Geno (♥♪!?): Return of the Starsend Savior

[EricTheGamerman]

You missed me making some sick Joker jokes.

But nah, not much, friend-o. It's been awfully stagnant. Nintendo is crossing Zelda over with an indie dev, though, which is NUTS.

Meh, they gave Zelda to Phillips before and let them make three train-wrecks, might as well give it to indie developers and give them a shot


...ok maybe the Phillips situation wasn't entirely a voluntary decision on Nintendo's part, just saying Zelda's seen some weird places before hehe....

 

[Ovaltine]

Meh, they gave Zelda to Phillips before and let them make three train-wrecks, might as well give it to indie developers and give them a shot


...ok maybe the Phillips situation wasn't entirely a voluntary decision on Nintendo's part, just saying Zelda's seen some weird places before hehe....

Eric, my man.

Never remind me of those disasters again.

(I love those trainwrecks so much. Maybe that and Hotel Mario made Nintendo extra leery about letting other companies use their properties afterward. I'd... definitely be careful after that bad a massacre to their IPs, too, if I were them. lmao)

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

:Temporarily crawls out of the hell that is my final semester in college:

So what'd I miss?

GDC went out like a wet fart, except for the mindblowing news that is Cuphead on Switch and a Necrodancer/Zelda crossover (which were both shown on Nindies anyway). Also, a sequel to Blaster Master Zero.

Meh, they gave Zelda to Phillips before and let them make three train-wrecks, might as well give it to indie developers and give them a shot


...ok maybe the Phillips situation wasn't entirely a voluntary decision on Nintendo's part, just saying Zelda's seen some weird places before hehe....

Eric, I think we can agree that the CDI games count even less than they already did from now on.

It's kinda like how Mario + Rabbids Kingdom made Hotel Mario and all those educational games look redundant.

 

[Sovereign Trinity]

What’s some music you guys want in Smash, whether they’d be originals or new remixes? I want Birdman (Pilotwings 64), Main Theme (Wave Race 64), Vacant Lives (1080 Snowboarding), and many, many others.

Main Menu and Battlefield soundtracks from the E3 demo. I'm surprised and not sure why they aren't in the full game as separate versions, despite a majority of us liking those tracks a lot better than the updated ones we got for the full game. Hoping these two demo soundtracks get added in version 3.0.

I'd like to actually see the original version of Sticker Star, if only due to the unique partners.

The original Sticker Star (Paper Mario 3D) looked like it was going to be fun. Sure it looked like it would only use Mario characters, but at least they brought more life to them. I wish we could've seen the Chain Chomp partner in action. It also would've been nice to see Paper Jam actually be a collaboration of ALL the Paper Mario games instead of just Sticker Star... ugh, I've seen fan-made photos of Mr. L and Popple, enemies from Super Paper Mario, and Goombella in Paper Jam, and it just makes me wonder how they missed an amazing opportunity like this.

 

[TheBeastHimself]

Eric, my man.

Never remind me of those disasters again.

(I love those trainwrecks so much. Maybe that and Hotel Mario made Nintendo extra leery about letting other companies use their properties afterward. I'd... definitely be careful after that bad a massacre to their IPs, too, if I were them. lmao)

You know for what it's worth I don't think Hotel Mario is an inherently bad game. Definitely a lot better than the Zelda CDI games. I can completely understand why people hated those. Those games are semi-functional and at times just flat out unfair, on top of those questionable cutscenes.

But I don't know, Hotel Mario is different. I'm not saying it's a perfect game, or even a great one at that, but it works fine and retains that classic Mario feel to it, jumping over enemies and shooting fireballs. I can't speak for everyone, but I actually had a bit of fun running around and closing doors lol. Of course the game isn't perfect and there are some aspects of it that can be annoying, but all games have those types of little nuisances. The clunky CDI controller doesn't help, but it's nothing game-breaking and frustrating like the Zelda games. And I know Hotel Mario also had those cheesy cutscenes, but I grew fond of them actually. Some of them are just so bizarre or bad that they're funny. Me personally, the Zelda cutscenes just felt so off and creepy...

Even Philip's' cancelled Mario game, Super Mario's Wacky Worlds, had a lot of potential to it. Looking back on it now, it's almost like a 16-bit Mario Odyssey in the sense that you travel to different locations around the globe. It looked really cool to me:

I feel like Philip's shouldn't have touched Zelda because they had no idea what they were doing. By the looks of it, it seems Philip's was more accustomed to 2D side-scrollers, so naturally their Mario games would feel more polished than Zelda. I feel like if Philip's had the opportunity to keep working on Mario games, they'd have potential to make something great. Super Mario's Wacky Worlds feels like it could have been that game, but I guess we'll never know now.

 

[ZelDan]

The CDi Mario and Zelda games were great youtube poop/meme material.

Sadly, that's more than can probably be said for other games.

 

[Sovereign Trinity]

The CDi Mario and Zelda games were great youtube poop/meme material.

Sadly, that's more than can probably be said for other games.

And before those memes, there was the mother of all YouTube Poop material itself... One that made millions laugh, made YTP amazing, and is still a living meme to this day. The literal MOTHER of all YouTube Poops: Mama Luigi. YTP's were one of the reasons why YouTube was great, and they were also here back when YouTube was in its prime. I mean, it was back when YouTube videos were funny, unique, and didn't have ads popping up on us every video we click on... it seems like every video I click on now, I get 2 unskippable ads. :/

By the way, who was here during the time when great videos and YTP's were all over YouTube? I remember those days... I miss 2005-2010 YouTube.

 

[Loliko YnT]

Honestly, of all the theories and evidence being thrown around about whether he is or isn't getting in, the most powerful indication to me that he might is the fact that we don't have his costume in ultimate yet. Correct me if I'm wrong, but every major DLC costume from 4 has been implemented into an assist trophy (Isaac and Knuckles ) or an actual character (Krool, Chrom, Isabel and Inkling). Geno is the only ballot voted costume I know of that hasn't received either treatment yet. I will say this though, and mark my words:

If he doesn't make it in via DLC, then it's game over. Don't expect him to ever make it into a future installment.

Why? Because Sakurai talked about the possibility of Geno since Brawl, but what happened? 39, yes 39 characters have been added to the game since then and none of them were Geno. For whatever reason, Nintendo/Sakurai have not deemed him a priority over any of those 39 characters. Now, I'm not comparing the relevance of any of them to Geno, but my point is that if the likes of WFT and Piranha plant could beat him in, then there's obviously more at play here than simply the desires of the fanbase (even though I wish there wasn't). I still hope he gets in, and we have at least SOME clues that he might, but if he doesn't, I won't hold my breath any longer.

I don't really find the "Oh , 39 characters got over him since Brawl" argument fair.

You need to realize that these characters were either first party , or very popular/iconic third party.

Even , let's look at 3rd party real quick:

-Snake : Iconic. Also broke the "no 3rd party" fan-rule. His games weren't much on Nintendo system , but the cinema feel the MGS games had made them iconic , and thus , Solid Snake became as well.

-Sonic : The stinkin' 90's rival of Mario. The iconic blue blurr. He's not always at his best , but damn it would be a crime to say he's not iconic.

-MegaMan : NES Icon and still pretty iconic , even if a bit less than Sonic. Granted , people learned to enjoy his games when he start to not have new games released for a while , but that just show he's a great character if people wanted him back.

-PAC-MAN : Lol it's PAC-MAN , the Arcade legend , I'm not gonna elaborate on him.

-Ryu : Mr.Fighting Video game. Nothing more to add. (Ken was an obvious echo and still as iconic)

-Cloud: Mr.RPG/FF7 Guy. FF7 was such a success that people think Cloud whenever you tell them "RPG" or "Final Fantasy".

-Bayonetta : Alright , she's the tricky one. She's pretty much a Nintendo character now , she needed Smash to survive... Because Bayonetta 2 was great , but also a Wii U exclusive. She also had requests , but not as much as others characters.

-Simon: NES Icon. Or Gaming icon in general. Even if he's just the "Vampire slayer/Guy with a whip" to people who don't play video games , it's enough to show he has let his mark on the gaming world. Richter was Japan's Simon in a way.

Geno can't compare to them. Heck , even Sora couldn't.
Geno is a fan-favorite and a retro character , people simply want him back and think he's a great Mario character.
SMRPG surely introduced RPGs to a lot of 90's Nintendo fans , it sold well and everything , but Geno as a character isn't iconic.

And Geno's owner aren't very generous with the SMRPG IP , so a Bayonetta situation is out of the question.

And nothing is stopping Sakurai from adding first party characters , and almost nothing is stopping Sakurai to adding 2nd party characters like Isaac or the pokemons. If he want the character in , he'll do it.
That's why Wii Fit Trainer and Piranha Plant got in , because Sakurai felt like he could do something unique with them while representing another part of Nintendo's history. They didn't got in over Geno , they have almost no connection to him.

We should also count the fact that he talked about Geno 3 times , and got his likeliness to use 2 times. That's A LOT for what was a one-off character from a 20 year old SNES RPG. It show that Sakurai is aware that we love him and we want him , and if he could add him...
Why wouldn't he ? The main reason he's not in right now is because Square Enix don't see the potential in him. Also... He wasn't going to get in over Cloud first. It was still generous from Square Enix to allow the costume and the 2 SMRPG spirits to be a thing.

You know when I would start to lose hope for Geno in Smash ? That's when we'll get Five Square Enix rep , but still no Geno.
I can understand Sora.
I can understand Dragon Quest.
I can understand Sephiroth.

But if they start to bring us characters like Mog , Tiz , Neku or an Octopath traveler rep , I won't understand. I won't understand why they'll give us these characters that , are still pretty cool , but also not really requested and start to be more niche , while Geno is in front of them , would take almost no effort (HE'S FREE DLC MONEY !) would make fans happy , and would open the possibility for Square Enix to work on A MARIO RPG.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

You know for what it's worth I don't think Hotel Mario is an inherently bad game. Definitely a lot better than the Zelda CDI games. I can completely understand why people hated those. Those games are semi-functional and at times just flat out unfair, on top of those questionable cutscenes.

But I don't know, Hotel Mario is different. I'm not saying it's a perfect game, or even a great one at that, but it works fine and retains that classic Mario feel to it, jumping over enemies and shooting fireballs. I can't speak for everyone, but I actually had a bit of fun running around and closing doors lol. Of course the game isn't perfect and there are some aspects of it that can be annoying, but all games have those types of little nuisances. The clunky CDI controller doesn't help, but it's nothing game-breaking and frustrating like the Zelda games. And I know Hotel Mario also had those cheesy cutscenes, but I grew fond of them actually. Some of them are just so bizarre or bad that they're funny. Me personally, the Zelda cutscenes just felt so off and creepy...

Even Philip's' cancelled Mario game, Super Mario's Wacky Worlds, had a lot of potential to it. Looking back on it now, it's almost like a 16-bit Mario Odyssey in the sense that you travel to different locations around the globe. It looked really cool to me:

I feel like Philip's shouldn't have touched Zelda because they had no idea what they were doing. By the looks of it, it seems Philip's was more accustomed to 2D side-scrollers, so naturally their Mario games would feel more polished than Zelda. I feel like if Philip's had the opportunity to keep working on Mario games, they'd have potential to make something great. Super Mario's Wacky Worlds feels like it could have been that game, but I guess we'll never know now.

Like it was said elsewhere before, Hotel Mario would have fared better if it came out during the older days of the arcade era, around the NES days. Functional, but a bit antiquated. Also, Mario/Luigi/Bowser's voice actor DID go on to have a role in Ratchet & Clank, so something good came out of that.

It still beats Mario Is Missing.

The CDi Mario and Zelda games were great youtube poop/meme material.

Sadly, that's more than can probably be said for other games.

When Devil's Third has flopped so hard that its planned spirit data was taken out, you know it won't be remembered even ironically.

 

[Teeb147]

And so Jane is revealed

 

[The Anigriffin]

And so Jane is revealed

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View attachment 200375

GIVE ME ALL OF MY YES.

 

[Deleted member]

And so Jane is revealed

View attachment 200376
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I didn't realize this girl had a ponytail

 

[SkeffVEVO]

I don't think the girl they revealed for Persona 5 The Royal is Female Joker per se. I think she is either this game's Marie or she has a side story, similar to Persona 3's The Answer, that lets you play as her. In any case this girl is probably Jane.

 

[EarlTamm]

I don't think the girl they revealed for Persona 5 The Royal is Female Joker per se. I think she is either this game's Marie or she has a side story, similar to Persona 3's The Answer, that lets you play as her. In any case this girl is probably Jane.

If she is an alt though, that does imply that she is near identical to Joker in a number of ways. At the bare minimum she would have to have the same knife fighting style. That is what makes me unsure of her being a Marie and more so a playable character that could be a version or replacement of Joker.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Unrelated, but TerminalMontage 's new thingy is out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5KIW8kZnFAg

 

[Tree Gelbman]

What relevance does the Jane/Joker thing have to Geno? Just wondering if there's a reason you guys are talking about it? Or just something to talk about it?

 

[Ovaltine]

Unrelated, but TerminalMontage 's new thingy is out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5KIW8kZnFAg

Geez, Jeremy, I had a really hard time finding Geno in this one, but I finally did. Have fun with this one, guys.

What relevance does the Jane/Joker thing have to Geno? Just wondering if there's a reason you guys are talking about it? Or just something to talk about it?

I think people are just bored out of their minds at this point. Lots of topics are bringing it up despite it not being relevant. It's just very stagnant right now, alas.

You know what you can do that is on-topic, though? Go play 'Find the Geno'!

 

[Loliko YnT]

Alright , this may sound dumb buuuut...

Did anyone ever made a Mallow moveset for Smash?

 

[Teeb147]

Alright , this may sound dumb buuuut...

Did anyone ever made a Mallow moveset for Smash?

There's been a few floating around. Here's one.

and you might have luck in the support thread.

 

[Deleted member]

Smash Ultimate's early competitive scene

 

[Loliko YnT]

There's been a few floating around. Here's one.

and you might have luck in the support thread.

Oh I see ! Thanks for sharing it to me.

It's nice to see how a weather based character could work. It's a bit of a shame that this moveset limit itself to the special moves and the final smash.

I could easily see his F-smash using cymbals , if he hit you with them , it won't launch you , but you will be stunned , and Mallow could follow up with an attack ! Anf if you do the timed hit correctly , the stun duration will last longer.

Using frogie stick in some of his attacks could be interesting... Every character who use a weapon use them for a majority of their moveset , but I could see Mallow using it for his pummel and Forward tilt as a poke. Or of course , to use his magic.

There's also his stretchy arms , wich could be a similar concept to Piranha Plant down-b , a lot of reach , but they would need to be charged and still are an hurtbox.

And that's a bit sad to see that the Mallow support thread only has 5 posts... The nimbus prince deserve more love , he's a good fluffy boy.

 

[Sovereign Trinity]

So, I'm going to come out and say it: I don't get the depression around Geno's chances. Some of you guys here bob up and down on the emotional roller-coaster, but I'm just coasting down the lazy river ride of 'Geno's chances have never been better, and if he still somehow doesn't happen, then we ask question later.'

Remember, we were pretty much casting our own illusion for his inclusion in the base roster: he's owned by Square and Square doesn't just give their character for the minimum amount of cashola, but for the closest to maximum amount they can get. Why in the hell would Square take a lump-sum for a character to be in the base roster when they could get years of profit from DLC like they did with Cloud? Geno would never be base simply due to the company that owns him.

With all the recent SMRPG references, Sakurai acknowledging the popularity of the character, the lack of unique gun-wielding character (have you noticed no one really shoots a beam? Samus/D.Samus/Gunner shoot energy sphere, Furry Space Bandits shoot small lasers as well as Naked Samus, Megaman fires a combo of both the previous, Snake and Bayo used realistic weapons and Inkling has a glorified Super Soaker. Only beams I can think of are Final Smashes, but not base gameplay. Boy, Geno really does offer a lot to the table, doesn't he?), the recent statements of Square and how buddy-buddy they are with Nintendo again...and MANY more positives, Geno really has better chances than he ever has.

Sorry I'm late on this, but thanks for typing and making this. It's okay to keep your head up and your expectations high or low, but all that matters is that this is just for fun and a game. Yes, it's stressful, but that's because we make it stressful; I focus on doing other things to keep myself away from being stressed about this. Even if Geno doesn't make it in Smash, there's no doubt that he's close to making it in a new game this year or in the next decade, and it's all thanks to the support we've been giving for him for the past 11-14 years. It's all been a wonderful and fun journey.

So it's okay to keep your expectations high, and it's not like you're losing someone close to you; those hurt much more than being disappointed in something like a video game. Coming from a person under depression, we must think positive and look at the bright side for Geno, not just the cons.

And so Jane is revealed

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Oh my, she looks like someone I used to know.

 

[Deleted member]

Ovaltine I found him in like 3 seconds

 

[Teeb147]

Ovaltine I found him in like 3 seconds

you could put that in spoiler tags in case some people wanna play the 'finding' game
i dunno if it was that much of one in the first place, but, ya know

 

[Deleted member]

you could put that in spoiler tags in case some people wanna play the 'finding' game
i dunno if it was that much of one in the first place, but, ya know

Just saving people the time

 

[Deleted member]

What relevance does the Jane/Joker thing have to Geno? Just wondering if there's a reason you guys are talking about it? Or just something to talk about it?

Mainly 'cause it's the news that could potentially relate to Smash, and we don't have much of that right now lol.

And yeah we get off topic a lot

 

[Teeb147]

Oh I see ! Thanks for sharing it to me.

It's nice to see how a weather based character could work. It's a bit of a shame that this moveset limit itself to the special moves and the final smash.

I could easily see his F-smash using cymbals , if he hit you with them , it won't launch you , but you will be stunned , and Mallow could follow up with an attack ! Anf if you do the timed hit correctly , the stun duration will last longer.

Using frogie stick in some of his attacks could be interesting... Every character who use a weapon use them for a majority of their moveset , but I could see Mallow using it for his pummel and Forward tilt as a poke. Or of course , to use his magic.

There's also his stretchy arms , wich could be a similar concept to Piranha Plant down-b , a lot of reach , but they would need to be charged and still are an hurtbox.

And that's a bit sad to see that the Mallow support thread only has 5 posts... The nimbus prince deserve more love , he's a good fluffy boy.

I definitely always liked the idea of having the cymbals as a smash attack, there's just something satisfying about them. And imagining being able to do a two parter to it could be cool too. (like timed hits)

Also, the thread with 5 posts was just a random one. the support thread has 2 pages of posts... which isnt all that much more, but i think most people are focused on geno first. Like, I made a support page for tifa because cloud was revealed. else id' been a real long shot Can still be fun tho.

 

[Sovereign Trinity]

Oh I see ! Thanks for sharing it to me.

It's nice to see how a weather based character could work. It's a bit of a shame that this moveset limit itself to the special moves and the final smash.

I could easily see his F-smash using cymbals , if he hit you with them , it won't launch you , but you will be stunned , and Mallow could follow up with an attack ! Anf if you do the timed hit correctly , the stun duration will last longer.

Using frogie stick in some of his attacks could be interesting... Every character who use a weapon use them for a majority of their moveset , but I could see Mallow using it for his pummel and Forward tilt as a poke. Or of course , to use his magic.

There's also his stretchy arms , wich could be a similar concept to Piranha Plant down-b , a lot of reach , but they would need to be charged and still are an hurtbox.

And that's a bit sad to see that the Mallow support thread only has 5 posts... The nimbus prince deserve more love , he's a good fluffy boy.

I made a drawing a few months ago where I drew Geno and Mallow together; they're supposed to be new designs for them in the modern gaming era, and I made it where one of his cymbals is strapped/held in his left hand, like a shield, and his froggie stick is in his in his right hand, as if he's wielding it like a sword. In other words, I gave him the Link treatment.

 

[Teeb147]

Loliko YnT I just realized I somehow posted the same link twice. This is the Mallow support thread:
https://smashboards.com/threads/mallow-frog-prince-from-the-beyond-the-clouds.456009/

my bad

 

[Loliko YnT]

I definitely always liked the idea of having the cymbals as a smash attack, there's just something satisfying about them. And imagining being able to do a two parter to it could be cool too. (like timed hits)

Also, the thread with 5 posts was just a random one. the support thread has 2 pages of posts... which isnt all that much more, but i think most people are focused on geno first. Like, I made a support page for tifa because cloud was revealed. else id' been a real long shot Can still be fun tho.

Yeah , their sound effect is satisfying. That's a weapon I always loved using with Mallow.

Oh , this isn't much lol
It's always fun to talk about the underdog or the secondary characters , we don't often talk about their potential. I legit thought about making a Zizou Olympia or one about the Mario and Luigi antagonists , but I doubt most people would be interested.

 

[GreyJinjo]

I miss 2005-2010 YouTube.

literally everyone does. the culture and standards of the internet during those times was the most free and creative. now it's all gone thanks to complicated and unfortunate cultural shifts and events.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

And before those memes, there was the mother of all YouTube Poop material itself... One that made millions laugh, made YTP amazing, and is still a living meme to this day. The literal MOTHER of all YouTube Poops: Mama Luigi. YTP's were one of the reasons why YouTube was great, and they were also here back when YouTube was in its prime. I mean, it was back when YouTube videos were funny, unique, and didn't have ads popping up on us every video we click on... it seems like every video I click on now, I get 2 unskippable ads. :/

By the way, who was here during the time when great videos and YTP's were all over YouTube? I remember those days... I miss 2005-2010 YouTube.

Been around since the start, really.

On the bright side, we did get the Reanimated movement these days.

 

[Ovaltine]

literally everyone does. the culture and standards of the internet during those times was the most free and creative. now it's all gone thanks to complicated and unfortunate cultural shifts and events.

You. Yes, you, of a species long killed by a large mech with a drill. I like your signature a lot. That is all.

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Ovaltine I found him in like 3 seconds

"First of all, what the frick am I doing here?

Second of all, what the frick am I doing here?"

Yes, Geno uses cursing substitutes because he has an Image To Uphold™. Wait 'til you see the hilarity when he accidentally lets that facade slip.

 

[Deleted member]

Man, it's sooooo hard leaving your relatives after having such a good time with them

Anyways, I'll try to be more active here lol

 

[Sovereign Trinity]

You. Yes, you, of a species long killed by a large mech with a drill. I like your signature a lot. That is all.


"First of all, what the frick am I doing here?

Second of all, what the frick am I doing here?"

Yes, Geno uses cursing substitutes because he has an Image To Uphold™. Wait 'til you see the hilarity when he accidentally lets that facade slip.

Fox: Open the wings. Check your G-Diffuser system!
Falco: Falco here, I'm fine.
Peppy: This is Peppy, all systems go!
Slippy: Slippy here, I'm ok.
Geno: ♡♪!? here, ready to get this show on the road!
Fox: Hey, who the hell are you?!
Geno: I'm the new guy.
Fox: Oh.

literally everyone does. the culture and standards of the internet during those times was the most free and creative. now it's all gone thanks to complicated and unfortunate cultural shifts and events.

I enjoy watching YouTube videos from the old days because they're ad-free and classics. Videos that always involved Nintendo, always watched them.

 

[valkiriforce]

By the way, who was here during the time when great videos and YTP's were all over YouTube? I remember those days... I miss 2005-2010 YouTube.

Yes, I definitely remember; I started watching and creating my own YTPs from 2007 onward. I still like to keep that oldschool flame alive with the occasional YTP whenever I feel like making one.

On the other hand there's always a site like VidLii, even if it's kind of a cheesy alternative.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

literally everyone does. the culture and standards of the internet during those times was the most free and creative. now it's all gone thanks to complicated and unfortunate cultural shifts and events.

Now, while I do agree there was a freshness and newness to everything internet related during that time period, including a wonderful amount of creativity...

Let’s not pretend like those weren’t also the prime days for a lot of the toxic internet culture that we’re still left with today. And the whole “**** your mom” commentary of online gamers was born of that era too.

YouTube’s gotten a lot worse and there are a lot of bigger sites that often dominate things, but we’ve also seen new things and avenues develop for content creators. I can’t say I have a ton of nostalgia for that era as I seriously reflect on it.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

In any case, every era has its struggles.

Besides, without those years of trying out video editing, we wouldn't have Steamed Hams vids.

 

[SKX31]

Spoiler: Spoilered the qoute so it wouldn't take up tons of space

As for your comments on the industry, your completely spot on. We're certainly letting companies get away with too much and accepting more mediocre products along the way. I don't want to knock people's sense of fun anymore than the next person, but we're objectively getting broken, mangled products on launch that developers use post-launch patches to either complete or fix. Developers are knowingly selling us broken or incomplete products, while also forcing predatory microtransactions into every aspect of gaming. Those practices need to be actively recognized and dealt with. Sonic 06 definitely falls into that category of broken game willingly sold to consumers.

But even beyond that, the gaming community at a large has pushed and prioritized so many of the wrong elements of games that I think we're really seeing an active decline. We've normalized the most beautiful AAA games that cost far too much to create and often don't contain any innovation or even exciting variation to what has come before. And so few companies can even produce on that level or even on half that level, so we're seeing a pretty noticeable shortage in meaningful releases or games that challenge the status quo by taking risks. Risk has become an exclusively negative word for the industry I feel, and that's really a shame. It's only going to get worse from here if we don't start voting with our wallets more selectively...

Fully agree - that said, I'd pin a lot of the blame not just to the shift to an online-focused environment (Not just F2P games both on PCs / consoles, but also on mobiles) nor just on hardcore fans pushing the wrong buttons; but this is also on an environment where the Average Joes / Janes do not care about the flaws in the games unless it's really (Star Wars Battlefront II level) obvious. I mean, your Average Joe / Jane that plays Smash, Madden / FIFA, Fortnite, whatever mobile game like Candy Crush are not going to really notice stuff like scripting enough to stop playing / spending. As long as the games are functional enough. Or hell, even thinking about the problems in some cases. Play a round, maybe get irritated at a bug, but forget about said bug 5 minutes later when doing some other chore or checking on social media or whatever. The video game industry is vast nowadays. And it's not just 150-ish million consoles (PS4 + Xbone + Switch) sold worldwide, since that figure does not include PC nor mobile.

This general environment being fast-paced has that negative side effect. And I'm someone who has a very positive view on tech (and information tech) despite its many - many - flaws.

Spoiler: Same here, TheBeastHimself

You know for what it's worth I don't think Hotel Mario is an inherently bad game. Definitely a lot better than the Zelda CDI games. I can completely understand why people hated those. Those games are semi-functional and at times just flat out unfair, on top of those questionable cutscenes.

But I don't know, Hotel Mario is different. I'm not saying it's a perfect game, or even a great one at that, but it works fine and retains that classic Mario feel to it, jumping over enemies and shooting fireballs. I can't speak for everyone, but I actually had a bit of fun running around and closing doors lol. Of course the game isn't perfect and there are some aspects of it that can be annoying, but all games have those types of little nuisances. The clunky CDI controller doesn't help, but it's nothing game-breaking and frustrating like the Zelda games. And I know Hotel Mario also had those cheesy cutscenes, but I grew fond of them actually. Some of them are just so bizarre or bad that they're funny. Me personally, the Zelda cutscenes just felt so off and creepy...

Even Philip's' cancelled Mario game, Super Mario's Wacky Worlds, had a lot of potential to it. Looking back on it now, it's almost like a 16-bit Mario Odyssey in the sense that you travel to different locations around the globe. It looked really cool to me:

I feel like Philip's shouldn't have touched Zelda because they had no idea what they were doing. By the looks of it, it seems Philip's was more accustomed to 2D side-scrollers, so naturally their Mario games would feel more polished than Zelda. I feel like if Philip's had the opportunity to keep working on Mario games, they'd have potential to make something great. Super Mario's Wacky Worlds feels like it could have been that game, but I guess we'll never know now.

Really, the CD-i's history is such a multilayered trainwreck that it's almost impossible to look away from it. If I had to guess, it's Philips overreaching creating a multimedia machine not really fit for video games (those didn't become practical until the PS2 / PS3 and 360), then digging in because admitting defeat would be catastrophic. Hell, the late Dale DeSharone (producer and head honcho of Faces of Evil and Wand of Gamelon) told his interviewer that Philips was hostile to the thought of video games on the CD-i... until Philips found out they were the best sellers. On their machine with a clunky start.

Thus, panic mode.

Could DeSharone and his team have done Zelda justice? I'm going to disagree with you and say yes. We know that the budget was $1.2 million split on two games and rushed out in a year according to Dale. And Dale told the interviewer that the Russian animators were hired via a friend of his - the animators themselves were effectively crammed into an apartment too (even if they were far from the best). It's not just a question of lifting those restrictions though. And it's not just about fixing the obvious stuff (No invincibility frames for you, few and laggy offensive options, confusing level design - stuff where the dev team obviously failed etc.).

Really, both Philips and Dale's team needed to go all out. Easy to say with hindsight, but even then Mario and Zelda were Nintendo's biggest names. Getting those licenses in the first place was really big, even if it was via a pull out on Nintendo's end. Of course, Philips undermined the CD-i beforehand when they didn't promote games as part of its multimedia nexus. But even after the weird launch, games like Burn Cycle did prove there was something in the CD-i, mess as it was. So fixing the obvious and adding new options (such as new attacks / magic options, multiple and clearer paths in levels etc.) could've done a lot. Wouldn't neccessarily made the CD-i into an instant winner, but salvaged something at least.

That does bring an interesting question. Could SMRPG and the CD-i games be seen as essentially (in)direct contrasts to each other? Same era, Nintendo striking a deal with third party and the two parting ways due to differences, as well as mixing new characters with established ones. On a second thought, I doubt most people would compare Morshu with Geno.

Which leads me to my opinions on Geno. Not sure, only heard of him in this context. I'm not exactly an RPG guy either, but I do think that his chances of a comeback is decent. I'm not just talking Smash (that I'm unsure off. I think his chances are more likely in a future base game, but I won't count out a possible DLC spot) - but a SMRPG remake doesn't seem impossible. Nor does the SMRPG cast being perhaps used in future Nintendo / Square spinoffs. Yeah, I know of Square's current rep as stingy (Cloud main here). But maybe Nintendo and S-E's talks went on for so long that any further S-E content would have to be pushed to this DLC cycle? Not likely in my eyes, but it's not impossible.

 

[Ovaltine]

Which leads me to my opinions on Geno. Not sure, only heard of him in this context. I'm not exactly an RPG guy either, but I do think that his chances of a comeback is decent. I'm not just talking Smash (that I'm unsure off. I think his chances are more likely in a future base game, but I won't count out a possible DLC spot) - but a SMRPG remake doesn't seem impossible. Nor does the SMRPG cast being perhaps used in future Nintendo / Square spinoffs. Yeah, I know of Square's current rep as stingy (Cloud main here). But maybe Nintendo and S-E's talks went on for so long that any further S-E content would have to be pushed to this DLC cycle? Not likely in my eyes, but it's not impossible.

Hey, it's really neat to see an 'outsider' and their views on the character! (Using outsider for a lack of better word, ha...) That especially holds true given you aren't unfamiliar with Square's, well... practices. That being said, I pretty much agree with you, even though I'm more on the pessimistic side than you seem to be. At least Nintendo and Square seem to be on much better footing now, which does leave a glimmer of hope for the future!