Good ol' fox. Is he still the best?

[Strong Badam]

I'm curious...who do you think is the best in Melee?

Falco

Fox is definitely the best in PM though

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

Falco

Fox is definitely the best in PM though

What makes Falco better than Fox? Fox has much better matchups vs. bunch of characters (Puff, Peach, Sheik...)

E: I'm not trying to argue or start a debate, just interested

 

[Strong Badam]

I think Fox has more winning matchups but he also loses to Falco, whereas Falco has tons of even matchups and no bad matchups. Having to outplay your opponent in order to win may be a far-fetched idea to most spacie players but that's why Falco is the best (in Melee). In PM he's definitely worse. More diverse stages and a short list of characters that probably beat him that don't beat Fox throw it in Fox's favor for sure.

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

I think Fox has more winning matchups but he also loses to Falco, whereas Falco has tons of even matchups and no bad matchups. Having to outplay your opponent in order to win may be a far-fetched idea to most spacie players but that's why Falco is the best (in Melee). In PM he's definitely worse. More diverse stages and a short list of characters that probably beat him that don't beat Fox throw it in Fox's favor for sure.

I see but I thought Fox-Falco was even? I guess it's up to a debate, it's definitely Fox's hardest matchup.

 

[1MachGO]

I see but I thought Fox-Falco was even? I guess it's up to a debate, it's definitely Fox's hardest matchup.

A good Marth who doesn't drop punishes and edgeguards is also really hard for Fox. I think Fox's prominence in recent memory and people touting him as some kind of unstoppable force is partially thanks to the stagnation of Marth's meta. That, and people are sheep.

In terms of Fox vs. Falco, its a very violent MU. Both have options to kill eachother with almost no effort if they have to up-b below the ledge and both have a lot of powerful combos on each other. However, I have to agree with the camp that says Falco wins because Falco's shine is wayyyy easier to land than Fox's grab (both being their principle combo openers). The advantages aren't major, but its enough to give Falco an edge.

I also have to agree that its Falco>Fox in Melee but Fox>Falco in P:M (in terms of overall viability). However, I think neither character is #1 in P:M.

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

A good Marth who doesn't drop punishes and edgeguards is also really hard for Fox. I think Fox's prominence in recent memory and people touting him as some kind of unstoppable force is partially thanks to the stagnation of Marth's meta. That, and people are sheep.

This is just personal bias but I think Marth is much easier to deal with than Falco, especially in NTSC where you can actually waveshine him which I think is a crazy advantage for Fox to have