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Hero vs Light

HeroMystic

Legacy of the Mario
Joined
Aug 3, 2008
Messages
6,473
Location
San Antonio, Texas
NNID
HeroineYaoki
3DS FC
2191-8960-7738

HeroMystic

Legacy of the Mario
Joined
Aug 3, 2008
Messages
6,473
Location
San Antonio, Texas
NNID
HeroineYaoki
3DS FC
2191-8960-7738
Two stocks then.

And no johns. The only johns allowed are lag johns, and those belong to me. ;)
 

Lex Crunch

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jul 25, 2007
Messages
338
Location
Alameda, CA
I can't take a Wi-Fi match too seriously. It severely degrades both players' skill (at least from my experience). It just makes you wish they were on the floor or in a chair or on the couch next to you :(
 

•Col•

Smash Champion
Joined
Nov 19, 2007
Messages
2,450
The first and second match are the same one.

Also, you spam Mario's Down B, Hero... xDD
 

Ussi

Smash Legend
Joined
Mar 9, 2008
Messages
17,147
Location
New Jersey (South T_T)
3DS FC
4613-6716-2183
First two matches are the same. I would also say lag was unappealing to watch.

Light you either have bad timing or that lag always made you fair to early. Stop dairing and countering. Its a waste of time and leaves yourself open for punishment. Sure countering his projectile can work, but did it work a lot? no. If you want to counter, you want to use it on his smashes. But you just countered without thinking hard enough. Also aether spiking really kills Mario when it happens. And lay of the QD so much.

Hero, I see lag didn't let you combo utilt to uairs. You should try to use bair and dair as well, as they are good moves for Mario. Mario's ground game will get beat by Ike's, so do SH bairs and dairs (auto cancel dairs). Also, you should jab cancel with Mario. Jab > dsmash and etc..
 

HeroMystic

Legacy of the Mario
Joined
Aug 3, 2008
Messages
6,473
Location
San Antonio, Texas
NNID
HeroineYaoki
3DS FC
2191-8960-7738
Jab canceling against Ike on WiFI = bad. But thanks for the critque Ussi. I know WiFi is a bad way to watch player skill, but this is the best I can do until I get some offline recordings, which should be soon considering I finally have a way to record stuff.

And yeah Colaya. I spammed FLUDD way too much that day (I seemed to do that on all my matches that day...), but I'm gonna stop that.

And I'll upload a third match some time tomorrow since I gotta head back to my dorm tonight. That's what I get for uploading in the middle of the night.

One day, Light and I are gonna meet at a tourney and I'll ***-**** him. ;)
 

Ussi

Smash Legend
Joined
Mar 9, 2008
Messages
17,147
Location
New Jersey (South T_T)
3DS FC
4613-6716-2183
Good luck getting him to florida or getting yourself to cali. While your at it make a stop in NJ and bring me to cali~
 

YagamiLight

Smash Champion
Joined
Feb 2, 2008
Messages
2,411
Location
California
Light you either have bad timing or that lag always made you fair to early. Stop dairing and countering. Its a waste of time and leaves yourself open for punishment. Sure countering his projectile can work, but did it work a lot? no. If you want to counter, you want to use it on his smashes. But you just countered without thinking hard enough. Also aether spiking really kills Mario when it happens. And lay of the QD so much.
It's probably not my timing, which is fine offline, but the rest of the points are fairly valid. I also got a bit lax at spacing in some points of the matches, but not too much.
 

Lex Crunch

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jul 25, 2007
Messages
338
Location
Alameda, CA
We ought to just make a thread in the General Chat to arrange a meeting of all those willing, somewhere in some obscure place like Colorado or something and we could all Brawl locally.
 

Ussi

Smash Legend
Joined
Mar 9, 2008
Messages
17,147
Location
New Jersey (South T_T)
3DS FC
4613-6716-2183
XACE-K and Colaya, we should car pool since we live in the tri-state area. Where in NY and PA do you guys live? ;o Oh and I live closer to PA then NY though soo..
 

Arturito_Burrito

Smash Master
Joined
Mar 24, 2008
Messages
3,310
Location
el paso, New mexico
If we ever travel anywhere It should be to a big tournament in Vegas because its the cheapest place in the world to travel to. I would actually go to cali for a big tournament though its just as far as central Texas anyways.

Plus my dad lives in cali I'm pretty sure he would pay for my trip there.
 

XACE-K

Smash Master
Joined
Oct 28, 2007
Messages
4,106
Location
New York
We ought to just make a thread in the General Chat to arrange a meeting of all those willing, somewhere in some obscure place like Colorado or something and we could all Brawl locally.
Agreed.

Zomg.................. ROADTRIP!!!!
YEAH!!!

XACE-K and Colaya, we should car pool since we live in the tri-state area. Where in NY and PA do you guys live? ;o Oh and I live closer to PA then NY though soo..
Staten Island. But I'm 14.....

I'll where a fake moustache to make me seem older. :bee:

If we ever travel anywhere It should be to a big tournament in Vegas because its the cheapest place in the world to travel to. I would actually go to cali for a big tournament though its just as far as central Texas anyways.

Plus my dad lives in cali I'm pretty sure he would pay for my trip there.
Sooo....

Las Vegas then?
 

doom dragon 105

Smash Lord
Joined
Sep 17, 2006
Messages
1,487
Location
Miami
I was gonna say somethings, but it's wifi so imo it doesn't show anything, what I did notice is that Hero should upair more, Mario's upairs do wonders, I think Light is too offensive and more mind games would be nice, but it's wifi and doesn't show anything

EDIT: Also try to use short hopped fire balls, its better because you can move around and stuff, and it keeps the opponent guessing more because your in motion, and you could use them to approach safer
 

•Col•

Smash Champion
Joined
Nov 19, 2007
Messages
2,450
XACE-K and Colaya, we should car pool since we live in the tri-state area. Where in NY and PA do you guys live? ;o Oh and I live closer to PA then NY though soo..
Well, my home is in Pittsburgh, however I'm at college right now. I'm in Bradford, which is only like a 15 minute drive to the New York state line, and like an hour and a half drive to Buffalo. Lol, I dunno if I'd have time to go to any tournaments during the school year anyway... xD However, I am hosting a Melee/Brawl tournament with a few friends when I'm back in Pittsburgh for winter break... =P Dec. 27th-28th.

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=193691
 

Hoser

Smash Ace
Joined
May 26, 2008
Messages
521
Location
Martinsburg, WV
I know wifi can't really determine skill, it screws with timing, ect., so I'm not gonna critique everything.

There were four things that really stood out about your (Light) gameplay though. The first of them being your U-Smashes. You were charging them WAY to early. You should have waited until he was lower to the stage, and moved under him. Instead, you started it like right after you hit him, giving him plenty of time to move away from it. Not to mention that you gave him time to recover and go on the offensive due to the end lag of the U-smash.

The second thing I noticed, was the lack of short hops. There were multiple attacks you did that probably would have hit, had you used a short hop instead. Do you use Y/X, or the control stick to jump? I'm gonna assume the X/Y buttons, but the lack of short hops kinda made it seem otherwise. (I know you did use some short hops, but not often. Thus why I am assuming the X/Y buttons.)

Third thing, Quick Draw. I know you love to use it, and you're out to prove it IS an effective move (just as I am with the counter), but using it against a character with a projectile in point blank range when he isn't in any pre/end lag is less than effective.

Lastly, the counter. I love the move, and try to use it multiple times in a match, but you gotta know when to use it. There were multiple times where Mystic was in his shield, and you countered as you landed in front of him. You most likely did that because you thought he'd strike you as you hit the ground, but nowhere in the match did he give any indication that he would do that (meaning, he never did do that at any point [that I noticed, at least]). Perhaps he had done it in previous matches, but if so, he had successfully predicted that was your plan, and thus stopped doing it. But you kept countering, even though he was not doing that.

Actually I lied to you, there's a fifth point. This may be because of the wifi, but your grab game was non-existant. IMO, Ike's grab game very important. It can lead into many other moves, like the good ol' Uthrow => Utilt for example.

And the most important thing of all, which could very double your skill: Be the gold Ike. Nothing says badass like golden armor.

>>
<<

Well, I guess I did critique everything.

Hero, I'd do the same thing for you, but I don't know Mario as well as I do Ike. At one point he was my secondary, but I never played him seriously. Yours is much better then mine was.
 

YagamiLight

Smash Champion
Joined
Feb 2, 2008
Messages
2,411
Location
California
I know wifi can't really determine skill, it screws with timing, ect., so I'm not gonna critique everything.

There were four things that really stood out about your (Light) gameplay though. The first of them being your U-Smashes. You were charging thing WAY to early. You should have waiting until he was lower to the stage, and moved under him. Instead, you started it like right after you hit him, giving him plenty of time to move away from it. Not to mention that you gave him time to recover and go on the offensive due to the end lag of the U-smash.

Yeah, this was a main error in those matches. I gave a clear indication of what I was going for, though more often than not the UpSmash connected.

The second thing I noticed, was the lack of short hops. There were multiple attacks you did that probably would have hit, had you used a short hop instead. Do you use Y/X, or the control stick to jump? I'm gonna assume the X/Y buttons, but the lack of short hops kinda made it seem otherwise. (I know you did use some short hops, but not often. Thus why I am assuming the X/Y buttons.)

The game hates letting me short hop online. I don't even know why, but it does that. As for jumping, I am really weird I use Y for attack jumps and Up for recovery jumps. Yeah, funky.

Third thing, Quick Draw. I know you love to use it, and you're out to prove it IS an effective move (just as I am with the counter), but using it against a character with a projectile in point blank range when he isn't in any pre/end lag is less than effective.

That was just me being completely stupid. I'm just glad it happened in a friendly WiFi match rather than an important one.

Lastly, the counter. I love the move, and try to use it multiple times in a match, but you gotta know when to use it. There were multiple times where Mystic was in his shield, and you countered as you landed in front of him. You most likely did that because you thought he'd strike you as you hit the ground, but nowhere in the match did he give any indication that he would do that (meaning, he never did do that at any point [that I noticed, at least]). Perhaps he had done it in previous matches, but if so, he had successfully predicted that was your plan, and thus stopped doing it. But you kept countering, even though he was not doing that.

I play a Mario offline on a few occasions, and he always likes to drop his shield and do a quick attack. This instinct that he was going to attack carried over into these battles I'd have to say.

Actually I lied to you, there's a fifth point. This may be because of the wifi, but your grab game was non-existant. IMO, Ike's grab game very important. It can lead into many other moves, like the good ol' Uthrow => Utilt for example.

I love Ike's grabs, but the lag was significant enough in these matches that I didn't really go for them.

And the most important thing of all, which could very double your skill: Be the gold Ike. Nothing said badass like golden armor.
Golden Armor Roy, Blue Scarf Ike. Yep yep.

>>
<<

Well, I guess I did critique everything.
I'm glad you did!

These are a pretty shoddy display of my Smash talents, but until I get videos up myself these'll have to do.
 

Hoser

Smash Ace
Joined
May 26, 2008
Messages
521
Location
Martinsburg, WV
Me and Light in the last two posts said:
I know wifi can't really determine skill, it screws with timing, ect., so I'm not gonna critique everything.

There were four things that really stood out about your (Light) gameplay though. The first of them being your U-Smashes. You were charging thing WAY to early. You should have waiting until he was lower to the stage, and moved under him. Instead, you started it like right after you hit him, giving him plenty of time to move away from it. Not to mention that you gave him time to recover and go on the offensive due to the end lag of the U-smash.


Yeah, this was a main error in those matches. I gave a clear indication of what I was going for, though more often than not the UpSmash connected.

At least you were able to identify your main flaw. IMO, self-critique is the best way to get better. Also, I did see a few unsuccessful Usmashes that would most likely have been successful had you used Utilt instead. It's a very good move, and when you used it, you used it well, but like I said, there were a few times that it would have been better then the Usmash. I myself prefer it over the Usmash (unless I'm using the Usmash to hit next to me, or slightly diagonal, where the Utilt can't hit.)

The second thing I noticed, was the lack of short hops. There were multiple attacks you did that probably would have hit, had you used a short hop instead. Do you use Y/X, or the control stick to jump? I'm gonna assume the X/Y buttons, but the lack of short hops kinda made it seem otherwise. (I know you did use some short hops, but not often. Thus why I am assuming the X/Y buttons.)

The game hates letting me short hop online. I don't even know why, but it does that. As for jumping, I am really weird I use Y for attack jumps and Up for recovery jumps. Yeah, funky.

That used to happen to me, but I recently discovered it was my paddle. Try using another, or hitting Y lighter. As for how you jump, I'm the same exact way :0

Third thing, Quick Draw. I know you love to use it, and you're out to prove it IS an effective move (just as I am with the counter), but using it against a character with a projectile in point blank range when he isn't in any pre/end lag is less than effective.

That was just me being completely stupid. I'm just glad it happened in a friendly WiFi match rather than an important one.

Indeed. Had it happened in a tournament, you'd be kicking yourself. I personally find the best use of QD against Mario to be when he fails a Super Jump Punch, and falls helplessly. There's no way he's gonna be able to move out of the way.

Lastly, the counter. I love the move, and try to use it multiple times in a match, but you gotta know when to use it. There were multiple times where Mystic was in his shield, and you countered as you landed in front of him. You most likely did that because you thought he'd strike you as you hit the ground, but nowhere in the match did he give any indication that he would do that (meaning, he never did do that at any point [that I noticed, at least]). Perhaps he had done it in previous matches, but if so, he had successfully predicted that was your plan, and thus stopped doing it. But you kept countering, even though he was not doing that.

I play a Mario offline on a few occasions, and he always likes to drop his shield and do a quick attack. This instinct that he was going to attack carried over into these battles I'd have to say.

I can see how that would happen, but you gotta be on top of your game. To be good with Ike, you need to be able to adapt to any opponent/player practially right away. If you had been focusing on how he was fighting you instead of acting on instinct, you probably would have realized how ineffective it was against Mystic's Mario, despite it working on another person's Mario.

Actually I lied to you, there's a fifth point. This may be because of the wifi, but your grab game was non-existant. IMO, Ike's grab game very important. It can lead into many other moves, like the good ol' Uthrow => Utilt for example.

I love Ike's grabs, but the lag was significant enough in these matches that I didn't really go for them.

I had figured that was why, but I thought I'd mention it just in case. I have the same problem in Wifi matches. I've never been able to pull Ike's wall infinite for more than four grabs on wifi. The timing is too different to be consistent, IMO.

And the most important thing of all, which could very double your skill: Be the gold Ike. Nothing said badass like golden armor.

Golden Armor Roy, Blue Scarf Ike. Yep yep.

Lol. I used to use Blue Scarf Ike, but switched to gold, for some reason unknown to me.

>>
<<

Well, I guess I did critique everything.


I'm glad you did!

Good to know my opinion is appreciated :D
Horay for quote editing.
 

YagamiLight

Smash Champion
Joined
Feb 2, 2008
Messages
2,411
Location
California

I can see how that would happen, but you gotta be on top of your game. To be good with Ike, you need to be able to adapt to any opponent/player practially right away. If you had been focusing on how he was fighting you instead of acting on instinct, you probably would have realized how ineffective it was against Mystic's Mario, despite it working on another person's Mario.
This is so true it's odd. It would have been very smart for me to just drop my knowledge of the previous Mario, but that would have been highly difficult in a short span, considering I've been playing his Doctor Mario for most of Melee and his Mario for Brawl.

Roy v Doctor Mario...all gone...gone..
 

Hoser

Smash Ace
Joined
May 26, 2008
Messages
521
Location
Martinsburg, WV
This is so true it's odd. It would have been very smart for me to just drop my knowledge of the previous Mario, but that would have been highly difficult in a short span, considering I've been playing his Doctor Mario for most of Melee and his Mario for Brawl.

Roy v Doctor Mario...all gone...gone..
I can understand that. Me and my friends have been playing brawl since it came out, but I had no idea that it had a popular competitive scene, until I discovered SWF. I had gotten used to how my friend played as DDD, and was shocked to hear that DDD has quite the advantage over Ike. After playing some wifi matches, I soon understood why. I got three stocked a few times, because I was playing as though my opponent was my friend I usually play against. It took me a while to drop the habit of acting like that. But I've gotten to the point that I can ignore how I've seen people play in the past, and focus on determining their gameplay. It's the greatest mindgame, IMO

R.I.P Roy, you are strongly missed ;-(
 

Kinzer

Mammy
Joined
Jun 2, 2008
Messages
10,397
Location
Las Vegas, NV
NNID
Kinzer
3DS FC
2251-6533-0581
It's not gay...but it could use some improvements...mostly in the field of lag...
 

Light_13

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 13, 2008
Messages
261
Location
E-town KY
OMFG! anouther1. Shiit why so many of me? I thought i was original not generic. :/

GG guys
 
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