I need to know why Ganondorf can't win a tourney

[xXZeroXx]

Hi, I'm pretty sure Ganondorf can't win a tourney (not a noob one), and I have my own reasons to say that. I have been arguing with a friend about this and why a very very good Ganon can't win a very very good Marth, MK, Snake, Sheik and most of fast characters. Now I wanna know what you think about it. It has to be on SAME conditions, without counterpicks.

Can Ganon win a tourney? Why, why not? Thanks

 

[Lionman]

He is too slow!

in 2v2 maybe he has a chance

 

[Gleam]

I'm not going to say Ganondorf is NOT a bad character, but I'll be one to say he's completley underrated.

He's unpopular, and much of the stuff you hear about him are:

"He's too fat!" "He's too slow!" "Why doe he run like that?" "He's so old" "He can't L-Cancel!" "Why don't you use the sword!"

Is basically counterpicked by all the top-high tier characters. What do tournaments usually consist of, that's right, Snakes and Meta Knights.

Ganondorf is a very advanced character, and many people aren't willing to work with such a character that takes a while to learn.

I myself think if he faced people in Mid Tier-Bottom Tier he would fair much better, but in a world of MKs and Snakes that just isn't happening.

 

[Lex Crunch]

Now that I think about it, I didn't see a single Ganondorf at the tournament I went to. I guess it's up to me then, to win a tournament with Ganondorf...

 

[Union of Darkness]

Snake out camps Ganon.
Meta Knight out speeds Ganon.
G&W out prioritizes ****ing EVEYTHING.
No comment on Marth.

The opponent would have to be lower in skill to win with Ganon. If they're equal, just forget about it. The best thing we as Ganon mains can do is at least prove that Ganon is not as bad as he seems.

 

[A2ZOMG]

The reason why Ganondorf can't win in tournaments is because he suffers against projectile camping pretty significantly and he is much too easily gimped.

I mean he has a good enough moveset for sure, and his mobility wouldn't be a problem if it didn't make his recovery so awful and if Brawl didn't reward camping by such a large margin.

 

[Metal_Dave]

In doubles it is extremely possible to win with a Ganon on your team...Ganon can change the tide of the game easily with his brute strength. In singles it is a bit harder, and yes it's true what UoD says, but he can still be to prove a tough opponent.

 

[Sgt. Baker]

Guess what, kind of good news

Yesterday me and my buddy (who uses Falco and Mario) went to a small Tourney at a local game store. I decided since it was my first tourney I'd stick with my Ganondorf. Well, I placed 7th in the singles (during that I beat a Meta Knight, Falco, and a King Dedede). It was still a bit messed up though because the final listings was:

1. Meta Knight
2. Meta Knight
3. Lucario
4. Meta Knight
5. Snake
6. Meta Knight
7. Ganondorf (Me, and I KNOW!!!)

Yeah, the Meta Knights were cheap. Sorry but I don't remember the people's names. I actually had to take out my friend too lol.

In the doubles we placed 11th out of 16 teams. I used Ganondorf and my buddy used Falco. We lost to a Game & Watch and a Toon Link. No offense to my buddy but he basically let G&W and Toon Link double Team me=no good.

But yeah it's extremly tough for Ganon in toruneys. Personally I got a few lucky breaks (like, I spiked a DeDeDe 2 times one after another lol). But it was a great time. I can't wait for the next one.

 

[Dangl]

Cause it takes him to long to jog there...


http://www.smashbros.com/en_us/characters/hidden09.html
"He runs while panting... "Uff uff uff!""

But that dosen't mean i dont love the old boy

 

[Union of Darkness]

Guess what, kind of good news

Yesterday me and my buddy (who uses Falco and Mario) went to a small Tourney at a local game store. I decided since it was my first tourney I'd stick with my Ganondorf. Well, I placed 7th in the singles (during that I beat a Meta Knight, Falco, and a King Dedede). It was still a bit messed up though because the final listings was:

1. Meta Knight
2. Meta Knight
3. Lucario
4. Meta Knight
5. Snake
6. Meta Knight
7. Ganondorf (Me, and I KNOW!!!)

Yeah, the Meta Knights were cheap.

Ganondorf can be cheap too. D-air spamming.

But no, that's cool to hear.

 

[xXZeroXx]

I don't want to go like ey Ganon can't win HAHA, is just that, as you are Ganon mains, your opinion about this must be the best one, you are the ones who knows the possibilities of Ganon. No I don't think Ganon is as bad as people think he is, almost every attack can kill, but, I just wanted to prove that he is in disadvantage to other characters in tourneys in equal conditions.
Thanks for your answers.

 

[Glick]

Anybody wonder where ganons chin is?

 

[snakattak]

I think his biggest problem is recovery time. Personally I don't mind his speed, so that just means that you have to play smart. Any missed Down-A in the air and fast characters are all over you. I would say that it is possible... but I've never tried it. I mostly play 1 on 1 vs a friend of mine, and he's quite a bit more skilled than me, but I always put up a good fight with him.

And besides, I don't think there is anything more satisfying than a perfectly timed warlock punch.

 

[LinkSceptile333]

It's possible, you can't deny that. It would just take one heck of a Ganondorf player.

Like me...

 

[OlimarFan]

Hi, I'm pretty sure Ganondorf can't win a tourney (not a noob one), and I have my own reasons to say that. I have been arguing with a friend about this and why a very very good Ganon can't win a very very good Marth, MK, Snake, Sheik and most of fast characters. Now I wanna know what you think about it. It has to be on SAME conditions, without counterpicks.

Can Ganon win a tourney? Why, why not? Thanks

I think Ganondorf can win a tournament...it's just that people are turned off by his slow speed and his steep learning curve.

 

[xXZeroXx]

But still, let's talk about a Ganondorf vs Marth (because is my main and is who I know best):

Marth outpriorizes Ganondorf on every aerial and every A attack. (Excepting, maybe, neutral A)
Marth has more range on his attacks. So, pressure Ganon is easier thanks to that.
Ganondorf is slow, very compared to Marth.
His recovery is bad, easy to gimp.

Ok, so what? Maybe a skilled Ganondorf can make it through those disadvantages. But really, I see it really difficult.

 

[4Serial]

Anybody wonder where ganons chin is?

it stayed in melee along with all of the other cool stuff =[

 

[Falconv1.0]

Chaingrabs **** him, anyone with combos **** him, projectiles kinda **** him, he's slow, the top characters destroy him, etc.

If you think Ganondorf could beat DDD, Snake, MK, Pit, Falco, G&W, and a multitude of other successful characters, you're nuts.

I think Ganondorf is kinda cool, but face it, he's not tourney viable, not by a long shot. Sliq was an amazing Ganon, and he chose Bowser over him because Bowser is better in pretty much every way possible.

 

[Griffard]

Guess what, kind of good news

Yesterday me and my buddy (who uses Falco and Mario) went to a small Tourney at a local game store. I decided since it was my first tourney I'd stick with my Ganondorf. Well, I placed 7th in the singles (during that I beat a Meta Knight, Falco, and a King Dedede). It was still a bit messed up though because the final listings was:

1. Meta Knight
2. Meta Knight
3. Lucario
4. Meta Knight
5. Snake
6. Meta Knight
7. Ganondorf (Me, and I KNOW!!!)

Yeah, the Meta Knights were cheap. Sorry but I don't remember the people's names. I actually had to take out my friend too lol.

In the doubles we placed 11th out of 16 teams. I used Ganondorf and my buddy used Falco. We lost to a Game & Watch and a Toon Link. No offense to my buddy but he basically let G&W and Toon Link double Team me=no good.

But yeah it's extremly tough for Ganon in toruneys. Personally I got a few lucky breaks (like, I spiked a DeDeDe 2 times one after another lol). But it was a great time. I can't wait for the next one.

very nice work! make sure you post this in ankoku's thread in tactical discussion.
also, Ganondorf obviously has the potential to win tournaments and beat certain characters. It's happened before! give him a chance, and work your butt off, and he's quite good

 

[Falconv1.0]

very nice work! make sure you post this in ankoku's thread in tactical discussion.
also, Ganondorf obviously has the potential to win tournaments and beat certain characters. It's happened before! give him a chance, and work your butt off, and he's quite good

No, he doesn't have a chance. I stated valid reasons why in my post. You cant just blow it off by saying "Be the better player!"

 

[:034:]

Falcon is right, guys. I really like playing Ganondorf, but he's not tourney-viable. At all. You can try, but you'll never get higher than top 8, probably. I keep my Wolf and G&W ready for those things.

 

[Finns7]

Ganon *****. The problem to me is not enough people take the time to learn him and create thier own style instead of watching a "advanced" player on youtube and copying thier style. When I started out using him I would get 2 stocked by a gaw or falco ect. but after practicing I now beat those characters. Ganon has weapons and I truly think his game is still develouping. To me its not the marth/snake, its the person controling them.

 

[Falconv1.0]

Ganon *****. The problem to me is not enough people take the time to learn him and create thier own style instead of watching a "advanced" player on youtube and copying thier style. When I started out using him I would get 2 stocked by a gaw or falco ect. but after practicing I now beat those characters. Ganon has weapons and I truly think his game is still develouping. To me its not the marth/snake, its the person controling them.

People do not understand the idea of evaluating things on even ground, holy ****. You just validated my statement basically.

The Ganon player must be way ****ing better, thus, GANON SUCKS. Good God man. If a 5 year old has a Machine gun and a Navy Seals guy has a knife, who's is going to ****ing win? Does that mean the knife is more effective at killing and is more deadly? HELL NO.

 

[mariofanpm12]

i think that ganon has a small chance at doing well in a tourney.
until someone finds some groundbreaking technique with him, he'll probably stay like that and just be low tier. but i must say that many people don't look at ganon's strengths... only his weaknesses. and a lot of complains are stupid...

"He's fat!"... really?

"He runs gay"...does that even matter?

I think he has potential, just minimal. More people need to start using him so that there will be more Ganondorfs ranking in tourneys and a higher chance of a new technique to be found.

Still, he's my favorite character and so I'm gonna stick with him until the end!

 

[Falconv1.0]

All characters have potential.


Ganon has an amazing spike, over b is crazy good, he has a suicide move, his throws are strong, etc. Still, low tiers definitely cant do good because there are better people.


Ganon cant beat DDD. He just cant.

 

[mariofanpm12]

im sur eif ganon players tried hard enough to do well in tourneys and prove that ganon is good that he could perhaps become mid tier, even if lower mid tier

 

[Finns7]

A great ganon player can beat a DDD player (if there a great D3 then you'll prob need god on your side). I really main Link and just use Ganon for fun, I know these are low tier characters but my mindset at the end of the day is to just have fun and beat my opponent no matter what place he has on the tier list. I think his true style is still undeveloped, mainly because of the lack of ganon players.

 

[Falconv1.0]

A great ganon player can beat a DDD player (if there a great D3 then you'll prob need god on your side). I really main Link and just use Ganon for fun, I know these are low tier characters but my mindset at the end of the day is to just have fun and beat my opponent no matter what place he has on the tier list. I think his true style is still undeveloped, mainly because of the lack of ganon players.

You're spouting nonsense. Absolute freaking nonsense, you're showing no intelligence what so ever here, srsly.


Think about this, DDD has a huge chain grab on him, which eventually gets Ganon off stage
Guess what Ganon is really ****ing ****ty at? Oh right, RECOVERY. What is DDD good at? EDGEGUARDING. Ganon is SCREWED. If the Ganon is to win, the DDD has to be one of the worst players to enter a tourney scene, ever.

If you hope to contend these stupid *** claims that low tier characters are viable, show some ****ing knowledge on your match ups so you put your money where your mouth is.

 

[Gleam]

Falconv1.0- He never said that Ganondorf could beat Dedede easily. He even said that somebody would need a god on their side if they ever faced a competent Dedede player indicating that it wasn't an easy match. That's how I read it at least

 

[Falconv1.0]

Falconv1.0- He never said that Ganondorf could beat Dedede easily. He even said that somebody would need a god on their side if they ever faced a competent Dedede player indicating that it wasn't an easy match. That's how I read it at least

He started out basically claiming all characters can place high, and kinda tried changing his point mid way, I dont do that ****.


I'm tired of "A great *crap character here* can beat a *character here*". They never say anything of the opponents skill, only the crap character's. Wanna know why? Because they already know that only a **** tastic DDD would lose to any Ganon.

Then claiming "You need god on your side to beat a great DDD" seems plain hypocritical, and essential destroys his own argument.


Thus, Ganon sucks. Deal with it. He will never do well against good players in tourneys unless that match up is rather even.

 

[Finns7]

The only D3 I lost to was Vex Kasrani's. It was online and I was using low tier bad recovery Link and it was by 1 stock. He Cged me ill admit but when he missed I punished him. Ganon can punish people with the dair if they miss which can setup other attacks. Im sorry for disagreeing with you about how Ganon or low tier chars cant beat D3 even though I did it before...I totally was out of line. I usually only play online because the smash scene in my area is not that big so the only tournies I go to are in person tournies they are local and they dont contain world class competition. A person would be pretty blind not to see that Ganon has a disadvantage against D3 in certain areas. But I feel to overcome this the Ganon player must not show those weaknesses to the opponent. Lets say you were a pro at madden and you used a team with a bad pass rush and you played against a team with a great run and passing game, in order to win you would have to acknowledge that fault and do your best to cover it up by blitzing or adding extra coverage. When I play with ganon I know that Im one fair away from a edgeguard to death so I have to be extra careful and precise. I dont care what ranking my low tier mains are all that matters in the end is winning.

 

[Falconv1.0]

...Oh. I see. You beat your friends. Good logic there.


DDD pwns Ganon completely.

 

[Finns7]

He is not my friend he is one of the top 10 best prob on allisbrawl...Look Im done arguing Im just going to say I dont agree with some of your statements and I agree with some.

 

[Falconv1.0]

he is one of the top 10 best prob on allisbrawl..

Now that's just plain ignorant.


Anyone who has close matches with someone who has never been to a tourney isn't good, unless they srsly were sandbagging. Either way, no one has ever heard of him, and trust me, he is no where near the top ten of anything.

Your lack of intelligence at Smash is astounding.

 

[Finns7]

He is ranked 13 on the singles ladder he also beat Ally's Snake (who is ranked #1 with only 3 losses) this shows he is not a ******** D3 thats why I mentioned him.

 

[Falconv1.0]

He is ranked 13 on the singles ladder he also beat Ally's Snake (who is ranked #1 with only 3 losses) this shows he is not a ******** D3 thats why I mentioned him.

Question: How does one ranked 13 do that badly with D3? Seriously, cg to bair, there is like no thought required.

Either way, personal experience coming from you is not a solid defense.

 

[Griffard]

People do not understand the idea of evaluating things on even ground, holy ****. You just validated my statement basically.

The Ganon player must be way ****ing better, thus, GANON SUCKS. Good God man. If a 5 year old has a Machine gun and a Navy Seals guy has a knife, who's is going to ****ing win? Does that mean the knife is more effective at killing and is more deadly? HELL NO.

simna, gimpy, and many other pros in melee. seriously, **** you. it is very possible for an equally skilled ganon to beat out other chars. you obviously need to go to tournaments or try harder with more characters if you think higher tiers win in an equally skilled game everytime

 

[Griffard]

one example of equal skill play with a win for ganon:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPbJdt6Ehcs
lee harris vs. hylian

i can dig up many many more if you would like

 

[Falconv1.0]

Now that's cute.


Cept for the fact I'm pretty sure Gimpy never once stated Melee Bowser didn't suck.

And one other thing that it says: FRIENDLIES from Centex 1.


Ask any player like them if they would do that in a tourney. The answer would be **** no. But nice try.

 

[A2ZOMG]

Y'know, it just occurred to me. I don't think Hylian actually uses Falco.