Q&A How to Wreck *****es with Ganon?- Linguini Q&A Thread

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

Literally just finished playing on stream with some local new players, check it out. The Ganondorf action starts at about 10:46

http://www.twitch.tv/dr4gonblitz/b/510571665

 

[iRanch]

Literally just finished playing on stream with some local new players, check it out. The Ganondorf action starts at about 10:46

http://www.twitch.tv/dr4gonblitz/b/510571665

I wanna start streaming

These two weeks are so busy with school though.

 

[tm]

EVO too far away, too much cash. Probably can't even schedule around the travel. Maybe next year when I'm not poor. Dropped a lot going to apex this year

 

[Renth]

I have no interest in MLG or EVO I may go to CEO

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

EVO too far away, too much cash. Probably can't even schedule around the travel. Maybe next year when I'm not poor. Dropped a lot going to apex this year

very unfortunate. i didn't even get to meet you at apex, either. now i'm really upset.

come to ceo. you're in toledo, right?

i really want to meet you, coastward, superspright, dero, and wanted by the end of the year.

 

[X WaNtEd X]

i don't go by wanted fyi. i'm known as purple killer or simply pk in the upstate and new england areas. not very well known however.

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

WELL I WANNA MEET PURPLE KILLER SO HOOK ME UP.

 

[Coastward]

LOL, reach the canadian MLG qualifier? i'm helping organizing it so you should reachhhhhhh.

 

[tm]

very unfortunate. i didn't even get to meet you at apex, either. now i'm really upset.

come to ceo. you're in toledo, right?

i really want to meet you, coastward, superspright, dero, and wanted by the end of the year.

CEO more of a possibility. I'll keep it on my radar

 

[Linguini]

I'm def going to CEO. Possibly MLG, vegas isn't my thing.

 

[Shiny Mewtwo aka Jigglysir]

LOL, reach the canadian MLG qualifier? i'm helping organizing it so you should reachhhhhhh.

Thissssssssss

 

[Coastward]

alright so CEO is a go for me. get ready for the trifroce of canadian bacon.

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

YO0O0O00O0OO0000 that's what's good man. caps lock just confirmed too. that makes for two out of state ganondorfs confirmed. good **** guys.

 

[Geenareeno]

Yooooo what's up people. Eikelmann summoned me here. This thread looks pretty hype lately, good **** Renth. The city I'm living in for school doesn't have a scene but the scene back in my hometown has picked up a lot. When I go back I hope to play a lot and possibly record. Everyone has been playing P:M lately which is pretty cool but I long for melee. Kinda picked up Fox since practicing Fox by yourself is more fun that Ganon but I'll probably stick with Ganon. Ganon in P:M... I hated him at first and I thought he was the worst character in the game. I still think that but I like him since they gave him some cool buffs/tricks. So yeah, I'll try to be more active around here. It's good to be back. Did you say Linguini and SpiderSense were at an event! That's crazy! SS is definitely my favourite Ganon.

 

[RedmanSSBM]

Yup I'm absolutely confirmed for CEO this summer. Looking really forward to being in the Land of the Ganondorfs haha. Meeting everyone is gonna be hype. <3 Florida.

MLG and EVO I will just have to watch cause there's no way I'm gonna have the money/transportation to get to either places.

Also, I played my Falco friend again yesterday and I kept beating him with Link just to see how my Link still stands. Of course he's been playing my Ganon a lot but he still has nothing on my Link LMAO.

I'm also planning on streaming or at least recording a few good matches with my friends. I'll be sure to put them here.

 

[Renth]

Streaming with Uber Ice

http://www.twitch.tv/renth

 

[Coastward]

yo, we should do a ganon crew battle.

 

[X WaNtEd X]

got 9th at a local out of 33 called smashing grounds. kdj, soft and a few other good players were there. i feel like i could've done better but i was p content with all my matches.

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

yo, we should do a ganon crew battle.

if there's crews, we need to sign up as the ganondorf crew.

 

[PseudoTurtle]

Watch me and ripple on stream! twitch.tv/ripple884

 

[RedmanSSBM]

Following Renth on Twitch because I keep missing his streams lol

 

[Coastward]

going to a tournament tomorrow, gonna test out my new strats. hopefully get over the 17th place bug that i have.

gonna try to disrespect some scrubs with some pivot gerudo fists.

 

[RedmanSSBM]

Well, the good news is that I played some really good Ganon games today, some of the best that I have played in a while. I did a lot of things that I hadn't done before. I used wavelands on platforms (still want to practice this more), and I just overall got a lot of good hits, spacing, grabs, edgeguards, etc. I feel like I leveled up a bit.

The sad news is that it was being recorded, or so I thought.... My friend's recording setup was working, but unfortunately, as much as the audio was fine, the video is what got messed up

Oh well. I'm just happy I played well, here's hoping to get it on tape again.

 

[spider_sense]

I'll try to make it out to the next CEO, though I would really like to try to go to MLG. Money is really tight for me atm. I haven't played Ganon seriously in a long time.

 

[Renth]

I'll try to make it out to the next CEO, though I would really like to try to go to MLG. Money is really tight for me atm. I haven't played Ganon seriously in a long time.

I got you bro, come to CEO I'll get you in such a good mood you'll trash everyone

 

[RedmanSSBM]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCqMwcZTs20

Finally got a good hour of friendlies recorded. Featuring mostly my Ganon but also a bit of Falcon action too.

Let me know what you guys think

 

[Superspright]

The recording seems slower than the way the game should be. Am I wrong?

 

[Coastward]

back from my tournament, time for the coastward update!

got 4th in pools, choked up in a set and sd'd twice which costed me my 3rd seed.
4th seed bit me in the ass since i had to play raynEX in winner's R1 and a good falco in loser's R1. (goes by frog if any of you care).

although i didn't get the placing i wanted, i definitely got the boost of confidence i needed and figured out why i've been performing poorly lately.

so the first thing i cracked down on was that i double jump way too much. what i usually do is double jump fair for some reason, i dont know why to be honest. i realized that what i'm doing with that is completely stupid because of how bad i can get punished for it. like if i go for my fair, but double jump beforehand, a fox can just ****ing nair me or some **** and i'm off stage waiting to get shined.

another thing is that i'm being too greedy/inconsistent with my edge guarding. i never go for simple edge guards, or i just dont get good edge guards at all. like if my opponent is recovering low, i opt to do stupid **** like dropzone bair or something stupid, and i end up either with a **** trade or nothing getting the stock at all. i just need to keep it more simple and get the clean stocks. i think this is where i'm losing most of my matches.

the last thing that i need work with is my OOS game. all falco players are gay because they make my life a nightmare. **** lasers. anyway, i just need to deal with shield pressure better and implement WDOOS into my strats. i'm a scrub and i just started doing it like a couple of weeks ago so i still need to get used to it. also, i learned that if im getting gayed out by falco, or any character that has some lame ass projectiles, retreating to platforms is usually the safest bet. once i'm there, i can just bait out my opponents approach and punish them with shield drop uairs or some ****.

none of my matches were on stream, so i can't really go back and dissect anything, but i'm happy with what i took away with me today.

hopefully CEO levels me up so that i evolve into coastwardzard X.

 

[Renth]

Truthfully, every ganon main double jumps too much. It's our #1 weakness some how we all developed this really bad habit of wanting to jump out of hit stun and counter attack WHICH doesn't actually work.

 

[Coastward]

Truthfully, every ganon main double jumps too much. It's our #1 weakness some how we all developed this really bad habit of wanting to jump out of hit stun and counter attack WHICH doesn't actually work.

yeah, its something i developed which i thought i was doing right. and then i realized like, "holy **** im getting punished for this so much i should stop". like, i was trying to do it after peach fairs my shield, and then i lose stocks.

 

[Renth]

yeah, its something i developed which i thought i was doing right. and then i realized like, "holy **** im getting punished for this so much i should stop". like, i was trying to do it after peach fairs my shield, and then i lose stocks.

This is called learning from your mistakes, you are doing it right.

 

[Coastward]

melee is ****ing hard.

 

[RedmanSSBM]

You'll get the hang of it Coast. Just remember that Falco's tend to want to put you in a situation where they can easily take advantage of you. Staying in your shield and trying to shield grab is an example of what a Falco wants you to do. He wants you to do that so that when you do try to grab, he can get an easy shine and start a pillar combo.

You want to avoid staying still or in shield so it's definitely important to use platforms a lot, even more than necessary if you want to throw off Falco's game.

Also, if you're getting pillared don't panic and just DI away from Falco and try to tech so that Falco doesn't hit you with another shine or f-smash. It takes a bit of practice but I'm learning to get out of pillars much quicker than I had before.

It's definitely a good idea to not get overwhelmed when you're getting combo-ed by Falco because most of his combos are pretty standard and guaranteed. Average Falco's don't need to put in a lot of effort to pull off a combo, so you just have to focus on messing them up by teching a different way or DIing really well. I insure you, once you get past their lasers, avoid getting pillared and get some nice grabs, Falco's will start to get worried that their "guarenteed" strategy isn't working and they will resort to playing foolishly, which is where you can take full advantage.

 

[Renth]

Streaming friendlies with uber ice www.twitch.tv/renth

 

[X WaNtEd X]

Truthfully, every ganon main double jumps too much. It's our #1 weakness some how we all developed this really bad habit of wanting to jump out of hit stun and counter attack WHICH doesn't actually work.

this is so true. i've started doing a few mixups. if i'm going to a double jump that's not out of hitstun, i'll try to do two aerials as much as possible. but sometimes i'll just double jump really quick and di straight towards my opponent and land with a fair or whatever if i need to cover a lot of ground really quick to get the punish in. out of hitstun i started down bing for the lols while i was sandbagging in friendlies and it actually worked well at high percentages often. idk if i'd have the balls to pull that off in tournament though.

in speaking of weird ganon ****, i pulled off a down b offstage into an up b for the last stock the other night. twas hype a f.

 

[PseudoTurtle]

So I went to a tournament on Wednesday. After not playing for a couple months, I was pretty rusty and my tech skill blew, but after a while (mid tournament), I started playing better than I ever had before. Combos I never thought existed, great reads and baits, on-point edge guards, etc. It's kinda weird, always after not playing for a couple months, I get to a new level. I didn't place as well as I would have liked- got kicked out of winners early to kind of a scrubby sheik (no johns) and then out of losers by this dude who always beats me, but it was a super close set. He made the 2 stock comeback twice in a row . I also learn that I play to please haha, I enjoy getting asked whether I'm the fastest ganon in the world rather than being told I'm a good player (but I think that title still goes to spidey)

Then I played with Ripple again (who kicks ass at PM by the way) a couple days later. I started out kinda shaky and then started playing really well at the end! It's like stuff just kinda starts to click, I was following up on combos that I definitely wouldn't have before, improvising **** like wavedashing off a platform to a reverse uair (the only thing that would have hit) to keep a combo going and then finishing with a wavedash ftilt- stuff I never would have thought of previously. Monster zero to death combos and crazy movement. Feels good man . Really hoping to make a name for myself soon enough!

 

[Coastward]

So I went to a tournament on Wednesday. After not playing for a couple months, I was pretty rusty and my tech skill blew, but after a while (mid tournament), I started playing better than I ever had before. Combos I never thought existed, great reads and baits, on-point edge guards, etc. It's kinda weird, always after not playing for a couple months, I get to a new level. I didn't place as well as I would have liked- got kicked out of winners early to kind of a scrubby sheik (no johns) and then out of losers by this dude who always beats me, but it was a super close set. He made the 2 stock comeback twice in a row . I also learn that I play to please haha, I enjoy getting asked whether I'm the fastest ganon in the world rather than being told I'm a good player (but I think that title still goes to spidey)

Then I played with Ripple again (who kicks *** at PM by the way) a couple days later. I started out kinda shaky and then started playing really well at the end! It's like stuff just kinda starts to click, I was following up on combos that I definitely wouldn't have before, improvising **** like wavedashing off a platform to a reverse uair (the only thing that would have hit) to keep a combo going and then finishing with a wavedash ftilt- stuff I never would have thought of previously. Monster zero to death combos and crazy movement. Feels good man . Really hoping to make a name for myself soon enough!

that **** always happens to me, i start out the day like **** and then i start pulling off ridiculous stuff. i don't know what it is, it always happens. like at the tourney i went to, i got 4 stocked by the guy that sent me to losers. after i played some friendlies with him, and i was taking stocks off of him. ****ing ganon syndrome or some **** lmao

 

[tm]

Recent results, did about average:
http://smashboards.com/threads/the-...lts-and-shoutouts-80-singles-entrants.350339/

got a couple vids, hopefully up soon.

EDIT: here

vs S1 (fox)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=By0Mnw2SOf0

vs Shrouded One [Renth, give me tips!]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5DxrlCS6BB4

(doubles) vs TheLake & Nakamaru
disclaimer: this set was incredibly stupid
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cIle5biAOV0

Advice greatly appreciated
(note: I left my controller at home and had to use someone else's all day... not only was I not used to it but I didn't like it in general, and made a lot more technical errors in general)

 

[Renth]

(S1 the god vs. TM)

I like your jab/tilt ground game TM. When it comes to stage decision you need to ask yourself what happened in the match before. Did I feel to pressured? Could I not catch him? The Answers to both of these if you are too pressured you need room to move around, if you felt like you couldn't catch him then you need a smaller stage. Going back to battlefield was a good choice as it is over all Ganondorfs best stage.

I feel like you need to work on your off the ledge game, in both sets (this and vs. shrouded one) you made some technical errors that lead to some unfortunate stock loss. If you smarten up / mix up your ledge mechanics I feel like you'll be a lot stronger. Also, a mistake I use to make the "speedy dorf" is not something you can build a style around (as much as it kills me to say that.) It can catch some players by surprise but once they catch on to "speedy dorf" then you need to slow it down and play the slower pressure game. Once they realize you are going to be fast on platforms and throw out aerials after each waveland you become predictable and then you have already defeated yourself long before your opponent has. Try to box him out into certain areas and keep stage control center of the stage is the safest spot on the stage.

Over all good work, I suggest trying to do some ledge cancel shenanigans. A double back air of the ledges in the center of the stage are scary how fast and how far they can stretch (food for thought.) Also, Grabs and down smash! Another thing to add to your ledge game, jump on to the ledge and immediately down smash. It has magnificent range and if it hits it will LAUNCH your opponent off the stage behind you in a gimpy/awkward motion that can lead to easy edge guarding opportunities.

Vs. Shrouded one |
(my set with shrouded for reference)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HNTQp9yRCI )

Your platform game was on point, I felt you did really good stuff when he was above you. You used up air very effectively. Most peach mains have a mentality of wanting to go for trades, she cannot do that against Ganondorf. I feel like your turnip game was poor, a side note is that peach mains use the turnips to create space or open you up to get close to you.

Do not fall for her bull ****, turn on some items with some friends (or ya know... just play against... a peach...) and have them chuck some items at you. Press Z if you are in the air to catch items, sooner or later you will be comfortable with the timing to catch them or hit them. If peach throws a turnip in an approaching matter the safest option is honestly just to get away from it. She has some sneaky set ups and much like you did in your set you kept her above you which was very very good.

RANDOM PEACH TIP TIME:

If peach uses her down air to assist in an edge guard if you DI Down, you will not raise up into her n air/f air/whatever she is looking for. Simply DI down, Fall out of her down air and try again to sweet spot the ledge. Depending how far up you already are when she begins the down air, you can also DI up and towards her to get past her so her next strong aerial will hit you towards the stage instead of off the ledge. Most peaches when they realize this is happening will often look to down smash to help finish you off. Down smash is incredibly easy to tech as it smashes you into the stage.

*The Art of Lazy Teching*

You have a twenty frame window (1/3rd of a second for those less frame savvy individuals.) During your up b where you can just hold L/R and it will input the tech for you. Basically as Ganondorf (or any character) Whenever you know an attack is going to hit you or if you are recovering in general *try to get into the habit of always holding L/R when you are close to the ledge* If you hold L/R you don't have to try to time the tech by pressing the button, it will buffer it for you. I've been using this trick for years and it works wonders.

Another useful tip to go along with the lazy tech is ASDI. (Automatic smash DI) Which is where you DI with the C stick in moments where you are looking to tech. The Automatic smash DI though helpful has some draw backs. It only goes 1/2 the distance of a regular input'd smash DI. Smash DI is incredibly difficult to do ASDI helps take off some of the stress. So basically, when lazy teching try to get into the habit of holding the C stick towards the stage to help get a few ASDI's to assist in your teching opportunity.

This also greatly assists in the "amsah" tech. Best way to practice is to have someone break your shield, hold down on the C stick and have someone hit you with a hard hitting move. Ganondorf f air, tipper f smash from marth ect. Hold down on the c stick and joy stick when you are about to be hit then try to tech the the move with L/R.

*I tried to add useful general information for everyone here along with notes for TM specifically so that anyone who read this can benefit from this instead of just Ganondorf mains*

 

[Coastward]

man not enough people know about the upb lazy tech. i do it so much and people think im just a god teching but im taking the lazy way out lmao.

also, renth going in with the triforce of knowledge.