Geno or Bowser Jr. for last Mario series spot?

[Mr.Victory07]

After seeing a few arguments over the placement of Bowser Junior and Geno in the game, i felt I hade to make a thread about their chances. Since Bowser Jr. and Geno are the most suggested, and their are already 4 Mario series characters in the game(you all know Luigi is in...), it is likely only one will make it.
First weigh out their advantages and disadvantages

Geno

Advantages

• 
  Was a very important character in Super Mario RPG, Mario's second biggest ally in the game
  Has a larger, more underground, fanbase
  Can have a very unique moveset
  Placed high in Sakurai's poll
  Could be a retro rep

Dis-ads

• Is technically owned by Square(square-enix), so he would likely be a third-party character, and with the limited amount of spots, many people would rather have other third-party characters in
  hasnt played a role in any recent game
  Super Mario RPG has only 1 game
  Super Mario was never released in PAL, so he might not have much fans in europe
  Isnt to well known outside of people who have played SMRPG or have seen him online
  SMRPG doesnt have confirmed material in Brawl

Bowser Junior

Advantages

• 
  Has been in many recent Mario games
  Could have a unique moveset with a Shadow Mario transformation
  Was the main villan in Sunshine and New Super Mario Bros., as well as a villan in Galaxy(sunshine and galaxy have been confirmed to have material in the game)
  Has provided more to the series(debateable)

Dis-ads

• 
  Has a smaller fanbase than Geno
  Didnt appear on Sakurai's poll
  Could be a Bowser clone
  Sakurai seems to have less interest on popular characters this time around

So with all that pointed out, i have to say i think Bowser junior has a marginally bigger chance of being PC then Geno. The biggest thing against Geno is that he is technically owned by Square, so technically third party. And I know many people would have fits if a third party spot, that could possibly have been taken by someone like Mega-man or Isaac is taken by a seemingly Ninteno character. But he did cameoin Mario & Luigi superstar saga, so maybe they could get the permission, but a whole character in a big fighting game is bigger than a cameo appearance. And another fact is that Geno hasnt stared in recent games, so is not easily recognizable by the "casual gamer". But it is true that the Ice Climbers nor Pit have een in recent games, but they are way retro. Geno could possibly be considered "retro", but the SNES and 1996 werent really that long ago. But Geno does have the upper hand on fanbase, as Bowser Junior wasnt in Sakurai's poll and Geno ranked pretty high, and as evident by Gardevor and the Sin and Punishment guy, Sakurai is listening to the fans. But I still feel Bowser Jr. gets the spot simply because of selling point to newer gamers, the fact he's been in more than 1 game and games recently, and the fact that hes a sort of popular villan, in which the game is lacking. So i would rate their chances as 8.4 to 7.9
But if their are six spots availiable and both made it in, wouldnt that be great too?

 

[vesperview]

Both

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[MarthTrinity]

Both

QFT

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[Svatos]

I think that geno is a far more interesting character and has had a huge interest,
but brawl may have Jr. Bowser beacuse of the legal matters.

 

[bballstar23]

Both

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Exactly

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[Gundo]

Geno

but I think us debating on who should be in is pointless. game is already done. just demos of the stages and events and stuff. I'm sure they settled on the characters a while ago....

but still, geno.

 

[3D King]

Both

Assuming Doctor Mario is out, and that the Mario series will have at least 1 more rep than Melee did, there are at least 2 Mario character slots, and I can think of none better than the youngest Koopaling and the possessed doll.

 

[Black/Light]

BJ

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[Fatmanonice]

For Bowser Jr, here are some more disadvantages:

1. Bowser acting independently in the SSE.

2. Pichu, Daisy, Waluigi, and Dark Samus being deconfirmed showing that Sakurai doesn't intend to add characters that are basically different variations of the same character. (Keep in mind that characters like Cell Shaded Link and Paper Mario star in several of their own games and thus are exempt from this. The fact that his name is BOWSER Jr doesn't exactly help his case either.)

3. Rosalina's being confirmed as an AT showing that Super Mario Sunshine is not the latest major Mario game being represented. (Many Bowser Jr fans have used this as an arguement in the past.)

4. The fact that several major villians haven't been added yet like Ridley and K. Rool (both characters that were mentioned more then once in Sakurai's journal and have much longer histories then Bowser Jr.) and naturally take priority over secondary villians.

5. Melee's villian ratio was 3/26. All of these villians were from different franchises and if you consider what I said in point 4, the percentage of new playable villians probably won't be that much greater then it was in Melee and these new vi;;ians will be from franchises that don't have one yet.

In the end, realistically, Geno and Paper Mario are basically the only Mario characters that are still in the running.

 

[Panduh]

Bowser Jr.
He's in so many games, and is so much more important.
Plus with his Paintbrush in all.
Geno is way overrated I think.

But personally, I wouldn't want either of them in.

 

[Sasori's_Shadow]

I'd like them both. The largest selling video game franchise of all time can have 6 reps (assuming Luigi's in). But if I had to choose between the two: Bowser Jr; don't even have to think about it. Geno may have more of a fan-base, but Junior's a whole lot more important to his franchise, and just a better choice if you ask me. Plus, he's my personal favorite Mario character, so I'd just rather see him in.

For Bowser Jr, here are some more disadvantages:

1. Bowser acting independently in the SSE.

We don't know this for a fact. We have very few, very short clips in which Bowser has made any sort of appearance. And still, if he was I hardly see that harming Junior's chances in any way. In the SE we have Fox working with Diddy and the Ice Climbers fighting along side Meta Knight, anything can happen really. Plus, Junior's acted independently of his father plenty of times throughout the recent Mario games.

2. Pichu, Daisy, Waluigi, and Dark Samus being deconfirmed showing that Sakurai doesn't intend to add characters that are basically different variations of the same character. (Keep in mind that characters like Cell Shaded Link and Paper Mario star in several of their own games and thus are exempt from this. The fact that his name is BOWSER Jr doesn't exactly help his case either.)

Don't ever use this argument against Junior again, really. There are enough people who do, and it's not a valid argument. Yes, Bowser Jr is Bowser's son, and yes, he looks like Bowser. Does this make him any less deserving? No. He's an entirely different character than Bowser; I've said this before but this reasoning is very elementary.

And Sakurai really never said "no clones in Brawl," so even if Junior's only potential was as a Bowser clone it hardly hurts his chances in the slightest.

4. The fact that several major villians haven't been added yet like Ridley and K. Rool (both characters that were mentioned more then once in Sakurai's journal and have much longer histories then Bowser Jr.) and naturally take priority over secondary villians.

This argument just doesn't hold any water either. There's no limit to the amount of villains this game can host; a villain can be just as deserving and just as important a character as a hero. And that's what we're looking at here, correct? Deserving characters.

5. Melee's villian ratio was 3/26. All of these villians were from different franchises and if you consider what I said in point 4, the percentage of new playable villians probably won't be that much greater then it was in Melee and these new villains will be from franchises that don't have one yet.

Yeah, and carrying that ratio over to this game is pointless. 64 didn't have any villains, did the 0:1 ratio carry over to Melee? Brawl is an entirely different game than Melee, and like I said, villains can be just as important to their own franchise, and just as deserving as a heroes.

 

[Jumble]

i think bowser jr. has a better chance
since geno is a third party character and all
of course i want them both
but i'd choose bowser jr. over geno
he has been in more games, he's a bigger part of mario then geno
and also.. he can turn into shadow mario!
and he has a paintbrush!!!! XD

 

[Fatmanonice]

I also want to bring how "being more recongizible" is hardly a factor considering how Waluigi and Daisy have been shot down despite being in 20+ games in the past decade and how Sakurai has already told us how he's turned down several highly requested characters like Deoxyes, Saki, and Little Mac*,

*It was further reflected that Sakurai didn't have that much interest in making these characters playable seeing how Deoxyes and Saki didn't appear in Sakurai's journal and how Little Mac only appeared once.

 

[Sasori's_Shadow]

I also want to bring how "being more recongizible" is hardly a factor considering how Waluigi and Daisy have been shot down despite being in 20+ games in the past decade and how Sakurai has already told us how he's turned down several highly requested characters like Deoxyes, Saki, and Little Mac*,

I think the argument Junior supporters are trying to get across here, moreso than the fact that Junior is more recognizable than Geno is the fact that he's also more important to the Mario franchise.

 

[paralasalud]

Geeeeeeno.

 

[shadenexus18]

I support both Bowser Jr. and Geno making it to the final roster 50/50. No mas, no less.

 

[IsmaR]

For Bowser Jr, here are some more disadvantages:

2. Pichu, Daisy, Waluigi, and Dark Samus being deconfirmed showing that Sakurai doesn't intend to add characters that are basically different variations of the same character. (Keep in mind that characters like Cell Shaded Link and Paper Mario star in several of their own games and thus are exempt from this. The fact that his name is BOWSER Jr doesn't exactly help his case either.

Dark Samus is not deconfirmed! And she ain't just a "different variation" of Samus.

 

[shadenexus18]

^^What he said. DS is a phazonolic. Seriously, youtube "Dark Samus." Then you'll see that she moves totally different than Samus. Plus, she is so NOT deconfirmed.

Anyways, it could go either way. Geno is on high demand by alot of people to make it in. On the flipside Bowser Jr. is instantly recongizable seeing how he's the spawn of Bowser. That and he's been in alot of recent titles.

 

[Machete]

So, the biggest videogame franchise of all time doesn't deserve 6 characters?

Both of them should be in.

Dark Samus is not deconfirmed! And she ain't just a "different variation" of Samus.

QFT.

 

[Mysteryfox1]

Bowser Jr.

I think a villian that reocccurs in the series is better then a sidekick who was in only two games and in one of them just a small cameo

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Geno is 3rd party and outclassed by better Square-Enix characters (such as Final Fantasy's Black Mage).

Bowser Jr. has a better shot at being playable.

 

[Storm Eagle]

Both

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Nuff said..

 

[Ryudo_Sama]

Geno, being number one in the polls now.

 

[Darkpaladin of Chaos]

2. Pichu, Daisy, Waluigi, and Dark Samus being deconfirmed showing that Sakurai doesn't intend to add characters that are basically different variations of the same character. (Keep in mind that characters like Cell Shaded Link and Paper Mario star in several of their own games and thus are exempt from this. The fact that his name is BOWSER Jr doesn't exactly help his case either.)

You are an idiot. That's all you need to know. You are basing similarity on names... So by your logic King K. Rool has no chance based solely on the fact that there is already a character named King Dedede, and Black Knight is disconfirmed solely on the fact that Meta Knight is playable. And of the characters you listed at the beginning, only Pichu and Daisy are close enough to be different variations of other characters. Shows how much you know about these characters. Maybe you should do your research next time instead of hopping on the bandwagon of people who have been saying the same ridiculous things all along.

 

[limitbreak]

I support bowser junior. Geno is waaaaaaaay too over rated, there is absolutely nothing cool about him. Hopefull junior would be a quicker lighter version of Bowser and hopefully he would have some what different moves.

 

[Darkpaladin of Chaos]

Geno, being number one in the polls now.

*cough* tied *cough*

 

[~Krystal~]

I'd give it to Bowser Jr.

 

[TMS]

Bowser Jr. has a better chance, but I wouldn't be surprised to see them both.

 

[Ryudo_Sama]

*cough* tied *cough*

With King Dedede who is already confirmed.

 

[Machspeed]

Both

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QFT.
Why can't we just see both? With the dropping out of Dr. Mario, and Wario/Yoshi representing their own series, there's enough room for the both of them and I wouldn't be surprised to see both.
No need for competition between the two.

 

[CT Chia]

this makes no sense, no one said that there was only one more mario spot

 

[Asuma]

I easily want Bowser Jr. but if Mario has 6 reps,I wouldnt mind both

 

[shadenexus18]

QFT.
Why can't we just see both? With the dropping out of Dr. Mario, and Wario/Yoshi representing their own series, there's enough room for the both of them and I wouldn't be surprised to see both.
No need for competition between the two.

Because the Mario series has alot of characters that can be in Brawl. I mean, even some of the minions have a chance to do battle in Brawl. I mean if Pokemon Trainer can get in, pretty much anybody can make it onto this game.

Still though, everybody has the right idea here. They both could make it, but if it comes down to it, Bowser Jr. has Geno beat.

 

[Davidius]

Neither to be honest.

 

[DeuceBlade]

Bowser Jr first, then geno.

 

[Sabrewulf238]

this makes no sense, no one said that there was only one more mario spot

Exactly people seem to just assume things and next thing you know they're fact.

I can't really choose as I'm not mad about either of them, But I'd prefer Paper mario and Vivian over them two.

 

[Bassoonist]

Bowser Jr. is stupid, IMO. Geno is so much better.

But looking at the chances it doesn't look like Geno will make it, hopefully Bowser Jr. doesn't either.

 

[DeuceBlade]

Bowser Jr. is stupid, IMO. Geno is so much better.

But looking at the chances it doesn't look like Geno will make it, hopefully Bowser Jr. doesn't either.

Just because Geno has a lower chance doesn't mean you have to hope Jr doesn't make it in, If you don't like him then don't play with him if he makes it in. and he isn't stupid. lulz

 

[Bassoonist]

Just because Geno has a lower chance doesn't mean you have to hope Jr doesn't make it in, If you don't like him then don't play with him if he makes it in. and he isn't stupid. lulz

Do you even know what "IMO" means?

 

[Darkpaladin of Chaos]

With King Dedede who is already confirmed.

No, Dedede had 5 votes. Geno has 4. I was talking about Ridley (4 as well).