I think Zelda does indeed transform...

[Pokec]

Ok, so...just before you read this post and start screaming, "OMG, OLDER DEN MAI GRUNDMUZZER!", i just think this post is important in recognizing that Zelda's chances of transforming are.....pretty likely.

Note: This "discovery" that I'm about to post has been mentioned before in another thread (in a single post, I believe), but I don't think people took it seriously. Hence why I'm making this thread. Should it be decided that this needs to be locked, lock away.
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On December 17, the update for Co-op Events was revealed. Yay, it was fun, a surprise, and most of all, awesome, since it continues to show Brawl's ability to stuff its face with awesome features without bursting a few buttons. However, on one picture included in the update, the last event shown had a small, hard-to-see image of Zelda and Zero Suit Samus:

Now. Why would Zelda and Zero Suit Samus be included in the same event? Isn't there some sort of connection as to why those two characters would be featured in a single event?

So....(aside from having breasts and being female O.o) what "similarities" or commonness do ZSS and Zelda have? We know Samus is able to "transform" or change into ZSS........

Does that mean Zelda can, too?

Of course, this doesnt confirm if Sheik is in, or if the transformation is a Final Smash or a B-move...but I'm sure it does indeed strike interesting.

After all, if Sakurai just wanted two women in a single event, couldn't he have easily used Peach instead of Zelda?

So. Yes. Interesting. Speculative. Logically Makes-Sense-worthy.......

Discuss.

 

[Hippochinfat]

Only losers like that one person who has the ugly zelda drawing for there avatar think sheik won't be in.

 

[The_Corax_King]

Only losers like that one person who has the ugly zelda drawing for there avatar think sheik won't be in.

LOL awesome post...



This is a pretty good idea actually... although the evidence is incredibly shaky... it's a possibility...

 

[Stiputation]

Well it could be an event that groups them together because they have two different playing styles.
"Magic vs Technology"


It would be rather weird to have them paired together if Zelda's downB was Sheik and Zamus had to wait to get a smash ball. Which, may I mention could either be stolen by Zelda or by the player. It just wouldn't be right. Also, Sheik couldn't be Zelda's final smash because it would be THE EXACT same final smash that Zamus and Samus share. Plus, theres more than enough transformation via Final Smash characters to go around.

A whole complete Zelda for Brawl :/

 

[Luthien]

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=126323

This link should say everything. This is an awesome thread, but like you stated, this point has already been made. Couldn't you have just bumped the other thread or something? Brought the point up again? You know. I honestly don't care anymore if Sheik is in or out; I'm just getting tired of the constant debates/arguements/'discussions'.

We can't over interprit every little thing Sakurai does (as if this hasn't been said enough already...).

 

[Iris]

Yeah, the event sure does imply a transformation, but without a description, who knows? If it is a transforming event, it probably means Sheik would be Zelda's FS, because as Stipulation said, it wouldn't make much sense for Zelda to transform with a down B and Samus have to wait for a smash ball.

 

[Soluble Toast]

Yeah, it's been discussed before.

It suggests a transformation, but it could really be anything. It could just be girl power, and there could be another girl power event later on, featuring Zelda, peach and Samus.

 

[Ztarfish]

Exactly, if they could've just as easily picked Peach, there is an equal chance they could've picked Zelda, the picture really proves nothing.

 

[FIERCE]

Also, Sheik couldn't be Zelda's final smash because it would be THE EXACT same final smash that Zamus and Samus share.

I'm hoping this is true as well, however, seeing as how Sonic&Pikachu have EXTREMELY similar Final Smashes there is always that possibilty.

 

[Pokec]

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=126323

This link should say everything. This is an awesome thread, but like you stated, this point has already been made. Couldn't you have just bumped the other thread or something? Brought the point up again? You know. I honestly don't care anymore if Sheik is in or out; I'm just getting tired of the constant debates/arguements/'discussions'.

We can't over interprit every little thing Sakurai does (as if this hasn't been said enough already...).

I would've, but I forgot which thread the post had been made in.

 

[Pokec]

. . .Which, may I mention could either be stolen by Zelda or by the player. It just wouldn't be right. Also, Sheik couldn't be Zelda's final smash because it would be THE EXACT same final smash that Zamus and Samus share.

A whole complete Zelda for Brawl :/

Not exactly, Samus' Smash features a HUGE Blast thingy. Zeldas Could be TOTALLY Different.

The only similarity would be a transforamtion , which they both have differnt movesets.

 

[Stiputation]

I don't think so. Seriously, there are way too many transformation characters through a Final Smash.

The picture seriously prooves nothing. Like I said, it could be
"Magic vs Technology"
RAWR :B

Plus, I doubt Sakurai would have us wait MORE than half a year simply for a TP designed Sheik. It just doesn't add up.

 

[Airgemini]

Exactly, if they could've just as easily picked Peach, there is an equal chance they could've picked Zelda, the picture really proves nothing.

QFTT!

I don't think so. Seriously, there are way too many transformation characters through a Final Smash.

The picture seriously prooves nothing. Like I said, it could be
"Magic vs Technology"
RAWR :B

Plus, I doubt Sakurai would have us wait MORE than half a year simply for a TP designed Sheik. It just doesn't add up.

Yeah that would suck...And yeah there are a lot of transformation FS's.

 

[joeysmash]

suck it shiek.

 

[RyuDragonKing]

If Sheik wasn't in, they would have no problem in putting Zelda into the demo.
From what we've seen, Zelda has the same moves, so it wouldn't be that it's hard to recode her.

And then there's the interview...

 

[pyroroth]

Well it could be an event that groups them together because they have two different playing styles.
"Magic vs Technology"

if that's your logic wouldn't it have made more sense to make it regular samus and not zamus since zamus lost most of her "technology"?

 

[Algus Underdunk]

if that's your logic wouldn't it have made more sense to make it regular samus and not zamus since zamus lost most of her "technology"?

But Zamus is still weilding an incredibly technical electricity/plasma based whip/paralyzer beam gun...

 

[Iris]

It's still up in the air. Transformation is very possible, but it could be as simple as blonde vs brunette, pretty realistic woman vs pretty realistic woman, speed vs power, or even something that has nothing to do with Zamus and Zelda having similarities, but rather some random event like the sudden death or coin one.

 

[-spAzn-]

It's all speculation from here on out. Could it be related to both transforming sure. Though as of now it could be anything really, in Melee there was a couple random pairings such as the Mewtwo and Zelda one I think there was a Ness and C. Falcon where you had to collect coins. So it could easily be something along the lines of that. I have been wondering though if it is a event where transforming is involved wouldn't it make more sense for it to be a picture of Samus and Zelda rather then ZSS and Zelda? There is a couple flaws to that assumption so I dunno maybe that's just me.

 

[pyroroth]

But Zamus is still weilding an incredibly technical electricity/plasma based whip/paralyzer beam gun...

which compared to her ENTIRE suit is relatively simple

 

[Iris]

I have been wondering though if it is a event where transforming is involved wouldn't it make more sense for it to be a picture of Samus and Zelda rather then ZSS and Zelda? There is a couple flaws to that assumption so I dunno maybe that's just me.

Right, why would it be original form vs post-transformation form? It wouldn't be a big deal if it were still a transformation event, but it seems incongruent.

 

[Drake3]

Oh god. What if Zelda's FS really is transforming into Sheik and to win that Event Match, the first one that pulls off the Transformation wins. *Fans self*.

 

[Luthien]

Oh god. What if Zelda's FS really is transforming into Sheik and to win that Event Match, the first one that pulls off the Transformation wins. *Fans self*.

Haha. Relax. The event matches are co-op, so it's not a competition. Your fears are void... or ARE they... Mwuuhahahahahaaaa...

 

[Soluble Toast]

if it is a event where transforming is involved wouldn't it make more sense for it to be a picture of Samus and Zelda rather then ZSS and Zelda

Unless Sakurai is once again screwing Zelda over by making Sheik out to be her greatest asset, and it's a " transform into your more powerful form!!" type of event.

I'd literally die if I saw that in the event description.

</3

 

[Superninjabreadman]

I don't think so. Seriously, there are way too many transformation characters through a Final Smash.

The picture seriously prooves nothing. Like I said, it could be
"Magic vs Technology"
RAWR :B

Plus, I doubt Sakurai would have us wait MORE than half a year simply for a TP designed Sheik. It just doesn't add up.

We didnt get Kirby because we obviously didnt have all his hats. (in the demo)

Theres no Reason not to put Zelda in if theres no Sheik. : \

 

[Soluble Toast]

We didnt get Kirby because we obviously didnt have all his hats. (in the demo)

Theres no Reason not to put Zelda in if theres no Sheik. : \

Huh? It's a lot more logical for Zelda to be absent from the demo due to Sheik's absence

Seriously, nothing about Zelda has changed from what we can see. She has a little buffing here and there, but nothing major. The only thing we don't really know about her is DownB and final smash.

Why keep her in the dark for 6 months, AND keep her out of the demo if nothing at all has changed?


A TP designed Sheik is not enough. At most, Sheik will be given brunette hair , and twilight designs on his outfit, nothing drastic as to completely change the character. That's hardly anything to hold out 6 months on.

so really, something must have changed. We know about Dins fire, Farore's wind, and Nayru's love ( sort of =S), But not whether Sheik is in or not. Something's up.

 

[-spAzn-]

Unless Sakurai is once again screwing Zelda over by making Sheik out to be her greatest asset, and it's a " transform into your more powerful form!!" type of event.

I'd literally die if I saw that in the event description.

</3

I was thinking that as well and I would not be happy one bit if that were the case.

As for the last post you wrote you make an extremely good point. I mean why would they exclude her out of the demo if none of her moves changed especially Sheik. So Sheik may have got a little makeover but still that shouldn't prevent her from being in it because technically that would make Zelda pretty much all the same so there should be no suprises.

Also Kirby was included in the japanese demo so again why couldn't Zelda be included? Oh and before someone says it's because she has no updates. Well Peach didn't have any either the first day of the demo plus she didn't change all to much. Practically all the veterans in the demo stayed the same actually only minor changes. So i'm assuming Zelda may be altered a bit cause why keep something (Sheik) hidden very well if we already knew she was a part of Zelda's moveset from Melee.

Oh and I just noticed she was the only vet not to be included in the demo minus the IC's.

 

[Stiputation]

We didnt get Kirby because we obviously didnt have all his hats. (in the demo)

Theres no Reason not to put Zelda in if theres no Sheik. : \

Does anyone have a baseball bat? Take from that what you will.

Darling, We've waiting half a year for a Zelda update. Since Sheik has been replaced do you think they would want to spoil the fact that she has something new?

Ands its obvious she does considering how long we have waited. A TP design for Sheik just doesn't call for NOT ONE Zelda update. Sheik being separate and Zelda having Light Arrows for a new B makes much more sense for all of our waiting.

 

[Luthien]

Darling, We've waiting half a year for a Zelda update.

Ands its obvious she does considering how long we have waited. A TP design for Sheik just doesn't call for NOT ONE Zelda update. Sheik being separate and Zelda having Light Arrows for a new B makes much more sense for all of our waiting.

"Darling?" What, another marriage? Careful, Stiputation, you might make us other partners feel unimportant.

Back on track, though. Let's be honest: no one on this forum is a telepath; none of us has seen into the mind of Sakurai. There are lots of possibilities here.

We could be overestimating him. To be frank, all this waiting could simply be because he's trying to fill the void between now and the games release date. Sucky updates just before the games release is not a good thing for sales (I'm talking about Smash virgins here; if you are on this forum, you're pretty much buying the game no matter what); he has to save some good updates for last. Character revealings/updates (Sheik in paticular) would be considered a 'good update' worthy of saving for later. The fact that they've postponed updates for a while sends the message that they're running out of ideas (they might not be, that's just an implication).

However, we could be right on track. All this secrecy and junk could just be a suspense builder, a subtle implication that the casual (except for perhaps Zelda mainers/fans) would not percieve. He could really be 'hiding' Sheik/lack thereof, and we've seen through his supposed ruse. Although, it seems a bit too shallow of a trick for my tastes. That's what brings me to my next option.

We could be underestimating him completely. It's incredibly hard to tell, but all this hiding might be in itself a ruse; Sakurai might be two steps ahead of us, not one. Something no one's even considered might be in store. What could it be? Don't look at me, I'm not Sakurai/telepathic/omniscent.

Which of these options is more likely? I have no idea. They all seem to have an equal chance in my mind, because I've never met Sakurai before, and haven't been able to get an idea of how he thinks (I'm giving myself way to much credit here; I probably couldn't discern how he thinks from a single meeting). This is a video game, not the Davinci Code; we might be digging WAY too much into this. However, some of us are pretty experienced with this kind of thing, and have a better estimation of what's in store. Or, if Sakurai's as smart as I hope he is, we might all be wrong.

 

[Pokec]

Does anyone have a baseball bat? Take from that what you will.

Darling, We've waiting half a year for a Zelda update. Since Sheik has been replaced do you think they would want to spoil the fact that she has something new?

Ands its obvious she does considering how long we have waited. A TP design for Sheik just doesn't call for NOT ONE Zelda update. Sheik being separate and Zelda having Light Arrows for a new B makes much more sense for all of our waiting.

y'know....

you annoy me.

mainly because your posts are mostly about how guaranteed sure you are that Sheik isn't in Brawl. I mean, whose to say YOU'RE right?

and...i STRONGLY disagree with you're 'logic' or theory or whatever. the whole hiatus on an update may be just because of anticipation -- the element of surprise -- will Sheik make it? Will she not? I don't think its necessarily her "new outift" or whatnot, but more of the fact if she even makes an appearance.

Even if there were no Sheik in Brawl, I can easily see Sakurai making an update about it. It's not that big of a thing to spoil. However, is Sheik does reappear, it contradicts TP's story -- and Sheik's role only expands in the LoZ lore.

Maybe perhaps THATS whats taking Zelda too long.




But who am I to say anything? But my opinion?


On a side note, I crave the day we're shown whether Zelda transforms or not....than I can pollute these forums in rejoice and praise.

 

[blink777]

You know, I'm back to wanting the Sheik-transform to return. I spent how many years using the two together, until this last year when I realised it was easier just to use one. But it was still fun using both, and chances are if they have it in again it will be better this time around.

Yeah, a new move for Zelda like Light Arrows or what-have-you would be nice, but I'm gravitating now towards a working duality for the character. It was a fun idea, and I have faith that they'll follow through properly this time.

 

[Ztarfish]

The Event could be Femme Fatales Part 2. It's a co-op mode right? It could be two women characters have to beat stereotypical man characters like C. Falcon, Link, King DeDeDe etc. And Samus is out of her suit because honestly a Power Suit doesn't scream Female Ability to me.

Oh and by the way, it makes a hell of a lot more sense to keep Zelda under wraps if something drastic about Sheik has changed. Because so far we know everything except Sheik, Nayrus (which we know will be returning anyways), and a couple of other moves. However the thing is that he might be hiding the fact that there's no Sheik, or he might be hiding the fact that Sheik has gotten a complete makeover (I'm talking more than aesthetics), or a new transformation mechanic. Honestly the latter two would piss me off, I'm pulling for no more Sheik, personally.

 

[Dreamking]

FS Transformation would take away from Samus' originality. I think either Zelda and Samus are separate or Zelda is the same as Melee.

 

[Stiputation]

y'know....

you annoy me.

mainly because your posts are mostly about how guaranteed sure you are that Sheik isn't in Brawl. I mean, whose to say YOU'RE right?

and...i STRONGLY disagree with you're 'logic' or theory or whatever. the whole hiatus on an update may be just because of anticipation -- the element of surprise -- will Sheik make it? Will she not? I don't think its necessarily her "new outift" or whatnot, but more of the fact if she even makes an appearance.

Even if there were no Sheik in Brawl, I can easily see Sakurai making an update about it. It's not that big of a thing to spoil. However, is Sheik does reappear, it contradicts TP's story -- and Sheik's role only expands in the LoZ lore.

Maybe perhaps THATS whats taking Zelda too long.




But who am I to say anything? But my opinion?


On a side note, I crave the day we're shown whether Zelda transforms or not....than I can pollute these forums in rejoice and praise.

Quite honestly, I don't really care if I annoy you. I visit this fourm to post and participate in discussions involving Zelda. The fact that simply because someone who has a strong difference of opinion from what you believe annoys you is a little immature on your part.

Like I've said. This is simply my opinion, I never ONCE said. "I KNOW SHEIK WILL BE OUT"
I'm simply stating the reasons why she may be out.

 

[Luthien]

FS Transformation would take away from Samus' originality. I think either Zelda and Samus are separate or Zelda is the same as Melee.

Maybe. But I doubt it. Taking a look at the Final Smashes, do you see any that are actually similar in more than one or two aspects? *Checks Dojo to see if any do*. I don't think so.

Sakurai isn't dumb enough to give clone Final Smashes. As Samus' FS proves, a transformation FS doensn't have to be (or actually, is highly unlikely) to be just a transformation FS. The only character who only transforms is Wario, and he stays Wario, just... weirder.

Here's a list of all the things we think could happen (keep in mind, a transformation could occur after any of these):

Opinion 9: Summons Light Spirits
Pros: Cannon with TP; Visually impressive
Cons: Over-representation of Twilight Princess

Opinion 10: Summons Triforce
Pros: Visually impressive; Cannon with Universal Zelda; Works in a theme with Link's and possibly Ganondorf's
Cons: Link already has a Triforce FS (unoriginal)

Opinion 11: Light Arrows
Pros: TP themed
Cons: Can be dodged (debatable); Special move instead (see Op. 5)

Opinion 12: Possesed Zelda
Pros: TP cannon; Original
Cons: TP over-representation/not Universal Zeldaish


Do any of those seem like Samus' Super Duper Charge Shot? No.

P.S. What did you mean by "I think either Zelda and Samus are separate..."? I didn't get that part.

Edit: Hah. That's what I get for being lazy and copy-pasting. ^^' A few of those FSes don't make any sense, but whatever. You get the idea.

 

[phantomphungus]

So....(aside from having breasts and being female O.o) what "similarities" or commonness do ZSS and Zelda have? We know Samus is able to "transform" or change into ZSS........

Does that mean Zelda can, too?

OMG! Zelda transforming into zero suit samus confirmed! Zelda transforms into ZSS!

 

[Stiputation]

OMG! Zelda transforming into zero suit samus confirmed! Zelda transforms into ZSS!

I'd die x.x

Edit: Although a ZSZ wouldn't be all that bad ;]

 

[Soluble Toast]

ZSZ FTB!

Zelda uses super magical explosion which vaporizes her dress, forcing her to transform into Sheik!

That way , Sheik is only needed to stop Zelda being naked!

*cough*

anyyywaaay, I'm HOPING her FS is canon to something EXCEPT OOT. It's an amazing game and all, but I want to see some other forms of Zelda shine through. Only problem is, most of her canon abilities come from OOT, and TP =/

 

[k-zelda]

zelda of course need to transform to sheik

its make her stronger

SHEIK MUST BE ON BRAWL !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Luthien]

ZSZ FTB!

Zelda uses super magical explosion which vaporizes her dress, forcing her to transform into Sheik!

That way , Sheik is only needed to stop Zelda being naked!

*cough*

anyyywaaay, I'm HOPING her FS is canon to something EXCEPT OOT. It's an amazing game and all, but I want to see some other forms of Zelda shine through. Only problem is, most of her canon abilities come from OOT, and TP =/

Are there any other games where presented any power at all? Keep in mind would probably want to use abilities that come from more 'realistic' Zeldas. I can't picture TP Zelda using a WW Light Arrow (Ok, bad example, seeing as how there a TP light arrows, blah blah blah, but you know what I mean). So, ideas, anyone? Sadly, Sheik is in the realistic category, so that's why s/he's an option.