be nice to have one id love
 

2BITfoxy

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i hope so after four third party characters i was not happy about in a row itd be nice to have one id love
How do you think I feel? Aside from Sonic, Pac-Man has been the only 3rd party I was semi-pleased with -_- (Now, Sonic, I was over the moon for... too bad his moveset, err... doesn't mesh with my play style :/ )
 
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Sonic is not going anywhere because it is still the most financially successful SEGA franchise. In fact, SEGA continues to grow it because their other franchises are struggling. Yes, a lot of the games recently haven't been great but it isn't as bad as some of the posters make it out to be.
And even then its Yakuza series is still going strong (with ANOTHER unrelated game using the series engine after FOTNS: Lost Paradise coming) and finally caught on more in the West, the Atlus arm is profitable as always, and some of their older properties are making a revival sooner or later.

That being said, after allowing Sonic to get offed early on in WOL, it's only a matter of time until Sega's relationship with Nintendo grows enough that they'll be perfectly fine with other Sonic characters going mano-a-mano with their best.
 
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How do you think I feel? Aside from Sonic, Pac-Man has been the only 3rd party I was semi-pleased with -_- (Now, Sonic, I was over the moon for... too bad his moveset, err... doesn't mesh with my play style :/ )
While I adore all of the Third Party fighters we got, the Sonic series is just too big of a gaming staple to warrant only a single fighter. Hopefully we'll get one in the DLC pack.
 

2BITfoxy

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While I adore all of the Third Party fighters we got, the Sonic series is just too big of a gaming staple to warrant only a single fighter. Hopefully we'll get one in the DLC pack.
Don't get me wrong; I respect Mega-Man and Street Fighter and well... to some extent all of them except Bayonetta (I call bull on the ballot to this day), I'm just not a fan of any of those franchises. I intend to finally play Final Fantasy 7 when it releases on the Switch...aside from that, I keep forgetting Cloud is even there ^^;
 

fogbadge

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How do you think I feel? Aside from Sonic, Pac-Man has been the only 3rd party I was semi-pleased with -_- (Now, Sonic, I was over the moon for... too bad his moveset, err... doesn't mesh with my play style :/ )
well i suppose wed all feel like that when a character we dont like gets in cant win em all i guess
 
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Can I be added to the support list please?

Now, if we get more DLC than the fighter pass, I'll feel a bit more hopeful. But if Smash ever gets to 100 characters and we STILL don't have Tails, Imma be PISSED...
Tails is the 2nd most iconic co-protagonist in gaming, so I agree he should get in before we pass the 100 mark.
 

Mewtwo

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ok legit question guys; what is the difference between Sonic's side B and down B? Whenever I play as him I don't understand these moves--I feel like the same move just got mapped to two different special attacks. Like I know the side special does a little hop and down special acts more like the spin dash does in his games, but....what else am I missing?
 

SonicMario

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ok legit question guys; what is the difference between Sonic's side B and down B? Whenever I play as him I don't understand these moves--I feel like the same move just got mapped to two different special attacks. Like I know the side special does a little hop and down special acts more like the spin dash does in his games, but....what else am I missing?
Down B has multiple hits and also requires mashing B to charge it up, Side B only requires holding down the B button to charge. While they look similar, they do have different uses. The hop from the side one is used for set-ups into aerial moves often. And while I can't recall completely, Down B can be used might be slightly faster so may be the better tool for either escaping your opponent and/or getting quick hits and getting out of there quickly enough.

The main purpose of it though I think is generally for mix-ups, your opponent has to keep in mind the utility of both Spin dashes and that's not always the easiest thing to do in a match since Sonic moves so fast. They're meant to confuse the opponent on which one is being used. With enough study, someone can tell the difference. But if they don't study how Sonic fights, it may make Sonic a difficult fight for them.
 

RineYFD

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I'm still keeping hope for Tails. While the whole spirit thing is a little iffy, he does seem like a strong choice for DLC. He's recognizable, beloved and marketable, which is ideal for a character you'd try to sell to the masses on his own merits. I can't see that many people opposing him overall, he isn't controversial or polarizing like other characters from his series or several of the top picks floating around the net. Ultimately, it'll be Nintendo's call, but I still feel he has a strong case for his inclusion.
I've been thinking that too. Tails certainly have all three of those criteria's but he's never mentioned much. I've seen characters like Sans and even Waluigi and Shadow.
But no Tails.
Also, apparently Vergeben was wrong about Minecraft representation in Smash. He said that there would be a Minecraft Boss but others on the forum claimed that they looked at a datamined list and saw no Minecraft boss. So yeah don't believe Vergeben.
 

2BITfoxy

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I've been thinking that too. Tails certainly have all three of those criteria's but he's never mentioned much. I've seen characters like Sans and even Waluigi and Shadow.
But no Tails.
Also, apparently Vergeben was wrong about Minecraft representation in Smash. He said that there would be a Minecraft Boss but others on the forum claimed that they looked at a datamined list and saw no Minecraft boss. So yeah don't believe Vergeben.
I don't think Verge is without credible sources though, it's scary how much he's been right...
Still, it is nice to know he's not infallible. Maybe there CAN be hope for DLC...
 

TailsFoxie

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While I adore all of the Third Party fighters we got, the Sonic series is just too big of a gaming staple to warrant only a single fighter. Hopefully we'll get one in the DLC pack.
Tails would then be a Spirit,
and Cameo, Being on the second menu of spirits mode,
and Potentially Playable!
Wow...
 

2BITfoxy

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Last day... I guess this is it for me on Smashboards for a while. I won't get to play the game until after my birthday (which is thankfully on Sunday, not too far off XD) And after that I'm gonna be offline entirely pretty much until February for personal reasons... Guess I'll be back in time for the next DLC reveal, heh. Fingers crossed, hopefully Tails has a chance!
 
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Interesting, so Assists in Training Mode can be particularly chosen if you want. Meaning it is actually very possible to get a snapshot of Knuckles the AT + Knuckles background character on Green Hill Zone at the same time. Even if possibly only in Training mode.
Oh thank god, no more constant resetting just to get the one I want.

But can you take in-game snapshots in Training mode (not the Switch capture button, the game's built-in one)?
 

The Snitch Studio

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Nintendo announced the first character to be apart of the Super Smash Bros Ultimate DLC during The Game Awards 2018...

Joker From Persona 5...

What does this mean for Tails?
 

SonicMario

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Nintendo announced the first character to be apart of the Super Smash Bros Ultimate DLC during The Game Awards 2018...

Joker From Persona 5...

What does this mean for Tails?
Probbbaallllllly not good since Persona is a Sega Property. Meaning Sega has 3 characters. People probably aren't going to want to get behind a fourth xP

I think Tails only hope is he's an echo outside the Fighter Pass or they let Sega get another spot in another season of the Fighter Pass

But I'm honestly not mad. I think I've come to terms already that Tails is probably not getting playable this game.
 

The Snitch Studio

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Probbbaallllllly not good since Persona is a Sega Property. Meaning Sega has 3 characters. People probably aren't going to want to get behind a fourth xP

I think Tails only hope is he's an echo outside the Fighter Pass or they let Sega get another spot in another season of the Fighter Pass

But I'm honestly not mad. I think I've come to terms already that Tails is probably not getting playable this game.
True, it's just the thought of this might being the last Smash Bros game, and Tails being a character I've been waiting for 8 years for...

I'm absolutely happy for the Persona Fans but I just feel like the Sonic Series has been played dirty. It's annoying having only one wish, and it never gets furfilled countless times.

I might just give up on Tails, and I think we all should. If we don't want to be left upset by the end of the DLC, we give up here.
 
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Nintendo announced the first character to be apart of the Super Smash Bros Ultimate DLC during The Game Awards 2018...

Joker From Persona 5...

What does this mean for Tails?
Honestly all hope for new Sonic characters is probably dead now, but it is cool that SEGA has hit another milestone to become the first 3rd party with three unique characters.

Let's hope bonus Echo Fighters happen and there's an extra Sonic character among them at least.
 

2BITfoxy

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This means that no matter how many Smash games happen, additional Sonic reps will NEVER, EVER happen. Sega is only willing to sign off on additional franchises and that's it.
I'm through. **** Smash. **** it to hell. **** Sega, too. I don't think I'll ever be happy again at this point. My life was over after Brawl... There's literally nothing left to look forward to...

I've never felt so full of despair in my life. I wish I were dead...
 
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CaptainAmerica

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This means that no matter how many Smash games happen, additional Sonic reps will NEVER, EVER happen. Sega is only willing to sign off on additional franchises and that's it.
I'm through. **** Smash. **** it to hell. **** Sega, too. I don't think I'll ever be happy again at this point. My life was over after Brawl... There's literally nothing left to look forward to...

I've never felt so full of despair in my life. I wish I were dead...
Dude, are you okay? If you need to talk, we're here for you.

I'm just gonna keep hoping, but I never really had much confidence in my favorites getting in - I got burned by Sm4sh. There are still four characters to go, and Sm4sh had more DLC than is confirmed for Ultimate, so they may end up giving us more. And remember, everyone thought Ryu was never gonna happen since Capcom already had a rep and couldn't get another. Unless Sakurai comes out and says that third party companies can't get another rep, it's just a fanrule people use to bash other peoples' picks.

To tell the truth, I never really expected Sonic to get a second rep as part of the fighter pass. Sonic's already got two stages, so getting a third would be excessive. We could definitely use one since a lot of the music is urban-themed, and the two stages are both Green Hill, but I'll make do. But Tails would be a great choice if they decided to throw some quick echoes in outside of the pack characters. I do expect at least most of the third-party Mii costumes to return, so there's still that.
 
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