Help Me Defeat Link

[Y-L]

As an Ike player, Link is one of Ike's worst matchups. What are Link's weaknesses that can be exploited? I have trouble first getting past the wall of projectiles (which is the worst part) then up close Link has a fast nair, a safe retreating bair, a tether grab, and an extremely effective up-b OoS. Off stage Link has multiple effective recovery options as well. How can I deal with Link? He's probably the only character that genuinely annoys me in this game.

 

[foxygrandpa]

once you're on him and comboing him, dont let him gain positioning. Keep him on platforms and in the air, dont let him gain control of the stage.

 

[ITALIAN N1NJA]

^This. Exactly. Link is all about zoning. You want to keep him pressured the moment you get in on him. Link's Upb OOS takes 8 frames alone which should give you enough time to run in and quickly grab him for a Dthrow combo. You just need to get more creative with your combos and movement.

 

[Zekk]

in order to beat link you have to be unpredictable and fast I know Ike is slow so you might wanna take the time and practice his wave dashing more so you never mess up the most important thing is not to get hit because once you get hit by link he likes to follow it up with a kill move or more projectiles depending on your percent

 

[Simmonick]

My friend plays a lot of Ike against my link main, i usually win, which leads me to believe its a hard match up period. But just keep the pressure of close learn to tech chase with your quickdraw, dont get greedy of stage when coming back with the b-up ( always sweet spot ) link will punish you with his up-b, and mix up your approaches. Try to read when link is going to tether return so you can get an easy spike.

With link its all about baiting out his mistakes once you get your spacing correct, just have to out think him. Good luck!

 

[BladeOFLucas]

Now, I have a request. Do you guys have tips on how to beat a good Link with Ganondorf? He has a few less mobility options than Ike, and Ike has somewhat better coverage from projectiles than Ganondorf. I haven't been up against many good Link's, but it is way too easy for any Link to zone out Ganon.

 

[Simmonick]

First off idk why youd want to try to beat link with ganon theres so much proof to say that its un-winnable for ganandorf ( ie: the entire Zelda series)

I cant say I've ever played against a good g-dorf. Ganon is a a very punish heavy hero. and sometimes it seems like a lot of links on stage stuff is unpunishable. A good link will not fight ganondorf unless he knows he can gets guaranteed hits on him. This means retreating projectiles and well placed nairs and bairs from link. Just learn to predict links movements and read his techs to punish him..You would have to see what moves out priority links projectiles ( warlocks foot and flame choke come to mind) if you can get close than follow up with some quick bairs and jabs into a a warlocks foot and that should get him offstage. Idk man i just don't think its a god match up at all of for g-dorf. But i would love to see someone come up with some good ideas!

 

[Fenrir VII]

Now, I have a request. Do you guys have tips on how to beat a good Link with Ganondorf? He has a few less mobility options than Ike, and Ike has somewhat better coverage from projectiles than Ganondorf. I haven't been up against many good Link's, but it is way too easy for any Link to zone out Ganon.

I'm sorry to say this, but I'm not sure that's a winnable match for Ganon... it's really brutal.

 

[BladeOFLucas]

First off idk why youd want to try to beat link with ganon theres so much proof to say that its un-winnable for ganandorf ( ie: the entire Zelda series)

I cant say I've ever played against a good g-dorf. Ganon is a a very punish heavy hero. and sometimes it seems like a lot of links on stage stuff is unpunishable. A good link will not fight ganondorf unless he knows he can gets guaranteed hits on him. This means retreating projectiles and well placed nairs and bairs from link. Just learn to predict links movements and read his techs to punish him..You would have to see what moves out priority links projectiles ( warlocks foot and flame choke come to mind) if you can get close than follow up with some quick bairs and jabs into a a warlocks foot and that should get him offstage. Idk man i just don't think its a god match up at all of for g-dorf. But i would love to see someone come up with some good ideas!

Thanks, I appreciate the attempt. It may very well be a match-up that G-dorf just can't win, but in my opinion any match is winnable, so I'll give it a try. Plus, anyone who is good enough as Ganon to beat an expert link on a semi-regular basis would be one of the greatest Ganondorfs of all time, or just really lucky. lol

 

[BladeOFLucas]

In the event that Ganon can't beat Link, however, who do you recommend alting for him. This doesn't mean I am giving up the G-dorf idea, though.

 

[Zekk]

Now, I have a request. Do you guys have tips on how to beat a good Link with Ganondorf? He has a few less mobility options than Ike, and Ike has somewhat better coverage from projectiles than Ganondorf. I haven't been up against many good Link's, but it is way too easy for any Link to zone out Ganon.

Use your side B to start combos and waveland ALOT

 

[Bravo_10]

In the event that Ganon can't beat Link, however, who do you recommend alting for him. This doesn't mean I am giving up the G-dorf idea, though.

I mean, if you can play a really good rushdown Fox, you'll have a pretty good shot at beating Link. He's so fast that it's hard for Link to zone him out, and he can throw down insane pressure on the poor guy's shield that's hard to break (Link's only real option against hard pressure besides buffering a roll is his nair, which can get baited pretty easily).

That said, Fox is a pretty difficult character to play well. If you don't have the tech skill for it, you're probably better off trying to lock Link down with Falco's lasers.

/edit: I wish I could help you with the Ganon thing too; the king of evil is one of my strongest secondaries. I never really play him against Link though because I am considerably more comfortable just doing a ditto.

 

[G13_Flux]

ZSS is a great character to face link with. She is super fast, has an amazing punish game, and has a crap ton of range to boot. spaced dsmashes, side bs, and nairs give link a lot of trouble. even her grab is great in this MU, since she can punish link with it OOS and link doesnt always have the speed to punish her if she wiffs it. links up close shield pressure isnt exactly great either, so her relatively mediocre OOS options dont hinder her much at all in this MU. hes easy to combo too.

 

[EndY]

Dealing with Link as M2? It's mostly the usmash and fair that I just can't handle. I can deal with the projectiles just fine (from a distance).

 

[Fenrir VII]

Dealing with Link as M2? It's mostly the usmash and fair that I just can't handle. I can deal with the projectiles just fine (from a distance).

I really don't know where to pen this match. I could actually see M2 with an advantage, but idk. Teleport tricksies get you around projectiles and into Link's face... and M2 can certainly edgeguard.

conversely, Link can just brutalize M2 with combos... as for usmash, just SDI that. Fair is a different beast with good spacing, but bait + punish will work.

 

[Bravo_10]

Yeah, I could see Mewtwo with a slight advantage in that matchup, but only because he can completely shut down Link's glide-toss recoveries. Link actually has all the tools he needs to space out those fearsome tail hitboxes, and the combos against M2 are so real.

 

[EndY]

Yeah, I feel like my neutral game is completely shutdown, and my shadowball is nearly useless as an approach tool to anyone with good neutral stancing. Confusion and my wd / teleport are the only things that really let me get in, but I have to juggle backwards sometimes because that fair is unreal.

 

[NickRiddle]

Just hit him with your tail.
Everything else is either used during a combo, or it's bad.

 

[foxygrandpa]

I've been experimenting with zelda against my brothers link, that I consider to be really good. Zelda goes pretty even with him as far as I've seen, but maybe my brother doesnt know the the matchup.
Zelda's pretty easy to play too, it might be worth picking her up for the matchup.

 

[Bravo_10]

The one big problem Zelda has against Link is that he doesn't have to approach her. She prays on imperfect approaches and baits like a champ, but Link can simply out-camp her (plus, a mid-range boomerang hit at 90+ percent practically guarantees a kill move). When I play against Zelda, it usually takes a moment to get into the right mindset, but I can really do some work once I get into the feel of it.

 

[Super_Primid]

I really didn't know where to place this but i had an idea of adding Primid to PM. He'd be a Super Primid having an ability from each of his forms. I already put him in my PM but it's not perfect an i don't have recording equipment. So if you guy could tell me where to post all this it would be great also..... SPREAD THIS AROUND SO PMBR CAN SEE THIS!!!i


(P.S. Primid would be a character who, in the right hands, could "beat" Link so it works in this thread)

 

[Fenrir VII]

Zelda just makes you be frustratingly patient. Zair zoning is fantastic against her.

Overall, it's probably a 6-4 match for link, but she's tricky, man.

 

[Problem2]

You can kill the boomerang with your sword moves. Just swing at it to make it disappear. Be very aggressive. Ganondorf can also b-air the boomerang as well, but that's a bit trickier.

 

[BladeOFLucas]

A well-spaced f-air would be better for G-dorf as far as killing projectiles, it's just that he has so many - projectiles that is.

 

[Problem2]

you can auto-cancel b-air (and n-air too I believe, but I haven't tested beating boomerang with that).

 

[Bravo_10]

Yes, nair autocancels as well. You can set up a neat little ganon-wall by following SH-nairs with jabs or f-tilts. It can probably beat boomerang?

 

[BladeOFLucas]

Yeah, Arty Vortex it up, that works. I guess I hadn't considered that, but is it enough to mute that advantage Link has? He still has range advantage on a lot of his hits.

 

[Bravo_10]

I really doubt it'll be enough. Sure, it can stuff repeated boomerangs, but smacking a bomb out of the air just makes it explode on you. Plus, Link still has zair, a quick-ish ranged grab that can punish predictable walling, and enough speed to make Ganon's day a nightmare.

 

[BladeOFLucas]

Exactly, it would require a lot of expert faking out, a LOT. Plus Ganon would have to be able to respond quickly enough to punish Link when he whiffs.

 

[Shin_Mazinkaiser]

Now, I have a request. Do you guys have tips on how to beat a good Link with Ganondorf? He has a few less mobility options than Ike, and Ike has somewhat better coverage from projectiles than Ganondorf. I haven't been up against many good Link's, but it is way too easy for any Link to zone out Ganon.

The first step to making that MU better for Ganon is to take him to a heavy platform stage or a stage that doesn't allow Link to run from you.

You have to learn to play directly on top of Link when you get in.

Once Link loses his ability to CC, he doesn't like to have people in front of him when he's not the one hitting people.

Choke his space, don't give him room to breathe.

But most of all, get him off-stage.

Link's recovery is free to Ganon's options.

While holding the edge, U-air spike and D-air will bop tether recoveries free. And B-air, U-air, and D-air holding the ledge body his Up-B recovery free.

This is just from my experience.

This is assuming you'd be okay with learning to be aggressive with Ganon.

I play almost everyone like a rush-down character. lol

 

[BladeOFLucas]

I have no problem being aggressive with Ganon, thanks for the advice.

 

[Super_Primid]

Aggression usually wrecks Link cause he don't have time to set up anything.

 

[BladeOFLucas]

What about Link's who don't obsess over the projectile game? Link's up-smash might become problematic, now that I think about it. 'Cause if Ganon is to aggressive from the getgo then couldn't Link just use that to force a retreat?

Scratch that, G's f-air outreaches Link's up-smash

 

[NickRiddle]

Why wouldn't you obsess over an amazing projectile game?

 

[ImpossiblyRood]

One of link's weaknesses is his obvious weakness to pressure. Take him to stages like Warioware and such. In a way, he's very similar to Snake in that you have to really get in on his space and never leave. You want to be an insurance salesman. Once you get past the beartraps and dogs, get your foot in the door, talk your way in and try and give Link bad insurance that won't, in fact, cover any of the damage he could realistically attain.
On a slightly less confusing and silly note, if you can keep him from zoning [platforms and large stages help Link here], you can generally kick his teeth in. Yes, his nair is dangerous, but it has a decent amount of endlag, as does his up-b. If you can either bait or dodge his nair, the punish must be swift and unyielding.

If you really want to do a Ganon vs. Link matchup, learn to powershield. That's essential. His boomerang is probably the best projectile to try and counter. Also, don't always expect to get the hardcore dunk/stomp punish. Don't be afraid to use your nair as a quick-punish tool of pain. Once you get through Link's projectiles, remember that many of his aerials and close range tools have lengthy endlag [excusing the dair, which is very quick and the nair, which has a lingering hitbox]. Assuming you can effectively bait things like the uair, you can fairly easily smack him with a dunk. Just remember to be patient with your punish timing, and while you should keep up the pressure constantly, do not get overzealous or greedy, as that's a sure-fire way to get yourself hurt. Last thing, Link's nair, while quick, does not make him invulnerable. The range isn't stellar nor is it disjointed, so if you can bait it, you can get in a good punish dunk. Also remember that the vertical range is exceptionally poor, so be sure to abuse Ganon's uair, or, in the unlikely circumstances, mash his face in with a stomp. This makes a lot of assumptions about you getting past his projectiles [which is no easy task], but once you get in on link, he is beatable.

 

[BladeOFLucas]

Good way of explaining, your metaphor was stellar.

 

[NickRiddle]

Link really doesn't have a hard time with pressure. It's more like pressure AND a fast dash. Normal pressure loses to retreating sh rang.

 

[E2xD]

One of link's weaknesses is his obvious weakness to pressure. Take him to stages like Warioware and such.

Yes yes... Please take me to Wario Ware. >: D

Gotta remember, Link can camp those top two platforms there without being touched, all thanks to AGTs and falling n-airs, d-airs (ledgecancelled). If you really want to pressure Link, take him to FoD. The platforms will mess him up and you can apply a lot of pressure there. But in all honesty, the argument can be made that Link doesn't have a bad stage. I'd gladly fight on any stage against any character.

Link really doesn't have a hard time with pressure. It's more like pressure AND a fast dash. Normal pressure loses to retreating sh rang.

^This

 

[ImpossiblyRood]

Gotta remember, Link can camp those top two platforms there without being touched, all thanks to AGTs and falling n-airs, d-airs (ledgecancelled). If you really want to pressure Link, take him to FoD. The platforms will mess him up and you can apply a lot of pressure there. But in all honesty, the argument can be made that Link doesn't have a bad stage. I'd gladly fight on any stage against any character.

That's surprising, actually I always get rocked on Warioware and do rather well on FoD. Different strokes for different folks, I guess. I will admit that I've never played against Ganon on either Warioware or FoD, so I can't really say. But when I play against a Martha on Warioware, I get my world rocked like AC/DC is making a reunion tour.

 

[Bravo_10]

I really like FoD too actually, but that's probably because I'm a little on the agressive side with Link. Usually my opponents use the platforms to get into that awkward little "dead zone" at about a 45 degree angle above Link. When the side-platforms go down, all I have to do is chuck a bomb up towards the top platform, and it's open season.

Warioware's kind of a mixed bag for me. If I'm playing with someone who won't get out of my face, it can be a nightmare. But the bright side is that the blastlines are so tight, Link's kill moves will start to KO at like 80%, which is ridiculous.