Damage Values
Default Ganon
Jab: 7
Ftilt: 13
Dtilt: 12
Utilt: 8, 22
Fsmash: 22-30
Dsmash: 8-10, 12-16
Usmash: 22-30, 19-?
DashA: 15
Nair: 12, 7
Fair: 17
Dair: 22
Bair: 16
Uair: 6-12
B: 34
SideB: 13
DownB: 15
UpB: ?
Sword Ganon
Jab: 7
Ftilt: 12
Dtilt: 12
Utilt: 14
Fsmash: 10-13, 9-12
Dsmash: 12-16, 9-12
Usmash: 15-20
DashA: 15
Nair: 10-12
Fair: 11-13
Dair: 11-13
Bair: 11-13
Uair: 11-13
B: 34
SideB: 13
DownB: 13-18
UpB: 13-15
Bugs/Notes:
-UpB: Grab has been removed from the default moveset as well as the sword moveset. Sometimes Ganon will grab onto his opponent on his way down, that's weird.
-Dash Attack is the same, you probably know this.
-Dash dancing is broken.
-Some aerials can't be L-canceled.
Recommendations/Comments:
Ground Attacks
Jab: I like this move a lot. It's great to close openings. Really nice as it is.
Tilts: If it poses a problem adding more animations in for angled Ftilts, then I'd say these are 3 acceptable tilts. Utilt is a cool follow up to a lot of things and it pokes platforms. Dtilt has the IASA. Ftilt got da range. I dig it. I like them all as they are.
Fsmash & Dsmash: Good. Only thing I might do is decrease the number of freeze frames on the Fsmash by a bit.
Usmash: I don't like how it moves him forward and the coverage pretty much makes it worthless. Sounds good to me, his smashes aren't supposed to actually be good. I think just get rid of the movement and just have him do this move in place and it's good.
Dash Attack: I think you should make this a little like Link's, except instead of having an upward trajectory, it has a downward trajectory which must be teched. I think it'd be better to give him a unique dash attack than his current DownB, btw.
Aerials
Default Ganon's aerials can all be full-hop wavelanded, save for the Nair. Sword Ganon's aerials can all be FHWL'd, save for the Bair. I'm not sure Bair is the aerial that shouldn't be able to be FHWL'd because I think it's his weakest sword aerial and its utility is already fairly narrow. If it could be FHWL'd, at least he could cover platform options with it and WL away. If anything, I think his Uair should have a longer cooldown because of how much area the thing covers and how well it kills. Plus, he can do the sword Uair a little too freely offstage IMO.
Nair: Not sure how I feel about this Nair. Seems cool but I'm not sure what exactly to do with its trajectory. It seems like it might be okay for starting tech chases and gimping, but it's hard to say. Haven't had a human to test against and I think this is one of those moves where you kind of need to test its uses against a real player.
Fair: Fair is really nice. A disjointed version of his classic Fair, but has less coverage above and below him and can reach a bit further ahead of him. It has a similar use and I think it was wise to keep his Fairs comparable because his Fair is kind of a core component of his moveset.
Bair: I kind of like this Bair but I also thing the sword path is awkward. The hitbox in the front on startup is cute, but I have a suggestion for a new one. Basically, it would have very similar frame data to the original Bair: comes out somewhat slow and has a moderately brief cooldown so he can FHWL it. But instead of the backhand swing, he just stabs his sword outward behind him like his sword Ftilt. Think kind of like Wario's Bair, but instead of a fist, you've got Ganon's sword out there. It gives him a spacing tool from behind, something he never had before that a sword logically would endow.
Uair: Animation is good, needs hitboxes to match it and those hitboxes need their trajectories and knockback adjusted.
An idea which he probably doesn't need on the startup: The move starts out covering his back, at least the animation does, but the hitboxes aren't there. You may want them there, but they should be weaker and with an upward trajectory, slightly angled away from Ganon so that it can be DI'd away from him. I wouldn't recommend implementing this, but I wanted to mention it specifically because I think it's easy to see this possibility and I think it's a bad idea for balance purposes. His character archetype doesn't contain many moves which have multiple different applications at each point during the move. His classic Uair is the best example of such a move. It comes out quick in front, so it can be used to stuff. It covers above him very well so it can be used to cover platforms, anti-air and just cover above him in general. Then the backend of it can be used supremely for edgeguarding not only because of its trajectory but because this point of the move is near the end and it has little cooldown so he can act sooner after connecting with the backside in general, and he can also space with the tail on stage and set up tech chases.
This property of having multiple applications in a move means the move has strong utility. Utility = options. This Uair should be comparable in utility, but inherently different. Something that Ganon's character archetype does not typically employ is strong utility. His options are very linear but they're very solid. His grab game works on most of the cast and it's very consistent. His moveset should follow a similar pattern.
Middle: The majority of the swipe is already good. I like where you have the hitboxes now, I like the sweetspots too, as well as the freeze frames. Only thing I would change is to have the knockback angles on the hitboxes follow the angle of the sword during each frame, and have them point perpendicular to the sword in the direction the sword is traveling. So, during this middle section, most of the time the move will send the opponent forward. It seems like this is the way it pretty much the way it currently works but it's hard to tell.
End: The move hits far in front of Ganon as well, this is great. The only thing that should be changed here is that it should be weaker at the end, but the knockback should be angled downward and away from Ganon, much like the end of his default Uair.
I envision this new Uair to perform something like a mirrored version of Ganon's default Uair, kind of like Pikachu's Uair but way bigger and slower. It should be able to be used OOS similarly, but not nearly as effectively as a defensive option like Pika's can be used for.
I spoke of it earlier, but I'll address it again here, I think the Uair should have a longer cooldown. I'd say increase it by around 8 frames for starters and go from there, it may need to be more.Nevermind, don't do this. I like the outward trajectory more, it fits with the rest of the sword mechanics for Ganon.
Lastly, I think this move is a little too easy to sweetspot. Decrease the size of the sweetspot hitboxes by juuuust a tad, move them back outward toward the tip, and leave the sourspots as they are (I think). Or whatever you think you need to do to make it a liiiiittle less free to sweetspot. We may also want the player to be able to use the sourspots for juggles, so making them a little more accessible can be a good thing.
Dair: Dair is super cool. I love FHWL Dairs. Combined with Fair, Ganon can still put up a defensive wall like he would with his default Fair in Melee. What's different about this is two things:
1. Ganon's "wall" is now disjointed, so it's safer and trades less.
2. His wall must be put up with two moves, rather than one like before, making the Ganon player's reaction time more important than before because he must choose between the two. Dair leaves Ganon's front wide open and the Fair leaves his underside open.
Specials
B: I guess this works.
SideB: It's the same, good.
DownB: Well then... after playing against a human opponent for about an hour, I don't like this move all that much. I think he should just keep the Wizard's Foot and use this animation for a unique Dash Attack. I found myself really wanting to punish at a distance with Wizard's Foot, and while at times this charge attack can accomplish that just fine because of the range of the swing and even cover more options, I just think it's unwarranted and feels very out of place.
UpB: This is great, the animation is perfect. The only thing you should do is match the hitboxes to the animation, especially on the swipe as he's ascending.
