Q&A Game Play Advice and General Discussion

[Pazx]

@ iDaire

• How do I play against people that spam fast moves like PK Fire?
• How do I play against people that spam dodge around the board?
• How do I move quicker in general? (My left hand moves and reacts slower than my right)
• How do I input tilts easier, grounded and aerial? (I end up putting in respective smashes rather than tilts.)
• How do I break out of habitual side dodging? (Moving left or right while blocking)
• In which situations is it better to block and sidestep (Block + DStick Down) rather than roll?
• What is vectoring? Is it directional influence?
• How does one read people and predict how they move?
• How do professionals remember what moves and options they have mid-game?
• How do I gimp and tech properly?

PK Fire is not a quick move, if you shield it or jump over it you WILL have time to hit Ness before he can do anything. If you do get caught in it, wiggle your control stick away to try and get out. Since you play Marth, if Ness runs in to hit you while you're trapped in PKF, spam your up special (Dolphin Slash) for a guaranteed escape.

If people are spamming rolls (shield + either side, "side dodges") try to be roughly 1 roll length away from them and when you see them roll you can downsmash (or some other punish) them. Rolls (and dodges) are not invincible the entire time, your opponent is vulnerable at the end and the start. If your opponent is air dodging you can wait for them to do so and then you can hit them. If they air dodge into the ground, they are unable to act for a little while and you can punish them.

Make sure your hands aren't cold, practice short hopping and dash dancing, dashing into shield, etc. Can't help you much here.

To input tilts simply don't move the control stick all the way to the side. To input a forward tilt, just move the control stick forward enough so that you'd walk but not dash. You can also switch the C stick (right control stick) to "Attack" rather than "Smash" and it will input tilts. Also, a back air is a back air regardless of whether you input it as a smash attack or a tilt, only Robin's aerials have differences.

Stop rolling. It is bad. Play Samus and you will understand. It is a habitual thing though, so I can't really give you any techniques to break it.

In almost every situation it is better to shield or to side step than to roll. You should make an effort to avoid rolling in from the ledge or towards center stage when you're being pressured as that's the easiest roll to punish.

Vectoring is effectively Directional Influence. If you're hit to the right, hold left/up/both.

To read people you can just look for patterns in their play. Maybe they always air dodge after being hit, maybe they always roll towards center stage when their back is to the ledge. Both of these actions are very punishable. You can also attempt to bait people, eg an empty (no move) short hop might force a shield or a roll, both of which you can punish.

Pros play the game a lot. They play their character a lot. You can do that too. They probably also know frame data (eg which move is quickest in X situation) which can be important but not essential. Work out what everything does yourself, then work out which moves are best used in which situation.

To tech, press shield just before you hit a wall or the ground when you're in a tumble animation or in hitstun (basically after you get hit). You can also tech-roll to either side by pressing shield and a direction. To gimp, try and hit people after they use their second jump and if they have a predictable recovery you can throw out a (preferably disjointed) hitbox (with Marth/Link/etc) to intercept them, rinse and repeat.

 

[HeroMystic]

I have a question. who is a character that will require fundamentals to win with?

While this applies to everyone, fundamentalist characters mainly go to Mario, Falco, Peach, and Fox, with bigger emphasis on the first two.

 

[Grass]

Whenever I'm playing I feel like I'm slow to start combos and react to things happening. I always end up becoming predictable and getting hit pretty hard by my opponent. How can I improve my reaction time to help with my combos and general game play?

A good way to improve reaction time, and I've told another person to do this as well, is to simply go into training with a character like Marth (even if you don't main him) and just keep trying to throw down and regrab them before they hit the ground. The reason for doing this is to train how fast your brain is able to react to something as simple as regrabbing your opponent or reacting to a dash attack or doing a dash attack. Everything comes down to reaction time in a fighting game. So that's all I have to say about that.

What are the most common mistakes made by beginners at tournaments

They get scared or intimated by the competition. As a new player coming into the scene, it is important to make a good impression with the rest of the players there. A lot of new players are also worried they might not do as well as everyone else. However, this is to be expected esp. if this is your first time there. Just keep trying and attending tournaments.

iDaire[/URL]]

• How do I play against people that spam fast moves like PK Fire?
• How do I play against people that spam dodge around the board?
• How do I move quicker in general? (My left hand moves and reacts slower than my right)
• How do I input tilts easier, grounded and aerial? (I end up putting in respective smashes rather than tilts.)
• How do I break out of habitual side dodging? (Moving left or right while blocking)
• In which situations is it better to block and sidestep (Block + DStick Down) rather than roll?
• What is vectoring? Is it directional influence?
• How does one read people and predict how they move?
• How do professionals remember what moves and options they have mid-game?
• How do I gimp and tech properly?

okay @ iDaire , let's start with your list of questions.

First off, PK fire has a lot of beginning and end lag, which you can use to your advantage, if you feel your opponent has been "spamming" PK fire, take to the air and go for aerials. Fox/Falco are a much lower threat as their blasters don't deal a lot of damage and you can really just get in while they spam blaster.

How do I play against people that spam dodge around the board?

I assume you mean roll spam. Well this is easy, just read them. As soon as they roll behind you or something, just turn around and grab them. If they continue, repeat the process.

How do I move quicker in general? (My left hand moves and reacts slower than my right)

all I can say is train your fingers. There really isn't any movement "tips" to give, to be honest.

How do I input tilts easier, grounded and aerial? (I end up putting in respective smashes rather than tilts.)

Hold a direction first and then press the A button.

How do I break out of habitual side dodging? (Moving left or right while blocking)

Easy way: set your shoulder buttons to attack or something else that's not shield. If you start blocking you will get into that habit, and this is for a lot of people, not just yourself.

Hard way: watch your replays and keep tabs on yourself. Rolling generally signifies the player is scared or worried about certain situations. Don't be afraid and go in. Only use the shield to block. Practice practice practice.

In which situations is it better to block and sidestep (Block + DStick Down) rather than roll?

Spot dodging is usually used again someone who seems to be grab happy, though spacing works better tbh. And blocking is usually good if you think your opponent is going to either challenge your dash (not dash attack) or they're applying a lot of pressure on you.

What is vectoring? Is it directional influence?

Simple answer: No.

Long Answer: People need to stop asking about vectoring as it's no longer an thing and has been patched over. DI is just moving your control stick in the direction you want your character to go after say being grabbed.

How does one read people and predict how they move?

Look for patterns in your opponent's movement and attacks.

How do professionals remember what moves and options they have mid-game?

This is related to reading, see above.

How do I gimp and tech properly?

Gimping and teching are 2 different things. Gimping usually involves messing with your opponent's recovery and I can't go into detail as it depends on the character.

Teching is easy, just press shield before you hit the ground or ceiling or wall.

 

[iDaire]

Not to bombard anyone with questions:

• How do I play against Little Mac (In general)? This guy has to be one of the fastest characters ever existing in a fighting game. That, or it was the one player.
• How do I play against Greninja (With Link and Marth)? I can't try much aerials with Marth without risk of getting hit by a UpSmash. Never played Greninja with Link, but seeing as how I got combo'd with Marth, I'm starting to question whether or not I can take Greninja with Link.
• Should I be using the Wii U Gamepad? I feel pretty comfortable with it. Alternatively, I can use a WiiMote or buy a Gamecube Controller (+ Adapter)

If there was an active chatroom I could join, that would be pretty nice.

 

[Madek]

Ok friends I'll keep this simple. I've noticed all the best players are able to dash and instantly pull up a shield. Yet when I try, no matter the character, I can't shield until the dash animation has completely stopped.

So how do you pros do it? As you know if you input the shield early in a dash you roll. It's frustrating to me because I see so many opportunities to us this in battle but can never execute it. Your input can be my lifesaver, thank you friends.

 

[Skattpilgrim]

Are you asking whether or not you can shield to cancel a dash during the initial dash animation or while dashing how do you stop and put up a shield with less lag?

 

[Madek]

Are you asking whether or not you can shield to cancel a dash during the initial dash animation or while dashing how do you stop and put up a shield with less lag?

More of a dash cancel, because I have seen great players dash into a projectile and shield in just a fraction of the time it takes me to do it.

 

[Krackatoa]

More of a dash cancel, because I have seen great players dash into a projectile and shield in just a fraction of the time it takes me to do it.

Don't release forward before shielding. The runstop animation isn't cancelable into anything, but dash is shield-cancelable.

 

[PHYTO-1]

press shield while still holding the analog stick.

not press shield after letting go of the analog stick

 

[KittyKyat]

Not to bombard anyone with questions:

• How do I play against Little Mac (In general)? This guy has to be one of the fastest characters ever existing in a fighting game. That, or it was the one player.
• How do I play against Greninja (With Link and Marth)? I can't try much aerials with Marth without risk of getting hit by a UpSmash. Never played Greninja with Link, but seeing as how I got combo'd with Marth, I'm starting to question whether or not I can take Greninja with Link.
• Should I be using the Wii U Gamepad? I feel pretty comfortable with it. Alternatively, I can use a WiiMote or buy a Gamecube Controller (+ Adapter)

If there was an active chatroom I could join, that would be pretty nice.

I don't play against enough Greninja's, but I can tell you about the other two.
Vs Little Mac, play passively. Zone him with the tip your blade (Marth) or your projectiles (Link) and if he goes in for a dash attack, grab and throw him off the ledge, and go for an aerial. It will generally end his stock, as his recovery is very poor.
Use whatever control option you wish though.
Oh and if you want an active chatroom, there probably is a Skype group for your respective character in their character boards.

 

[DrizzyDrew]

When you are hit to the right side of the screen, you should hit your stick to the top left most of the screen. Opposite goes for getting hit to the left, tilting the stick to the top right most of the screen.

When you are hit up ward, you tilt the stick to the right or left.

This is the best way to DI?

 

[Vipermoon]

Your DI input should be perpendicular (90 degrees) to the direction the attack naturally sends you. This is for survival DI. Go perpendicular in the opposite direction to DI furthest away.

 

[DavemanCozy]

Mixing up DI is a thing as well, and varies between levels of play too. At certain low-percents (character dependent), it's impossible to escape the follow up from a specific move, but you can try to tweak your DI to have them miss.

For example, a low-level Ness players will always go for the F-air follow up after D-throw at low %. If you DI in, they'll miss the F-air follow up. A higher level player won't fall for this though, and you'll be getting hit by U-air if you DI in.

 

[Spirst]

@ DrizzyDrew I have merged your thread with the gameplay advice/general discussion thread where it is better suited.

 

[Grass]

Not to bombard anyone with questions:

• How do I play against Little Mac (In general)? This guy has to be one of the fastest characters ever existing in a fighting game. That, or it was the one player.
• How do I play against Greninja (With Link and Marth)? I can't try much aerials with Marth without risk of getting hit by a UpSmash. Never played Greninja with Link, but seeing as how I got combo'd with Marth, I'm starting to question whether or not I can take Greninja with Link.
• Should I be using the Wii U Gamepad? I feel pretty comfortable with it. Alternatively, I can use a WiiMote or buy a Gamecube Controller (+ Adapter)

If there was an active chatroom I could join, that would be pretty nice.

I actually do have an active chatroom you could join, but it's only really active on the weekends when I hold tourneys and such. You're still welcome to join.

How do I play against Little Mac (In general)? This guy has to be one of the fastest characters ever existing in a fighting game. That, or it was the one player.

Mac is actually one of the most easily gimped characters in this game. I should know, I play him. It might be just that one player who made all the right reads, or it may be your own actions/inactions that lead to your defeat. The easiest way to beat him is to get him off stage and bait the counter.

How do I play against Greninja (With Link and Marth)? I can't try much aerials with Marth without risk of getting hit by a UpSmash. Never played Greninja with Link, but seeing as how I got combo'd with Marth, I'm starting to question whether or not I can take Greninja with

I'll tell you flat out, as a Marth main, that greninja is fairly easy if you get him off stage. Despite hydro pump being fairly effective against marth, and greninja's stage presence with his speed. You have to remember the nerfs Greninja has and use that to your advantage. You must also use frame traps when possible. Usually at the edge. Down tilt near the edge is a great frame trap with Marth. Link has much more tools to deal with Greninja than marth does, and Link has a better chance than Marth against Greninja. At least, imo.

Should I be using the Wii U Gamepad? I feel pretty comfortable with it. Alternatively, I can use a WiiMote or buy a Gamecube Controller (+ Adapter)

This is entirely about preference, I can't answer this question.

 

[iDaire]

Little Mac's one of the most easily gimped characters in this game. That explains why my stocks drop so fast with him. It's like gravity is attracted to Little Mac more than the other characters. Though he has poor recovery, he makes up for it by being the most annoying character on a platform.

Alright. Most of my questions were answered, except for the one about reading frame data, but judging from the previous response, I just need to have better skills at reading players mid-game and reacting accordingly. Not exactly sure why I'm taking SSB4 to such a competitive level if I'm just a casual player (I don't attend tourneys or events, hence, casual or semi-competitive). Thanks guys.

I'll just head over to the Marth, Link, and Shulk boards. Lucina has no tippers except for Dair, which makes me want to bang my head against a wall. Thanks.

 

[DrizzyDrew]

Your DI input should be perpendicular (90%) to the direction the attack naturally sends you. This is for survival DI. Go perpendicular in the opposite direction to DI furthest away.

So did I describe it correctly? In terms of which way to hold the stick?

 

[Dre89]

Quick question who would be considered the most technical character in the game?

When I say technical, I mean uses character-specific techs (or techs specific to only a few characters) that are core to their gameplay.

 

[Vipermoon]

So did I describe it correctly? In terms of which way to hold the stick?

The right side of the screen is a huge area. So what you described depends. Just follow the 90 degree rule (meant degree, not % from the first time). So if you were sent perfectly horizontal (0 degrees), DI up. If you are sent diagonal at a 45 degree angle, your input should be 135 degrees, which is perpendicular to 45.

As mentioned before, do the opposite or something in between if you are not at risk of dying. Always using survival DI can actually kill you. Like if Captain Falcon down throws you, it's a free knee and possible death if you use survival DI there. If he gets the knee, then you survival DI.

 

[Grass]

Lucina has no tippers except for Dair, which makes me want to bang my head against a wall. Thanks.

Lucina has no tipper period. She does have Marth's spike in the same hitbox frame as marth though.

 

[Jaxas]

Quick question who would be considered the most technical character in the game?

When I say technical, I mean uses character-specific techs (or techs specific to only a few characters) that are core to their gameplay.

I've heard a lot of talk about Peach being the most technical character floating (ha) around. Otherwise I'm pretty sure that Shulk is up there, especially with (H)MArt cancelling.

 

[Vipermoon]

Lucina has no tipper period. She does have Marth's spike in the same hitbox frame as marth though.

Exactly, thank you. Marth and Lucina's spike is the only hitbox in that frame and it doesn't have a hitlag modifier. Those aren't tippers. But for some reason Marth's is stronger, doing 14% vs 13.3% for Lucina.

Fun fact, Lucina has tippers on the first 3 hits of Dancing Blade (like Marth obviously) but only to help it connect from different ranges. Same damage throughout (obviously unlike Marth).

 

[Sushi1119]

Hi, I'm a solid player (90% For Glory win rate), but I heavily struggle against very good, campy players (i.e. Megaman, Duck Hunt, etc.). Even when I use my best character (Sonic), I can't punish their moves and they just zone me out. I even try to mix up my approaches, but that doesn't seem to work. Although, against characters who don't/can't camp, I don't struggle at all. Do you guys have any useful advice to offer? If so, I would greatly appreciate it if you could lend a hand to a smasher in need.

 

[Gunla]

Hi, I'm a solid player (90% For Glory win rate), but I heavily struggle against very good, campy players (i.e. Megaman, Duck Hunt, etc.). Even when I use my best character (Sonic), I can't punish their moves and they just zone me out. I even try to mix up my approaches, but that doesn't seem to work. Although, against characters who don't/can't camp, I don't struggle at all. Do you guys have any useful advice to offer? If so, I would greatly appreciate it if you could lend a hand to a smasher in need.

Moved to this thread.

 

[BlueX]

Guy's i am in need of really bad help that involes speed.

I just seem to be really slow at the game and it's driving me insane i try to be fast with the controller but my accuracy (at least mostly) just seems to be really bad. I kinda miss alot and my opponent always hits me faster and moves quicker than me?

Help.

 

[Shaya]

Practice in training mode, feel confident in your "combos". Change around percents, get the cpus to do jumps or whatever.
Are you auto cancelling your aerials? Are you buffering movements out of your actions?

Then practice basically zero-deathing CPUs (whatever level is comfortable, 1 or 3 is normalish), do it a lot.
I learned this from M2K basically, it was something that he used to keep "hidden" from people recording, but he'd usually practice against a level 1 CPU Snake in Brawl and just annihilate it as a warm up, but would otherwise practice with it. I'm sure there were eventually videos of it but I couldn't find any just now scouring through youtube with some particular terms.
Armada did/does the same thing in Melee, Peach vs a level 3 Fox on Battlefield I believe.
Many different top players apply a similar method of practice (+ "99 stock match where I SD every time I whiff"; etc) (I personally go with level 9 CPUs 99 stocks and stop when I lose my 10th, usually trying to set personal records)

 

[BlueX]

How do i auto cancel aerials?

 

[Shaya]

It's unique to each character's aerials, it's a timing in which if you land during the cool down of an aerial you'll not suffer the normal landing lag of it.
Learning the timing of them is pretty important, different starting times in your jumps or fast falling, etc.

 

[Dre89]

Which characters have the best boxing games? (Aside from Mac)

 

[BlueX]

What is buffering movements?

 

[David Galanos]

Does anyone know what to do against Ikes who charge eruption (neutral b) at the ledge? There's literally nothing I can do. Roll gets you killed, standard get up gets you killed, jump gets you killed, same for if you try to hit them out of it. Im tired of all of these ledge things that cover every option like DDD's slowed down gordo, rosalinas jab thing, etc.

Also:
I've heard some things about conditioning which is supposed to be really useful. Can someone who knows a lot about it explain to me what it is, how to do it/examples of it? Thanks

There was nothing on Youtube, or anything from searching it on Google, or here.

 

[Iceweasel]

Conditioning your opponent is training them to do the same things over and over. For example, a Link could keep throwing bombs at you, never expecting any to hit. However, if the opponent start powershielding the bomb every time, or rolling past them, the Link player conditioned the opponent to react a certain way to an attack. Having created predictability in the opponent, Link can hard read a reaction to a thrown bomb and go to town.

 

[Spirst]

@ David Galanos I have merged your thread about conditioning with the gameplay advice thread.

 

[Shaya]

What is buffering movements?

Well it's very easy to buffer actions in this game due to it's buffering system (it'll take a single input from the last 10 frames and use it as soon as possible after the action of something else). i.e. rolls
But things like moving, like dashing out of something or just 'turning around' into another action is harder as you can't input the attack/other things, just the movement one first.

If you hit someone and "wait" for a while to think about your next action, you're being too slow. When you're comfortable with a hit confirm you usually have the time to reactively make the next input (due to hit lag and the move's cool down), and buffering is the only way to guarantee you're doing those things as fast as possible.

Hi, I'm a solid player (90% For Glory win rate), but I heavily struggle against very good, campy players (i.e. Megaman, Duck Hunt, etc.). Even when I use my best character (Sonic), I can't punish their moves and they just zone me out. I even try to mix up my approaches, but that doesn't seem to work. Although, against characters who don't/can't camp, I don't struggle at all. Do you guys have any useful advice to offer? If so, I would greatly appreciate it if you could lend a hand to a smasher in need.

In short, wifi is terrible. Every fighting game boils down to reaction speed as it's true "differentiation" of ability, and design usually focuses around this as the scale for risk/reward. When you're losing 100ms (several frames) or whatever on not only every action you choose but the actions you in turn see, the game is muddied beyond it's original balance considerations. With the way buffering is in this game (different to Brawl where it'll take all your inputs in the last 10 frames, now it's only one input), characters which have strong single input actions can abuse these as the counters to them (movement, reactive shielding/dodging whatever) is on several magnitudes higher in difficulty than what they're doing, it only exacerbated beyond what skill can compensate in normal conditions by the delay/lag.

 

[Sushi1119]

In short, wifi is terrible. Every fighting game boils down to reaction speed as it's true "differentiation" of ability, and design usually focuses around this as the scale for risk/reward. When you're losing 100ms (several frames) or whatever on not only every action you choose but the actions you in turn see, the game is muddied beyond it's original balance considerations. With the way buffering is in this game (different to Brawl where it'll take all your inputs in the last 10 frames, now it's only one input), characters which have strong single input actions can abuse these as the counters to them (movement, reactive shielding/dodging whatever) is on several magnitudes higher in difficulty than what they're doing, it only exacerbated beyond what skill can compensate in normal conditions by the delay/lag.

Yes, and you're completely right on that, but do you have any general tips against campy characters?

 

[Shaya]

Yes, and you're completely right on that, but do you have any general tips against campy characters?

Be patient. See how they react to your approach options but don't approach to get a hit, approach to apply pressure and remain safe.
Push them to continually retreat, as backed into a corner (ledge/etc) they have less options than before, they have to move through you realistically, punish that.
Chances are those players are going to spam retreating attacks and then start dash grabbing your shields or rolling in if you aren't taking stage control. This is where the stupidity of wifi will basically defeat you every time. Do your best to hard read punish something so they don't just triple roll away to restart it all again.

So in short:
Maintain safety and chip away at enemy stage positioning through advancing safely and punish cross overs they attempt to make. In an advantageous stage position, things will fall into your lap.

Dealing with that stuff on wifi? Try Falco. Or crouching with someone super short.

 

[Rango the Mercenary]

Sometimes I play in tournaments and my opponent will survive what should be a vertical KO at an dangerously high number. I want to know how it's possible to keep yourself from dying when the red lightning attacks connect.

 

[Dark Dire Wolf]

I'd like to try my hand in the competitive scene in Sm4sh, so I've started off in For Glory. It's going horribly, my win rate is about 25% out of ~45 matches. I'm maining Greninja at the moment. So I'm simply in dire need of tips that can help a nooby like me.

I'll give a review of my gameplay from my point of view if it helps give tips to give better advice.

For starters, I've had the game for about only 5 days, so I maybe I'm expecting too much. I've worked on removing the habit of rolling over and over that acquired when playing Brawl with my friends (it worked really well with us, but it seems we all were just horrible), and I've improved, but it's still there.

At the same, I find it very difficult to transition from offense to defense and vice versa. When I go on the attack, I get countered, when I go defensive, I can't land a hit. I also find tilting in the heat of battle difficult.

Lastly, I've come to the conclusion that Greninja might be too advanced of a character for me at my skill level and I might need to choose someone else. I mained Falco and Wolf in Brawl, maybe I should use a character with similar properties?

Thanks to whoever gives me advice, I'm quite demotivated at the moment.

 

[Iceweasel]

I'd like to try my hand in the competitive scene in Sm4sh, so I've started off in For Glory. It's going horribly, my win rate is about 25% out of ~45 matches. I'm maining Greninja at the moment. So I'm simply in dire need of tips that can help a nooby like me.

I'll give a review of my gameplay from my point of view if it helps give tips to give better advice.

For starters, I've had the game for about only 5 days, so I maybe I'm expecting too much. I've worked on removing the habit of rolling over and over that acquired when playing Brawl with my friends (it worked really well with us, but it seems we all were just horrible), and I've improved, but it's still there.

At the same, I find it very difficult to transition from offense to defense and vice versa. When I go on the attack, I get countered, when I go defensive, I can't land a hit. I also find tilting in the heat of battle difficult.

Lastly, I've come to the conclusion that Greninja might be too advanced of a character for me at my skill level and I might need to choose someone else. I mained Falco and Wolf in Brawl, maybe I should use a character with similar properties?

Thanks to whoever gives me advice, I'm quite demotivated at the moment.

For starters, don't take FG seriously. Lag rewards bad play, and I've never seen an FG match with less than 6 frames (1/10 of a second) of lag. It's only useful for learning how real people play their characters and practicing reading and mindgames. Unfortunately, this is mitigated by the fact that almost nobody plays like they would in an in-person match, due to the aforementioned lag. Find a local event and play there. Make sure you're early enough to get in plenty of friendlies, and expect to get bodied. Try to fix that tilt problem before you do, though. It helps if you only move the joystick about halfway and use a relatively new/stiff GC controller.

As much as people rag on CPUs, they're actually fairly decent for training combos, zoning, and execution. Not as good as a real player, obviously, but better than nothing.

You said you main Greninja? What does your Side-B do, and how do I counter it? It seems that no matter what I do, it always hits me. Sometimes it's in front of me, sometimes it's behind me, but as soon as I drop shield, a lingering hitbox hits me every time.

 

[HeavyMetalSonic]

You said you main Greninja? What does your Side-B do, and how do I counter it? It seems that no matter what I do, it always hits me. Sometimes it's in front of me, sometimes it's behind me, but as soon as I drop shield, a lingering hitbox hits me every time.

Do you understand how it works? The shadow travels along the ground when you hold it, wherever you release it, greninja will teleport to the spot the shadow is and pop out, doing a kick(Duh). But you can alter the side Greninja attacks on by holding left or right while he starts teleporting. So if you hold left, he'll attack to HIS, not YOUR, left side. Same goes for right. It's kinda like Metaknight's DownB changes depending on what direction you're holding.

So what you want to do is see where the shadow is in comparison to you. If you're facing right and Gren is on your left facing you and they start to use SideB, and the shadow ends up travelling behind your character (on the left of you now), chances are they're gonna pop up behind you and attack right (as you will then be on their right). Assuming they know how it works anyway, if they don't you shouldn't be worrying about them as they're probably pretty bad with Greninja.

As for how to counter... His teleport won't be instantaneous. You'll hear a "poof" sound, then he'll pop up like half a second or so after. Just hold your shield up. You'll either block it (and the more you do it, the better you'll get with timing it), or they'll attack the wrong way and you can punish it, as there is a bit of lag after it while he does that backflip. If you have someone to practice against, just have them repeatedly use SideB on you. You can get used to shielding at the right time in sync with the "poof" sound pretty quickly.